#162 - Get Your Techs to Close More Tickets: How We Built Confidence, Boosted Sales, and Cut Stress

Like, there's a lot of optimism for 2025. As owners, we always want more. If your team's conversion rate is half of what it should be, then I'm gonna ask what's happening. The bigger we've gotten, the tighter we've gotten our product lines. That's how you start with building a training program. We're about 8 months into using Avoca, and Avoca's been an awesome partner for us in our call center. So what Avoca does for us is they do 2 different things. One, they have their Coach product, and Coach has been helping us do what it says— coach our CSRs every single day. It listens to every call and uses AI technology to basically pick apart that call and tell us where we can improve. And for the last 8 months, we've been consistently improving our scores, which has been awesome. The other product they have is just conventional booking, and it's an AI tool that books over the phone. A customer calls in and it either handles overflow as in our phones are full, or it does nights and weekends for us. And a customer will call in and actually deal with an AI agent all the way through booking. And the savings inside call center has allowed us to ramp up our marketing to continue to grow even more. Thank you, Avoca, and thank you, Tyson, for your partnership.

Welcome back to Owned and Operated with your hosts, the HVAC Jack and John Wilson. It still gets me every time. It still feels good.

Thousands of people cheering, screaming. I, I know, I know.

Makeshift, uh, protect—

I also can't wait to talk plumbing and HVAC and electric.

Sweet, man. Well, let's, let's dig in. Um, we wanted to touch base today on training. Was there any specific kind of training that you wanted to hit on?

Yeah, so what I wanted to talk about today, I— this has come up Just in the couple of the groups we're in. So I thought, I thought just a 101 on how to do technician training, how we think about it, what to talk about, when to talk about it. I thought that'd be an interesting discussion to sort of like, hey, I want to do more training. Great. What now?

Yeah. Do you want to start off? I will give how we train because it's definitely suboptimal to where you're going to be. And then, okay.

Yeah. Go ahead.

How you would do it differently. So we do departmental trainings twice a week. I guess, do you want to start on— do you start on new hire? I guess that's probably the better place to start on initially. The background's going to be shaped by the new hire process itself. So, taken from you, we do our interviews. We have a ride-along workday with our team to make sure that this person has the basic skill set, has the basic attitude, is willing to get their hands dirty. Do the work that's necessary. So, they do a ride-along day, then follows in a week of training. And that week of training starts off with day 1 being ServiceTitan training in-depth on how we are, how we do the systems and how we, how we do ServiceTitan and all of the subsequent needs of our business and our expectations for them.

Mm-hmm.

Followed by then twice weekly trainings after that week ride-along. Oh, excuse me, I jumped ahead. Then the other 4 days of that week, they're doing a ride-along training with a senior member of HVAC or plumbing who is giving a sheet of things that they are grading them on. Essentially, we get that sheet back and then we determine if they made it, need more training, another week in the van to really figure out if they're going to make it, or they get their own vehicle. So one week of onboarding training, and then it becomes a twice a week. Once a week is going over numbers, how we did last week. Did we win? Did we not win? And then on Fridays, we do another training, which is sales-based. Hey, we're going to go through role-playing. We're going to go through different scripting, how you deal with these scenarios. And so that is the extent of our training is really 3 items. It's onboarding. And then twice a week, numbers and sales.

I feel like that's good.

Really?

Like, hey, I think the, the place to start is like even a little bit back. I want to start training. What do we do? So like you had that question at some point and you decided, hey, our onboarding isn't robust enough. So I'm going to create this week-long program of like, here's how to use ServiceTitan. Here's how to Use Divvy. Here's how to clock in, clock out. Here's how the price book works. Um, so I agree. It's like setting them up for success off that rip. That makes total sense to me. And then as you get going, you develop a cadence of, yeah, sales or ticket training. We've done a bunch of stuff. Um, we've tried a lot of different things and it really depends on like the maturity of the team. Some, sometimes we do role plays, sometimes it's more indirect role play. So like we'll pull a Ciro or Rilla recording and we'll listen to what happened on that call and then give each other feedback. Uh, and that tends to be pretty impactful. We'll do invoice reviews. And I think where I was hoping to start is maybe a company does a training once a month or, or no training at all. And they're like, how do I begin? So how did you think about beginning?

So we think about beginning because we had an, uh, a point in time very recently where Techs weren't meeting standards. And you can probably go back and listen 6 months ago and you'll hear this point somewhere right around pre-summer to going into summer, maybe June, April, May, June. And yeah, the techs weren't performing. And it— we said instead of blaming them for non-performance, because when you're so small, uh, all you're doing is trying to get someone out in the field because you can't afford to keep them into training, but realistically, it feels that way. I think at the end of the day, though, you're wasting your leads. You're wasting really good leads that are high-ticket value, which are going to allow you to grow and allow you to do more training because you're not training them. So they're not putting in opportunities. But that's because you as the employer didn't set those expectations from The gate. So that's where we, we started. And the first step was to say, okay, let's start with bringing people in so that they know their numbers, they know where they are, they know where they're winning. That was the first step. That was our first weekly training, is touching base for 30 minutes a week. We have to at least do that. And then after we got past that point, that was great. Now the techs know if they're winning, they know if they're losing. There's a bit of a competitive spirit that they are utilizing against each other and it's, it's more fun. They're getting to know us. We bring in breakfast, whatever the case may be. And then we said, okay, that is extremely helpful. But the next step is they're asking now, hey, my number's this. You're expecting me to be up here north of that. Like, how do I get there? And can we get training? They were asking us. Yeah.

We need sales training.

Like, we want to reach our goals. We want to get those benefits and those commissions. Show us how. And so, that's when we started that secondary training day. And then we said, well, we need to now wrap all this up of what is the key and entrance points for all of these items that we're requiring. And we need to put that now on the very front end so that from day one, this is now the culture versus trying to change the culture midway through is so much harder. And so, that's how we got to where we are today. And it's through a lot of conversations on this podcast with you.

And it's awesome. Yeah.

Because I would imagine you, you do it somewhat similarly.

Yeah. I mean, ours is pretty similar. You know, we started it 7, 8 years ago at this point. It started with a once a week huddle and, uh, still what we call it. And now it's more developed. You know, some teams have one training a week, some have 3, and it really just depends on like what's going on with that team. But yeah, they, they're going to deep dive into numbers. They're going to do sales objections videos. They're going to do a lot of stuff. I think when you're thinking about planning the training, the important thing to cover Is that it's really the same stuff over and over and over. And, and it's not— because I think when we first started, I remember it like 4 years ago, we're like, all right, we want to really take training seriously. So let's, let's plan out the next year of training because we want to be able to hold our managers accountable to doing trainings, which we still believe in that. It's just what we found was really all we actually need is like the next 8 weeks. And then all you do on week 9 is do week 1 again. So you're talking about like 20 different topics. And really, you're talking about 5 different topics in 4 different ways. So it's 20 total. But, you know, conversion rate, you've got a million different ways to take conversion rate. But I think, I just think it's like a simpler process. So we started, I think the first one was probably like 52 straight weeks or 26 straight weeks of like a totally different topic every single time.

Mm-hmm.

And we've landed now on like, I think it's week 12 or week 13. It's a rolling 13-week calendar. So, at week 13, we just start again and we're back.

So, if you were to go back in time though and talk to yourself circa 2019, 2020, what would be the advice you would give yourself on starting those first initial trainings? Either A, what makes the training actually meaningful while you're doing it? How do you structure these trainings so that they are high value to you guys and the team? Where would you focus? Would you focus on their numbers? Would you focus on actually like the objection in the sales portion? Where do you think that the first training should start?

I mean, the first training I think is how do you read your numbers? And like, what, what are we looking for? Like, what is good? Because I think that's a, that's a big one that honestly is, uh, complicated. I think is, you know, as owners, we always want more. So, you know, often our teams will be like, hey, what's the goal? And I'm like, the goal is more like the, you You know, the goal's always more, but they're like, okay, but like, we need a number that we can tie ourselves to here to know that I did a good job. Uh, so as an owner, we always want more, but like, people need to know if they've done a good job. Like, so I think getting really clear about like, hey, this number's a good job and like how to read your numbers, how to look at 'em. I think that's just consistency of reporting and conversation.

Well, and so how did you get there? Is there any kind of rule of thumb? 'Cause I'm trying to not, you know, jump over steps.

Open sharing, scorecarding. Talk in the onboarding, we talk about your scorecard on ServiceTitan. Um, but like being very open with numbers, like our, you know, you can walk around our office and there's dashboards everywhere. Everyone can see everything and we're adding more like every day.

Mm-hmm.

Um, not every, not every day, but every month we add, we add more data so we all understand and we increase visibility. Uh, so like now daily gross margin and daily net margin is public information. Like you just go, go walk up to the TVs and like, there it is. We're getting ready to add, you know, this is, this isn't tech focused, but just sort of the level of clarity we think. We're getting ready to add an HR dashboard for like, here's how many inquiries we've received and here's how many we've answered, or here's how many customers we've contacted in the last 24 hours to collect money, or here's the dollar amount of money. And those are going in hallways. That's like going up on a TV so we can hold our support team to the same level of accountability that we hold our field team. So I think, hey, here's what's good, and then display that information absolutely everywhere is the answer. Like, you know, hey, it's everywhere, we're going to talk about it nonstop, and make that a part of your culture. And public dashboarding, I think, is the easiest way to do it because at that point, it is a part of your culture. Like, people are going to look at that wall and they're going to be like, interesting.

Yes. And then, so the first step is make time, make time for these meetings. They're important.

Yeah. So you make time for the meetings and then you start Like, hey, what are the things that happen? And this is like, you can do this for call center, you can do this for whatever, but how do we train the behaviors? And then how do we compare them against the outcomes? So the behaviors are like, how are we gonna show up to the house? How are we gonna dress? How are we gonna drive our trucks? Where are we gonna park? How are we gonna greet? How are we gonna like handle exploring? How are we gonna explain options? How many options? Those are behaviors. The outcome is your sales, your conversion rate, your number of options, and your total sales output. So you like compare those, Here's how we're doing in trainings to here's what those trainings resulted in. And it's just that cycle back and forth. So, okay, our conversion rate is low in plumbing. We're in the 30s. We want to be in the 50s. What do we do? Okay, well, it's conversion rate and number of options look good. So that means we're not handling objections very well. Could be pricing objections, could be any type of objection. So we really hone in on objections for a couple weeks. So you can deviate from that 13-week schedule a little bit based on like whatever the current need is.

Mm-hmm.

But really it's always like, what's the average ticket? An average ticket just means how much are you selling? And conversion rate is, are you selling something on every job? Like it's those 2 things and that's most of what we're gonna focus on. And then recently we've added more technical training because one, we, we want to be good at our jobs and, uh, 2, People, you know, people sell or they talk about more options that they understand what the option is.

Mm-hmm. And so what, when, when you're going in there, I mean, this is a lot for anyone new who's listening. It's like, I don't do trainings and I have to do behavioral and, and figure out like how, as an owner, how to understand overcoming objections and how to understand the distance.

I think we dive like by topic. So I think like you do a topic on like, here's how to overcome the service fee objection. Here's how to overcome the your price is too high objection. Here's how to overcome the next available, like when can you do it objection. So I think you can do it by like micro topic. So that's what I said, like, hey, it's probably 20 trainings, but really it's 5 topics said in 4 different ways.

Yeah.

That's 4 different ways to say conversion, like dealing with objections. Then the next one could be like how to, how to explore the home and like ask open-based, open-ended questions to try to understand the need of that customer. And that could be, okay, here's a training on lifestyle questions. Here's a training on who lives in the home. Here's a training on their current mechanical systems. And again, you just had 3 different ways to attack the same, the same problem. Earlier this year, we started an outbound campaign and we really didn't know where to begin. So we were using dialing on the phones, we were sending text messages, we were trying emails, tried a couple different softwares, and ultimately we ended up with Hatch. Hatch Hatch has been an awesome partner for us. We started with them about 5 or 6 months ago, and we've just continued to ramp. Every month we add 3 or 4 more automations. And my personal favorite thing about working with Hatch is Hatch comes out of the box ready to go. With Hatch, you get automated multi-touch outreach across text, voicemail drop, email, and a ton more. So every single lead that you have gets worked, every invoice that you leave gets retouched and rehashed, and It's freaking awesome. Check out usehatchapp.com/oao.

And so as you're going through these trainings, right, the owner or the trainer, manager, HR, whoever is available to do these at these— at everyone's company is putting these together. They're trying to be one step ahead of the techs to give them value. Do you have any advice as you're going through the actual structure of the training itself? You bring them in, you sit them down, you bullshit for 10 minutes, and then You're on to like the actual structure of the training itself. Is there any advice to making them extremely effective? Because I know a lot of times what we had to curb very early on was this, this—I don't call it banter—but like this back and forth with very little actual value in the training. Yeah, right. Somebody argues, and then that argument goes and just continues. Well, we can't do that because of this, and da da da da. And then you go back and forth. How do you do? Is there any books that you used, or is there any kind of resources that? you use that help you to structure trainings really well? Any advice there?

I think most of it's like, who's doing the training? That seems to be the biggest differentiator. And honestly, like the best way to do it, this might be a little bit scary, but ask your team. Like we ask them for feedback. We got this from Chris Hoffman, but just like, hey, was this a good training? Like, did we do good? Did we answer your questions? Do you feel like you got value out of it? Was it worth the drive? We really honed in on that and we tried to get— we tried to improve and take that feedback and improve. And I'm still early in it, but yeah, I think who's doing the training was the biggest lesson because we had people that would permit that for 30 straight minutes, and then we had other people who would just sort of corral it and then get the training on. And that was a— seemed to be a person-by-person. So my point there is I would lean into your strength, lean into the strengths of your team of like Who does this really well and who just doesn't?

And I know we've talked about this before, but also, I mean, where it helped me in terms of those trainings and to get to a point where they were actually becoming valuable was EOS, understanding how to do a training and how to, I mean, frankly, take objections and take questions from your employees, put them aside to continue the training, to get the points across, and then go back and solve or however you want to handle those. But making them highly valuable with timeframes and with any kind of follow-ups necessary. I think that that's an important part to making it effective training, at least on our end. What we find is that high level of structure dissuades kind of the monkeying around to some extent.

No, that's honestly, that's a good idea. We don't, we don't do it exactly like that. Something that we're getting ready to do, and this was a move that we saw from a shop visit 2 months ago, was we went to this shop and they start every meeting the exact same way. And that's in my next 90 days, that's one of my tasks to complete.

That's cool.

Is every meeting starts the same exact way. So it's like you start with 2 review shoutouts, you go through the core values real quick, you give a quick shoutout to somebody that lived those core values, and it's a literal slideshow. And every meeting starts the exact same way, which kind of aligns with what you just said. And I like that Because it like, I think, I think what it does over time is it gets you in the mode of like, okay, we're in meeting mode. Like we've done this 5 things. Yep. We're aligned on this. Yep. I'm totally on for the VTO. Makes sense. So yeah, we sort of backed into it from a different way though. But I do like that a lot, that level of uniformity.

Yeah. And so, so we have those trainings. Well, we have the 2 different separate trainings. How many times are you training? You said multiple for some departments. Maybe one for other departments. And is that based on the needs and the wants of the technicians? Who's dictating how many trainings they're getting?

We will typically leave it up to the manager unless that team is suffering, then we stop leaving it up to the manager. But we'll typically leave it up to the manager. And if the team is succeeding and hitting their targets, I'm, you know, I'm not going to ride them. But if your team's conversion rate is half of what it should be, Then I'm gonna ask what's happening. Like, hey, what's your training plan? What are you doing? When it's, when the team as a whole is succeeding, then there's always gonna be like 1 or 2 people that need more help. Then we go personalized. So we do this, uh, that's interesting. And, and I, I personally do this. Yeah. So every Monday afternoon I spend a half an hour with each frontline, uh, like department, plumbing, HVAC, electric, drains. And we go through their KPIs for the previous week. Hey, here's what happened. Uh, your guy did this, his conversion rate was this, average ticket was this. What's going on with this guy? Uh, when was the last time you talked to him? Is there something going on with his personal life? Is there like something professional?

Yeah.

Has he been struggling a lot? Like, did he follow the process? How many times did he contact you for help? And we just sort of unpack it. And usually what ends up happening is we, I, we force a ride along. Okay. Hey, this guy, like, what do you think you're gonna do about it? Like, here's the results, here's what happened. How are we gonna support this guy? Mm-hmm. How, how do we like help, you know, keep him improving? So, and, um, our, our manager's going to ride along and they, they help out. Or sometimes they're like, ah, I don't think a ride along's necessary. Like, I think he's good. We're, we're just gonna talk to him. And I'll be like, great, we'll try that. And if it's not improved next week, then we're gonna do a ride along. So like, you tell me.

Yeah.

Um, but I think a weekly touch base and making it like, we don't need to make one person's problem a group problem. So if one person's struggling for some reason, like we've had, you know, it's a big business, so people have a lot of personal stuff going on. Every, any given time, somebody's parent is really going through something or somebody's kid has really gone through something. And so like, we just try to handle, handle that on a personal basis. But if the whole team is underperforming, then we're, we're gonna start.

Yeah.

Then we're gonna start, what's going on with your trainings? When was the last time you had an objection training? How are you talking about options?

What's going on? And then so, so from an individual training perspective, still managers to individuals and on an as-needed basis, correct? Yeah. Okay. And then with that, I mean, I guess, is— would you consider a one-on-one training? And then how often do you— are you requiring managers to give one-on-ones to frontline staff?

Uh, it should be weekly. Okay. We are not as consistent as we should be on that, and that's a big That's a big area of focus for us.

Yeah, it is for us as well. We do it in plumbing pretty well, but in HVAC it's, it's nonexistent. So we're working to streamline that across. But interesting. I mean, it's, it's a lot, but I think at the end of the day, training is— much as nobody wants to spend that time and that money to bring people in, that's not revenue generating. You know, I reiterate, like the amount of The amount of returns we saw off of that training and those training exercises is so extremely valuable. People who don't have the training and who are not performing, you're wasting, you're wasting money. I mean, you really are. You're wasting those calls, you're wasting those leads, and you're not getting performance at the end of the day. And it's not doing—

Yeah.

You're not winning as a team, you're not winning as an individual, and the customer's not winning. Because they're not getting the best service possible by a trained individual.

And I think like if you're just getting started off in training, I just don't think you have to overcomplicate it. Like pick 3, 4 topics and you can repeat them. Like right now we're on a 6-week training with HVAC service and it is literally 4 topics that we're repeating for 6 straight weeks. That's it. Like it's not— I think we really want to overcomplicate it and make it brand new or whatever, but like it just doesn't matter. Like this is the, this is the 4 things that we have to talk about. And at the end of 6 weeks, you have to know Uh, you have to know how to size, you have to know how to call by call, you have to know how to do these things, which the whole team is systemically struggling with.

With those trainings, are you focusing, especially like this instance that you're talking about, is it focused primarily around the sales portion or is it technical training? Do you offer technical training on the back end?

We're doing a ton more technical. So that's been an area of focus. I would say it's by trade. We're trying to make it more systemic because really the managers run the training. But we asked for a survey. We just did a survey of our team of like, hey, what do you think of our benefits? And like, if you could add something, what would it be? And most requested was more technical training. Interesting. So like, can—

sorry, this is purely selfish here and now asking, but like, what kind of technical— like, can you, can you give examples of what kind of technical training you guys are moving into?

A lot of it's product specific. I mean, with HVAC, a lot of it's been refrigeration focused. Like, we're doing refrigeration changeover right now. Like, yeah, we gotta know what's going on. Like, that's a big deal. That's a really big deal. Um, like, oh, we've got the new fire alarms or whatever inside those, inside these, uh, systems. We, we need to know what's up. Mm-hmm. So that's a big area of focus for water. It's okay. What's, how does water quality work for water heaters? We, we just switched water heater, uh, water tankless water heater brands. How's it work? Like literally, how does it work? Yeah. Um, 'cause it's different. Like it has a different type of condensate and our installers need to know and our salespeople need to know.

Yeah.

So they can sound intelligent when they're talking about it. So pretty product-specific stuff.

And then so now, now circling that back. Yeah, that does. Circling that back, back to the kind of hiring process. So when you're doing the hirings now, if you are offering these product level, you still are requiring on hiring that these individuals have a decent background in HVAC and then you're just giving them more specialized, not generalized knowledge. And specialize.

Yeah, like here's the specific products that we install because we've— the bigger we've gotten, the tighter we've gotten our product lines just because it's easier. So yeah, that's been an area of focus for us.

It's really interesting. I mean, that's neat because, you know, when I think about technical training, what scares me is, right, you should be able to hire out the generalist portion. If you— if your technicians in HVAC are having trouble with refrigeration theory, yeah, maybe a refresher course doesn't hurt, but to be giving in-depth trainings on You know, how does a, you know, a heat coil work or how does a contactor work? I'm thinking that, you know, that's a hiring problem, not a training issue. But it sounds like what you're doing is completely not that. It's products only. And how does this— yes, new— these new items work, which makes sense because you want the tech.

We do want to add— we do want to add a live fire lab to do more of what you just said, because I feel like that would help anybody sharpen up their skills. Yeah. Like heat exchanger breakdowns. Here's how you identify cracks, you know, because you want to be able to do a good job. Like, we want to be good at the thing that we're hired to do.

We had something like that, a live fire, the live fire box. When we got to— when I was working at Frito-Lay and it was this giant box and it had like 6 different electrical tests in it, like how to, how to set a photoeye and all this kind of stuff, how to wire up a 3-phase motor. And that was like the first thing they touched before they even got hired was making sure that the individuals know their basic electrical skills. So interesting. I mean, that's extremely helpful. I highly recommend anybody out there who's not doing trainings regularly to make the time. It's hard. It is so hard. And I'm not, I'm not someone who's going to pretend like it's not because stealing that time away from running, it's hard, you know?

Yeah. Well, and getting like planning it out and like, and that's why I think you take a few hours and like, You just build a program. Yeah. And that's why I'm going to really like push for that. Because if you build a program, it's like, hey, here's our 12-week program twice a week. Here's the links to the videos. Here's the links to any like paper forms that you print out with it. Just do it once. Yeah. And then you're done. And then you just go in and you open up, you click the video, boom, here we go. Here's the talking points.

The problem is not, at least for me, John, the problem is not that. The problem is like, hey, I got a call at 7 AM. And we got an active water leak on this just super juicy call. And all the plumbers now, they're sitting in a training for 2 hours or an hour and 10 minutes plus drive time. So, or we have a down 10-year-old HVAC unit. We need something over there ASAP or we're going to lose the call. And at the end of the day, like those juicy calls are, you know, we still will skip trainings on call by call because of that if it has to be that juicy. But in general, we've said Hey, it's not worth it because the time that that goes into training. Yeah, that's one call, but they have another 15 over the next 2, 3 days. Like, those 15 are going to be more important than that singular call.

Yeah, I mean, I think so. And I think, yeah, I mean, you can go even for like, we have 8 people right now at a Next Start training for basically the whole week. And like, obviously 8 people is a lot. Uh, it's like 2 people from each department.

NextStar's a lot.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was saying that to somebody the other day. Like, I do think NextStar is the right answer above a certain point. Yeah. So I'm just gonna say that. Um, I was talking to someone about that the other day. It's like, I, I don't remember what NextStar is, probably like $30,000 or $40,000 a year or something. But on top of that, we easily paid $80,000 to $100,000 additional for training. Like easily. Um, I puked in my mouth a little bit.

Yeah. But I mean, no, I know, I know it's, it's the same concept, right? It's like really good training to be able to get an employee to a spot where they can convert.

I mean, we have 8 people that are gone this week and they're going to come back and probably double. They're going to like permanently double basically, because now what's going to happen, and this is how this gets even more impactful. So you get into this training rhythm. So then onboarding, people onboard into this awesome rhythm that you have. And then when you do one-time trainings where like people move up a level, your ongoing and consistent training, like they get more out of it.

Yeah.

So like these 8 people are gonna go to these trainings, they're gonna come back and they're going to get more out of the trainings that you're already doing. So they'll never regress. Whereas if you send people to these, like I hear about people going to these one-time trainings and then they never follow up with another training.

Mm-hmm.

And they regress and they're like, oh my God. Yeah. The first month was amazing. They did awesome. And it's like, well, what did you just do to support them after that? Nothing. Then what are we doing here? You know?

Yeah. I mean, it's like anything else. You don't— it slowly falls off. You don't use it, you lose it. And then they regress back to initial points.

Whatever the mean was. Yeah. Well, that's how you— that's how you start with building a training program. So you make it simple. Same 5 topics, 12 weeks, 8 weeks. Like you can do 6 weeks, you can do 4 weeks if you want and just repeat it once a month. People have to hear stuff 7 times for it to get in. By the 7th month, they'll be maybe tired of the training, but I bet not because you will add more people. People will have different perspective and just document it and run it.

I love it. I mean, we started it, like I said, based on the talks from this podcast. I think if you haven't started today, get it ready to go. Nothing crazy, just make it a habit. We're meeting, we're talking about training, we're talking about our goals, who we are, where we are. And how we're going to overcome those objections in the future.

Thanks for checking us out. Check out ownedandoperated.com if you want to hear more. That website is starting to get a lot more traffic, which is kind of fun. I think we're at like a few thousand hits a month and I'm just like, where are you guys coming from? That's pretty cool. Follow us on the Facebook group too.

Facebook group is awesome. I've been more active in there. Love it. Really good groups of people in there.

So yeah, I think we're about to cross 700 there. Yeah, lots of question answering.

I think it's very, very, very helpful.