The PT System is Broken, Here's How You Can Break Out

What's up, guys? Welcome to Pelly Biz Podcast. I'm your host, Kelli Elhue. Today I want to talk about new grads coming out of school wanting 90k. And I want to talk about it. Most people tend to not touch the subject, but I've actually been interviewing a lot over the last year, I would say. And what I'm realizing is these days, new grads are coming out requesting a minimum of 90k. And I really want to have a deep conversation on this because I truly want to understand where is this coming from and, you know, what they ultimately want and what ultimately, as us, as owners, what we can actually give. And let's have a realistic conversation. So the first thing I want to say is, you know, like I said, I had many recent new grads interviewing, and I asked them, so what kind of salary are you looking for? And the response I get is at least 90K. And I'm like, okay. So I don't say anything. I just say, okay. And then I ask this question. I'm like, all right, so tell me why you're worth that. And a lot of times, and I know that's very blunt and upfront, but I've interviewed so many freaking people. I just want to put it out there and understand. So I'm like, so tell me why you're worth that. What do they tell me? They're like, well, I just want to live and be able to pay my loans. It's exactly what they say. And I. And I literally go, hmm. And I remember thinking, wow, Kelly, that is actually what you said when you're interviewing for jobs. That's my response. I just want to be able to live and pay my student loans. And I really think about that now, and I'm just like, wow, how freaking sad is that? Like, we don't even have dreams or aspirations to do other things. We just want to live and pay our student loans. And that literally was my mentality. These student loans eat you. Like, they freaking own you. Because they do. You will die with the student loans. Like, I'm not kidding. And they control your whole life. They control how many vacations you have. They control if you can buy a house. They control. They control if you could have a wedding. They control if you can even get a wedding ring. They control all of it. They can control maybe if you can have a baby or not. Like, that's how much these student loans have an impact on all of us. And I want to openly talk about this and how kind of, you know, upsetting this is, it's like so upsetting. It's upsetting as the owner, it's upsetting as the therapist. It's upsetting. When I was coming out of school because I felt like I was blindsided. I mean, I could go on and on about why this is so upsetting. And I really was thinking about this, these answer because I kept getting the same answer over and over and over again, no matter whatever new grad I was talking with. And then I thought, wow, this is me too. Because I said the exact same thing. And so it's like, okay, they just want to live. And so how much do you need to live? And then you have to ask that question, so how much do you need to live? Okay, well, how much do you need for your loans a month? Okay, well now does the salary ultimately equate to helping you pay those off? I remember when I was in school and got out as a new grad, made 62k, I had to pay $1,500 a month to my student loans. I had $500 guys, probably less than that, $500 a month to pay my rent, to eat, to just live. And that was it. And no, I had no savings, I had nothing. And I did that for eight years and I couldn't make it. So what did I do? I decided to get three more other jobs. So I had four freaking jobs. But today no one's thinking that they're going to have another job. Like, no one does that. And I realize that's probably like I am kind of the one off in that no one's coming and being like, hey, can I have a full time job? Oh, by the way, I'm going to get three more other jobs. Like no one's saying that. I just did that because I knew the math didn't add up, but I just thought, let me get more jobs which equals more time because I didn't know there was another way. Does that make sense? And so now people are like, well, I don't want to do four jobs. I just want you to pay me well and that's it. And there's nothing wrong with that, which I'm going to get into today. But there then has to be, there has to be some give and take here. I want $20 million. But there also will have to be some take. Meaning if I want $20 million, I have to then have massive sacrifice on the back end that I'm probably going to be working 120 hours a week trying to get that up. That's A massive sacrifice. I'm probably not going to be going to birthday parties and my kids soccer games and all that because I'm going to be working. So. So there is these payoffs that people have to understand that it comes down to payoffs. What are you willing to give up to then get? And like I said, I just want to have an open conversation about this because sometimes it even frustrates me when I hear this stuff that I'm just like, they don't get it. But I also realize I didn't get it either when I came out. And so I want to start changing the conversation about this. The other thing I tend to hear when they tell me, I'm like, well, what do you want to make? And they're like, well, at least 90k. The next thing they tell me is, well, I looked up the market value in this area and the Internet told me that I should be making at least 90k because in this area, because of the cost of living. And also I'm a doctor, so I should be making that. I'm like, okay, so again, no one is telling me why they should actually why I should give them $90,000 for salary. No one's telling me that. They're just telling that they need to live and pay their student loans. That's not a reason why to give someone $90,000. That doesn't make sense. So this podcast is to hope inspire you guys that if you want to make $90,000, I'm going to tell you how to ask for that. This podcast is also to set expectations. If you're going to ask for $90,000, what ultimately we're looking for in return. Okay, so I want to get into that. So basically they say, you know, like, basically I want market value. Okay, well this is what I say. Basically. I had the same thoughts when I came out of school and then asked them, you know, why? And then the next thing I say is, well, and also too, the next thing they also throw at me a little bit is, well, I'm an athletic trainer, I have my CSCS, I have my OCS, I have my WCS. So I 100% should get paid more. And traditionally I say big hospital systems will pay you about $1,000 more a year on average if, if you get one of those certs. Now cash based PT is different, but traditionally in a hospital based setting, if you do get one of those certs, you do earn about $1,000 more a year. Not a month, not a paycheck a year. Okay, and here's the thing, those big hospital systems and those big, big bigger corporations, they also get you to buy into like a 12k residency, meaning it's a two year process. You pay them 12k when you come out of school. Now do you have that money coming out of school? No, you don't. But you're in the school mentality, so you think gotta pay more so I learn more. And ultimately it's just another revenue stream for that company. And so you're generating them cash flow because you're paying them 12k for over a two year time period. And so now think about this. I mean this is how crazy this gets. You have maybe $200,000 student loan debt. You're then paying for a 12k residency program. You're then paying at least another 2k to take a test. Okay, all for what? So that you can put letters behind your name and get a thousand dollar raise a year. Is that worth it? You better work at that company for at least 12 years so that you can get your thousand dollars, you can get your 12k back from that thousand dollar a year raise, you know, each year, if that. By the way, most companies, most hospital systems give about a 25 cent raise each year. Just so you know, like it doesn't make sense guys. I don't want anyone to be blinded by this. It doesn't make sense. So my next question is, how does it make sense? And I basically put this, I realized this when I interviewed multiple therapists, that no one is telling them that they get a raise if they were able to book patients out and be able to ultimately get patients to their actual goal. Now why is this so important that we get patients to their actual goal? We get patients to their actual goal because that means that that company is going to look like a freaking rock star. Because we're able to get them ultimately to solve the problem. People give us money in exchange to solve a problem. So when we can solve a problem, more people will give us money if we can actually solve the problem. So if we're not solving anyone's problem, then the company's going downhill. So when you're looking at and you're coming in and saying, hey, you know, I am, I have my ocs. Well, if you can't keep a client on your schedule, then that does not help the company. That does not help the company. I know guys from PT school. I was one of the people that was probably one of the best with clients. I'm not just saying that, I really was. I just knew how to Communicate effectively with patients and I just knew how to get them results. And I was the worst test taker. Worst test taker. I can tell you people in my class that were the best test takers, but they were the worst with clients. So what does taking the WCS or OCS or personal training or you know, athletic training, what the heck does that have to do with getting patient outcomes? Just because I have my OCS doesn't mean I'm going to get the best outcomes of my patient. It does not. Nor if you tell that to a, if you tell that to someone you're interviewing with, that doesn't get, that does not say, okay, great, I'm going to give you a raise. That just doesn't, that doesn't prove anything. So I'm going to give you tips in a second of you know what you need to do if you are trying to ask for a raise, what's helpful. But you got to understand whereas from an owner's perspective, where we're also coming from. And so the biggest thing, at least for me, when I look for people for orthopelvic, I look for do they understand the clients? Are they able to communicate effectively? Are they able to listen to the patient? Are they able to hit their deeper why and are they doing things to ultimately be able, meaning things, exercises or movement patterns to ultimately be able to unlock the people's fullest potential to truly get them back to their goal. Meaning if they want to run that marathon. We are running that marathon. Why we are actively in therapy sessions. I'm not saying, hey, I'll discharge you, I'll see you whenever I see you. Good luck on that marathon. No, you're getting people to run that marathon without leakage. Most insurance based companies are not doing that and that's where we bridge the gap. So here's my thing. So I'm asking new grads, if you're going to come and ask for 90k salary, please have these things. This is how you're more valuable to the marketplace. And even if you're not a new grad and you want to ask your boss for a raise or you just want more money, this is what you need to have. You need to be able to communicate, you need to be able to listen, you need to be able to dig to the patient's deeper why you need to understand objections and how to handle any objections that maybe the patient has and be able to ultimately get them the best results. Now you have permission to ask for a raise. And guess what? As an owner I have no problem paying someone and giving them a raise. If we are getting the best outcomes and results, no problem at all. But if we are not getting them to, at least for me, completing my LSR method that I have specifically for orthopelvic, then there's the problem. Because I know if we don't complete the method that they're not getting the outcomes that they want and ultimately they're not going to be satisfied with the care. And so that is a problem. So I think it's just a really, really important conversation to have because think from the owner's perspective. Being on this side now, sometimes it's frustrating. And I know some of us practice owners feel this way when it's like, oh my gosh, like these salaries they're asking for is insane. At the same time, we get it because I made 62k coming out of school and I couldn't live on that and I had to get four jobs. So I understand and I get it. But I didn't understand this part that I'm telling you about what makes me more valuable because school taught me what makes me more valuable is more certifications. What I'm telling you makes you more valuable is learning how to communicate, learning how to dig to deeper. Why? Being able to listen to the patient, truly getting them back to their goal and getting the outcomes that they want, not what we want, that they want, is what actually makes you more valuable, not more certs. And ultimately, what I have found with working with lots and lots of therapists on board my company, and just other people's therapists in general is the biggest problems I see is this. You don't know how to communicate effectively, even though we all think we do, but we don't. And then also we don't know how to do higher level exercises to keep the patient interested, to get them to truly back to their goal. And so I find those are the two major problems that I tend to have to keep coaching on over and over and over again and to objection. And money handling. Because most of us have money issues because we sympathize with people that have debt or that can't afford it. Because we are the people that can't afford it. Because, you know, we don't. We didn't have any extra money. Like it's just money didn't grow on trees, you know, and so we sympathize with the people like, hey, I can't afford to come in because we are those people. And the faster you can kind of get past that the faster you can give yourself a raise and the faster you can even ask for that raise. And so both parties are happy when the results are there. If anyone is a good owner, they should be like, yes, no problem, I'll give you that raise. If the results are not there, then there shouldn't be any asking for that raise because the results aren't there. So how are they going to pay you if the results aren't there? They can't. Just so you know, they can't. What else do I want to say with this? Also, I want people to know this. When anyone is hired on, the company takes the risk. The owner takes the risk. Meaning especially if there's salary you hire on a therapist and that owner is the one that is in charge of that 90 to $100,000 salary. Even just three years ago, most PTs were not making that just so people know, like, it just wasn't a thing. Like I said, I started at 62,000, I worked eight years and I made it to $85,000 after eight years. Okay. And so I just want people to be mindful of that. This is like a new thing, especially recently, that I feel like people are like, we're not standing for these lower salaries, which I get. Good for you guys. Great for you guys. I want you to have higher salaries so you don't have to go through all the pain I went through. But I also want you to know that there is a trade off. Like I talked about, there is a trade off that comes with it and there's an expectation. Because if you're going to ask for the $90,000 salary, well, then there's certain things that have to come. Those are the things that I said previously. And so just know that there's that trade off. So don't then feel like, oh my God, I'm going to get burnt out because I'm now seeing seven patients a day. Well, that's the trade off. That is the trade off. In some patients, a day isn't too bad. It's really not that bad. So you have to know that because the owner in the company is taking on the risk that they're taking a chance on you, they're taking a bet on you. And they're basically saying, do I think this person can get people to fully be able to comply with their plan of care? And do I think the patients are going to vibe with them or like them? And you ultimately don't know until people start working in the company because people can tell you anything on an interview. And seeing how the patients respond to it, that's really it. And so just be mindful of that as well. Just because you start with one salary doesn't mean that you can't start with 90k and then progress from there. And you don't have to wait until a year. I think that's another big misconception that, oh, I could only get a raise on a year. No, if you're doing well, you can get a raise throughout. It doesn't mean you have to wait to the year. So I think a year is kind of a BS thing. It just again came from some corporate dude that was like, hey, let's give raises every year. No, if you're doing well, your boss should be like, hey, awesome freaking job. Like, let's go, I'll give you a raise. Why not? Again, if we can bring, if we all share the pot, then everyone is satisfied, the therapist is happy, the owner is happy, and we're all singing Kumbaya. But if there is someone that comes in and they're like, I want no more than $90,000, but I only want to see six patients a day and that's it. And I want to, you know, that's all I want to do. And I'm not going to do anything else. And I don't really care about if they get the results or not. I'm just here for the paycheck. It doesn't work. Those people, if you are one of those people, those people go to the hospital system, they go and die there. Basically. They go there because it's stable, they get their little insurance there and they go there and that's what they do. They go to die there. Meaning they're not growing and they just go and are complacent with what they have there. And they don't really, you know, do too much for growth opportunities or anything like that. Just like, yeah, we just need you to work and that's it. But if you ultimately want to progress and be amazing at your craft and really be able to be different and have a passion for this, this is a no brainer. Just get better at communicating, get better at getting to people's deep well, why get better at objection. Handling. And there'd be no reason why you should not get a raise. Okay? So hopefully this is insightful and by the way, hopefully I want people to get a raise. I really, really do. But there comes with, there comes with a trade off with that. Meaning you ultimately need to get the best results. That's it. And what I find is people, they can't get the best results, but they're still asking for even 95 minimally or even $100,000 minimally. And that just doesn't work. It just doesn't work. So hopefully this is very insightful on how kind of the behind the scenes are and what it is to bring more value to the marketplace to get the salary that you want. And it's okay to ask. Don't be ashamed to ask for a bigger salary. I'm not shaming anyone for a bigger salary. I hopefully get. Hopefully you get a takeaway of this, of if you're going to ask for a bigger salary. There has to be more of a reason than I just want to live and pay off my student loans. There has to be. You have to point out the value that you can bring to the company and then also prove that. Not just say it. You got to prove it. So. All right, I'll get off my. My soapbox today, but hopefully this is helpful. Hope it's insightful. They have more questions, guys. Please reach out. You can always DM us at Pelvibiz on Instagram and we'd be happy to chat it up. We'll talk soon, guys. Bye. Bye.