808 Rich Froning: Becoming The World’s Greatest
10 Jun 2019 · 66 min
In episode 808 of the School of Greatness, host Lewis Howes interviews four‑time CrossFit Games champion Rich Froning. The conversation traces Froning’s upbringing, the influence of his hardworking parents, and his early athletic pursuits before discovering CrossFit through a college strength‑and‑conditioning professor. He recounts his rapid rise—winning the Open, regionals, and the Games—highlighting the pivotal moment of finishing second in his first Games, which reshaped his mindset and fueled four consecutive titles. Froning describes his obsessive training routine, the evolution from individual to team competition with CrossFit Mayhem Freedom, and the physical toll of injuries (ankle fracture, meniscus tear) and his recovery strategies. The interview delves deeply into his personal life: meeting his wife Hillary, adopting three children, navigating infertility, and the lessons learned about presence, resilience, and love. Froning shares his philosophy on pain as a catalyst for growth, the importance of faith, community, and being present in every role. He reflects on the recent structural changes in CrossFit (sanctionals, media cuts) and how they affect athletes. The episode closes with his definition of greatness—being fully present wherever you are—and three core truths he wishes to leave behind: faith, being a present father/husband, and the impact of relationships.
Chapters
This is episode number 808 with four-time fittest man on earth, Rich Froning. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. T. Allen Armstrong said, Champions do not become champions when they win the event, but in the hours, weeks, months and years they spend preparing for it. The victorious performance itself is merely the demonstration of their championship character. I'm pumped about this one because we've got Rich Froning, who is one of the greatest of all time in CrossFit. He is a four-time Fittest Man on Earth, meaning he won first place at the CrossFit Games in 2011 through 2014. Didn't lose during that time. He also won the World Wide Open for three consecutive years. And when he retired from the individual competition, he captained his team, CrossFit Mayhem, Freedom in back-to-back Affiliate Cup Championships. His story was documented in a movie in 2015 called Froning: the Fittest Man in History, produced CrossFit. He currently owns and operates the gym CrossFit Mayhem in Cookeville, Tennessee, and has a podcast that he shares with his friends called Froning and Friends. In this interview, we dive in about a lot of different things. We talk about the mindset behind his unprecedented wins. How actually losing his first CrossFit games, getting second place, was the changing moment and defining moment that allowed him to win the next four years. years as an individual, the reason he stopped competing as an individual, how he's handled fear throughout his career, the journey of adoption, and the greatest lessons he's learned from his wife and adopting his children, and so much more. I'm very excited about this. If you're a fan, make sure to share this out with your friends, lewishouse.com/808. Tag myself @lewishouse and @richfroening over on Instagram. Let them know that you're listening to this while you're going through the process in the interview and text a friend or two. Let them know about this interview to send some inspiration and spread the message of greatness today. All right guys, I'm super excited about this one. Without further ado, let me introduce to you the world champ, Mr. Rich Froning.
Welcome back everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. We've got the iconic and legendary Rich Froning in the house.
That's right.
Good to see you brother.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
The greatest of all time CrossFit world, unless the new guy.
Yeah, unless Frazier, Frazier's got a couple more to get there.
He might be able to get there.
In the next few years.
Yeah, probably. I wonder what it would have been like if he was the same age as you and he would have started in 2000, 8, 9, 10.
10, yeah. Yeah, it's just different, you know, it's different eras, you know, it's like comparing Jordan and LeBron, that type of thing, where it's like, you know, when we started, it was like we were trying to figure stuff out and nobody really knew what we were doing and we were just kind of crushing ourselves all the time. And so now there's a model and a system.
Yeah.
He's an incredible athlete, you know, not, but it's just, it's different. It's just comparing different errors is hard. Sure. Um, but yeah, he's super fit, man.
It's, he's a good athlete. Good dude. He's a machine. So now I met you, I think in 2011 or 12 briefly at the game. Yeah. With Graham.
It was like in the athletes.
I got like a coach's pass. So I came back there with the enemy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think you'd won twice at that point, so it didn't matter. And I remember, you just having this reputation and I'm also friends with Webb.
I think Webb was from...
Okay, yeah. Yeah, Webb Smith, yep. And I remember you just always had this great reputation of being like the nicest guy, solid guy, Christian guy, just.
Like cared about family and the hardest worker in the room. Well, my parents, you know, that's all from them really, you know, that's the literally the anytime anybody asked me about my parents and how I was raised, it was like, you know, my parents were the hardest two working people in the room wherever we went. Really? And so yeah, that was just kind of it was understood when I was a kid, that's what you're going to do. If you weren't gonna find yourself something to do, they were gonna find you something to do. Really?
Yeah.
They're gonna put you in something that would help you.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, if we weren't outside, you were gonna, and weather was weather permitting, but if we weren't outside doing something, they were gonna find us something to do. So we were always trying to play a game or do whatever, but even on the days we found stuff to do, they were still finding us something to do.
Who did you have a deeper relationship with, mom or dad?
Both, really. I was a mama's boy when I was real little. really close with my mom still and, and, but, yeah, they were both have equal, equal parts responsibility in, in my upbringing. I'm still really close with my dad, too, so I couldn't say one way or the other. They're both, you know, have different, different things. You know, I got certain things from my mom, maybe a little bit more nurturing. I got, you know, kind of the, the hard line and, and some of the stuff that I use now with, from my dad.
Yeah.
But, you know, they were both the hardest workers ever.
What was the biggest lesson both of them taught you?
They weren't super, there weren't like a lot of speeches or a lot of like pep talks or anything like that. It was more lead by example. You know, they weren't gonna ask us to do anything that they weren't gonna do. Like if we were outside doing chores or doing work, they were right there with us doing it. And so I think that's probably one of the biggest things I learned from them is I'm not a, I'm not gonna get in, you know, on the team stuff. I'm not gonna get in the, get in anybody's face and, you know, I'm not a real rah rah, get you fired up in person, but they all know that I'm gonna be right there next to them and I'm not gonna ask them to do anything that I wouldn't do or I'm not gonna work just as hard as they are. that are going to be there. So that's probably, you know, somebody asked me about that a while back and I was like, I don't really, you know, I don't have any like particular speech I can go back to from either one of them. But they were always, they were always there. They were always present. You know, that was one thing when I think about now with my kids is like, I want to make sure that I'm there. You know, it doesn't have to be, you know, there doesn't have to be a big speech or anything like that. But it's, you know, when I needed something, they were both there. And so, it was pretty awesome.
Is there anything you missed from your parents growing up that you wish they would have given you, whether it be a mindset, a skill set, a nurturing-- yeah, energy.
You know, my dad is incredible, like building stuff, working with his hands. I was actually just talking about this. We, you know, build anything, can fix anything, do any of that stuff. I wish I had that. I can fix enough stuff, but I'm not, it's not my, you know, like, I'm not gonna go do that. But I think, you know, I was there helping him and doing that stuff, but I was more concentrated, like, I wanted to play sports, I wanted to do that type of stuff. So I don't, it can't blame him for that. for me not wanting to do that type of stuff growing up. But yeah, I mean, I wish I could-- Build a house, right? My dad is just like, oh yeah, that's broken. Let me fix this. Two seconds, it's knocked out. And I'm like, dang it. I wish I could do that. I could YouTube a video and I know enough that I've helped him a bunch growing up, but it just wasn't my thing that I wanted to do growing up. I wanted to be outside. I wanted to play baseball or play football in the yard where he was like, oh, I'm gonna go over here.
And work on this. And I'm like, oh yeah, I'll help.
You clean up when you're done or whatever.
Would you trade that for being the.
Greatest of all time? I don't think so. I don't think that, you know. Yeah, yeah, I think it worked out all right, you know. And so, you know, you can't really look back and be like, oh, I would change this, I would change that. I'm happy where I'm at. I learned from things that I moved on from, but my parents were awesome. But, you know, they did the best they could with, you know, with what they had.
So I'm super appreciative of them from that. Now, what got you into CrossFit in the first place? I never talked about this before, but how did you first discover it?
'Cause you were a star in baseball, and baseball is the main sport. Yeah, so I went to college to play baseball.
D1, D2?
It was a JuCo. And so it was Walter State. A lot of the guys had either been drafted and didn't go the round they wanted to, so they went JuCo ball, or they went to an SEC school and, or got an offer from an SEC school and they didn't wait three years to get drafted, so they went to Walter State. And I was neither of those things. 5'9 white guy, good glove, decent speed, lead-off guy, a dime a dozen. And so I got there, had a girlfriend back home, that's really the reason I was like, you know, ah, you know, I need to head back home.
And so the girlfriend made.
Yeah, she didn't really make me come. Why do girls always ruin everything? It's always, you know, it is what it is. And, and I hate it because they won the national championship the year that I was. Oh, no. And so, but, you know, I wouldn't be where I am now. So it is what it is.
And so I.
No, not my wife. So she knows the story. So it's all right. I went back and they had this program at Tennessee Tech, where I went, where you'd work as a full-time firefighter and they'd pay your tuition. It was actually the city of Cookville would do it. And so I worked as a full-time firefighter for four years, three and a half years while I was getting my undergrad. And I was taking a class in exercise science. And one of the professors was the head strength and conditioning coach who also did CrossFit, owned CrossFit Cookville at the time. And so he was like, man, you're into working out, you're a firefighter, a lot of military police fired, do CrossFit. You should check it out. So I said, 2008, 2009. I still have the textbook and I just wrote CrossFit.com on the inside of the book. And so I started reading the book or went to the website. I was like, oh, this is pretty cool. So I'd add some of the workouts in and then I ended up getting my level one in June of 2009. And then in July of 2009, my cousin moved down who's my coach, but glorified training partner.
Right.
Been with me since the beginning. And we started doing CrossFit. only CrossFit on July 1st that year. And so it's been be going on 10 years in a month. And so, yeah. And so kind of haven't really looked back from then. And then I didn't even know you could compete at the time. So we just kind of trained people. We couldn't afford the affiliation fee. And we would, you know, we'd say we use CrossFit methods, do it the legal way. And so we didn't know you could compete. And then we saw these videos, and we're like, oh, this is cool. So we tried some of the workouts from the 2000, I guess it was the 2009 games where they did. Savon did these videos, and we tried the workouts. I was like, oh, my times are pretty comparable and so were his. So we're like, maybe we should try this. And so I guess it was the beginning of that year they announced that they were doing sectionals. And so sectionals was in Huntsville, Alabama. There was a...
Played arena football there.
There you go. Nice. All right. I never want to go back. No, no, me either. It was on the way to spring break. And we were like, oh, on the way to spring break, we'll stop and.
See what it, you know, give it a shot.
And so that year you had to be in... What, 22, 23 at the time?
Yeah.
20, it would have been 22. and so I was like, if I'm in the top, because you had to be in the top 15. If you're in the top 15, sectionals. Yep. So go to Regional. So I was like, if I'm in the top 20, you know, we'll hang out. But if I'm, you know, there's 70 something guys. If I'm in the bottom 25, I was like, we'll get an early jump on spring break. Well, I was in first after the day, and I was like, all right, we'll hang out a little bit, see how it goes. And so went to Regionals, same type of deal. Didn't want to get last.
Ended up winning the region. Wow.
Went to the games and and we talked about it earlier.
You got second.
Fell off the rope. And that's been kind of the... That.
Was probably the greatest lesson you ever learned.
Yeah. That year. For sure.
As much as you wanted to win.
Yeah.
It probably made you so much more disciplined.
Oh, yeah.
Over the last nine years.
For sure. I go back and say, if I would have won that first year, I don't think I would have won the next four.
Wow.
Because, you know, I'd kind of narrowed my focus so much that I'd let CrossFit kind of define who I was, and it'd become my focus, and it put so much you know, into that, that, you know, when those type of things are taken away from me, you say taken away from you at second place, but for me, it was awful. It was like I was miserable for months. And so it really helped me. And I grew up a Christian and my faith has always been a huge part of it. But that really made me refocus and realize that's why I do what I do is, you know, those were my talents and they've been given to me and I'm going to bless him or, you know, glorify him with all that I have. And so it really made me focus on, all right, It's not about, you know, who I am and my identity is not in CrossFit. It was very freeing and, oh, like I didn't have to worry and it took a lot of pressure off. You know, I don't necessarily think that God willed me to win, but it was the fact that I didn't put so much of my identity in that, that it kind of loosened me up for that.
It's funny, because I remember I was training with Graham for two years before that, because I was playing professional football, arena football, he was training me in the off-seasons.
Right.
And this was about the time where he learned about CrossFit. Okay. And he was a trainer at a.
I think, Bill's gym.
Bill's gym.
Yeah.
He was a trainer there, and they were doing just kind of like sports specific training stuff, you know?
Right.
Kind of like Accelerate Ohio type, all those training facilities.
And.
But he was doing more and more CrossFit type stuff. I don't even know what it was. And he was. He said at one point, he's like, I'm gonna go and. there's like this, you know, world championship thing. I'm gonna go check it out. My goal is to get like top five. I did it last year and I think he was like, yeah, 20 or something. He's like, yeah, I'm hoping to get like top five. And then I remember like, cool, have fun. I had no clue what it was.
Right.
And I was like, good luck and I'll talk to you later or whatever.
And then it was like a month.
Afterwards I saw him, I go, oh.
How did that thing go? Yeah.
He's like, I won. I was like, what?
Yeah.
And then I really dove into CrossFit.
And learned about it.
I was like, wow, this is powerful. And that's when I heard about your name. You were, like, leading.
And then I ruined it.
Yeah.
But it's probably the greatest lesson in your life. For sure, man. Like, it's. It was, like I said, it was awful. I'm in that backing up, especially as.
A 22 year old where your whole life is.
Yeah.
Yeah. You gotta win. Yeah. Championship. And, you know, everybody asks, you know, how. Why are you so competitive? I was one of 32 first cousins. 25 of us are boys. Wow. So, I mean, it was this. And even the girls would beat us on a lot of stuff, you know, because. I mean, all athletes. And so, man, it was, I hate losing in anything. And so for that to happen and be so public, like, it could be just me and you and nobody else know, and I get embarrassed. Like, I still, it still drives me nuts to lose. And so to be, this is public. Public and just, you know, a failure. It felt like a failure. You're getting second. You know, everybody's like, oh, you got second. That's awesome. I was not, no.
And no part of me was happy about that. And so, yeah, for sure, it was like, all right, we're gonna lit a fire for the next couple years.
What did you think about the next.
12 months or however long until the next games?
What was the mindset?
Every morning.
Yeah, I mean, every day. Did you have a photo of Graham up on your wing mirror? It wasn't really, you know, you can't in CrossFit, you can't really concentrate on just one person. You know, it's like there's so many people that could, especially those years, you know, there was five or six guys that were always, you know, mixing it up for events and, and, you know, it was a tight field for a while. And so, yeah, I mean, every day, you know, I, that's one of the things I talk about is why people get, are so upset that I don't compete as an individual now. It's like, when I woke up every single day, my goal was to win the CrossFit Games every single day. Like, whatever I had to do that day was it was the CrossFit Games. That was my goal. And there was a lot of relationships and a lot of six years, right? Five, six years. Yeah, there was a lot of relationships. There was a lot of missed, you know, family time, stuff like that. And that was my goal. That's what I wanted to do. And that's I was going to do whatever it took. Like, I would, you know, 9 or 10:00 at night, I would part of me now is like, it was so probably counterproductive, you know, now knowing the stuff that I know and I've trained for as long as I have, I'm like, man, if I would have just been smarter, you know, it would have been better. And now, but you had to learn those things, you know, like, like I said earlier, we were kind of the guys that were figuring it all out. And so we had Lakeland, my first daughter. I was like, I can't do that. And, like, my goal needs to be being a dad and a husband first, and I just don't have that. Like, now it's, I do want to be super fit, and I want to, you know, win the games for my team, but it's now I've got, you know, three kids, a wife. business that I run first, and then I still compete and still have fun and get to do that. But it's not my number one goal. And I don't feel like if I was to go back as an individual, I don't have that. Like, I'm not going to sacrifice those things.
What were you doing? What were you doing those first two years afterwards?
Were you just training 10 hours a day? Oh, yeah, for sure. Every day, all day. You know, it was like a get up and, you know, everybody talks about, you gotta get up at 5am to be successful. No, I would sleep. Sleep was a huge part and is a huge part of recovery. And so I'd sleep until I, I would get up and then I would literally from you know, it might get up 8 30, 9 o'clock, but literally from nine o'clock until I went to bed at nine or ten o'clock again, that next night or that night I was training, doing obsessing, obsessing.
Obsessing. Yeah. What would it be like?
Was it just two hours in the gym doing lifting?
Yeah.
I mean, it was literally anything I could think of. You know, it was machines, it was real actual, like, strict CrossFit workouts. There was lifting, there was, you know, anything that I was like, oh, yeah, I should do that. Or, you know, I'd have a group of guys that would come in the morning, I'd have a group of guys.
That would come midday, and then I.
Have a group of guys that come afternoon and I might do the same stuff in those same states.
It was just like-- you-'re trying to beat them all.
If you're first, it didn't matter. Yeah, exactly. And so-- Wow. And I had-- it was a great, great group of people that, you know, they would beat me in or like push-- like I'd have a guy that would push me in something super heavy and then I have a guy that push me in something, you know, all body weight and then I have somebody that push me in the cardio type stuff. So it was a team effort even then. But man, it was-- yeah, if you look back at those years, you're like, man, I-- I, you know, we worked hard, but it was, it was maybe not the smartest at the time. Part of me just feels like I.
Missed those days, though.
Right.
Yeah.
Me, too.
All you do is train. That was it. You know, that's your life. That was all I wanted to do. And that was, I was gonna do it. And now, looking back, I'm like, man, that was, it was a lot of fun. But, man, it was, it was, some of it was stupid. You're like, why was I, you know, I would clean in the morning, and then I would do, you know, cleaning.
Again at that night, you know, it's.
Like, what am I doing? But I was like, oh, yeah. It'll help somehow.
Right. Did you get injured a lot through those phases?
Honestly, no. You have some overuse type stuff, but the only things that I have major injuries that I've had in 10 years and you're talking top 1%, so it's a profession now. It's not just CrossFit, so I'm not going to link these back to CrossFit. But, I came down off of a rope, twisted my ankle, and broke my ankle that was in 12 or 13, November 12 or 13. Stupid. We had, like, a Thanksgiving party at the gym, and Hillary left, and I was like, I'm gonna sneak something in real fast. And sure enough, I come down on the Rope, break my ankle, and I'm like, oh, man. So I, like, it's the only workout that I've ever quit. I was like, I was the first Rope climb, too. So I'm like, I can finish. I went to do another one. You know, like, you walk off an ankle sprain, and you're like, I'm all right.
This wasn't a walk-off ankle sprain.
And so I actually had to, like, drive with my left foot. That's the hardest thing to do. So bad. Right foot's up on the dash. I'm like, Stop the swelling. And I get home and Hillary's like, what's wrong? I'm like, I twisted my ankle a little bit. What were you doing? I was trying to show Henry how to climb a rope and blah, blah, blah. She's like, oh, okay. Well, she's like, Should you go to the hospital? I'm like, no, I'm fine. Well, so about middle of the night, I get up to pee and I go to stand and just immediately hit the floor. So I scoot on my butt to the bathroom. And so I get back to the bed and Hillary's like, We're going to the hospital in the morning. I'm like, yeah, you're right. Wow. And so I get an X-ray, sure enough, it's broken. So that was an injury I had. Honestly, you know, I've had little like, you know, overuse type things and, you know, shoulder stuff, but nothing major. That's pretty amazing. I tore my meniscus in 17 and that was, that has been the most frustrating thing is because it was like, oh yeah, you know, so tore it the week before regionals. Doing a workout in the basement, was gonna do three rounds. It was just like ski, double under, burpee over the parallette, and then rest. It was like an interval type thing. I was gonna do three rounds. When I did three rounds, I was like, I might as well do four. on the fourth round on the 90th double under, I just feel something. It just doesn't feel right. Doesn't really like pop or anything, but doesn't feel right. I'm like, oh, okay. It starts to swell up. Can't put any pressure on it. Like, all right. So I go the next day, see some PTs at the gym. They're like, I think you just maybe sprained your MCL. I was like, take it easy for a couple days. So I did a bunch of upper body stuff, and it's a week before Regional, so I'm like, I can't completely take time off. I probably could have been and been fine.
Yeah.
So the next day, the next morning, we're doing a workout. swimming in my dad's pond. We're doing dumbbell snatches. I go to dive into the pond and I just feel something. Oh, no. Let go. And you're like, oh, no. And you're like, leg kind of goes like, oh, no, man. And you're like, you're like, oh, that's not good. So I finish, finish the workout. Oh, I'm an idiot. I'm an idiot. And I'm like, tell the team. I'm like, hey, we need to talk to John Lindy, who was on our team. It was our alternate. I was like, you need to get him, get his mind right because I don't know what's going to happen. So I text one of our, he's a PA at the gym. It's like, meet me at the office. So he does these tests. He's like, you told your meniscus. I'm like, what do I do? And he's like, good news is you can't really make it worse. He's like, if you can handle the pain, like, if we can get some.
Of the swelling down, you can probably still compete.
Shut up.
And so he gives me a cortisone shot.
Oh, my gosh, man. And so I go see a surgeon, and he's an ex-NFL surgeon. He's like, yeah, you'd be fine. He's like, as long as you can handle the pain, he's like, you can get through Regionals. He's like, we'll look at it after Regionals, see how the cortisone shot does. He's like, we can do the surgery. You got Six to eight weeks before the games, we'll do the surgery. No way. He's like, or you can wait till after the games. So I did the cortisone shot and felt fine, like was good. So I was like, you know what? I'll be, I think I'll wait till after. I might even do the surgery. After the games? Yeah, I might even do the surgery. I'm about halfway between training from regionals in the games. That cortisone shot wears off and I'm like, I need another cortisone shot. So I got another cortisone shot, which had to do it, not wish, kind of wish now I wouldn't have, but then I had surgery the week after the games in 17. so you did the games. Did the games with the tormeniskus. With the tormeniskus.
We got second that year.
Oh, man. It was frustrating. But then I had surgery, man, and it never got better. And I was frustrated. So I did stem cell, I did the hyaluronic acid, I did a bunch of stuff. And for, like, a year and a half, the hyaluronic acid in the stem cell kind of helped. But I still was like, some days it would be great, and other days it would be like, depending on what I did the day before, it would be awful. And so I was like, even that was going up until December of this year and then met this doctor in Cookeville and he does, it's called strain counter strain therapy and so, and then he did some acupuncture and I'm back to about 95% pretty crazy. Like those were the, the meniscus was the hard one because it was like, you know, you just, you can't load anything. You can't do anything. Can't do anything. Squatting, jumping squatting, it would get so swollen. I couldn't run, couldn't squat, couldn't jump rope maybe. No, and it was just frustrating and so, but man, I found this guy in town. Everybody's like, Did you go to Nashville? And I'm like, no, it's Cookeville, Tennessee. This guy's a genius. And it's basically all but fixed it. You know, like still, like, there's days I need to be smart. Like yesterday we walked around at Disney.
For eight hours and it's a little like tender today.
But man, he's a magician.
Wow.
Pretty cool.
Wow.
Okay. So very minimal injuries. Very minimal, yep.
And after you got second the first year, you went four years back to back.
Four years.
Four years.
Did you ever feel challenged at all?
Oh, yeah. Every year. You know, I'd always, and we were talking about, you know, when people dig their holes at the beginning of the weekend, I had a couple years where I would do that. Like, I got 27th in 11 on the first event. I got 27th on the first event, I think, in 13 and then 14, I had another event that was terrible. And so I always decide to, like, dig a hole and then have to climb out of it, but just make it interesting. Right.
Make it come back.
But, yeah, no heck, no. I mean, back then, you know, There was a lot of guys that were, you know, right in the mix all the time. You know, Calipari was on the podium several years in a row. You had Graham super fit, you know, Bailey, you had Matt Chan, you know, kind of all the originals, all the guys I competed with in the Legends event last weekend. But yeah, it was just a different time, you know, it was a little.
Bit different than it is now.
Where is CrossFit now compared to 10 years ago? Oh, well, with all the global... It is. Yeah. Well, and you know, all these changes we've talked about, this year, it'll be interesting to see what happens. It's grown exponentially and the games last year were, I think, one of the best games we've had. Really. Especially being in Madison, they moved it from California. It kind of, the first year in Madison, it almost felt like a glorified regional. It didn't feel like the games, but last year it felt awesome. It felt like the games, it felt.
Like, you know, back.
They should do it in Ohio State. There you go. Rogies, man. It would be cool. I mean, who knows with this new system what's gonna happen? and so yeah, it's kind of frustrating just to see all these, you know, we felt like we got to this really good point and then everything completely changed. Why did they change it? You know, Greg, you know, Greg's the owner of CrossFit and he's the, he wanted to see these changes and it's his deal and he can do whatever he wants. And so, you know, that's what he wanted to do. And so now we have all these sanctionals, which I think are a cool idea, you know, what's that, what's that mean? So, you know, we used to have regionals, used to go to the open, Regionals and then games. And so basically you built on each other. The top three from Regionals go or whatever it is. Yeah, whatever it is. And so now it's like you have the open. And so this year what they did with open was the top 20 individuals, men and females got an invite to the CrossFit Games.
Automatic.
Automatic. Top 20 in the open. So you don't have to go to Regionals anymore. Nope. And so. Oh, really? That also if you won your country. Wow. And as long as there's an affiliate in your country. you can go to the CrossFit Games if you win your country.
So then that means anyone could go to some country.
But it has to be your passport country. So like wherever your passport is issued.
You can like apply for anything.
So whatever country, then you can go to the games.
It's like Olympic stuff now.
Now they have these sanctional events. So any, not any, but you have to go through CrossFit. You pay whatever fee to call yourself a sanctional event. So this year there were 14 or 15. So if you won one of those sanctionals, you got to go to the CrossFit Games.
Man, it sounds like you guys are.
In for a wild ride. It's going to be easier to go now. Yes, and so as individuals, well then teams, the only way you can go to the games is if you win a sanctional. No open, no nothing. So there's only like 15 teams or 14 teams going to go to the games this year. However, there's going to be a hundred and I think 160 something men and 160 something women. Huge. Where there used to only be 40. Right, 40. 40 men, 40 women. So now the deal is allegedly the first day of the games they're gonna have one or a couple events and they're gonna cut like the field in like huge. And so basically if you, that's cool. If you won, I think your open rank somehow they're like however you qualified has precedent over how somebody else qualified. I don't remember how exactly.
Because if you have the worst event first and you're the best in the world, exactly.
There needs to be some type of of net, safety net. So it'll be interesting. It's just gonna be different. You know, it's kind of frustrating. CrossFit cut all of the games media. There's no games media anymore.
What does that mean?
So like any of the videos that they would produce, CrossFit would produce, they're gone for the games. So now they're like, like marketing videos or like everything. So now why they did that money, I guess he was like, it's expensive. He's wanting to, Greg's trying to concentrate more on the health side of things instead of the game side, where I feel It's a good idea. I think for a while we got too caught up in the CrossFit Games, the top 1%. I think there's value to that, and I think we don't need to completely abandon it. But he's concentrating on the health side of things and getting people moving and trying to reach an older type of crowd. And I feel like maybe he got a little scared that people got intimidated seeing the Games and they think injury and all that stuff. But you got to look at it as two completely separate entities. The Games is literally, it's a showcase of what CrossFit can do, but it's not CrossFit. You know, CrossFit is the community, it's the gyms, it's the affiliates, it's the people that do CrossFit. It's not the CrossFit games. And so we've kind of swung completely another direction where it's kind of like, I would like to see almost like middle direction, but like I said, it's Greg's to do and he runs the show and it is what it is. So back to it, there's no actual games media anymore. He's kind of relying on these other, you know, there's a called Morning Chalk Up, there's some other publications that are doing the media type stuff for it. So, I mean, it's actually opened up an avenue for us. Like, we know we have our own YouTube channel when we produce our own videos. We have in-house media. So it is good. And, you know, it's kind of the whole market that he does with the affiliates where it's like the cream rises to the top type of deal. So we'll see. It's just a lot of change in such a short amount of time. There hasn't been a ton of communication about it. Like, they cut Instagram. Like, there's no now, no CrossFit. Instagram, no CrossFit HQ or Facebook.
What?
Something about privacy issues with Facebook. So last two weeks ago, no way. Almost like it's gone.
All the content is gone.
There's Twitter still because it's not Facebook owned. Completely got rid of Instagram and Facebook. That's the games. CrossFit HQ, all of it gone.
The website's still up.
The website's still up. That seems kind of crazy.
Kind of crazy. But hey, it's his, like I said, it's his. Maybe someone else happening behind the scenes.
Who knows? But everyone is on Facebook and Everyone to promote and tag and share. And so it was just like, all right, we're done. And it was just like, gone. So CrossFit HQ or the CrossFit Instagram was gone first.
At CrossFit Games is still gone?
Was for a day and then it was gone the next day. And so you're kind of like, all right, see you. Peace. Wow. So yeah, there's been a lot of changes in the last couple weeks and a lot of people are frustrated and fired up. You know, you talk to people in the gym and they're like, what's going on? And it's just like, the problem is there's just lack of communication. And, you know, he's going on these podcasts and There's a couple like CrossFit, traditional CrossFit podcasts, and he's kind of talking about why he's doing this stuff, but it's, there's no media anymore to kind of tell you why it's going on. It is what it is, you know? And so then I'd also heard that he turned down the viewer, like, I think Facebook actually offered to broadcast the games and turn that down. And so you're just kind of like, so right now, apparently, there's nobody to broadcast again. ESPN or no? CBS Sports was, and I'd heard, hearsay, you know, you kind of hear different things and CBS Sports is was turned down as well. So we'll see if the games is even broadcast. Crossfit.com, maybe. I don't know. You know, that's what they did for years, but there's no media. So what are you gonna do?
It's kind of interesting, man.
It's kind of gotten, it's wild west right now.
So I feel like it's always been that.
It has. And that's every year something changes when somebody, you know, when you have one person that runs a show and they can do what they want to do, you know, that's, it's, yeah, that's what it is. Wild West.
How do you think your mindset is different than the rest when you are competing at the highest level as an individual? How do you feel like, because everyone can work the same amount of workload.
Right.
Right.
And I feel like there's probably guys that did just as much.
Yeah, I think there's probably people that are mentally or physically fitter.
Yeah.
How did you, how did you train the mind to prepare yourself for the whole world to try to take you down?
Yeah. So I, you know, I think it was kind of a mix of everything. My entire growing up, I talk about my parents. I talk about the hard work and the leading by example. And they were always, there was always something to do. There was that. There was me being one of 32 first cousins. Everything was competitive. Everything was a competition. Now I realize it was my parents trying to tire us out and, hey, run around the pond. Let's see who can run around the pond the fastest as kids. We're like, yeah, let's do it. and so that type of stuff. And so there was that. And then, you know, high school baseball, I had an incredible high school baseball coach that would push us and we would always joke that we ran more than the track and cross country team. And, you know, he was huge in the mental toughness. And, you know, he said he did CrossFit before CrossFit was a thing. That's his joke now. And, you know, we would do these workouts and now I look back having an exercise science degree and I was like, what the heck were we doing? But it was hard and it was mentally tough and, you know, that was his deal and mental toughness and there was that. And then I had, you know, being in the fire department and those lessons that I learned from that. I think it's just a mix of all of it. I don't think there was one thing that I can pinpoint down or think about the mentality of, you know, what one thing it was. I think it was just a mix of all of it, you know, and like wanting to win the games where having the atmosphere where I could do that, like having those guys that would train with me in the mornings, in the midday, in the afternoon, those to push me and, you know, my cousin the same way and, you know, just all that, all of that into one. perfect storm, I guess. There wasn't, there's not one thing that I can be like, oh yeah, that was it.
How did you feel like you handled the pressure though, during those first few years where it seemed like a lot of pressure?
Right.
You know, so many people there, it's on the line, each event matters, or you lose. What did you think about before every event would start? Or in the middle when you're like, gosh, I'm exhausted.
Yeah.
Like, this person's crushing me right now.
How did you stay focused? Yeah, I think a huge part of that, like I said, was my faith and not having such a, you know, not having that pressure. There was still pressure. I'm not gonna say that I didn't have pressure on me, but it took some of that pressure off.
And what would you think about in that moment when you felt like, oh, this pressure is on me. What would you say to yourself?
Well, the good thing was, I'd had that rope fall and I'd embarrassed myself greatly. Way more than I was gonna embarrass myself again. So it was kind of like, I've already done the worst. The worst that it could happen. in my mind was the worst thing that could happen. And so it was like, it's gonna be all right. And then the more and more I competed and the more and more the years went on, I noticed that, hey, it's not about one event. As long as there's damage control, there's certain events you're not gonna do great at if you can damage control in those events. And I think that was one thing that I kind of figured out a lot earlier than people was, everybody was like, when I go out there, I compete against myself and I just do the best that I can. blah, blah, blah, and all this stuff that people want to tell themselves when they don't want to either don't want to push hard or don't want to take credit for their, you know, something happening. So what I learned was you can watch people and watch, you know, hey, I need to stay ahead of so and so, you know, there's times that were it bit me in the ass, but it was like, you know, luckily for us, you kind of knew what lane you were in, what is what place you were in. And so you could figure out, all right, so and so is maybe better at this, But if I'm within a, either a rep or two or a person or two of them, I can make up points or not lose too many points, and then I can get ahead of them in another event. And so I kind of learned that, you know, and you would kind of call audibles in the middle of it. You're like, oh, I gotta push here. I need to, like, do whatever. And so I think that was something that I, one of the things that I figured out a lot earlier than people was it is a sport. Like, as much as, you know, it's just working out. There is some strategy to it.
There is.
You'Re trying to game things and you're trying to like, all right, I know this movement is kind of a rest for me, so I can kind of push here, or, you know, this movement's going to be a little bit harder, so I need to slow down and, and gaming workouts. And that was something I think training so much and doing so many different things that I did in the volume that I did that I learned, you know, had done certain combinations of movements. They may not have done the exact workout, but I knew how they kind of played off of each other. And so that was something that I'd learned. pretty early on and helped a ton.
That's great. How did you handle fear throughout the career?
Yeah, I mean there were times where especially I remember specifically one time in 2013. So, I'd gotten 27th on a pool event. I got second on a rowing event that was the half marathon, but you started out with a 2K sprint, which was the worst thing ever. So, I went 27th, second, seventh, I think on the marathon, and then I went seventh, I think, on the burden run. Well, Kalipo had went first, first, first, first. So he had, like, a huge lead, and I'm just in pissed off, and I'm in a horrible mood. And my wife comes up, and we're kind of sitting in the athlete area between events, and she's like, you don't look like you're having fun. I was like, I'm not having fun. I'm in, like, I was probably in, like, third or fourth at that time. This is awful. Like, whatever. And she's like, go get your stuff. What do you mean, get my stuff?
Stuff.
She's like, if you're not having fun, we need to go home. And I was like, what are you talking about? Like, I'm gonna go get my stuff. Leave this. Like, I trained all year for this. She's like, you do the best when you have fun. And I'm like, back. Like, she's never played any type of sports. Like, anything like that. She did when she was really young. Like, she played basketball and stuff like that. But she never in high school, she's the least competitive, could care less about anything CrossFit related. But she was like, go get your stuff. We're leaving. Go tell Dave we're leaving. I was like, what are you talking about? Then she's like, well, then start having fun. And I was like, all right, well then it. And, you know, I didn't, like, start having fun immediately, but I turned around, so she always takes credit for, you know, that, that year that she was. She was. But, yeah, I mean, it's like, you know, you try to have as much fun as you can, and. And over the years, you learned that when I first started competing, like, a month out, like, my nerves would start getting me, and you're like, man, you know, butterflies and all that. Well, then, you know, after a year or two, it two weeks out, then it was starting, then it was like a week out. Now it's like, two days before, yeah. Now it's like the event, the event of, then I start getting a little nervous still, you know, everybody's like, you still get nervous? I'm like, heck yeah, I still get nervous. I think when you stop getting nervous is not fun anymore, you know? That's true. But yeah, I think it's just the nerves and, you know, being a competitor and you have that, like, before it, you know, you have all this build up, but then literally as soon as 3-2-1-GO happens, it's just like, you gotta go. It's just like everything goes away, you know, you talk about flow or whatever it is, but it literally, like, I can't tell you any music that's played during events, you can't hear any of the cheers, you can't hear any of that stuff. You're just kind of in it and you just kind of go through it and it's kind of, it's hard to explain, you know, it's just like a competitive nature. You know, it's hard to, people are like, what makes you so competitive? I'm like, I don't know, it just, it is, it's just something that you just get into and you don't really think about those things. Yeah, the workout sucks and it's gonna hurt and, you know, for a long time, you know, like I said, I have those certain things that go through my head. I'd write Bible verses on my shoes and think about, you know, the crucifixion of Christ and those were the things early that really got me. But then it's just like after you've done it for so long, it's just what you do. You know, it's like you just get into that space and you get in that zone and it's just let's go.
You've already experienced the pain so much.
You're like, I know it's gonna hurt. Yeah, it's gonna hurt. You know, it's when is it gonna hurt? You know, like most of the time you're like, all right, this workout's gonna take 10-15 minutes, but you know the pain is really gonna set in about minute nine minutes, you know, depending on whatever the workout is. But yeah, it's just it's like you've almost become not numb to the pain because it still hurts. But you almost like embraced that pain and you just know it's almost like a sick twisted thing where you're just like, this is what it is, you know? And it's, I was talking, I've got kind of an addictive personality and there's, you know, some substance abuse in my family history, but I've never had any substance abuse, but I think working out is probably my substance abuse. Yeah, it really is.
How important is pain for everyone in the world? to experience on a daily or weekly basis. It's when you grow, man.
You know, it's. It's. You never grow and you never move forward when you're comfortable, you know? Like, you've gotta. As bad as it sounds, you got to go out and you got to seek that stuff. You have to. That's when. That's when you. You get better, and that's when you grow. I think it's same as physically, you know, like when it hurts, that's when, you know, something good is happening. So you almost embrace that where it's like, this is gonna. but I know on the other side, I'm gonna come out better. And it's the same way mentally. It's like, if you're not pushing, you're.
Not, you're not growing. Why do so many people resist pain.
When they know it's either their upbringing or it's, it's, they've never had that, or they just, they just don't enjoy it. You're not gonna enjoy pain. Like, let's be honest. You know, we, we talk about, like, some of the most miserable experiences when you're done with it, you're like, that was awesome. You know, like, you go out and seek these, like, challenges. I never want to do this again. But this in the middle of it, you're like, you know, I went on this El Con mountain trip for six days. And for the first three days, it was awesome. The fourth day downhill, we didn't see any elk. I hiked 60 miles in six days, like sun up to sundown, going through the woods. And I'm like, this is miserable. Like, I hate this. And then I got done. I'm like, I can't wait to do that again.
You know?
Like, you're just like, it's sick and it's twisted, but, you know, like, you're growing in that, you know, as long as it's productive pain. Like, there's different. Like, there's certain things that aren't productive. as long as it's something good, you know, you're on the other side, you're going to come out better. And I think, I don't know, I don't know if it's hard for me sometimes to relate to other people that are like, how do you get there that you want to, you want to compete or you want to go to that pain? I'm like, how do you not want to? How do you not see the benefit of it? It's hard sometimes for me to like talk to people that don't get that, you know, like you get it, you know, we're just talking about it, but it's hard for me, you know, it's just hard to like relate to that because I don't know I don't know what makes me want to do that. But my wife, she's similar. She's like, I don't want to do that. I don't want to do anything that's painful. Like, I just, for me, that's just.
How I do it. Why do you think you're wired that.
Way to want it? I don't, I think it's that perfect mix of everything that we talked earlier. It's just, because you want to win that badge. I want to win that badge. It's not even, I want to win that badge. I don't want to lose. I don't want to make an idiot of myself. Like I said, it could be just us two and nobody else could be watching. But it still just drives me crazy. And it's ridiculous. You know, like if you really look back and like, yes, you know, like we're saying, you want to grow through pain, but like some of the stuff, it's like, why does that cause, like, why am I so caught up in that? But it's just the way I am. It's just the way I'm wired, just the way I've always been wired. How did you meet your wife? Met my wife getting my hair cut. I was a firefighter getting off shift and we had a mutual friend that she cut my hair and she colored Hillary's hair. And so while Hillary was getting her hair colored, I was getting mine cut. And we'd actually both gotten out of like four year, four or five year long relationships. We were both miserable in those relationships and finally got out of them. And I was a perfect gentleman to every woman that I ever dated. My mom was always like, open every door, do whatever. And I was a jerk to Hillary. And she kept coming. I was like, I'm not ready to get in a relationship, you know, like, Wanna have some fun? I gotta go like, Spring Break. Exactly. And so I'm like, like was a complete just jerk to her. Really? And she just kept coming and was like, I don't know. She doesn't take any crap either and would just like, there was one time, this is awful and I'm such a jerk for doing it, but she came to visit me at the fire station, kind of met her, introduced, this was like a little bit later on when we were, like we'd kind of hung out and talked and text and all that stuff for probably three or four months and I was just like, you know, I'm not ready, I'm not ready and all this stuff. So we, she comes to the fire station, I introduced her to all the guys and she's going to leave and take her out to her car, open the door, let her in. And she's like, so what are we? Are we talking?
Are we texting?
What's our deal? Together?
Are we? Yeah.
And I'm like, I don't like titles. The stupidest thing I could have ever said, ever. And she goes, Don't ever talk to me again. Wow. Okay, that's not good. So the next day. So you text her the next day? I didn't text her the next day, 'cause I was like, All right, I'm gonna see what happens. The next night, she goes, why the hell have you text me all day? I was like, you, told me not to. And so I was like, All right, this girl, you know. So she can dish it out, She's perfect. Like she's completely, the statement opposites attract are literally me and my wife. But we work really well together and she supports me and everything and I support her and her things and you know she could care less about anything CrossFit related. You know we, she, really?
This is your whole life.
Whole life man. She doesn't care about it. Listen to this.
So she supports you and shows support.
She's my biggest fan but she could care less, like, as long as, you know, whatever. And so we have three kids, our oldest, Lakeland. She bought all the most expensive, like, dolly clothes for her. And Lakeland hates them now. But at the time, you know, Lakeland maybe wore this stuff once, twice, whatever. So I'm doing some laundry one night with her. And so full laundry, I take it up to Lakeland's room. I open this closet, and it's just like the. The amount of money hits me that we spent on these clothes, and it's just.
I've been using the light.
Oh.
And so I'm like, whatever. So, you know, and we had some infertility issues and all that stuff and Lakeland's adopted and all three of our kids are adopted. So I, you know, it wasn't, didn't really, like, I would give her crap about spending money, but I'm like, hey, you know, we waited long enough for this kid. Like, yeah, yeah. You know, I want her to, and so this is years later. And so I walked back downstairs and I'm like, I have to be a dick. Like, I'm just, I just want to know, how much money do you think is in that closet up there? And she's like, It's a hobby. And I was like, it's an expensive hobby. And she goes, well, if you weren't so good at CrossFit, that would be an expensive hobby. And I was like, that doesn't make sense at all. That pays for this stuff. Like, yeah, this is what I do. And she's like, well, you know what I mean. And I'm like, no, actually, I don't know what you mean.
So that's, in a nutshell, that's our relationship is she could care less. But she's super supportive.
What's the biggest lesson that you've learned.
From her over the last eight years.
Oh, man.
Through her journey.
Yeah.
Supporting you.
Too many probably to list. I mean, she's the most with the stuff that we went through with, you know, infertility, with adoptions, with failed adoptions and all that stuff. She's the most just resilient woman I've ever met, but also the most caring and loving, you know, like now she'll go, like if somebody's had any type of any, you know, like she had a friend that had a failed IUI or like whatever, it's a fertility treatment. And you know, it's devastating, like watching Hillary go through that. You know, for me it was a little bit like until I knew we were having a kid or something was until we had the kid in our hands, I was okay. But for her, anytime anything failed or any adoption failed, just watching her, like it was like she had gotten so like, that's our kid. And then it wouldn't happen.
And it was just, it was awful. Oh, man.
But she's, you get your hopes up, you get your hopes up. But watching her do that, it was almost like, too, like, you know, we had the disappointment of not having that, but then watching her was, like, double because she would just get so just distraught. And so, but she's now so supportive for these women or anybody who is going through that. And so it's, it's just, she's the most caring person on that side, and.
It'S, it's pretty cool.
Did you guys know you wanted to have kids? Pretty Yeah, yeah, yeah. When we talked, you know, when we first, you know, got serious and we were kind of talked about family, 'cause you know, you're 20 years old, you're like, Hey, you know, it's coming. And we, our plan was to have three biological and adopt one. That was our plan. And so we're like, yeah, let's do that. And so when we finally decided to start having kids, we were like, It's not working. And we went and got all these tests done. And they're like, no, you're both completely healthy. There's no reason why this can't happen. And so we tried for a couple of years. Well, then Hillary went on like hormone therapy and that was a nightmare. And then, you know, like even having those, like she's like, I'm pregnant. I think I'm pregnant. And I'm like, do you have a test?
No, no, but I think it.
I'm like, let's hold back here. And well, you know, she'd get so caught up and then, you know, it wouldn't happen. So she gets, and it was just watching that those things happen. And then so she came to me and she's like, what if, and we were talking about doing IVF and I was like, I don't want to pay for IVF for a chance and it not happen. and so she's like, what about adoption? I'm like, I just don't know if I could, looking back, this is the stupidest thing ever, but I was like, you know what? I don't think I could adopt my first kid. Like, I just don't feel like, she's like, we'll just think about it, pray about it. And I was like, I just don't think I can. Well, then she was like, finally I was like, let's look into it. Well, she found Lakeland's birth mom. She had a family back out. That was the day that Hillary actually talked to her through a video call. an agency, the lady, the family had backed out the day that Hillary talked to her. And she was like, this is kind of weird. This is kind of a godsend. Let me process this and I'll get back to you. So she talked to Hillary a couple days later and she's like, I'd like to meet you and, you know, have lunch and kind of figure it out.
And so this girl is eight months.
Pregnant at the time. Oh my gosh. This was my last year as an individual at the CrossFit Games. I'm like, okay. And so she's like, she meets Hillary, loves Hillary. She's like, I'd like to meet your my husband. Well, met her. She's like, yep, let's do this. And so that was a month before the games. Lakeland was born two weeks before the cross. Oh, my gosh. We were both in the room. I cut the cord. So then, yeah, we had to, like, it was finalized, actually, on my birthday, because in Tennessee, there's a 14. It was a 14-day waiting period. So, like, at any time during those 14 days, she could have came back.
And said, I want to keep the.
Gosh. And so you're just waiting, waiting. It was awful.
And the game started that day. Yeah.
And we finalized my birthday the next day we started the CrossFit game. So it was the kind of a world when Lakeland came out here with us. She was two weeks old on a plane, all that type of stuff. Man, it was, it was chaos. But it was awesome. And I won. And so I was like, all right, that's amazing. We're good. Yeah, it was hard.
It was a, it was a, it's an emotional, tough game.
It's your last one. Everyone's talking about Right. Yep. And so it was rough, but it was awesome. And then, yeah, it's kind of funny. So we had Lakeland during the games. We had Trice, my son, during regional, like a couple weeks before regionals, and then Violet, our youngest, we got the first week of the open in '18. So it's like we always games regionals open.
So.
So you've adopted three children.
Adopted three. Yep.
What's it like being a father of adopted children versus How do you feel not having a biological child?
Never once does it cross my mind that those aren't my kids. They're my kids. I don't know the feeling of having biological children, but I could not love these kids anymore. They're our kids, you know, like.
They were yours in the first day.
Yeah, so Lakeland was there the first. We got her immediately. Like I said, I was there, cut the cord. Trice was nine days old. He was in the NICU. When we got him, that was a kind of a crazy story, too. We had a couple failed adoptions. I was tired of watching Hillary go through that. And so I was like, you know what? I'm perfectly content with Lakeland. Like, let's pump the brakes with this. She was like, I feel like we have another kid out there. And I'm like, I'm not watching you go through this. Let's take a little break. And she's like, Fill out this paperwork. And I'm like, I can't fill out this paperwork because I can't watch it. Like, I'm not doing this. So she comes up to me. She's like, you,'re gonna fill out this paperwork. I'm like, All right, I'll fill out the paperwork. But this is the last time. This is it. I'm not doing it. If it doesn't work, I'm not going through anymore. So it was a lawyer in Florida. And so she overnights the paperwork because it was due the next day. We get an email that night and they're like, hey, you're one of 20 families. This girl wants this baby to go to somebody. He's already been born. He's nine years, nine days old. He's four pounds, three ounces. He's in the NICU. She wants him to go to a family that doesn't have any kids. We're like, crap.
Crap.
But in the 20, you know, there's two or three that don't have kids, and they, they won't, they don't list the names. They just list ages, names of, or not names, but number of kids, ages of the kids and whatever and where they live. And so we get an email that night. It's like, you're one of the top five. And so Hillary's all excited. I'm like, just calm down. Yeah, yeah. I'm not the brakes. And so the lawyer calls a couple hours later, and he's like, how soon can you get to Jacksonville, Florida? I'm like, well, I mean, we can be there the next morning. Mind you, this is a month before regionals. I'm like, okay, here we go. And so we drove to Jacksonville, Florida, and we met Trice and Richard III is his name, but we call him Trice. And so we've had Trice since he was nine days old. And then Violet is actually our youngest. She's Lakeland's biological half sister. Hillary stays in touch with the birth mom. You know, it's not an open adoption, but she'll give her updates. And so she reached out to her on Facebook and was like, hey, I had another baby and can't keep her. keep her or would you guys take her? And we're like, of course. And Trice was 10 months old at the time. That was tough. The 10 months and Violet was super colicky and it was hard. Really hard. Now she's an angel. She's our sweetest kid. Trice is a disaster. He's literally like 100% boy, all go all the time. But it's awesome to see, you know, like they're not biological, but they, like if you look at Lakeland and the way she acts, it's Hillary and myself like combined and then Trice Trice the same way. And, like, you don't think about the things that the kids pick up on, but now the older two go to me, go with me to the barn or to the, the gym a ton. And so, like, I've never once told them, hey, let's work out. But Lakeland loves to work out. Like, when I say work out, she swings around on the pull-up bar. She'll make, like, obstacle courses. She'll run around. She has a little barbell, picks up dumbbells, Trice is the same way. He tries to follow her around all the time. He's two, but, yeah, it's the things. It's kind of cool to, everything comes full circle. Like I'm never once, like I said, I'm not gonna be a, like get in their face rah-rah type of parent, but the things that they pick up on, you don't realize. And so that for me is another motivator now is like, hey, I need to, these kids are watching. Like that's, they're the most important thing to me. And the things that they pick up on, like I've gotta like, you know, when you get a little emotional, you're like, all right, I need to rein it in a little bit because, you know, that's where they feed off of it. And you don't think about it 'cause you're like, they're two years old or four years old or one year old, they're not gonna pick up on some of this stuff, but they do, man. It's insane what they pick up on everything.
Where do you think it'd be if you weren't married during those five years in the games? Do you think you'd have won?
No, I don't think so.
Without being married?
I don't think so, I think.
Yeah.
I mean, there's some type of focus there that, you know, you can't replace. And like I said, Hillary kept me super grounded during those years and still does, you know, she could literally care less about. Like, I'm like, hey, I snatched 300 pounds. Take out the garbage. Or like when in one of the events, the overhead squat event, you know, I tried to put 400 pounds over my head and she's like, why did you do that? I'm like, I mean, I was trying to win the event. She's like, I just don't think it's necessary that you put that much weight over your head. Why do you ever need to do that? And I'm like, thank Thanks, you know, she could literally care less. But like I said, it's good, you know, because like, I know that my worth to her is not in, in the stars.
Based on track record, you're like, I.
Don'T, I don't have, that's something, a piece of, of the equation I can take out is like, oh, I have to do this for my wife to stay with me. My wife's like, no, you have just, like, watch the kids. That's how, you know, she's gonna stay around. But, so it's, it's been a very, she's been awesome for for, you know, getting me to where I am. She's a huge part of it.
That's amazing, man.
Yeah.
And transitioning into the team, you guys won once or. Well, we won three times. Three times.
Three times. Yep. What's that like, winning with the team versus winning individually? It's so much better, honestly. She gets to do more fun. You get to share it with people. You know, like, growing up, I was a team sport guy. You know, obviously there's a ton of individual sides of baseball, and I did play some football, too. But being able to share it with other people and. And to see the. The sacrifice that they put in and, you know, they're right there with you going through it and to be able to, when you reach something like that, a goal like that together is, is pretty awesome. Pretty cool.
Yeah.
Do you guys win money on the team or.
No.
Yeah. Yeah. Not nearly as much as an individual. 50 grand total or something. Probably. Yeah. I think last year we, I think.
Last year was like 75 or something like that.
How many is it? 25. Yeah. So, yeah. Now it's four. It used to be six, so. Yeah. But it's fun. It's a lot of fun. You know, I still get to compete, still get to do the sponsorship stuff because I'm still competing. But I get to share it with other people and it's a whole lot more fun. You get to suffer together and it's, you know, you're not suffering by yourself all the time.
It's not a lonely suffering.
No, not lonely suffering. But it's good. It's, you know, made some of my best friends now through competing on a team. So it's cool.
Now that you're, literally probably the time this comes out will be 10 years since you started CrossFit. what would you say are the three biggest lessons you learned in 10 years of training, competing, and being in CrossFit?
One of the main things, and this is something I always tell people, is if you're not doing it for a profession, use fitness as a release of stress. Like some people get so caught up in, I've got to do this, I've got to... and there is value in being using, not stressing about it, putting some value in it, but getting so caught up where it like affects your day or affects your home life. It's like, hey, be stressed out about it while you're doing it in that hour, but go home, have some fun. Like, don't, don't get so caught up in it that you're, you're ruining your day. Another, another pet peeve that I actually have is kids and, and sports and giving up sports for playing cross or playing CrossFit for doing CrossFit. It drives me nuts when kids are like, yeah, I quit playing football. I quit playing baseball to pursue a career in CrossFit. I'm like, man, you have the rest of your life to do CrossFit. I was like, some of the memories, best memories that I have are sports. Some of the best lessons that I learned are playing sports. And I probably, you know, playing more sports would have been better. Like, I kind of, I concentrated on baseball, but I did play football and, you know, like, maybe not organize football, but I was playing football in the yard and doing that type of stuff where you're gonna learn a whole lot more and you're gonna have a whole lot better base of of athleticism and fitness, and it's going to serve you well. That's one of the things too, is you see a lot of the guys that are gym rats, you know, when certain events come up, they're not as good. But the guys, Graham, who played sports, you can adapt on the fly. Graham was one of the best guys that would adapt to stuff on the fly because he played sports, played a lot of sports. Ben Smith, the same way, because he played as many sports as they could. They're the best athletes. And so there's a big part of that. Number three, I don't really know if I have a third one. I think just enjoy the community side.
Of it, you know, like, you know.
Have some friends, like share, like I said, the shared suffering, you know, don't work out by yourself if you don't have to, you know, like if you can get with some people, have some fun and that's, that's what the beauty of CrossFit is, is that community side of it, you know, people see the games and see what we do, but that's not, that's not really CrossFit. It's the, you know, day in and day out. Yeah, going to the gym, like I got to go hang out at CrossFit GlendorA a little bit while I was here. And just seeing, you know, it's the same community no matter where you go. Like we were in China competing and it's the same, speak a different language, but it's the same people. The same workouts? Same workouts. And everybody's super supportive and it's pretty awesome to see that.
That's cool, man. Yeah, it's awesome. This is called the Three Truths. It's a question I ask everyone at the end. Three Truths. so imagine it's your last day on earth.
Okay.
As many years away as we want to be.
Right.
You get to pick the day, but you gotta go.
Okay.
From the physical body.
Right.
And you've created and achieved every dream that you want to create. You've got as many kids as you want, the family life, the legacy, everything you want, you've done it.
Right.
But for whatever reason, you got to take everything with you, everything you've created, you know, your content, your books, your jam, whatever, it's all going to go with you when you leave. But you get to leave behind three things you know to be true about your entire life, your experiences, your lessons. And these would be the only three things you could leave behind.
Okay.
What would you say are your three truths?
Three truths. My faith, for sure. That's something. Obviously, I want to take that with me, but that's the lesson you would leave behind. Yeah, yeah, my faith. You know, I wouldn't be where I am without my faith. I want to say whatever my kids take from me. So, I don't know if that would be my parenting, my, you know, just the things that they've learned. You know, I want them to, I want to be known as a good dad to them, you know, not to anybody else. I don't care what anybody else thinks about me. But I want my kids to take that as like, I don't even know if that would be a truth, but.
That'S, what's the lesson you would want them to take?
Yeah, I don't know if there's any one lesson, but I want them to I want them to look and say, my dad cared. My dad was there. My dad was present. Probably the same as a husband, honestly. It's the relationships and the things that you get with family, with friends, those are the things that I want people to remember. I don't honestly, like, the CrossFit Games and the fame and all that stuff was cool. It is whatever. It's more or less like now I want to have, I want to make as much money as I can to where I can spend more time with my family and do not necessarily that we have above and beyond what we need, but enough to take care of the things that we need to do that I can be there and be present. Because that's something that I got from my parents. They were there, you know, and they were always there. So I don't even know if those are three truths, But yeah, that's kind of what I want to leave behind, I guess.
Okay. I want to acknowledge you for a moment because since I've heard about you over the last 10 years and seen your stuff, you've been so consistent with your, how you show up. Just as in person as in online, you're just a good, consistent, hardworking guy who doesn't make a lot of mistakes, who doesn't try to hurt anybody, doesn't say anything stupid.
Appreciate it. There's some times where I do some stupid stuff, but yeah.
But you're just constantly like a good guy.
I appreciate that.
And you work really very hard.
I appreciate that.
And I acknowledge that because you could have easily letting the fame or whatever, you know, celebrity in the CrossFit world take over to be more egotistical. But from my experience of you over 10 years, you've always been just a consistent and good dude. And that's what I would acknowledge about you. She's just like, It's hard to be consistently at that level.
Like I said, I've had a lot of good people around me that kind of, you know, hold me accountable. And that's one thing. That's another thing is like having people that are gonna hold you accountable and being able to take those, when people tell you, Hey, this is what I see and this is what you're not doing right. And granted, you have to have miles with those people and you gotta trust those people. But, you know, having somebody that's gonna hold you accountable and tell you, Hey, you need to ship or shape up here and you're like, like, all right, you didn't have the wherewithal to be like, all right, you're right, and actually do it. So I appreciate that.
That means a lot. Yeah, of course, man. How can we support you? Where can we find you online?
You've got an app, you've got a gym, you've got-- yeah, we've got just Instagram. Twitter is @RichFroning. I don't do a ton of tweeting, but-- Instagram, you're on a lot. A ton to say. Yeah, Instagram. I have fun with Instagram. I'm not a super, like, I'm not really on top of it all the time. Like, if I'm like, oh yeah, I need to post something, I'll post something. But yeah, we have, you know, our CrossFit mayhem, we have mayhem athletes, Instagram that has a lot more of that type stuff. And then our YouTube is just CrossFit Mayhem, same the CrossFit Mayhem on Instagram as well. But we do a lot more on that type of stuff. But my personal is literally it's me and it's just, it's really who I am. I try not to, you know, we've talked about like having somebody run it, but I'm like, I want it to be authentic and be real. So it's, that's, that's where we're at. That's cool, man. You got a book as well. You got a book, yeah. First, it's been a couple years. We've had a couple people like, you should write another one. I'm like, I didn't think anybody read the first one. I wouldn't want to write another one.
So we got that.
Then Netflix, there's a movie. We don't actually have an app yet. We're working on an app, but we have CrossFitMayhem.com the movie is called what? Froning? Froning. Froning.
Book is first. Froning is the movie. Yep.
And this is different than the CrossFit Games documentary. Yeah, so there's the Froning CrossFit Mayhem or CrossFit documentary.
I gotta watch.
I don't think I've seen that one. I've seen the CrossFit one, which you're in, I think. Is that the main one? 'Cause there's one that I'm like, there's like the next couple years they did them on a couple different people, but the first one that they did is called Froning and it's on Netflix. But then we put out a bunch of stupid stuff on our YouTube, CrossFit Mayhem. So that's where most of our current content is.
Awesome. And so you've got the CrossFit Games coming up.
You got the games coming up in end of July. So about to go into hibernation with kind of shut out all of every life. You know, this week kind of, it's been a long season with the sanctionals. So we gave the team, I was like two weeks, like just go relax, still train, but don't be super stressed. I said, when I get home from California, it's... We're going time. June 1st. We're on. So it's exciting, man. Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. It's, anyway, it's been a long season.
But I'm ready to get there. Exciting, man.
Yeah.
Very cool. So we'll check you out at CrossFit Mayhem. CrossFit Mayhem. Yep.
Yep.
Fronting the documentary, get the book, all this stuff. Make sure to support. What's the team called?
CrossFit Mayhem Freedom or just Mayhem Freedom? Right.
Freedom.
At the Games, make sure you guys support you guys. Appreciate it. If it's online. If it's online, who knows? And I don't really know to tell.
You where to get that information. Maybe check out our Instagram or whatever.
Because that's where we'll put that stuff. But if you go to the Games in Madison, scream for them. Yep, that's right. Give them a high five. Heck yeah, come see us. Heck yeah. you know, I try to in between events, try to take as many pictures as I can with people when I can, you know, as long as they're not rushing us in and out of places because they're the reason why we get to do what we get to do.
That's it. That's it. It's fun.
Final question, what's your definition of greatness? Definition of greatness. You know, you can go with who you are when nobody's watching that type of stuff. But I think it's just being present wherever you are, you know, like it can't be a that's something that I'm working on is like when I'm a dad, I'm a dad and that's, I'm present there and it's hard with social media, it's hard with all this stuff. And when I'm working, I'm present there. And yeah, I think it's, you know, you can't get too caught up and, you know, I just work out for a living and everybody wants to think, oh, you're, you know, you have all this going on, but it's like there's other people that are, you know, your job may just not be as in the limelight, but you're great at your job. So, yeah, be present wherever you are. The legend.
Awesome. Thanks for having me, man. Appreciate it.
There you have it, my friends. I hope you enjoyed this episode. Always fun for me to bring on the world's greatest at what they do. And for someone who'll be able to repeat back to back to back to back years of what they do, it's unbelievable the mindset, the commitment, the discipline, the consistency of showing up and performing at the highest level when everyone is trying to take you down, everyone is trying to beat you, everyone's trying to get better than you, to continue to push yourself to be and stay at the top. It just blows me away and I loved connecting with Rich because he's such a humble, genuine, grateful man as well and really enjoyed his energy and looking forward to doing some type of workouts that's not a CrossFit workout with him in the future. Maybe we'll play basketball so it's more of an even playing field because I'm a little taller than him, even though he'll probably run circles around me. Make sure you share this out with your friends, lewishouse.com/808 tag me @lewishouse and @richfrowning. Let's stay connected over on Instagram, on YouTube, on Twitter. We've got the content up there as well, so make sure to check that out. We're on Spotify, SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, anywhere podcast that you can listen to, you can find us. So make sure to subscribe, leave a review and a rating that helps us continue to spread the message of greatness, and share this with a friend. Share it on your social media platforms, text a couple of friends, let someone know you were thinking of them today. Be a hero and a champion in someone's life by spreading the message of greatness. Just send them this link and let them listen. It's free and we hope they enjoy it as well. And to bring us back to the beginning, T. Allen Armstrong said champions do not become champions when they win the event, but in the hours, weeks, months, and years they spend preparing for it. The victorious performance itself is merely the demonstration of their championship character. I love you guys so very much. I hope you enjoyed this interview like we do with every interview. We give you our best. as we want you to give your best. I love you so very much. You know what time it is? It's time to go out there and do something great.
