Jolean Fleck

Guiding conversations with community leaders.

In this podcast, we'll explore the human journey of leaders, their stories of humility, triumph, roadblocks and lessons learned. Come join us as we journey together and uncover the questions you've always wanted to know. This podcast is brought to you by the Gilbert Chamber of Commerce. Providing resources, connections and belonging for business.

Professionals and modern an event and meeting venue in the heart of Gilbert and Gilbert Independent. Yourvalley.net dedicated to serving readers with good community journalism. The Gilbert Independent is a non partisan newspaper an online site that covers our towns institutions, development and events. Subscribe and follow YourValley.net daily to stay up to date with latest local news. Is it cold in here? Are you cold?

It's just your heart.

Oh, it's just my heart. Thanks for that. Well, on that note then, let's warm things up. We got somebody that's gonna warm it up for us today.

We have a warm and special person here today. This guest grew up in Clarksville, Tennessee. The oldest of four sisters, her mom a registered nurse and her father a police officer. A business major in psychology minor, she found her way to Arizona where she has enjoyed a successful career. Career in human relations. Today she holds the title of Senior Vice President of People and Organizational Development at Delta Dental. She believes in possibility and can see when others are destined for greatness. She's married, a mom of four and finds joy in serving. Welcome, Jolene Fleck.

Thank you.

Welcome to the show.

Thank you.

We're glad to have you here. We like to start with what we call rapid fire. Okay, so first question. Would you rather spend the day with your best friend or party with everyone? You know?

My best friend?

Yeah.

Phone call or text message?

Text.

Favorite superhero?

Oh, gosh. You know, he's not popular, but I really got into Loki lately. Oh. And he's a dynamic character.

Dine in or delivery?

I like a good dine in experience. Okay. I like the whole thing.

Yep. Yep. Okay. What's the last book you read that you can remember?

Oh, gosh. So right now I am reading the Pale King by David Foster Wallace. And it's so wonderful to be reminded of what an amazing writer that he was. And yeah, I'm just. I'm loving every page.

That's awesome.

Your hobby of choice?

Fishing or hiking.

Cool.

All right. I don't know who writes these questions, but this is the question. Would you ever ride a bull?

Oh, my gosh. Well, yeah. Like, that's one of my favorite sports is like the PBR bull riding thing. Like, I've been To the finals in Vegas. Like, I am all about stunning.

Stop.

Yeah, nailed it. Like, I was. I was a huge fan during, like the blueberry wine Dillinger, you know, phase. Yeah. Like, deeply. Like, I follow some of them on Instagram. Like, I'm just like, deeply into bullet writing. So I would. Absolutely.

Well, this was meant for you.

I was gonna say we just changed these questions today and who knew?

That's incredible. Yes.

In your teen years, what was your favorite song?

It probably was an REM song. Yeah.

So were you emo back in the day or.

No, I was. Big hair. I was about it. It was. Yeah.

All right.

Okay. One day with any person, living or not, who would it be?

You know, this is just the first thing that popped into my head. I like to just ask Joan of Arc, like, how did you find that kind of personal conviction and strength and certainty about yourself at such a young age? I mean, if I thought about it, I could probably come up with maybe a few dozen. But yeah, in this moment, it's just like, what a fascinating person.

Absolutely. Last question. Glass half full or half empty?

Oh, it's half full. Yeah.

We don't get too many empties in this room, do we?

No, we really don't.

Maybe just Sarah Brom, everybody. That would be a bummer, wouldn't it? Who would want to be like that?

My half empty glass in your cold heart. What are we going to do?

It's going to light the world. I tell you.

Every day. At aps, we're here to help you save energy and money.

APS Solutions for business can help you make energy efficient upgrades more affordable.

Find rebates@aps.com businessrebates.

Well, let's go to Tennessee because it sounds like that's where all things began for you. Yes. Tell us a little bit about that journey in the beginning years of your development.

Yeah. So, you know, oldest daughter of, you know, four and my father passed when I was nine. So now I was the oldest daughter of a single mom. And so I think that probably had a lot to do with who I became.

He was a police officer, correct?

Yeah. Although that was not a part of his passing.

Okay.

Yeah, he had an accident at home, but yeah, so that kind of like set things in a certain direction. You know, like you don't have the option to like. I don't think I feel like being helpful today. That's not a thing.

Everybody has to step up at the point, right?

Everybody has to step up. So that was a big part of the first early years I went to a private school though, and mom really believed in education, so all four of us went to college. I think all four of us actually have advanced degrees as well.

And she's a nurse or was a nurse, right?

Yeah, yeah. And we all just did it on our own steam student loans. And it'd be very difficult, I think now to do something like that, but we all just kind of muscled through and we just always knew. I always knew that education was going to be how I was able to survive later. And my mom really instilled that too.

Yeah. So nine is a very young age to lose a parent. And then your sisters being younger than you.

Yes. Yeah.

I just. How did you. How did you take on that leadership as the oldest and the child at that time?

Yeah, you don't get a whole lot of choice, so, you know, it kind of is what it is. And my mom worked nights, so I very much ran the household and, you know, made sure everybody got ready for school and everyone would get fed and you just figure things out. And my mom was very open, like Jolene's in charge, so it helped. I didn't have to do a whole lot of convincing. But yeah, that was just life and that's what we had to do. So I think that it definitely made me a more self reliant person. I never thought, okay, someone else going to do something, you know, like, I'm the person that's gonna do something or it's not going to get done. So from that perspective, I think later in life, all these things end up being blessings, you know, all these things end up adding up to who you are and why you're able to do what you're able to do. So in the moment, you're thinking, man, when I get out of here, can't.

Wait to get out of here. Yes.

But then later you take all those gifts with you and you're like, okay, this really has been helpful.

Have you ever reflected on thinking of your dad, what characteristics you might have inherited from him?

I have thought of that sometimes. He was a Southern man. He grew up in Georgia. All of that family is very Southern. And he was the second oldest, so he kind of had a little bit of that chip on his shoulder. I know that he left high school early because he had a confrontation with a teacher. He had orange hair at one point. His father was a Baptist minister who was not having any of this rebellion. And he was sent to live with his older brother in Illinois and met my mom while he was away from home. But sometimes There's a part of you that just says, I've got to do what I've got to do in this moment, and I'm going to be who I am. And I feel like I probably have a little bit of that.

Yeah, that's awesome.

As you were growing up with a single mom, who else in the community really helped to support your family?

Yeah. So it was interesting, you know, in the environment that I grew up in, when I looked at my friends, like, they had these intact families, and they all looked very perfect, and they would all roll up on Sunday morning and from perfect land. And, you know, you look at all this and think, oh, gosh, like, that is not my situation. But I had a grandmother who was just amazing, you know, Like, I. A lot of people have grandmothers who are nice ladies. I had. She was a nice lady. But my grandmother was, like, a huge fan, and she let us know she was huge fans of ours. If she was in the room, you'd know she was a huge fan of mine. And she just believed in all of us and just never took an excuse or no for an answer when it came to us. So she was amazing. I think she's a big reason of why I'm here. And then, of course, I had teachers and other people who would encourage me, you know, put me in positions where I could shine.

Anyone stand out in particular?

Well, I had a teacher named Mary Davis when I was very young, and, you know, she was very nice to me and felt like the kind of adult that you could just be real with, you know, and. And that was really nice. Especially when you feel like you're growing up in perfect land and you're just trying to look, you know, like you can hang, but inside you're kind of like, okay, like, this is a big struggle. It feels like a much bigger struggle than for the rest of you. And she could. Could see that and made all of that okay for me somehow that, you know, like, look, like, you don't have to do any of this, and you're just fine how you are, and you have special talents, and there are ways for you to shine. And, you know, truth be told, they.

Don'T have it together any more than you do.

Of course not. My sister has a saying, like, everybody has a third nipple. You know, everybody's got some weirdo thing they're, you know, embarrassed about. And that is so true. Like, literally everybody has some kind of insecurity, and if they said it out loud, you'd be like, what are you talking about? Right now, but. But, yeah, that's absolutely true. Whatever weird thing you're so afraid that everybody else is going to find out is something amazing that is, like, a talent you have. And if you would just give that a little bit of sunlight, people would just, like, gravitate towards that.

At what point did the new normal, meaning not having dad around, become the normal? Like, it seems like there was a lot of transition for you, and it lingered. But was there a point where, like, okay, this is the new normal and you guys carried on?

Yeah, my parents separated a little bit before that, so there had already been, like, even more transition and so getting used to all of that, you know, and there was also, like, a move in there. You know, we moved in with my grandmother for a while, and so it felt like just constant transition, but being able to function and. And show up and go to school and still make the grades you need to make in the transition, in the battle and, you know, just keep going, like, that kind of pace. I think that's something else that has kind of stuck with me, too, because, you know, in organizations, in life, you know, like, that's one of the things I love the most about life, is that you don't know what's around the next corner. And there's a 50% chance it's amazing, you know, and if it's not amazing, then the next corner might be your corner, you know, but you have to.

Just keep going or you'll probably learn something from that previous.

Yeah, yeah. But, like, that's. That's what's so great about it. Like, you. You don't know what's coming next.

Right.

And you think you do because you make your plans and you choose not to think about it. But there's so much about life that's just random things that you have to deal with and. And learning that kind of early that, like, okay, every week, every day, there's a new surprise you're going to deal with in half of the time. It's going to be great. But the. The time you have everything you need to get through it.

Yeah. And actually, thank goodness that we don't know.

Yes. Yes. Yeah, totally. Yeah. Like, that's one of the things I kind of took away from that experience. Like, when you have a loss when you're a child, it's like you can see things that your friends can't. You know, like, you're aware that, like, death is not a foreign thing for, you know, pets and grandparents and stuff, you know, like, it's real. And so you're a little more cautious, and you. You see things that your friends don't. And you can see kind of the privilege in that, you know, that they're able to sort of pretend like, yeah, there isn't all of this danger. And, you know, it makes you a little anxious sometimes. You know, you're, I guess not as, you know, fun loving, throw caution to the wind kind of kid.

Sure. Yeah.

Okay. So. Ta da da. You're in college now.

Yes.

What's that? Like, what's going on there?

Oh, gosh. So that was interesting. I've always been good at school, so I always liked kind of like the structure of that.

So you're a good test taker and studyer.

Yeah.

Do you remember afterward, or is it just the test and then you.

There would be tests where it would be like, okay, here's five essays. You're gonna have to write two essays. So I would write all five essays just like, for prep. Like, I am that kind of nerd. Like, I. I loved going back to grad school. Like, I remember driving home, you know, after going to class and feeling just, like, truly euphoric. And I know now, like, they refer to that as, like a state of flow, you know, and, like, there's a whole science behind that, you know, getting into that state of flow and how long you can sustain it. And I paired that of being in flow with being in class and learning. And I don't know. I also know that being in a state of flow, like, you will learn things much, much faster. So I think it might be a chicken egg thing, but that state of.

Flow tends to be something you're passionate about, right? So.

Yes. Yeah.

That's your jam.

That's my jam.

Because I could never flow in that flow.

Don't we know? So you graduate from college and the very next day.

The very next day, I'm in a U Haul truck. I'm driving to Arizona.

Why?

Yeah, I have been out to visit with a friend the summer before, and I was, you know, I'm in Clarksville, and I'm thinking I need to go somewhere to get, like, where the big jobs are, where the big buildings are. So I was like, maybe I'll go to Atlanta. You know, I've got some family nearby. But I went out to visit Phoenix. And I remember in the plane, looking out and seeing all those buildings and just thinking, there are jobs in those buildings. And, you know, this was the late 90s. So I was just like, this. This looks like opportunity in every direction.

It must not have Been summertime.

No, I don't think it was.

There's a mystique about that.

Yeah, but.

But it looked so new and open, you know, and it just really kind of, you know, I had this sympathetic vibration with the whole scene and I was just like, this is where I need to go. I'm going to find my people here. So. So, yeah, I'm in a U Haul and I'm driving like the very next day all alone with a cat named Lita.

Oh, yeah. And what do you find when you get out here?

Well, you know, like, things are always a little harder than you imagine. You know, like, I'm going to go to the big city and it's going to be great. But. But I found a job within two months and it was a temp, you know, with a temp agency. But. But six months later, my first job is with Rockford Fosgate. And you know, again, this is like late 90s, and this is all about the cars with the bass and the lowriders and the lights and the. Yeah. And so, you know, for a younger person, being in that space, like, it was so fun.

Cool.

It was so much fun. Yeah, yeah, it was, you know, sound offs and people measuring decibels and it's just, you know, kind of this super masculine environment. You know, there's just lots of cars and stuff and it was so much fun.

When you look back on that time in your life, what is a lesson that you might have learned during that time that you've carried with you?

So, for me, So I spent 10 years there and we went from, you know, kind of a small company to a public company. We went from being in Tempe to being global. And I was so lucky. I had the best boss. Her name's Jackie Mott and she was the VP of HR there. And she just let me observe, you know, like, she just made sure I was in the room and I was willing to, you know, put butter on toast. I was, you know, I would clean the. Whatever it took to get in the room, I would do it. And just watching the dynamic, like, who's nervous about this deal, who's excited about this, who's mad at who. Just being able to kind of quietly observe was such a gift. And if you think about the way that you learn things, you might read about it, hear about it, you watch someone else do it, and then you feel a lot more confident doing it yourself. So being there when the company was growing so rapidly and, and then being able to observe during that time, it was Such a gift. And so I try to develop people the same way, just with exposure. Like, I just want to get you in this room. You don't have to do anything. Just watch.

Yeah, so that stopped. Then what?

So at the end of my time at Rockford, I went back to school, went to business school at ASU and I got my mba and I was feeling just like feeling myself. I was just like, I am ready for anything. And so I found a position at Alcoa in Chandler. And it was heavy manufacturing. It was unionized. Like, from an HR perspective. It was like the scariest thing I could do. And so I was so excited to go do this. And I felt like, you know, I had kind of grown up at Rockford and I was ready to sort of test my own wings. And I was a the plant HR manager. And we had an amazing experience there. You know, it was a plant that was really solid but underperforming. It had a cast house that wasn't functioning at the time. And so I was really brought in as part of a turnaround team to bring them back to profitability. And we did. And that was also just an amazing experience. I was working with metallurgists, like, and the aluminum that we were extruding was going into airplanes. So I remember this. I was there around the time when, you know, remember Sully when he, like. So there was Alcoa aluminum in that plane. And so people had to go to the crash and do whatever, you know, engineer things that they do. But it was just, again, just like the coolest thing. Like you could go to the cast house and watch liquid aluminum getting poured. And yeah, it was so much fun.

I also think it's really neat to see the opportunities you've had by pursuing a degree in hr. Who would think that you get to have those opportunities in such diverse industries because of an HR degree?

Yeah. And there are not a whole lot of colleges that have any kind of HR oriented part of business school. Like, I was fortunate at Austin Peay State. They had an HR concentration, but a lot of colleges don't have anything. Even when I went back to business school, there was no HR class, which was crazy to me because, like when I would read about HR and learn about hr, it's like this is like the epicenter of everything, you know, like every business problem is a people problem. Like, so many things can be solved by just getting the right people in the room. Yeah. So like, for me it felt like everything, you know, so I know things are different now and there's a lot more HR education in colleges, but sure.

Seems like there's a lot of resources outside of college, like once you're in the field, right? There's a lot of resources.

Yeah. There's a lot of organizations and support and things like that. But, and there are some people who think, think and I've interviewed with these people that like HR has to be a certain flavor. Like you have to be like an education HR person or you know, a government HR person. But you know, I've never done HR the same way twice. You know, it depends on the industry, it depends on what you want to accomplish, it depends on what the organizational strategy is. And then I can work backwards and get the right people there and put the right, you know, HR strategy in place and build a roadmap to get you there. So, so you're right. Like that's one of the wonderful things about the profession is that, you know, I've, I've worked in software, I've worked with a shipping company, you know, and, and it's just people, you know, like it's the same people problems. Yeah. You know, whether they're, you know, loading containers or they're writing code.

Yeah, absolutely. So you are climbing the ladder and doing amazing things professionally during this time. What does family life look like?

So, okay, well, I got married when I was at Rockford and that didn't work out. But I did get my daughters during that time and they're amazing, wonderful people. And so I was by myself for a little while when I was kind of the tail end of Alcoa and spent a few years just kind of being a mom and with my daughters. And then I met my husband Dan and, and he was very much, you know, it felt like we had a whole lot in common. Like his mom was also a night nurse and he had also kind of been in a 10 year relationship that didn't work out. He had two kids too. And we just kind of found ourselves sort of in the same place, you know, in our 30s. We like the same music and you know, all those things that you're just like, oh my gosh, this is like my person.

He passed all the HR tests is what you're saying.

Well, you know, like you say, but like I thought, you know, like the first time I did this I just kind of went willy nilly, like, yeah, marriage. But the second time it was like, you know what, I'm an interviewer. Like I am a professional talent selector. Like I'm gonna employ some of these skills this time. And I'm gonna, you know, make a good decision like I do at work. And you know, lo and behold.

So have you ever considered matchmaking as the second career?

Oh, no.

Oh, that's funny. I don't know if I could do the love part of it, but like, I'm pret at seeing, like, okay, like, you know, I don't care what you do as a job. I get what you're good at. Like, when I was at Rockford, we were looking for speaker engineers, and those are kind of hard to find. So what I started looking for were engineers that designed hearing aids because you understand how ears worked. And if you understand how ears work, you'll understand how to go back and do speakers. So things like that that are kind of transferable. There are all kinds of jobs like that where, like, there's just so much more to it than what you write out in a job description. And, you know, certainly experience is important. You know, having know how and abilities and education, all that is very important. But then you're just going to have some things you're great at, you know, that make you really good at what you do.

When you think of especially small companies who might be hiring and they're hiring on their own, what do you think that they should be considering? That might not be the first thing that comes to mind for a small business owner.

Yeah, so I worked for a little while for a software company called shipworks in St. Louis, and they were an online shipping company. And back when ebay was coming up, you had a lot of small mom and pops who like, weren't that sophisticated with E commerce. And so that's kind of where, where they fit in and would get things organized and shipped for them. And so when I joined, it was like four people in a room who were like, listen, we just signed this deal with the post office and UPS and like, we need to be like, you know, way bigger. And so there was a lot of investment in looking big. And so I knew from an HR perspective, like, how do I offer big company benefits? I know how to do some of those things. But we had an experience where there was an outage of some kind and customers were calling in and you know, some folks were doing the can I speak to your manager thing. And so like finally got to the owner and he said, listen, we're a small company just like you. And so here's what we're experiencing right now. And that person totally understood it. But there are some unique things about being small that you should leverage. Not everybody wants to go work for GE or some huge conglomerate. A lot of people really love the feeling of being noticed and that their contribution is visible and that they show up and they don't work with this. This team. They work with, you know, Joe and Becky and, you know, whoever, and. And so there's a lot of wonderful things about being small that you want to hide and not talk about because you want to look big. But when you are kind of honest and open about those things, like, people are gonna. I mean, it's like anything else. People are gonna gravitate toward that authenticity about who you are. And, you know, we know that there's not necessarily a connection between stability and organizational size. Like, you can get laid off at a huge company just like a small one. There are always going to be risks associated. But embrace what is unique and special about you, and the right people are going to find you. It's okay to turn some job seekers off. You don't want a bad fit. Be who you are. You don't need everybody. You just need the right people and be specific and know what it is you're looking for, and it's more likely you'll be able to find them.

I really appreciate that because I do think oftentimes small businesses start out with a mindset that they're at the disadvantage.

Right.

Yeah.

But that is not necessarily true. Right. And, you know, I've worked at huge companies and small ones, and there are some wonderful, unique things about working for a small organization.

And even when it comes to letting someone go, I think small businesses ride it out longer sometimes because they have that relationship.

Absolutely. Yeah. It's. There's a saying I live by, like, you never name the Sunday hog because, you know, once you have a name, you know, make sure professors know your name. You know, they'll give you the benefit of the doubt. It'll be harder for them to fail you. Right. Like, when people know your name, there's a lot of. Yeah. You're not just, like, a name on a list that they're gonna send a package to.

Well, I'm glad you clarified the meaning, because I saw this listed. I was gonna ask. I got it.

Now you've named your hog. Is that what you're saying?

Well, I'm gonna. All right, take us back to the journey.

Back to the journey. Here we go. So what's going on in the future? What's next?

So, well, Delta Dental of Arizona, like, we have a new CEO. We. He's been on board, Michael Jones, for two years, and this has Been a really great opportunity for me because he showed up and I, you know, presented my HR strategy like I always do, kind of half expecting, like, to have to explain a bunch of things. And he, like, kind of almost stopped me halfway through and was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I get it. Like, okay, what. What's the plan? How fast can we go? And I was like, yes, I love you. Thank you. So. So we've just been working on strategy, doing some foundational things. You know, we're looking at other things that might be complementary to what our offerings are now, various partnerships, and, you know, there are. There's a whole lot of things that are. Are possible that we can do as an organization. And we're really embracing the part of our mission that's around providing a path to better health and wellness, that your teeth are a part of your body. And it's kind of weird that they're seen as so separate, but, yeah, like, this is a part of the entire part of considering your personal wellness. So what other things go along with that? You know, we're a wellness company, too, and so when you don't define yourself strictly along terms, like, I, you know, we. We just do teeth, you know, what else makes sense for us to do? So. So it's been a very exciting time for us. We're growing, and it's, you know, it's a lot of fun internally, too.

Wouldn't it be great if you go to the dentist, get your hair done and a head massage all at once? Like, that's all related.

I actually don't think this is gonna work out too well.

Yeah, sometimes people get a little nervous at the dentist.

I'm okay to maybe get a head massage, but my hair done at the dentist just seems. I don't know, chemicals.

I mean, you're already in the chair, you know.

Right.

So that's where I'm going with that, by the way. Maybe you get your pedicure or something like that.

Maybe that's far enough away from my mouth, I might be okay.

I'm giving you all these ideas.

That's great. Yeah. I'll write those down.

Yeah. Would you? Yes. She's not writing any of this down. What do you do? I know that you work hard and you maintain a family life. What do you do for you?

Oh, that's such a great question. So I ask myself that sometimes. I like my alone time, and I have a daughter who's super extroverted who just doesn't believe me that I'm like, no, really, I'm Fine. You know, I. I like, you know, I'm getting a little bit more into self care, you know, getting my facials and, you know, other. Other stuff done. I love being outside. That is just so kind of like.

You mentioned fishing and outdoor stuff like that.

I love hiking. I love, you know, being in Prescott. There's such great hiking and fishing up there. Yeah. Like, being outside just somehow, like, recharges my batteries. I like that.

Yeah. I think self care is so important. Very. And now we know that we are going to be able to get our pedicures at the dentist, so maybe something to look forward to if that happens.

If that happens, we'll know where you heard it first. That's about all I got to say.

And then Jolene will go into matchmaking, so.

Sure. Yeah.

We've got a whole plan for you.

Yeah.

Okay. So Delta dental, you say Delta dental is today. Do you see anything beyond that for you?

Oh, gosh. You know, like, every job I do, I think, well, this is where I'm gonna retire. You know, like, I always just put everything into it, and that's all there is. I love the organization. I love where it's going, and it would not bother me one bit if, you know, this is the last job I ever have. I would love that. Yeah. So, like, I'm thinking more about, like, I've got a daughter graduating from ASU in a few days. Got another one behind her. You know, like, we've just got so much family stuff, and I. I really like the ability to, you know, post pandemic where it all just kind of merges into one, like, smoothie of a life.

That's so true.

And, you know, it. I. I like, now post, you know, pandemic that you're able to think about all those things at. At once, and somehow it all fits.

Yeah.

So, yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

Good. Well, thank you for being here with us today. This has been a great conversation. Loved hearing your journey. Loved hearing all the interesting stories of hr.

Yeah, there's lots I couldn't say.

I'm sure. I'm sure.

Maybe we'll write a book someday.

That'd be fun, huh?

Yeah. All the names will be changed.

Absolutely.

Well, thanks for being here.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks.

And I enjoyed this conversation. I know you did, too. So subscribe to our tribe. So you get these in your inbox and learn more when we have great guests like Jolene. Thanks for being here. Guiding growth conversations with community leaders.

Ben, let me ask you a question. How do you see other community members being involved in this podcast.

This is going to be a great opportunity for so many people in the community to have a chance to be heard if they want to tell their story or if they just want to be part of this journey with us and help sponsor it in a way that helps bring more people to the table with us. So I think there's many opportunities at hand. Whether you want to again be on the show, reach out to us, let us know what your story is and how you think you could be part of it. We'd love to hear from you. Reach out, let us know, and we'll see if we can make that connection. Connection.