EP75 Angela Lewis - Basketball (Player/Coach)

This is episode 75 of the Empowered Athlete Podcast. Our guest today on the Empowered Athlete Podcast is an incredible basketball phenom. Playing four years at Saint Louis University, she scored over a thousand points from the floor while pulling down over 500 rebounds. Of course, she went on to play pro in Europe, and after that, she was a coach of Webster University, Southeast Missouri State University, Marquette University. Then it was on to the pro leagues, where she coached the St. Louis Surge to a professional women's basketball championship in 2014. She's offered three books. The Game Changing Six Simple Ways to choose Success, the Game changing assist workbook and Post Moves, and the female athlete's guide to dominate your life after college. It's none other than Angela Lewis, and we are three to bring her story to you because it's a story that takes a turn you wouldn't expect. Heavily involved in the sport as a player, in competition, as a coach, she made the shift to focus on fun and bringing passion and fun back into the game. And she does that with youth across the country, helping young women and girls get into the sport that she loves. You are going to fall in love with Angela Lewis, just like we did on this podcast. Now, before we get into today's show, I want to quickly remind you that on March 28, coming to the University of Western Ontario, it's the exercise and nutrition seminar put on by Dr. Pete Lemon. Kari Schneider, my one and only, of course, will be presenting along with the John Berardi as well as tons of other notable speakers in the exercise and nutrition world. You don't want to miss us if you're in southwestern Ontario over the weekend of March 28th. Again, it's happening at the University of Western Ontario. You can catch Kari there and amazing speakers and presenters and be on the bleeding edge of what's happening with nutrition, sports science and exercise physiology. Let's see you there.

Welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast, created to support athletes in their pursuit of excellence and inspire others toward their best lives. Hosted by Kari Schneider, coach to top performers in sport and life, and Paul Durden, former national and professional volleyball player.

Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Empowered Athlete Podcast and we are excited to present Angela Lewis to you who has quite the background in the basketball and sporting world and helping people change their lives and thrive and grow. And before we get into it too deep, I want to know right out of the gates. Tell us about these forts and dance parties with your nieces and nephews. What jam is rocking when you guys dance?

You know what they love Fortnite like So many kids do. And so we have these Fortnite dance parties, and sometimes there's three of them, and sometimes we have dance battles. And so it really just depends who wants to be on my team or not. But I can't quite do. There's this one called the Orange justice, which is a really popular Fortnite dance. Google Orange Justice Dance, and you'll see this guy, and it will be comical to imagine me doing the Orange justice dance. But those are a lot of fun.

What's the one where you're doing the loser sign on your forehead and you're kind of.

That one. I know about that one as well. Yep.

Our twins can rock most of those moves, I think.

Yeah. We'll put the youngest to the test, though. She'll be the one that has to pull off the real moves. So that's amazing. We're so glad to have you on. And you've got a very pretty extensive past in sports, specifically basketball. So tell us a little more about how you got into it, because you can't really see on camera, and the people who are listening can't see hear how tall you are. But we're accustomed to that kind of height in the volleyball background, so it's kind of normal. Not normal for me. I think I'm that tall, but I'm not close to that tall. But tell us about how you got into your sport and the beginning.

Sure. I grew up in the city of St. Louis, and we were the people in the neighborhood who had a hoop in the backyard, and we were the ones with the hoop. Like, we didn't have a driveway. It was in our. Like, you have to come up the steps, go around the side of the house, open the side gate. So we were the house that everyone. All the boys. There were no girls came. I was the only girl with my brothers in the backyard playing basketball. But I didn't really play organized or competitive. And I wasn't really looking to play. But one day I was walking out of Blockbuster Video. Y' all remember Blockbuster?

Oh, yeah.

Perfect. The kids these days don't know about Blockbuster.

Yeah, I know.

And there was this guy who asked if I play basketball. I'm six one. I've been this height since I was 12 years old. And he asked about. I was 12 in this body.

So.

It was so uncomfortable in my own skin. I felt really like an anomaly, Like a really stiff stood out at that age. And when I began playing basketball, that's where I found this tribe. But I wasn't. I never played Basketball because I wanted a college scholarship. I actually didn't have a goal when I started. I just liked it because it was fun. I didn't, there wasn't, I wasn't trying to get anything from the game, if that makes sense. You know, I just enjoyed it. I played and from there we started playing competitively in these tournaments. But I never set out to play competitively. So like, my approach to the game is my approach to helping young people, which I'm sure we'll talk about, is a little different than a lot of what I see because I just, it was just fun making baskets, it was fun high fiving people. And it was fun going on road trips or, you know, the things that make playing fun. But from playing and from staying within and developing, I was able to get a full athletic scholarship to play at St. Louis University, which is NCAA Division 1. Then I played in Germany and then I coached high school basketball and we won a state title and I coached college basketball at a few different Division 1 schools. And then I coached with the St. Louis Surge. It's a professional women's team here. And so, yeah, the game has opened up the world to me and it's because it is fun.

So I gotta back up and ask a couple questions here. First of all, were your brothers tall as well?

They are six, five.

Okay.

But I used to be taller than them. When I was in the fifth grade, they were in the sixth grade, I was taller. But yes, they are tall.

The record show.

Yeah, we have a height little mark on our kitchen doorway that goes up for all the kids and there's a little competition going on there. The reason I'm asking that is simply because it's one thing to feel like you're standing out in a way that you don't want to stand out. And it just feels too awkward or too different and like you may not belong with other people. But it's another thing to feel like it's normal within your family if your parents are tall or your siblings are tall. And then you're kind of feeling like you're connected that way way. But it sounds like, you know, you just felt so different at that time that when, when you're being asked to go into a team that really honors someone who's tall, it's just like, oh, you know, you're, you're looked at like, oh, this is fantastic. Look who's here. Someone who's taller. You're describing this thing that I think has disappeared from spread. And it's the thing that what Used to happen when we were kids and just neighborhood play where people would get together on a schoolyard after school or in the evening and they would play soccer, or they would play basketball, or they would play and they would figure out the game, or they would figure out not even the rules of the game, but the nuances of being up against another player or figuring out how to correct on their own without being told by someone else who's a superior or without trying to please a superior. They're just figuring out on their own by trial and error, trial and error and having fun and, you know, go at it again and fall down and do the thing. It doesn't matter what sport it is. And that kind of play is not. You know, nobody allows their kids just to take off and run through the neighborhood and do the things. It's like the parents are driving the kid to the club, team to the thing, and then they're getting competitive, coached by the time they're seven years old. And then they're being told how to do everything. And it takes away some of the best parts of what sport can do, in my opinion. And that's some of what I was kind of hearing occurred for you, naturally, that you probably see. Like, we're in Canada, but we've spent some time in the US and Europe and things like that. But are you. Is that something that you're finding more and more, or what's your opinion on all of that?

That I've said I agree 100%. I mean, I began to learn the game and get introduced to the game from watching the bulls in the 90s, you know, with Michael Jordan. And you're a Jordan fan?

Yeah, he won a dunk contest in high school. And I think Jordan was probably his just total idol at that time.

But the Bulls did was amazing. We used to watch the VHS tapes and rewind it, and you go out and you try the moves and you do all that stuff. And then women's games were on TV some. So you watch, like, University of Tennessee and lsu. You watch them play and you try this stuff, and then you just play. And then you. You. There's this. There is this beauty of being creative with the game and without fear of judgment. You weren't recorded. Like, no one recorded anything that we did. You just did it so that we didn't have the fear of embarrassment of not being perfect. Where I think a lot of young people have these days. You see the videos of kids getting crossed up and the girl falls and everyone laughs. Like, no one wants to be that person. Right.

Someone's gonna film it, you know, it's gonna be recorded some form or another.

It is, it is. And so even when I talk to kids about what we did, they don't have a context for it. You can't like recreate. I mean, you can say, go out, here's a ball, go play. But it's hard to get them to even understand a world without a cell phone or the Internet, you know, so foreign.

Yeah, yeah, it's. It is a.

It's funny that you have to create unstructured play now.

Yeah.

Which is just. Unstructured means it should just happen. Everything like you're saying is structured. It's go to practice, have a coach do this, and just the happens in an instant pick up game somewhere. That's the rare thing now, the unstructured needs to be planned.

We have a seminary near our house. Not a cemetery, but a seminary.

Okay.

Yeah. Trying to make sure people understand because we used to send our older four, just go play outside. Go play in the seminary. Not cemetery. We weren't sending graveyard because there was tons of green space and forest area that, you know, was just visible from our house. So we felt safe about it. And it's just like, go play, go play hide and go seek, go run around, go like throw the ball, whatever. And now we have one that's younger who doesn't have a group of siblings to go with or a group of neighborhood kids to go with. So we. You can't just send her out. And it's one of those things where we don't want to be the parents trying to play with the kid all the time. We want that natural integration and interaction to happen. But as a parent, it's like you say you're trying to create something that isn't happening organically only because parents are always watching or there's a coach always watching. They need to be able to sort things out on their own. And that's what's not. There's not opportunity for that. There's just. We're not allowing opportunity for that. So, yeah, I don't, I don't know at all what the solutions are, but I do know as a parent and someone who's grown up being active, that it's such a different beast now. And I think we're gonna see more and more of the repercussions of having people not be able to move creatively, think creatively, and respond creatively to whether it's sport or life. Because to me, sport is an example Or a training platform for all kinds of scenarios in life as well.

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you hit the nail on the head with be creative. You're allowed to be creative when you're just playing for fun and things happen organically. You create rules, you make up new games, you try things in a non threatening environment and you create an opportunity to come back and try it again later. And you learn from older kids who you know are better than you. And then if your shot keeps getting blocked, you adjust the way you shoot. You just figure that stuff out. You develop an instinct for the game.

Yeah. And did you when you went to Germany, you weren't intending to go there. You wanted to play in the wnba, didn't you?

I had no intentions of going overseas.

So what happened there? What made that shift for you?

I'm going to give you a little background about my family and then I'm going to jump up to that question. We went to two places growing up as a family. Memphis, Tennessee, because family was there, and Mound Bayou, Mississippi, because family was there. Either by Greyhound bus or by Greyhound bus. That's it. The only way we traveled. And when I got older and started playing ball, we would travel via like car. You know, you carpool with your teammates because we would have tournaments in Memphis occasionally, which is about four hours south from St. Louis, so. So in the context of my family, you don't go other places without family being there. So Germany, my plan, because I'm kind of an anomaly. Yes, a bit further. My plan was to go to this combine at the Final Four. It was a pro combine for girls who were seniors who wanted to keep playing. And I was ready. I broke my butt off to prep and I get there and the organizer says, oh, I'm sorry, we changed the time. Like there are people walking out when I get there, totally devastated. And I say, I tell my college coaches, well, you know, I still want to play. What options do I have? And they said overseas, we can. My coach connected me to someone who was an agent. And you know, you go through the process, send your film, she agrees to represent me. And so I went to Germany. The most amazing experience at 22. I was 20 at that time in my life, so it was really good. But I never planned on going. But the world opened up to me and I learned some things about myself that I didn't know. And it was, it was incredible. It's incredible, especially coming from where I come from. And the only people who went to Germany were in the military. No one could understand why I Would go to play a game in another country.

They're like, I had a good friend, Marjorie Kelly. She went and played in. I think it was Germany. Janice Kelly played volleyball, but Marjorie Kelly played basketball. But when you say it was an amazing experience, what made it an amazing experience? Because that was one of the first places or second place.

That's the first place I played pro.

Where were you in Germany?

I was in Binsburg. It's the same small town near Cologne. Where were you?

Just outside of Stuttgart.

Okay. All throughout the country. What made it amazing was I was really uncomfortable, and I didn't know that I was okay in that situation. Like, I'm an explorer. I didn't know I was an explorer until I went to Germany. I was just walking around, looking at stuff and having to figure it out. However, they lost my bags when I got there. And that part. Got there, couldn't find my bags. I'll spare y' all the long story. The short version is, they didn't have my bag. And I went in the bathroom, and I started crying. And I'm like, oh, my God. I'm in another country. I don't know the language. What am I doing? And I pulled myself together and said, no one made you do this. Like, you chose to do this, so figure it out. Like, I distinctly remember being in the stall crying and saying to myself, no one made you do this. It's like, okay, let's figure it out. And then I figured it out.

Isn't that one thing such an incredible distinction?

Because.

You take back the power.

Yes.

Instead of feeling like, oh, my, I'm only powerful, or I'm only okay if things are going my way, you take back the power by going, okay, like, I created this, and it's all fine, and what's my next choice? And it's huge, because when you decide, then it's. You have the power.

Very true. Very, very true.

How long were you there?

I was there a year. Then I came back, went to grad school, and got married, which is another podcast. Another story girl.

A few marriage topics on this podcast, but, yeah, no, we get that. But so. But you. What are some of the key things? Because you've. You've really created a direction out of passion. And there's a lot of things that you're up to right now, between writing books, between running clinics, between mentoring youth, and there's a real passion to do those things because it's easy to stay in. You've had coaching jobs, You've had teaching jobs that have been very Successful, it's easy to stay in those roles. It's easy to keep going through that system. But you've basically stepped away from that into one of the hardest things to do, which is self promotion, going out there to help other people, not knowing whether you're gonna, you know, as an entrepreneur or doing your own thing, not knowing whether you're gonna get paid for your next thing, like what the fuel to do that and take that kind of risk has to be pretty intense. So what are some of the things that really have sparked that passion?

I'm crazy.

There it is, everyone. There it is. Be crazy.

I was having a conversation with my friend today about this. I just don't want to do anything else.

Yeah.

As you mentioned, I've done a lot of things. I've done research, I've talked to a lot of people in a lot of different industries. Like, I've run the. I pretty much run the gamut of I could do this, I could. I mean, I could do this, I could do that, I could do. The only thing that lights my soul on fire is stepping in between the lines with young women and teaching young people the game and affirming, supporting and empowering in a very, like, in a really real way. Young women. Young women. And letting them know that who they are is enough. And in between the lines is where I do it. Like, I can't do it in a classroom because of the structure of education. Like, I don't care about that. And I love to play. So really I just like shooting baskets with little kids, particularly, like helping little girls know that playing is okay and it's important to be active. I just don't really want to do anything else. And I don't. Gosh, I mean this. And it's. I don't say it publicly often, but it's the truth. I don't care about winning games because I know they're games. So I can't get all like, emotionally invested in the scoreboard and you kind of have to do that. So I coach a team, so I've been asked to coach teams, but I just don't care. I really care about playing, which has nothing to do with winning or losing. It's literally just playing.

You clearly love to have that impact, especially on these young girls. Did you get out of high level coaching because did you feel you were getting them too late? That were you seeing something that troubled you? That you're like, I need to help these women at a younger age? Because the feeling being with the team and coaching and Helping people. Success fuels you. But you shifted to the younger age and that younger group. Do you know why?

In 2010, in 2009, November 2009, one of my good friends passed away. Her name was Jackie Moore. She was 28 years old, had an undetectable heart defect. She was working out and die. And I was like, oh, my God, I could be working out and die. Like, that is a possibility. I mean, outside of the heart defect, like, I don't have that, that I know of. However, she's the first person who I knew, like, who's close to me, who passed away. And so I took a really deep examination of NCAA Division I basketball, where I was coaching. I was at Marquette University in the Big east, really big. We charted every flight, got all the gear you could possibly want, ate really well, you know, all the things that are alluring to coach at that level. But I never saw my family. I never saw my family. You have to recruit kids, and I don't really care about that. I just want to play right in a firm. Like, that was the heart of it for me. And so I moved back to St. Louis and started working with different school districts and school systems and started training kids. So for me, it was, what type of life do I want to live and what do I value most in terms of my life experience? And that kind of shifted me from wanting to coach at that level.

Do you think that your love of playing and almost transferring that on to your athletes, do you think that that inadvertently caused them to be more passionate, love the game more, and thereby win more, versus if you compare to the coach who's just focused on technical and tactical play, and winning versus, say, you, who loves the game is probably boosting. The athletes all the time, cares a lot about the chemistry of the team and how they're interacting and the actual just enjoyment of experience. Do you think that that approach fostered more success than. I mean, definitely for you, but in general.

Depends on the temperament of the kid. You know, some kids need, like, the structure and the. I think whoever the coach is authentically, you can. If I'm authentically who I am, and there's a coach who is very tactical, very like you described, you know, in that if they're authentically who they are and I'm authentically who I am, I think we can get the same results. If we both are willing to connect with the kids in a real way and get to know them. I think that that's par for the course. That's the baseline. But you have to Be who you are. I was coaching at Southeast Missouri State. I was an assistant coach, and our head coach was. He's really itch. Was really tough. I mean, he's a yeller. He cared about kids. But our personalities are really different, which is why he wanted me to be a part of his staff. So we're. We're in the game on the road. We win this game, and we go undefeated on the road and are in the top spot to win our conference. And one of the best players is having a terrible game. So he says to her, hey, Angie. He says to me, I'm gonna call her off the game, and I want you to get in her. Specifically get in her ass. Like, get in her when she gets to the bench. And I'm like, okay, cool. I'm like, how do you do? Like, that's. I don't do that.

It's not my thing.

He's been knowing me since I was in college. He coached me in college. That's not. That's not what I do. So, anyway, she comes. He calls her out of the game, y'. All, right? When he calls out of the game, another player sits down next to me and wants to talk. And I'm like, okay. I cannot tell Rachel. Get away. I need to yell at Sonya. Like, excuse me.

I'll be right back after I'm done yelling.

I can't do that. So I talk to Rachel, and I give her all the time she needs, because that's who I am. I'm attentive. I listen. Well, Sonia's at the other end of the bench doing whatever, and he's just, like, looking back at me, waiting for me to go yell at this kid. So Rachel finished talking. Sonya comes. I wave her to come, and I talk to her just like I'm talking to y'. All. Cause this is who I am. Halftime of the game, he ripped me. He's like, I told you to get in her. If we lose this game, it's your fault. We need her to step up. You're the one who can connect with her. Sorry, man. I don't know what to do. So we won. Thankfully.

Yeah. Okay. I didn't cost us the game.

Exactly. So my point is. Depends on who you are. It could work. Maybe. Maybe not.

It's true, though, because it doesn't matter who is facing that. Whether it's a child or an adult, they can feel that a mile away. Whether someone is being themselves or not, and they're drawn to someone who is being themselves. Even if. Even if it's not the right match for that person. You know, even if they're two different personalities, they at least will appreciate that. Oh, that's who they are. Clearly, you know, Exactly. So you clearly there was a pivotal point in looking at your life and going, okay, like this is, this is a change. I'm, I'm choosing my path instead of following the path and I'm going to carve this out. And that led to you writing, writing books. What prompted the topics? What made you feel like, hey, this is what I need to write about. This is the key topic because I think it's your first book. You have a game changer, is that it?

The game changing assist? Yeah. That book was birthed out of a speech that I gave to a group of students, group of young people. And so I was coaching at Southeast Missouri State and I was asked to speak to a group of high school kids who were on campus. They're a part of a program for first generation college students, so upper bound program. And the night before, I was just pacing my apartment trying to figure out what to say to these kids and gave a speech and talked about listening to positive voices and having a vision and understanding your values and upcoming valley, I'm volunteering, reaching the point of victory, all of that. And I gave it to them and they liked it. It went really well. So I just kept giving that speech over the years and that speech was in like 2008, and my first book wasn't published till 2012. And so I just kind of kept refining the speech and it seemed to be a good framework and it resonated with young people. So that's how that one came about. Just because I wanted to help young people beyond basketball. So the book isn't about like how to be a great scorer. It's about how to live your life in a way that's authentic to who you are and always with the idea that you have something to give and who you are is enough.

As well. I would think that when you look at the numbers of how many people play sport, men and women, there's such a tiny, tiny percentage that actually make it to the NCAA or make it to a pro level. And that tiny percentage, you know, sport isn't about just that tiny percentage of people who make it to that next level. So what is sport doing for all those other people? Is it creating a framework for how they live? Is it creating a passion that can serve them as they need it throughout their life? Like he's, he's playing old timers basketball Men's league. No, sorry, men's league. That's what I meant to say. But it's a distraction, It's a release, it's some fun. It's something that, between the demands of work and kids and all the things that we've got going on, that he can just go and not think and just, you know, be the. Be the high school dunk champion again. Right. Almost.

Without the dunk part.

Right. Few things hurt too much.

Yeah.

So. And that led to some other books as well. What else do you have going on?

So I have a book called Post Moves the Female Athletes Guide to Dominate Life After College. And this book was so much fun to put together because I interviewed 15 women who are all former college athletes and some of them are actually were international players as well. And I interviewed them about their experience and how they transitioned, kind of what we started talking about at the beginning. And they all shared their experience and then they all agreed to have their contact information in the book. And so when a young woman reads it, not only do you learn from others experience, you actually have a book full of mentors who you could call or email or text or find them on social media and ask them about their path and connect in a real way. One of the challenges with transitioning that I found is that college athletes often don't have professionals who they're connected with other than their coaches and professors. So having another avenue of professionals to connect with, particularly for young women, was really important to me. So I put that together.

Do you think that kind of a buddy system or something like that, that's say there's a retired athlete who's buddies with someone who's in the upper years, who's buddies with someone who's a rookie, then that just keeps carrying forward. Do you think something like that could mitigate some of the. Some of the challenges of identity loss as an athlete when people retire or feeling like they've lost their tribe or lost their group, that was so important to them, like how. Are there any thoughts or ideas you have around?

Sure, yeah, I think, couple of ways. Having a network of mentors, some who are athletes, some who are not athletes. Our culture loves sports, our meaning, like the world loves sports and athletes. And so being an athlete gives you pretty easy, for lack of a better word, access to people. People just want to talk to you, hear about what you did. Because so few people play at a high level. And so I think that's part of it, just having the courage and confidence to reach out and ask people about their path. But then also being exposed to what's out there within sport and outside of sport can really help.

Are the alumni systems in place for the ncaa? For sure. Is there an alumni network that athletes can tap into? Is that something that happens or not? I'm just ignorant to whether that exists or not.

That's a great question. I'm not sure. I'm not sure if that exists. I know every university has an alumni system. And actually this weekend, ironically speaking of alumni, my high school has their alumni week, has their alumni day tomorrow, Friday. I'm not sure when this will air, but whenever. That's on Friday and then my college has it on Sunday.

Oh, wow.

We'll be able to go back and all the. Everyone comes back and you get to meet the players. And so that's a way to connect. But there's alumni organizations with every university because they need a donor base. And, you know, most athletic programs do something with their alumni.

So thinking back, just while we were on the topic of college, what's your top one or two pieces of advice for an athlete coming into that system? To have the best experience possible outside of obviously performing their best on the.

Court to, I would say get to know your professors well, they can be great advocates and you're gonna know them forever. There are people, you know, when I was 18, I just thought these are people who run, you know, who were just there to learn something, then I can move on from them. But looking back now, I'm still connected to so many of them. You just, you just don't know who you can help in the future, who you're able to help. So that's the first piece. And then the second thing I would say in terms of university life is, if possible, try to build friends with people who aren't athletes, like those in accounting or legal, you know, some friends in different who are indifferent, who are doing things differently because you're going to meet other people than your team as much.

I was, I was working with some track athletes that are local, who go to university and they referred to the NARPs.

Yes, NARPs are a thing now.

I was like, excuse me, what are the narps? Well, non athlete regular people. I'm like, oh, so you have a name for that?

A narp.

Awesome.

That's incredibly creative. We didn't call them that.

It goes international.

Yeah.

I think your point is perfect though, because it is that chance to run in different circles exposes you to things that you're just going to completely miss otherwise. And I Was lucky enough to make friends with. I went from high school to the national team and so was thrown right into the mix of full time training, but was lucky enough to make a couple of friends or just going to school where the university we trained out of. So having those relationships to be able to actually withdraw from the sporting world, looking back was so valuable because it gives you that mental break, it gives you a different perspective, it makes you remember that, you know, we're just normal people too. And so I think that's an amazing point you made. Rings true for me.

It also diversifies an individual so that if there's an injury or if they do retire or it's the end of their career, then they have something else that might be a friend or a hobby or an activity that can direct their attention away from the sport being everything about their whole world. And then there's more of a healthy life balance instead of sport being the be all end all agree.

And you know, one of the challenges with being an athlete at a high level is you expect to be good at stuff. And when I.

Everything else. Everything else?

Yeah, like you gotta be, you're gonna be great at whatever career you're in, you're gonna be great. But you have to remember the times when you can make a layup and you can shoot a free throw and you didn't quite understand the offense. And basketball, like every sport, but especially basketball, take years. It takes years to begin to get into the flow of it because there are so many moving parts. And so personally I've had to say, all right, Angie, step back. You've just started this. You're not going to be great right now, okay? You had coaches, you practiced, you watched. You know, like there was a systematic way that you gained competence and confidence in your sport. Like you're gonna have to struggle through that during this. And that's okay, just go play basketball, because you're still really good at that. But I struggle through this.

You know, I just gotta add, I love that point, especially in the social media world, because younger people, older people, everyone who's, you know, involved in any way in social media, you're seeing, and rightly so, some successful people, but you're seeing them, you're not seeing the 15 years of grind that got them there. And even. And so for an athlete, like you're saying, you have this, you know, built up impression of yourself that, yeah, okay, I'm good at this, I'm talented, but you kind of don't value all the things you're talking about that you've put in, in years prior. You don't put enough weight on that. You don't think. I didn't think, you know, mid career about all the hours I played as a kid. And it's, you know, in club ball before even in high school. And so by not valuing that and then having that mentality, as you said, look at another job, another career, and have expectations of success because that's what you're used to. And the higher the athlete you go, you've had success for a number of years now. It could be demoralizing or depressing to not fairly quick success.

I remember I was the director.

Hey, just say that again. We lost the audio there.

Sure.

I was the director of a nonprofit that helped high school kids learn about entrepreneurship. My first time in a real leadership role. And I had no clue what I was doing. Oh, God. Like, I was good at connecting with people. I had that all day. But in terms of systems and processes, and we had all these events and I had to, you know, fundraise some donors and write grants. There were all of these things that I didn't know. And I had so many days where I was like, I wonder if they see. They have to see that I don't know what I'm doing. You're great. Right. And it was really hard to feel good about the work because I expected to do well, but I didn't know. I didn't feel like I knew what I was doing in a way that. That it. I felt like it could have been or should have been there.

There's something you said earlier about just that you voiced out loud the internal talk of, you know, hey, Angie, this. This took you how long to get this good in basketball? Don't you know, now it's gonna take some time to get proficient at whatever I'm working on now. That's huge. To have some patience and grace with yourself. Most of us are really hard on ourselves in our internal thoughts. Do you have some outside support system that also kind of help you have that confidence because you've got people that believe in you. What's the other thing that helps you think so positively internally?

Practice. You practice it, like every day. It's practice because we all have doubts. I don't think anyone is immune. I'm always. Rarely have I met a few people who weren't incredibly arrogant who don't have doubt or didn't express that or question. So I have an unbelievable support system of people. One of my friends is a psychologist by training so she has her doc. So she really like, helps me understand human nature, which is really helpful. So like when we talk, it often feels like a therapy session for me. Apparently practicing.

She's practicing on you, you know, she's so good.

I'm like, oh, that's why I do that. Okay. All right, now go back and do this. Yes. Human vulnerability, mistakes. Yeah, that happens. Practice, Keep trying. Okay. Yep. So I'm really thankful for the support system. But it's not. But. And when I'm, you know, when you're like in your lane, it's really hard to put into words what that feeling is. But you know that that is it and that is all of the confirmation. So I may have a day where I'm like, oh my God, I don't know, what am I doing? Like the plan for another strategy. And then I step on the court in between the lines with these kids and I'm like, this is it.

You know, I'm supposed to be.

Yeah, yeah. Yep.

That's incredible. So if we wrap things up, is there a special kind of message that you would want to tell young athletes who are starting out that or that you would have shared with your younger self? Is there something that you'd want to impart?

Just keep playing and play a lot of different things. Just play, like enjoy. You'll have plenty of time to be stressed out about a bunch of other things that are not games. They're not games. So just enjoy the process. And if you decide that you want to be great, then take it more seriously and put some systems in place. But if you decide that you just want to play, then just play and either is okay. It doesn't define who you are as a human.

Do you? That's perfect. In a time where everybody feels like everything has to be so there has to be a why and there has to be a purpose and there has to be a specific direction. And if you don't know what it is, you're screwed. And you know all those things. So I love, love hearing that.

It takes some deconstructing though. I mean, to your point, it takes some deconstructing of societal norms for you to say that doesn't make sense. For me, I'm going to go against that and do things my way and be okay when people think I'm crazy.

Yeah.

And it's the, it's the longer game for the athlete or the kid because you're creating the fuel that'll be self sustaining, just the passion for enjoying it. And if, like you said, if they do want to get more competitive, they will because they're actually enjoying it, not because it's the path and the next step, which is the mode. Now that everything's in, it's like, okay, plan. Enjoy it, but practice hard. We gotta win. Just that extra little bit that's added in there that rubs the fun off.

Right.

And so by at least, you know, giving them the start of just having fun, look, they'll fall in love with the game and then that competitive thing will fuel itself if it's there.

Exactly. And it's not. Everyone doesn't have it. Every kid doesn't have it. And that's okay. We, the clinics that I run, you come into our third through eighth grade clinics for these little girls. Kidz Bop is playing. We're playing Kidz Bop. We have tons of high fives. They're shooting games. I mean, it is like, you know, walk in and you can just feel their smiles. They're laughing. It is fun because you might just want to shoot baskets on your free day off from school, and that's all you want. And I can help you learn how to shoot it. Well, yeah.

I used to play horse with my dad.

That's it. And that's okay. That is perfectly fine in my mind, at least. Yeah.

I love what you said. The rub the fun off. Don't rub the fun off or the thing. Too much structure. Rubs the fun off on more of a personal note. Do you have some favorite music that you kind of get jazzed up to or to work out or to play, or do you have some favorite music or some favorite movies?

I love. I love the movie Coming to America. It's super old.

Oh, it's amazing.

Is that Eddie Murphy?

Yeah, Eddie.

See, we're old enough to get this. Isn't that great?

Wow. I love comedies. I'm a big Martin Lawrence fan as well. Okay, so my favorite movie, outside of that one, a bit more modern. Martin Lawrence has a movie called Rebound. Have y' all seen it?

No.

It is the most non. It's fun. It's cute. It's really cute. So I'll give you a synopsis, but I won't give it away. Martin Lawrence is a coach. He's a basketball coach at a university and he gets kicked out of, like, the ncaa, but it's, you know, a different league in the movie, and goes back to his middle school to coach the team. And that's all I'm going to tell you. It's so cute. So that is, like, my favorite movie. But Then coming to America is fun as well. But that's my favorite basketball movie of all time.

And what about favorite foods? Do you have some favorite desserts or foods?

Girl, my dad was a baker. I could eat pie, doughnuts, cake, cookies every single day without fail if I wouldn't get diabetes.

Yeah, if it wouldn't kill me.

You know, unfortunately there's a trade off to eating that way.

But favorite pie, you get one more pie to eat. Ever.

Ever.

What's it gonna be?

Sadness? My mom's sweet potato pie. You gotta get sweet potato pie.

Oh, that's so southern. That's awesome.

I don't.

Yeah, I have relatives in Kentucky, so I get a little taste of the southern here.

And there's cakes and pies. I could eat pizza every day as well, but I don't basically. Bunch of carbs.

Actually, now that we talk about it, cauliflower crust pizza. We've been experimenting with that.

How is that?

Well, okay, I thought it would be brutal, but I had it in a restaurant once and it was among the best pizza I'd ever had. I thought, okay, this has to be bad, but no, it's fantastic.

What special cauliflower are they using? You have to.

You gotta like. Well, of course there's a little cheese in it or. But yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's like a three step process to make it cauliflower the right way.

I had to try.

There's a trick to the process.

You gotta boil it and squeeze it out and then put egg in it and press it in and all the things. But first, before you try to turn yourself off with all that, you gotta go to a restaurant that does it well and try it first and then decide if you're gonna try and do it. Your. Okay, yeah, those are good things.

I will try it. I'll try that out.

On that note, we want to make sure people can find you and reach you. You're on Instagram a little bit. Are you on Facebook or on Twitter?

Instagram Coach Instagram and Twitter Coach Alewis and then Facebook. Angela Lewis.

And the website site is angelarlewis.com yes.

Angelarlos.Com.

And then your books are on there too, so people can find them.

Everything is on the website. Yeah, absolutely.

Awesome. Well, it has been an absolute pleasure to be with you. You are so bright and uplifting and just such a positive force for so many young people. So thank you so much for your time and we look forward to sharing your experience with our audience. So this is incredible. Thank you.

Thank you. All as well. I appreciate the time.

Hey everyone, thank you so much for listening. If you're wanting to connect with Kari and I for online training, public speaking events or more, simply send your request to info powerconditioning.com and hey, we need your help to keep growing this show, so please share it with coaches, athletes, trainers, parents, anyone who you think might be interested. Get them to smash that subscribe button and follow the Empowered Athlete Podcast. We can't do it without you. Thanks again for listening.