766 Barbara Corcoran: Success in Business and Life

This is episode number 766 with the shark. Barbara Corcoran, welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. Henry Winkler said, assumptions are the termites of relationships. And Bill Gates said, it's fine to celebrate success, but it's more important to heed the lessons of failure. Welcome to this episode. We've got Barbara Corcoran in the house. Loved connecting with her. She is a wealth of information and such a generous guest, giving heart. And for those that don't know who she is, she's a very successful businesswoman, investor, speaker, consultant, author and TV personality. She began her career in the 1970s with real estate in New York City and really took the city over by storm, then became a television personality as known as a shark investor on ABC's hit show Shark Tank. And she also has a new podcast out that I'm loving. It's called Business Unusual. So much information and I wanted to get her off her normal talking points. So in the beginning of this interview, it gets a little interesting. It gets a little uncomfortable for her because I ask her questions about relationships. What I thought was pretty interesting, some of her responses, she's got so much experience in relationships in business, but I wanted to ask about personal relationships as well. So we discussed personal relationships and how it can affect you in your business. With the type of partner that you have, can the partner you have support you or hurt you in business? The power of reshaping the way you think about mistakes, how regret can quietly take down your confidence. And in my opinion, confidence is one of the key determining factors of you being successful. If you're not confident, then that's going to hurt you in the long run. So we talk about regret also, what the best qualities are for a successful entrepreneur and salesman, what she looks for the top two or three qualities to find an incredible salesperson. And she also shares who she thinks is the best salesman that she's ever seen. And she is not proud to talk about it, actually. But this was a fascinating story about the best salesman she's ever seen. The Kia Sportage Turbo Hybrid has a bold design, a spacious interior with 232 horsepower, and a 12.3-inch panoramic display to keep the adventure going and fit with the way you live. And with SiriusXM, every drive comes alive, bringing you closer to the music, the sports talk and podcasts that you love right in your vehicle or on the SiriusXM app. Every SiriusXM equipped Kia Sportage Turbo Hybrid includes a three month trial so the experience begins the moment you drive. Learn more@kia.com Sportage Hybrid Kia Movement that inspires this message is brought to you by Apple Card It's a great time to apply for an Apple Card. You'll love earning unlimited daily cash on every purchase. That includes 3% daily cash when you buy the latest iPhone, AirPods and Apple Watch at Apple through this special referral offer. When you get a new Apple Card, you can earn bonus daily cash. To qualify, you must apply at Apple Co getdailycash Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs bank usa Salt Lake City. Branch offer may not be available elsewhere. Terms and limitations apply. The best B2B marketing gets wasted on the wrong people. So when you want to reach the right professionals, use LinkedIn ads LinkedIn has grown to a network of over 1 billion professionals, including 130 million decision makers. That's why LinkedIn has the highest B2B ROAs of all online ad networks. Spend $250 on your first campaign on LinkedIn ads and get a free $250 credit for the next one. Just go to LinkedIn.com Lewis that's LinkedIn.com L E W I S Terms and conditions apply. Big thank you to our sponsors today and I'm so excited about this one. So let's dive into this all about how to master sales success in life, love, relationships and everything else with Barbara Corcoran.

All right, welcome back to the School of Greatness podcast. We've got Barbara Corkin in the house. So good to see you. I'm so glad you're here.

So good to see you too.

We met for about five seconds about four, three or four years ago. I was on the Today show in the green room.

Yes, I remember.

And you were in the green room as well. And I just came up and said hello and you said you flirted with me then, like you flirted with me now. I flirted with you and told me I was like tall and handsome and I was like, okay, this is gonna be so true. I appreciate it.

Thank you.

But every time I've interacted with you and every time I've seen your online, your content, you always bring positivity and you just say it how it is. You've been telling me how it is before the interview about relationships, which I appreciate. And you always are very kind and Generous. So I just want to acknowledge you for that before we start.

Thank you. But you're not married to me.

Not married to me.

I've got another side. Talk to my uncle.

Oh, really?

Oh, yeah.

Dark side, huh?

Well, not a real dark side, but my positiveness isn't 24 7, I can tell you. Yet.

Okay, what's the angriest you've ever been in your life?

The angriest I ever was was being angry with my husband, Bill, because he was inconsiderate. And I can't even remember what was bugging me, but it was on Christmas Eve. And I punched him.

No way.

Hard, with all my might.

In his chest?

No, no, no, no. His chest. But he's a big guy.

So what did it feel like, a flea? Like touching him?

No, I got a good. I got a good connection in there. But then he left. He drove away. And I thought he was driving out of my life. I panicked. But he came back two hours later, totally dressed as a goalie, a hockey goalie with mask pants. And he walked in. I thought he was gone, but. And I hear him in the driveway. Oh, God, he's back. Like a young girl. Oh, God, he's back. And he walks in, fills the door frame, goes. Hit me. Now I can't feel anything, baby.

Wow.

And I had to, of course, roll over. And I don't even remember what I was angry with, but I loved him twice as much for the moment. Until the next argument.

Till the next argument.

Wow.

You don't remember what the argument was or. It's irrelevant.

It was something inconsiderate about my sister who would drive anybody crazy. But I thought he should be a little bit more phony or be more tolerant.

Wow.

So instead I became the intolerant, mean spirited woman and took it out on him.

When a woman gets mad at their partner. A man partner.

Yes.

How should a man respond in that situation? Should they leave and come back with pads on? Should they take it and let them punch them emotionally or physically or, you know, whatever it may be. Should they?

Well, it depends if you're a smart man or not. Okay. If you're a smart guy, what a woman really wants to hear is that she's right. So the quicker you can accept the fact that she's right, whether you feel it in your heart or not, the happier the woman's going to be. And then if you can move right on to what attracted you in the first place and what you love about it and deliver it in a most sincere way, then you're ahead of the game versus falling down the pike, you know, wow.

You think that'll typically work? If the person says, okay, you're right, and here's something I love about you.

Or let me tell you, ask any happily married man who's been married for years how he stays happy and almost two out of three will tell you. I tell my wife, she's always right. And that's the secret to a happy marriage.

Crazy.

Yeah. Well, that maybe sounds old fashioned, but that has really been my practical observation as well. My husband's very good at saying you're right much faster as the years go by. And that's what I want to hear. Because, you know, I'm always right.

Sure, sure. I think I've heard that before where men say, you know, I'd rather be happy than right.

Yeah. But women want to be adored, really. They really want to be cherished for the specialness they have. And it's the same with, of course, men. But you can lose sight of that very quickly when you're in someone's life for a long time. It's so important people get on the game. Of course, when there's a marital threat, people dress up better, shave more often.

Right.

Smell better.

Outside threat is not so bad for marriage.

Yeah.

Wow. So you've been married for 30 years, right? 30 ish. 31.

It feels like 500.

Really?

Yeah, yeah.

Does it get better or does it get different or how does it evolve?

You know, it gets better and it gets worse. I think marriage, quite honestly, and I don't know why you're asking me, I've been married twice. Just curious, so it's not like I'm an expert here.

Well, you've had multiple experiences. That means you've learned from different experiences.

Yes, it's true.

And I think as a successful female entrepreneur, business owner who's invested in multiple companies and very driven to achieve and just achieve so much, I think it's even more challenging to be married for as long as you have. So that's why I'm curious, because you do have experience.

Well, here's the good news and I'll give you the bad news. The good news, I think, or speaking from my own experience, is all I know. I think I become more tolerant and kinder and have a softer eye as I get older and stay with my husband Bill for all these years. Like, I could have more empathy, much more easily. I can call it up. Whereas only 15 years ago I'd be very intolerant, not accepting of something now I see it's his personality. And I might as well just roll over and be comfortable with it because where am I going to get? I'm not going to get anywhere. I'm not going to change him at this point. He's not going to change me. The bad news is you start to assume you know what to expect and never expect anything different or better or unusual or exciting. But I think the key then, in a marriage is also not to think you're going to change each other and find your joy or your excitement or whatever it is you're thinking. You don't find in one individual and find it outside the marriage. And that keeps the marriage stronger because you have other windows. You're opening up on many relationships. And I'm not talking about having an affair.

Right, right. You know, business relationships, personal friendships.

Personal friendships. You know, it's like a crayon box. You can't get all the colors from one color. And that's what your husband has, three colors. He's mastered those three colors. So you have to introduce those other colors and make sure you stay vital. If I was sincere in saying that, I think that.

No, I think that makes sense.

Did it sound sincere to you?

Absolutely. I think it's hard to say that you're gonna get everything from one person for your whole life.

Yeah.

You believe it. When you're like a dog in heat, like you are right now, you're blinded by the light.

Right. I think I'm realistic about, like, the future. And it's just like, that's why I love to ask questions of very successful people in business. Because, like, how do you keep your marriage strong or a relationship strong when it gets boring or dry or whatever?

Yes.

And I'm hearing you say you've got to find excitement in other ways, not in that relationship.

Not very exciting news. I'm afraid I can't deliver more. But can't we talk about the stuff I'm really good at? I mean, marriage is not my forte.

That's why I like asking those questions.

It's a challenge every day.

That's why I like those questions.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I should be asking other people that are so happy. I can't stand those couples at a restaurant that are gazing into each other's.

Eyes and then look old.

Forget it.

Holding hands all the time.

Other things to talk about. My God.

Now I'm curious. From a business perspective, when people are getting into a relationship, into a marriage, or just an intimate relationship, not married, and one person is a driven entrepreneur, they're focused on their mission, their impact, their business. They want it to be successful. They want to make money and also create a great product. Do you feel like there's ever challenges in those relationships that can be foreseen and talked about before it gets too challenging?

You mentioned before we started Cousins Main Lobsters. They did two partners, Cousins, a few years apart, grew up together wanting to start a business on the side called Cousins Main Lobster.

Great product, Great product. Right down the street, we, you know, it's expensive, but it's great expensive.

But lobster is expensive.

Worth it.

But great product because of the great guys. Great guys. All right. I bring them up because before they went down the road toward partnership, they both went and got psychologically tested as to what was important to them, what was a turn off, a full battery of psychological tests, like for four hours. And then they openly discussed it before they went in the partnership. Now that's a dream world. How many people do that? But how smart are those guys? And they divided the test based on their personality traits, and they're very, very happy partners.

Wow.

Yeah, It's a great example of how to do it right. Do most people do that? No, but some people intuitively choose people very smartly as to who should be their partner in business or in life. And I have found that the most successful ones on both fronts have been when you choose your opposite opposites. I know a build is always attracting and maybe not staying together, but no, I think if you can have mutual respect and build good fences as to who's good at what and who does what, I think it's got the best shot at being successful in any kind of relationship.

Wow, interesting. Have you ever seen a really successful entrepreneur fail because of a intimate partnership?

Happens all the time.

Not from just like, oh, you don't.

Mean another business partnership. You mean because of their partner?

Because of their intimate partner, yes. Have you ever seen a man or woman was, like, driven, their thing is taking off, but their emotional intimate partner somehow brings it down?

Well, you're kind of billing the emotional partner as the bad guy, which is not usually the case from what I've seen. I've seen it's a mutual bad dance. And it goes like this. Somebody starts a business or is really committed to making a success of themselves. Very often it's the guy because he wants to be the breadwinner and really wants to be able to. He's setting up his life. He's more serious about setting up his life and making the money generally, you know, feels like this Time pressure. So the guy goes out and he's got a wonderful spouse, I'll say, in this or whoever in his life. But it goes awry. I think a lot of it goes awry because it takes 150% effort to succeed in life, in the workplace, if you are going to be hugely successful, successful, you're going to pour your heart and soul and hours into it and you better have a spouse who signed up for it. So there's never an honest conversation because very often the warrior doesn't know how successful or how hard or how much they're going to be out of the home or what their single minded focus is going to be. So you're not asking your spouse to sign up for it. And yet most of those relationships go awry. Why? Because what the spouse wants is who they married. That guy that doted on her and loved her and spent quiet hours at the beach collecting seashells and saying I love your eyelashes and all that shit, right? So then all of a sudden she's not hearing that and she goes somewhere else for her love. It happens all the time. It's a hard balancing act if you're serious about business. And I can tell you for myself, it has played havoc on my relationship, really. My first partner was very supportive, but I knew he was fine. It was like a parked car. I didn't have to give him any attention, whereas my business, my salespeople took 150% of my time. You can't do that. You really have to parsel yourself out with what's important in life.

Man. That's fascinating because I think sometimes I'll speak for myself.

I knew you were going to confess sooner or later.

I'll speak for myself. I feel like sometimes myself and other men that I know who are driven entrepreneurs that want to build businesses and make a big impact, myself in the past and other male friends that I have have built these female relationships with intimate partners, been so committed on their vision and mission and then feel bad they're made wrong or they feel guilty that they don't have as much time to give the relationship or they're giving too much time to the business, but that's their mission that they feel called to. What is the conversation that the driven person for business in the relationship should have with the partner before they really take it to another level? Whether it's marriage or, you know, being committed boyfriend and girlfriend? What is the conversation they should have so they don't feel guilty going 150% in on their mission and they don't resent the partner for pulling back when they make them wrong for going all in.

Well, let me tell you the real objective, an ideal objective, is to get the partner on the same page with you. Sometimes that doesn't work. Whatever you're aspiring to may have not been in the first place or certainly not now what she or he's. Can I say she in the sense that it's like you're a guy? Okay, what she's aspiring to. But I think the most important goal there is to get rid of the guilt. Guilt is a terrible thing. And I'll tell you what it will also do. It will drive the relationship apart more than lack of communication. If you are chasing your rainbow and going at 150% and you're feeling like guilty that you're not giving enough to the relationship, but that's really where your heart is, you want to do that right now. This is the 10 years you want to mostly focus on that you owe the honesty because the guilt will erode it. You'll resent her anyway if she's not willing to play, even though you never spoke about it. So I think shooting between the eyes is the best way to go, whether it be directly one on one or whether you get someone to help facilitate that. Listen, I'd like to take another. I'd like to size up our relationship. I'd really like us to be honest about what we're looking for in the next five years we've been together 10 years, blah, blah, let's get it all on the table. And you know what, sadly might happen. You might find you're not suitable. There are chapters in life. People change, people have different aspirations. But why piss away another five years at the wrong relationship? That ain't gonna go anywhere any.

When did you learn to communicate so, like directly? Have you always been that way?

It's shorter. I'm impatient. I mean, I can't stand any indirect communication. Even with the people I work with. If they start going like, well, you know, I was thinking that, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I go, listen, tell me where you land and then tell me how you got there. And guess what? When they tell me where they land, I never stay tuned for how they got there. I just want to know where you land. It saves a lot of time and also it gives permission for the other person to be direct. People really see through bologna a lot. You know, if you're dancing around the bushes, try that with a long term relationship. Dance around the bush. If you've been Together more than two years. That person's gonna look at you. What's he bullshitting about? Whether you're saying it or not.

Were you always this direct or did it kind of evolve over time?

I think I've gotten more direct as I get older because you become more yourself. But remember, I'm one of 10 kids with only two parents. We didn't have 12 parents. And if you wanted to get attention, you had to say what you want and say it fast or you lost the attention of your parents. They were on to the next kid, like, hey, this is what I want. Get it out fast.

Wow.

So I had early training, you know.

Who was more influential for you of.

Your two parents in different ways? I would say overall, clearly my mother. Maybe because I'm a female, but my mother, in my mind, was rocking. Amazing, because she raised 10 kids with hardly any money to even feed us and did a phenomenal job and was so positive in every way. And she was a workaholic. She worked harder at 10 kids through the night, the ironing, the washing, everything.

Oh, my gosh.

Than I could ever work in my building, my business, you know. But what my dad did for me, though, had a profound effect on not only myself, but my nine siblings, or eight out of nine, is he hated working for someone his whole life. He worked two jobs to support us. He was a printing press foreman in the day and he washed trucks at night. But what my father taught us, because he would constantly get fired for insubordination. And when he would come home early from work, we'd all run around the table, dad's home early. Dad, we couldn't wait till. And he'd say, guess what, kids? And we'd all scream, you're fired. And he'd go, you Betcha. I told Mr. Stein to shove that job up where the sun don't shine. We're like, yay, dad. But what was beautiful about my father is he taught us quietly in his own way, not to work for someone. And all of us are self employed and doing very well, except for my sister, who's a hospice nurse. But she's self employed because she goes to people's homes. But we all have businesses that we've done well with. But I credit my dad with that and I credit my mother with her people skills, teaching us and being such a positive human being. So combined, we had a very lucky, lucky mix. And as you know, luck is such a big card in life, right? You don't know what you get.

You gotta make the most of what you get though, can.

But a lot of people don't, of course. And a lot of people don't get much, especially as kids.

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What's the biggest lessons you Learned from being one of 10 kids?

I should come up with something better. But I'll tell you what comes to mind. I think you learn how to be a member of a team.

Wow.

And that's a huge head start. When you go out in life to think that there's a lot of opinions and you kind of have to make it all gel and work. And so I think I can really build great teams. I think that's my true, true gift in any situation. And I think I could not have learned it. I may have learned it later, but I certainly came out of the household at 18 knowing what a team was all about.

Yeah. Because your whole family had to be that way.

Yeah.

Did you play sports too or.

No, I did not. But, you know, I'm old enough that in my high school they didn't have girl sports.

Wow.

But I worked every day after school and that's a sport. And to this day, I think of business as a really good sport. It's a contact sport at times, but it's definitely competitive and it probably has similar skills. But if I had been a sports woman, I would have been great because I'm a damn good skier.

Really?

Yeah.

Yeah. And that's the only sport I've really done. But my younger sisters and brothers were, a few years down, were great athletes in high school. My brothers in particular. When the girls kicked in. Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah. So I would have done. I wish I had. You know, I think I would have liked it.

It's like you still play sports now.

Well, the one sport. Yeah. Yeah.

The sport of business.

Yeah. Oh, the sport of business and skiing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you ski in the east coast or.

I ski out in Utah a lot. Cause we have a little place there.

Powder is amazing this year.

Depends what year you ask. This has been a good year. Last Christmas, we were begging and praying for snow every night. Yeah.

Where are you? In Park City or Park City?

You know that?

Yeah, snowboarded there.

Yeah. Well, I don't go right in Park City. I go in Deer Valley because I don't like snowboarders.

I used to be kind of crazy growing up when I was doing snowboarding, but I kind of. I just don't want to get hurt now, so I just like going slow and chill down there.

That's called middle age. You start to think about risk instead of just doing it.

Well, I just got so many injuries through my body, so many broken bones from playing football and other sports.

It's just like, you don't want to do it.

The pain is just not worth it anymore. Just the recovery process where. When I was a kid, it didn't matter, you know? Just wanted to have fun.

Well, so you can have a lot of fun without going against the speed record or something.

True, true. Trying to jump off every cliff like I used to do. I remember I hit my head so hard one time. This is when I didn't wear a helmet because I didn't think it was cool. I hit my head so hard and I slid down. I was in.

Where was I?

In the Canadian Rockies. Slid down, and I probably laid there for about six or seven minutes while people just went behind me. And I thought I had a concussion or something because I was like, I will never go snowboarding without a helmet again.

You learned the lesson.

I learned the hard way.

You were lucky.

Lucky I didn't crack my head open. I just had, like, a minor concussion or something, but.

And if you're young enough, a minor concussion is no big deal.

Yeah.

Lucky for you.

Well, I played football, and I probably had many minor concussions.

You never got it checked out, I bet not have to let me check my head after this game.

No. And I used to only hit with my head. I would tackle with my hand as hard as I could. Full speed, the full wheel. Crazy. I'm lucky I got injured after my first year playing professional, because I don't know if I'd even have a brain anymore if I played Lions.

I think when you get married, you should give that lovely future wife, which I have a gut feeling is gonna be soon. Give her an out in the contract that if you start acting strange with those head injuries, she can walk away and get herself a younger guy.

Okay?

Be kind. Be reasonable.

I'd always be kind.

I don't have a good feeling about your future. You better give that girl an out.

No, I'll be fine.

It's been 10 years since football, so I'm fine now.

Okay.

I'll be fine. When do you feel the most loved? When you do what or when what happens in your life you feel the most loved?

If you exclude children, when children say they love you and mean it, or you got my back, or however they, at different ages, find a way to make you feel loved, that's the best love of all. But if you want to move that out of the way, which is true of anybody who's a parent, I think. I think the second best is when I see a happy team at work. Maybe I shouldn't be putting much emphasis on that, but when I see a happy team all clicking like a clock and really helping each other and enjoying each other and mostly thinking they could do whatever they want and be whoever they want, they're gonna go to the sky and back again, it makes me feel so happy. I guess that's parenting, too. It makes me feel like I've empowered these kids to be wonderful, whether they. They're not all kids, but it makes you feel young adults full. Full of happiness and love. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Greatest satisfaction.

Greatest satisfaction for me, building teams and seeing them thrive.

Yeah. And the. Seeing the individuals feel like they're discovering themselves, things they didn't know they could do. So it's kind of as close as you get to playing like a miracle worker, whether it be the people at the office that I work with. I have a very small team today building the big business that I sold or working with my different entrepreneurs from Shark Tank. Whenever I feel like I can make a difference and I see them reaching higher and really believing because I could sell anybody on themselves really. Well, pump them up and mean it, though. I'm not bullshitting. Well, I'm trimming it up. I'm trimming it up. But I really. It's based on something that I really see. When I see them starting to take off, I get tremendous satisfaction. And you said that wasn't really your question. I guess you said, how do you feel?

Loved.

But I do feel loved in those circumstances, which probably have nothing to do with love. But I feel loving and loved.

That's good. What is the greatest mistake you've made that you're so grateful for that you made because it made you a better person from the lesson you learned or from the thing you got out of. Like you mentioned that you're previous boyfriend, a boyfriend back in the day, married a secretary. And it was the greatest gift that you had because you got out of a relationship that wasn't going to work or you met your partner. Is there really like a challenge or a mistake you made in business or life? Besides that?

I don't think I'm the type of person that is brave enough to admit I've made a mistake, honestly, because I think things have not worked out along the way where things just didn't work out as I had hoped or dreamed them to be. But I don't see them as a mistake because as quick as you are thinking, oh, poor me, you start to see the light of the door that it's opening that couldn't have opened without it. Okay, so I don't have like a regret of this was a big mistake. That was a big mistake. But I have to also say I have my whole life been very cognizant of doing anything and exposing myself to anything, even when I didn't want to do it. Because I'm deathly afraid of feeling like I would regret. Like, what if I don't do it? That's more of a motivation for me to do it.

Me too.

You know, just like will I look back, you know, like for example, with Dancing with the Stars, I did not want to do it. I'm an old babe. The last thing I want to do is practice four hours a day.

You were great.

Well, you think I was so great? Not the judges, they didn't think so. I was the number one person on Dancing with the Stars last season. Number one rejected. Now there's a record. Okay, but so you might say that was a mistake. With all the work that that led up to and it was a social embarrassment, I thought I'd be rejected. Maybe number three or five or six. But number one, I never saw it coming. And so I was kind of a little mortified on that one. But you know what? I'm so thankful I did it. And the minute I recovered by the next morning, I'm like, thank God I did it and thank God it's over. It's a lot of work.

It's a lot of work.

Because I didn't want to. I. I said yes because I didn't want to wonder what it would have been like.

So what did you learn from the experience about yourself?

I learned I'm not a good dancer. I swear. I've looked at the tapes. Now, one year later, when I thought. Same tapes I looked at a year ago, I thought, you know, I really got this. But I look at the one year later, I'm like, I'm stiff as a board. What was I thinking, missing steps? So what I learned from that is that I can't dance well. But inside my body, I feel like I'm a good dancer. And I'll get out on any dance floor, do my own makeup steps, and people really smile as I'm dancing because I don't really give a crap and I look like it, you know? Yeah, but what did I learn? I learned that I learned the same lesson I learned again and again, which is, thank God I did it. Thank God. And the injury of, oh, God, you did so poorly dissipates quickly. But there's an echo to not trying something that's gonna sting you, I think. Not that I. Cause I really don't do that, but I'm afraid of it. It's like fear of a nightmare that might happen. I don't know why, because I don't really have that in my life, but I'm fearful of it.

Yeah, I think that'll sting you for a long time, too. That fear of regret, of like, oh, I had the opportunity to do this Dancing with the Stars, and I didn't do it. How many years would you think about not, you know, what, maybe a year.

But still a bad year. Regret does, I think, and why I've been able to build up my personality and whatever I can get out of and give to life as best I could. What regret does is it quietly takes down your confidence a notch because, in short, you're a coward. You shied away. Even if the right decisions to shy away. Once you shy away, you quietly, without even consciously thinking, think a little less of yourself. Now, I say that from experience because I've watched many people get stronger or people where life makes them weaker. And there's a lot that goes into that, but I really believe that that regret piece is not given enough due. You really have to try everything and try your best, because even. And listen, two out of three things I try don't work out, you know, but people just remember the success. That's what I wanted. But I know what the failures are. But still I got confidence out of failing. Each time a little notch up, a little notch up. So then you conduct yourself with more power in life because you feel better about yourself and Ironically, you have more to give. You're a better package to give more. Because you've put a lot into that basket by just trying, trying, trying, trying, you know?

Do you feel like you're more confident even though you're the first one out of Dancing with the Stars that you, you did it and you went towards it?

Absolutely, yeah. Absolutely. I'm more confident. I got a lot of confidence out of that because every female friend and male friend I had that was even close to my age, they were like.

I can't believe you even went for it.

Right. They said they discouraged you. You're out of your mind. Da da da da da. But I won all their respect. And they constantly say, that was amazing. That was amazing. So even my friends that kind of took me for granted think better of me. I went up a notch in their.

Head, you know, it takes a lot of courage to do that.

It takes a lot of courage to publicly fail. But I happen to be very good at public failure. Really, because I've done it my whole life and that doesn't bother me. I think what I didn't want to happen was that I would look foolish or old dancing with a 24 year old ripped stud on the floor. Until I realized it feels really good to lean in on that guy.

There you go.

I'm spinning around that floor. And how many of my girlfriends are having to dance with anybody like that lately?

There you go. That's a good way of looking at it.

Yeah.

Why are you not afraid to fail publicly?

Because you know what I've learned? Nobody's really watching. Nobody gives a shit. Yeah, everybody sees you.

Forget about it the next year or.

Whatever, maybe even in the moment. Because the truth is that people most of all are thinking about themselves. So just when you think the limelight's on you and everybody's gonna say, God, is she stupid. God, why would she say that or do that? The minute they've given you that one moment of attention, they back onto their own problems, their own selves. So it's like overstatement of your ego to think you're really that important.

Right.

You know, you could just move right on. We could distract people. You try the next thing, their eyes on that, if you're lucky. So no, it doesn't really amount to anything. It doesn't really amount to anything. It's self ego. That is not really true.

That's interesting because you say that most people are focused on themselves. So when you mess up publicly or you fail publicly, they'll think about it. For a moment, but then they're on to their own thing.

If you're lucky and they notice.

If you're lucky, you notice. Most people won't notice. It just feels like everyone notices.

Yeah, definitely.

It's a shame, right? Exactly. What about when you want people to have the attention on you for the things you're doing? Good. How do you keep the attention on you? The relevancy of yourself as an entrepreneur and individual. When people are focused on themselves so much, how do you keep them thinking about you, Your brand, your business, your work, your mission?

You have to think of a way to grandstand, you know?

What do you mean by that?

Good old fashioned grandstanding. Like, I built my Corcoran Group brand on the backs of the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post. Without a doubt, I would think of all kinds of crap to get media attention. Okay? As long as my brand name was in there. Really the best single best thing I thought of, which was really just an attempt to get publicity when I couldn't afford advertising because it was a bad market, was my Corcoran report. And all that was a one page report giving the average sale price of apartments in Manhattan is how I labeled it. I was too stupid to know that that was a wrong label. It was just my 11 sales, but it was on the front page of the real estate section. I was quoted on the first line and boy, that was an eye opener. That's how I learned that publicity can build a brand. Today's version of publicity that I look for in all of the entrepreneurs I invest in is how good are you at social media? I don't care if you're in the sock business, if you're in hardware, what's going on? How good are your social media? What's your follow? And those are the key questions. Now. How good are you at building attention through social media? Because that's the new free ride. Not really free, but to a large degree, free. Just like the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal were my free ride. Okay? So you have to be creative, I think, in thinking of how you can grandstand. And so what's like, I don't know, I'm thinking, what's a business right today? Like, well, I don't want to use cousins. We already talked about cousins. Like Grayson Lakes, which started out as a baby sock company. Phenomenal entrepreneurs I have.

Is this the long, like the long lady stocking?

Yeah, with a little lace on top.

I bought some of those for a girl before. Yeah.

And they make girls look sexy.

They make them look great.

And they're well priced and they're beautifully made.

Yeah, they're nice, they're elegant, they're sexy.

Well, now it's a full fashion line and It's I think $17 million in sales this year. But what are they particularly good at? There's a husband and a wife team. Melissa, the wife of the team, has gorgeous long legs. You may remember her from Shark Tank. Her husband's more of a. A nuts and bolts guy, but great at business. What she does is she constantly models and talks directly to the camera. She has so many people that love her. She has a limited edition. She sells out constantly, constantly. She's great at social media. She knows how to primp herself, look sexy, talk to the ladies and get sales.

Okay, so she uses her assets, her.

Skills, but she does on social media and that's built their entire business. Social media, wow. And did I answer your question? Because I feel like I somehow got lost in my.

How do you stay relevant when things are going good? Because when your things are going bad, they'll look at you for a moment, maybe where it seems like everyone's looking at you, but then they forget. How do you stay relevant while you're growing or while things are kind of going the same?

I'll give you another example. I have a company I just bought in this past season. I was out of my mind to buy into them. It was two guys with a couple product called Comfy. It was a sweatshirt blanket. You slip into it, it's like a sweatshirt, but it's actually a blanket blanket. Why I say I was crazy to buy into it. None of the sharks they were smart enough not to is because they're two loudmouth guys having a good time pitching their product. And they had no inventory. They had handmade their own product, two prototypes, had no idea what it would cost to make, what they'd sell for, who they'd sell to. They had none of the answers, but they're great salesmen. And I said, I'll take 15 or 40%, whatever I got of it, boom. Just because they're great salespeople. And what they have done is they've done in their first year, $11 million in sales. They found a way to produce it and sell it. But a couple of weeks ago it was very quiet. They have had social media coverage to the moon and back, but it was very quiet. And they hand delivered. And I wish I could remember the famous actress named sexy, cool, long legged actress. I'm so bad with names. Whoever she was, I think she was the same actress who closed the Oscars the other night. I might be telling you I didn't watch it, but ah, shame.

I watched the highlight videos.

Oh, my God.

I was on a plane, so. Oh, come on. All right, well, anyway, I saw your little party watch party on Instagram.

Oh, so lonely. But anyway, they sent hand delivered to her front door. How they found it in Holly with the package and she put on video her jumping on her bed. And it they quicker than a second start a social media campaign. People competing with the jumps. They're Johnny on the spot. That's smart business. Okay? They're causing attention. They made it happen. And then they're gonna write it again and it's gonna be all over social media. All over. They're annoyed with me that I'm here because I don't have their product because they want me jumping on the beds. You know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna put the hood on. I have one girlfriend that has gorgeous long legs.

There you go.

I'm gonna Photoshop my head into her long legs and I'm gonna win the contest. Perfect.

I like that. So grandstanding now is like more influencer marketing. If you can find creative ways to find people with an audience. Maybe it's a micro audience or a.

Large audience or create an audience of your own one by one. But you really have to be able to grandstand.

And now let's get back to this episode with Barbara Corcoran.

I know you talk about the keys to entrepreneurial success a lot, but for those who haven't heard you talk about it, what are you think some of the smart ideas in business right now, the smart industries to go into, if someone's maybe talented, maybe they sold a company or they're trying to. To start as an entrepreneur. What's an industry you really like? A product? A section you really like, you know, is software, Is it coaching, is it consulting, is it an agency? Is it physical goods?

Food?

What's the type of category you really, you know?

Really? None of the above. Okay. It's not my cup of tea to think of an industry that's that you can. There's certainly leading industries. I don't believe that's where your head should be if you're thinking of going into business. I think your head should be. Is what do you enjoy? What are you naturally inclined to be good at? What were you always good at? Things. These abilities don't change much. Whatever you're, you know, if you're gregarious as a young kid, you generally don't wind up as a bookworm. You know, when you get older and get a head on your shoulders, you're still gregarious. So I think what you have to do is think. What would suit me? What could I visualize myself doing where I could picture a happy picture of myself? And I think most people are capable of dreaming that up. I don't think it's an analytical kind of left brain kind of thing where you apply yourself to your best shot, like going and playing blackjack and putting your chips on the right thing. No, I think you have to figure out you're the table. Where should you put your chips? What's on you? What's true to you? Okay. And so for me, it took me 22 jobs to find real estate. But the minute I was out opening keys, you know, opening the doors and chatting people up and it didn't feel like work and I was the boss, I knew I was going to be the queen of New York real estate. I knew it as sure as I knew my middle name was Ann. I just could see it in my mind's eye. I never had that vision when I worked my other 22 jobs. And the other thing, it's sort of related to what you ask. I think it's such wrong thinking that you have to choose your spot. I think it's like finding out what clothing you look good in. You got to go try a lot of shit on the rack and see what works with you. And then you kind of, little by little, kind of get your look of what looks well with on your body type, your personality, the colors that are good. I think you find yourself little by little, it's very hard to sharp shoot. It's not that kind of a thing. And you know, often the people I know, so many entrepreneurs well beyond or well before Shark tank peers of mine, in many industries that have succeeded, no one, no one ever went out for that industry. And so that's what I want to do. But you know what made the biggest difference in a myriad of those, if that's a word, a selection of those people that made the biggest difference was they came along someone they worked for who believed in them. Getting one good boss that gives you an opportunity is worth a million intellectual thoughts. And Harvard MBAs grouped up in a pile because you kind of can sometimes need somebody else to see that light or you get into something you never thought you'd be interested in and you really love your job, job and Then that winds up being what you do for a lifetime.

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And so I don't believe that you name the big industries. That's more of Mark Cuban stuff. He's like high level investment strategy stuff. But I'll put my businesses against his any day, one to one, because I think I'm so good at seeing who's got that talent that matches where they are.

You know, if someone's approaching you for investment or to partner with you and you could choose only three qualities that you would dream that they would have, whether that's never giving up, a grid, a positive energy, whatever the quality might be. And you could say if they had these three qualities, it doesn't matter what business they're in. Maybe timing and the economy might play a little bit of part here and there. But like if they had these three qualities, they're most like, I would bet on them any day.

Yeah, well, that's what I do every day on Shark Tank and I've gotten better at it because I've learned to hone in on those. I could think of two. Maybe I'll come up with a third if I keep talking. All right, number one is salesmanship. I have never succeeded with any business where the principal didn't know how to sell. I mean, sales is the guts of every business. If you don't have sales, you're not in business. Any business applies to everything. Okay, so, okay, if you're a technology nerd and really are in a technology space, but you better have a partner who could sell the shit out of it or it ain't gonna go anywhere. Okay? So selling is number one. The other thing I look for, and maybe it sounds weird to you, but I've learned it to be a great almost insurance policy. I look for injury, I look for anger in the individual. If I could find someone, and this is true of all my successful business, interestingly enough, if I could find someone who had injury at an early age and has something to prove, I got myself a winner. It's like insurance. So when I say injury, meaning they were done some school, like 3 out of 4, 3 out of 5 sharks were dunces at school. They're out to prove, you know, I don't want to out them, so I'm inclined to use the names, but I won't. I have entrepreneurs, usually successful, never had a father. And then when they went on Shark Tank, their father, after 35 years was back into how insulting enraged them. Okay, I have entrepreneurs who were sports figures, almost going to be professional sports. People had an injury but were fiercely competitive with someone who wound up in their space. They hate that person because they played against them in ice hockey. Crazy. All they have to do is name the other person, their sales go up. So anger improving is very much part of a lot of successful stories out there. It's an over compensation, over proving, over driving. Like, I'll show you. Give me the. I show you something that went wrong earlier, and you've got a motivated person, and it gets you through hard times really well. And then I'm coming up with a third. I can't. There's a million other ones, but none of them as serious as that. It's those two. You have to be able to sell. And if you have injury to prove something, it's a wonderful insurance policy.

How important is a positive attitude with those two things? Like if you were negative.

Oh, you don't. Let me tell you.

I'm just. I don't know.

You're not even gonna get out of the gate. Well, there's negative people, all right. You know what you might be trying.

To prove people wrong and always nasty about.

I get it. Let me tell you what's true about a negative person. You won't meet them in the entrepreneurial space. You know why? Because they are far more comfortable criticizing the next guy than doing. Negative people are blood suckers. They just suck your energy away. You know the nicest thing I did for all the people that worked with me over the years was get rid of negative people. The minute I spotted them, I didn't care if I had cause, they were out. You know why? Because it's like letting the enemy quietly into your camp and giving them free reign. Negative energy is the enemy of all business. Especially I've always been in sales related businesses. You let a negative person into a salesforce, they have a pity party. All of a sudden they need one more person to feel sorry for them or point out what's wrong. It's terrible. I would spot them out. I feel their vibe. Do you have a few minutes on Friday? I'd love to have a chat with you because I felt like I was saving my good people. They were good positive people. I don't mean criticism. It's invaluable in business. You need to have your criticizers to let you know when you're off and what you could do better. But I'm just talking about regular blood suckers, you know, everybody's met a few.

I hear you. I hear ya. Now sales is number one for you. If they're a great salesman, you would bet on them. If they're a great salesman with something to prove, that's like the golden ticket it sounds like. So how does someone train to be a great salesman if they don't know to how to? Is it something they can learn or is it something you just have to be a part of your energy?

Well, you had question about positive. That's the blood that goes through a great salesman, seeing the positive side of anything. And a lot of people see that as baloney. I don't. It's just like you show me a negative and I'll say, you know, you're right, it's a negative. But I can tell you what the upside of that negative is. So you have a bend toward being positive. So you must have that okay to be a salesman. If you don't, you'll never become a salesman. I don't care how hard you try. I think it's an intrinsic quality of personality trait. I know you're not supposed to say that. Everybody's supposed to believe you could become a salesman. I think if you're inclined to be outgoing and positive, you can become a better salesperson. But the real phenomenal salespeople that I have worked with and I've made my living my whole life in different venues with phenomenal salespeople. I am telling you, they come out of the gate, maybe not out of the womb, but they come out of the adolescent gate as salespeople. It's very hard to teach that it's an artistic gift to be able to sell really well because think of how complicated it is. You have to read the situation accurately. You have to read the person and think of how you could use them in the way that they want to use themselves and thank you in a thank you note 12 hours later, thinking it was their idea. That's a complicated little thing, right. And you need to think of how that person could be used for your long term goal of the picture you want to create. So that's very complicated math in the head. And that's what great salespeople do. They phenomenal. The best salesman, I hate to say it, that I ever met in my life and spent endless hours with Ms. Donald Trump. Really unbelievable salesman.

How so? What was it that made him so great?

He can read the vulnerability of people. You walk into the room, he could see what's wrong with you. He could just feel and know accurately what's wrong with you and how he's going to use that to get his way. It's an instinctive trait. I don't know if he was that way at 12, but I met him at, I guess I worked with him since he was 27, 28. He is just a couple of years older than me and we were in the same industry, the same town. So I had so many good dealings with him over the years until of course, he owed me money and I had assumed that he didn't like me anymore. That's all right. I got the money. That's all that counts. But he is, he could sell anyone, anything. I witnessed it again and again firsthand in his office, in meetings. Unbelievable salesmen. And that's exactly what he did with the American people. He sold them.

Wow.

He's a great salesman.

What's the vulnerabilities that he would look for and how would he use those to get people to buy what he was selling?

Oh, God. I'm thinking of a million stories of him using my own vulnerabilities.

Really?

Yeah. But they're kind of too long winded to tell, I guess.

What's one he would use with you, and then one you saw him. Him use with someone else, Like a vulnerability they have and then what he did to lean into that.

Well, you know, actually, I'm, like, on a scary turf here, because I don't want. I've been sued by him.

He's relentless.

But let me just.

In a positive way, okay.

My most positive self. So, for example, I saw him. Maybe a silly example, but I saw him interviewing huge ad agencies in New York for an advertising campaign done all the time by large developers, right? And I saw him to promote a.

Building that he was.

To promote a building he's going to spend a lot of money advertising. That's a sizable account for any ad agency in New York. And also how to market it, how to frame it, how to name it, Marketing, sales. But most importantly, sales and advertising. And I saw him sit at a meeting because I was there judging who was the best person along with them for a development site. And I saw him meet person after person, like a beauty contest, person after person after person, and then blow up the ego of one team. Unbelievable. What you created here. Unbelievable. And I'm like, I don't get it. I'm a marketing person.

I don't get it.

I don't get it. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. Can you do this? Can you do that? And that was all done. And then he did the advertising on his own. But I could see, why is he doing this? But now in hindsight, I see he knew that that guy was gonna float and work for free because he needed the ego pet so much. Wow. Yeah. And I'll give you a story of me that will sound. You'll think I'm a witchcraft person. I'm really not, you know, But I had a situation where my husband was a Navy captain and was sinking tanks along the east coast, and Donald had just bought Mar? A Largo. And there were erosion issues. So my husband said to me, why don't you call Donald Trump and ask him if he wants me to sink those tanks in there, and I'll do it right along his coast, courtesy of the U.S. navy. We need the exercise. I got the tanks. I said, I'm not going to ask him for anything. He said, no, it's a favorite. I'm not asking for anything. He's not the kind of man I want to owe anything to. No, thank you, Bill. My husband badgered me. Badger me. Finally, I wrote a note saying, just on the off chance you're interested. Cowardly way to do it. I'm writing Him a note. I saw the man all the time. Just on the off chance you're interested, I thought maybe I rewrote it. Rewrote it. Rewrote it because I didn't want it to look like a favor. I was careful. Okay. My danger Gene. Doot, doot, doot, doot. Sent him the note, got hired for a big job. We were at a big board meeting with like, 30 people there. Every captain of the industry, of the different trades was there. He's building me up for weeks. Barbara, Barbara, Barbara, Barbara. And then he decided he got out of me what he needed. And he said, can I tell you guys about the time Barbara wrote the notes? I'm like, sitting there going, no. She goes, yep. She was so afraid to ask me.

Wow.

That she must have written the note. How many times, Barbara? Four or five times.

No way.

I was like. I thought I was in some kind of a horrible way. Everybody's looking at me. She writes a note, she's afraid of you. Only the week before, I was amazing. He was done with me. I knew it, didn't want to pay the commission.

Done.

Contract never got done. So that is acute ability to read vulnerability. How would he know that? To this day, I'm like. But I saw him do that over and over. He's just. He. Yeah.

Wow.

Do you know, when I was selling real estate, I could always pick up between the lines between what people said they would buy and what they'd actually buy. So they'd say they wanted a terrace, had to have a terrorist. Had to have a terrorist. They were leaving for the terrorists. And I knew, as sure as I knew my name, that they weren't going to buy a terrorist, that I was going to sell them instead on a view apartment in new building versus a terrace in an old building that they wanted. Because what they were really looking for was charisma. That's an ability to read people. Okay. And be able to substitute. So that's another version of that. But on the negative side, does that make sense?

You did it in a positive way? Yeah.

I could have done a negative way if I had that ability. I didn't. Wow. Yeah.

So how did you see this with people, then, where you could shift what they wanted to something that you could still sell them in a positive way? Like, you said, they wanted the terrace, but I knew they just wanted charisma. How do you spot that personally when you're selling a home or something else?

I think most of us, if we listen well, could sense it. I think what it is it's all in the delivery. First of all, very often you're selling couples or a single person, and you have time to. If you get below the person's skin and kind of figure out what kind of person you are, very often you know better than they know what's going to make them happy. They could be repeating what their peers said they should have or the way they, you know, you don't know where it comes from, but get to know them and you can reach your own conclusion. So I really found that the old slogan buyers are liars is really true. They don't mean to lie. But what you really got to do is in any sales situation, really get into the person, ask a lot of questions and try it. Like if you, after you were visiting with someone, trying to sell them something, someone said, what do they like? What would you say about them? What do they really like? What would you say about them? That's where you find where the soft material to sell is.

I think if you were given three questions to ask, any buyer, potential buyer that came into you, you can only ask them three questions.

Yes.

Try to figure out who they really were, what they were really interested in, or what you could potentially sell them.

Yeah.

What would you say, maybe two or three of these questions that you would ask to see what you could get out of them?

Yeah. The first question I would ask is, when do you need it for? Urgency is 90% of it.

Interesting.

The second question I would ask is, when do you need it for? And the third is, when do you need it for?

Really, the rest doesn't matter.

Because if you have a motivated person who needs something, you've got a sale.

Doesn't matter. I feel like we need it this week.

Well, it doesn't matter. You have time to figure it out. But you get instead, like as a real estate salesman in a typical qualifying. And all my qualifying forms that I taught every salesman, every manager used my entire life. First question bolded, the only one, Boulder, when do you need it for? Because salespeople will say, oh, so what are you looking for? No, they miss the big question, when do you need it for?

Interesting.

Because they will move all over the board as to what they'll actually see and what they'll actually buy. And you have all the time in the world because how do you really know that? Because you haven't spent time with them, you're going to actually believe what you hear. It's crazy. You need to spend the time to form your own impression of what they're really going to buy or what is just really where the sale is or where's the opportunities. It doesn't just have to be in sales. It's in business. Dealers. You need to have the ability to spend time enough to read them well. But. But the one thing you can ask up front is when do you need it for? Because I had more salespeople in the early years spin their wheels endlessly with the high priced customer. All cash this and that. Price is no limit. But they didn't need it for years and they were going to work with them for years and spend all that cab fare and car services. No. The need is the most important question. Question you want in any sales situation. And any salesman that comes in and doesn't vet that out right away or on the phone is not a good salesman. I could tell right away. Not a good salesman. They missed the main question. Yeah.

That's good. I like that. Any type of sale you're looking for you need to ask that question. What's the thing you're most proud of that no one knows about?

There's really nothing that no one doesn't know about. I'm sorry. What's in my mind is on my tongue. Out of my mouth. You know one of those. There's really nothing that people don't know about. Really. I wish I could come up with new stuff. I'm so tired talking about this stuff.

What's the thing that you're proud of that you're just proud of the most that you've done that maybe you don't talk about all the time but something you've done. Maybe it could be something small or big.

Well two things came to mind. Big and small. So I'll give you both small. But somehow feels so big in my life is when I first got my first profit for running the Corcoran Group. And I never made any profit Year and year and I pay. I was putting that cash back down long before I even had it in my hands. I was always reinvesting. Reinvesting because I wanted to see how far I could go. But in those years when I finally got my first profit I had about 48,000 or maybe 40, 40 some odd thousand dollars. I could see what we're going to actually have a profit. How did that happen? And I bought my mother and father brand new car each. I bought my mother a bright blue Pontiac convertible she always wanted. Blue's her favorite color. She always wanted a convertible her whole life. And I got my father a. What do you call those big Ass cars that everybody liked.

A suv, a Suburban, a truck girl in this.

You know, all the drivers you hire in the old days, they had those big cars and the big backs. That one of the Lincoln Continental. No, Lincoln. Yeah, not a Continental. Lincoln. And I have my uncle Richie and his friend drive it out to Florida and deliver it.

Wow.

I remember at the time they were so much in disbelief because we always had a clunky old car with all the kids stuffed in the back. It was always. And all of us learned how to drive. We were always crashing that poor car. How my dad put up with it through store windows. We were like what we were. Each kid was learning. It got more dense. But I remember that day and I'm so happy I thought of it in the moment. Because it's bad when you miss these moments. I remember thinking I'll never feel more satisfaction or richer than I feel in this moment. And it's not that I wish it upon myself, but you know, that's exactly been the truth. I've never felt as rich again or as endowed or as lucky or as fulfilled ever again as that moment, you see. And so that. That was that. Okay.

Sure.

And you. So I wouldn't say proud of that was the most satisfying and such a. Oh my God.

Okay.

The most overreaching thing I'm most proud about is I proved Sister Stella Marie wrong. I still hate that bitch. She was the nun from hell. And I later learned out that she was buried in the nun yard and that she had a drinking problem. I wish someone had told me that as a kid that she had a drinking problem. Who knew that nuns drank other than Sunday, right?

I didn't know.

I didn't know either. Okay. And of course we were raised by nuns in our Catholic school. And they were all great except for the one I had, Sister Stella Marie. So I'm so proud that her messaging to me that I'd always be stupid just cause I couldn't read that. I didn't let that determine my life because I was. I. I had a hard time getting over that, you know, And I had the help. My mother told me I was a genius. So that helps a lot, you know, having somebody on the other side.

Sure.

But the idea that I've proven again and again and now it's a weird thing. I'm kind of very thankful to her because I think because of her I tried so hard. Do you know? So really she was kind of like an early version of Ramon Simone. She played that role. And I'm so thankful That I got over that. Mostly because not only have I had success as a result of it, but mostly because I keep that message going out to all these dumb kids at school. It's such a sad thing that kids are defined by how they do in school, and yet most successful people I know build their own stuff, weren't good in school. That's been an mo. I see. So I like to. I feel like I'm lucky to be around to keep getting that message out.

Yeah. And you said most successful entrepreneurs have a lower IQ or average iq, right?

Yes. Well, I don't really know that.

If you feel like it's that way. They're street smart. They're not book smart.

They're street smart, not book smart. But what I really mean by that is that, you know, that rejection card is a big kahuna in building anything in life, not just business. So they're too stupid to lay low when they've been smacked about. You know, most people get punched. You stay low. I don't want to get punched again. They just keep popping up like a jack in the box. Keep popping up like. And so that takes a certain lack of intelligence, I think.

Yeah, it does. Just keep going. You don't think about it too much.

Keep going.

A smart guy would lay low, right?

Exactly.

I'm glad I'm not that smart.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm curious. You talked about the first year you made a profit. $40,000.

I think you said 47.

I think 47,562. Well, I don't know about that exactly. If someone is an entrepreneur right now, let's just say they had their biggest year ever and they had a bunch of extra cash laying around. They're just like, wow, we finally made some money. An extra 100 grand, an extra 300 grand, whatever it is. Million bucks. What should they do with that extra money?

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To continue to grow?

Two things I thought of right away. Number one, they shouldn't have that money. Okay? If you're really serious about building a business, you're putting the pedal of the metal. You're spending the money and putting the bets down long before it comes in. So the idea like I made a mistake that one year I had a profit, shame on me. I mean I made something good of it of course, but you should really have any money coming in over aggressively targeted towards something that you do well. And I think the best place to put the money and I work with my entrepreneurs all the time on this and they're not so inclined. Most people want to put the money in on a new idea, a new version or a new this. No, the best place to put the money is what has worked. Where have you gotten your sales? Give me the sources. What has worked? That's where you put your money all in. Put a pile it up until it stopped working. Then you move to something, something else. But people don't do that. People always like the new stuff. Like oh but we, if we hire a PR company, you know, we'll really get. No, no, no. The trade show has produced 80% of your money.

Right? Showing up and building those relationships yourself.

Yeah, whatever has worked for you before. Keep repeating, repeating, repeating and I just think the money shouldn't be there in the first place. Do you know my whole life I open offices much bigger than I had any business doing. If the minute I had sales in a company and started seeing that we were doing well and I started smelling a profit, like we might get a profit this thing might really start kicking in. I was out looking for office space, and if I needed. If I thought I needed 18 desks, I'd go out looking for 36.

Wow.

And I plunked the money down because I found that when you threw the money onto your bet in advance, you find a way to make it work. If you wait till the time is right, wait till you have the. Guess what. There's a smarter guy out there that's already put the money, your competitor, and he's already ahead of you. And it's such a quick market. When you're competing, you've got to like, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba. Like, there's like a timer on you, you know, get it going good. You have to have it done early, I think.

So invest it back in the thing that's worked before for you until it.

Doesn'T work anymore and more than you think you could handle. Because human beings who are talented, especially entrepreneurs, are remarkable on making things work. When the gun's against their head and they're under fire, but gives them a lot of leeway and have them plot out, they start to go to sleep. It's really not healthy for a business.

It's that pressure that allows you to really kind of have more urgency and make it happen.

Well, you're a football player. Did you play better in a game or in practice?

Game.

Yeah. Same difference. Same old thing.

Yeah.

Okay.

You said. That was the first thing you said. There was two things, potentially two things.

That I wanted to say was you shouldn't have the money. It should be spent way in advance. And the second thing is spend it on stuff that's worked before.

There you go. I got a few questions left for you. I don't even want to stop this, but I want to make sure I respect your time.

You are so handsome.

Thank you. And I will take it.

I will take it. I would say not just handsome, but the way you look at me. It's kind of hard for me to think you have a girlfriend because you are flirtatious. I know you're not flirting, but in my mind, I've convinced myself you're into me.

I am.

I'm into you.

I am.

Oh, God, I'm loving the interview.

You tell Bill.

I will. I will.

I will.

Okay, final few questions. I wish I had more time, but we'll get you back on here. And you have an amazing podcast.

Yes. Oh, thank you. I was supposed to be here to promote it.

I know.

Such a bad one on that.

It's called business Unusual, Unusual. Unusual. And I just started listening to your first few episodes.

They're short.

Bite size.

I'm making a little longer through popular demands.

That's good. Yeah. I listened to one of the interviews that you had with I think, was it Mike or someone in your team?

Yes, the guy who works. Mike Stevens.

Mike. And then you have these other shorter, you know, 10 minute episodes that are beautifully done because you teach a powerful story and a lesson up front and then you do some Q and A from listeners. So I think it's really well done. Make sure you guys go listen. Business unusual. Thank you for the promotion on iHeart.

Iheart or wherever you.

Itunes, Spotify everywhere. Yeah, make sure you guys check it out. This is one of the few questions I was curious about you. When do you feel the most pain?

You don't mean physical pain, emotional pain?

Yeah, no, not like someone's punching you, but when do you feel like anger, pain, frustration? What happens in the world or in business or in relationships where you feel the most pain?

Well, business has never caused me any pain at all. I mean, even the toughest of times, somehow I always felt I would make it. And so that gets you over a lot of pain. If you could see the finish line. And it always was clear to me where the finish line was. So in the worst of times, I didn't really feel pain. It's true you have stress and you feel responsibility because you're feeding a lot of people, if you think about it and you don't want their jobs going away. So I felt the responsibility and the pressure of that. But no, the only area of my entire life ever feel pain is over my children.

Really?

Yeah. And I'm not a worrier by nature, but with regard to my children I am. And I'm always, I'm always. And I have great kids that are doing well, so it makes no sense whatsoever. But I'm always feeling like I have no control there and I'm scared to death that they won't have as fabulous a life as I have. And I don't mean about monetarily because I think that's another whole issue. You can really wreck kids with money. It's easier to raise poor kids than rich kids. My own philosophy. So it's not that. It's just that I want them to feel the satisfaction and the joy of accomplishing on their own, having truthful good friends, having people that love them. And I'm always, I'm always over concerned about it. Always concerned and fearful about it. It's a Terrible thing. I should probably get a shrink. It's now my youngest, 13, my oldest 24. Maybe a little late, but not so late. Yeah, maybe I need a good shrink. Because I do worry about that. If that's the closest I feel to pain, like I start to think the worst, and yet there's no reason for it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's fascinating.

Not fascinating, it's ridiculous. Why don't you say it? It makes no sense.

I think it's fascinating. That's where you feel the most pain. Because as you said, it's where you feel the most love too. With your kids.

Oh, of course, with your kids.

So you feel the most love and the most pain in the same place.

That's not fair.

I know, right?

We just want the love part.

We just need to trick you.

We need to learn how to. We just to want love.

Love.

I know, right? Exactly. I'm curious. How do you raise kids when you have money? When you have lots of money or an abundance of money or more than most people in the neighborhood, let's say. Or how do you raise.

How do you avoid spoiled brats? Yes, yeah. Entitled kids.

How do you raise kids that do want to work hard when they have the ability to have everything or you have a nice life, lifestyle, or luxury or comforts?

Well, number one, you have to realize there's a lot of things those kids are never going to have that you had. Okay. Which is the satisfaction of doing it themselves.

Man.

So that's unfair. So in that way, the rich kids gets the short end of the stick.

They have an unfair advantage by having an advantage.

Well, yes, if you could follow that logic, I'll agree with you. Yeah, it's true. And so I think there are a couple of areas that I focus on, but still I worry. And I have a 24 year old that has no heirs. Hard working, you'd swear he was a poor kid. But he was an easy kid. He was born easy, was kind of easy to raise. So I got lucky, okay? But I did keep my eye on a couple of balls, which I think a lot of my peers, other rich, rich, affluent or affluent kids in the New York area especially, didn't keep their eye on his parents. I think they helped too much. I don't help my kids unless they ask.

Okay?

So the extra tutors, the specialized training to compete, the cool look, all of that, I resist it, okay? And it's hard for me because I want to do just like you want to give. You want to give. And then another version of that. But more powerful as I let them fail, which is the hardest thing in the world for a parent.

Powerful.

Okay.

Powerful.

Hardest thing in the world. Okay. So if someone like, for example, I watch a very big difference. Right. I would have my son come home and complain about his time. And my answer was your science teachers. Right. Go in and figure out how to make him your friend.

Wow.

I had other peer moms, kids in the same class that went in and spoke to the science teacher, made it very clear they didn't like the way he was talking to their kid. And you know what? They may have been right. He wasn't appropriate. This person I'm thinking of. But guess what? They missed the main thing.

Doesn't matter. Yeah.

They should have told their kid to shut up and put up because that's the way life is. Okay. So I think as an affluent parent, you a give your kids everything that they had wanted to earn on their own. They've already had the fancy vacation, the lovely car, the this that, the lovely home, the maid service. They didn't have to make their bed. They already had all that first class confidence. Yeah, yeah. But then on top of that, you haven't allowed them to build their confidence because you don't. You shelter their failing. You're there to catch them, to buffer it. Ooh, ooh, ooh. And then the last thing is don't shepherd them toward where you see them. So many people buy into the right school, the right grades, the right industry, the right job, the right introduction. All this stuff, you know, what you take from your kids when you do that, the confidence, it's like you're in partnership. You're not in partnership. They were loaned to you. You got to give them back. And they're going to go out in the world long after you're gone. So I really try to hold back. It's a self discipline.

Yeah, that's true.

Self discipline thing. So it's more what you don't do than what you do. How's that?

I like that.

I wish I had explained that more succinctly, but I had to get, get around.

I had Sara Blakely on and she said, that lovely woman. She's amazing. Love her. And Jesse, she said that her dad at dinner table every day would ask her, what did she fail at today? Like every day he asked the question, what did you do that you failed at? Wow. So he made it a daily requirement to fail at something.

My gosh.

And she said that was her.

I hope he also gave a compliment.

I'm sure she's very positive though. So positive. Yeah. So I think that's powerful to like let your kids complain.

And she's this self made woman with a huge success.

Huge success. Spanx is crushed. Okay, this is one of the final questions. I promise.

Thanks. This is called it's almost over.

This is called the three truths.

Ah, I didn't know that.

Yes. I ask everyone at the end the three truths.

I should have done better research.

It's okay. It's okay. You'll be great at this. Imagine you have as many years left on this world to live.

About 10.

You have a long time, but for whatever reason, you got to pick the day for you. You've accomplished everything. But one day you just gotta say, okay, now's the time, I gotta go. And everything you've ever created, you've gotta take with you. Let's just say hypothetically, right?

Everything you've created, you take with you.

You gotta take it with you.

Sounds like a weird question. I know.

Hypothetical.

Hypothetical, right.

All your podcasts, your books, the work.

Your messages, you've gotta take it all with you. So no one has your message that you've shared anymore, but you have a piece of paper and a pen to write down the three things you know to be true about all your experiences, your whole life lessons. And these three things you would share with the world. That's what they would have to remember you by. What would you say are your three?

I like giving this advanced thought to.

Come up with a good plan. I like to not have a plan because he comes up with what's in the moment. So three lessons or three truths that you would share what's coming on your mind right now.

The first thing that I thought of is that people are wonderful. The next thing, maybe this counts as one. I don't know what your real rules are here.

Go ahead, you make them up.

The other thing or part of that, if you can't count it as two.

Count it as one.

Yeah. Is that you have to see the light in people. You have a happier life. You have a more fulfilled and loved life. Okay. And maybe three. The complainers, the people that say, you know, bring you down, that don't have a sense of humor. In fact, maybe I'd replace it with get rid of the clunkers and make sure you surround yourself with people who know how to laugh. You know, I only have friends that have a sense of humor. I learned years ago because I get great opportunities to have new friendships and I bring new friends in my life. I don't know how I squeeze them in. But my criteria, after I've. I've been with them once and I could tell they want to be my friend. I'm thinking they really make a good friend. I think I'll invite them. I stop and I say, do they have a sense of humor? If they don't have a sense of humor, I end it right there. Because people with a sense of humor bring a whole bag of delicious things with them. They're big hearted, they're sharers, they're generous in spirit and heart and physically they're generous. They're huggers. It's a big one to get hug.

I love hugging.

Hugging is good. So if you could just qualify to have a sense of humor, you wind up with a lot of good people in your life and you wind up as a result of that with a great life. Because think about what's more important in life than who you surround yourself with. It's choosing the right people. That's a big thing in everything you do.

That's it.

Yeah.

I love those. Those are great truths.

It's great truths. I don't know. Did that count as three? I hope so.

You have one more you want?

No, no, I don't have any more left. That's about it. I want to get out of here.

That's perfect. Well, I want to acknowledge you, Barbara, for constantly showing up consistently. You've been consistently funhearted over the last decade that I've been watching you on tv.

Sweetheart, you don't look old enough to have seen me that long.

You've been consistently creating big results in everything you touch or seemingly in everything you touch.

The ones I report.

Exactly. And you continually are a huge giver. I love that you want to show up. You don't have to do the work you're doing. You've made enough money, you've. You've had a lot of success, but you constantly show up.

Don't credit me for that. I'm very selfish. I enjoy it so much. It's self serving. Don't make it look like I'm here to give to everybody or not. I get it much more out of it, of course. Of course.

Well, I acknowledge you for everything you do. It's amazing. And you've got your show. Is there anything else you want to talk about? People can follow you on Instagram, Twitter.

Wherever they follow me every, everywhere. I have a big mouth. But the most important thing is if they're going to watch Business Unusual, tell me what you like and dislike about it. It's still in the motion, being invented. You've been there a long time.

I have. Six years.

Six years. Amazing what you've accomplished.

Almost 100 million downloads, 750 episodes.

Well, all of a sudden, I don't like you. It's funny how that just switched, right?

Hey, you've got a career that I admire. In other words.

Yeah, but I want to. I want to do it better. So I appreciate the feedback.

So Business Unusual. Check out out on podcast, on Spotify, on itunes. Subscribe now. Rate it, review it, and why don't.

You add in here? I'll give everyone who listens to Barbara's podcast 10 bucks if you write to me.

Really?

No, you say it, not me. Okay, you say it.

Oh, I'll pay the house. I was like, you're paying 10 bucks. Amazing.

No, no, no, no.

You can pay it.

Okay, I like that. My final question is, what's your definition of greatness?

Always really trying everything in your power to just try harder, to see it all work out, whatever it is.

Yeah.

Thank you. Appreciate it very much. Thank you.

My pleasure. I wish I could take you home with me.

Amazing.

There you have it, my friends. Such an inspiring and eye opening interview with Barbara Corkin. I loved in the beginning where I got her to kind of get uncomfortable and open up a little bit about relationships because she told me afterwards she was like, I wish you would have asked more business stuff early on because I wasn't prepared. And I said that's exactly what I wanted to go into to get you really talking about stuff that you haven't talked about very much. And I think by her doing that, we really allowed ourselves to open up up in a big way and share some powerful insights. So I hope you enjoyed this one. Make sure to share this with your friends. Lewishouse.com 766 tag Barbara on Instagram. Take a screenshot of this. Tag myself, Lewishouse. Let her know that you're watching this, that you're listening to this. I'm sure she would love to see all of your support and see what you enjoyed the most out of this. Put a quote up of hers that you liked and share it on your Instagram story. Make sure to check out her podcast as well. Business Unusual again. She's got some inspiring stuff, stories and insights over there and I really am enjoying her show. So make sure to check it out. Business Unusual as well as Shark Tank on abc. Powerful show. I love watching it. Big thank you to our sponsors and a big thank you to all of you. We continue to grow this podcast. We are almost at 100 million downloads. We're not there yet, but we're getting very close and it's all because of you. So I want to thank you so much for constantly showing up, for constantly listening and constantly sharing these episodes. We are always looking to grow at the school of greatness. We're always looking to improve, to find the best talent to bring on an interview, to find the best information to help you solve life's greatest challenges and optimize your great greatness inside of you. So we appreciate the support. If you haven't left a review yet, make sure to leave a review. If this is your first time here, please subscribe over on the Apple Podcast app, on itunes, on Spotify, or anywhere you like to listen to podcasts. We love your support and share these with a friend. We've got 766 episodes. We've got some incredible guests coming up very soon that I can't wait to share with you. So I thank you all for all of your support. And as Bill Gates said in the beginning, it's fine to celebrate success, but it's more important to heed the lessons of failure. Look at your life in the last six months and ask yourself, what are some of the smallest or biggest failures you've had? Really reflect on those. Reflect on how you can improve from those mistakes or failures you've made. See what you can do differently moving forward. Forward so you don't make those same mistakes or failures again. It's okay to fail. It's a necessary step on the path to success. Just make sure you don't make the same failures over and over again. Be aware of them. Take inventory. Give yourself the feedback you need and start moving forward with positive action towards your dreams. I love you so very much and you know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.

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