EP23 Sarah-Anne Brault - Triathlon - Olympian

This is the Empowered athlete podcast, episode 23.

On this empowered Athlete podcast, we've got Sarah Ann Breaux. She's a triathlete, a 2016 Olympian, and I've been so fortunate to work with her in her younger years just getting into the sport. She is an aerobic beast and an incredible human being. Let's dive in. It's frisky.

February 1230 challenge is going on all year, and February is frisky.

When we made this challenge, I had no idea we'd be going public with this. I swear, we just wanted to have our own personal growth.

It was. It started as a conversation on the couch of how we could challenge ourselves for a month with no meet. And then we thought, let's go all year. And eventually it grew into, let's invite everybody after we had already decided what this challenge might be.

So, Kari.

Yeah, I think this is the absolute hardest challenge to talk about, and we really want to respect everyone's life situation. So here it is. Frisky. February is a little love action, nookie, shebang, shebang. Getting it on, whatever you want to call it. It's sex daily.

Daily.

Mm.

Best month ever. But seriously, here's the reality. Many of us have never had healthy, open, frank discussions about sex, and therefore, it becomes that taboo topic. I definitely didn't chat about these things with my parents, that's for sure.

Or your kids. I had to working on it. Here's what Paul and I know. If it isn't happening, then we're not even close to being really healthy and connected in our marriage. And it's a very healthy and important part of every relationship.

We realize and acknowledge that everyone is different and in a different situation.

So.

So you could be single, could be long distance, et cetera. So make this challenge work for what's going on in your life.

Have fun with it. Get creative. Keep the spark. Try something new, and be brave. This is all about love and connection. If you think we've lost our marbles, then you know you don't have to listen to our challenge this month. We still love you, but we hope you'll consider. Consider what we're doing.

So get in the game. If you're not already the 12:30 challenge, you just subscribe via the link in the show notes.

And.

And we're doing this all year long, so February is a little crazy. If you want to skip this month, join us for March. It's going to be great all year. Let me take you back to the summer of 2008. It was my first summer not playing for the national team, I had it off. And I got to train the entire summer with Kari on a specifically made program that was tailored to me. My injuries, my body, and my goals for that next upcoming season. And I was 34 years old. Well, the result went back over to Turkey and won a European cup in incredible physical condition. Thank you to that program setting me up for the perfect season. Well, now you have access to the exact same thing. Hit email ksempowerconditioning.com that's KS for Kari Schneider. And get started on one of Kari's incredible online training programs. The program is tailored to you. It has video of each exercise you're doing so you know what you're doing. Your reps are laid out, the sets are laid out. You can't go wrong. Reach out now to reach your best.

Welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast, created to support athletes in their pursuit of excellence and inspire others toward their best lives. Hosted by Kari Schneider, coach to top performers in sport and life, and Paul Durden, former national and professional volleyball player.

Hello, everyone. Paul Durden here, and I have a huge smile on my face. The reason for that, Sarah Ann Breaux is joining us today on the podcast along with Kari Schneider, my co host. And Sarah is just someone who lights up a room. She puts a smile on your face. We've been chatting before getting rolling here, and we're already laughing. And we're so glad to have her on the show, as she describes it, and meeting Kari. She said Kari taught a bunch of skinny, scattered triathletes how to do Olympic lifts, stay focused on quality work in the gym and bring professionalism to her work. Well, Sara Ann learned that lesson. She became a pro, represented Canada at the Olympics and triathlon. And Sara Ann, we are so excited to have you here.

Well, Paul, I think I'm just as excited to be here as you are. This is great.

So, Sarah, it's been so long since we've spoken. It seems like a lifetime ago, but, you know, you've come so far in your career. It's been incredible. So can you, you know, from a Commonwealth Games to, you know, junior Pan Am championship to being an alternate for 2012 Olympic team, but then you, you know, you reach that ultimate goal of making it to the Olympics. But I'm sure that that all sounds good for the outside listener. But what. Take us back. Take us back to kind of what. What got you into triathlon? And tell us a little bit about your journey.

Yeah, it's, it's, it's funny. When you list off all those accomplishments, I get all these, like, good. Good memories and bad memories rushing through my head. So I think. Glad to have the opportunity to talk a little bit about that today. So, yeah, you. I, Kari, I actually met you at the very beginning of my journey. I had. So you were my very first strength coach when I joined the Manitoba. What was it called back then? The Manitoba National Triathlon center. Mntc. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

So because I grew up in Winnipeg, and I think I was. I think I was 15 or 16 when Gary found me. Yeah, I was a swimmer and a bit of a runner back then, and he, like. I like to say that he found me because that's kind of what happened. He kept tabs on all the kids around. Around the city and figured out I had a little bit of talent and got. Got me to buy a bike. And then I had some success pretty. Pretty early on. We had a really good. It was a really good program for juniors in Manitoba. I was really lucky to be in that environment, I think, and because my very first year, I think I had a road bike for a few months, and I went to nationals for triathlon and qualified for worlds and raced all around the country that summer. And that was. That was. That was really the start, I'd say feels like quite a while ago, but at the same time, it was like yesterday.

It's. It's amazing because, you know, I think back then, and it was. You already had so much of the running ability and the swimming ability, and he just had to plop you on a bike. Some of the athletes I remember back then, like, some of the athletes, he'd be like. He'd be trying to get them to be able to swim. And that was a whole. A whole other beast in and of itself. But. But you were really. I mean, you had the work ethic. If I think of you back then, you had the work ethic. You had the drive. You were also so positive all of the time. And then at the same time, you know, there's that little je ne sais quoi, that little extra, that little. You like my French? I know you appreciate that.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah. That was perfect. That was perfect. Thank you.

I love when you speak French.

Yeah.

Yeah. Thanks.

And then.

But you had that something that then you could, you know, you could still keep pushing and driving to progress. And so what was. What would you say was the first real taste of, you know, that success that made you want to. Made you hungry for more?

I just. When I think back of that time, there's not very negative, not very many negatives. Especially that first year I just had so much fun.

Yeah, it was such a great group too, wasn't it?

Like, I still talk to a bunch of them now.

We have personalities like fun people, hilarious people.

Yeah, it was just really easy. It didn't. It. When I. When I first started, it didn't feel like. Because I had, I. I had. I was a swimmer first and I didn't have as much success as that. So I think even though I was younger, I could appreciate what it meant to be successful. And I think part of it is hard work, as you said, but part of it is also genetics. And I had a lot of support, I think to develop, develop that. And the group, the group was awesome. It didn't feel like work at all, I think. And then also I always. I've realized around my kids throughout my career that I always perform quite a bit better when there's no expectations, when I don't really know what to expect. And I. Every race was a new experience and I just. I just loved it.

When did it start to get tougher for you?

Well, I think all Taipei athlete personalities. It's hard when you're not as good as you think you should be or as good as other people expect. But usually it's self inflicted. And so after my first year, I did great. I won a few races, qualified for worlds. And then the next year was a little bit tougher. I seemed to have trouble swimming in races. It wasn't going as good. Gary didn't know what was going on. And I think it is just that the novelty wore off a little bit and I had to back up what I did last year. And honestly I thought I was great. Yeah, I had just made it to worlds my first year. I had a good training team. I didn't really know any better. And then I had the few tougher races where I didn't perform where I should. And that was kind of hard. But I think I feel like I went through that cycle in different parts of my career. Every time I try something new, it's pretty. It's easy at first and then it kind. After that first success it gets really hard for me. But you have to go through that and then on the other side you come out so much stronger. And then my last few years, juniors of junior were quite good, I think and I. It's a much different mindset once you've had a little bit of setbacks and hardships.

So were you like in those early times? When you'd go through that cycle of going, okay, I performed really well, and then it feels really good, and then maybe not performing as well and having to work harder going through those cycles, you still maintained the love for the sport, like the love for the race, the love for the training. Because there's so much volume in triathlon. It's one of those, you know, when I think of some of the grueling sports that take a ton of training, it's the swimming and the rowers and the triathletes and there's so much volume. But, you know, if you don't still really love putting that work in and love the racing, it's going to get miserable pretty fast. So you must have still loved it. What were some of the things that kept the love for it or kept the. The drive for it? Like what kept the spark?

You know, sometimes I think back on it and I just think triathlon is such a ridiculous sport and it doesn't really make any sense that we all did it. But I mean, I did it for 10 years. There must have been some reason why I did it. But I honestly, I really did. Like, I enjoyed swimming, cycling and running. I really did. Some of my favorite trainings were when we would just have an easy run to do and I would get to run for like an hour and a half. And I still run and bike and swim a little bit, even though I don't have to. So I think at the base that's what you need to get through those low points. You actually have to enjoy the sport. And I don't think that's necessarily everybody. So that helped a lot. And we talked about the group that also helped a lot. That makes a big difference. I had a great environment whenever I didn't perform. It wasn't no one like I didn't get blamed. It wasn't that I was bad, it was just that I had a bad performance. And I think I was taught how to view those in that light pretty early on. And that helped throughout my career.

How did you learn that? Who taught you that? To not really take it personally to understand that it wasn't you.

I think it came from everybody environment. So we had Gary was the coach and then Adrian was the sports psychologist. And she was awesome. She was, she was really, really good at putting things into perspective. And you have to understand what went wrong. And I think if you look at that, then you can understand that it's not necessarily you. It's just maybe one bad performance. But you as a person aren't isn't wrong. And I think my parents also were great. They got involved, but not too much. They didn't understand all the nuances of triathlon necessarily. So they didn't judge or they just wanted me to be happy. And I think it's not easy for parents to be a parent in a high performance sport. I've seen a bunch of different types and I appreciate that it's not easy, but I think my parents did a great job. So all of that put together made it so that I could enjoy what I was doing and I had the resources to train as much as I needed to and as much as I could.

Yeah, it's huge because you, some of the parents, you, you can tell right away, you can tell that they are living vicariously through their child instead of supporting their child.

So it, that's really hard on the athlete. So.

Yeah. Yeah. And what there's. So you, you've got this level of success and what most people don't understand is those worlds that you were qualifying for, a lot of that was in high school. What, how were you able to. For some young athletes out there who are trying to make that next step and potentially go to a school in the US or, or get a scholarship, how did that go?

So that wasn't necessarily all planned. I did triathlon, but then I also raced track nationals, so I had a few track times and I raced cross country nationals and the coaches scout. I ended up going to West Virginia. Coach came up to me. There was a few other schools, but I also know about other triathletes that just sit, send out letters like. And I, I don't regret, not like I'm really happy with how it turned out, but I love that because they just took ownership for what they wanted to do. Like I have. So Marianne, she, she was, she went to three worlds with me and she decided she wanted to go to school where there was a beach. So she sent a bunch of letters and she wasn't all that. She wasn't as. Like her times weren't as fast as mine. But she went to school in San Diego and she had a full scholarship for four years, I think. So, like, don't be afraid to put yourself out there or ask or see what's available and ask, but ask a lot of questions. It's not everyone that succeeds in the NCAA system. For me, I think it was really, really good, but ask a lot of questions and it's hard sometimes. It was hard sometimes when I was picking what to do because I could have stayed in Canada and done triathlon focus still try to go to school. I could have stayed at school in Canada and get. Go run track for them or there was this NCAA opportunity. So there was a lot of things and that was a really. That was quite a stressful time in my life because no one would tell me what to do. I had to decide myself. Yeah.

And because so few people had been in that same situation. So you don't know who to ask or who to.

I didn't really have any, but role models per se that did that went to the US On a track scholarship and then became really good triathletes after, which is what I wanted to do. Now there's probably 10 of them on the circuit that did just that. There was. Back then there was nobody that had gone to the US on a triathlon ship and become a best in the world triathlon. Yeah.

Successful.

And what three. You know, you say you need to know the questions to ask. So you're one of those role models now to young triathletes. What. What would you put in their toolkit for questions to ask? What maybe are your top two or three things that they should be asking schools if they're considering going there?

I think they need to understand the coaching and what the coach actually wants for them and for the team and the coaching philosophy. That's not necessarily easy when you're younger, but I think that's what makes the biggest difference. Because if the coach is focused on like think school is important, then your life is going to be a lot easier. If you actually want to go to school as well. Understand who goes to that school, what the atmosphere on the team is. When I was recruiting, you get to go for a visit so you get a pretty good idea of the personalities on the team and the atmosphere. And that's why I picked West Virginia because it was just so. It was such a nice atmosphere and good team and I feel like I could connect with the girls even if it was just one weekend. But yeah, the coaching I think is massive. And just the environment that you're in, trying to understand how that's going to be.

So for you, though, you were competing in indoor and outdoor track and cross country. How did you maintain your competitive edge in triathlon if that was the main focus when you were at school?

I always believe in having like. If you have a focus and you focus on that entirely. So back then my focus was running. That's why I was there. That's why they paid me and I was lucky enough that whenever I had the chance, I would go swimming, I would ride my bike, I would race in the summer. I had a lot of fun with it. There was no pressure because it wasn't my main focus. I think my favorite summer ever was in 2011, just before, like, the 2012 Olympics, I guess. And I just spent the whole summer traveling around the country and training with random groups and racing a little bit, and Gary would kind of oversee it, but whenever I would be, I was in Victoria for a couple weeks, and I would just train with the Victoria people. And I don't think I lost this. I think I won every single race I did that summer. It was. It was great, but it was kind of a. After. Not. Yeah, it was a bit of an afterthought. It was. Well, maybe not an afterthought, but it wasn't a priority. But I was able to put all the energy that I had when I had it into that. That was a lot of fun in that time.

When you were approaching the 2012 Olympics, how did you. How did you find out that you were being considered or that you might be able to go to the Olympics or you might be considered as an alternate? Like, what.

How.

Yeah, I think that was a. I.

Think that was a nice story, actually. So I raced all of summer 2011, and I knew I still had one or two years at school. I think I still had two years at university, and I wasn't thinking about the Olympics at all because I had school to go to. So I remember I was always late for the first few days of school because national championships were always at the end of August, and school started like mid August back in the States. So I got to school, and then my coach was like, well, the track coach asked me what my chances were, and I was so taken aback because I never had actually considered it. But realistically, I was sort of not. It would have been. It would have been a big jump, but there was no one that was a clear favorite to go at that point. So he's the one who actually gave me the green light and said, yeah, go and do this. This is your opportunity. Chances are you won't make it, but, like, try. So, yeah, you have to. And then I think once I came back to Gary with that, he just, like, took in and ran with that. So I think my whole year was organized within, like, two weeks. Right.

Was. Was it not on Gary's radar, where I know you. You were surprised. You just hadn't consider it. And the coach planted the seed. But others watching you compete, watching your progression, was it not in the back of their minds or in the forefront of their minds?

I don't remember. I don't. Because I don't remember people really talking about it until Sean kind of just gave me was like, go for it. I think it was still a little bit of a stretch and I wasn't necessarily on this. I wasn't on the circuit. I would just race, just not local, but I would. I raised con Continental cup also. All season I never even done like a wts, so I wasn't in the same position as a lot of those girls. I don't think. I don't know. I, I honestly, I can't remember if people thought clearly Triathlon Canada didn't because I didn't get much support.

You weren't being contacted? Yeah. You weren't getting contacted or carded?

No, I wasn't getting carded because I was going to school and I couldn't go to worlds and stuff. So they. Yeah, I think I didn't get much support on that end.

That's probably why though, one of the reasons that they weren't following you as closely because you weren't being groomed specifically and only for triathlon. You were running track and. Yeah, probably.

And triathlon wasn't my focus, which, which.

I guess in some ways is that, you know, those are some of the reasons and the drawbacks for why somebody might not choose the scholarship route, of course, if, you know, because. Because it may hamper their chances for staying on track for, for an Olympic quad or that kind of thing. And that's probably one of the reasons too why it was such a surprise because who is going to expect someone a year out from the Olympics to, to really be on the radar when they haven't been training for that whole quad, just.

Oh, of course, of course. And I still wonder maybe I would have made it if I. To London, if I had gone to university in the States. Maybe I'll never know or maybe I wouldn't have been in the position I was to almost make it. So.

Do you regret that?

No, but. No, I don't regret. I think I had a great time at university. I got a degree. Maybe if I had kind of taken some time off for my degree earlier and race through that summer, the 2011 summer, thinking I could go to Olympics, but I don't think there was. I, I don't, like, I don't think I made any mistakes. I think in term, like for my whole life, this was, this was good.

And, and you Were. But you were chosen as an alternate for 2012, right? How did you get that news? Was that just kind of mind blowing or what? What happened there?

That was a little bit. That's still a little sensitive, I think, because.

There was.

It was, it wasn't necessarily an easy decision for Triathlon Canada. And in a lot of ways I, there was a lot of arguments that I could have been on the team, I didn't meet the criteria, so they didn't have to pick me up. But I'm not the only one who didn't meet criteria, so.

And other people got picked, so that.

Was still, that was a bit messy. And even like I was working with Daryl this whole time, our physiologist and Gary, and they still believe that I maybe would get to go as an alternate or that I should have gone. So that was, I think a lot of people underestimate the emotional side of being a high performer athlete. And especially around Olympic time, it was, there's a lot of emotions from all different sides. And as an athlete you're kind of in the middle of that. And I don't think I was necessarily well equipped to deal with that both times. I think both, both Olympic cycles.

Okay, what, what happened for you? How, how were you managing it when, when you found out?

Well, I didn't take it that at first I was fine with it because it was such a long shot anyways and I was really proud of what I'd done up to then. It's just a bit disappointing because obviously you've done all that work and you've had all these people believe in you and invest in you and you just come up just that short. But at the same time, that was just something that came up a year before. Like some people spend the whole quad preparing. I spent a year traveling the world. So.

Yeah, it's funny because in some ways your, you're counting your blessings, you're, you're looking for what you're grateful for, but at the same time, you know, you, we can feel the sting and feel the, of it. Oh yeah. It's like you can taste it and it's just like, oh my gosh. And, and at the same time I can't count. And Paul's experienced this too from a team sport aspect. But I can't count the number of times I've seen the political side of a, of a sport body. So for instance, I'll give you an example for weightlifting. Someone might meet the Olympic criteria in for, for weightlifting to qualify for the Olympics. But then Canada won't send that athlete because they don't have a chance to medal. Or another example would be, I've seen a tennis athlete be seated and again be able to qualify for the Olympics. But, but then Canada won't spend the money to send them. Or like you've experienced in sports like figure skating or other. Different sport bodies will consider different athletes. But even if that athlete has or hasn't met the criteria, it's almost like a popularity contest or a favoritism issue in order to see who gets better picked. But it's not a clear cut. It wasn't ever based on numbers, it wasn't ever based on performances. It was based on, well, even though this person didn't perform, we're going to choose them anyway because we think they might. Or. And it's, it's. I've seen it cause heartbreak over and over again and it's just that political unfairness that it's sometimes soul crushing for athletes and the higher ups or the people making the decisions never really see the fallout after some of the things that are chosen. And yet so many of those sports could make it really easy and clear cut, make it all based on numbers. Like, if this happened, then this happens. Because numbers don't lie. They're right there. And it doesn't always happen that way.

Yeah, no, I think, I think soul crushing is a good, good word that you use there. I like that. And that's what it is. That's what it is. I don't think it can always be based on numbers, but even athletes like numbers because they know what they have to do and it's not a popularity contest. Yeah, it's comforting. Yeah.

Numbers can be very comforting that way. So that soul crushing thing, what was the most. And you, if, when you look at your career, what was the most heartbreaking or the toughest thing that you had to overcome?

We've talked a lot about, like early in my career, but when I think of harder times, I think like leading up to London was a lot of fun and there was no pressure, but leading up to Rio was a little bit different. Like when I talked earlier about the first go around is always fun and no pressure, the second go around leading to Rio was a bit of a different. I was in a bit of a different mindset. It's funny because I actually ended up qualifying for Rio. So it should have been a lot better, it should have been a lot happier. But I was injured going. I got hurt a couple months before and there was another whole big thing to do with a whole another political. I was on the right side of the fence this time, but I still have to prove fitness. And I didn't know if I would actually get to go until like a couple weeks before, I think, because I still had to prove fitness. So that was really, really hard. I still. I got to go and I got to race, but I don't think I risked my potential.

So that.

And I just see that whole year as being. As being really, really hard, not just one moment that was definitely necessarily crushing because you get a lot of chances in triathlon. I feel like even to qualify for the Olympics, there's a few chances. I never made it out right. I never hit the criteria, but I was a bit far off that anyways, like, as an athlete, I wasn't. I was never the best in the world. So it would have been hard for me to hit criteria. But just that here was. Was. Was really hard.

And what was the. What would you say the single most challenging part of it was? Like, were you in a low place and didn't know? Like, were you feeling the pressure to keep going even though you weren't maybe in love with what you were doing at that moment? Were you overwhelmed by what, what you were facing? What was the feeling that that really was the hardest to manage?

Well, I think I've talked a lot about the support system and how it was fun. And I had a lot of people behind me for that first sort of cycle. And I'm not saying I didn't have people behind me for that second cycle, but it wasn't the same environment. I was out training on the other side of the world. And so I was part of this group called the Wollongong Wizards, and it was a international group. So they basically paid the coach. Triathlon Canada paid the coach. So he was a Triathlon Canada employee, but he also had a bunch of Australians that he was coaching and people from all over the world. So we were in Australia and I think In March, we.

No.

1 was performing in triathlon. Canada was falling apart and we lost all funding, I think. So I'm in Australia. The Olympics are like four months away, qualifying isn't done yet, and all of a sudden we don't have a coach, we don't have any support system. We don't know what's going to happen. There was three of us out there, and I think I found that a little bit harder than I thought at the time. Hindsight. I was also. There was like, few injuries that were lingering that I don't think I took care of properly because of the time pressure, because you just have to go. You have to go race, you have to qualify. And yeah, in a different setting, I probably would have played my cars differently. Hindsight and honestly, hindsight, like you asked me if I regretted going to school, that I don't. But I think I regret a few things I did in the lead up to. To Rio. I mean, I would that.

Would that be pushing through injuries or would it be who you have.

Yeah. And not listening to what I felt I needed as an athlete. I think before London, I was training with a bunch of different groups, but Gary was overseeing everything and I was his only athlete that was trying to do that, whereas there, it was great because I was part of this high performance group that, like, don't get me wrong, I learned a lot and when things were going well, it was awesome. But you're just one in like, 12 other people that want to qualify for the Olympics. So I think I got down and I think I lost a little bit of who I was because I was quite. I think as a person, I was that you're different than everyone else. And I was quite different than some of the other people that trained there. And I just tried to be like them because they were faster and that didn't work.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's. It's. There's a couple things that, that you're making me think of and, and number one is that first of all, people assume, most of most people assume that if an athlete's gotten to the Olympics, they kind of have this vision of it, like what may happen in many US Situations where that athlete is sponsored or there's lots of funding money or whatever. And the reality is, is for most of the other countries in the world, they are scratching and clawing to try and find a way just to barely get by with living and training at the same time. And it is such that alone is a stress because, you know, it's the question of making ends meet from a month to month just to keep training, and then let alone you're in this high performance group. So then the second thing that came to me when you were, when you were thinking that or describing this was that I know what it was like for you when you were trained by Gary in those earlier years. And one of the things that he was so gifted at was understanding each person's physiology and customizing and working with the physiologist, but customizing the training for what that person needed and then working with the other professionals. In order to adapt things. And yet when you're in, when you're an individual sport athlete, yet you're in a team environment, there is that pressure to keep performing and you're always looking at the person who's faster than you. But if the coach isn't adapting your workouts to be what's appropriate for you, it's so bloody easy to get overreached or over trained in a way that, that just causes you to break down. So it's, it's a really hard, you know, it's one of those things is survival of the fittest and at the same, and maybe you get through and you become a much better athlete or you drop off because the coach didn't adjust things for what your body needed and who you were in order to be your best. Not just, not just that group's best.

You know, I think at the same time it's about, like you said, it's a balance because sometimes that group can take you to the next step. And I had some great, great times with that group. But, and you said like Gary was really good, but he couldn't do that for every single athlete that he had. He kind of catered the training to his best athletes and I just happened to be one of his best athletes, so. And I don't think I realized that.

Yeah, no, you're, you're bang on, you're, you, your training was, your training impacted everybody else's training. And I'm sure that that's probably part of what you were experiencing in Australia.

But I was on the other side of that. Right.

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. And would you say that you, in your mind, because it's such a, you know, such a long career in such a hard driving sport. Like people don't truly understand the volumes that like I remember when you were in high school, you were training at least 30, 30 hours a week in high school. And so people who aren't triathletes don't necessarily appreciate the kind of volume that goes in, in everything that you've done. And so my question is, when you're driving to be better, are you driven to be the best or be your best?

Well, I think that depends on the athlete. Right. Like, but personally, but for you, if you. I think I wanted to be better, be my best and I, that's why, I think that's why I had such a long career in the first place.

Yeah, it's healthier, it's, it ends up becoming healthier because you understand that improvement is a huge milestone versus Constantly beating yourself up for not outdoing everybody else.

The whole system is built around being the best. Right. So even though internally you want to be your best, you still evolving within this system that you're not going to get recognized, you're not going to get funding, you're not going to get external validation unless you're the best.

Yeah, that. That's the rub.

Because, yes, right.

Being in a game where only the best get the accolades and the recognition, but to be healthy, you have to focus on being your best. So, yeah, it's great you can recognize.

That, but it's hard when you're an athlete to balance those two, I think.

Oh, absolutely. Yep.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. And most athletes are starting at such a young age that as an individual, they're too young to have had the life skills or have ever been taught the skills to differentiate between attaching an outcome to their own identity and that becomes this thing that sticks with them, that they don't feel valuable if they didn't succeed in that game or that event or that competition.

Yeah, I totally agree.

And. And what. So what was. What was competing at the Olympics like? And were you. Was it, you know, amazing, disappointing? Did it. Was it the culmination of so many years? What was it like for you?

Well, the race itself, my performance was disappointing, I think, in a lot of ways. I thought I could still pull it off. Even though there was a lot of, I'd say, drama going into it. And I was hurt.

I still.

Because I'd done it before. It pulled off some nice performances off of not much training, but that was a bit disappointing. And we didn't really get the full Olympic experience. I say, because we weren't even staying in the village for most of it, we only really got to stay in the village for one night. So a lot of people, now that I'm like a normal person, they recognize the Olympics, and for them, that's all they know about sport, is the Olympics. But really, when I think, like, at the end of the day, for me it was just another race. It was the exact same girls that I lined up against every, like, two weeks for the past three years. And I think if you're at the top and you get to experience everything with your country and everything that surrounds it, that's what makes the Olympics, like, don't get me wrong, it was an incredible event. And just to see everything and everybody come together as a country. And I had. I had my parents come. I had actually a couple of friends from when I do so train Back in Winnipeg come. So that was really special. But at the same time it was, it was for me personally, just because I didn't perform right. And it was, it was the end of a long journey, I'd say.

And when were you, when did you decide to retire?

Actually, I wasn't sure after the Olympics. We still had, we still had worlds to do in Cozumel month or two later. So I did that. And that was underwhelming as well. And I still didn't know. It took me a while. It always takes me a while to decide on things, but then once I decide, then I don't usually change my mind anymore. So I really took like, it was a few months into the fall, I think when I decided I wanted to look at my options, I knew I would need to make some changes, but I didn't know exactly what. I was trying to figure out a little bit of who I was after having spent three years in this super high performance intense environment. And then it was just like one day I just decided that, you know, maybe I would be happier without going through another four year cycle. And then I just, I just felt really free after I made that decision. So I, I knew, I knew it was the right one and it was, it's very, it's a very individual decision. Right. There's so many factors that come into play with that decision, but for me it was, it was the right one, I think.

And at the same time, when you speak to happiness, so many people who are in high performance sport, they decide to keep pursuing it because they think that it makes them happy.

Sometimes it does, right?

Sometimes that's, yeah, yeah, exactly. And it does because there's so many things about it that they love and it does make them happy. But sometimes what happens is that their goals end up being so big that they might keep making those happiness sacrifices. Because like you said, there's three years of high performance training to make it to that Olympics. So there's a whole bunch of sacrifices that need to be made along the way. And it's this conscious decision to, okay, I might have one level of happiness because I'm doing my sport that I love, but I'm not getting all these other layers of happiness because I have to make these sacrifices because I'm at such a high performance level. And then when you finally decide, okay, like, I am making a completely different direction in my life, it's interesting to hear what you experience. Is that freeing that a lot of people will describe that weight lifted or that freeing experience or It's. It's almost like you have a whole new look at what?

Life. Well, because all of a sudden you have all these opportunities that you didn't when you had an athlete, when you were an athlete because you had to be an athlete first.

Well, yeah, yeah, it's exactly that. It just opens doors. Because if you make the decision that I'm not going high performance in an instant, it changes what you could eat that day. Literally, though, I'm being completely serious, it changes in an instant what you could eat that day because you might consider eating something that you would never touch for years because it was just so detrimental to your training. You know, how far back that meal would set you. So from something that you're going to eat to. To how late you're gonna stay up to anything that you're doing day in and day out, and the little things that people take for granted, it opens up all those doors. It literally flips your world on its head in an instant. And you can understand why it's so freeing for you.

You know, it's so true. I remember it was around the time I was working with that triathlon group with you guys. Sarah. I was competing for the university for track because I was doing my master's degree at the time, but I was still full time with a sport institute as a strength coach. So I was doing all these different things. But I remember making this decision that, okay, well, if I'm doing all this, I'm not going to have. I used to have maybe a glass of wine or a Bailey's Irish Cream or something like that at night. I used to love that before I went to bed. I used to love my glass of wine or whatever it was that Bailey's Irish Cream. And then I made this decision that, okay, well, I really want to perform well and do well and I've got work and I had a young child, all these things. So I was like, I. Any day that I have training, I'm not going to have any alcohol prior. Like, not even one drink, not even one sip, I'm not going to have any. And then I realized that, okay, well, I'm training almost every day. And so I kind of inadvertently stopped drinking any alcohol because of the decision I made for training. I had put that in a higher category or higher priority than anything else. And it just brought my memory to that because of what you said, Paul, in that as soon as you decide, it suddenly changes all these other things about what the rest of your decisions are for that day. As soon as you decide what the priority, everything else cascades down from what's important and what you will do because of what that decision means. So going forward, you, I think from there. Did you go to do your master's?

Well, it took me like, it wasn't right away that I got my life like flipped around. Takes a little bit of time, but yeah, I suddenly had to decide what I wanted to do, what, who I wanted to be. But I had, I did have my undergrad in. Fine. I had my undergrad in economics and finance and I loved, I really enjoyed my classes, but I hadn't touched anything of that in the past three years at all. I never done an internship. I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do or I kind of knew. I'd known for a few years that I didn't necessarily want to stay in, within the sport. I'd seen a lot of athletes retire and kind of become coaches or struggle to stay relevant when they didn't really have as really much of a spot within the, that sport that was their whole life. And I would rather, like, I decided I would rather learn how to do something else and be really bad at it for a while than try and hang on to something I used to be really good at.

That's a brave decision.

It was really, it was really scary. It was like you said, it was freeing, but at the same time it was terrifying. It would have been a lot easier, I think, for me to actually say, okay, I'll just do another Olympic cycle and keep doing what I was doing. It would have been a lot easier in a lot of ways because it's.

What you know, and as humans we like to, we would rather stay in something that we don't like as much and not change, than change and go to something different.

So I think like, I'm really proud of taking that decision and how far I've come since then, but it's, it's really scary.

So, so you're in a completely different. Are you. So you're in finance now. You've just stepped into having a, a job, right?

I do, I do. Like, it's, I can't even feel, do you feel all. I can't even say it's nine to five because I work more than that, but. Well, not as much as I thought. I thought once I stopped training I would become like a grown up and, but just like I, I, there's still a lot, I still have a lot of freedom. I still like go ride by bike and stuff and I still make a Bunch of mistakes all the time. So I don't feel as grown up as I thought I would with like this fancy finance job. But it's not been, it's been really fun because I've had to learn a lot. I. So yeah, I did, I did. I applied for this master's at McGill. It was just a one year finance masters and exactly what I needed. And I think we had like a little bit of an interview to get in and I think the interview with I was 10 minutes and I think we spent seven of those 10 minutes talking about the Olympics, of course, because.

That'S what everybody wants to know about.

Right. So like I can take some of my background with me and a lot of people really appreciate that and that's helped with the transition. But I realized even though I've kind of changed my life a little bit, I'll always be a high performance athlete. And I can almost, it's almost easier now to understand the difference and what being an athlete means when you're surrounded with people that aren't.

Yeah, yeah. You see the difference in, it's, it's almost like you have a different understanding of discipline than maybe some other people do. And you, you also, you might be able to transition that into your work in a way that some people haven't learned how to yet.

Do you feel 100%? Yeah. Yeah. Performance and like even performance and ownership and teamwork, like all these things. People like to talk about that. But you can see you, you notice it different in normal people when like you just assume that it's the norm and then it's not.

Yeah. Because you've been in a culture that requires. It can only requires it.

It is the norm.

Yeah. It can only succeed with that kind of discipline and that kind of trust among other people. And then you see in a corporate world that companies spend an entire, you know, they spend years trying to develop teamwork within their employees or trying to develop discipline and accountability and all of these things within their employees because they haven't learned it outside of the workplace. So, you know, as an athlete, you come into that as such a valuable commodity because you have these traits, these characteristics that, that a lot of other employees simply wouldn't have learned in regular life.

Yeah. And that's what I've tried to convince people through all the interviews that I took, that athletes are the best.

And you. And you did it because you got the job, right? Yeah, yeah.

No, and the, like the. So I'm, I'm on. I work for a pension fund, but Basically we, we do investments and private investments and that's actually a lot of very, very high performers and very performance driven individual that have to work. Like they, we don't. No one checks when I come in, no one checks when I leave. It's. There's a lot of things that I recognize from high performance sport and I think that's why the, like I was able to make the transition and land this job and enjoy it.

Yeah, because you're self motivated in a lot of.

You have to be in where I am right now.

Yeah. In order to succeed and you have.

To work hard and it's not as clear cut sometimes as athletics. Like there's not, there's not times necessarily to look at to see, okay, you're the best and you're the second best.

Yeah.

But there's a lot of factors that I recognize and I think just knowing that about myself and that's why, like that's what I developed during the sport and that was. I, that's what I was good at. I could kind of go looking for that in the workplace as well. So I think that helped with that transition too.

What do you, what do you see yourself? Where do you see yourself in five years? I don't know, because you're in this now and you're enjoying it. But does the work truly light you up or is it a good fit at the moment? Do you see yourself in this role.

Five years from now?

Or maybe you don't want to say and have your employers here, but.

Well, I like to take it like one step at a time because I think if I set a goal for myself, then I don't actually look at if I'm actually enjoying it at the moment, what I'm doing. Because you're just kind of like. Well, of course I like this because that's my goal, right? Yeah, yeah.

Like you have to. Because you decided.

Yeah, exactly. So. And I think that's a lot of how I've done, how I've kind of lived my life. So I, I think it. Things. You change pretty quickly. Like if I stay there for five years, what I, the work I'm doing now is gonna, the work I'm gonna do, be doing in five years day to day is gonna be quite a bit different than what I'm doing right now. So as I evolved, I'll see. I'm really, I think I'm pretty lucky to be out in Victoria and I like, I like the work, I like the team and it's pretty challenging for now, so Yeah, I honestly, I don't know. I don't know where I'm going to be in five years. I tend to need a little bit of change. I've never lived in anywhere for more than the few years in the past few years, so we'll see. What. How I do it. Settling down.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's scary.

I'm going to. I'm going to wrap up here with a few questions just so that people can get to know you a little better. But what. What would you say you've learned about yourself with regard to your own happiness? Are there certain ways that you know that you can keep ensuring your own happiness? You kind of suggested a couple of them right there about change and that kind of thing.

I think you. I don't. I think I've learned the hard way that you have to trust yourself and not compare yourself to other. When it comes to big decisions and what's going to make you happy. I think if there's anything that I regret is not being myself more and putting more of myself out there. Especially in a world where you're just trying to be the best. So you're just trying to be like other people. But there's so many ways to the top, I think. And even in this finance world, like, I don't fit in. Exactly. But I'm trying to figure out where I fit in and how I fit in and what parts of Sarah do I bring and what parts of Sarah do I need to kind of like, line up. And that's gonna make me a better investor or better at my job. Right. So that balance, I think, is. Is something I've learned the hard way. Well.

And even deciding when it. When it's okay to be imbalanced one way or another.

Yes. Yes. Because I sometimes I do think I learned a lot by looking at how the best do things. And there's a lot of things that I took from that and that makes you a better person. But at the same time, you can't just be like everyone else. Yeah. Yeah. And there's parts of you that are going to be better at sport or at life, but you have to, like, know when to bring those out.

I think it's bringing the. You and knowing who you really are, getting to know yourself.

And that's hard sometimes too, right?

Yeah. Especially when you've been coached to be a certain way maybe for the majority of your life and for people's sports.

And I think girls especially are really good at listening to coaches and people and what they tell you.

Being coachable and then not really understanding who they are after they make their own decisions.

Yep.

What would you say? Just some lighter questions here. What would you say is your favorite food or dessert?

I really like cookies and muffins. Yes. Cookies.

Eh?

Cookies.

Yeah.

That's my weakness.

I think they're really underrated.

Did you? Oh, Paul doesn't think so. He thinks they're the best thing ever.

Yeah.

Did you have favorite pre race meals?

I like it. This is a boring answer. But I tried to keep it pretty open because you never knew exactly what you could get so I didn't want to be too specific. So I would just get like rice and chicken, something like that.

Pretty universal.

Yeah.

Do you have a favorite movie or type of movies?

I kind of like cheesy romantic comedies a lot more than.

You're not the first.

Yeah, you're not the first with that answer. You'd be surprised. Your answer's that way.

And you know, they're horrible. But I still enjoy them sometimes.

They make you feel good. You know what's gonna happen, that it's.

Gonna be good in the end and you don't have to think too hard. Just, you know what's gonna happen when you like within the first five minutes.

Well, S. Sarah, we interviewed Connor Trainor from the national rugby teams. He plays sevens and fifteens and that's his go to as well. So his, his episode is out there. So when yours comes out. Yeah, another on the list.

And are you still. Are you still working out right now? Like are you gonna do some not so competitive racing or you know, is there something that you're doing? Do you have a favorite workout right now?

Well, so the cyclocross scene in Victoria is actually. I didn't really get to ride my bike much in Montreal, but my goal is to be competitive in like the open women's like community race next year in cyclocross.

I don't have a doubt that that will happen. That'll be great.

So yeah, I'm just trying like the, like I, I work, I work quite a bit. So I'm just trying to find the balance that right now. But I like, that's part of who I am.

So that's fantastic.

Yeah.

Do you have a. Do you have a favorite book?

I read like random stuff. I'm actually reading how to win friends and influence people right now.

That's a well known one that is recommended for many people in the business world, that's for sure.

So we'll see if I can do something with That I don't think you'll.

Have trouble in that realm with how likable you are and positive and smiley. So I think that's a good one.

What about a playlist? If you're going on a long ride or run. What are you listening to?

I don't listen to that much. That much music. I'd rather go run with friends.

Oh, that's nice.

Yeah.

And what about. Do you have any hobbies besides cyclocross right now?

Not. Not that much. Like right now, my free time is mostly taken up trying to keep exercising a bit. Does going to brunch on the weekends count? Yum.

Yeah, sure, we can take that. Yeah, I like that a lot. And what about. What would you give as a tip to young triathletes just coming up into the sport? Is there any tips that you would pass along?

That was actually one of your. Your questions on the. On that. I got to think about that last night, and I think. I think people don't. It comes back to what I said earlier about being yourself and daring to be yourself. I think that comes a little bit easier for the boys a lot of times, but especially triathlon, it's such a. In a way, it's a pretty traditional sport and there's a lot of Taipei people and there's a lot of things that you have to do. But I think you have to try and bring yourself into the equation. That's how you're going to be successful and to dare and try things. My most successful and the happiest I was was when I was doing new things and I was trying and I had the opportunity to fail just as much as I had the opportunity to succeed.

Yeah.

So that's. That's great. That's what I miss about and the.

The lack of fear because you're just being yourself and it doesn't matter what anyone else. Thanks. It's just because you're being you.

And that's a lot easier to say than to actually do.

Yeah. Because if we don't fit in, we get scared.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, it might not work. It might not work, and you might not fit in and it might not be the right place for you. Yeah. But if you're not happy, then you're not going to perform.

There is. There is only learning. Not failing, just learning.

Yes. I think that's okay. Listen, famous quote. Yeah.

We really, really appreciate this time with you. It's been fantastic to learn more about all this gap of time that I haven't seen you and Just how what your journey was like and who you've become because, you know, you're still that bubbly, fun, smiley, happy person and so driven. And I know it's going to translate into all these amazing new endeavors that you're doing right now. So we really appreciate the time with you and yeah, we hope to keep connecting and thank you for all your insight into your journey and what it can provide other people and.

Well, I'm just really happy that I was able to do this and talk about my past. I don't usually get to talk about my Winnipeg days very much so. This was, this was awesome. And I just, I have only good memories from working out with you, so it was a little bit of pain. Liar. A lot of pain. But nobody was always happy. You had always so much energy when you came into that gym. It didn't matter if you'd done like a three hour ride before. You just had to just gather up the energy and do those lifts.

So, yeah, those were. Yeah, it was great. It was a great group and great times and yeah, just great memories. And I'm glad that there are more good memories than bad.

Oh, yeah, definitely, definitely.

Well, thank you so much and we're really happy to have you on and we hope you, we wish the best for you.

Well, thank you. Thanks a lot.

Okay. Thank you so much for listening. To get more support in living your best life, find us in our free Facebook community empowered Top performers. We're on Instagram, Paul Jordan and PowerConditioning. Please share this podcast and rate us. A five star review would mean the world to us. That is how we connect with and support more people to excel in sports and life. Take what you learned today and try it. Progress is perfection.