Alexa Whippo

Guiding conversations with community leaders.

In this podcast, we'll explore the human journey of leaders, their stories of humility, triumph, roadblocks and lessons learned. Come join us as we journey together and uncover the questions you've always wanted to know. This podcast is brought to you by the Gilbert Chamber of Commerce, perhaps providing resources, connections and belonging for business professionals.

And Rocket Space, an event and meeting venue in the heart of the East Valley with a full service four person podcast studio. Are you ready?

I am so ready.

How ready are you?

I am ready. Here we go then.

Let's do this. Who do we have today?

This guest hails from Oregon where she was raised by her her parents who are Vietnamese immigrants. She is a graduate of the University of Oregon and enjoyed a successful career with more than 18 years in sports broadcasting media for Fox Sports and ESPN. Today. She serves as a communications and multimedia consultant for Deloitte here in Gilbert. She is a married mom of four and an advocate for women in business and sports media. Please welcome Alexa Whippo.

Welcome, welcome.

Hello.

We're so glad you're here.

Thanks for having me.

Absolutely. So let's get started with what we call rapid fire.

Fill in the blank. Happiness is.

Oh, rapid fire is not going to be very rapid for me.

It's okay.

I'm really thoughtful. Happiness is. I think it really just ends with happiness is okay. I know that's probably a weird answer.

It is what it is.

Yeah.

What's your hidden talent?

It's not really hidden, but. So I used to be a singer. I was signed to a record label when I was 21. Perfect. It was specifically for hip hop, so I was the girl who sang on the choruses. And then I had like three other songs in production and then the record label shut down. But it's not really a hidden talent. I sing around my house.

Singing. Singing is your talent?

Yeah. And playing trombone. I know, that's odd too.

Hip hop and trombone.

I know goes together.

A concert you will never forget.

That's a good question. Because my parents never let me go to concerts. Very strict Vietnamese immigrants. So the first one I went to was a Z100, like summer concert. I don't even remember the name, but it was Backstreet Boys where the headliner. And I was an NSYNC fan. My sister made me go. And that is why it's my most.

Memorable first in that. Okay. Have you ever lived abroad?

I have not.

What is something people get wrong about you?

I'm actually a really simple person. I think I come off not very simple. I Don't know why. Appearances, maybe. I like things just as simplistic as possible because to me, that's the easiest way to go.

Simple as Good. What makes you hopeful?

Oh, my kids. Everything about them makes me hopeful about life, about the future, and about what they can accomplish. Because I'm nearing the end already. You know, at 35, not so many life changes that can happen at this point. Maybe. Well, a lot of things happen past this point, but for them, I have great hope.

Are you more of a thinker or a doer?

Well, as I'm thinking, I'm probably actually more of a doer, but every. Every doer thing has a lot of thought. I'm a really, really solid mix of.

Okay, she's simple, remember?

Right.

Yeah, I know.

Sorry.

If. Okay, this is gonna be an easy one. Ready? If someone was to play you in a movie, who would you want it to be?

Someone play me?

Yes, you.

Me?

Yeah.

I would play me in a movie.

You would play you?

Yes.

Okay, easy.

What is your favorite pastime or hobby?

Now it's just resting because a two year old takes a lot out of you.

Okay, maybe before kids, what was your favorite pastime or hobby?

I used to just love going to wine bars with my friends.

Excellent.

Those days will come back, I promise.

I miss those days. I have like one a year at this point, but I do have a Temecula trip in a couple weeks for a friend's bachelorette, so that'll be fun.

Last one. What is one thing you are grateful for?

I'm grateful for my journey. I think so many things in this life can be looked at as negative or whatever happens to you is such a bad thing. But I'm grateful for everything that's happened to me.

Excellent. Yeah.

All right.

And one more. Last one. Glass. Half full or half empty?

Half full.

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That's 480-848-3037. Very well, then, let's get this started.

All right. All right, so let's dig in from very beginning. So you are a middle child, parents are Vietnamese immigrants, and you grew up in Oregon. What did childhood look like for you?

So I alluded to it already. Very strict. I think my parents know this now, but then it Was a big struggle for us because they were immigrants and they wanted to raise us with Vietnamese values, which are very much the idea is that children stay home until they get married. There's no leaving. You don't leave a nest at all. Um, they were very fearful of American culture. Just the bad things you see on the news, which is exactly how the news is built. Funny. Going into journalism, I learned that very quickly, bad news is what sells. And so bad news is what you report on. Right. So they saw all these things about kids getting taken and poisoned during Halloween and just kept a very tight leash on us. Vietnamese culture is very family oriented in the sense that you don't really do outside activities outside of the home. Like, outside of the home away from your family. So everything is done as a family unit. You go to dinner together, you go see friends together. Your friends groups are your parents, friends, kids. Right. So it was a big struggle because there was also this very strongly instilled value that they wanted us to work for success or work towards success in our lives. And I think I always struggled with that because I wanted to be a journalist when I was like, 12. And I was like, well, I'm looking into this journalist thing, mom and dad, and they keep saying I have to move out of the house, I have to move away from home to get a job. And you're telling me that as a Vietnamese child, I need to stay home, but that I'm also supposed to be independent and go into the world and you're not letting me or you're not. You're not providing me that outlet. Right. So college was a really great area of exploration for me as a person, because I think it truly allowed me to make mistakes, go do stupid things, realize that I love to be everyone's DD more than anything, but also that I could still be true to those values that they instilled in me. The hard, like, the work ethic, the family oriented. Like, I'm very family oriented now, but still be an American citizen. Because that's truly what they wanted was full integration. And I was like, okay, if you want me to integrate, I'm gonna go do all of these things in school. I'm gonna go do every single activity I can. And I'm going to tell you it's so that I can get scholarships for college. But what it's really doing is getting me out of the house, because that was the only way I could leave my home.

And were your siblings the same way?

No. So my. My older sister was very much stuck at home. And she didn't do hardly any activities. I got into sports. I was a three sport athlete. Ended up being the captain of all three sports. I was in band, I was in marching band, I was the drum major, I was in three types of choir. Trombone, yeah, trombone. I was in the orchestra. You know, all of these things. And my mom was like, oh, okay, so your sister's gonna have to do swimming now because you need a ride to swimming and we can't take you. So they forced her to do a sport because I needed a ride. So she was, she would have much rather just stayed home. And that was obviously, maybe not obviously, but it was the rise of the Internet and the rise of dial up. So she was actually very into like online message boards and gaming and things of that nature. So she would much rather have stayed at home. My brother is a boy. He has different rules. He's always had different rules. I love him to pieces, but he's always got to play by different rules because he was a boy. So.

So. And that's an interesting spin on things for me in this conversation because you went into a very male dominated field and had that battle in your career as well where there are different roles for, for you than there were for others.

Yeah, I think there was a, there was a sense of like it was, it was a fight all the time. And then it was really hard because you get pigeonholed into. While you're a girl, you have to be a reporter, you have to be a sideline reporter. You can't be a play by play person. You can't be an analyst, you can't do X, Y and Z things because this is the role you have to do. And it almost caused this level of. Even in college, I think I had friends who were female journalists, but I was like, oh, they're not going to sports. It's fine. Like in my mind there was almost like this is something that many women in this industry battle with is that we think that there's a competition and it's not really a competition. Right. Whoever's going to get hired is going to get hired because of whatever the reason may be. But then it's time to fight for those other positions and those other roles that maybe they say that you shouldn't have. So it kind of led to a different level of advocacy for me because I was always told like, these are the roles you can have. You can be the anchor here in Idaho maybe, but that's not going to be your path unless you work for another 10 years or whatever. There was just the arbitrary things that are put in your, in, in play when you're trying to move forward in your career. You realize when you look back, or like those were completely arbitrary, but it felt like this was the only path you could take at that time.

Yeah, and I'm curious too, just where did your. With growing up in a strict household, where did your love for sports come from?

My dad. So my brother is. My sister and I are very close in age. We're two years apart. And then my parents like to say that I was such a hellion of a child that they had to wait for a boy. They waited six years. So my brother's six years younger than me because they waited five years. Now that I know how babies work, so he is six years younger than me. So for the first six years of my life, I was like my dad's little buddy. I'd like to say I was my dad's little buddy and my mom's best friend because I would be in the kitchen helping her cook and clean and do all the things that a girl's supposed to do. But then my dad would be like, hey, come in here, I'm fixing the sink. I need you to get in there because you're smaller than I am. So he would help with the wrench and you know, if something fell in the sink or with the car, he's like, this is what a spark plug is, you know, he was very much. He would include me in things because I think he felt, I don't know, that my sister was very much helping my mom. And so I was the one. I actually floated in between them the most. I just like to. My, my term that I tell people is that I like the term jack of all trades, master of none. But I'm not that. I'm jack of many trades, master of many. I like to. If I'm going to be interested in something, I want to know all of the inner workings of how it came to be, how it operates now, and what the future could look like. Right. So my first job at Fox Sports, people were like, why are you going to take a website job that's not, I mean, it's in sports, but it's not a reporter job. And I was like, why not? I mean, the websites are going to be here forever now that the Internet has launched, so why not learn back end coding? Why not learn HTML coding? Why not learn these four different CMSs that we eventually change to? I mean, it's only going to make me A stronger person. And I like knowing things in a weird way. I like being knowledgeable in the areas that I like that I'm interested in. So why not just learn as much as I can?

Yeah.

Very much intrigued by how your. How it was for you growing up. Mother of four, right?

I am a mother of four.

Have you ever thought about how that's translated into your life today? Like. Like how much of that has come through and you're doing.

Oh, all the time. Because they always say you turn into your parents. Right, Right. My parents were extremely strict, so I did make a conscious effort not to be that way.

Okay.

It's also not super encouraged or it's not a part of the culture to be very affectionate toward your children, at least not at the time. I mean, I think maybe that was the age, the era, and in general, not just immigrants, but my parents were very much like, we don't hug, we don't kiss, we don't. We don't do physical contact as a family.

It was not even high fives.

No high fives.

Okay.

It was. Yeah, no high fives either. Sad, huh? I mean, I tell my dad this all the time because he always says, he's like, I'm so proud of you. Right. And I was like, you never told me that as a kid. Right. When I was in high school. And again, captain of the too many things, involved in too many things, doing too many things. But I got a lot of accolades for those. I have literally, my parents have a book of all of these certificates that I have from Honoral and, you know, being the best citizen and things like that. Right. And they never told me they were proud of me, but they would tell everyone else.

And they certainly showed you if they had a book. Right?

Right. Well, I kind of started the book and then they kind of kept adding to it.

Got it.

But it was that I had all these things just piling up, and I was like, hey, I'm just going to throw things in this thing. But. But my. My dad's co workers or my mom's friends would be like, oh, I heard that you did this. And I heard all these things. And I'm like, from who? Because I don't. I don't know what my parents say about me. Right. And they're like, oh, your parents are so proud of you. Your dad's so proud of you. So it came to a head, actually. I was like 16, and we had had some family. Just some family discord. There was issues where my sister and I were not Getting along. And we were teenagers and all these things started happening, and my parents were blaming each us. And I think at a certain point, I literally just said to them, do you guys love us? Like, do you love me? And they're like, what do you mean? I was like, do you love me? They're like, well, I mean, of course we do, but what. You know, I'm like, you are raising American children or you're raising Vietnamese children in America. You want us to have these values. And I understand that, and I understand your core to the core values that you were raised with. We are American children. And sometimes, like once every, I don't know, six months maybe, just tell me you're proud of me and you love me. Just tell me that. And then from then on, like, I went to college and I would end every conversation with I love you. And they'd be like, you know, they don't. They did not say it. Now, every time before we get off the phone, they are the first ones to say it.

But it.

So it flipped.

Yeah, but it was a shift for them because that it was not how they were raised and probably outside of their comfort zone. And so to meet you there now.

Yeah.

So you probably have a strong love language with your kids now.

Yeah, my. My love language. So mine's always. It's funny. We did the kids love language. 1. You can, you know, there's a kid's version. One of my kids is very words of affirmation. The other one's gifts. Loves gifts. The baby's too young to know. I don't know, but she just likes cuddling, so I'll do, you know, physical touch. I'm a quality time person, but I'm very much a. What is it now? I can't remember all five.

That's okay. I don't either.

It's the one where I like to do things for other people. Which one is that?

Acts of service.

Yes, that's me. I'm the acts of service person. So my husband's are quality time and physical touch, and mine are acts of service and quality time. So, you know, it helps you build your relationship if you can lean a little bit more toward the other person's preferences. So I just, you know, he did the dishes last night and I was really happy. You know, things like that.

So simple things.

It is.

So you talked about. You always knew from a really early age that you wanted to go into sports reporting, but you shared a situation with us where you were so driven that maybe you needed a little bit of an attitude adjustment, and there was somebody in your life who helped you so that you didn't derail your own success.

Yeah. So my first job with Fox Sports in websites. It was their first time launching this regional sports hub, basically from Houston. There were 24 brand new, like, basically brand new graduates. I think four people had been out of college for maybe four years max, and they launched this hub where we were managing 20 different websites for Fox Sports regional networks from one local hub. So we would be basically on the clock when the local people would be at home with their families, which was nice for them, but we would get to copy edit, and that's. I actually got. Technically, I got hired as an intern. I was right out of college. I had no prospects in the. In the reporting game. I literally had somebody in Texas tell me they wouldn't hire me because even though I was ethnic, I wasn't Hispanic, So I was not the right type of ethnic. And that's why they wouldn't hire me. I look back on that now, and I probably could have, like, sued them, but I was 22 or 23. So I went from intern. I got hired at the end of the summer. I moved up, and I learned every single position. Like, as I explained, I like to know things. And so I learned every position, and I learned the ins and outs of every position. And so I was like, I want to be the person who helps kind of manage the day to day, even though it's not a manager position. That's the type of role you play as an assignment desk editor. So I started kind of just being high on myself and being like, this is too easy for me. I don't understand why these people are having difficulties. Just really rude. I wasn't very nice. Can I swear on this program?

Do you see whatever you want on this?

Oh, see, this is great. We have Sarah here.

So, yes, all rules are up there.

I know. So my boss pulled me into his office, and he was like, I know you want to be more than this, and I know you learned a lot. You're doing a great job at your role. But you, Alexa, will not get anywhere being a bitch. And that is exactly what you are to your colleagues. And you have to remember that one of these people may be your boss one day, and they might remember that you were a bitch, and they won't hire you or they may not give you an assignment. And. And that means he's like, I know you're trying to fight, right? You're trying to fight to be. To show that you're worthy of this role, that you're worthy of whatever may come next. But if you don't appreciate the people around you for everything that they are and maybe even the things that they aren't, you will never make it in this. In this career. It's all about humility. And it really kind of is. It struck a chord, obviously, and it made me realize almost the first steps, which I now know as servant leadership, but I didn't know that then, but it was the first steps in really understanding how much you have to support others, no matter what type of leadership role you may be in, and understand where they may be coming from and their difficulties. To be able to one, move forward as a team, but to show that you are really worthy of being that.

Leader and risky for that person too, because they invested in you.

Right.

To, to be honest, and probably a really hard place for them to be in as well, but amazing that you heard it and received it the way you needed to.

Yeah, I think it was one of those. It was prefaced by, like, I can say this to you because I know you can take it, but I'm just gonna say it plainly and I'm not gonna beat around the bush. Right. You're a bitch. And I probably was. I mean, I look back on it and I was. I was not nice to people in college. The whole idea of, like, I need to be the best so that I can go be, you know, I'm. I'm fighting all these other women or all these other people for all these roles in the world where there really weren't that many. If you look at the job split, sports, jobs, boards. There were a hundred. Okay. There were a hundred people in my class. Right. And then thinking about all the other journalism schools in the nation and in the world, how am I going to compete with these people plus those other people if I don't rise above? So that mindset really did shift at that time. Thankfully. Maybe not. I don't know. I mean, I feel like it has, but it is. It definitely was a turning point in my life that helped me realize how important servant leadership really is.

We can all wear crowns.

Oh, yeah, you can crowns all day for sure.

I just gave my. My 14 year old turned 14 on the 14th. This buzzy, she had a crown and she gave her friends crowns to be a part of her court for her golden birthday.

That's awesome.

Absolutely.

So if you saw any kids walking around Gilbert High School with crowns on.

Now we know why.

Yeah. Even though it is Hoko Apparently I got. It was fairly confusing for some.

That's funny.

Thought about. I forgot about that.

So talk to us about your. Okay. So you're in the journalism world and then you decide to get out.

Yeah.

What happened? Why? What made you move?

I love journalism still. I love sports broadcasts. I love sports. Okay. My first love was sports.

Not the Chiefs.

I just wanted. But not the Chiefs.

Say what you will, but look at the records.

Los Santo.

Okay, sorry.

So my. I will say this. My old manager, his uncle was Len Dawson. And so there was always a little bit of Chiefs. Like, I root for him, for him. I rooted for him, not for the Chiefs. My. My old manager, just to be clear. Okay. But he was happy when the Chiefs won, you know, and then we would talk about Uncle Lenny and that was always great. So, yeah, sports were my love. Broadcasting was always my love. And I did it. I like to say I did my dream job and got out. So it was my dream. I was 12, I wanted to be a reporter. My first job was in radio when I was 16. And people were like, oh, so you were just doing things like filing papers and stuff? And I was like, no, I was on the air. I was a producer for a radio station and I was doing on air board operation on the weekends and NASCAR would be running and they're like, okay, you're gonna. If there's a rain delay, you have to broadcast. You have to take. Tell everyone there's a rain delay, go on the air and then cut to our other programming and then cut back and do all of the on air announcements at the age of 16, they gave me that much power.

Guys doing all that tap dancing, huh?

Think about how crazy that is. I think about how crazy that is sometimes. But went into school, I had 13 internships when I left college because I started doing internships when I was a freshman, like a crazy person. And did the website thing. Learned a lot about back end design, wysiwygs, if you know what a wuzzy wig is, what you see is what you get. For those of you who do not. And then moved into the reporter anchor role in Idaho. Worked in Arizona here for Fox Sports and then Valley Sports. And then I just realized at a certain point I wanted to be more. I wanted to be a leader. I wanted to be a manager. And I talked to my general manager and he was just really honest with me, who's retired since I asked him, how am I supposed to move up when my managers have been here for 10, 15, 20 years? And he's like, you're gonna have to leave. You're gonna have to leave and gain management experience somewhere else. You can always come back. He's like, you have base knowledge, obviously, and you have so many years under your belt that if you wanted to come back to sports broadcasting, I have no doubt. I've worked for every team in some capacity, so I have no doubt that if you wanted to come back, you could come back. But he's like, you gotta go. So I left. I left to. I. Actually, the funny story is that I didn't even know what Deloitte was at all. Like, not even a glimmer of this is what Deloitte is. When I saw the job posting for a communications consultant and I was like, well, this place is down the street, so. And right now they're fully remote, so why not? You know, just the time and effort that you put into broadcast and sports is a lot, and it is definitely a passion job. But there was no more moving up for me, so I had to go.

So what do you love about what you're doing now?

I get to use all the skills that I. That I have, I mean, in different ways. And now I am getting to lead more projects. There's a lot more project management experience that I'm gaining. But also, I still get to be a little bit tactical in that, like, design phase, right? Like, hey, put this together. I'm like, yes, I'm in. I'm in Adobe and I'm doing things in Photoshop. But also, it's still very much in the realm of what I like to do, which is tell people stories, right? Because I'm a communications consultant. That's the number one thing we do, is we're communicating a story to an end user to get them to understand what's happening. So I've always. That was my biggest part about reporting anyway. My mom's like, oh, you want to be on tv? And I was like, no, I just like talking to people and telling, like, their best version of their story from a point where they can't. If they can't communicate it, I can communicate it for them. I always told my. When I was reporting, I would tell people I was interviewing. I'm like, I'm never going to make you look bad. Don't worry about anything you say. If you say. If you say, eff it, whatever. If you say, whatever or if you think you look bad, I will make sure you look great. And that's in audio and visual, right? So I had people literally email me after I would do Stories, they're like, oh, my gosh, you really captured my story. Or, hey, you really didn't make me look bad. Right. That's my goal, was to always just kind of be that storyteller.

Coolest story you've ever covered.

Story is hard because stories are personal. They are personal. And I think I've done so many events like Super Bowls, but I think the coolest story that I got to cover really, like being there and seeing the work that was being done was. Was any of our community. Just our community service stories. You know, the Coyotes go and see kids at Phoenix Children's Hospital. So I'm there. The D backs go and see kids at Phoenix Hospital. Children's Hospital. Going to the Coyotes do a playground build every year, and we got to do that, but also interview players about why they think it's important. So those types of stories are really impactful to me because then we get to go back and see what the impact truly is for those schools, for those kids in the neighborhoods. And those ones were, I think, the best because the kids are always awesome. Like, oh, I got to see my favorite player. Who. Or not, because I don't know anything about hockey, but it was really cool that they did that. But they're very excited, you know, that's awesome.

All right, so you shared a mantra with us. Never regret anything, because at one time, it was exactly what you wanted.

Yes.

I love that.

Yeah, it's on my phone. It's like my background on my phone. Yeah, it's like a graffiti. It was a picture I found, I don't know, perusing the Internet back in the old days of the Internet, not even the new days, and it was just like, dang, that's it. That's it. Like, I've done a lot of things in my life, and I've learned something from every single piece of it. Kind of what I said about journey, being grateful for my journey. I've done a lot of crap, a lot of stupid stuff, but I've done a lot of great things, too. And I think you have to appreciate every piece of it, even at the lowest moments of your life. Like, man, that was a bad decision. But you know what? Four months later, this happened. So now it's fantastic. The only way I could have done this thing four months later was if this one piece happened. So I don't regret anything.

What's tomorrow look like for you?

Like, tactically, what is tomorrow?

Futuristic.

Yeah. I'm sorry. That's just me.

Yep.

This is why Sarah and I might get along a little bit. It. I don't know, I never. Everyone's like, what's your five year plan? What are your goals? I'm like, I just want to be happy and I want my kids to be happy, healthy and safe and hopefully enjoying whatever they're doing in life. Because, gosh, that means my 20 year old will be 25, my 16 year old will be 21 and oh, gosh, my 16 year old should not be 21. And 14 year old will be 19, hopefully in college and then the baby will be seven. School, you know, seven is crazy because everything up until then is crazy. So it is, it's just making sure that I'm growing as I keep moving forward every day. It's so. It's really like an. I'm very. Oh, geez, what's the word? I like to look within myself quite often to make sure that my path currently is aligning with what I really enjoy. So a lot of inward reflection. Reflection. And that's what future looks like is lots of reflection.

I guess that's good.

Actually appreciate the fact that it doesn't always have to be mapped out. Like it's okay to just take it as it comes. And some days, especially when you're raising a family, that's the best that we can do. And that's good enough.

Yeah, especially since my kids, so the older kids are my step kids, but they're mine. And so I never thought in my wildest dreams I'd be like, I think one married guy who has three kids and then make a baby with him. I think that's what I'm gonna do. If I looked at what I truly wanted when I was 20 something be like, you know, married, two and a half kids, white picket fence, maybe. Actually, that's probably not what I was thinking because as a reporter, I knew I was gonna be moving a lot, but I was dating a guy at the time and I told him, you know, you're gonna have to move with me. And then I ended up marrying a guy who had deep, deep roots in Arizona. So there was no moving anymore, but planted here. And it's fine.

It's good.

It's actually. I actually very much like and enjoy Arizona. My family does not. It is too hot for them, but I love it. Not my, not my gc, not my current family. I mean, my parents, sure, yeah. They do not like hot things.

Do they enjoy trips to Vegas? I don't know if that's.

I don't. I don't think my mom's Ever been to Pig? Oh, no, she has.

No road trip.

We've gone shopping in Vegas.

They do.

I also enjoy Vegas, but not anymore. I actually haven't been in.

Six years.

Five years for a friend's wedding. Yeah, they got married in Vegas. Yeah.

Well, thank you for being here. This has been a very interesting conversation. Love learning about your journey.

Yeah, yeah. Thanks for having me. It's been a little while. Journey where people call me a bitch and I learned to reflect.

You know what, that's everybody's journey.

Right.

Like, we really, we all have those moments of self discovery and then we learn and we grow.

But you don't regret it because it's what you wanted exactly at that time.

That's right.

It's true. 100%.

100%. Well, if you like this episode, and I absolutely love this episode, so I hope you did too. Join us, Join our journey. Subscribe to our tribe and learn more about the shows that we have for our show. Thank you for being here. Guiding growth conversations with community leaders.

Ben, let me ask you a question. How do you see other community members being involved in this podcast?

This is going to be a great opportunity for so many people in the community to have a chance to be heard if they want to tell their story or if they just want to be part of this journey with us and help sponsor in a way that helps bring more people to the table with us. So I think there's many opportunities at hand. Whether you want to again be on the show. Reach out to us, let us know what your story is and how you think you could be part of it. We'd love to hear from you. Reach out, let us know and we'll see if we can make that connection.