Building a Business Without Losing Your Soul | People Magic Summit with Ryder Carroll

Foreign. Hello, my friends, and welcome to our third session of today. I am so excited to be back. I already saw someone. I think it was Lakeisha in the chat that was like, I'm back. Oh, yep, I'm seeing it now. I'm back for session three out of three. Feeling grateful and ready to go. Yes, Lakeisha, me too, girl. I am ready. I'm so ready to do this. And what's so exciting about this next session is we're going to transition just a tad in regards to ensuring that we're continuing, encouraging each and every single one of you, motivating each and every single one of you, and helping produce the confidence that we know is in you to bring out of you that future community, that future course, that future event, that future vision that you see for yourself. And this session is definitely going to just add necessary layers to that to help you out as much as possible. So it's going to be good. For those of you who weren't here at the beginning, in the introductory session when we first opened up and went live, just want to take a second to introduce myself. I'm Angel Marie. I have the incredible pleasure of being one of People Magic's host throughout the entire summit this week. So you will see me here and there at the introductory sessions, the ending sessions, and then interviewing some incredible speakers for you in between. So I'm super, super excited and just can't wait to engage and interact with each of you in the comments section as we go about this. Okay. All right, my friends, who's ready? Can I just see some fire in the chat? Like, just tell me that you're ready. Tell me that you're pumped. Tell me that you're excited. I know that as the day continues on, whenever you attend a live experience, I know sometimes we kind of get tired. Some of you just might got done eating lunch. You might be hitting that afternoon slump. I feel. Feel you. I get it. Believe me, we want to bring that energy back and we're going to continue to do so throughout the rest of the day. So, yes, give me that fire in the chat. What's up, Monica? Ariane, good to see you. Dorothy, Bill, Carolyn. Yes. I love it. So, so good. Let's get started, guys. Without further ado, I want to invite Ryder into the room so that we can dive into a very heartfelt, necessary conversation. It's going to be so, so good. Ryder, how's it going today?

It's great. Happy to be here.

Good.

Oh, I'm so glad to hear that. So just to Set expectations for all of you that are in the room. Ryder and I are specifically going to have a conversation about how you can build a business without losing your soul. That's right. We're going to get a little deep. We're going to. We're going to focus on the internal because Ryder knows better than anybody that that is necessary and in order to build and to sustain the business that each of you seek in 2025 and moving on after the fact. Okay, so it's going to be so good. So we're going to dive into conversations in regards to guiding you guys through aligning your business and community with deeper purpose. And yes, we want to talk about actions and how you can do that, specifically purpose driven actions and systems, just to help you guys as specifically as possible and to have you walk away with those key takeaways. But we're also going to talk about the mindset. We're going to talk about the internal so that that is reflected in the business that you each are going to be producing. So it's going to be good. All right, Ryder, let's go ahead and dive in. I would love for you to kick us off by talking about what you are most known for in the online space, which is the bullet journal. So for those of us that are in the room and who may not know much about that, I'd love to hear your story behind what that is.

Sure. So, as you said, I'm known for being the founder of the bullet journal method, which I like to think of as a mindfulness practice that works like a productivity system. So not only does it help you organize what you have to do, but it keeps you aware of why you're doing what you're doing. And we recommend that people start with pen and paper. So that also puts us in a very particular niche, especially in the online space.

I love that. Oh, that's so good.

And what. What is your story in how the idea of you wanting to create this journal method for people, how did that come about? I'd love to hear your background story behind that.

Sure. So I grew up with pretty severe learning disabilities back before the Internet was a thing. So I'm dating myself a little bit. But essentially I was diagnosed with what was then known as add, but there was no resources available to me, so I had to design my own using the only tools that I really had, which were pen and paper. So I tried to figure out ways to become more focused and productive, and most of the things didn't work. Most of the things I Tried, didn't work. Especially the things that people are trying to kind of shove down my throat. Like, you learn this way, you study this way, you organize yourself this way. It didn't work the way that my mind worked. So I developed something that was much more flexible and forgiving, but still had just enough structure. And every once in a while, something did work. This is the way I could take notes in a certain way. This is the way I could organize my thoughts, my feelings. And over time, a system started to evolve. And then in college, I actually started studying actual graphic design and systems thinking. And that actually went back into the way that I organized my life. And then when I graduated, I started working in the web space, in the early web space, and really started thinking about interactive systems and structures. And a lot of those methodologies went back into how I organized my life. And then at some point, I was working at a place that my friend had actually gotten me this job. And then she was planning her wedding at work, obviously, and her desk covered in post it notes and just like color swatches. And she was just really very stressed out, very disorganized. And I. I don't know what came over me, but at some point I'm like, hey, I have a way of organizing myself because your desk looks like my brain and it works. So if you want to, I'm happy to walk you through it. And then as soon as I said it, I regretted. I'm like, why would I offer this to somebody? Like, this is the, the crutch for my mind that, you know, over and over and over again people told me, like, you know, know, you don't know how to think. You are not productive, you are not organized. Right? So for me, it was kind of like revealing the way that I snuck through to this job, to this place in my life. And so we sat down a week or so later, and it took me like 45 minutes to explain to her how I thought. I don't know if you ever tried that before, but that is not something that comes naturally. This is how I think.

It doesn't work too well that often.

No, not at all. So I stumbled through the whole thing. And then when I looked up at her, she was just like looking at me with her mouth hanging open. I'm like, oh, no, she thinks I'm completely crazy, you know. And the first thing she said was, you have to share this with people. And that was when everything kind of changed. And then I gradually, very gradually started sharing it with people. I'd share a tool here and a tool there. And the thing that I found interesting is that these tools that I would share with people, just like these different kind of mental models worked for very different kinds of people. So this was an accountant, this was a designer. A lot of people were organizing their lives on pen and paper. They just had no way of organizing pen and paper, if you will. So eventually, I sat down and actually thought about how to educate people in this methodology. And I picked a domain name and launched Bullet Journal. And I walked away from it. Like, literally, I just launched the website. And I was like, that's it. I'm finished. I just want to show people how this works. I had learned a lot from the Internet from for free. People share their knowledge for free. And I'm like, this is my little way of showing you how I organize my life. I hope it's helpful. And some people did. Some people thought it was really helpful. And then all these little communities started forming. And then before I knew it, it became a real thing and went viral. And, yeah, here we are almost 11 years later. Wow.

Oh, my goodness.

That is so empowering in so many different ways. So there's a couple of things that stood out based off of all the incredible things that you shared in your story. The thing that stood out to me was that you had mentioned that the idea of creating the Bullet Journal method, something that transpired into a community, something that went viral, something that is helping a lot of people, which started off unintentionally. Right? Something that was that. It. It. It all started from you trying to find solutions for yourself and trying to get advice from other people, but it just didn't work for you. And I'd love to lean into that a little bit because I think a lot of us in this room can relate to that. Like, how many of you. And feel free to just shout out a me in the chat. How many of you can relate to you trying a method from what other people are telling you, but not being able to implement that method or feeling like it just wasn't working for you? And you might have gotten to this mental point of being like, is there something wrong with me? Like, why. Why does this seem to be working for other people but not me? I just. I want to set a very resonating, like, feel between me, Ryder, and you guys in the chat right now, because this. This does not just happen for. For you. You are not alone in this. This is a thing that. That can occur. And what is so inspiring about Ryder's journey is that instead of Allowing that to possibly defeat him to the point where he was like, okay, well, nothing anyone is telling me is working, so maybe I just need to give up on this in general. He found a solution. He created it himself. So, Ryder, I'd love to ask just to enhance on that. I'd love to ask. Did it take some confidence being able to pull out of you? Okay, let me just put the time and effort into figuring out what can work for me when it comes to journaling and getting organized. Did it take, like, a certain level of finding confidence or finding intentionality to take action in that?

I don't think I had a choice, right? So for me, it was like, I had a very loving and supportive family. No siblings, just my parents, who were both teachers who also both struggled in school. So I was fortunate enough to grow up in a place where the main message wasn't you have to succeed. It was, you have to try your best, and everything else is out of your control. Right? So that completely changed my context, which was great because everybody else told me I couldn't succeed because I had dyslexia, which wasn't true, or I had this, or I was just stupid or whatever. It was like there was just so much disbelief all the time, and I just refused to buy into that. I guess I was like, okay, so either I buy into their version of my reality or I create my own reality, if you will. I know there's more there. Right. I just couldn't believe that. So I had to figure out how to make it work. I mean, also in school, like, it was a little bit different because, like, you either pass the class or you don't. You have to figure out how to study. You have to figure out how to do the homework. And that was a really, really intense time for me because I went to a school where it was kindergarten through senior year, right? So I could see the difference in my evolution as opposed to my peers. Like, it was very different how I did in class as opposed to they did. So I had to figure it out. I just had to fig out and that. That it took forever. You know, it's a. Still. It's. It's. It's still an ongoing process, but something changed. So when I got to college, a big thing that changed is I could start to apply these things towards things that I actually was interested in. Right. In college, you could pick some of the classes that you were interested in. All of a sudden, I could actually really not only meet the. The expectation, but surpass it tremendously. Right. And Then the more I was able to believe in myself, the more I was able to really focus on the things that lit me up. The system really superpowered me. So there's two real inflection points there. One is I had to get through. The second one is like, oh, wait a second, now I can actually thrive. And then there's like, a last part where I got exactly what I thought I wanted and it wasn't it, which was the real turning point in Bullet Journal's story, which was a professional part, which we can get into in a bit. But I don't think it was confidence so much as, like, just needing to figure out a way to get by at first. And that only got me so far. But then it got. Then there was a very hard end to that.

Oh, that's so good.

Yeah. Yeah. I definitely want to dive deeper into the professional aspect of that here soon. What I love most about what you said is that it wasn't like a flip of the page where all of a sudden, oh, yep, you have the solution. Everything's good now. It took time. It took, it took genuine processing and progress through that. Would you say that the key was knowing that you needed the solution? So because of that, there really wasn't a choice to give up on it because you were the only one to deliver the solution that you needed for yourself? Would you say that that's where you were at?

I think so. Seth Godin put it in a great way. I forget where exactly was, like, there is no lifeboat. Right? There's no, there's nobody coming, you know? And I felt that way as well. Like, again, I had some people in my life that were really cheering me on, but they couldn't do more than that. And that already gave me a leg up just having some people believe in me regardless of who I was. Right. But I, I, I learned early on that if I don't figure it out, it's just not going to happen. It's not going to work, you know? Right.

So that's so good. Yeah, that is so good.

Something else that I thought was so powerful in the story that you shared previously was that you were your own case study. Almost like you knew you needed a specific solution. If you found it, you implemented it into your own life. And then your friend who was planning her wedding at her desk, which is like, the best, by the way. I love that for her, you were like, oh, hey, I, I actually do this. Maybe this can help you too. Like, you didn't, you weren't necessarily desperate for People to implement what, you know, worked for you, but you were just open minded of like, hey, I think that this can work. And that one person, that one person was proof in and of itself that this can help multiple people from all around the world. Um, and, and I'd love to talk about that because I'm sure so many of us in. We feel like we have all these ideas in us. Right? All these ideas in us that might, that we might just be keeping to ourselves. Inside of your creative brain, you know you want to do it, you know you want to put it out there in this world. But something might be holding you back, whether it's fear or confidence or time, and you're just waiting for the right time. And I think rider story and just sharing it with one person can help you develop that confidence and honestly develop the proof. If you want to say that, that you need of like, oh, wow, maybe this, maybe this actually can be helpful for people. Maybe this actually can work. Ryder, do you have anything in regards to like, how that made you feel when that one friend was like, wow, you need to share this with other people?

Yeah. I mean, for the longest time I just thought she was being nice. Right. Because I took the time to explain this thing and I was obviously quite embarrassed by the whole process because again, this was the first time I like literally opened my mind to somebody and there was a lot in there. Yeah, I think it's, it's. It started with that, but then I tried it on again and again and like little sample sizes. I think that I gained confidence when I saw that it worked over and over again. But that again, this was never a product idea. This was never a company idea. It's just this is something that helped me. Right. It's like holding the door open for somebody else like that. It was in that arena. Not like I'm going to turn this into something. Even after I launched it, I didn't think about turning it into something for another year. So it was just really trying to be useful. That was it. And as a designer, I think that for me everything has been around, how do I make things useful? That was what I did. Before Bullet Journal, I was a user experience designer for digital products. And that's what we do. We try to make life easier for people. And it just so happened that the ultimate app that I designed was with pen and favorite.

So.

I love that.

That, that is, that is absolutely incredible. I see Jordan in the chat and I want to highlight this because this is such a powerful comment. Jordan, in the Chat said he became a leader by being a servant. Yes, Jordan, yes, yes, yes. I love that so much. Because leadership comes with your ability to serve first. And one of the best ways that you can serve is taking that amazing idea that you have in your mind, that first thing that you know that you want to start, and you know that 2025 can be such a great way for you to finally do that. You taking the time to say, you know what? How can I serve people that need this? How can I serve people around me? How can I serve people in my future community that could be greatly influenced or encouraged by what I know, by what has worked for me, by what has worked for my friends based off of the advice that I gave them? That is just so powerful. Thank you so much for sharing that in the chat. Okay, Ryder, you had mentioned earlier this. This transition into the professional aspect in the bullet journal method. Method, I believe, and I feel like now is the perfect transition into it, because when I was preparing for you and I to chat today, I saw a recent Instagram reel that you had put up where you were kind of sharing the story behind how you used to have, like, two normal journals before the bullet journal really became what it is today, where you had, like, a personal journal where you would write personal things and goals, and then you would have a professional journal. Professional things and goals. And I thought it was interesting because in that video, you were like, the problem with having two separate journals in. In this. The power behind journaling was you would go to work with your professional journal, but you would be thinking about personal stuff. And now it's like, oh, well, where do I write that? So I'd love to hear more of your story behind it and how that prompted you to kind of combine both into what is today the bullet journal method.

Yeah. So as you said, I got tired of, like, thinking about where to write what down. And then another thing happened that I didn't share in that reel, which I think will bring us up to speed, which is the way that I was journaling at that point. I collapsed the two things together at some point. Right. Like, this is the one book where I write down everything. And it allowed me, after years of development, you know, after decades of developments, like now, I finally got what I wanted. I was able to become focused and productive, which I wasn't as a kid much of my life, but now I did, and I got the raise, I got the promotion. Like, all this worked, and it worked for other people that I hadn't shared it by this point. But it helped me become hyper productive. And then I realized that that productivity felt quite empty. And at some point I'd ask myself, like, why am I doing all this stuff? Why do I want to become more focused and productive? Like, what's the point of this? What do I actually want? And at that point in my career, I didn't have an answer. I had launched my own company, I had made the money that I wanted, all the things, and none of that seemed to matter. And for the first time I was like, why am I doing any of this stuff? And that's when I realized that I had a perfect tool. Like, the Bullet Journal is a paper mirror. It reflects your life back at. Right. So if you pointed at your career, it will reflect your career back at you. If you point it at yourself, reflect your life back at you. And that's when I started to develop this sensibility of like, what brings me up, what brings me down, how do I feel about what I do? And that's when everything changed. Right. That's when they went from being like purely productivity based to being much more mindful, if you will, why am I doing what I'm doing? And that's really where I think the community aspect of Bullet Journal became very interesting to me. So in my own progress, somewhere along that transition for me, I launched Bullet Journal. And then trying to think about how I can best serve what was happening with this thing that I put out in the world.

That's so good.

Yeah, I'd love to dive into that transition for you. That transition between you put out the Bullet Journal, it was coming to be a success. And then transitioning that into the Bullet Journal community for people to be a part of, to have conversations, be a part of events and things like that. What was that transition like for you to take something you already created and to expand it into something that you knew could be valuable, such as a community.

Yeah, so actually it's a little bit the other way around. The community taught me that it could be be valuable. So when I published Bullet journal, it was 2013, as I said, I just made a website. It got picked up by a bunch of people. So I got a lot of hits. But all of a sudden the thing that was really interesting is I saw all these different kind of disparate communities picking it up like Bullet Journal for veterans or for teachers or for students or for nurses. There are all these communities, lives that I had no experience with. We're using this tool to help them navigate their own experience, their own stories. And that to me was completely unexpected, right? Especially when I saw like bullet journal for adhd. I was like, oh, you know, like a community had formed around my own thing and I could serve them a little bit better. But it became clear to me that I was onto something here. So in 2014, I started a website that focused mainly on actually bringing other people's bullet journal experience to the surface. And so I did that for a while to showcase what it could be to different people. And in that time, what happened was that bullet journal kind of went viral big time. And then the more people learned about it, the more and more distant it got from the source, if I can say it that way. So soon I would start like getting emails from people like, hey, your bullet journal class sucked. I'm like, what class? Or like, this community didn't work. I want my money back. And I have no idea what you're talking about, right? So people had started to kind of like hop on to this trend at the time and teaching people a bunch of nonsense. And that. That to me was a point where I'm like, okay, something has to happen here. And then like, I would see how people were sharing it and what they were talking about. Like, a big part of the bullet journal method is that it is very much about self expression, but within a very specific container. Because without that, it just becomes either a scrapbook or a regular journal. Behind the bullet journal method, there is a real architecture. So for me, at some point I started to see what was also. Not only was there a lot of misinformation, but also on a lot of social media, where a lot of these communities were, there was the algorithms and a lot of trolling and just a lot of toxic culture. Especially in bullet journaling. A lot of what I found so touching is how vulnerable people would get. And they talk about like mental illness or people like, you know, that were dealing with medical conditions or their own struggles, and then somebody would pipe in with something completely toxic or unhelpful. That was really hard for me, right? Like people are opening their heart online, which is already incredible. And I. There was obviously a need there to connect with other people because there are incredible people there. This community that I had nothing really to do with, that was self organized, was creating all this incredible opportunity for each other. There was just a lot of noise and a lot of misinformation, as I was saying before. So I'm like, I think it's time for me to create a space for people where I take away the algorithms and the ads and all that stuff and give them the most accurate information based on my own experience. Right. Like, I. I want you to share what you've learned from each other within the container of this thing that has worked for, at that time, hundreds of thousands of people. Like, yes, I invented it. And then we have hundreds of thousands of use cases where this works. It works because of the framework. So, you know, you get creative within the rules. So just a home for this community that, you know, seem to be getting a lot of value from this. And that's what inspired me to create a space for it.

Oh, that's so good.

And. And in the space that you're currently running today, I. I'd love. I'd love for people to hear how that is being ran, because what's interesting is your. That journaling, in and of itself, people tend to see it as more of a solitude exercise. That's something they do themselves rather than in community or a paid community. And I love this question from Jane, who's asking about what your weekly calendar looks like within the community space that you created. She's mentioning she's curious how people are interacting with each other in that space, since journaling is so individual and can oftentimes be seen as more of a solitude kind of thing. So I'd love to hear your thoughts in how you've created the safe space for people to come together and what that weekly calendar looks like.

Yeah.

Okay. So there's a couple things there. I know how to create a space, but I don't know how to run it. So the first thing is that I wanted to find somebody who could do that for me. And I found this tremendous person, Jessica, who runs it for me, who comes from an educational background. She's really good with people. Something that I'm, like, okay with. I'm an introvert, so, like, being constantly involved in the community is not something that I'm good at. Right. So I wanted to figure out a way where I can actually have somebody who brings the kind of energy that I want. And the thing about the. The solitary versus public nature, bullet journaling is very. Yes, journaling is part of it, but it's. It's really a read and write and read sort of exercise. So the whole point is you're not just writing things down. You're learning from your own experience, and chances are you're going to learn something from it. A big part about bullet journaling is surfacing insight. And a lot of those insights can be transformative and they can be confusing, and they can Be exciting. So there is this point where you're like, well, what do I do with this? So having a community there where you discuss those kinds of moments or also really tactically, it's like, well, how do I organize this problem specifically or this challenge or I want to do this. Has anybody tried that before? For. Because it has a really strong organizational aspect to it, not just emotional. There is a lot of dialoguing to have, right? There's just a lot of creativity. And people like doing it together, right? They. They will learn from each other and then go off and do it and then come right back again and be like, hey, this worked, this didn't. And a lot of that had to do. A lot of that was organic. I would say those communities already existed. And I looked at what the most popular topics were within those communities, and then I found somebody who was really good at facilitating those things in terms of the weekly calendar. Like a big part of bullet journaling is learning ways to live a more intentional life. That's really the core of it all, to write a better life. And bullet journal is about writing a better life. Bujo u Our community is to write a better life together. So we try to figure out different kinds of programming that enable that, that go above and beyond. The thing about bullet journal, which is nice, is it's kind of a personal operating system, if you will. So we plug in all sorts of different apps, how to sleep better, how to move better. And that's not necessarily my thinking. Those are subject matter experts that focus on that and we show people how they can use that within the framework that I created. So we have book clubs, we have what we call experiments where try different ways to sleep better or to time block, things like that. So a lot of the programming is there to really live the information as opposed to just receiving information. Like, we want people to fully engage and have, you know, an empirical experience of what we're talking about.

Oh, that's so good.

I. I love that you're emphasizing on the fact that you aligned your weekly calendar in your community. You aligned what's available to them in the community, to what it is that they need based off of what you can teach them and what you can help them with. I think that that's fantastic. Now, in, in relation to your community members coming in, would you say that they would need to have experience with the bullet journal itself before they come in? Or could really, anyone who's interested in journaling or interested, interested in learning how to be more productive come into your community and learn about the Bullet journal there.

I think that we do our best to create kind of like what we call a zero state. It's like, oh, I heard about bullet journal. Oh, I like the idea of learning it with other people. Let's create that context as well, like a big part of the community. We also use it as our school, if you will. So it's not just people getting to know about each other, but we have different learning experiences that are more formal, self paced, live cohorts. So what will hopefully what we're doing well is creating a user journey where they can go from 0 to 100 and they find themselves wherever they need to. I guess it's always a work in progress though. I mean that's the thing. When you start running a community that works and it keeps growing, there's more and more use cases and, and we're always looking for ways for people to feel more and more at home and way find easier and you know, get them to what they're most interested in in the shortest period of time. And that's very different.

Yeah, yeah, that's so good.

To your point on sustaining a growing community, I know that your methods specifically thrive off of keeping things purpose driven, running a purpose driven business in order to create that sustainability for the community that you build, the, the course that you create, the event that you're putting on, anything like that, how would you, what would you say are like the red flags maybe to look out for when someone might be leading too much with that profit driven mentality over a purpose driven one. Because I think a lot of people at times they want to balance it, right? Like we want to hit six, seven figure communities, we want to reach that success and everyone in this room is capable of doing that. But at the same time, if we're forgetting about our purpose behind it, if we're forgetting about our why, like you mentioned earlier, then it doesn't create sustainability for our businesses to thrive in the long term. So I'd love to hear your thoughts on that, Ryder.

Yeah, I think you spoke to it a little bit before. I mean I know that back in the day a lot, lot of like my productivity was based like if I get all this stuff done, then I will be happy, then I will have the money, then I will be successful. And I understand why people do that. In my experience that's kind of backwards. Like what I want to try to do is bring the future into the present. So I'm consciously creating all the time and that begins with filtering my goals through My purpose or through my values. Like why does it need to be six figures? Why does it need to be any amount of money? Exactly. And get, and this is, this may seem very woo or esoteric, but when you actually ask yourself that strategically something really important happens. Like a lot of times we try to figure out how much time something will take. And time is money, it's energy, it's all that. When you start asking things this way, then you start asking a very different question. Like why does that get my time at all? Right? And all of a sudden many things that seem very exciting fade away very quickly when you realize like, okay, so getting six figures or six people in the six, getting many more people into the network is something a, that you may not be able to support and actually doesn't move your goal any closer to where you want to be. Move your company to where you want to be. Making more money does not necessarily a mean that you're making more profit because chances are the faster you grow, the more people you need. And so, so there, there are there. It's a good filtering mechanism to be very intentional about growth and change within the community. And I think that a lot of. For me, what's really important is to pay very close attention to the problems that my community is encountering in my field, right? Like what problem am I solving for them? Like, I don't use an advertising model of any kind inside the community, right? So like my, my audience needs to be served. Like that's, that's the whole point. How can I serve them best? And then what are, what problem are they facing? That's the why often, right? I want to serve the community. So like, okay, how can we solve this problem in a way that is obviously financially viable but that, that kind of drives it? Not just like some arbitrary metric. The metric is designed around creating like a clear guideline for growth or change.

Yeah, that's, that's fantastic.

What about some points that you brought up in regards to wanting to grow it, knowing that, okay, well if you want more you community members inside of the community that you eventually want to start, you're going to need some help to help you run it, to help you sustain it. I, I love this question in the chat here from Brian who's asking how did you have the confidence in yourself to allow someone else to run your community for you and at the same time just being able to, to sustain that so that the community can continue to thrive and grow?

I don't, I don't think I had the confidence in Myself, to run the community by myself. I. I think a big part about owning a business, being really honest about what your strengths are and what your weaknesses are. And I. I've tried to manage different communities in the past, right? Like their Facebook page or something like that. And it's just. I don't know, it just didn't feel like this was something I was particularly good at. Just. I was just answering questions all the time. But running a community is much more than that. I needed a facilitator, right? I needed somebody who could really engage with people and create a. For lack of a better vibe. And that's something I was confident I couldn't provide. So I was finding people like that. It's like, what am I not good at? That's what I try to hire into in general. And then as the community grows, you will start to identify people within your community that you love being around. It's like, this person is great. Every time they're in a session or they're doing something, people love it. And I love the way that they communicate with people. So then you get into a place where you can actually start bringing people from your community into the team as well, which is what we did. This is a person who's always engaging. This is a person who's helping others just because they're being a great person. They're just being a great actor inside your community. And I pay attention to that.

Oh, that's so good.

I love that so much, because I know a common thought for a lot of entrepreneurs and creators is how do I find the right person to help me run this business, run this community, to help me plan out this launch? And what I love so much about what you said is that a lot of times those people are right in front of you. Like you mentioned, you a lot of times hire people that are already in your community. They're the most engaged. They know the system backwards and forwards. They would be the perfect person to come onto your team. I love that. That's such a powerful point. I also. I also want to think through, what does it look like for having someone come on your team to help with the community? How do they engage versus how you engage? Cause I'm sure you're still in the community, engaging, and maybe for some events. So how do you find that balance between what they do versus what you do?

I think it takes time, right? So it wasn't like, I just hired this person and, like, walked away from it. And we talk. It's like, how can I best Serve the community. How can they best serve the community? And also, this really can't be understated, but I think a really powerful metric is joy in doing the work. There are things in a community that I really don't like doing. I'm very grateful for the people, obviously, but there are things that I'm just not excited about that she is. And then there's things that I do that she's not excited about at all. So, like, finding a good balance about what keeps this work fun and engaging for us. Because if we're not engaged, if we're not having a good time, neither are the people in the community. You know, if I show up, like, or they, you know, that that really translates, I feel like. And that's a powerful way of kind of divvying up who's doing what. It's like, do you like doing this? Yes. Great. I don't. And vice versa. And that that's what worked. And then there's, obviously, as the community grows, there's just, like, more complication. Then we find either more of me or more of her or somebody in between that goes with that. Like, the needs will start to surface really quickly.

Yeah.

Oh, that's so, so good.

I. I know a lot of times when it comes to building an overall community, we want to. We're so focused on joy and fulfillment of the members, right? Like, are they liking this? Do they want to upgrade to maybe this plan here? Are they enjoying this? And that's great because at that point, you're being more servant, driven by just thinking, what do they want? What do they want? How can I make them? But I love your point in how important it is to also make sure that you're fulfilled in the work that you're doing too. Because if you're not, then how can you show up as a successful leader in that space? How can you sustain the community that you intentionally built to help your community members? So I just think that that is so beyond powerful. Thank you for sharing that. That's so good. I. I want to talk about. We talked a little bit about how sometimes we get to a point of losing our why you had brought up. You kind of found yourself in a place of forgetting your why and needing to do the deeper work of like, okay, why am I doing this? Why am I really doing this? Which is what helped you to transition the bullet journal into that personal and professional aspect we were talking about. What would you say to people that are struggling with their why right now? Whether it's they're focused on like, oh, I'm worried about finances. I'm worried about this. This isn't working. They have doubts, they have fears that might all be overshadowing their why in the first place. Any advice there?

It's hard to give one piece of advice because those are very different problems, right? Like sometimes you have to make more money to make it work. And that's like a temporary thing. And I think that that's valid, right? Sometimes, like, we. This is the season where we gotta really, like, button up the business model. We're not going to be launching all sorts of fun new things. I think a big part of this is to make sure that you're clear on the problem that you're solving, right? And see if that's a problem that you want to continue to solve for the foreseeable future. Two things come up. One is that your why will change. I think that a lot of us, myself included, often suffer under this tremendous pressure to figure out your one thing. And that can be debilitating because even if you're passionate about something, you're like, well, it doesn't feel like my one thing. So I think it's fine for you to lose steam in one idea if something else comes up. I know that with my own business, like the bullet journal was one thing and now it's something else. And what allowed me to transition from one thing to the other is to let go of one purpose, to pursue something that was related but quite different in some way. So not holding on too much to your old why, I think is one to see if that still fits. That's fine. Let it go. Allowing yourself to feel fear, right? The whole idea is that a lot of times people won't do things because they're scared and waiting for the time where they won't be. And courage isn't the absence of fear. It's doing it because despite you being afraid, right? That's the whole thing. I think being clear on the problem that you're solving, being clear what is most alive for you right now is. Is also really important. So the problem can be more intellectual. What's alive for you is much more emotional. But, like, that's important. As I said before, like, paying very close to attention to your own state over time is absolutely critical for the sustainability of any business, because if you don't care anymore, it won't work. So just kind of paying very close attention to what you care about. Again, there's so many different pieces of advice depending on where you are in the state. Right. Yeah. I think that there's the. There's the season where you just got to get through it, and then there's a season where you also just got to let go. And it really depends on where you are in your journey. But, yeah.

Yeah, I love the authenticity behind that answer because I 100% agree. There are seasons where you gotta. Gotta push through, you gotta get through, and then there are seasons where you gotta let go. And I think that that right there is so powerful too, because a lot of times we struggle with letting go of what once felt good to us. Like, once, once in a lifetime, we had a why that felt good, and it gave us the motivation and the fire to do what we said we were going to do, to launch that community, that course, that event, whatever it might be. But then we might be questioning, why don't I have fire or passion for this thing anymore? And constantly trying to figure out why that is, when what you're saying, Ryder, is this is normal. Like, your why does evolve over time? Because you as a person are changing and growing, and what you're putting out into the world, therefore, is also going to change and grow. So I love that. It's really good.

Yeah, it's. I wish I could give a more clear answer, but that's just not real.

No, it's good. It's.

It's so good. It's so good.

Okay, so as you look ahead into 2025, we talked a lot about finding and keeping your why or just being okay with allowing that to evolve. We talked a lot about how to keep your business purpose driven, how to sustain a community, whether it's hiring people to come on your team and help you, making sure you have the right mindset when it comes to personal and professional development, things of that nature. I'd love to hear. What does 2025 look for you? Someone who took the bullet journal method, transitioned it into this incredible community. Do you see any other transitions happening for you again in 2025?

Yeah, certainly the nature of the bullet journal method is to evolve, right? So that. I don't say that to plug the bullet journal method, but it's great to be able to align your community with, like, the values that you have as a business in general. So I think a big part for us in 2025 is actually housekeeping. You know, like, we. We have all sorts of new products, all sorts of new services, different. Like, you know, it's been around for 11 years, so we have entirely new generations of people inside the community. So for us, it's about really refining what is there. And that's another reason why it's helpful to have people, because you can be a real echo chamber for yourself. But having other people be like, hey, this is what I'm hearing, your community there. And people are actually flocking to this thing that we didn't really think about and then taking a step back and just taking the time to reorganize what's already built. So in terms of the community, I think one thing that we're really going to emphasize is like creating more accountability structures because a big part of bullet journaling is to actually do the thing over and over again. So actually leaning into the benefit of a membership program, which is to be there and provide some kind of scaffolding so people can come together to practice. So that's a big one. And that's not necessarily a big new thing. It's about taking what we have created and elevating it.

Oh, that's so good.

Yes, I like this, I like that a lot because I'm, I'm sure you know of the, the shiny object syndrome where you see something shiny, oh, it looks good over there. Oh, this idea, let me try that. And then you completely forget about the idea that you originally said that you were gonna try and put out into the world. So I love your phrasing of just like, hey, it's not about like, oh, 2025 shiny object syndrome. It's about how can I evolve what idea I already have or how can I add on to it and make it an even better for the people that you serve in this world, but also for yourself just so that you can maintain that alignment, maintain your why and maintain that fulfillment. So that's really good. I see some fantastic questions in the chat. I'd love to take some time to go over those with you. Ryder, a good question here from Jordan is asking, just speaking of, you know, your future, your 2025, do you see yourself taking the bullet journal method to an in person conference or maybe even more in person meetups at all?

I would like to do that. And I actually just went to a summit that gave me a much better idea of what that would look like. I, I, I've, I've, I've stalled on it because I want to make sure it's something that I'm super excited about doing. Obviously I'm excited about meeting people, but I don't just want to do a meetup. I want it to be a real experience. And the answer's not clear yet, but we're getting there.

I love that we're getting there.

We're looking into it with very big eyes.

That's good.

Oh, that's fantastic. Super exciting. And again, that's just a future evolution. Like we're talking about the process of evolving something you already have, adding onto it that could just be another, not shiny object, but just adding on to what you already have. That's working. So I love that. That's great. Another question in here. How do you. Do you have a free and paid version of your community? And if so, how do you kind of work through the process of something that's so that has a lot of depth to it, such as journaling and getting clarity and people getting organized? How do you kind of figure out, okay, what should go in this paid version versus this free version, if you have them or have you thought about that?

Yeah, this was actually a really. A really difficult point for me of launching my Launch the community, because everything with Bullet Journal has been free, other than our products, obviously. But Bullet Journal is not a product, it's a methodology. That's something that often gets lost, like you can learn it in 10 minutes. And also, journaling is incredibly personal and incredibly powerful. So for me, I was like, do I create this free community? And honestly, the answer was no, for one very strategic reason. It filters out a lot of the things I was trying to get rid of. Right. People who just kind of come in and make a mess and leave, which happened everywhere. So we tried to make the membership as accessible as possible. It's all paid and there are tiers depending on what you're interested in. So we can. Can give people what they want, when they want it, and then in order to make it accessible for those who may not have the means, we also have member scholarships. So for every five people that sign up, we get one seat away for free. But it's also an application. I just want to really maintain the quality of the community as much as possible. So we're trying to, you know, make sure that everybody who's there is there with good intentions.

Oh, that's powerful. Oh, that's so good.

I. I once heard that you are the bank of your own business, meaning you get to decide price points, you get to decide scholarships you get, decide when that happens in order to create a more inclusive community for people that genuinely want to be a part of what it is that you have going on, no matter their financial situation, no matter their time constraints, things like that. I love that she said that. That's so good. And Speaking of the, the members that are coming in in the various paid tier options that you have, what is the current size of your community right now and the average membership duration that you're seeing?

So we have about 5,500 people in the community now. I'm not sure what the average membership duration is right now. This is one of the reasons why I have a community manager because looking at statistics, too much is also not great for my health. Because I mean, like when you start having numbers like that and you know, this can be an incredibly large number, comparatively small number, but there's fluctuation, there's always fluctuation and if you fixate on that, that reduces your fun.

Yes.

That's so good. Oh, I love that.

Oh, that's so amazing. Okay, I have a big question for you because I think that this is going to help a lot of people tune into themselves when it comes to the sustainability of running a purpose driven business in 2025. Because when I think about that personally, to sustain and to keep things purpose driven, I think a lot about narrowing it down to what my day to day even looks like. How intentional am I being day by day to ensure that I'm setting my business up for success, to be sustainable and to maintain it, being purpose driven so that I can feel fulfilled and the audience that I serve can feel fulfilled. So with that being said, Ryder, what does A Day in the Life look like for you? You have a wonderful mentality in how you approach business. I'd love to hear A Day in the Life behind Ryder.

Yeah, actually I would say that the closest approximation is something that Tim Ferriss talked about. I don't know if it's his line or something. I spend the very first part of my day taking care of myself because again, as a business owner it sounds really selfish and egotistical, but like you are your most valuable asset. Like if you're not working, nothing's working. That took me a long time to really get so take care of myself and then I create, I make eat, and then I manage. So the first part of the day is I get to make like for me, creation is something that really brings me joy. Maybe that's writing an article or writing a YouTube video or creating, working on a course. But it has to be something that's generative and creative. And then I have lunch and then after that I manage. So that's when dealing with emails, putting out fires, you know, actually adjusting dials, if you will. So that's the short version.

Yeah, that's great.

That's great. And what about. Because we all know in our, in our day to day at times we, we, we tend to have moments of maybe burnout. We tend to have moments of questioning certain things where doubts tend to creep in for you. How do you kind of stop those, those signs before they happen as a way to just help you remain afloat and to stay focused on your why?

Yeah, it's a good question. I want to be really honest about this. Like I experience burnout as well. Especially when, when you have a mission driven company and you really believe in what you're doing, often you come last. Right. You just put everything in front of yourself. And that's what I was saying before, that is not sustainable. So a big part of my own evolution is I track how I feel about what I do. So I have daily, weekly and monthly rituals as part of my, the bullet journal method. And I'm looking at what am I feeling, patterns in my feeling and in my thinking, both of which are important. Like if a lot of my thoughts are negative or alarming or my emotions are either, you know, I'm in hyper or hypo arousal somewhere most of the time it's like, hey, time to take a step back. If you're feeling this way, what's a way to deal with that? If you are having these patterns of, of thought, what do we do next? So really trying to be as diligent as possible with just checking in on my state before I figure out any kind of strategy that's so good.

I myself need to keep that in my mind every day, tracking what I feel about what I do and being consistent with that. Oh, that's so powerful. I love that. So with, with that mentality in mind, what are specific steps that you think people can take who are in this room right now? Specific steps they can take today, this week, this month, before the new year hits, in order to create a successful purpose driven business that's aligned with what they actually want to do, that's aligned with themselves. What are specific steps they can take?

I think one that goes understated a lot is to really get clear, clear on what your definition of success looks like. Is it the amount of people? Is it amount of time you get to work on it? Is it how much money you're making from it? Because if you're not clear on that, then you'll never be successful because you don't know. If you don't know what you want, you can't have it. I think that's a big one. For me, I know this is kind of a spicy take, but I also, if people are on the fence about should I like leave my job and dive in fully? I. What I submit for your consideration is that that's not necessary. Like a big part of this is that you can test it out. I mean, that's a beautiful thing with online tools. See if you, if you can start this before you take the plunge because afterwards you're going to have a whole bunch of different, very real concerns. Like, I think building a business while you have some kind of revenue is just really smart. That worked for me and a lot of other people. And if that's not the problem, you know, I think that creating an environment that you're excited about being in is really important. So whatever you do, chances are there was a point where you didn't have it or you really wanted it and it didn't exist exists. So that's why you're creating it. So trying to kind of channel that version of yourself by like, how could you have helped the younger version of yourself? How could you have been there for the person going through that thing? How could you have helped you get to where you are now faster and then like structuring the community that way so you can start really specific and strategically?

That's so good.

I know a lot of you are watching this right now, probably taking a lot of notes or even just feeling this sense of relief, almost like, wow, wow, you. I, I hope that this is what you needed because I'm even taking a lot from this session as well. Ryder, thank you so much. Thank you for showing up with authenticity and just being real when it comes to the mentality in approaching your business, when it comes to how to sustain it, when it comes to keeping it purpose driven while at the same time maintaining productivity. So that, that all was just amazing. Thank you so much, Ryder. We so appreciate you for being with us and sharing all of your insights. For those of you that are watching right here right now, we have our next session coming up in about 17 minutes. They will. Yep, Chloe already dropped the link in the chat for you. That is the link that you'll go to to be brought to the next session. However, you are going to be emailed the link to that next session session as well right at 3pM Eastern time. So grab some coffee, take a little meditation break, reflect on all the things that Ryder so graciously shared with us today and we will see you back here in about 15 minutes, my friends. Bye.

Thanks everyone.