#226 HVAC Owner Makes $4M/Month (Here’s How)

You're about to hit $4 million a month. I want to understand the $4 million a month. I want to understand the seasonality. I want to understand the memberships and like how you're managing an HVAC business at scale.

Retention rates of field pros. I think that's where the magic is. The thing that we've been super focused on the last 2 years is career progression for our field pros is like, how can we take them from no experience, a level 1, and how can we objectively make them into a level 5?

Welcome back to Owned and Operated. Today I have my friend Brian from TR Miller on. Welcome to the show.

Appreciate you having me, man. Yeah, I appreciate the tour.

Yeah, yeah, no, this is good. I mean, you were just on over Zoom, but you were just on, uh, 2 months ago, 3 months ago, 6 months ago.

It might have been 6 months at this point. Yeah, yeah.

But you know, we get—

you invited me back though.

I did, I did invite you back. You're about to hit $4 million a month.

Yeah, we are.

That's pretty legendary.

Appreciate that.

Yeah. And that's— yeah, that's what we're going to dive into today. I want to understand selfishly, like you're running an HVAC business at scale. I want to understand— I want to understand the $4 million a month. I want to understand the seasonality. I want to understand the memberships and like how you're managing an HVAC business at scale.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, we started off as HVAC, so that's where we kind of cut our teeth. So up until 2020, that's really all we knew before we added like plumbing, sewer, and electrical now.

So it was 2020 that you added plumbing?

Yep.

Okay. Yeah. How big is plumbing now?

Plumbing will probably— I would say month over month is about a— I would say probably $1 million month over month between our plumbing service install and like our sewer teams.

It does $1 million a month or it does—

Yeah. Yeah, it does about $1 million a month. Yeah.

So that's a $10 million business, $12 million business.

Yeah. Yeah, we've been super lucky. I mean, part of HVAC, the hardest part is like, how can you diversify your revenue? Like, especially, I mean, in HVAC, you know, I mean, we still face it to this day. We'll kind of jump into the $4 million a month. But like, you know, our month over month, like if, you know, in January, February, March, you know, our budgets were $2 million a month.

Yeah.

You know, because HVAC is so dominant. Yeah.

And half of that being plumbing. So HVAC really just tanks off.

It does. Especially, you know, we always struggle February, March, just the seasonality. And so the biggest challenge for us is, is how can you really, how can you retain technicians the best to your ability during February and March?

We struggled a lot with that this year.

Yeah, it's hard, right? It's like—

Everyone gets real squirrely because like calls aren't there. It's a lot of maintenances.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because they'll run like— Yeah. And so some of the things we've, we've thought about over the years is, you know, like what's our minimum hours per technician, minimum calls, and then where do we, where can we flex up to? Um, and so because really the, the trick to HVAC is being able— the flexibility or the bandwidth is like, how can I create maximum bandwidth?

Yes.

During peak, you know, we're in a peak week right now, you know, it's, it's the end of June. And how can you peak from, you know, let's say on average running 40, 50 calls per day with a service unit up to 120 calls per day?

Yeah.

You know, and just having that flexibility and that bandwidth is important for the HVAC side.

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This was a lesson I got a good taste for. I visited Jimmy at Baker, and I am good friends with RJ from Sierra in Vegas. And they really— and you guys might be doing this too, but they, they were— their install teams were so flexible, they could go from 1 install a day to 3 full systems a day. And I think it was the same thing, like, how do you sort of manage that low time? and be able to triple your output during peak?

Yeah, yeah, that's a good question. So, um, I would say like, you know, in February, March, we were probably running on like 5 or 6 install trucks, and now we're at 10 install trucks, you know, a few months later. Some of it is, is hiring. Like, we do a lot of our hiring practices in like the February, March, April. Uh, you know, if someone, you know, unfortunately decides to leave the team in like December, we might wait until like, you know, let's find a new team member, but let's start for like April 1st.

Yeah.

So that's a little bit of the strategy. And some of it too is field supervisors. We still haven't solved this, but I think we're further today than we were a couple of years ago is what is the role of a field supervisor? And so I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but how we've kind of thought about it is, you know, during the slow time, that's when it's the time to work on the business. You know, that's the one-on-ones, that's, you know, documenting processes. What's our, you know, our refrigeration process? What's our heat exchanger process? That's the time is when it's slow. But when it's peak, hey, it's time to go get back in the truck. And so a lot of our field supervisors have stepped up, especially in this heat wave, and, you know, hey, let's go do an install for the day. You know, that's another truck on the road, or let's go run more service calls. So we've pushed and our field supervisors have elected to go in because, you know, so many customers, you know, don't have cooling right now. And so how can we increase our bandwidth there too has been part of our strategy.

Yeah. Are your install crews running several systems a day?

The way we think about it, yeah, the answer is yes. So an HVAC install crew might do an HVAC, so furnace, air conditioner, typically getting done between 4 and 5.

Like PM or hours?

I'm sorry, 4 or 5 PM.

Okay.

Yep. And then they'll do like an air conditioner after.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So like system and a half. Yeah. Like system and a half. That's where we're at right now. Is System and a Half.

Yep.

It seems like it's a big transition to 2.

It is.

Yeah, just like hard. Like there's a lot more, like people start running like, uh, QAs or they start, um, what Sierra was doing was I think it was $500 or $1,000, it was something, but for every additional system you installed after the first, you get an extra, let's just say $500.

Yeah.

Each, like helper and lead. So then, you know, their installers during peak season putting 3 systems in a day are making like $4,000 a day. Like—

That's crazy.

That's crazy. Yeah.

Yeah.

I was like, are you hiring?

Yeah. Because I mean, the byproduct is where we're at today is like we have a week's worth of backlog.

Yes.

And the real issue at hand is, is that's awesome. Sales team's pumped. They're selling jobs, shooting fish in a barrel. And then boom, customer calls and cancels. Yes, they found someone that could do it sooner. And so that's like in these peak months is like, how can I prevent my cancellation rates from like spiking? Or how can we still do these installs we're selling? Yeah, you know, that's the challenge right now. Yeah, it's a good challenge to have. No, you know what that means?

It totally is. I think it's just funny that, you know, you talk to like Baker Brothers was interesting. They're $106 million or something. And they only had like 12 install crews. It's just that their install crews do 2 to 3 times more than ours do.

Yeah.

It's crazy.

Yeah.

How are you doing this for service? Like, how are you going from 40 to 100?

Yeah. Um, well, I think something that we've been really intentional about lately is our memberships. Um, I think that's kind of like our, our foundation. It's our base work. It's where we're really, um, our, our big hairy goal over the next 10 years is really focused around memberships. And really, that's important. Now dived into the question is like the biggest, the biggest challenge with heating cooling is seasonality. And actually, it's probably a big challenge in a lot of industries is like, all right, I have a friend that runs a $30 million power washing business. Yeah.

And they have to hire, I think it's 500 people between April 1st and May 1st.

It's a real thing.

So I'm like, all right, you guys have it worse. Like, that sounds insane.

Yeah, that it's hard. And interesting, my friend has a power wash business too. They do. They got into Christmas lights.

Yes.

Yeah, that's what they're into now. Yeah. Um, and they're crushing it. Like, yeah, they're crushing it. Um, so we start with our memberships and it's really how can we create work year-round for our team members? That's, that's the thing is we need to make sure we have enough work during the off months, um, so that we can make sure we do a good job in the peak months. And so we try to make sure that, um, we schedule those maintenance calls February, March, April, um, try to at least get 2 to 3 per team member, uh, at least keep them busy, you know, get them some type of security, 30, 40 hours per week. And then what we ask on— I'll try to explain it to the best of my ability— is we have 4 shifts. So we don't do on-call. So we have a Monday through Friday, what we call an AM shift. So that's 8 to 5. We have a PM shift that's like 11 to 8. And then we have a Sunday to Wednesday shift and a Wednesday to Saturday shift.

Mm-hmm.

And so right now, Our service leader, Aaron, has done a really great job of is, all right guys, if you're a 5-day, 5 working day shift, how can we, you know, during the month of June, we need you to work an extra day. We need you to work that 6th day, which increases bandwidth. Or if they're, you know, scheduled from 8 to 5, it's, hey, we know it's gonna be an 8 to 8 kind of, kind of week, you know, we need you in at 8 AM and then, you know, ending around 8 PM. Or lastly, if they're a Wednesday to Saturday or Sunday to Wednesday, is hey, we need you to work an extra day or two, which has been really huge increasing bandwidth because we're still you know we still have a responsibility to run those calls accurately. Like you know we we grew up at a time back in 2015 where it's like hey, I need each technician to run 12 calls. Like we have a ton of calls. I need each team member to run 12 calls. And when I was a service leader, what I always found was. But when you run that many calls and you're in and out and you're turning and burning these calls within an hour or half an hour is, you know, I go to a customer's house, I say, hey, I don't do a thorough inspection. I replace the capacitor. And what happens is the next day the customer calls and says, hey, the technician that was there yesterday didn't know what he was doing and my system's not working again.

Yeah.

And so Really, we still want to preach, like, even these, these tough times— or not tough times, but these, uh, these busy times— is like, we still need to do thorough inspections.

Yeah.

Um, we still need you to spend an hour and a half, you know, 2 hours on each call and do a thorough inspection, because we can't have callbacks either, because that's bad for brand reputation as well and customer service. So that's kind of how we've thought about increasing our bandwidth.

Okay.

Yeah.

And then do, do they run more calls during peak? Like it goes from 2 to 3 to 6 or 8 or—

You nailed it.

5, okay.

Yeah, yeah. So we try to like, I would say our goal every day is to try to run 4 calls per technician per day.

Yeah.

4 opportunity calls and maybe a recall or a warranty if they come in. That's like our target. However, during these peak times, it will be, you know, 6 to 7 opportunities per day.

Yeah.

You know, longer days, you know, more days in the week. But we do try to pace like six to seven opportunities.

Yeah. Are you guys running a selling tech model or a CA model, or like how are you actually selling equipment?

Yeah, this is something. I think this is something that changes for the whole industry over the next few years.

Yeah.

I would say we're a hybrid. So we do have comfort advisors. They run marketing leads, and they also run what we call tech-generated leads. So called. Technicians in the home and they flip it over to the comfort advisor. So a lot of our sales model is in the home. Um, we do have one selling tech, uh, or 2 selling techs, I apologize. Um, and I don't know, I think you have to do what works best for you. Um, I don't think you should be pigeonholed to like, we're, you know, this group says we should only run, you know, selling techs.

Yeah.

Or this group says we should only do comfort advisors. I think at the end of the day is like, you know, be resourceful as a business owner and like what makes sense for your business and what's going to, you know, how can you maximize the opportunities is what's important.

Yeah.

Not every tech's meant to be a selling tech and not every comfort advisor is meant to be a comfort advisor.

Yeah.

You know, I think it will be interesting where it goes with technology. You know, there's a lot of things like call-by-call out there.

Yep.

There's a— I think right now the industry is trying to find its way. Um, we have some early leaders on it, um, but what we currently do is Comfort Advisors and selling techs. Yeah, yeah. Especially when it gets hot like this is we might not be able to get a Comfort Advisor there for a day or two, and it's like, we have techs in the home. Yeah, like we have techs in the home. Like, so we do greenlight some technicians to sell in the home during peak seasons and some year-round.

Yeah, yeah. I think, you know, we, we've, uh, pivoted our model just sort of following the lead of others. And that was a big part of it, is if I was a buyer, why would I— like, I barely have time to meet you in the first place, let alone meet you a second time. So, you know what I've— yeah, how I think about it, and maybe like this is rude, but I took an hour out of my day to be here with you today. So if you're— if you need to come back for a second appointment, you'll be meeting with my assistant, which like That's a closed sales window for whoever that is. Um, and I would imagine a lot of our customers are more like that, like they're busy professionals that are, you know, living their life. So I think being able to one-call close is important.

Yeah, and I'm sure that's where— I think where we're at is, um, I think what's best for a company from a data standpoint is like we just know we have higher conversions if we're in the home with the Comfort Advisor and Like a pain point we had with some of our techs that were selling techs before we went to the Comfort Advisor model is like they would sometimes sell stuff that like—

It's out of their own pocket.

Yeah, yeah. It couldn't go like the— we literally can't install this high-efficient furnace.

Oh, sure.

Because you just can't do it because it's all, you know, finished drywalled ceilings.

Yeah.

And so they were selling stuff that the customer either didn't need or we couldn't install.

Yeah.

And so I think that's where the Comfort Advisor model makes sense is we just know we have higher conversions, at least for us. with the comfort advisor and we're selling the right stuff.

Yeah.

Um, but I think we really have to take a step back in the future and look is like, what also makes sense for the customer? Like, the customer doesn't want a second person. They barely want a first per— like, to back to your point, this is tough. Yeah.

Well, and from a, from a company, like, well, now I have to build rapport 2 times when like the technician already did it. Like, why am I rebuilding rapport? Like, we're good to go. What we found with comfort advisors is Um, the, the job was already sold before the tech, before the CA walked in the door. Like the tech already built rapport, sort of started preloading options in that customer's mind. The CA walked in and signed paperwork and then they got a big check for doing it.

Mm-hmm.

And this, and the tech got less, which like, that doesn't make sense. He did most of the work. Um, so we just sort of like reset that. So then the tech gets most of the economics because they're the one doing most of the work. Which I think has been a win. And then one less appointment. But what, you know, what, what has been interesting, and I'm just— you compete with them, so this will be interesting to see. But like, you know, Four Seasons— I always bring up a few examples when talking about this, but like—

I love it. Yeah.

The— some of the biggest pure HVAC companies, or like just HVAC in general in our industry, run a split sales model. where we have selling techs do this, we have CAs do this, and that's where we wanted to end up. But Four Seasons is a great example. I've heard forever, I haven't seen it personally, but hey, the CAs just run marketed leads. They have a different price book even. Like, it's a totally different structure than the tech flip leads. Is that how that works in practice?

Yeah. One is I think Four Seasons. Dave over there is the owner, and he I think he's brilliant, and he has a lot of brilliant people on his team. I mean, think they're probably the largest up until most recently. I mean, they still are single location in the U.S.

Yeah, they are.

Like honestly, so what they've been able to do. I think Parker maybe, but like they're probably chasing.

Yeah. But Four Seasons is 251. Building.

One building.

That's crazy.

Yeah, they got a car wash in it. It's great, man. And so they're— I think they've done a really good job of like— I think you need scalability too.

Yeah.

Is like, you know, if you only have 4 comfort advisors, it might not make sense to have like multiple price books.

Yeah.

But they probably have a comfort advisor team of like 20 to 30, or if not more, maybe 50, who knows, um, where it's like, all right, this group of 15, these— this is, um, these are gonna be our box store comfort advisors. These are the ones that are gonna run Costco leads.

Yep.

And we're gonna be hypercompetitive with these leads. And then they might have another 15 Comfort Advisors that are designed for just customers that are calling in because they want, you know, they're getting a few estimates out there. And then the last 15 might be the sale, you know, the technician was in the home and now they're selling, they need the equipment. And so that I—

And that's the highest price point.

And that's the highest price point. Because it's already converted.

Bingo. It's already converted.

Yeah, and so they've done a really good job. And they're tough, man. They are incredibly tough. They're competitive.

Yeah.

It's interesting because I think a lot of PE models go to, we're gonna charge more.

Yeah.

But these guys, man, they are a competitor. I mean, they are—

We're up against Heartland that's like that.

Oh yeah.

Where, so on one hand, I have Apex just north of me. They have an Apex shop.

Okay.

And like their average ticket is very literally twice my average ticket. So like—

Which is great.

We love competing against them. It's awesome.

Yeah. And you know what's embarrassing?

Sometimes they still beat us.

Oh no.

Like we had, we interviewed one of their salespeople the other day and he walked in and he's like, hey, I followed you guys on this sale yesterday. I sold it for $5,000 more than you quoted. And we're like, oh my God.

Do you want a job? We did offer.

We did offer. We've been working with wesupplytrades.com for the past 10 years, but most importantly for the past 6 months as our primary vendor for HVAC supplies. And that's gonna be generic as well as some OEM. They have been a huge partner for us in our HVAC for restocking trucks, for getting packouts done on time and getting quick deliveries when we need it. Their free pro membership is going to give better pricing. It's free shipping for orders over $99, and you get access to a team of world-class experts that know plumbing, hydronics, and HVAC like the back of their hands. Like, these guys are incredible. As a savings to our audience, they offered 20% off your first order. If you use the code OWNED20, O-W-N-E-D-2-0. So click the link below or go to wesupplytrades.com/ownedandoperated to find out a little bit more. But on the other, like we have Heartland and Heartland does that thing. I know they do it in Chicago too, but they have like 10 brands in one city and they get competitive. I mean, they will throw down on pricing. They're slugging in like systems for like 6 grand if they have nothing going on.

And they have a good price. I think it comes down to your pricing model. I mean, I've never really popped the hood in really like 2 and 4 Seasons, but I'm sure they have— this is just an assumption.

Yeah.

But I think during slower months, they're a lot more competitive even on their highest points. On the peak months, they're really maximizing. But at the end of the year is what matters, right? Like, how do our margins look at the end of the year or trailing 12?

Yeah.

And they've done just a really good job. Yeah, it's tough. They they're a competitor in the home. Yeah, they they're good.

Yeah, that's funny. All right, so sounds like the deconstructing this four million dollar month. One, you have a stable revenue in plumbing, a million dollars a month.

Yep.

So like, I think that helps a lot.

Big time.

Yeah, big time. I I have friends down in DFW, and I see their like service Titan charts. Wild. Like HVAC only, right? And it's like we'll do like ten thousand dollars or you know that's exactly maybe a hundred. We'll do $100,000 and then we'll do $2 million. And like, it's that much of a swing. So plumbing gives you a nice stable— is electric in there too?

Electric's new. So we just launched electrical this year.

Okay.

Which, I mean, that's starting. I think we have 3 or 4 team members now over there. So that's really starting to project in the right direction.

All right, cool.

Yeah, but—

So a million of stability.

Yep.

Managing capacity and like being thoughtful about extra days. And mainly retaining capacity, it sounds like, during slow season. Like, how do we make sure we really do a good job there?

I think that I wanted— 2 things that I thought of as you were looping the information back is one thing that I think has really helped us maximize capacity these last couple of years in these peak times is like dispatch software.

Yes.

Like making sure that we used to have dispatchers that would, you know, right tech, right call. And they, you know, but now we use just software to automate that whole process of like, what should the next call be? Yeah, I think it's really helped our bandwidth.

Yes, um, because that's been a win for us too.

Yeah, that, that's been huge. Um, that's when I, I would say it pays for itself. Yeah, like 6 months of the year when it's slower, you can, you could build an argument. The other 6 months is when it really pays for itself.

Yeah.

Um, and the other thing that we've been super focused on that I want to make sure maybe to highlight is, um, retention rates of field pros.

Yes.

Is, um, I think that's where the magic is, is not only how can I pick up You know, like if you have all like we, you know, right now our HVAC service team that for service calls is 25 service technicians on HVAC.

Yeah.

But if I have to hire 25 new HVAC service techs every year, like our performance at a conversion rate, at a customer quality options, like all that's going to be in the tank.

Yeah.

And so it's not only how can I flex up, but like really what we've been keep.

Yeah.

How can we retain these 25 members?

How are you thinking about that? Yeah, that's a gap for us. Like, our turnover in HVAC service is a consistent challenge.

It is because of the seasonality. It's the damn seasonality.

And it's a lot of guys like leaving industry or like, oh, I want to go to sales. You know, it's like different, uh, and it's tough.

That— and that's the— that is the hardest. And so some things we've done around it is, um, really creating career— like, I would not say that we have it nailed. But the thing that we've been super focused on the last 2 years is career progression for our field pros. Is like, as someone joins us today is, you know, and they might come from a local trade school or a local community college, is how can we take them from no experience, a level 1?

Yeah.

And how can we not subjectively but objectively make them into a level 5?

Yeah.

And we fell into a trap. I wouldn't say trap, but like one of the challenges 2 years ago was We— because we're, you know, when people join us, like, our purpose is to expect more.

Yeah.

And we're a growth organization. And so we were always thinking like, hey, the next step is, is being a leader. Like, that's important. We need leaders. And so that's also a focus. But we've taken a step back and said not every technician needs to become a leader and not every technician needs to become a level 5.

Yeah.

It's your journey and it's just our job to like shepherd that journey to wherever they want to be. And so that's something we've been focused on. Our leaders today, they made like literally booklets that says like once you install, you know, 10 humidifiers, you're competent, you get it, you get a stamp. But really taking an objective approach into like how can we develop our team members? Because, you know, if a team member wants to make a dollar more, is I think it's our job as leaders to show them how to make a dollar more, but just not give them a dollar more. Otherwise, you know, everyone's gonna, um, just think, hey, you know what, I woke up today, I want a dollar more.

Yeah.

Um, but it's our job to say, hey, if you want that, you want to make more money, here's a path to make more money and kind of guide them.

Yeah, it's been a big focus for us too. What we're trying to— well, one, the retention side. So yeah, this was helpful. What we're trying to nail down is how many people do you have on the team?

Uh, for HVAC or just the total company? Uh, I think we're around, uh, Well, this might be a story for a different day. So we're at about 145 and we're in the middle of adding 2 new partner groups to our team. One will add 14 members, which is Tuesday, and then another is another 10 team members August 1st. So we'll probably be around 160 here in the next month.

Yeah, it's one of the benefits of HVAC. But like, yeah, so we're 160, but obviously like plumbing is like a big part of it. But what we're finding is like 160 is a lot of people. Yeah. And people get kind of lost in there and or they feel lost in there. And what has been hard is like pointing out like where you can grow. So like where can you start? Where can you grow? And we've been really blessed because of nearly all of our leaders so far have been promoted from into leadership. And that's like from the director level To the frontline leader level, like they have been promoted up to there, which is really cool.

Yep.

But we had we had someone almost quit two weeks ago, and this is something we've been working on for like a year of like career laddering and progressing. How do we map it? How do we show it? How do we like you know help people on their journey? And it was a good wake-up call to the team of like hey this needs to be front burner like really quickly because we had someone almost leave and they're like well I just got this opportunity over at this other place. It's like what I want. They wanted an inside sales position. And it's like, we have, like, we have that.

Yeah.

Like, we have that. We have 4. We'd love a 5th. Like, how— why don't we just talk about that? Like, how did, how did we lose the fact that, like, you can progress your career here just inside a slightly different team than what you're used to?

Yeah.

So that's something we're trying to nail down. It's like, where can you grow vertically? Where can you grow horizontally? And like, what are all the opportunities inside a team that's 160 people?

How have you thought about bridging that gap of like lateral movements? Because sometimes people think like it's always up and up and up, but sometimes people want to just move laterally from maybe a service tech to an inside sales. Have you thought— I mean, it's been a week, it sounds like. Have you thought about like how to help bridge that gap? Well, a lot of that's a challenge for us too.

Yeah, I think it's how we map it. So I wish I could put the picture up, but it— what we did is we created a map that shows it. So like, here's where you start. So you can start as a coordinator, and like I think some of this is titling strategy.

Yeah.

So like what's a supervisor? What's a coordinator? What's a manager? What's a director? What's a senior manager? So like nail that down. But where can you start? So you can start as a coordinator. You can start as an apprentice. You start as an individual contributor. So those three things are where you can start, and then the next level you are a technician, a CSR, a dispatcher inside sales, and those are basically the four options that. That you can be. Then the next layer is, well, you're going to be a senior tech, you're going to be sales, you're going to be a supervisor, and then you're a frontline manager. And there's 2— are you, are you a senior frontline manager, inside frontline manager, outside frontline manager? And then finally director. So it's like it starts at 3, goes to 4, goes to 3, goes to 2, goes to 1. Yep. And it sort of shows where you can move, but it's designed in a way that like you can imagine your horizontal movement too, because it's just right there. It's like, okay, well If I'm a senior tech, then here's the other option. I can move to sales.

Yep.

And that's a horizontal movement for me, which is great. I could potentially move to inside super, which like we've never had anyone try that, but like that is in the same tranche of seniority.

Yeah. Yeah. I think that's something we're going to be focused on. I actually, I remember picking your brain on this. Yeah.

I remember a picture once it's done. Like we're, we're, we had to map it out in our heads.

Yep.

So clearly that we could wrap a wall with it. Because what we want to be able to do, we're really intentional about our interview process and like walking people through the building. We want to be able to stop at this wall and talk about it for a minute or two. Like, hey, it's called Here's Where You Can Grow. So like, here's where you can grow with Wilson. This is the position you're applying for. Like, let's check out like, oh yeah, check that out. And then ideally we put in like potential earning.

Yeah, with each position, because that's the important part is they want to see what they can make too, right?

But we want people to know that they can just like, hey, this can be the end of your career. Like this can be it. There's a lot of different seats here. We have 25 titles. You can just land here.

Yeah, yeah, that's a— I think that's a gap we have is, um, because like we're a growth organization, you're a growth organization. Like we're both— me and you've had this conversation where we're like really in stride to stay Step for step is like—

Well, you're beating me, but yeah.

No, no, no. Um, is how can we— yeah, we— how— I guess what I'm thinking about right now is how can we— we're going to retitle everything. Is like right now we have everyone just listed as manager and we don't have like a great strategy around titling, but we haven't needed it until this point. But I think we're starting to kind of reach our capacity with that.

Yeah.

Um, one thing we've been focused on is, uh, cascading messaging.

Yeah.

And so like, how can we— I mean, you had this conversation as we were walking in with EOS and scaling up is, is, you know, we self-implemented EOS, which I would encourage everyone to hire a facilitator. They range in all different costs, at least for your first year. Like, don't self-implement. We did it. Learn from my, my, my challenges. But now after 5, 6 years, we've gone to scaling up because one of the challenges we were trying to overcome is like All right. What's the company mission? What are the different locations' mission to help support the company mission? And then how does that cascade all the way down to the frontline team member on how they can feel they're contributing towards the company mission? So that's been a huge focus of ours. And then really we've redone all of our bank partners and a lot of our professional services has been a kind of a focus and maybe for a different day as well. Conversation for a different day.

Yeah, we're like beginning that journey and It's annoying.

It is. It is. Yeah. I— the bank one, I looked at like I started conversations a year ago and yeah, and we're just now kind of coming to, you know, the—

It feels like, yeah, yeah, we have— we've started opening the conversation and like they're trying to like rush it along and I'm like, I don't— I don't think we can. Yeah, we're talking about like $5 million of like debt. We're talking about like Treasury. Like we can't. Yeah, you can't.

They're just trying to lock you in as fast as possible. They don't want you to shop it. Yeah. Yeah. Good salespeople.

Yeah, I tell my daughter good urgency.

I tell my daughter this when we were driving here is is with the especially on the bank side. You know everyone has like a VP of like a VP title of some sort. I'm like Mac at the end of day is I said you know they're customer relations people at the end of the day. Like don't get hung up on the title side.

Yeah, that's funny. This was awesome, man. So we so I'm gonna repeat the the big wins on four million a month because that's crazy. That's amazing.

Appreciate that.

A million, like stable revenue somewhere. There's stable revenue. So in this case, it's plumbing.

Yep.

Strong membership base. Really making sure we're retaining our team, and that's like tactically what's their schedule look like, and strategically what do their careers look like? And then just being really thoughtful about like adding additional days and increasing capacity when the When grass is growing.

Yeah. And I think that's 100% it. The last thing that comes to mind is we used to do this. I just want to throw this out there is like, it's hot right now. We know it's hot. We've seen it's going to be hot forever. And back in 2015 when I was a service manager, I'd say like, hey, it's Friday. Any chance you can work tomorrow? Is not being like so by the hip. Make sure that you're having that conversation on the front end of the week or even before the month begins. June's always hot and busy. It's like just have your team prepared. Don't just ask them on Friday to work tomorrow.

Yeah, that's a good call. We got in the habit of doing it like every Tuesday we send out messages, but you're right, like we should have done it in May for June. Yeah, so we're behind the ball.

All good.

This was awesome. Thanks for coming on.

Thanks, man. Thanks for having me.

If people want to get a hold of you and like bother you and ask you questions and stuff, how can they do that?

Yeah, I appreciate it. Yeah, Twitter, man. Yeah, so I've been trying to be more active on, on that.

Welcome to the club.

Yeah. It's an awesome community. It's a good community. I love it.

Yeah, it's good. It's robust.

Yeah. And I feel like you're getting raw information there. Like it's not filtered through.

Yes, definitely.

So yeah, you can find me on X. I don't know my handle or name at the moment.

We'll link it.

Appreciate that, man.

Cool. If you like what you heard, make sure you like and sub and check out ownedandoperated.com for more.

Thanks.