EP30 Kevin Hill - Snowboard X - Olympian

This is the Empowered athlete podcast, episode 30. If you were to meet an athlete who was the best in their sport in Canada, they'd been to two Olympics, they'd won the Winter X Games. What kind of lifestyle would they lead? You think they'd have financial worries? Well, the answer might surprise you. Our guest today is none other than than Kevin Hill, Snowboard cross champion. He is on the World cup tour. He has done it all in the sport, and his financial scenario might surprise you. Fantastic conversation coming up with Kevin Hill. Let's get into it.

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Hello, everyone.

Welcome to the Empowered Athletes Athlete Podcast. Today's guest, bmxer, skateboarder. He surfs downhill mountain bikes, does it all, loves to lift weights. Oh, yeah, and he's been to the Olympics twice for snowboard cross. We are welcoming Kevin Hill to the show. Kevin, thank you so much for making the time.

Thank you very much for having me today.

We're excited to have you. So this isn't. This isn't your standard sport that we've typically interviewed? We interviewed a lot of team sport athletes and some individual sport athletes, but never a snowboard cross athlete. So we are really pumped to hear your story. And so, you know, if you take us back, what. What got you into this sport?

Well, that's quite a long story, but I'm here to tell it all. So what got me into snowboard cross is, um, as my main sport was originally just snowboarding for fun at the age of nine and Also BMX racing at the age of nine. Um, always liked the individual sports as a kid. So I did some BMX races for fun when I was younger and really felt that I liked that. I started competing in snowboard half pipe slopestyle events when I was 10, 11, 12, 13 and really enjoyed the individual sports idea because I felt that I, the harder I worked and the more onus was put on me for my results and how I would do so. The solar cross started later in life at the age of 19.

But so was this as a kid, was this just really accessible to you because your parents took you to the slopes? Like, because you lived in bc, you still live in bc, but was it because it was really accessible and you're just loving it and couldn't get enough?

That was the main reason we actually moved to Vernon. I was born in Chilliwack, bc. We moved to Vernon two weeks after I was born and luckily my parents found a house halfway up Silver Star Mountain. So I'm about 12 minutes from the ski hill. And that really helped because.

Oh yeah, yeah.

We're in a very wealthy family, that's for sure. So being close to the ski hill was one of the biggest things that helped start off my career as a snowboarder.

That's fantastic. So you now I read that you saw the Olympics on TV and you just wanted to be a part of that. What sparked that for you? What did you see? What did you feel? What was the thing?

I don't know. I think I was about. Could have been 10 or 11 years old. I saw the Olympus on TV and I was like, that's the ultimate pinnacle of sport. I was like, I want to make it to that event no matter what it takes, no matter what sport. Because I had no idea what I was doing when I was younger. I was just like, I want to be there someday. Told my parents. I was like, I got to get there and luckily it worked out.

Do you remember what sport you were watching or what you. You know what I mean? Because I mean, it kind of. There was an evolution of what sports came into the Olympics. I don't know what year snowboard cross came in.

Snowboard cross was 2006. So obvious it was before that. And to be honest, there's. I'm not sure what sport I remember. I was glued to the TV watching all the sports. Back in the day when I was a little kid with the bad TV quality and all that didn't matter to me. I was just really, really into that, watching the Olympics that's amazing.

And then you. You ended up in. You ended up in just doing a lot of skateboarding, do a lot of bmx, that kind of thing.

Yeah. So I got really involved with the BMX club here in Vernon. My parents ran the club for 10 years. I coached and I turned pro in BMX at the age of 19 and really wanted to chase that as my career because BMX racing had been introduced into the Olympics in 2008. So just before then, I was quite going strong on the. On the national BMX team, actually with a few of my best friends traveling around Canada, a few international events as well on the national BMX team even before I got serious with the snowboarding.

So you basically thought that was your ticket to the Olympics?

I thought it could be. I was quite highly skilled in the bmx. There was one downfall, though. I had a of lot. Little bit less power than a lot of the guys. These guys are bigger than me, pushing a lot more weight at the gym in their legs. And I'm not sure if it's a genetic thing or whatever. It was tough for me to have the. The same amount of power and wattage that these guys were producing out of the start gate. And that's kind of where I fell a little bit behind. It wasn't the tracks, track speed or skill. It was just the power out of the Stargate.

And were they a little bit like taller than you? Like, did they have a little more leverage?

No. BMX can range any. You can range any height and be good at bmx. There's been guys that have been in the Olympics that are five foot six, and there's guys that are six foot three, six foot four. So it wasn't the leverage. I'm a slimmer build guy as an athlete. I was brought up vegan, vegetarian my whole life, right from a baby. And not that I want to blame it on being vegan, but as we know, being vegan helps with a lot of it helps you slim down. I wouldn't say it helps with building big, massive muscles. Have you so.

Well, there's. There's.

Have you seen that? Yeah, I was just going to say, have you seen the pro bodybuilder who's vegan? I'm blanking on his name right now.

It doesn't matter. I mean, you just have to look at a gorilla.

Yeah.

Yeah, right. You're true.

Gorillas are incredibly powerful and they're eating plants.

I agree. 100 and so that's. I wouldn't blame that on my lack of being Able to get the same strength and power as these guys. It's just something that I wasn't really able to reach my. In my BMX career. So.

So when it snowboard, you pursued BMX pretty hard. When did you feel like you needed. You know, you said you're hellbound on getting the Olympics no matter what sport it is when it happened. So when did you I up maybe a shift or a change in your pursuit?

Yeah. So it all came back to snowboarding, doing the freestyle competitions around bc, doing tricks, doing all that. I had my first and only concussion up at Silver Star Mountain, where I was practicing with some pros, trying to get noticed by the pro team that was there riding that day. And I came up short on a jump, doing a 720, hit my head fairly hard, split my helmet open, and that kind of took my eye away from the freestyle side of snowboarding. I jumped back in between BMX and snowboarding a little bit, but then I was like, man, I really got to rethink this. Like, what am I doing? The concussion scared me quite a bit, as I'm sure it scares most people.

So with that. Just a pause there with that concussion, you know, were you. How long did that sideline you? Were you. Did you have some? Because so many people are dealing with concussions. And what were your symptoms? What were you dealing with?

I got very lucky. From what I remember, I wasn't fully knocked out. I could hear things just everything went black. I thought it was the worst thing in the world because nothing had ever happened to me like that. But luckily, other than the. The bad ambulance ride down the hill, getting super dizzy and sick, other than that, I recovered very quickly from that. Luckily, not all people do. And I've heard many, many stories from friends and teammates since then that things have ended a lot worse. I think I was probably back to normal in two weeks. I mean, not 100%, obviously, but I hadn't had any symptoms after the first week whatsoever.

Yeah, that is really lucky, especially with a hit hard enough to split with the helmet, which, you know, that's what it's there for. But that's such a hard impact.

Yeah, I felt very lucky to bounce back so quickly. I mean, I didn't jump back on the snowboard right away. It scared the crap out of me. I took the rest of the season off from snowboarding and tricks because I was like, man, I'm not sure if I want to do this anymore.

How did you get back on the horse, per se?

Yeah, I took a little Step back from the slope style stuff. I was BMXing full time, trying to make the Olympics and BMX in 2008. And in that time, that time period, about two years, I was like. After I took the decent a year break or so from snowboarding, I was like, I want to try this again. So I went to Big White Ski Resort close by me here, about an hour and a half drive. And there was a slopestyle competition, There was a border cross competition. I'm like, oh, maybe I should enter one of these and see how it goes. Cause it's similar to BMX race. And I was like, I have that competitive edge still. I maybe don't want to do tricks and throw my body around like that and risk that kind of thing happened again. But I still want to go fast and be competitive because I was. I think the concussion happened when I was 17 or 18. I'd have to look back one of those two years. And so I tried the competition in Big White Border Crosser and I did quite well. I think I got a first and a second on my freestyle board, which isn't a race board whatsoever.

And in your. In your first competition.

And the team BC coach at the time noticed that I could move quite well and I was quite fast. He's like, whoa, you should. You should try out for Team BC here. And I think I was 19, just turned 19, I'm not sure, 19 years old. And he's like, you should try out for the team. And I was like, oh, why not? You never know. Because at that time I was just. I'd missed the BMX Olympics by. I think my best friend went, and my other best friend was in second and I was third. Only one guy went for bmx.

Oh, man.

So I was like, it wasn't. It wasn't a big, like, heartbreaker for me. I knew, I knew I was close and I knew I was good. But I knew that they were better at certain things and that's why they were chosen. So it wasn't like a big letdown.

You weren't fully expecting anything. You knew that your shot of going was if one of them got injured, basically, or both of them got injured.

Yeah, totally. And I was right there training alongside. He was training at my house the two weeks prior, the month before he went to the Olympics. So, I mean, I got to enjoy all the fun I could with him in the process. So it didn't affect me whatsoever, mentally not being able to make the BMX team.

Yeah, but you thought. No, at that point, did you think you were going to try for the next Olympics for bmx? Like did you think you were going to up level your skills, you were going to push harder in bmx or were you starting to kind of think, hey, maybe snowboard, cross, maybe something like this could be on my radar? Is this when you started getting interested in like, was it the provincial team they were looking at you for?

Yeah, it was the provincial team they were looking at me for. For snowboarding. And I had it in the back of my mind, hey, well, why not try this sport out, see how it goes. I can still BMX all summer long, have fun with it and see which one takes me further. So I went with the snowboarding a little bit more serious and did the provincial team. Obviously you have to pay when you get on the provincial team. It's not just like, oh, you're on the provincial act that you get everything paid for. No, it came with a lot of bills and luckily my parents were able to support me for the first little bit because it sure isn't cheap.

Yeah, it's not a cheap sport. Between the travel, the equipment, you name it.

Yeah, very expensive to start out and.

What went on from there.

So I did the requirements for the provincial team. The coach was great, we got along really well. We did a couple events which are called. We did a few more provincial events and I was placing first or second in the competitive level, which is the fists it's called. And then I did a few norams and is the same thing as well. I had a couple podium finishes. And a noram is a race that is you get points, you gain points, you can reach the World cup level next. So it's like an entry level to qualifying for World Cups. You have to do the provincial. The norm, then the World cup.

Is that like a North American kind of thing? Like is that what standard is North American? And then North America, that becomes a qualifier for World cup. And then does a World cup event become a qualifier for an Olympic event?

Yes, that's the exact way it goes. Yeah. So luckily, because it's really expensive traveling the North. I'll just touch a little bit on that. If you were to travel in the North American tour, you're probably spending 15 to $20,000 a year just in North America doing that tour to get you on the World cup tour. So I did a few of those.

So that's still, that's still provincial. So your parents are footing the bill for that?

Yeah, 100% like that.

That's mind boggling because you Know you just like we all, we all would like to think of this wonderful dream. You know, the kid works hard. They, yeah, they put, you know, time and effort and energy and money, but you know, not a part time salary into, into the season alone in order to get to that goal. Like it's such a big endeavor, not just physically, mentally, time wise, skill wise, but financially.

Yeah. And I'll touch on the financial side a little bit later. And this is 10 years ago. How crazy. Like mind blowing for a sport like this. So luckily I did a couple NorAms within the US and Canada and qualified with a spot for the World Cups very quickly, which was very luckily on my part because as you know, just the longer on the Norham tour and so on, the more you're paying. Yeah, so I did a, I did a few of those and I was invited to my first World cup which was in Cyprus.

So does, does Sport Canada pay for that once you go to the World Cup? Like is that getting funded by the sport body?

No, it sure isn't. It's 100% you. You're paying for your coach as well to come, your provincial coach. Until you get onto the national team level, you're supporting everything you're paying.

Still funding out of your own pocket.

Yeah.

So how are you classified? You're on the World cup tour, but you're not considered representing Canada, but you're not national team. Okay.

Yep. So that all comes with. You have to meet the criteria on the World cup to join the World Cup Canadian Olympic team. So it's, it's a process. Guys can be racing the World Cup, I can get invited to World Cups as an, as the amateur athlete I was, but still have to pay for everything until I meet those requirements to be on the national team.

Okay. And that's what you're mentioning before we start recording. You mentioned you just finished the tour in Switzerland and you've met the criteria for next year.

Yes.

Okay, got it.

So it continues your funding right now because you've jumped through the appropriate hoops.

Yes, thankfully I have. It's a lot of stress. It's stressful.

Yeah. I mean it's one thing, the stress of competing, the stress of perfecting your craft and your skill and continuing to travel and perform and compete. That's stress in and of itself. Never mind knowing in the back of your mind that, oh well, if this doesn't go well, there goes my funding.

Yeah, yeah, it's carding as well as funding for them to pay flights, coaching fees, race fees and so On.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. So you, you ended up qualifying for World cup and performing well enough, you know that then you, you start to have this shot at the national team that must have been mind blowing at the time. Like where, where was your heart and your head at?

It was, it was great because my first World Cup I can remember very well in Cyprus and I went with my provincial coach. We went to Cyprus, which was luckily very cheap. First event. And I qualified 19th at my first World cup and they take 32. All right. As a final. So I qualified. My first World cup might have been 23rd. I. Anyway, that's a long time ago. Yeah, that was 2009. So just before the Vancouver 2010 Olympics. And I did quite well. And for my first result they said sometimes it takes guys five to 10 World Cups to qualify even to a final. And that really got things started off when the national team, they saw me, the national team coaches saw what I was doing and liked what I was doing. And I only had to do one season, paying my own full way, traveling around. I went. After that I went to, I think Stoneham, Quebec, and I might have finished off the season in Italy. But I remember at the end of that year being told that I was met some of the criteria to join the national team for the next year. And I was like, oh, that's, that's really good. Because I knew how much the bill had cost my parents for that year to pay for the coach to travel with me, to pay for the waxing and every accommodation, everything else.

So were you almost happier that you'd made it because of the financial stress than making your. Do you know what I mean? Like, was it. You were almost more. More elated because the financial stress wasn't going to be there versus elated because, oh my gosh, the national team is looking at me and I'm on it. I'm. It.

Totally. I'm very money based. Some people are, some people are. But it worries me through life as lot of other people as well. But I, I knew if I could make the national team quite quickly that it would save my family a lot of money that they were putting out there for me.

For your dream?

Yeah, yeah, for my dream. And then I could take care of myself because I think, I think my dad paid probably two seasons. That was anywhere from 15 to $25,000 per season.

Oh my gosh.

10 years ago. Yeah, it's minimum. Minimum.

Yeah. We're parents, we get that mind boggling. Yeah. Holy cow. Okay, so then you're Then you're. You're getting some funding. So it's basically paying for itself. But in this sport, it's not like it's paying you a whole bunch of extra money that you can sock away. It's paying you. It's paying you to get by, and that's it. So you're living, you know, you're living basically like a lot of athletes, basically at the poverty line of just paying for what you need. And that's about it.

100%. That's exactly how it is. So the first year funded there, I was getting the carding, which means you get a little bit of a salary every month from the government. They just upped it. So it's $1,870. Nothing special.

It's still in the.

It's still in the pocket.

I used to get 800amonth.

Okay.

Yeah, yeah. Back in the day.

But that was team sport. So then a lot of the guys are living together, but. But still, it's like. It's brutal.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I. Yeah, I remember the first time I got carded was the development card, and it was $900. My first monthly check was $900. Wow. Back in the day and.

But at the time, like, you look back at the time, you're like, $900, like, oh, my God. You know, this is the best.

It's definitely a nice feeling, as long as you don't have to right away go spend that on a flight or travel or coaching.

Yeah, it's gone.

So gone quite quickly. Yes.

But it was all for the dream. It was all to get to the olympics. And so 2010. Tell us about the quest. What happened there?

Yeah, so I had my sights set on the 2010. I knew I came into it. 2008 was my first starter up season. 2009, I had a great season. I had a couple of good results. And leading up to the Olympics in 2010, because I think it was in February, so I had a fifth place and I had another top 10 result, and those are part of the criteria to make it to the Vancouver 2010 Olympics. I knew it was a long shot because the team, I think it was 11 national team riders at the time, and that's the biggest team I've ever seen. And I just joined the team kind of on the outside looking in. I think I was Even Development Team 2019. I wasn't officially named to the team till the end season of the Olympic season, 2010. So leading up to the Olympics, I had some really good results ahead of a couple other riders on the national team and so on. And the last race I remember, Stoneham, Quebec, I've placed sixth place. I was in the small final, just missed out on the big final and placed sixth place behind the Mike Robertson, which would go on to win silver at the Olympics.

Wow.

It was a very tight, it was a very tight race and I was very happy with my best World cup performance. And so they were announcing the team within a few days after that race. And my coach said, you have a good opportunity. Like my provincial coach, just before I actually officially joined the national team, he had said, you have a very good shot at it. They're going to have meetings, they're going to talk with the higher up people, see what, see what goes on. Anyways, they told me they would let me know what the call was in the next few. And I think it was actually the next day they had to decide because the Olympics was only two or three weeks away. So it actually comes down to you only know if you're going sometimes a few weeks, as you guys have probably heard from other athletes. So there was a, there was a coaches meeting, my coach, the national team coaches, some higher up people and they decided to send someone else for the fourth spot because this was, we were all going for that fourth spot, 10, eight other guys or so. And they said that they were going to take one of the other national team members. And they said to me, you're a great athlete. You're coming up in the sport. You're young. For snowboard cross, young is 19, 19, 20, you're still young. You're going to have many years ahead. You have many Olympics ahead of you. We're going to send someone else because they have more experience and they have a lot of invested, the national teams invested a lot in this athlete and so on and so on. So you're gonna go to probably many more.

How did that make you feel? How did that sit with you?

I was quite upset because in the criteria there's always loopholes and they wouldn't always. I'm very happy for that other rider that he went. He was one of my idols growing up. But the other hand, there was some races where people had crashed, other people had stuck through, people had reached certain podium finishes because of unforeseen accidents and so on and so on. Because border cross, as we know, is a very random sport. Anything can happen. Anyone can get. I've gotten lucky end of the stick one time and the other end of the time I'm getting taken out from behind at the Olympic Games, years down the road. So anything can happen. But at the end of the day, I was pretty distraught, if that's a good enough word to use that, because I had very high hopes. I was very confident at that time that I was one of the best riders, for sure, in Canada. And missing. That was quite. I don't like to use depressed, because I don't usually like to say I'm ever depressed, but I was quite sad, let's put it that way. Yeah, it was a big. It was a big hit to the ego and everything else, because I knew in all fairness I should be there.

Yeah. Yeah.

But it wasn't meant to be.

So.

Yeah, that's.

That's really. It's really tough because I understand the coach's perspective that. Okay, it sounds like the decision went to more of a veteran, somebody who'd paid their dues. And this guy's put in all this effort. Let's give him the trip to the Olympics. But here's the thing. Because it's the fourth spot in the roster.

Yep.

You know, your best hopes for medals are your 1, 2, 3, your best guys. And if it's that they're clear, that's an easy decision. But this four spot, it. I mean, as an outsider, I would hope that the program would be looking to the future with that four spot. You've got a rising star. Let's give him some Olympic experience so that when he's, you know, in his prime, four years from now, he's been through this once. He's been through it. He understands the process and the magnitude of the Games, as opposed to you then hitting the Games four years later with none of that experience. That's. That's how I would see it. But I understand that coaches want to, you know, you feel bad. So it's that. It's that horrible human. That's kind of almost the business side of it, but political side. Yeah, it's the politics and. And you're caught in between, which just sucks.

Yeah, I agree.

It's totally the political side of it. And it's the kind of thing where, you know, I can. I can think of experience with specific sports like Olympic lifting, tennis, track, figure skating, where, you know, numbers should be what dictates who goes and who doesn't go. And it wasn't numbers or seating or ranking at the end of the day that dictated who went and who didn't go. And that's where it gets unfortunate, because, you know, it's. It sometimes for some people it's destroying their life, livelihood because that was their either last shot or who knows what. But if the numbers dictate one thing and then the sport body or the coach or a number of people decide a different thing, it's really hard for people to absorb or accept or really understand when, you know, it wasn't about who did best, it was about something else. Yeah, yeah.

And that's what it came down to. And I think sport in my sport has changed a lot since then, and things would be different now nowadays, but things were very political back then. They wanted to give someone one last try, one last shot at the Olympics before they retired. Yeah. Anyway, that's what it came down to.

So, so what did, what did you do? Did you just like, did you end up, you know, hunkering down on the couch and watching the Olympics and just, you know, having some box of Kleenex next to you and eating some comfort food? Like, what was your, what was your recovery there?

So I was away from home, probably called my parents, cried a little bit, telling them the story of what had happened because I was quite down then. And then I was told that I'd be an alternate, so I was first alternate. If anyone was injured at the Games, I would be the one competing. So to most people, that'd be a great thing to be the first alternate to be able to go and experience the Games, enjoy them. Um, I'm very happy to say that I was there. I was able to ride the course, train with the athletes and so on, but I was, let me tell you, I was definitely more sad about it than I was happy because I, in my opinion, I had done what it take. I had worked hard. I had met most of the criteria. Not 100%, obviously, otherwise it would have been a clear straight shot there, but I felt that going, going there. I didn't. I didn't have any time to mope around or, or think about it and let it dwell on it. I mean, you don't want your teammates getting hurt, but when you're in my position, you don't. You don't wish for it or anything. But you know what?

Yeah, yeah.

I think anyone in my shoes would say they wouldn't be mad if they got to take away the spot from someone else on the team if some unforeseen thing happened.

Yeah, yeah, it's a tough thing.

So, yeah, very.

After that. Was that. Was that something that had you reconsider your career or was it just fuel to the fire that made you go, okay, 2014 there is going to be no question in anybody's mind.

I think it was because just after the Olympics, four running there, being part of it, got to see what it was all about. Shortly after there was national championships and I was able to win that. And back in the day it was, it was a way stronger field than it is now. We had all the national team guys would show up. They were told to compete by our coaches or by the national team coach. So everyone was there, very tough event and I was able to win it. And as soon as I won that, I kind of was like, there. You see guys.

Yeah, yeah. In your face. Yeah.

It was a smaller course, obviously not Olympic size and, and I was riding those smaller courses full time and I was very hungry, but I was like, yeah, you see, I just beat all your national team members that were at the Olympics fair and square and take that.

Yeah. So take it and like it.

And right after that I was named to the national team. So things looked up for me after that. Although it was a sad night after I was told what was happening and I wasn't going to the Olympics. But I definitely use it as fuel to work for me in the future and to perform well from then on.

So we know after that 2011 at the Winter X Games, you finished second silver medal, incredible result. So you obviously continued on your path of excellence. Can we spin it forward to Sochi to 2014? And you know, you mentioned being on the good side of a crash there. We know that you were unfortunately on the other side. You want to maybe talk us through your games, experience what happened and want to give it away here for our.

Listeners, but just also describe to listeners what, what a course is like so that in case they haven't watched, like just because this is, this is an intense sport.

Yep. So leading up to Sochi, just before it, we did some test events. We've been there. I liked going there. So it was a great place, beautiful mountains and everything. Showing up for the Olympic Games in 2014. I did some good results previously. I was very, very hungry, feeling great showing up to that course. It was a, it was a big course. It was the kind of course you watch. You watch people test the course the day before, two days before the race, so you can kind of get a feel for it. But the first time down the socio Olympic course was a big rush. I don't know what, whether some people would say it's like skydiving where they're jumping off a 50, 100 foot cliff in the water. Something else That I enjoyed doing. But it was a great thrill. The jumps were, the course is steep. It's usually about 50 seconds to a minute and 10 seconds long, depending on where the jumps range. Anywhere from rollers, step ups, step downs that are blind, that drop 10ft, maybe 15, 20ft with anywhere from a 10 foot gap to 25, 30 foot gap all the way down the course. So the first time down you get a really big thrill and it's.

We're six riders, right?

Yes.

So you got six riders, six guys all behind the gates at the top starts, the gates kick open, you rip and pull and fight for your position, right?

Yeah, it's a hundred percent. As soon as that gate drops every, all the, the worries, everything else flies out the door. It's 100% forecast trying to be first to the finish line. So in, in Sochi, I woke up actually on, on race day. They don't, they didn't do qualifying at the Games. Everyone that, everyone that came to the games, top 40 in the world was automatically qualified. So woke up and it was raining and super foggy on the race day. And I was like, wow, what am I doing? Snowboarding? Like I could have been bmxing still. I could have been surfing in the sun somewhere, skateboarding, BMX anything. And waking up to the rain and the fog on race day was kind of a different feeling. But as the, as hungry as I was, I knew that I had potential to get a medal that day. But things didn't really go my way. So I'll just run through it really quickly here. The first round went great, made it through, qualified to the quarter final. Not everything was going so well. We were having trouble with our wax that day. We were like, what's going on here? Because the snow conditions were absolutely crazy. It was slushy, icy, chundery. You'd be sobering along on this fast slick snow and then all of a sudden you'd hit this soft crystallized snow and you'd break through and it'd feel like you're gonna fall. So the conditions were by all means not very good. Anyways, I made it to the semifinal and I was super hyped up, really excited and coming down in second place, nearing the finish line and someone behind me had a draft. And what a draft is, is they, they pull in behind you and all the wind you're breaking all the way for them. They can gain a lot of stream in your slip stream. So they had my slipstream and I went over a jump. Wild, out of control, like snowboarding is over cross. And they actually clipped me on the landing. So how it worked is they, they had a little bit of extra speed over the lip of the jump, and we're right behind in my slipstream, and they landed on the tail of my board. Yeah. I had no idea it was happening. I was, I was looking towards the finish line. I was 10 seconds away or less going, this is good. I'm gonna make the finals and be able to go for metal. But the next thing you know, I'm on my face, sliding across the snow out of the blue. Like, you have no idea when someone hits you from behind. Just blindsided my goggles. Smashed off my face. Like, broke into little pieces. The lens went flying. I scratched my face on snow. So it's not the worst thing. But, I mean, numb face. Had no idea. Luckily didn't get knocked out. Yeah. And Dr. Came over and I was like, I'm okay. Didn't get knocked out. Really surprised because I probably hadn't hit my face ever so hard my whole entire life, anywhere, anytime. Got up and said I was okay. I, obviously, they, they hold the course for you. And he's like, do you want to continue? I could race the small final, which was the, the race where you didn't make the big final.

Yeah, yeah.

So big finals, top six, small finals, the remaining six to battle for, I guess, seventh through 12th.

Yes.

Okay, so how much, how much time did you have to get after the fall to that small final?

Then I snowboarded down a couple minutes after I recuperated from the fall, the Winnie of myself took the snowmobile up. I probably had about 10 minutes. Yeah. From one of the.

Do you have other. Do you have other goggles?

I had other goggles, yeah. As a snowboarder, you always know to bring a couple pairs of goggles every time you compete. And Oakley was a sponsor, still is a sponsor. And they, they supplied with a bunch of goggles. So luckily I had that because you definitely need goggles when you're snowboarding down the hill.

Thank you, Oakley.

Thank you.

Holy cow. So then you, then you did the, you did the other race, but that determined your placing.

Yeah, so determined. I wasn't in the final. Did the small final race, it's called, and finished second in it after the worst fall of my life in the sport.

I mean, plus a heartbreak.

Yeah, yeah. I, I like to take those kind of things are completely out of control. There was no, There was no crying at the ball of the course. It was, I was sore, but it was totally out of control. And I expect it. Like, I was silly enough at a young age or medium age to know that this sport's very dangerous and anything could happen. So I was able to accept that, move on and compete in that small final race and finish second, which was for eighth place, which wasn't too, too bad. It wasn't what I was going for at all, but especially the way I was riding that day, an eighth place finish. But I was happy to walk away from it. Wow.

And you just. But you also competed in 2018.

Yes, I did.

And so, I mean, you're really, you've settled into a solid career.

You've.

You've got two Olympics under your belt. You've got tons of finishes that are, you know, worthy of a seasoned professional.

You got the winner X Games Gold, 2015.

Yes.

Champion.

Yeah, I'll just talk about that quickly. So after the heartbreak in Sochi, if you want to call it that. Heartbreak, unfortunate event.

Slash, face break.

Yeah, slash face break. A little bit of scars on my face. I was able to come back and win X Games the next year and have a couple other good results. And that became pretty much the highlight of my career because that was a childhood dream as going to the Olympics was as well. But winning the Olympics is the pinnacle of action sports per se, and I felt that it was just as good as winning Olympic level. I know it happened every year for us, but I felt it was just as good as winning an Olympic medal, in my opinion.

Well, it's specific to your sport. You know, it's like the. Yeah, it's, it's not. It's like the, it's like the Stanley Cup.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay.

Yeah, totally. Yeah, it's one of the. And it pays the most, too. Not that that's the 100 reason why I was so excited, but it pays more than Olympics pays. So.

Yeah, that's a direct reflection of how important it is to that audience that, you know, X Games has a huge following.

Yeah.

You know, in the BMX world and all the extreme sports. And so to, to win there, that's. That is, it's, it's the Mecca of extreme sports.

Yeah, it is for sure.

That's incredible.

So that was, that was great.

And that kept you, that kept the fire lit like you want. Did you know after 2014 Olympics, 2015, X Games, did you know that you wanted to keep going for the 2018 Olympics as well, or were you ever thinking about, about finishing?

I always had people asking, what are you going to do after sport and Are you ready to move on with your life and so on. Not. Not my family, actually, but people around me like, are you ever going to get your life together? And so on and so on. And kind of like, you, because you've just been.

You've just been screwing around, really kind.

Of depending who you're talking to, basically. Because, I mean, you can't really live a normal life or have a family on the salary I make or the money I make, even with these winnings, that's what it comes down. So that's why other people here and there would say this and, and. But I really didn't want to slow down because I was so close. And Sochi, I was like, why give up when I haven't reached my dreams and goals? When I knew I had the potential to. Things that always go your way, there's always these, these setbacks. But I was like, you know what? I'd met the criterias and whatever else. Fully funded. I was like, let's. Let's carry on, see what we can do in the future. Life will figure itself out as it's meant to be.

That's fantastic. And, and so 2018, how. How did that, How. How did that finish in relation to your expectations or your goals?

Neither of either, really. The race before Pyeongchang 2018, the World cup before, actually, like a few weeks, um, I made it to the final and I was in first and second place, battling side by side with a guy, and I actually got bumped and I went from per se first or second if I rerouted the tape. We were completely side by side. I went from that position to last place and finished fourth. So my, My sights were set high because I knew making the final the weekend before the Olympics, that definitely at the Olympics, I could make the final and do quite well. But then when it came to the Olympics, everything was feeling great. I was riding well. I qualified seventh in my qualification for the final. Everything felt good. And then you pull out of the gate your first round. I play second my first round, which is okay, the guy, the guy, bigger guy in front of me. And then the second round, which is the quarterfinal, made a little mistake out of the gate, which isn't a mistake that you make every time. It's a mistake that fluke randomly happens out of the blue, and you have no idea how it happened. You catch. You catch a little bit of an edge and you go from side by side with everyone on the start gate to last place. And in your head you're like, crap, this is the Worst thing that could possibly happen. And you battle your way down the course, and you come up short, you come up fourth place, and only three makes it through to the next round, and there's nothing you can do. It was just those random things that happens.

Yeah. What's the. Just you. You mentioned, like, just what's going through your head. Once something happens at the beginning, but when you're at the starting line, what's going through your head then, like, before anything has. Is underway? Are you. Do you have, like a. Do you have a mantra? Are you. Are you nervous? What. What do you. You know, what's there? Are you. I don't know, do you say something or think something specific every single time? What's. What's it like for you?

I don't have a strict routine. Some people do, and some people say it's like the ultimate thing. They have to have certain things. Certain things they think about. I think that if I was to say that I didn't have some nerves, I'd be lying. There's some excitement, there's some nerves. You're thinking about. You want to get down the course, you want to win. So there's a lot going on in the head. As soon as the gate drops, everything goes blank. It's just another race down the course like every other day. No matter whether it's Olympics, Noram race, World cup, whatever it is you're racing, you're trying to get first place, no matter what.

There's no time to think because there's so much. There's so much input going on and what you have to do and adjust and read from everything that you're seeing and doing and. Yeah.

Yep.

That's intense.

Yeah, it is. But after that race where I place fourth, which led me to, I think, a 14th place and way under my expectations or goals for the Olympics in Korea there. But I wasn't. I was disappointed, but I wasn't upset because the guy that came down beside me, that crashed right in front of me, that I almost hit right before the finish line, he broke his neck.

Oh, gosh.

So he was lucky he was able to walk away from it, but that retired him from sport.

Wow.

So placing fourth wasn't the worst thing. Like, I mean, I walked away healthy. Not happy.

Yeah.

Happy at all. But I was healthy. And sometimes, the end of the day, that's what you got to look at in sport, because that could have been.

You that, like, you're right there. Yeah.

Could have been a lot worse. I could have smoked him. I dodged him, luckily, he could have been worse. Worse hurt. You think about that kind of thing a lot more deeply when something bad like that happens.

Your sport can be deadly.

Yeah, it can be. And then you're just thankful that you walked away alive and that you can live another day and race another day.

Yeah.

With doing the dangerous sport we do, it's so.

Yeah, it's so unique that from a mental standpoint, obviously, you're just craving the win. You're there to win, but at the same time, you know the nature of the beast. You know, somebody can land on the tail of your board. You know, the snow condition can change slightly. That weird thing can happen at the start. There's so many variables that are within your control, slash outside of your control, that you have an amazing temperament to deal with that. I think it's incredible how you rebounded and Sochi after that crash to come back and finish second in the next. That just is a testament to that, that kind of. You have a really unique mental fortitude, I think, to deal with the adversity at the same time being intensely passionate about it as well. It's a unique combination.

Thank you. Thank you very much. So.

So what's. What's next for you? Are you. Are you going for another Olympics? Is it. Are you ready to take a little time off because your season's just finishing? What's the. What's the next step for you?

To be honest, the next step for me is more so towards making money and a living. I haven't decided about the next Olympics yet. I want to take it year by year. I finished off my season okay for how it started off pretty bad this season. There was. There was a change in the guard with everything higher up above me and our. Our program, how it's run, coaching and so on. So there's a big change we had to go through this year, and the year started out quite rough for me, and I was able to pick it up and finish 10th overall in the World cup season, which was boosting me a little bit mentally as far as funding goes and as far as support if I choose, which as of now, I've choose chosen to continue a little bit longer here. But I'd like to take it year by year, try and figure out kind of my life and what I'm going to do on the side to make money, because living on this salary isn't quite cutting it, especially if I want to purchase a house soon, which is my goal, and so on. So work's going to be not number One priority, maybe.

Yeah. Yeah.

Trying to slowly ease into it.

So if there's any listeners you're. You're putting it out there that you're looking for a career.

I am looking for a career, whether I have to start it myself and. And work for myself. I might be doing that. I'm. I have a few. Few weeks, months here to really figure things out. I'm trying to every day. It's. It's a big thing on my mind every day when I wake up, what I should be doing and what I want to focus on. So I can still continue to do what I love, snowboarding in the winters with a little bit more flexibility and also work all summer full time, whether it's for myself or for someone else, and be a little bit more satisfied with what I'm accomplishing. Because when you're spending everything you make in the sport, it's. It's great being a part of the sport and being competing for Canada and your family and your friends and everyone, but a little bit unsettling in the back of the head for me, knowing that I'm, like, really prolonging everything in my life and my future for the sport, that it's giving me lots. It's giving me lots of opportunity, and I'm very blessed to be able to do what I've done. But on the other hand, it's also. It's a struggle the whole way. Yeah, let's put it that way.

It's almost like, you know, what Paul and I have seen and so many of the athletes that we know, it's almost like you get this unique Master's or PhD in world experience because you experience more than most people you'll ever meet in what the world is really like, and travel and competition and all sorts of things that way. But. But your development for your other parts of your life is put on hold and stopped because you're not, you know. You know, getting your foot in the door in some career and then building it and progressing it and making a little more money or whatever, because it's all been focused on sport. So you're kind of. You're kind of in that purgatory of, you know, doing something you love, but there's everything else is still on hold and including sometimes relationships, too, because you may not be able to really have a decent relationship because of distance or all sorts of things like that.

But. So.

If we wrap up with a few questions, can you answer a few for us? Just these kind of quick little things, some favorites and things like that, of course. So you're a bit of a gym rat as well.

I love going to the gym and training.

Okay, what's a favorite type of workout that you might do?

Favorite type of workout is pull ups.

Oh, yeah.

It works the whole upper body. It works the whole upper body. And it's a great gauge to how strong you are physically in your upper body. Because if you can only do one pull up one day, you can do 10, then you can do 20 and so on. You come back to the gym after you've taken a good time off and you go back to that pull up and you go, how many can I do? You can do five, maybe 10. And you're like, wow, I lost a lot of strength in the gym and do these pull ups. Because that's a good gauge.

So that's such a measure. It's. So it is a gauge. Okay, what about, like, on the personal side, do you have some favorite foods or dessert?

Oh, I sure do have a favorite food. My favorite food is curry. I love Thai curry, Tofu. Thai curry, red, green, yellow.

Oh, yeah. Okay. So because you're, you're vegan.

Yes, we had, we had that a few weeks ago.

Okay. I make a decent cauliflower curry in the instant pot. It's good.

Sounds amazing. I would love it. Yeah. So.

So traveling, how do you find it difficult when you're traveling to eat the way you'd like to eat? When you're in, you know, like a cafeteria setting or the sports, you know, whatever, whatever you have available to you, is it difficult to eat what you want?

Yeah, I think that's probably the toughest thing about my career is traveling the world, not being able to eat the foods we have access to. In Canada, as far as being vegetarian, vegan, it's a lot different in other countries. Finding the right nutrients, protein is my number one struggle to maintaining strength, body weight, mass while traveling the world. Definitely the most difficult.

What do you bring with you? Do you have a favorite, you know, some favorite dry goods or proteins like a pea and rice or. What do you bring with you to make traveling hacks? Make sure you have it all the time.

Yeah. So nothing special. I always make sure I bring some bars. There's the vega bars, protein and snack bars. I like Clif Bar, Chewies and so on like that for little snacks while I'm competing. And I always make sure I bring a protein powder, whether peace, soya, whatever it is, protein powder. Because without that, when I'm hungry after that meal, I ate an hour before And I get hungry already. I have to have something to supplement a little bit of protein because I mean, 90% of the time you say you're vegetarian in another country, they're going to feed you pasta with pasta sauce and that's it. And there's no protein. There's no protein involved.

Yeah, there's no, there's no lentils or beans or grains with extra protein and. Yeah, okay, cool. So what about on a, you know, down, Downtime? Favorite movie, music or bucks?

I just started reading this year. I love, I used to not love reading. Now I love reading because I know that it's definitely helping me learn stuff. So instead of a TV show, instead of a movie, which I can't even really usually focus through a whole movie or show, especially with the phone in the background, always lingering there, texting, keeping a hold of friends and family back home. My favorite book, the Power of Habit, I just finished it a few weeks ago and I've read a lot of books that I couldn't really focus on and concentrate throughout the whole book. And really like, what am I reading this for? Like, nothing in this book is pertaining to my life and what I'm doing. Just, oh, I want to read this because someone so and so said it. But this book really hits home with a lot of different things in life. And if you want to get somewhere, you need to establish good habits. So.

Excellent, excellent. And then lastly, any, any or did you have a movie or anything like that or music that you wanted to add?

Movie? I would say old time favorite Point Break and New Time favorite Savages. I think those two movies are great movies and I also like to listen to hip hop, rap and electronic music.

Awesome. Cool, cool. And then do you have any, any tip, one or two tips for young upcoming up and comers in your sport?

From what I can think of in my career, the number one tip, and I'm sure lots of athletes will say this, write your goals down on paper, set those goals and never give up because you never know where life and sports going to take you. But if you have a focus and a outcoming goal that you want to achieve, anything's possible, no matter what.

That's awesome.

Very, very.

People say that to write it down. That's key.

Yeah, very much so. And put it in front of you so you can see it. Even daily, weekly. It's a big help.

Very inspiring. Very, very inspiring. Well, thank you so much. Is there anything else you want to add before other than, you know, now in your habits you're going to build in listening to the Empowered Athlete Podcast.

And.

Is there anything else you want to add before we say goodbye?

No. Thank you guys so much for doing this with me. I haven't done a podcast before. It was great. You guys asked tons of great questions. I was very happy to do this and I will be definitely adding this to my listening in the future.

Excellent. We're so happy to have you Kevin and we will keep in touch and talk to you soon.

Perfect. Thank you guys so much.

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