EP34 Claire Hanna - TSN/CTV - Volleyball

This is the Empowered athlete podcast, episode 34. Claire Hannah isn't one to back down from a challenge. Her volleyball career at UBC was one that saw her on the sidelines and on the court and forced to reinvent herself as a player to make an impact. Such an impact that she made it to the national team and represented Canada for four years. But it was a strange twist of events at UBC that really lit a fire inside Claire and led her to where she is today, back on the sidelines, but this time calling things for TSN as a reporter for them and their CFL coverage. Sit back, relax and enjoy this great conversation with Claire Hanna. All right everyone, the 12:30 challenge, that's 12 months of 30 day challenges for the entire year 2019 for Kari and I continues in April and this one is a special one for us. It has to do with the environment and taking care of it and making the world a better place. And the way to do that is to avoid the use of single use plastics. I personally think this might be the hardest challenge of the entire year as plastics are so invasive. They're in every part of our lives and in starting this challenge we know it is going to be tough, so we're determined to make it happen. Here's what we're going to do. We are committing to trying to not buy or bring any single use plastics into our home. Make every effort to use something different than single use plastic. And if we have used any single use plastics in the month, we're going to collect it and post in the group a picture of everything that we use just to get a feel of what's really going on. I've gone grocery shopping with Maeve recently, our youngest, and it was a massive challenge looking at things that we could buy that didn't involve plastics. We're getting creative with bringing our own bags to the grocery store and spending netted bags for all the produce, looking at things that come in glass containers or jars and anything that's tin, canned or in paper as well. So this is a massive one. Easy things that you can do. Use a reusable water bottle, coffee cup, and if you do need a straw, make sure it's a metal one. So that is the challenge for April. Eliminate these as single use plastics. Join the group the show notes and help us make the world a better place.

We believe in natural products for ourselves and our family. That's right, I'm an essential oil addict. Paul, on the other hand, is a closet oil user.

All joking aside, essential oils have allowed a higher level of health in our home. From bug repellent and cleaning to wound care and with five kids in four different schools, flu prevention Doterra Essential oils.

Are the only oils we use due to the highest quality and worldwide ethical sourcing. I have pretty high standards as most of you know. My oils need to be consistent and work. For information on DIY recipes, go to mydoterra.com karischneider that's mydoterra.com Karischneider and if you want me to come teach a wellness class for you, reach out to me@ksempowerconditioning.com that's ksempowerconditioning.com welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast. Created to support athletes in their pursuit of excellence and inspire others toward their best lives. Hosted by Kari Schneider, coach to top performers in sport and life, and Paul Duarten, former national and professional volleyball player.

Hello everyone. Welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast and we are welcoming Claire Hannah to the show. We are so thankful she could make it. She had a late night last night. A double overtime affair with a delay for some ice repair, some playoff hockey. But Claire is a former volleyball player with the national team. She played at UBC and she is now a reporter, a sports reporter for CTV and TSN in Regina. Claire, welcome to the show.

Woohoo.

Thanks for having me. Just. Just finally woke up with my alarm. Barely. But yeah, made it.

Yeah, it was a late one last night.

It's almost like work. Yeah, I shift work.

Hey, I know. I don't think I've ever gotten home at 3:45 in the morning before. But hey, it happens.

Unreal. What was it like? Like what was. What was going on last night? How was was good?

It was just the fact that I'm in Regina and it was playing played in a town two hours away. Some unexpected things happened during the game and of course it went to overtime. My camera person was like I'm going to cry if this goes to overtime. And then like two minutes later they scored and it went to overtime. And then we were leaving at 1am so yeah, that's how it happens.

They jinxed it by saying that. Right.

I know that. I was like, you jinxed it? And she's like oh, did I? And then it happened. And then I'm like this is your fault. So anyways, it's all on her.

So I mean just that experience alone, that. That's the epitome of being a pro. You have to do what it takes in that situation and still be everything you need to be for your job, even though you've been there for how many hours, it's getting into the wee hours of the morning, you know, you've got to drive ahead of you. You know, there's all of the things that are there, but you still need to be a pro. What is it? What do you draw from in order to do that in your work environment?

It's funny, Kari, I was actually thinking that when we were in the second overtime, and I'm like, man, I'm getting tired. What am I going to feel like if it's in quadruple overtime? Because you never know how late the game's going to go. But then I'm thinking about the athletes, I'm thinking about the refs. I'm thinking about the coaches who are also all there and, like, way past their bedtime. And then I'm thinking about the kids in the stands whose parents are, like, forcing them to stay there because they want to see the game.

Yeah.

And so I think everybody's feeling the same way, but there's always so much adrenaline because this game could have. The series could have ended had the Humboldt Broncos won that game, but then the Bruins won it, so now it's going back to game six. So I think everybody just gets caught up in the energy, and you don't even think about the sleep, but truly the drive home. We thought about getting a hotel, but then we just switched back and forth. And that. That was the part that was potentially dangerous because we kept asking each other, like, how are you feeling? Do you want to drive? Okay. How am I feeling? I'm actually feeling a little tired. Do you want to switch? So, but the game itself and covering is never a challenge. I don't find that a challenge ever. In those moments.

Yeah. Because it's the sport, it's the adrenaline, especially with a team like Humboldt, and so much. So much love and support around that team and. Oh, my gosh. Yeah.

Yeah. But what's funny is the other team won. The Bruins. Yeah. And everybody, like, so everybody there's cheering for the Bruins. And I actually asked a couple of fans, how do you feel about the fact that your team is playing the Humboldt Broncos, who have had so much media attention and. Very familiar. Yeah, everybody's familiar with their story and what they've been through, and they're like, you know what? It's just a game. And this is why they're playing this year, and this is why they played last year. And. And those boys just happen to have jerseys on. And one says, humble Broncos but everybody wants to win. And it's so true. Even the players on the answer. This comes down to. It's just a game.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And they're to do. They're there to do their job.

Totally.

Yeah.

Well, I want to add. I want to add about the late night and having. Well, I follow you on Instagram, see your story, and it can get a little goofy at times. But here's the thing.

Goofy's good.

That.

Exactly. That was something I would do on the road or if we were having a. You know, there's a 8am practice on the day of a match, you don't want to be there, you don't want to go to the gym. They give you the crappy time, and you gotta get goofy. You have to do something stupid, make it fun. And you do that through your Instagram. I saw you rocking the massage chairs or something there in the arena and doing other stuff. But I feel like that's something that maybe. Or did you learn that as a player? And was that something that you brought to the team?

That's a really good point. I think I was always. Maybe I was not, like, the team clown by any means, but I also think that you need people on the team to keep things loose. And I've heard this, actually from coaches at all levels now. Like, what does that guy bring to the team, actually. Or female. They keep things loose in the locker room, which is important when the chips are down or people are feeling really stressed and tight. And those people, I think, you know, are so important. And maybe it's not even on a team, but I think last night, my camera person, who's amazing and so professional, like, she was just feeling so tired, and I was like, here, Katie, I'm gonna put $2 in this massage chair in this intermission. I'm gonna take half of it. And then you sit down and like, she sat down, and after she's like, oh, my gosh, I actually feel so much better. And some of it's just, like, keeping things fun while they can be very tiring and stressful.

So that's. Yeah, there needs to be that. That distraction and fun and just that little injection of silliness, and it makes that huge difference.

Yeah, that's why we're doing it. We're doing it for fun, you know, we're not doing it because it's, like, extremely. And it makes it stressful or whatever.

It makes it clear that you're also loving a lot of the parts of the job as well.

Yes. Loving every Moment, maybe. Except for the drive home.

Yeah, exactly.

So.

So take us back. You. What. What people may not know is, you know, you're immersed in your career right now, but one of the reasons that you got into this career, or it really was a pull, or you are maybe compelled to this career is because of your background in sport and you played at UBC for a number of years. But lead us into that. And what kind of led you to the national team and what started your career in volleyball?

Honestly, I think I've got a pretty, I want to say, quintessential like, sports story in terms of. I just was really active growing up. My parents enrolled me in everything from soccer to gymnastics to swimming lessons, and I just continued along. And then in gym class in junior high, I tried out for every team and usually made every team. Probably because of that, you know, diversity. Yeah.

Totally different movement patterns.

The volleyball team, the basketball team, the field hockey team, and like, obviously it was usually some of the same girls who were always on those teams as well. So we'd kind of just like become really tight. And then, you know, some teams would have a couple different people, but you sort of build that core. And then I remember getting into volleyball actually, growing up, I was a really high level badminton player. And I'm not sure if many people know that.

Yes.

So your.

Your reaction time. Glenn Hogue would always love to have any of the players have something like racquetball or badminton or the hand eye plus the racket, the skill that was involved. He loved that for what it brought to the game. Yeah. There's just so many of those, like little quick, explosive movements in the hand, eye reaction, and it was fantastic.

I didn't know that. And I love that. He.

Validates your badminton. There you go.

So you're a high level player. Did you call it a birdie or a shuttlecock?

We called it actually both, but we would never say shuttlecock. We just say the shuttle. Or we'd call it the birdie.

I just wanted to say that.

I just want to say that.

I know, I know. You're being a brat. You're totally being a brat.

You're being the goof right now.

Right, Exactly. He just wanted to say the C word. Yeah, I know.

Anyway, but no birdie. Shuttle. Anyways. But playing badminton was, like, really awesome and I loved it. But one thing I didn't like about it was the independence of it. I don't like being a solo athlete and I would play mixed and doubles as well. So, like, with a female partner, and with a male partner, but. And that was okay. But when I started playing volleyball in junior high, I was just like, oh, my gosh, I love this. I love the big team part of it. And so that was when I really just decided to kind of phase out badminton, which was difficult, and then phase in volleyball.

Why. Why do you think that you have such an affinity for the team environment versus the individual sport?

I didn't like being on an island. I didn't. I loved the support of teammates and I loved giving the support. But I felt like in the down times, I could rely on my teammates and maybe you could be having a bad game, but your teammates could still lift you up or you could rely on teammates to get the job done. But I didn't like all of that being on my own in badminton.

Was it. Did you. Did you find you ended up like a lot of athletes? A lot of the individual sport athletes of the track, the swimming, the. You know, all of these sports where it's the ultimate accountability, but then if something doesn't go right, that that athlete ends up beating themselves up over all the little things that went wrong. And it becomes very hard to go forward when they're beating themselves up over all the little things that went wrong. So did you ever find that. That. That accountability was kind of tough to manage as well? Instead of having fun in the me in the meantime, you might be replaying the. The thing that went wrong or.

Yeah, that's. You know, it's a. That's a good point. And I think so. Like, when I stopped playing badminton, I was 16. I played it, like, so competitively between, like, 11 and 15, which is weird, but I think I. I just also. I felt like my parents were my coaches in a weird way because we had, like, a badminton coach. But there were so many people at our club that they were always, like, watching all the players. And my parents would watch all my games and they'd give me so many tips after. And I honestly hated that. I was just like, I don't want. I don't want my parents to be my coaches. Like, that's so many roles. And sometimes I'm like, hold on, I don't see you playing. Like, what do you know about the sport that I don't.

Right.

Like, just being a little, like, head kid. Right?

Yeah.

So I just. There was just things that I. I just started not to like about badminton. And I don't think at that age I was beating myself up too much about it because.

Because your parents were busy doing it. For you?

Yeah, but I was just like not having as much fun, to be honest.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Were you in Calgary at the time? This is.

Yeah, I was in Calgary.

Okay, so you started. When did you really become. Would you say you were a volleyball player and kind of.

I'd say probably when I was 16, 17, like when I like I was still playing badminton and volleyball, probably when I was 14, 15, 16. But I couldn't balance those two things in my life because actually the badminton club that I was a part of, my head coach, his name was Channerong Ratana. Swing Swing. I'm not even kidding. And Channel Wrong is like a legend in badminton. When he was a kid, he was top in the world in Thailand, like number one. And he like won the Commonwealth Games. And he I think is the only certified level 7 coach in Canada. Like it's ridiculous how good he is and. But he ob. And I liked him a lot but he wanted his players to attend practice. And sometimes I would be like, oh, we'll have volleyball tonight. And then sometimes in volleyball I'd be like, oh, I have badminton. And it turned out that I just.

Too much.

Neither coaches. Yeah, exactly. And I think I kind of just didn't want to quit in badminton because I'd played it. But I didn't realize that those skills were very transferable to volleyball. And it wasn't like I was quitting it. I was just using those skills to.

Then you were evolving into something different. And it's very hard when you're with someone who's a guru in what they do because you also appreciate the value that you're getting from that expert coach. However your heart is going, okay, I'm leaning towards something different. And then you're at that age when it comes to overall development of an athlete. You're that age where you have to start to choose. Whereas before that 16 year old age, you do want to be diversified as an athlete. You want all kinds of different movement patterns and experiences. But right around that age, especially for team sport athletes, it is that kind of time where it's a key time for more specialization and getting the real skill set.

Yeah, and I'm so happy you brought that up because now as somebody who covers sports, and I cover a wide gamut of ages and ranges too, I see how specialized kids are getting early and it's actually so scary. Like especially in Saskatchewan, for example, with hockey and football, I see kids like girls and boys, it's just like their parents are just putting them in these sports and I'M like, I don't know how if that's actually going to make them a better hockey player in the end because I just remember playing so many sports when I was younger and you didn't need to specialize until you were a bit older. But, but I don't know how that's working into the psyche of things.

No, it's, I mean the psyche is one thing, but the overall development and movement patterns and the athlete in their brain and their hand, eye and all of those things, it shouldn't be a specialization of one thing so, so early and they never get the experience of other things. But yeah, the whole psychological aspect of it too. It's a whole other, it's a whole other developmental process for an athlete to experience what it's like to be accountable in an individual sport or a team sport or the different dynamics of different types of team sports. There's so much to be said for what they can draw from all of those experiences, not only socially in their overall development as a, you know, growing up, but also for what it adds to their sport experience and their sport development as well. Yeah. So you, you were in club volleyball then in Calgary and then, is that, is that correct? And then you.

Yeah, that's right.

You were, did you, did, did UBC become a draw because of the volleyball or because of school? And then you were there for school and wanted to try out for. How did that work for you? How did you transition there?

Well, I actually was born in Vancouver and we lived there till I was about 10 years old and so we moved to Calgary when I was in grade three and I loved Vancouver. Like we went back to visit like friends and family sometimes in Vancouver. But one, I wanted a combination and you just kind of said it, I wanted a good school and I wanted a good volleyball program and I wanted a place that was going to be beautiful. And Mirka, who I'm sure you guys know that name, the setter for the U of A Pandas Forever, who's like another legend in volleyball. She actually was like helped coach my club in Calgary and when I was trying to decide what school to go to, I had applied to Western Ontario and like was being highly recruited there and University of Winnipeg and also UBC as well as a couple other ones, but those three were the big ones. And I just done a visit to the University of Winnipeg with Diane Scott and I really liked Diane and I the program had just gotten second at nationals, so there was like that, but I wasn't sure about the school. So Much. And then Mirka. I have told so many people this. Mirka was like, claire, do you want to break your leg the very first week of university and then be stuck in Winnipeg with a broken leg and you can't play volleyball?

That's one way to look at it.

Oh, my God.

Holy.

I was like, I've never thought about that. She's like, claire, you don't want to be in Winnipeg. Like, she basically was just like, don't go there. And it's ironic because I spent four years there with the national team and loved it, but I was like, okay, I think you're making a good point in going to ubc.

But that's how Diane gets tug.

Ryan.

Diane creates tough athletes. It's not only the program she runs them through and how she coaches them. It is also the cold environment. That's why the national team was based there, is toughen up these athletes.

And I've told Diane Scott that story about what Mirka said, and she's like, oh, my gosh, I'm gonna have to punch her in the face. Like, she just hated Meera. Kept her saying that. But I really think Mirka, because I had. I had a really great time at ubc, but it was not easy at the beginning. And when I knew I wanted to go there, Doug Reimer didn't know who I was, hadn't heard of me, and I honestly wasn't that good coming out of high school. I'd never played on, like, a junior national team. I had made the provincial team and stuff. But when I talked to Doug, like, I sent him, like, a VHS tape because that's what we. Back then, There was no YouTube. There was not even DVDs. Like, I sent him a VHS TV tape of. Of, like, some volleyball stuff that I'd gotten my dad to, like, set up a camcorder with and whatever. And he was like, okay, you're okay, but I can't really get a good feel. And my mom worked for the airline at the time, so they were like, well, how about we just, like, we'll fly you out to Vancouver. And, like. Because Doug was like, are you ever going to be in Vancouver? And we're like, well, actually, I've got big roots in Vancouver. And he's like, if you're out here, then, like, I can kind of, like, have a mini tryout for you in December when we're not really practicing because of exams. So I went out there for that, and just, like, he had his setter, Amy, set some balls and stuff, and I like, did a bit of, you know, he just had me do some footwork and blocking and serving. And then I went out for lunch with like some of the girls after. And I remember later in the year, Doug emailed me. He's like, he's like, I mean, if you want to come here, you can, but I'm not really interested in you. It was such a backhanded email. And, and. But here's the thing. I showed it to one of my friends because she's like, are you gonna go to ubc? And I was like, well, look at this email. And she's like, oh, that sucks. I'm like, no. He says, yes, he's letting me come there. And that was what I pulled out of the email. Like, I was. I was like, no, no, no. He says, I can go and be on the glasses.

Have.

But like, oh, totally. That's how I saw it.

That's fantastic.

And then I remember, yeah, basically calling him in like July and being like, so I'm coming. And he was like, okay. He's like, I don't have a spot for you on a team, but you can be a red shirt. And I thought that was good enough.

Yeah.

So.

Well, it's interesting because it's the whole psychology of wanting something bad enough that you're going to see what you want to see in that scenario because you want it so bad. And so clearly UBC was the choice for you because you're getting kind of a. A sigh, an offhanded no, you know, and you still are seeing the. Yes. Like, oh, it.

Yeah.

One in a million. So you're saying there's a chance. Yep.

You got it, Lloyd.

I look back and I'm like, I loved my attitude back then because I don't know how I would take it now. Right. But I was like, high school. Yeah. Woo. I'm doing it.

Such a good thing to draw from, though. Paul, you're gonna say something there?

Well, I just wanted to ask. So he said, you, red shirt the first year, but the second.

My first.

But did you get cut the second year?

Go ahead. Yes, I actually did. So that was like, oh, just awful. And like, honestly, first year there was. We had some other like quasi red shirts, but they were kind of given a spot on the team. And so Doug had this really interesting thing where he had to like slot them into the game sometimes. He had to. He had to dress them or like get them in. And there was that classic scenario where they got in for like three points and lost a year of Eligibility, Right?

Yeah. He.

He had this. He had a balance with him because he had so many people there. So. But I did. I didn't get into one game. And I remember sometimes I was like, well, sometimes these ones are dressing, and he's like, you don't have the same deal as them. And I'm like, okay, crap. So anyways, but second year, I, like, remember I worked my ass off that summer, like, in the gym, because I was like, I don't want to give him an excuse to cut me. Like, I don't. I'm not going to leave anything on the table. And I just. Just worked out so hard, worked on my vertical, because that was always an issue. And also, I should say, when I went to ubc, I went as kind of, like, not a middle, but he switched me to power because I was short. So, like, power kind of writes.

When you say short, what's your.

I'm six.

Yeah. I just want. I want listeners to understand, like, Paul and I know what short is in volleyball, but for a female athlete, we want the listeners to understand that you being a short player at six feet, what that really means, you know?

So.

Yeah, compared to you.

A hundred percent. Yeah.

I've seen the picture of you with Mark Messier, and you're taller than Mark.

So, yeah, there's a.

There's a pro hockey player and thinks, oh, they're huge.

Yeah, Claire's taller.

Yeah, he was a little thicker, but, yeah, for sure. Taller.

Yeah.

But I. Yeah, I guess in my second year when I, like, was kind of short and had tried to work on my vertical, I, like, really wasn't getting into drills in my second year. It was just like he'd had some other new recruits, including, like, Liz Cordonier. So obviously we all know her talent, and it was just, like, really challenging. And I remember one day after practice, I was like, okay, I need to set some goals because I need to figure out what I need to achieve. And this year. Right. And I went to talk to him about goals, and then he cut me. Like, it was just, like, out of the intention.

And your vision for that meeting was to see from him what you could do better and really work together to get you to the next level. And his. He used that opportunity to cut you because you had a meeting with him. Yeah.

And it was, like, so. So, like, devastating. It was just, like, one of the biggest blows in my life because I was just, like. I had worked so hard, I felt in the gym that summer and, like, come in really dialed in and just to have everything taken away. And I was like, oh, my gosh, you're cutting me? Like, what? Why are you doing this? And it was October, so I couldn't even apply to a new school if I wanted to transfer. Like, you know, And I kept thinking, like, university of Winnipeg, University of Western. I'll take it. My leg's not broken.

Yeah, Yeah. I don't care about the call.

Oh, my gosh. Like, yeah, I'll do it. But that was really awkward. And he's like, well, if you. He's like, I know you're really tight with the team, and I know that one of the girls in the team, Danielle Van Heusen, kind of. I think she stood up for me in a way. And she's like, you know what? Like, Claire brings a lot of energy to the team. Like, positivity. She works really hard. Are you sure you want to cut her? I think this is what Dee told me, at least. Danielle vanhusen. And I think Doug was like, okay, like, Claire, you can. And then we made this weird scenario because I would kind of keep showing up to practice. But, like, Like. Which was so awkward, too, right? He had, like, cut me, but he was like, it's okay. You can still, like, kind of come, but, like, I need you to be more of a manager. And so I would show up and, like, kind of just sit there, and people like, why are you practicing? And I was, like, so embarrassed to say I got caught.

Oh, my God.

I didn't even say it. Isn't this weird? Like, I'm cringing thinking about this, you guys.

Oh, the clammy sweats and the hands and the. Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

It just feels bad. It feels bad.

Yeah, I know. And so he. I remember Doug was like, hey, join the junior varsity team. Like, I'm going to put a call in, and you can, like, come and practice with us two days a week. And then the other two days, I would write, like, newsletters and stuff for the team. But it was really. Anyways, that was, like, all of my.

What were you. What were you taking in school at that point? When you're writing the newsletters and you're. And you're, you know, getting cut.

Oh, I don't even remember. I remember, like, I ended up majoring in political science and international relations. But at that time, like, it was dark, and I would say, like, I.

Like, I was depressed.

Yeah. Like, I. And also, like, a week before, he had cut me. Like, I had been dating this guy, and he broke up with me. And so it Was like a lot of things coming in. In your second year, you're 19, you're away from home, like, it was just not good times.

Everything you envisioned had, had just crumbled in front of you.

Yeah. And I just was in a dark place. And I remember like, my dad flew out for a day because my parents were just a little worried about me. And he flew out and he just like came to the library with me and like, we went out for coffee and like, we didn't really talk. He was just like there for me. And that was just so important to feel. My family and my family has always been there for me, but that was like a good day. And we just kind of talked about feelings and like how, you know, like everything. And I remember I made a big commitment to try to get my marks back up because in your first year of university, I don't, I don't think I really cared about school because I was like, oh, I'm playing volleyball. Ubc. Da da da da. Like, I've got my own dorm room. Like, boys, all this stuff, right? And so I just was like, hey, what's the actual reason you're at ubc? You came here. And I remembered back to the recruiting and I'm like, you came here because it was beautiful. It has a great program and there's the volleyball. But like the other two things you aren't even noticing right now because volleyball is so bad. So I really started to like, focus on school. Like it was. That was the big thing. I'm like, let's just get your school back up. Let's get the marks back up. Focus on that. Don't even think about volleyball.

You know how many young university level athletes don't have either some of some parental support unit that A, understands what they're feeling and what they're going through, but B, you know, if, if their vision was totally sport and an injury or getting cut or anything sidelines them from that, they feel like you probably felt like their whole world has been lost and the rug pulled right out from underneath them. And then it's just this void, this blank space and it's, you know, what are your choices? Do you turn to partying? Because there's that option always at university.

Do you.

Do you may not know what you want to do? So how appealing does school look when you're not sure what you want in life? So it's just, that's one of the reasons, I think, not just with student athletes, but students in general in university, that they end up Becoming so lost and the rates of depression are so high. And you know, it's just, it becomes a real issue for, for that age group in, in university.

You nailed it. Like, I think a lot of us deal with that at different times. Even if, if sports can be going well, we get caught up in the partying. Like, I remember binge drinking a lot and I remember like, I don't want to say, like I wasn't, I honestly wasn't sleeping around a lot. Does that make sense? But I was definitely like just having fun with guys. But definitely it was not focused on like, like the core roots of what you want to be doing at university.

And I mean, it's this first freedom that, that young adults are exposed to and it's like, well, let's do what every other university student does. And I'm not sure what direction I'm going. What were you going to say there, Paul?

What was the composition of the coaching staff outside of Doug? Was there female leadership in the staff or was it male dominated? Because that can obviously be a huge. In terms of just communication and leadership.

From the coaching staff.

Was that there?

Not at all.

A little bit. You know what, we had a female sports psychologist and then. But we didn't in terms of coaching at the time. It was also Jesse Knight who ended up becoming the head coach at the Dinos a little bit later. But it was mostly like Joanne Ross ended up being an assistant coach, but she would just poke her head in at that time. So Joanne Ross is obviously an amazing female who. Great leader, amazing volleyball player, all around person. Um, but at the time, I don't actually even. It's funny, I didn't even think about that as a factor, but I, I definitely didn't feel like I could talk to anybody on the team because like, I also felt like they didn't. Like at the time, Doug didn't want to have my back because he didn't want to make me to feel like too much part of the team because he knew that was painful because I wasn't part of the team. Like, that was a really tough balance for Doug and I, I feel bad for him in that position because he was just trying to like make his team great. Cut somebody who wasn't accepting being cut.

But it's, it's one of those, those issues I think, in sport that, you know, I've, I've thought about so much over the years because I've been in that. I've been that peripheral support as a strength coach to help these athletes get to where they want to go, but maybe their skill set just wasn't there. No matter how strong or this or that they got how powerful or fast or, or whatever, then maybe they still don't make the cut. And so like, for years, for 25 years, I've seen the fallout from these athletes getting cut, but I've always wondered, you know, if each system, so each university or club system or even pro system had some sort of protocol post cutting, you know what I mean? Like say there was a protocol in place and maybe it's slightly different at each different level, but a protocol in place that looks like maybe an older, a vet athlete mentor has a certain number of, you know, tea dates or coffee dates or whatever, you know, sounds like a play date, but has some sort of connection with that athlete. So they're not completely cut off and isolated from a community that they were desperate to be a part of. And all of a sudden that's been cut off. And it's quite, quite literally the feeling for an individual like that is very primal. Like you feel like you've lost your tribe, you are being, you know, kicked out of the tribe to die in the wild. That's basically how we primally feel. You're voted off the island, basically. And how so devastating. And so, you know, I on, I don't know how it would be set up, but this is part of how this podcast was birthed, was. Because there's a need for support for athletes in all sorts of scenarios, whether it's injury, whether it's when they're in the thick of going from team to team, they don't feel like they have connection or community with other athletes on their team because they're competing against them and they could be cut at any time and lose their contract or whatever it is, but they just feel unsupported. And, and whether it's retirement, something that they've chosen, or whether it's them getting cut, but just some sort of connection or protocol that if someone gets cut, then this is what the next steps.

Are versus every step, like a support system. Right.

This is what the next steps are. You have these people and these meetings and these resources, like a multifaceted type of thing. But it's not just cold turkey, like you're done and then you literally feel like you're, you're dead to them. You know, you've, you've been, you've been thrown off the boat kind of thing.

Yeah, and one thing you said in that, that was the reason I didn't want to leave the team because that was like, my best group of friends since I'd gotten to ubc, you know?

Yeah.

I think that was what drove me to, like.

And it's like, yeah, like, are we supposed to not be friends anymore? Because these are your friends and yet you've lost some of what you. What. What drew you together.

Totally.

Yeah. So you got cut, but how. That wasn't the end of your UBC story. What happened?

Well, I guess I just. Okay, so I joined the JV team and played on that and with, like, mixed success, whatever. Like, I was starting on it, but, you know, I told you and this was the truth. I really, like, got re. Inspired by my education because I was like, hold on. Like, eventually one day volleyball is going to be done and you want to make sure you've got a good degree after and you've got. You've set yourself up for a future career. Because at that point, it wasn't like Team Canada was even on the radar. Right. It's not like I thought I'd have a career in volleyball. So I just. I worked hard. But then the next year when I came back and here's something weird that happened. I actually sprained my ankle that year when I was playing on the JV team and which, like, prevented me from jumping where I was playing power. And so I started doing a lot of passing reps. And eventually, when there was this random team at the end of each season back in the day, that was like a junior team, but it was like just basically anybody under third year on the UBC varsity team. But, like, I got included in that team and we went to nationals. It was like an under 20 nationals, and I wanted to be on that team, but I didn't have, like, the ability to play power because I, like, injured my ankle. And I probably wasn't going to make the team, but my coach was like, do you want to play libero? And I was like, yeah, for sure I'll play libero. And so all of a sudden I saw this opening where, hey, maybe this is where I can make a name for myself at ubc. Or, like, not even make a name for myself, just get on the team, you know, maybe I can be a libero. So I just kind of worked that angle. And then when I came back in my third year, I was like, I'm trying out again. And. But I was like, hey, Doug, I want to try out his libero. And he's like, okay, sounds good. And so I tried out that way and honestly, kind of made the team, but again, kind of just did it in a red shirt way again. But at least I was back on the team. Like, I was getting full practices. This wasn't awkward anymore. I wasn't doing a newsletter. Like, I was back on the team, getting full wraps. And then we had a couple injuries on the team. But, like, I'm talking middles, powers. And so here, all of a sudden, I'm a dynamic player who can kind of do a little bit of middle, a little bit of right side and pass. And so all of a sudden, I was kind of this dynamic option for Doug and he started traveling me a bit. And then I started just getting in a little bit. And when I got into the games, like, it was magical. Like, I do good things. It was crazy. I didn't. I surprised myself, you know, And I think it was like, totally this underdog story because, you know, he'd like so blatantly cut me. And then all of a sudden I'm getting in and I'm like getting kills in, like, big moments of the game for momentum swings and stuff like that. So that was amazing. And then when I came back, like, that year, we actually. We made playoffs, but it was like the first year in like seven that we didn't actually go to nationals. And then the next year, when I came back from my fourth year, I was just full on a libero. And then it was on and then that was it. So that's kind of the short end of it.

That's awesome.

So what there was. There was a comment you had mentioned to us previously about. The school newspaper and posting a win of the men's basketball team. And at the same time. So when was this? And tell us about that story and how it influenced you.

And this is truly the reason I'm in media to this day. And I think about this all the time, and I thought about it huge at this moment. But in our fourth year at ubc, this is my first year starting as libero. We made it to nationals, and we actually end up winning nationals. And I mean, we could make that a big story, but we were such an underdog team at the time, and it was our first national championship at UBC since 1979. So any. Anybody who knows UBC obviously knows now it's become a powerhouse, but at the time was still a powerhouse. It was just always the bridesmaid, never the bride. We had had so many silver, bronze, so many national championship appearances, but we just couldn't get it done. But in 2008, we win for the first time since 1979. It was unbelievable. And I remember we were in Fredericton, and we get back to UBC the Tuesday after winning on Sunday because it took so long to get home. And I was, like, so excited to see the newspaper, the student newspaper called the ubc. And it was, like, widely circulated. You could get it in any classroom on campus. And I pick it up, and the front page is the men's basketball team for winning, like, an insignificant game. Like, it's just. It was just like a fricking game.

But you guys are on page two.

Like, no, six, five. Like, we weren't even. And here's the thing. They're on the COVID and they're like, the men's basketball team's just like, the huge cover page. And I'm like, hold on a second. This went to print, like. And I know they could have had us in here. So I'm, like, flipping through it, and I find us in, like, the bottom corner of page five. Like, not even a full page picture. Like, it's, like, taking up 18 of this page. And I was like, oh, my gosh, what the heck? So that was just like, oh, I brought the newspaper back to my team, and we all just, like, bitched about it, and we just. We just couldn't believe it. And then.

And for you, that's.

That's the TSN turning point.

It is. It totally is.

That was your TSN turning point in your life.

Yeah.

And, like, I actually. I don't know if I have a copy of it anywhere, but I'm like, I almost want to get a copy of it because it's just, like, to me now, it's a point of pride. Like, that was a reason. So I thought at that moment, I'm like, what the heck? First of all, it's like, mostly male editors at the student newspaper. And also at the time, like, men's basketball got so much attention, and they were good, but they weren't winning nationals, like, ever.

Yeah.

And I'm like, which is.

Which is a huge accolade for the school. It's not just about just the women's team.

It.

It draws attention and all kinds of things for the school. It recruits more athletes. It makes the school look good. It, you know, combines the academics and athletics. There's all sorts of good things that come from, you know, plowing that. Yeah. And there's. There's plenty of research that shows that. That the success of females has a greater ripple effect in a community for all kinds of people. More so than the success of males.

That's amazing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's very amazing. And. But. But here's the thing, and this is what I want to touch on, and not as a criticism, but just as a. A general observation with women. That newspaper goes back with you guys into the locker room, and you guys sit there and you bitch about it. What else happened beyond that?

Well, okay, there was one point when I had actually written, like, a letter to the newspaper, and I was like, this is like. And it wasn't about that article, actually. It was. I think I. I turned it into about that article. But it was also about just, like, marketing in general at the university. You'd always see people, like, out there, like, come to the men's basketball game this Friday. Like, people from internal UBC relations, like, marketing the basketball games. I'm like, we never get any marketing. Like, people aren't trying to promote our team yet. We're, like, national champions. Like, all this stuff. Like, I wrote a letter to the ubc and they printed the letter in the newspaper, which I thought was pretty cool, because it's like, here's a member of the women's volleyball team sharing her opinion. And they shared it, and it was criticizing their newspaper, too. So I give them kudos for putting that in there. Right. But that started. Then they were like, okay, like, why don't you write for us? And so I actually started writing for the UBC in terms of this Athlete of the week. In the Thunderbird Athletic Council, which I sat on, we would always nominate two athletes of the week. Usually it was a male and a female. I think we always did both. But then we started writing up. I'd write little articles about their achievements that then got published in the ubc. So even though that's equal gender representation, which is. I'm not even asking for equality, I just want to, like, have some kind of attention put on women. You know what I mean? And so that. That was a big, I think, turning point in terms of, like, holy crap. I want to make sure that one day, like, I want to be a sports reporter and put women in the spotlight more because we never get the attention we need. And that is something I notice in, like, national media, we're treated differently. We just. We just don't get as many eyes on us. And I think that there's so much value and benefit that comes to that that can trickle down to even women getting more money as professional athletes.

Absolutely. And at the same time, it's this like, kudos to you for writing the letter and taking more steps and it opened up an opportunity for you.

Right.

And at the same time, there's so often what happens, and young females often don't have enough female role models to stop this from happening. But so often what happens is, yeah, they go back together and they talk amongst themselves and, you know, maybe it's the fact that there's not enough female washrooms in the airport or in the sports stadium or in the. Whatever. And then all the women are together in a community talking about it, bitching about it. Air quotes. Yeah, but then what's being done about it? And where are the represented? Where's the representation to. To then take that a step further so that it's not such a discrepancy between what's available to men or what's available to women. And so I think, you know, the key thing here for women is not to be busy pointing out what the problems are, but to be busy doing something about it or elevating the conversation instead of having it be a little bitch session. Yeah, and elevating the conversation and having the strength to do so is going to be the key for something actually being done versus women hanging out together and going, oh, this is. Doesn't work this way, or this sucks for us that way or whatever. No, it has to be a voice that says, okay, what needs to be done here is this. How do we collaborate, work together, work with other men, work with other women in order to make this happen. And that's the only way the changes will be made versus only seeing the crap side of the stick, for sure. So this. I just got on my soapbox there and got a little preaching.

That was good, do something.

But at the same time, this propelled you forward. You kind of fell into a media career in a way, via the action that you felt passionate about. Your passion started to lead you down a path for your career. So there's that little inkling there. But your fourth year university, what happened to open your eyes to the national team?

Yeah, it was when we actually won that national championship. One of the coaches of the national team was watching. And so that's when I kind of got the letter. Well, not kind of. I got the letter in terms of inviting me to try out. And like, long story short, I actually didn't end up going that year because I'd already made plans to travel China with my sister that summer and. But I ended up getting the invite the next year with our new head coach, which was Lupo. Aren't Ludwig and then tried out that year and ended up making it and kind of just to kind of grow the conversation because I know we could probably talk about so many things. But it was when I was playing Team Canada that I really felt we were getting such a lack of representation in the media. And because we were living in Winnipeg, that's. The men's team had relocated to Ottawa. And this is when there was no Winnipeg jets, there was just the Bombers. There was the Winnipeg or the Manitoba Moose. And so in terms of high profile sports in the city, you know, I felt like we were, we should be top three teams. We were total up there. And we would get one reporter out kind of like right around tryouts. And then maybe we'd get another reporter out for another event. But I would feel like what we've not. Nobody here is covering us. This is ridiculous. And that was really when it started to dawn on me, the lack of women representation in the media.

And I had the feeling there that the women's team was just taken for granted. They've been here, they're always here. I can see them next week. No, there's never, like you said, any attention or urgency or star quality promoting the team from within or from external sources through media channels.

Yeah. And Paul, I would agree with that. And you have a good perspective because, like, you having played on the men's team, you'd probably see how much media you guys might have gotten. And I'm not sure if there was a difference, but I never, I wasn't used to anything else, so that seemed normal to me, but it also didn't seem right.

Yeah.

Does that make sense?

Oh, yeah.

There. There was a big. There was a big difference because, you know, for like I was working with both teams and in Winnipeg for two quads and the women's team was, I mean, and I was in the behind the scenes stuff. So the meetings, the funding, you know, all of the stuff that goes on. Yeah, one of the reasons, one of the reasons, and this is one of the crappy things really one of the reasons that the women's team got as.

Much.

Got as many services that they had, whether it came down to sports, psych or things like that, is, is because it was all kind of in, in one place. And the men's had all. The men's team had way more funding. The women's team didn't have as much funding.

It's like the women's team got the leftovers totally, but.

But almost the women's team also got probably A little more than they would have had if the men's team hadn't been there. Oh, wow. Do you know what I mean? Because of. Because there was already the volunteers there for the men's team or the volunteers there for other things or the staff or the sports science or me. I would be a prime example. Strength and conditioning was already there in place for both teams. And one of the things. Here's one. This fundamental problem goes deeper than that. It goes down to. It goes down to the grassroots level, the club level. What's missing when those players step into a national level is they don't have the level of skill or physical resilience that they should. Stepping into a national level team. And so on a world stage, you probably realize what a shock it was stepping into a world stage from the training you had that on a world stage, you just weren't prepared from all of the experiences that you had already had. Like this. This goes much deeper. So we're dealing with athletes that aren't as ready and then need way more support from the performance enhancement teams or the extra services, but aren't getting it because Canada doesn't fund it. Like, it's just not. People don't realize that, oh, you're a national level athlete, you must be getting paid. Yeah, you're getting paid a carding bit of money that's lower than the poverty line. Like, you cannot live on it. We have to jam all the athletes together, have them eat bare minimum food. They can't. They don't have the major supplements that they need. And then, then we're expecting them to perform at the highest level and they don't even know half the things that they need to know before they even got to that level. So it's, it's more than just, It's more than just a discrimination between genders. It comes down to so far below that that these athletes are simply not prepared for where they need to be. And then performing on a world stage.

Yeah. And I also just want to make it clear too, at the time, like, I know the men have been to the most recent Olympics in Rio, but at the time I would say there was like really not much of a level of difference in the success from the men's and the women's volleyball programs. Is that.

No.

Accurate?

Well, yeah. Or anybody Just before Paul speaks there, like, on a world stage, the women's team would be ranked a little lower than the men usually in the time that I was there, so a little lower than the men. But the women's team had been to the Olympics in a more recent time than the men's team had.

Gotcha.

But at the same time, the women's team didn't have exposure to things like World League or they just didn't have as many major, major events that could put them or give them the experience to elevate them to the next level to be able to qualify for the Olympics. So, I mean, there's a number of factors there. But then when they were on a world stage, the women's team, like there was, there was a number of years that I was there that we acknowledged, we knew that the women's team weren't good enough or weren't skilled enough to compete against what the competition was out there. So it came down to being the best we could be. But then that creates a scenario where Volleyball Canada or Sport Canada in general won't fund the teams that aren't. That aren't sniffing at, you know, medals or qualifying for Olympics or things like that. They just won't fund them as much. So it's. Yeah, that's, it's a backwards.

That's the point I was going to make is that it's, it's not a Volleyball Canada thing. It's a Sport Canada thing where their analysis of each sport and their ability for each sport to possibly contend for a medal drives so much of the funding. And I mean, it's a whole separate podcast to discuss that and dig into that. But I want to steer you guys both in another direction just in the interest of time here. Both being women, clearly both being in male dominant dominated industries and just kind of in the last bit of time that we have together, Claire really want to get some stories. I want our listeners to really understand what you've had to do to rise to the level you have in the broadcasting world as a female, first of all. And Kari, really, if you can echo any sentiments or themes that are coming out of what Claire is saying, having done a similar thing in the strength and conditioning world, which is a male dominated industry, if that's all right.

Well, I can tell stories another time, but let's hear Claire's stories.

Well, I feel like in anything you do, you just have to be skilled, like, you know what I mean? If you want to be successful in whatever is a very competitive industry. And I'd consider sports broadcasting to be super competitive because it's so awesome. Everybody, like a lot of people want to do it. You just get to watch for a living and talk to athletes and then go on TV And. And talk about the stories. But I think, honestly, it's just about been, like, being professional, because I think, oh, no, I don't want to. I'm not gonna bash any women, because I don't. I don't see a lot of women in this industry who are not professional. But, like, you have to take it seriously. You know what I mean? And sometimes players might flirt with me, but I don't engage back. You know, there's. There's that matter, but there's, like, doing my research, doing like, a ton of research about who I'm covering, the history of athletes to make sure that I come across as professional as well. And I'm not saying men don't do that as well, but I honestly think it's given me. There's been a bit of an advantage to me being a female in sports broadcasting. And I want to also indicate the difference between being an anchor and a reporter, because when you turn on tsn, you're going to see, yeah, there's a lot of female anchors, and also there's a lot of male anchors, but you do not see a lot of female reporters. And anchors are the ones you see on tv, on the desk, reading the highlights. Reporters are the ones who are telling the stories from the field and, like, at the hockey arena. And that's where you see so few in Canada, women. And I've always wondered, and I've talked to some mentors about that, and I think it's because sometimes women get kind of suggested into that anchor role, because I think executives assume that most people watching sports are men. And so if there's mostly men watching sports, they want to have a female anchor. And I don't know why. You know, that's assuming so many things, like heterosexuality. You know, that's assuming an audience and stuff like that. But I think. I don't know why there aren't a lot of female reporters. Like, I love being in the action. I love talking to the athletes. I would never want to be in a dark studio for an extended period of time. I'm not saying I don't like anchoring. I think it's really fun hosting shows. But getting out in the action is important. But I. You know, it's really been funny when I've, like, noticed sexism. And here in Regina. Oh, gosh, it's amazing. Like, I. I have an amazing group of peers here. And I'm not the only female. I work with another. There's a lady who works in radio who's phenomenal. She's just so great. We're about the same age. It's just great to be at at rider practices and games with her, just like bouncing off ideas and stuff. But the men in this industry here in Regina are also incredibly helpful and I've never felt condescended by them. But that I don't think that's the case everywhere I've worked. And I just feel very lucky for where I am here. But certain things that I think are funny is like, I remember I had a male intern working with me at a previous job and he was obviously sports guy and just kind of like, I want to say loudmouth, not very good at listening. And I think that's something that's really, really important in our industry is listening. Because that's the only way to get a story. You can't do all the talking. But we went to an event together and I'd like called ahead of time to say that we were. That our station was coming to cover this event. And when we showed up, everybody just talked to him. Like, everybody was like, yeah, I assumed he was the reporter. And I'm like, actually it's me. And like, you know, he even kind of like he didn't say anything either. He kind of went along with it. I'm like, okay, you're the intern buddy, you're not getting paid. I'm the one doing the story. I'm the one that's going to be telling this on television tonight. Like, like, it was just. That was kind of funny. And I've noticed a lot of language use as well around sports. And there was somebody in another market once who, it was a play by play person. And he was calling a game and he said, oh, that was such a manly play by so and so. And I was like, what did he just call that? A manly play? So I called him out on Twitter and I actually said, hey, so and so, if that's a manly play, like what's a womanly play? And you know, and it's funny because I actually got in so much trouble from my current boss at the time for that tweet. And it was a male coworker of mine who snitched me out, who was like, hey, did you see this tweet by Claire sent it to our boss and our boss is like, hey, Claire, you can't call out people in our industry who we work with for this kind of stuff. And I'm like, what are you talking about? That person just offended an entire gender just because I made them feel awkward. And I Shamed them publicly. And they feel, you know, in this one moment, uncomfortable. I'm sorry, but they made an entire like, like all females feel uncomfortable with that comment. And that was super interesting, that whole dynamic about, like, you know, and I'm like, I, I think I'm a kind of a fan of public shaming when it's not appropriate or things like that. Because if you feel uncomfortable about something, then you've obviously done something wrong, you know, and. And I want.

It causes change faster.

Yeah.

And I want to have that emotion. Like, I want somebody to feel an emotion like that, to realize what they did was not right.

Yeah.

Anyways, those are. Yeah, those are just some examples I can think of off the top of my head.

But, yeah, yeah, it's. It's sad to say, but I would bet that there are more that you've experienced and, and that. And that it's not going to be done with yet. You know, like, it's. It's just the nature of the beast in the sense of the industry that you're in. But at the same time, there are so many, you know, male athletes, male coaches, female athletes, female coaches who have been raised in a way that really is respectful towards both genders, and they are. They are applauding anything that either, either gender does, and then it's. It's supported. And I, you know, I think that it's important to get something like that called out so that people understand that that's it's not appropriate anymore. It's not appropriate to say that one play is. Is this. Like, you could describe it as being lame or this or that, but. But not in the terms of a. Of a gender or. For sure. Or a sexuality or a, you know, because then you're describing that gender or that sexuality or that.

This or that.

That as. As better or weaker than the other one. Exactly. In a derogatory way.

Totally.

So. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Now what? Just. Just to kind of get a little wrap up here, but what. What prompted your. Your shift from the national team and into your career? How did you transition?

Well, I think it was kind of, honestly, based on what we talked about with the UBC article and just thinking, okay, after I played volleyball, I wanted to sort of stay involved in athletics to some extent. I. And I felt like getting into broadcasting was the best way. And I did some video blogging when I played on the national team. Just kind of taking people inside, what it might be like a day in the life of athletes or kind of doing some stuff about training. Just little Little video blogs, nothing professional. But I just felt that there was a lot of similarities in sports broadcasting and athletics. It's so competitive. It's hard work. It's about making connections. I know that's maybe not so athletic y, but it's about performing. So there's a lot of prep that goes into it, and then you perform on air. And I just felt like when I got a little taste of it, I really liked it. And it's definitely hard work. And I think people just see people on television and think, oh, that looks really fun. They're at this football game and just talking about things. But there is so much prep that goes into just a minute of television, and it's ridiculous. We say for about a minute of television, that can be like, you know, a couple hours of work behind the scenes just to get the research and stuff.

So, yeah, that's something that most people understand. And when I had the chance to start to do a little bit of commentary work, I was so lucky to have my first job alongside Mark Lee from CBC and to see how he prepared the, you know, pages of notes and just the work that he put into pronunciation of names.

Just to say.

Just to say names correctly, you know, you've got players from every country in the world, you know, and to get that right is a job within itself. And that's exactly how you describe it. There's so much work going on behind the scenes, but it does, you know, parallel with athletics so well, because you're, again, you're training, you're putting in the work in a different kind of way. And then you got to perform when the red light goes on.

Yeah.

And, Paul, like you said, too, it's crazy. When I do, like, sidelines for TSN on cfl, I'll prepare, like eight or nine stories. Maybe not that many, but, like, I'll have so many little stories that they can throw down to me for at any moment. And maybe maybe two get in, and then the other seven or whatever are wasted. And it's not wasted, but it's like. But then you have to understand, too, that there's, like, graphics people who have prepared so many graphics and only a couple make it in the show. Everybody over prepares, and it can feel really crazy crappy on your ego to not get involved in the show that much. But then you have to realize the whole team is dealing with that. But that's what makes the success, is that we get the best in the show.

Yeah, that's super cool.

Yeah. Yeah. It creates the standard and the highest Quality by picking the best out of what you've. The best of the best. Yeah. We're going to wrap up here. I want to ask you a few. Just quick questions so people get to know you just a little bit better. What would you. If you had a tip to young women who are either in sport or looking to transition to a career like yours, what would you have as little tips of how to get the best or get the most out of what. What they want to do.

Get a mentor and ask them all the questions possible.

Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. And do you have. Are you still. Are you still working out? Do think you still train?

I do. Orange Theory. Love it.

Awesome. So you love the intensity of it.

The competition, seeing your heart rate up on there, wanting to Crush Everybody else. 100%.

That's perfect. Little do they know that physiology, from one individual to another individual doesn't necessarily mean that one is working hard.

I knew you'd have something to say. Way to spoil it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

What the heck?

Sorry, but for all you. For all you Orange Theory fans out there, just because your heart rate is the highest doesn't mean you're doing the best. And sorry, guys. What about favorite movie or a favorite book? Do you have something that's. Or. Or even Netflix? Do you have a favorite or maybe a movie drawing your attention?

Oh, yeah. Well, that. No, I think my favorite movie, you guys, is Good Will Hunting. I love it. I think there's so many good, like, notes in there.

It's not your fault.

Second one.

Somebody's.

It's not your fault.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah, it's a Good Will Hunting. Favorite book? East of Eden. John Steinbeck.

Oh, all right.

Oh, neat.

Cool, cool.

I like to write these down because I'm getting so many great book suggestions. And do you have some favorite music that you like to kind of get in the right mindset for doing commentary or doing or porting or even for a game or Orange Theory? Yeah.

I honestly just rely on what the stadium plays and, like, they have the same thing on, like, repeat every game. So it's so funny now when I hear those songs in, like, other things, I'm like, oh, my God. Okay, I gotta get ready for these stories. Da, da, da. But I. Yeah. Oh, who am I into these days? Actually? Okay, so I'm going to Bali in May, so I've been, like, getting into some, like, Bali playlists. So like, just really chill stuff with just like, a little hypnotic beat.

All right, cool.

And what's embalming in Me. Is that a vacation?

Yeah, I'm going with my partner. It's the one time right when he's done curling and right when I'm just before CFL starts that we have like this one pocket of time can get away. Yeah, one window. It's me.

Awesome. Now last. Just finishing up here. What do you. What do you. Do you see yourself continuing in reporting for quite some time? Do you have a goal that's that you're aspiring to? What. What do you see the future for yourself and say the next five years?

Next five years. I really like where I'm at right now, but I'd love to report in a larger capacity. So right now the only national reporting I do is on the CFL and specifically the riders. So I'd love to branch out a little bit more. I'd love to even, you know, I love the Olympics and doing some more reporting from the Olympics in some kind of a capacity would be amazing. I got to go to London 2012 and Sochi 2014 and do some. Some stuff there, but just doing it in a bit bigger capacity would be amazing. And then, I mean, like, this is a really crazy dream, but one day I want to be a Canadian senator.

Neat. Very cool. That's not a crazy dream. That's a. That's a realistic aspiration. There you go. That's fantastic. Well, I can't thank you enough for your insight into the world of reporting and at the same time, your journey in your sports career as well. Because so many female athletes need to hear this, so many male athletes need to kind of understand the differences and be able to relate to what women go through as well. So we really appreciate your insight on this and being with us today.

Well, thanks for having me. It was really awesome. Just bantering back and forth and hearing what you guys have to offer too.

Thank you so much for listening. To get more support in living your best life, Find us in our free Facebook community empowered top performers. We're on Instagram, Paul Durden and powerconditioning. Please share this podcast and rate us. A five star review would mean the world to us. That is how we connect with and support more people to excel in the sport and life. Take what you learned today and try it. Progress is perfection.