EP25 Gord Perrin - Volleyball - 2016 Olympian

This is the Empowered athlete podcast, episode 25.

Today on the Empowered Athlete Podcast, we welcome Gord Perrin, volleyball star international. We even shared an apartment at one time. Actually, we didn't share it. He moved into an apartment that I used to have in Turkey where Kari and I lived, and he took over and things went well. So must be the apartment, right? No, what it is, is the incredible work ethic that Gord has, and he shares some of his secrets to success in today's episode. Don't miss it. Let's get started.

Let me take you back to the summer of 2008. It was my first summer not playing for the national team. I had it off, and I got to train the entire summer with Kari on a specifically made program that was tailored to me, my injuries, my body, and my goals for that next upcoming season. And I was 34 years old. Well, the result went back over to Turkey and. And won a European cup in incredible physical condition. Thank you to that program setting me up for the perfect season. Well, now you have access to the exact same thing. Hit email ksempowerconditioning.com that's KS for Kari Schneider, and get started on one of Kari's incredible online training programs. The program is tailored to you. It has video of each exercise you're doing so you know what you're doing. Your reps are laid out, the sets are laid out. You can't go wrong. Reach out now to reach your best.

Welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast, created to support athletes in their pursuit of excellence and inspire others toward their best lives. Hosted by Kari Schneider, coach to top performers in sport and life, and Paul Durden, former national and professional volleyball player.

All right, everyone, here we go for another round of the Empowered Athlete Podcast. And we are absolutely thrilled to be joined by a good friend of ours, an incredible athlete, an incredible person. Coming to us today from Belgrade, Russia, it's Gord Perrin, a cornerstone of the men's national volleyball team. I've had the pleasure of commentating Gord's action for almost the last decade, it feels like, but just so excited to have him on the show because we know that he's someone who can teach all of us something about the process to becoming one of the best in the world at what you do. So, Gord, thank you so much for making the time. You're in the middle of your season, you're traveling. I know your mom's visiting you there. So this is time away from family, literally, to do this for us. So thank you so much.

Awesome. Awesome. Thanks for Having me on.

Guys, we're so excited to speak with you. And before we get right into it, Gord, are you. What's it like being in Russia?

Mother Russia?

I'm about 40 minutes from Ukraine, so the weather's not too, too, too bad. There's a lot of snow, but it's not. It's not minus 40, minus 50. But we've played quite a few games in Siberia where it's been very, very cold. But I've been enjoying it. It's a. It's a very challenging league, and I get to play against some of the best players and work every day doing what I love, so I enjoy it no matter where I am.

That's really cool. I know that we, you know, we have a buddy who played hockey in Russia, and we talked to him a bit, and some of the stories he would tell from there, just these kind of. I don't know, it just feels like underground spy stuff in some ways. Everything was just done a little bit differently than where it would be done in Europe or other places. So I was just curious about Russia. Can you. Can you back up a little bit? Because we love. We love to hear about how people got started. And of course, you're no different. You've come so far and, you know, you're only 29 years old and you've had an incredible career so far. Where did you start? You grew up in B.C. and what got you into volleyball?

I grew up in a small town in southeast bc. I grew up on an acreage, too. We had a large plot of land, but we weren't farmers. But I was always outside and always kind of running wild. And I grew up around my extended family, too. I had my mom's brothers and sisters who all had large families, so I had three siblings of my own. And then I had, feels like four cousins from every other family that was around. So I had a lot of family around. And we would play large pickup games. We would have, like, floor hockey, basketball, whatever we could, whatever we could get into. And it feels like that's kind of where the competitive spirit started for me. But they were. And I was actually one of the. Well, if not the youngest one of the. Of the crop. So there was. It felt like I was always getting beat up on, and I was always the worst player by far. Like, I definitely was not the best or the strongest by any means for my whole childhood growing up. But it never stopped me from getting out there with them and trying to. To win. And they never took it easy on me. So that, that definitely helped me to play the games that they were doing, whether it was, you know, floor hockey or volleyball or basketball or whatever we were up to.

So do you, do you think that, I mean, we have our own opinions on this, but do you think that that is a dying or dead era of kids just kind of getting together in a neighborhood, on the streets doing their thing, playing pickup games? Like, do you think that that's gone by the wayside or.

I don't know. I hope not because it was a lot of fun, but it kind of seems like it.

Maybe it's because, I mean, that was, that was the kind of thing that we grew up with. But I just don't, I just don't see it anymore. You know what I mean?

Well, it's become the playdate era.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Where it's.

Let's organize with some helicopter parents making sure that everybody, everybody's being nice, right?

Yeah. But it definitely wasn't like that for me when I was growing up. So there was sometimes not even parental vision or like we were kind of just on our own, you know, doing our own thing. Yeah.

So I'm not surprised that you're the youngest as well because it seems to be a common thread or normal that a younger child fights extra hard to keep up with the older siblings in sports or game, whatever it is, and then that translates to a work ethic.

I remember playing or, Or a competitive drive. Yeah, exactly. I remember playing one on one with my brother in basketball for hours. And. Yeah, I don't think I've ever beaten him growing up. Like, we stopped playing. Maybe when we got, maybe when I got taller than him, that's when we stopped playing. But I. We were stopped. Yeah. And I would never win. And I would never win.

I knew one time was happening.

Yeah, there was one time we had been playing for probably two hours and I just, I've lost over and over again and I was furious. I couldn't beat him and my dad had to come and stop me from chasing him around the backyard. I had a two by four in my hand and I was trying, and I was trying to chase him down with it. And then, yeah, he had to come and separate us for a while.

It seems to be like a, almost like a genetic thing for the young, the youngest in the group. Like our little one, she's the youngest of five and all her siblings are, you know, between 11 and seven years older than her. So she's just doing everything she can to, to have the things they have do the things they do be, you know, and then there's inevitably tears. It's just right. You know, but she's trying so hard and you just, you know that it's developing something in her that is gonna want that. That passion or that drive that you just can't teach someone.

Mm.

So.

So when did the volleyball come?

I think I started playing as soon as I could. Just about every sport I think it was. I was playing with my older brother even when I was 12, and I wasn't. That was before I think you could do. I think that was when it started as organized sports. Was 12 in my town and I started playing with him still. And then. Yeah, by the time I started playing against the organized sports kids in my own age, I had to kind of dial things back because it wasn't. It wasn't the same for everybody else. Like, you couldn't. I had to figure out that you couldn't chase a kid down by two by four for losing a game. It wasn't. They didn't take it as serious as our pickup games. Like, I don't think a pickup game that we had ever ended without some sort of fight. So it took me some time before I could get into the normal realm of. Of organized sports.

But did this lead to some teammate frustration? Getting frustrated with teammates because they weren't putting in the kind of gritty competitive edge that you were?

Yeah, I think it was a frustration for everybody at the beginning. And then from. From then on, I kind of. I played with my brother almost in every. So he was two years older. So I was always playing with the older age group. And then I was just not even. Like, I wasn't as good as them. Like, not quite as good as them, but I was good enough to be on the team, which was. So it just felt like I was always fighting to stay on the team and just to get better and to help the team win. So. But I started playing. The first volleyball experience I had, that was the pivotal moment was I. When I was 14, I started playing club and then I got invited to try out for the U16 team. BC team. And I drove up with one of my best friends who was trying out and it was in. It was in Vancouver. So it's about a nine hour drive from Crescent. It wasn't close. And then we did the tryout and I ended up making the team and my best friend got cut. So I was. I just remember, like, I was. I was freaked out. Like, I really, really, really did not want to stay and play with, like, the other kids were a year older than me. And, you know, I'm from a really small town of 5,000 people, and I'm a really shy kid, so I didn't want to. You know, it was. It just felt like a whole new world to me. And I remember telling my dad, like, I don't think I can stay here and do this. Like, I was crying. And he literally left me on the, on the side of the road at UBC to figure it out and to just kind of go and, and meet the kids. Like, it was obviously, like four or five days where, like, I didn't even think about home. Right. Like, I have my best friends in a couple days, and you realize that it's not as scary as you think it is.

Yeah.

And then, like, I got to spend the whole two months training with, with the best players from B.C. and then we competed. At the end of that, I think it was Manitoba. That was my first, like, experience that volleyball is like, that. It was my thing, you know, like, it was kind of broad before that. And then I guess that year 14, and then going into my junior year of high school, turning 15, was when I really went up and played with my, my older brother's team and, and was one of the best players in, in his team.

And you got the taste of what, what you could grow into as well. And you could also. Is there someone or something that you saw that you thought, okay, I want to. I want to get better, like that, or I want to achieve that? Is there something that's became a carrot for you?

A little bit. But I still. I didn't really know, Like, I didn't really process everything as, like, I think I always wanted to be a pro. I always wanted to be a pro athlete. Like, I thought I would be in the NBA when I was a kid.

Nice.

Just, this is what I'm gonna do, and there's nothing else that I want to do. And my parents, like, they were. They supported it 100%. They're like, go for it kind of thing. And. But so I always had that in my head as, I'm going to be an athlete, I'm going to be an athlete. And then when volleyball started taking off, I started, you know, researching. I started looking into, like, is it even possible? And then, yeah, I did find out it was possible. I found out there was other players playing abroad and obviously, like, Paul was one of the biggest players. So I heard about Paul and how he had such a long, successful career and. And then it was, you Know, that was when I was starting university and then it was basically the only thing that I've kind of done since then. I didn't really think about another career choice.

Wow. Wow, wow.

And that was Thompson Rivers you went to for.

Yeah, yeah. University ball. Yeah. I had two more years with Team BC and then. And then I went to Thompson Rivers. I played there for three years and the first year we won the bronze and then we had two fifth place finishes. And then every summer from there I was playing with the junior team. Well, it started at the youth team when I was 17. That would have been before I joined Thompson Rivers. I played opposite for that team and then. And then kind of went on and did the junior team and then kind of worked my way up, you know, to the senior level.

Did you. Was Thompson Rivers a big school?

No, it was two years before I arrived. I think it. It declared as university. It used to be Caribou College. Yeah, exactly. And then.

Yeah, we were there for Canada Games. 93.

Oh, my gosh. Oh, no way. Yeah.

So it was the College of the Caribou.

Yeah, exactly.

What did you take in school?

I was in Bachelor of Arts. Not much of anything. I wasn't. I wasn't really into school. It wasn't a dream.

You wanted volleyball?

Yeah, I wanted volleyball, yeah. Really, I did. It was. It was just kind of thing that I grabbed onto at that time, you know, it wasn't. Wasn't for me. It wasn't anything else. I knew that I was going to be a volleyball player when I went there and when I left, I had the same, same goals in mind. And then it just kind of took off and snowballed and you left.

Heading to Turkey. No.

Yeah. Yeah.

Nice.

I. Sorry. Go ahead, Paul.

I was gonna say you had a great apartment.

Oh, my gosh.

That was your. That was. That was your apartment, wasn't it? Me and, me and Duffy shared that apartment for two years. That's amazing.

That was our home.

Yeah. I think there was actually still a ton of books and stuff in there from. From what you guys left behind.

Oh, no, those had to be Curry's books.

And there was like games. It was like a completely stacked shelf of stuff.

Well, but when we left, I don't know if you, like, Paul left first.

About a few weeks before I left. And like, we're leaving permanently, as far as we know. So we're leaving with one child. I was pregnant and two dogs. And so when he left, he left with one of the dogs and I was traveling with the other Dog and a child. Plus I was pregnant and with the rest of our stuff.

So there was.

How did you guys. I can't travel, like alone with my guitar. I get stressed out.

Oh my.

I can't imagine with two dogs and children. That's crazy.

Yeah. No, and I was nauseous. It was, it was a. So what was left behind were those things that it's just like nothing else is going to fit with us and we're not taking anything else. And for sure it would have served somebody else anyway. So I hope you enjoyed it.

Yeah, I think there actually was some games that we did play that were in there. I for sure left things there too that people behind me got.

So there was IKEA patio furniture that we had bought. There was like any of the stuff in the kitchen, like all that good stuff. You should have been well equipped. That's good.

That's right.

Pay it forward. It's all good. And so. Yeah, go on.

Well, I want to, I wanted to ask though, you've. You've gone to Arcus and right off, right on the gates, you know, we know that you're, you're close to your family because you grew up in that environment, be with extended family. Your parents are heavily involved. What was it like getting away from them at university, going overseas? How, how is that for you? And the other thing I want you.

To touch on is, you know, you've.

Let us know that you have a bit of a temper and how did, how you evolved with that as well. So kind of two parts to this question. But first, just being away from the family, but also managing yourself and your temper as well.

Let's, let's do the temper thing first. All right. I think it was, it mostly evolved to like, you can't. There was like I would get thrown out of games. I've been probably thrown out of almost 10 games in my high school. Even on to university, I think I got thrown out of two, two or three. I got red carded in university. Like leave the gym, you can't even sit in the back area type thing. And then. Wow. Yeah, I would have, I had, and I had some long conversations with, with Pat Henley, my, my university coach and, and he was actually almost as bad as, if not worse when he was, at least when he was young and he was pretty bad even then. But he would share his experiences and just, you know, where the, the path is going. Like, obviously I was a very talented young athlete and he knew my goals of being professional and playing with the national team. And I Mean, you just can't. You can't keep going on like that and holding yourself like that. You know, you have to. You kind of have to gauge it in a different way. So I think it was just a, you know, an adapt, like I had to adapt to. And also, when you play internationally, it's very rare that people understand what you're saying, too. So I think that, that, that might help me a little bit. It might be. There's very little referees internationally that speak perfect English, so that might help me a little bit too. But. But I think it was just like. That was a big pothole for me, for me growing up. Like, it was like I got suspended in. In basketball. I wasn't able to play for the. For two months of the entire season, so I basically lost an entire basketball season for being just ejected from games, just complaining with the referees or getting in, like, scuffles with other players, and just. I just couldn't control that emotional side of me just because I was. I wanted to win. And if I couldn't win, I would, you know, create a big mess to the game.

And the common denominator typically was the. The officiating that would be the catalyst to setting you off, or was it, like, you just mentioned the scuffles and kind of below that. Are you aware now of what really was setting you off? Was it a feeling that this isn't fair or a feeling that it could look bad in some way?

Yeah, it could have been both. Could have been both, yeah. Because this was also, at the beginning, it was kind of adjusting to just. That's not normal because to me, I grew up at a young age and that was normal. Just to leave it all on the floor and, you know, if something spills over, it spills over.

It's part of your culture.

It's part of the way that we kind of did it when I was young. And then I guess it could have been that a bit too, because when. When I started playing on the bigger teams, people kind of knew that I was one of the young athletes that people were looking out for. And maybe. Maybe that was part of it too, that if I. If I lost, I would get embarrassed. And, you know, maybe I was blaming it on the referees or blaming it on someone, but. But also in basketball, I was a pretty big guy, and I felt like I was officiated unfairly. But obviously it's not. Not even close to what, to getting kicked out of a game. Like, you shouldn't be getting kicked out of a game at that point. But I don't know, there was never a moment where I dove into it and really figured it out. I just think I kind of, I mellowed as I started to understand everything a little better and that winning and losing maybe is not everything. Winning or losing that one game is not everything, let's put it that way. Because maturity continues. Yeah. And maturity, of course, it all, you know, I just kind of matured, I guess. Yeah, you're right.

Maturity makes a big difference. But at the same time, you know, Paul can easily share countless times where, you know, he seems like the most mild mannered guy, very, very intense on the court. But. But then if he loses his temper, like he really loses his temper, he does not see anything. Like it's just complete rage.

It's hard to bring it back. And I just couldn't do that for a long time is bring that back. Yeah, I guess maybe use it too because it's, it's nice to be able to hold those things in and channel it. Yeah, but I, exactly. I would just, I would just go until it was over and then I'm in the locker room.

I'm going to give my coaching perspective here. And that's just simply that especially guys who grow up with such competitive success that channeling that anger in towards what you are competing in is really promoted. But then at the same time, any vulnerability, any other emotions, like it would be hard to name other emotions that competitive male athletes really know how to feel because they're. It's often supported all the anger, all the intensity, all that, that's supported. But other ways of dealing with things, they just never get taught that. So then it becomes a, it becomes a, you know, a problem later on when if you only have two ways of dealing with things, either really intense drive or anger, then life can become pretty black and white and pretty gray at a lot of times if you don't have other ways to deal with things.

And there's a lot of times that when I look back that like that could have ruined my career. Like I could have, like if there was a coach that was like, okay, this kid is just a hothead. You can't, can't be on the team or you can't handle this guy. Right. Yeah. But there was, I was fortunate enough to have, you know, coaches and people that understood me and were able to help me, you know, through this and to mature and be able to handle that.

They wanted to see the real whole you, not just the hot headed side of you.

Right. Which is, which is very Important when you're obviously dealing with young kids. But I can, you know, there's definitely circumstances that. Seen that have gone other ways.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we've talked with a few athletes who quite literally got a reputation from the time they were 14 years old, and it followed them for the rest of their career. And it just, you know, what do you. What do you do with that?

Right, right.

So what about. What about the national team and developing on that stage? What was that like for you?

It just. It seems like it's been like it's flashed by. It's been nine years, I guess, since I joined the team. Like, it seems. Definitely does not seem like nine years, but I joined in 2010 with the. With the senior team, the year we went to Trieste for the World Championships. And it's. It's. It's been a blast. It's been, you know, I've been able to see like a great evolution of the team and a bunch of different guys that have come in and been a part of the team in different ways. So it's. It's been a lot of fun and I'm just blessed that I was able to make it to this level.

I. In talking with Kari about you before.

The interview today, something that really stood.

Out.

To me about you and who you became or have become as a player with the national team. It's when. When I started calling games for Team Canada, being on the other side of things, I felt that at that time, Gavin obviously was a star on the right side, but Canada didn't have. We didn't have balance offensively because we didn't have a go to guy on the left who was consistent. And what I was saying to Kari today was that in my eyes, you really became that guy, that offensive star. I mean, you're one of the most well rounded players I've ever seen in terms of being able to do all facets of the game. But the way that you came on in terms of clutch hitting and coming up in the big moments for the team when the team needed that, because it can't be the Gavin show. It's too predictable. And then with Gavin being injured and being out, you even became bigger. And can you talk about what I mean, looking back on it, do you see yourself going through that evolution? Do you know what triggered it? Do you know when you kind of made the switch? Because for me, I think back to the World League, when you guys made the run and finally made the final six for the first time. That's when I really Started to see it for me, as an outsider. But was that your feeling?

Can you talk about that? Definitely. I've always tried to pride myself on being a well rounded player and just to try to do everything. So I appreciate that, that you've noticed that. And I just, I just think it took time for me to get, you know, comfortable and confident in that, in that level because there's it. It takes time where you're kind of. I was, I was really nervous when I would start a game and I was really, the first few games I was not being able to play up to my own ability. So it just took me, I think, at least the first two years where I was able to convince myself that, okay, I can do this, I can play at this level. And then, yeah, I think that that run was a very pivotal moment for me because we took down Russia, we played neck and neck with the best teams in the world. And that definitely gave me the confidence that I'm at this level and I can be, you know, the one of the go to players on this team and to help this team, you know, go places that we haven't been before. But yeah, as far as like the working on everything and just trying to be that well rounded athlete. I remember when I first made the provincial teams, I was a middle blocker and every coach always told me I couldn't pass. I wasn't going to be a good enough passer to be on the outside. So I played middle of the first year that I was there and then I went back to my high school team and played with the older team and he put me as an outside. So I learned to pass a little bit and to do enough to be on the court at the high school level. And then I went back and tried to try out for the provincial team again as an outside, but they again put me back in the middle and told me that it wasn't, you know, the right position for me because I couldn't pass.

Yeah.

And then like that just kind of stuck with me. And that was like the thing that I worked on the most over anything, just because I wanted to be able to pass. I wanted to be able to be on the court as a left side because that's what I wanted to do. I played left side, went back to high school, I played left side again and then I went back and joined the provincial team again and I tried out only as a left side and then they tried to put me back in the middle after I made the team. And I just kind of told Them that I was going to play outside and if I couldn't pass well enough, then I just had to deal with bad passing or don't play me. And then that continued when I. That next summer I made the youth national team, and then they put me as an opposite because I couldn't pass. So this was just like, it kind of followed me for a long time that I couldn't pass. And that is funny because that was what I focused on that next summer after when I went to university and I did three years at university as a left side. And by the time I left university and joined Glenn in Turkey, like, I actually looked this up a couple. Couple months ago. I saw this online report online on Glenn when me and Duff first joined the team. His report on, on me was that I was a young, talented kid that could pass, but I need to work on my spiking. He said I was. He told me, there you go.

Yes.

And that was like, okay, I know that I can do it now because I can pass. Like, that was the reason that I couldn't play.

Right on.

So then that's so huge.

From then I just. The rest kind of came into it because I knew I could spike and that was getting stronger and developing as a, as an adult and not, you know, catching up to the, the.

Yeah, the older players. Yeah, yeah. And. And what you're describing is so pivotal for so many athletes because you were told in multiple different situations and over and over that you weren't good enough in this one particular area. And most athletes, what happens is they stop trying because they are ready, their brain is ready to adopt that belief and go, okay, I'm not a passer. It's not. They don't adopt. Oh, I'm not good at passing right now, and I can get better. What they adopt is I, I'm not a good passer. I'm not a passer. And, and what's pivotal in that is that you wanted it bad enough or you weren't willing to accept it enough or whatever it was that, that you just kept working on that thing. And that's the thing that I, I find that with, I don't want to say kids in this day and age, but ultimately it's that I don't see as many young athletes now who, who want to work on the area that they're not good at that maybe when we were younger or like, they definitely the. Want to improve upon the thing that you're not good at. That kind of hunger. That's the thing that Evens things out. That's what makes you a well rounded player. That's the thing that, that's the difference. Totally. And that's where you have fewer and fewer weaknesses so that somebody can't capitalize on that thing that you just suck at. So. So it's huge to hear you say that because it seems like one of those key areas that really defines you as a player now, even though it happened so long ago.

Right. And I think that's going back to playing with people that are better than you when you're growing up. Like if they're better than you, you have to, you have to work on your weaknesses. You can't. If you're the biggest kid, you're just gonna spike hard and straight. As in a volleyball term. In basketball, you're gonna go do an open layup because you're taller than everybody, but you're smaller than everybody and they're more powerful than. You can't do those things. You gotta find another way.

Better skills.

Kind of the only way that you're going to is just by failure. You're going try to do a layup or you'll try to spike the ball hard and it won't work. So you gotta find another way.

Yeah. You always would rather be the worst of the best than the best of the worst.

Yeah. And it's hard. Cause you grow up when you're a kid and you idolize stars and you want to be a star from the age of 14 and then you know that might be the biggest problem for you is to be the best player.

In the gym at that age. There's no way you can see the benefit of all the struggle you're going through at that age. Because that age you're just like so frustrated with everything.

Right?

Yeah. Is there. Are there some key people who really made a big difference for you in your journey along the way and developing or even once you achieve some success?

And back to my question earlier about being away from your family. Obviously other people have to kind of step into that role for you. If you can just run with that.

Yeah, for sure. I think the first time when I was away was like I said, when I played on the provincial team when I was 14 and spent the summer in Vancouver. And then when I was returning, it definitely got easier to be away from home, but so I did the summers away from home. And then when I left the university, it was probably the hardest time to leave home because I just lost my cousin to suicide. So it was, it was a really, really Difficult time for. For me and my family and I. It was two months before I had to go to university, so it was. It was obviously a time that I needed to be with my family, but it was obviously very important for me to go to university, too, and to carry on with my life and to do things that I needed to do. But, like, it was a. A very challenging year for me. And volleyball was. Was probably a thing that kept me balanced because without volleyball, I think could have fallen apart really easily because it was very hard for me to keep, you know, anything else on track other than volleyball. Like, I could always show up to practice. I could always work hard. I could always put the work in when it came to the volleyball. But without volleyball, it was like I couldn't. I rarely went to class. There was times I got into trouble off the court. There was other things that were going on, but it was like, volleyball was my muse, you know, it was the thing that I just kind of grabbed onto in that time. And then it's kind of followed me like that. Even after, like. Like when I. When I leave home, it's. It's obviously very sad and it's. It's hard to leave home, but when you get to going and you get to do something that you care about and you get to be passionate every day, it's. It's. It plays a big role in your life. So that was. That was. That's probably been my biggest struggle with being an athlete, and I go through it every year when I have to leave home. It's obviously getting easier and easier because that's just part of our life, that as a professional volleyball player, there's no leagues to play in that are close to home. So. Yeah, yeah, unfortunately, you have to play in Belgorod, Russia, where things are kind of upside down, but. But that's just the way it kind of is. So.

And what was.

Is there. Is there anything aside from volleyball that helped you deal with the pain of the loss that you endured? Were you, at the time. Did you turn to alcohol? Was there a friend that you confided in or other family members? Was there something else that was there besides volleyball?

I wasn't. I didn't. I don't think I had a problem with alcohol much. I didn't drink a whole lot. I grew up in a pretty religious family that it was. You know, I partied here and there, but it wasn't something that was. That got a hold of me. So. But I. I talked a lot with my coach, with Pat Henley, and And he was a big, big role model for me. And he was. He was, you know, would share. Would share stories about his past and what he went through and how he grew through, you know, different times in his life. And. And then, you know, it was volleyball and it was friends and the relationships that I've made through volleyball. So I've met, you know, hundreds of amazing people in volleyball that I can consider a friend that I would call up at any moment and we could have a great conversation. So. But I don't know. I don't think it's something that I constantly. I just think it kind of. I don't know. Things. People adapt. I think people. They figure it out, and it's hard. It's not an easy thing to do. But.

One of the things that Paul discovered that I don't think he ever would have really been aware of had it not been for his hall of Fame induction was how many people he didn't realize he was connected to because their lives were changed by watching him play or watching him. Develop and grow into the sport. And I'm sure that that's the same for you in how many people have. That you've influenced, even though they're not one of those people that, you know and would call up. But there's just a larger circle of people that you've impacted and. And, you know, even you telling what you've gone through, I'm sure impacts them and being able to help deal with what they're going through because, like, Paul having lost his brother to suicide only a couple years ago, and other people who. I don't think there's one of us alive who's not affected by depression. You know, hearing that we're all affected is one of those things that keeps us connected and keeps us being able to have those relationships and those people to talk to even when you feel like you don't.

Right. It's definitely an ongoing battle that, you know, I don't know if you ever completely figure it out, but it's just something that is definitely challenging in everyday life. And, you know, depression is always, always there. And it's. It's definitely nice when you have a good, good group of friends that you can. You can talk to through, whether it be sport or, you know, through life. So.

You mentioned Pat Henley a lot. Is he one of those people that, as a role medal, role model you would like to acknowledge?

Yeah, definitely. I think that the first coach that I had that really got me interested in the game would have been my high school Coach. Just because he was. He just had a great way to relate to younger. Younger age group. And he was. He was actually a math teacher at the school, too. So he would help us out, you know, with our math or whatever we need help with, like, if that's what it was. Yeah, but. And he was actually a really good volleyball player and coach, so he was the first person that got me into the sport. And I'll always, you know, when I go home, go out for a game of golf or take him out for dinner or do something with him. So he's definitely still a good friend of mine and a role model for me. And then the second coach that I had was Pat. And Pat, you know, he. I could always tell that Pat really believed in me and saw something in me, because since I was in the 10th grade, he would hound me at every single high school tournament. Like, this guy. I could see him from across the gym, like. And I was trying to avoid him, too, because I was so shy. I didn't want to talk to him. And he would just sit me down and talk to me for, like, 45 minutes. And I was like, I can't take any more of this guy. But it was like a. Two years of solid recruitment and I could just, you know, I wanted to play for him just because I knew how much he believed in me as a player and how much it was important that I go to his school.

Yeah. And that you could trust him because he was consistent.

Yeah, for sure.

What was the name of the high school coach?

Mike Nelson.

Nice.

Yeah. Yeah. And. And then, like, I was. I was. I wasn't heavily, heavily recruited, but I had some interest from U of A. From Terry at U of A and then ubc. But it, like, it definitely wasn't Pat Henley. Yeah. Like, it was like, I felt obligated because he put so much work in, and I talked to him so many times, and then, like, he put me on the court my first year, and I got Canada west rookie of the year. And, you know, I achieved so much and grew so much in just my first year playing that a lot of first years don't get when they go to a strong program. And we were able to perform, too. We got the third. We got a bronze medal, so it wasn't like, our team sucked, so.

Yeah, and he had a vision for you before you did.

Right, right. And I remember my first day of the team, too. He sat down and just asked me what I. What I want from this team and what are my goals. And I told him like, I want to go on, I want to play pro, I want to be on the national team. And I believe he really helped me do that and never, you know, tried to stop me or persuade me when I wanted to leave the team early to pursue my, my careers in volleyball. So. And then there's all the office off the court stuff he did for me too, you know, helping me out and with whatever else I have going on. And so he was just a great, great person. And then my third coach that helped me out was, was Chris Green. I don't know if you, Paul, if you've had some time with Chris.

Chris was. Yeah, a number of years.

Yeah, he was like. But he was a whole nother. He was just a beast. Like this guy was an animal.

Like, well, when Glenn.

I was so afraid of this man.

When Glenn would be gone, it was me and Chris who took care of all of the full time training center. So it was just like you, you just, they were just trying to survive, you know, it's just like I don't.

Know what it was like for him, how he was around. Like obviously you guys were in adults and full grown athletes so he was probably a different coach. But like he was a beast against us. Like he was, he would punish us. And that was one of the first times I had to work as hard as I had to work in a summer like two months of just grinding and grinding and grinding every day.

Yeah, he's got a tough work ethic, that's for sure.

Definitely, definitely. And you need that at that age when you're 19 year old kid and you know you.

Yeah, it's perfect.

The guy was probably a little bit cocky at that time too. So he was a good coach for us. And that was the junior team that we have now. Graham Vigrass is in there, Jay Blankenow was in there, Jason Durocco was in there, Rudy Verhoof was in there. There was, there was a lot of players that went on to play on the national team that could attest to Chris Green.

But it's part of what bonds you too.

Yeah, for sure. If you can survive Chris Green.

Exactly.

And go on.

So if. Can we wrap up here with a few kind of quick questions that I like to have people get to know you a little better with?

Yeah, for sure.

Okay, what, what would, what would you say is a discipline that's come easily for you and maybe one that's been harder for you? So maybe the hard one might have been your passing ability, but what was a discipline that Was always easy for.

You.

Just showing up and putting the work in and doing. Doing the job. Like, there's so many people that don't.

Yeah.

That they just kind of get weaned out of the sport. And then they kind of say, like, this guy was given everything because he got the opportunity or he got this and that. But, like, you don't. You get it from you going and you work and you get better and, you know, you put the work in. So that was the thing that would just seem natural for me to show up to practice, go through the routine of getting ready, and then once it's time to practice, I'm there. Like, nothing else really matters to me other than trying to improve at volleyball and doing the best I can.

Yeah. Like.

Sorry, go ahead.

I was just gonna say you're describing not just consistency, but. But really being present once you're there. Like, when you're there, you've got the mindset, you've got the attitude. You're there to work. It's not just kind of, okay, I showed up now. Now what? It's. I showed up and I'm. I'm gonna do the thing.

Right. And what was the other one that.

Well, it was just.

What. What was it in volleyball? Did I answer that question right?

It could be in volleyball or it could be in anything, but it could be mindset, it could be volleyball. It could be anything in life, really. But. And it's one that would come hard for you, too, but you talked a fair bit about the passing, but is there another one aside from that?

I've always wanted to be a better server for a long time, too. Like, that was probably the. In volleyball, the thing that I worked at the most since I've been a professional at volleyball, because you need to have a very consistent and aggressive serve. And that was probably the thing that I was the weakest at. And it's the thing that I've worked the most at since I've become a professional athlete. So I'd say that in volleyball.

Yeah.

Then.

And the better you get, that's when you have diminished returns. Just meaning that the better you get, the harder it is to see more improvement, the more work you have to put in to see small increments of change.

Right. Yeah, for sure.

And are you one that you. Do you think that you want to do your best or to be the best?

I'd definitely be the best.

I kind of predicted that based on what you've said so far. It's that competitive nature.

Like, I. Yeah, I really want to.

Learned in the backyard?

Yeah, I guess so. But I don't think I'll ever stop, you know, overthinking what I need to get better at until I would be undoubtedly, in every single person's mind, the best player on the planet, which is impossible. So I don't think I'll ever stop trying to be the best.

Keep going.

Hopefully I will do my best. Do my best in the process of trying to be the best.

So I'm taking both answers.

Okay. Beautiful. And what do you think you want to do after volleyball?

I think I'll coach.

Yeah, I think that. What level speaks to you?

University? I think that I would have a lot to offer to the. To that age group. I would want to work with players that are good enough, that they're at the level where they're. They're ready to learn and to become that next step in the sport. So I think that. And I think that once you become this level in a sport, that it's kind of hard to switch. And maybe you can probably tell me the truth on this, Paul, but like I'm saying, to go on a different path and try something outside of volleyball, like, I would. I would be afraid to try something outside of volleyball. Not that that's the only reason that I'd want to coach, because I would want to coach, because I want to help players get better. But I also think that it would almost be a waste to do something else outside of volleyball.

Yeah, it's definitely. You see all the guys who retired going different directions, but you're not surprised when you see a lot of players stay in it. As a coach, it obviously needs to be the right fit because people ask me, do you want to coach? Speaking to me, and I'd say, not really, because it. At the time, it was being away from the family again, you know, to coach at a high level. So it was more of the same and reach kind of the breaking point of being away from the kids and things like that.

But.

It is hard to imagine doing something different if you're in it for a long time like you've been.

But that's specific to you, though, too, in that, Paul, you would love to coach, but you would have to coach at probably almost the highest level because you wouldn't feel you're not as challenged or as passionate about coaching at city. A lower level.

Yeah. And it's hard to share the knowledge that you have, like you're. Well, we are at the highest level in our sport, so it's hard to Share that knowledge to a child. They can't understand it.

Well, you could be the Chris Green of coaches, Gord.

No, I don't have that. I don't have Chris Green in me. I don't think. I think I have it. Like, I appreciate the Chris Green, but I don't think I have it.

What about on some lighter topics? What about. Do you have a favorite food or dessert that you love, either in season or off season? What speaks to you?

I love cheesecake. Whenever I. Oh, yeah, I'll eat a lot of cheesecake. If I get a dessert. I would get cheesecake for sure.

We just had cheesecake the other night, so.

Good. Yeah. Raspberry. Raspberry, to be specific.

Yum.

And. And what about other, like, regular meals?

I had a lot of popcorn.

Yeah, that's a meal.

No, not a meal. But. But I. I eat out a lot. I'm not a big fan of cooking. I'm just not. I'm not a fan. I just haven't. Yeah, I just haven't, you know, dove into it because I'm. It's so tiring after practice, especially. Especially when you go twice a day.

Have you found some favorite Russian food? Because, you know, when you get into different culture, you kind of start to learn your favorites.

Yeah, I eat borscht a lot. It's the eaten cabbage soup. It's so good. Yeah, almost every day.

My great grandmother was Ukrainian and she would make like a homemade borscht, but that was years ago. That's awesome. What about favorite movie? Do you have a favorite movie?

Hmm, there's. There's too many good movies to pick a favorite movie, but I really like the Shawshank Redemption. Like, that's a pretty normal movie to say, but it's such a good movie.

Awesome. And what about. Are you a reader at all? Do you have favorite books?

I read a couple coaching books that I really liked. One was Pete Carroll's Win Forever. And it was short and an easy read, which I liked, but I read the Michael Jordan biography too.

Yeah, but.

And my dad has eight books about veterinarian. He was a vet for 30 years and he just writes about. It's kind of like a. Almost a comedy satire about his experiences and what went on in his life experiences. So he's got eight best selling books in Canada that I really enjoy.

I'll bet there are some hilarious stories.

Yeah, they are actually really funny. And he just had a really humorous way of telling the stories.

Do you have that talent or a desire to ever write about some of your experiences.

I do like storytelling, but I've never really sat down and put the pen to the paper.

Maybe one day.

You never know. You never know.

Yeah. My mom always tells me to write and keep a journal because that's something that she does every day.

It's so. Because if you don't, you can't remember back. So much happens. And then if you don't write it down, there's the saying that the. The faintest ink is stronger than the strongest memory when you look back and.

Just to know how you're feeling is what she kind of puts it. Some people have it, some people don't. But when you write, I guess you can really know how you feel about something.

Go back to her journals.

I'm sure she's written a lot about you.

Probably.

Do you have some favorite music that you like, either pre game or to mellow out? What's your. What do you listen to?

Well, you play some guitar?

Yeah, I dabble a little bit. I'm kind of like a teach myself on YouTube type of guitar player. But I'd usually listen to any hip hop, like probably just whatever's popular at the time when I'm getting ready for a game. And then I like city and color and. And a lot of just melody guitar stuff when I'm on the road traveling, like on an airplane or on the bus.

Awesome.

And what about any tips to young upcomers in volleyball? Do you have any advice or tips that you'd like to give?

Probably not to focus on being a professional at that time. Just enjoy the game and do, you know, do it because you love it and then that way you'll probably get the best at it. And like we said earlier, just learn every possible way at the game that you can and try to improve on the game too. Maybe you can be creative and start something that you know because the game is always evolving. Look at basketball, the last 20 years or even volleyball. Like there's so many new things that are going on. So be creative and make it fun. And then if it happens in the future that you're a professional athlete, it happens, but if it doesn't, it doesn't.

Yeah, yeah.

I think that's great advice, especially the thought of just trying new things because that's how the game grows and it's fun to try something different. You don't have to always run a set to the same spot.

Yeah. Go to the gym half an hour before practice and mess around with your buddy or friends.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And is there anything As a last thing that you want people to know about you or that you want to share or even something that people wouldn't know about you. That is interesting. Is there any last thing that you want to share?

Not really. I don't think so. I would probably prefer people know less about me.

Speaking of which, they can find you on social media. You're on Instagram.

Yeah, yeah, My app is at Gord Perrin, so you can follow me there. I try to post as much as I can about what's my life, what's up my life or what's going on.

So in Russia.

Yeah, exactly.

And anything else for you, Paul? Is there any last questions?

I guess really, where, where do you lie personally with goals and what you still want to achieve in the game?

What.

What's left on your hit list?

Metal at the Olympics would definitely be the next goal for me.

That'd be huge for Canada.

Yeah, yeah, it would be. It would be huge. And. But I think it's very possible and I think that it's something that, that is on the horizon for us. Like, I, I really believe that we're going to do it. We've taken every step necessary the last 5. 5 years and I just think that it's, it's destined to happen. So I, I believe that it's gonna happen and that's, that's kind of thing that I'm. I'm shooting for now.

Well, we'll be there.

I'm calling that game. Yeah, you better be not.

Hopefully you will screaming and we'll be there. Awesome.

Awesome.

Well, thank you so much. Everything that you've shared and just allowing people to learn about you will make a big difference for them. And we really appreciate this opportunity just to be able to touch base with you and have a little chat with you, get to know you a little bit better and share this with others. So thank you so much, Gord.

Yeah, definitely. Thanks guys.

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