Maria Hesse

Guiding Conversations with Community leaders.

In this podcast, we'll explore the human journey of leaders, their stories of humility, triumph, roadblocks and lessons learned. Come join us as we journey together and uncover the questions you've always wanted to know. This podcast is brought to you by the Gilbert Chamber of Commerce, providing resources, connections and belonging for business professionals and.

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We have a legend in our midst.

I love legends.

This guest grew up in a military family and was the middle of five children. While working on her MBA at Arizona State University, she stumbled upon a weekend job in education where she found a passion for working with students and turned this passion into a lifelong career serving Arizona's education community for more than 45 years, including 25 years in the community college system. When she decided to retire, her alma mater had other plans. Today she is the professor of Practice in Higher Education program at Arizona State University. She has lived in Gilbert for more than 30 years where she and her wife raised their daughter. She is the warm, humble, thoughtful education and community leader we have all come to Revere. Please welcome Dr. Maria Hesse.

That is one long intro. I love it. Well done, Sarah.

I actually, can I just say we.

Could have gone on a little bit.

Longer because she has a big story to tell.

Yeah. Well, give you a little kudos every once in a while. I know I was gonna fall over for that one, but hey, welcome to the show. We're so glad you're here.

Well, thanks for having me.

We're excited to hear about your journey. So let's jump into what we call rapid fire.

Fill in the blank. Happiness is family.

What is your hidden talent?

I'm not sure I have any hidden talents. Certainly not cooking. Education.

Okay.

A concert you will never forget.

The Eagles.

Oh yeah. I love the Eagles. Have you ever lived abroad?

Yes, many years.

What is something people get wrong about.

You sometimes thinking that because I'm a little bit more soft spoken that you can't be a good leader. A lot of people think that of women leaders in general.

What makes you hopeful?

Our children. The future.

Are you more of a thinker or a doer?

A little bit of both.

This one's always Interesting. If someone were to play you in a movie, who would you want that to be?

Oh, I should have given that one some thought. Well, who wouldn't want like a Meryl Streep or, you know, somebody really interesting like that? You know, who was it who played in Murder She Wrote? Angela Lansbury. Although she's gone, she would have been perfect.

That's awesome.

That's awesome.

All right, what is your favorite pastime or hobby?

I like to read, watch movies, be with family.

All right, last one. And this is a simple answer. What is one thing you're grateful for?

Family.

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Well, you touched on this a little bit because you come from a military family and obviously you shared with us that you've lived all over the world. So tell us a little bit about your childhood and what that looked like for you.

Well, my dad was a West Point graduate and he came out at the end of World War II. So we spent some time at World War II, the Korean conflict, Vietnam. And he survived all of that and made a career in the Army Corps of Engineers. And so, you know, he married my mom shortly after World War II. We had five children in the family. My mom's mother, my grandmother lived with us. And the eight of us kind of bounced around all over the US and in Europe in various military bases. My parents, you know, when I think back on it, it's just extraordinary to think about how, how they set such a strong foundation when we just moved constantly. All different states, all different countries, different currencies and languages with all these little kids around. But they kept us involved in extracurricular activities. And all of my siblings have done really well. My oldest sister Katherine is a well known attorney in Boston. My brother dan was the CEO and president of AT&T Wireless and then was CEO of Sprint. So he was in the telecom business world. I was the middle child. I ended up in education. The sister just younger than I was a computer analyst. The next youngest sister, the youngest. The baby of the family was in health care. She managed a dental office for years and did other health care things. And so, you know, they've all done well. And I think it's because my parents set such a strong foundation for us.

Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. Learn by examples, for sure.

Well, and I was gonna ask that, like, what is. I'm raising Two kids in my own. What was your parents secret sauce? Like, how did they make this work?

Well, we did have family meals, and I do think that's a piece of the secret sauce that we're missing nowadays. You know, we're in such a rush to get in and out that it's hard to find time to eat together as a family and kind of listen to one another's stories of what happened during the day. And they always made time for that, always family dinner.

Well, and I would guess maybe because you moved so much, you really only had each other in certain instances.

That's right. Yeah. You became each other's support system because often, you know, you'd be in one location for six months and then up and picked up and moved somewhere else where you didn't know anybody or the way it operated there. And so you relied on one another for that support.

Yeah.

In your school years, where's the place you stayed the longest?

College was actually the longest I ever lived in the dorm in one place. I was in the same dorm for, like, three years. We had never lived anywhere that long before, so. But no, I mean, we lived in dozens and dozens of states. You know, when I think about it, Virginia, Kansas, over to Italy, back to Kentucky. Georgia, Omaha, Des Moines, Iowa, over to Pennsylvania, up to Minnesota, back to Germany.

I mean, was there even a reason to unpack? Did you ever hang a picture?

A few times. I lived out of a box for a very long period of time because we didn't know if we would be moved again in a period of time. And you get so that you're pretty good at just keeping your essentials nearby, and you can, you know, adapt as needed. And I think that flexibility actually served me well over the long run in my career.

Right. Do you look back on a certain place as a place you really connected with? Obviously, other than Arizona, is there any place that you.

Oh, I just loved parts of Europe.

Yeah.

I got to go back to some of them this summer. We traveled back and we saw. You know, we never lived in. In the Netherlands area, but my brother did when he was with AT&T. He was stationed international. And so we visited there. We visited parts of Germany where we had lived, parts of Italy, and I just love that area. It's so beautiful.

Yeah. That's amazing.

And you mentioned Kansas, so I have hope that you might be a Chiefs fan. I don't know. It's just a thing.

I happened to see the very end of the game last night. My brother's a big Chiefs fan. He's in Kansas City.

Take it.

Well, I wasn't a Chiefs fan, but Taylor Swift really put him on the map, so.

Oh, yeah, that's right, Taylor, right.

I wrote to my daughter last night and I forget. Oh, I was watching a documentary about Fiddler on the Roof that I thought would be good preparation for seeing it at the Hale Theater tonight. And I said, you know, I really think you ought to watch this. She says, oh, no, I'm watching the football game in case I can see Taylor Swift.

There you go. I always tell people I don't care who comes to the game as long as we win. Bring on Taylor Swift. Bring on Donald Trump. I don't really care, just as long as we keep winning. That's awesome. Well, I want to know a little bit more now, because you're obviously in education, that tends to come from some inspiration somewhere. And so as you look at your parents, as you look at other influences, where do you suppose that came from?

Well, you know, I didn't plan on going into education.

I don't think anybody does.

It was one of those flukes. I was actually doing a master's in business administration, kind of following in my brother's footsteps. He had just finished his. He went out into the business world, was immediately making six figures, doing really well, and I thought, who wouldn't want to do that? I'll do that. And he encouraged me. He was like, hurry and get it done. Come on out. We'll do some things right. And I started working in a school, as you mentioned. You know, it was just a fluke that I started running out of money in graduate school. I went over to career services, found this part time job at a school and began working there and found myself kind of sucked into the environment where I realized, oh, you know, I actually enjoy working with the students. I loved working with the faculty and staff. They were very smart, very hardworking, very dedicated, you know, kind of caring people, the kind of people you could be friends with that you actually would enjoy as colleagues. And then on top of that, all these skills I had learned in the MBA program were so applicable in schools, applicable in any organization, you know, who doesn't need to know about finance and budget and HR and legal issues and project management. I mean, those skills are applicable across every sort of organization. And before I knew it, they offered me a full time job. And I thought, I'll try it. And then I blinked an eye and I was the principal, the person in charge. And so it just kind of grew from there. Wow.

Yeah.

Was There. I still think there had to be. It was a bit of a risk to totally change course. And so many people would have said, I've already come this far. I'm not going to change course now or chase my passion. And I'm wondering, where did you find that courage?

Well, it was not easy because even my own father, who was always so supportive, he was like, oh, my gosh, are you crazy? People don't respect teachers. Education. You can't make money in education. And of course, it's a depression. You're a child. Getting stuck financially stable was just always high on their radar. So he wanted that for all of us, girls and boys alike in the family. And so I think he saw that as potentially a bad career choice. You go into education and you live a life of poverty, which shouldn't be the case, but it often is, unfortunately for teachers in our communities. And I just decided at some point I wanted to do what I wanted to do rather than just doing something to make money and then finding your happiness elsewhere. I wanted to also find happiness during the bulk of my day because I am a workaholic by nature. I just like spending a lot of time at work, and I wanted to be doing something I loved.

I honestly think that's so bold. It really is. I wish more people would see the opportunity in that.

Yeah. I'm always so impressed, too, with the nonprofit leaders in our community who do what they do despite not really making much money or having much personally to take away from it. But they're full on their heart, I'll tell you that.

That is the key, for sure. Yeah. When you're not chasing the money, you can find different kind of satisfaction, for sure. Be great if money was with it, but not always. So Arizona State University, how did you end up there?

Going to school or working there?

Well, school first.

Well, school. It was just another one of those flukes. I was living in Germany at the time, and, you know, it was just fascinating. We had never been stationed in the west, although we had been stationed a lot of other places in the world. And here was this interesting area where the geography was different, the cultures, the blend of Native American culture and kind of the Western frontier culture and the Mexican American culture and was all coming together. It was just interesting and different and felt like there was still something new and vibrant. So when I came out, you know, keep in mind, this is a long time ago now. This was, you know, like in the early 70s when it was very different here than it is now. It was just. It was Fascinating, you know, in every way. Beautiful in lots of different ways. And so I came out to go to school and. And I never left. You know, I just found that there were people here I enjoyed. There were places I enjoyed going to and seeing, and it's always been like that.

Yeah. It actually occurs to me as we speak that I think part of your success comes from your commitment to be curious. It seems that you've always had something that allows you permission to explore.

And I love to learn new things. Well, and I think that comes from a military upbringing. You know, you're used to seeing different things and adapting and changing and being flexible and. And I think that has played a big role in my success over time.

Yeah. Okay, so you change course, you're seven years, and you're a principal, and then how do you get into the community college system? And what does that look like?

Another bit of a complete fluke in one's life. So I was beginning to look out of state for jobs, and a friend of mine who was working for the local community college system said, you know, you really need to come over and see the community colleges. And of course, I was really pretty ignorant about what that meant. I never had any friends who attended community college. You know, everybody went off to university. In fact, my parents were shocked that I went to a state university instead of, like a name university. And so, you know, being at a community college was just not something with which I had much familiarity. And she was insistent, and I really respected her. So I went over and she introduced me to the president of Mesa Community College. And here was this smart, articulate, passionate person who showed me around, and he said, you know, I'd really love to hire you as a consultant for the college because I need help with strategic planning. I need help connecting to the high schools, which I was part of the local principals group. I need help putting in new technology systems. I was really interested in doing all of that. And what I found over time is that the mission and vision of community colleges, offering opportunity and access literally to anybody who's willing to go and work hard, regardless of how they start out, was very aligned with my own values. And so it was just a good fit for me. And again, it was one of those things where people were like, what are you doing? Why would you take a job at a community college? Why aren't you going off to the university or. Or to private prep school or something like that? But there was just something about what they were doing at the community college that seemed so important and so Worthwhile that I thought that's a great fit for me. You know, it aligns with my own personal mission and goals.

Well, and clearly it did, because you committed 25 years of your career to our community college system and certainly left an incredible mark on that system. I'm curious, what are some of the highlights of your time spent in our community colleges?

Well, I love them all. I started at Mesa Community College, went to South Mountain Community College for a little bit, down to the district office for a little bit. But I spent the bulk of my years there, 22 years at Chandler Gilbert Community College right here in this community. And, you know, when we started, we were just tiny. We were located at what is now the Chandler Boys and Girls Club on, well, you know where it's at. Near the railroad tracks in Chandler. And our staff was so small that all six of us could fit around the picnic table when we had staff meetings. And we were building the campus that is now at Pecos and Gilbert Road. And I think one of my most fun experiences there was building a college from the ground up. I mean, who gets to do something cool like that, you know, where you're involved in every aspect, you know, establishing the culture of an organization, deciding upon facilities, making decisions with the community about which programs and services to offer. We were growing with this community. And When I left 22 years later, you know, we had three campuses, more than 18,000 students, a vibrant array of different programs and everything. Workforce development, transfer, gen ed, developmental and remedial education, credit and non credit programs, Just so many things. And I love the fact that I was able to be a contributor to that work. And I love the fact that the community was so very supportive of the college because they understood that the college was going to be integral to the. The growth and the development of this community. You know, offering programs not just for their families, but that their businesses might need.

As you look back at those years. Oh, I'm sorry, Ben, did you want to say anything?

Oh, you just keep rolling.

I'm just having a great time.

I love it.

As we.

As you look back at those years, are there individuals that stand out as really helping you along the way or serving the purpose of advancing Chandler Gilbert Community College?

Well, my parents were always a fantastic sounding board, as were my siblings at the college. Arnett Ward, the founding president of the college, was a real mentor over time to me. You know, she was the first black woman college president or university president in the state of Arizona. Very unusual at the time because, remember when we were starting the college this is back in the 1980s. You know, these communities were very white, very, you know, non diverse. And so it was a very bold move for the community college system to select her to become the leader. And she had very interesting ideas about what she thought needed to be done to make sure that the college served all portions of this community, all the populations in this community. And I found that really inspiring. Yeah.

And as you mentioned, her memory comes back for me, attending a Chandler Gilbert Community College graduation at Chandler center for the Performing Arts. And she sang.

Oh, my God, she had such an amazing voice. Yeah, she was a beautiful musician, but, I mean, she used her. Her voice to inspire students and employees, and, you know, she was just amazing that way.

Amazing.

Yeah. She put herself out in a difficult climate in that time and did amazing things.

And now the college celebrates 30 years, I think this year.

30 years of being separately accredited. We started as an extension of Mesa Community College. And so when we first were separately accredited from Mesa, that was 30 years ago now. Hard to believe.

I know. Amazing.

So you transitioned out of that into what next?

Well, I went to ASU next, you know, the university that maybe I should have been. Other people thought. Other people thought maybe I should have started at.

So you fulfilled their dreams.

Forgot the 25 year little interim stint that I just loved. It was just a fluke. The university administration invited me to go to lunch. I made the. The assumption that they wanted to talk about our shared locations at what was the former Williams Air Force Base. They had just begun their polytechnic campus out there. We had a portion of acres out there that we had been given for the Chandler Gilbert Williams campus. We were both offering aviation. And so I thought, well, maybe it has to do with our shared lands or programs we have in common that could feed into each other. And to my great surprise, just on the spot, they offered me a job. And, you know, normally you have to apply for jobs. At least that's always the way it worked in other jobs I applied for. So I was really surprised that the president and the provost were basically saying, no, we've looked at this, and we want you, because we want to dramatically change the way things are working for transfer students, for students who begin at a community college, but who still want to finish a baccalaureate degree, and we need to do better, and we want to do better, and we believe you're the person, you know, to put in charge of this for us. So, you know, I was initially flattered, and then I was kind of stunned when I heard what their goals were to more than Double the population of transfer students at the university. I thought, well, that sounds kind of unrealistic. Has that ever been done anywhere in the US and so we searched to find schools that had done this, and there was nobody who had done that. And so I summarily marched in and said, I'm not sure that this is a realistic goal. And they said, well, we're going to leave it. It's a stretch goal, but this is what we're after. President Crow just takes no prisoners in that regard. When he sets goals, he intends for them to be met. And people rise to the occasion. And I was really glad to have a team that was ready to rise to the occasion because they had moments, I think, of feeling a little hopeless and helpless, you know, like, oh, my God, what have I gotten myself into? You know, usually these education jobs are really stable as long as you don't do anything wrong. You know, here was a job. And they knew heads were rolling at the university for people who didn't, like, get goals addressed. But it seemed like a really fun challenge and, like, you know, like, who wouldn't want to try to do something big like that? Sure. And so we kind of gathered force, and it was great. I spent 10 years as the vice provost. We nearly tripled transfer student enrollment in that time. We did a lot of good things. I, during that time, was also teaching graduate classes and doing a few other things, and that actually led me into the transition of what I'm doing now at the university. So after 10 years as vice provost, I kind of semi retired this time. I didn't announce that I was going to really retire. I just announced that I was going to try to slow it down just a little bit. So now I'm in kind of a halftime capacity. I teach graduate courses. I serve on dissertation committees. Heard a fabulous dissertation defense yesterday. Just absolutely outstanding. You know, I serve on master's thesis committees, handle occasional projects for either the administration or the school dean. And it's still a lot of fun. So I'll stay at it for a few more years, probably until they kick me out.

Well, I'm not sure that that's ever going to happen. I know in your spare time, which I'm not sure you have a lot, but you do a lot of work with our nonprofit community, and you have a lot of passions, and I'd love for you to share some of those nonprofits that you work with and why they're important to you.

Well, we were at a recent event that it was a fabulous event that East Valley Partnership put on about women's empowerment. And the keynote speaker really hit the nail on the head with a number of things. But she's the new CEO of the Arizona Community foundation, and she was talking about the nonprofit world and how much nonprofit money actually goes to helping young girls and women. And do you guys have any idea what percentage? So if you think of the billions of dollars that go to support nonprofit organizations, you know, people in the audience were guessing 30%. No, lower. 2010. 5. No, no, no, lower, lower, lower. And she finally discloses it's like 1.6% of all of the money contributed less than people give to pets. Now, I'm a pet lover, but I mean, that people would give more to pet related nonprofits than to help women and girls. That just doesn't make any sense. So to me, I'm very much into helping nonprofits that are working with families and or women because women still bear the brunt of child rearing. So when you want to help families, the key, I think is helping women in the families because they're going to influence the children, which is the next generation. And you can put an end to intergenerational poverty if you can get the mom educated and in a sustainable income, you know, something stable because it keeps the children. Of course, when you can get a decent income in the family, you're putting food on the table, you typically have good childcare, you have children who can read and so forth. And it just, you know, makes its way into the next generation, builds upon itself for sure. So, yeah, I'm very committed to Positive Pass, which is a nonprofit that does scholarship and mentoring programs. Boost a foster family located right here in Gilbert, my neighborhood. Yeah, they're a fabulous organization. Another great way to help is to keep foster children in kinship families. 100 plus women who care. A really easy way for women to network with one another while also making a collective impact in the Community Assistance League of the East Valley HD South. There's a lot of fabulous nonprofits in this community.

That's amazing.

I can't imagine memorizing all those. So it's a lot.

So I'm curious. You've spent 30 years in our community. Tell me what makes you proud to live here in Gilbert? And also, what is it as you look to the future that you hope our community can do better?

Well, I do love it here in Gilbert, and people often ask me why I stay. And I think part of it is that, you know, it was like a pioneering community when I moved in in 1990. 91, thereabouts. Gilbert was tiny, and it has grown, but you still have this kind of hometown community feel here, which I wouldn't trade for anything. A lot of people don't even know their neighbors. We know all of our neighbors, and they know us, and we feel good about that. You know, it feels like home to me. And, you know, I don't think we'll be moving. Yeah, this will be where we'll end up.

Absolutely. Yeah.

My daughter and her husband live in Gilbert, too. And I hope they don't move.

Right. I hope they don't either.

So let's look a little bit to the future now. You kind of hinted to that, but what's on the horizon for you?

Well, at some stage, kind of real retirement, but not yet, probably.

Now, what would that be for you? I gotta imagine it's gonna consist of travels and other adventures and things like that.

Well, I'm hoping maybe eventually grandchildren, travels, you know, all of those things that just kind of enhance and make life all the more fun in later years.

Okay, Well, I am so grateful that you joined us today.

Oh, my pleasure.

I appreciate all the lessons that you've shared and honestly, all the service that you've given to our community and to our education system. You are a true leader. You have a way of directing a crowd and a meeting, and very grateful to have observed you over the years. So thank you so much for all you do.

Oh, thanks for having me.

And I've just enjoyed listening to you. You've got such a great storytelling voice. You should just read books and audio record them. I think I could just listen to them all day long.

We've got a podcast studio for that.

Well, some people have that gift.

And you definitely have idea for retirement.

There you go. There you go. All right. Well, I know you enjoyed this show because I absolutely did. And I know Sarah probably did, too. Sometimes she looks like she doesn't, but this time she did.

I did.

So if you did enjoy this, join our tribe. Subscribe and you can get these into your inbox. We love having you join us and listen to the next one One. Thanks for being here. Guiding growth, conversations with community leaders.

Ben, let me ask you a question. How do you see other community members being involved in this podcast?

This is going to be a great opportunity for so many people in the community to have a chance to be heard if they want to tell their story or if they just want to be part of this journey with us and help sponsor in a way that helps bring more people to the table with us. So I think there's many opportunities at hand whether you want to again be on the show. Reach out to us. Let us know what your story is and how you think you could be part of it. We'd love to hear from you. Reach out, let us know and we'll see we can make that connection.