982 The Science of Self-Confidence (How to Command Your Mind) w/Dr. Ivan Joseph

This is episode number 982 with Dr. Ivan Joseph.

Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former Pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur.

And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you.

Discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today.

Now, let the class begin. Mel Robbins says confidence isn t the absence of self doubt. It s being willing to try even though you doubt yourself. And US Open winner Sloane Stephens said, When you have confidence, you can do anything. My guest today is an expert in the development of self confidence. Dr. Ivan Joseph is a high performance coach, a sports psychologist, and the author of youf've Got this: Mastering the Skill of Self-Confidence. He also gave a TED Talk on the topic that has received 19 million views and counting. We had a truly enlightening conversation on mental and physical routines that are essential to success. And in this episode, we talk about how you can graduate from retention to mastery when developing new skills. The crucial difference between negative feedback and critical feedback. The ways gratitude scientifically increases happiness, using a simple exercise to find your values and your purpose, and this was powerful, how to avoid the simple things that ruin people's pursuit of greatness, how to coach your kids and athletes so they can achieve greatness without discouraging their talents, and so much more. I think you're gonna love this episode, so please share this with someone who you think needs to hear it, who you can make an impact on their life. And a quick reminder to subscribe to the School of Greatness on Apple Podcasts, and make sure to leave us a five star rating and review as well. And without further ado, let's dive into this episode with the one, the only, Dr. Ivan Joseph.

Welcome everyone back to the School of Greatness Podcast. We've got Dr. Ivan Joseph in the house.

Good to see you, man.

Thanks for having me, Louis. Thanks for coming from Canada. Very excited about this because you have been studying self-confidence, resilience, optimism as an athlete, as a national championship coach, as a sports psychologist, as a high performance coach, for leaders in business for a while now. But you weren't that great about an athlete, is that right? Thank you for bringing that up.

I'll send it to the subject. I was average at best, you know, but as, you know, like a fish story, the further away I get from it, the better athlete I was.

Thank you. Thank you very much.

You had some legendary moments.

Yes. We'll hang on to that. Now, do you feel like because you weren't the best or you weren't the all-star, do you feel like that makes you a better coach? But you're able to see things differently and you can be better in other ways?

That's a good question. You know what? I was average at best. And, you know, I mean, level, I was captain of my small college team, all conference. But what really makes me a better coach is because I'll say it this way. I was an educator before I was a coach. So I understand how to teach skill acquisition. not just for, you know, learning the skill, but really for mastery and retention.

How do we master skills?

Oh, now you're going into my more learning days. So, I was a professor in my early days. So, many people don't think about skill in terms of retention versus mastery, right? How quickly we learn a skill is one thing, but how we master a skill is another, and there's two different ways to teach that skill. You're an athlete, so you know. So, if I do the same skill over and over and over again, called block practice, my skill retention will be, or my skill acquisition, you'll look really good. So I want to learn how to, I'm making it a pole vault. Get on there, plant the pole, plant the pole, plant the pole, plant the pole. At the end of the day, when I measure plant the pole skill, I'll look really good. But if I said to you, I really want you to learn that skill, and I came back a month later and I asked you to plant the pole, you would maybe score a four out of 10. But let's say a month earlier I said, I'm still going to teach you plant the pole, but I want you to plant the pole, I want you to work on your spring off the top and I want to work on your barrel roll over it. And I did all three of those skills in different random order. At the end of the day, the pole skill wouldn't be as high. But if I came back a month later, your retention of that skill would be way higher than the time I did it over and over and over again.

Why is that?

Because what happens is we groove a motor pattern. So think of it like the Appian way. If you've ever been to Rome, In the Appian Way, there's these chariots grooves. And the horse can basically find its way wherever it's going because over time, those chariots have grooved their path into that stone. And it's very similar with the motor signal that goes from your brain to your muscles. When you're doing something, it just becomes automatic, automatic, automatic. And so you don't have to attend to it as much. When the skill is more novel, so every time it's variable, you have to attend to that skill every single time. So there's no latency memory, there's no pattern that's developed. and so you got to really work hard at learning that new pattern and there's where the retention or the mastery happens.

The repetition of the pattern.

The repetition of the pattern. So people sometimes hear me say repetition, repetition, repetition and they want to do the same skill over and over and over again and over and over again and think well I've had mastery. Not necessarily true, right? Vary the patterns, right?

What do you mean by vary the patterns?

So whatever the skill is, right? Vary it, so put three skills together.

So instead of just run up to the pole vault, we're using this in run up and plant the pole and go up and come back.

Yes.

It's go up, plant the pole, go upside down and go over.

Yes.

And do that over and over again. Not the one skill, but all three.

Yes, all three. So, but then the first time, really focus on getting that plant right. On the second time, don't worry whatever plant you get, but really focus on the stuff at the top of the pole, right? Wherever you're attending to that skill will be different and you'll get greater success.

You'll get greater success by coupling the skills than by just focusing on one skill.

Yes.

But why is that psychologically or physically? As opposed to doing the same thing perfectly, practicing perfectly, one thing, I think that's, I can't remember, Daniel Coyle maybe said that or something. Why try to do three things really well as opposed to one thing perfect?

And that's a good question, right? So you're talking about the skill of acquisition, or the acquisition of a skill, right? Which is different than how you want to feel psychologically, Right? So these are two different things. So some folks, and this is where it's really important when you're teaching and coaching folks, because some people, they need to feel really good. So you better let them see that immediate success and immediate gratification from doing that or else they'll shut down.

Right?

And so you've got to balance that psychological impact that you need, that your player needs, that your leader needs by not seeing immediate success with the learning that you want to have as a coach. Because as a coach, you'll have a bigger, longer term picture, and you know that every athlete will react to it differently. Some people need that immediate, immediate path of gratification. Thanks to the words. I can't defer it. But, so now you're asking about motor learning techniques versus psychological approach to the game, and both of those are different. Both of those are two different skills that you need to then figure out, how do you blend both? to build the perfect leader, the perfect athlete, the perfect performer.

It seems like it's really hard to be a coach of a big team. How do you know the skill of learning how to coach multiple personalities is a whole 'nother? How do you know when to give someone positive encouragement with instant gratification, when to delay that for someone else, what to say? You have to be such an intuitive, present individual to coach a large team of athletes.

Yeah.

And I will say this, it's not just multiple personalities, it's also the different genders that we have, right? All across, whatever we identify with, everybody has a different personality and they approach it differently.

With their gender or with their personality.

Oh, really?

Oh.

So don't do this and you use the word intuitive, you have to be intuitive. No, I think we need to ask. When I think about what I did as a coach at the very beginning when I brought my students in, I'm gonna recruit you now, you've just the team, Louis. Louis, tell me, how do I bring out the best in you? Louis, tell me what makes you angry. What's a pet peeve that I do? How will I shut you down? And so I took that same approach that I brought to a national championship team, and I brought it to the culture of leading high performers as a director of athletics. I took over an athletic department that every team had a losing record. We were just woeful. The only reason I got the job.

They'Re like, who is sorry enough to take this now?

I'm not even kidding. That's exactly, the job was vacant for 18 months. 'cause nobody wanted it. But as an HR consultant, you should be doing that same process as part of your onboarding. At the middle of the year, when I'm doing performance management, it's not just about goals. Okay, tell me something I did by accident that you really liked. Okay, that I need to keep doing. 'Cause sometimes I, okay, tell me something that I'm doing that is really frustrating to you. Okay, what do you need in order to be for you to be able to do your job better? not resources, but for me as a leader. Like we shouldn't leave those questions to be accidental.

That is really important. How many kids or athletes were on the soccer team that you took over?

22.

22.

So if you ask this to all 22 people and they all tell you something different, you know, I really didn't like when you did this. I really like when you did this. Can you change this? Can you do this? That's a lot of requests for 22 different athletes of who have different personalities, different positive things, maybe challenging things about them that then you have to take that information in, simulate it and say, okay, I'm going to bend my personality and flex my coaching for 22 individuals to make them all happy. Is that even possible?

I will say this, it's hard, but I have a team of three or four. I had my head coach, my assistant coach, my goalkeeper coach. I had the defensive coach who worked with these four. I worked with these folks. But their job was to remind me as well. So I had a star player, his name was Kevin Suter. He lives in Scotland right now. My first player to be drafted into the MLS played, I remember him, there's a picture of him playing against David Beckham. When I first brought him in, he was an outstanding player. He was like a little, you know, when you get an animal from the pound and you move too quickly and it shies because you think it's, you know, they're gonna, he's gonna hit it or something like that. He was like, if you moved aggressively or assertively, I just saw his game just go, right? Just fall off the planet. And I had to stroke him. He needed to be praised. He, if I raise my voice and just what was some, it's like, oh, man, you did that wrong. He would shut down. And there was another guy over here. What the hell's wrong with you?

Right?

There was another player. I remember there was a player. We talk about arousal, you know, get people up, get people ready. he would never do the warm-up with the team. He always would go off and say a little prayer. That was his job. And I remember this because there was a span where he had two or three red cards in five games. I'm like, this guy was too pumped, he's too jacked, he's too hyped. And he needed to get in a different headspace to bring out the best in him. So yes, it's hard, but if we're pursuing high performance, My job is to bring out the best in those folks.

To get high performance on a team, you almost can't have a one-size-fits-all approach to the team. You can have team goals, team vision, team, like we're all aligned on this mission, but individually you'll need to adjust and flex your communication style a little bit for each person, I'm assuming.

This is my belief, right? And it's led to success in my personal career. Right. the key of this all is the ability to communicate, not one way, two way, and to be open to the challenges that come with that communication.

Yes. Now here's the, you know, I had many different coaches. I had some great coaches, and I remember my first coach playing Division two football was a screamer. Was a screamer, was a, you stupid, you're an idiot, you're a sweater, you know, aggressive in your face. I don't know if that was his love language or what, but he was screaming at me all the time, even if he did it right. But you missed this step, or whatever it was, right? It was like, that was his way of communicating. There was no flexing. And I remember, I'm the type of guy who shuts down. The more and more you do that, like if I need it once in a while, cool. But when you blow the whistle and you single me out in front of a hundred guys, it'd be like you messed up over and over again. It's like, yep, that doesn't make me encouraged to do better. Maybe once in a while, if I keep messing up, I get it. And I had to learn how to overcome that psychologically, which was very challenging because I would beat myself up even more. I would say those things to myself even more. How do we adjust our self-confidence when the coach, your leader, boss, whatever, your partner is an aggressive type or maybe just communicates in a style that doesn't work for your belief and confidence in yourself? and you've tried communicating to them, you've tried giving feedback on how they can improve their communication, and it still doesn't change.

Yeah.

And you're, but you're on the team and you're on the job and you can't, how do you build confidence in yourself in spite of that adversity?

And this is a tough one because they have all the power, right? They have all the authoritative official power. But one of the things I always talk about is who do you give your power away to?

Right?

And so there's one thing to be in that a relationship in some way, and there's another thing to give your power away to them, meaning fully engage and embrace them. What if I came in here, I'm nobody, and I said, this podcast sucks, Louis, this terrible. Like, I'm this guy from the street. I got maybe two cents worth of credibility. Like that. Well, that guy was a jack, whatever. And you would, if maybe Tony Robbins came in here and gave you some feedback, maybe then you'd be starting to hear it, right? And so I say this because there are people that are always going to be coming at you, right? Recognize what are they really experts in? And do you choose to give your power away to them? And I always say get away from the people who will tear you down. Now, sometimes you can't do that because they're in your family, they're your boss, but you can choose to limit your interaction with them. You can choose to make sure you're discerning the difference between negative feedback and critical feedback. the negative feedback type, this is what's wrong, this is why it's broken, this is what's happening, this is why you suck, this is why it's not happening. Don't pay any attention to those folks. The critical feedback, here's what's wrong, here's what's broken, here's what I recommend, here's what I suggest. And lastly, I think, well, not lastly, but one of the other key points I'll say is, who do you choose.

Also in your life, in that circle.

To surround yourself, to counter that piece? and I think cheerleading is key. Yes.

Right?

You know, like, you need somebody that's going to stroke you. Because it's hard. Okay, you can go in the mirror. Yes. Yes. But you need, everybody needs a little love.

Everybody needs a little love, right? Yeah, yeah. So how do we build that confidence in ourself when all we hear is that negative feedback though? And that we, it's going to happen. We can distance ourself, but we keep hearing it. How do we then say, okay, I'm not going to listen to this, but it really affects me and it hurts me. How do you then say, All right, I'm going to hear it every day or every week. It's going to come my way no matter what I do. But psychologically, internally, what are the tools or the skills we can acquire to develop that belief?

First thing I always say is you got to take yourself back to any time in your past career or even current career and remind yourself of all the things that you're good at. All the accomplishments.

Celebrate your wins.

Amen. Right? These is what Man, I'm a tall, handsome, brown man. You know what? I'm really good in math. I look good in white dress shirts. Whatever those things are, remember, Ivan, you were the first person to get your PhD before the age of 30. Whatever those things are, and it's not enough just to tell yourself, you gotta write it down. When I took that job as an AD, even when I had a job as a vice president, self-doubt comes in. There's enough people tell-- I've never done this before.

Why should I be in this position?

You only got the job 'cause he's black. You only got the job 'cause you're a woman. Whatever it is, all people that are going to be coming at you. And if you're not careful, you'll start to take on those thoughts. And then those thoughts will influence your belief system, and that belief system will then influence your actions, and you'll start messing up. And it's this self-fulfilling prophecy. So stop that thought. Put something down on paper. You'll hear me speak about a self-confidence letter, a letter you write to yourself.

Yeah.

There, Louis, congratulations on building your business. You set a goal. and you accomplished it. I was in a lit-- whatever it is. And it's your personal brag sheet to yourself. When I became an AD, I had to read that probably, I kid you not, two weeks straight. And this isn't about ego. This isn't about, oh, you're telling everybody how good you are. No, this is your personal brag sheet. And I equate this to, you remember when you were in a track and field meet and you were a kid? There's some kids that put their medals on and they walk around the track and field. First place, first place, first place. and then there's the person who takes their medal and puts it in their bag. But when they get home at night, they put it on and they're looking at the mirror like, yes, yes, whatever that is, that's the difference about a self-confidence letter.

Interesting. Yeah, self-confidence letter or a letter to yourself. We call this rainy day notes from an exercise that I've been through where it's like, write yourself a letter that when you're going through something challenging, you open it up. I love it. And you remind yourself of your gift, how much you matter, the contribution you've made in your life, your family, your friends, things like that. Or you could get a group of friends to write letters to you that you seal and you open up when you need some inspiration or motivation.

I love it. There's a researcher by the name of Lubormoski, Sonja Lubormoski, and she speaks about taking a gratitude, taking a letter and writing it to one of your friends, a gratitude letter to your friends. telling them of all the things you appreciate in them and how that builds your happiness and your optimism and your confidence. Not just in the moment, but even when they come back 30 days later, it's even higher than in the moment. And so those are the things you need to think about is, okay, sometimes we think about just a letter to ourselves, but if you can share that happiness and genuine praise with others, it also boosts your own happiness and optimism.

Why is that? When we express gratitude or appreciation towards others, increases our happiness.

What they say, the science of it says it releases dopamine, right? And when dopamine comes in your, it's the, I'll say the endorphin, the happiness chemical. And the more dopamine in there, the better you feel. Unfortunately, as you get older, dopamine receptors, dopamine gets down in your body. Really?

Yes.

Just naturally or- Naturally, naturally. Should actively build it. Yeah. You always wonder, why grumpy old man?

What is it?

I'm getting to be the grumpy old man. Really? I got to get my dopamine Climbing up. So you got, it's a chemical thing.

Where it's like testosterone or something else.

Exactly.

And the older you get, you start losing it.

Yes.

I feel it. I feel it coming on.

You already feel grumpy?

I already am a, you know what? Crazy whippersnapper man. I got less patience. I feel it's like I'm gonna be coming back. Am I Sanford and Son? Is that what's happening? Wow. You're not old enough to know even.

Who Red, are you old enough to.

Know who Red Fox is? Sanford and Son.

Sanford and Son, yes. Oh, old junk man. Okay, just checking. Just checking. so you're. It's interesting. So this is something you really got to cultivate. I interviewed Dr. Lori Santos on, and she's got the happiness lab. She's a. I think it's one of the most popular classes at Yale. Yale.

Yeah.

And I asked her, I go, what are their, you know, because she was talking about gratitude as one of the key factors of happiness. And I go, you're talking like a self-help personal development personality with no science backing anything, just saying, be grateful and. express gratitude and appreciation. She's like, this science is proving that that is true. The more you express gratitude, the happier you'll become. The more you do for others and contribute to others, the happier you become.

The science of, and not only just from feeling good and happiness, but the science also then links that to performance. And don't quote me on the numbers, but it's related to your creativity output, right? I think the same Lubormoski, the same study she did, I think you're 19% more productive. Analytic problem solving. You're 29% quicker to solve complex problems. And here's the big one.

When you're what?

When you're happier, when you express gratitude, when you use positive statements of affirmation to yourself. The big one, you increase your revenue by 36% if you use three statements of happiness, personal affirmations.

No way.

Sonia Lubomirski, 2006, Harvard study.

Wow, so if you do, how are you gonna increase Your income?

Three affirmations, three positive statements of gratitude, three expressions of hope, warmth, joy. That is what showed.

Yeah.

Wow.

About yourself, about...

Either yourself or others.

Oh, interesting.

Right.

Now, what if you're saying something about yourself, but you're really lying? This is... You talk about this too. It's like, is it a, you know, the science of lying to yourself? How do you say something like, I'm a great individual. When you're like, actually, I haven't been a great individual. I've been bad, treating people bad. I haven't been showing up on time, whatever it is.

Yeah. And so this is an interesting one.

The lying self-talk that hurts you.

It's hard to say because what might be a lie to me may not be a lie to you. I'll tell you a story. I had a guy, his name was Kyle, who made my soccer team. And he believed that he was the greatest guy. I'm like, I'm gonna make this team. that guy showed up and he had like a foot like a donkey, right? And I remember seeing him come onto my team and I had just taken over this team at Ryerson. I was like, oh, he's a black guy from Jamaica. He's gonna be fast and so happy. I was never so disappointed.

Wow.

Right?

And that guy was gonna be an equipment manager. Yeah, at best. Fast, like, fast forward four or five years. This guy became the captain of my team and all Canadian and the starter on my first ever team. that went to the national championships. He had no business believing that he was good enough to make this team. I mean, I coached at this championship, that world championship, Olympic World Cup qualified. So maybe I'm not the one to judge what is a lie. But I will tell you, if you think you're gonna fly, I'm gonna be a bajillion dollars, I'm gonna be a million dollars. I will tell you it's not the statement that really sets you up. It's the fact that people then start putting into their psychological mindset steps to move them in that direction. Whatever those little steps are, they stop feeling helpless and unable to affect their own destiny and start moving in the right direction. And that's where the impact happens.

That's. That's an interesting thought, because you might look at someone like Jeff Bezos, who's like, I want to build a trillion dollar company when he'd never done anything close to it. Well, you might have laughed at him, but. Even though he was lying to himself in the moment, he didn't have that, but he was setting himself up to create that and to become the person he needed to become, the leader, the man, the human, to develop the skills to potentially do that one day.

Yeah.

Is that right? Or like, you know, Tesla, the Elon Musk, or, you know, sending rockets out into space and all these different things.

I can't imagine, and I'm going to ask you for my own, let's turn the tables. When you were sitting on your sister's sofa, What were you thinking when it started to germinate? When did the seed start to germinate?

I started to really think of, I don't have anything right now and I don't have the skills, the confidence to go do the things I want to do, the big dreams. And so I said to myself, I'm going to go face all those fears and overcome all those doubts by doing them, by acquiring those skills so that I can then go out and accomplish my dreams. Because I knew in order to have the dreams come true, I had to overcome a lot of challenges Did you.

Have the dreams though? Were they- oh, I had a lot of big dreams.

But you weren't articulating them.

I had very specific dreams. Yeah, yeah, very specific. But you must have thought you were crazy. Like you were- you- thought it was crazy. You didn't even have- My family was.

Like, go get a job. You know, yeah, you ain't got two shoes to work together, right?

Yeah.

So, but I believed it. And that's all that matters really for me. And I think, you know, and I say this a lot to people that it doesn't matter if the world believes that you're, and you probably had a lot of great athletes as well, who you were like, you,'re amazing. You're the best. You can be so great. But they didn't believe it themselves. And it didn't matter if you and every other player thought they were incredible. If they didn't believe it, they were going to be subpar. And the reverse is it doesn't matter if everyone else is against you or doesn't think that you have the skills. If you believe it, you can make.

It come true, which I think is unbelievable. I will tell you the number. There's two factors I've always seen that derail a young athlete or a young professional's career. Number one is their self-doubt, right? Their inability to believe in themselves. And interestingly enough, number two is the people that they have surrounded themselves with that become distractions that take them away from their goals. Over and over and over again, they fall into the wrong crowd, they get with the wrong partner, they-- the wrong advice.

I think of Maurice Clarett. I don't know if you know who he is.

Yes.

I'm from Ohio, and so we're the same age, and so when he was a freshman and they won the national championship, he was like this all-star running back, he was like this is the chosen one, he's gonna do unbelievable things, but then he was surrounding himself with the wrong people who got him into the wrong things and influenced and persuaded him to do bad things and take the wrong steps. And that sent him to jail and he never got in the NFL. And it was so much talent that could have been.

It is such a shame. I remember that story quite vividly when he declared early. Didn't the NFL change the rules to make sure that that never happened again?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it goes to show that being around the wrong people could influence you and potentially set you up in the wrong ways. So how do we make sure that we get out of that? When we're so, we're such social creatures that we don't wanna hurt people's feelings, that we, it's hard to go meet new people. You know, this is your comfort zone. These are your boys from the past. Like they've been with you. How do we get out of that and say, hey guys, like I'm gonna do this thing over here instead.

Oh, I wish I could give you the gospel on that, because that is harder to to do than what I'm gonna say. But here's where I always believe. And every time I have not done this, I have faltered. We all have that little tiny voice in our head. Whenever I don't listen to that little tiny voice in my head, I falter. And to me, that tiny little voice is, you know, I don't know. I'm gonna now use some voodoo language. You know, you got your head voice and you got your heart voice. And it's hard to to. Whenever I make a decision purely logically, I always am bitter.

Right.

If I buy the cheap car instead of the one I want, if I do, like, the Practical decision instead of the emotional one. Yeah, I'm always bitter. And then you got this little heart that's sitting there, that little self-conscious piece that's telling you when you know when you're going south. I don't know if it's your crap detector or your holy smoke detector. There's no science behind this, but anytime I don't listen to that voice, When I fall off my values and my principles, I go south. And it's cost me money, it's cost me friendships, it's cost me opportunities.

How do you determine what your values and principles are when you're not sure?

That's a good question. I'm going to walk you through a little exercise. Do we have time for it?

Sure.

All right, I'm going to ask you and we'll do it together. I call it my purpose exercise. what's the, in the last 18 months, what's the most important decision you've made? I'll do mine, right? And we'll share it for 30 seconds. In the last 18 months, you know, I gotta be careful with this one, but I've made a decision, right, to take the vice president's job at Dalhousie University. I was the king of my fiefdom. I had all the freedom, all the things I want. And I made a decision to take that job. Boom.

Decision I made was to get into a relationship. Ah, yeah, a new relationship in the last 18 months, yeah.

You got now seven words, only seven, to tell me why you made that decision. And so I could be nice and fluffy. I had, it was time for a new challenge, seven words. I could say I had outgrown the job, right? I was bored, whatever it is, but seven words.

She made me a better version of myself.

Ooh, nicely done.

I'm gonna put that at seven bucks.

Yeah, that's pretty close. Why her? So for me, why this job?

Right?

People told me I couldn't do it. The one word and it's got to be a value, the challenge.

Mm.

Right?

The challenge.

One word?

Yeah.

Why her? vision, right? Five years ago, I had done a guided visualization of the dream person I wanted to be with.

Yeah.

And she was the image of that vision.

So now we've just found two values, right? For one of my values is challenge. One of your values is growth, Vision, whatever that word is. This. You saw it. And so when you start asking yourself these questions, what's the most important decision you made in work? What's the most important decision you've made in your family? What's the most important decision you did for yourself?

Right?

What's the most important decision you make when taking on a conflict? Those help, that's the exercise I do. You could help me find my North Stars.

Interesting.

And whenever those things are in alignment, you'll hear Daniel Pink talks about this transcendent purpose. Whenever those things are in alignment, happiness, confidence, success, performance goes up. when they're not sick days go up, disease goes up, conflict arises, poor choices.

Yeah.

Right. And so those are the things you need to think about. Now, that's the exercise I use, but I find it very, very helpful.

Wow.

So back to this science of lying. So how do we lie to ourselves in a positive way to set ourselves up for success or accomplishing our dreams? If I have I've been doubting myself for a long time. And I'm, you know, I've got no money and I've got no skills and flunked out of college, whatever it is. But I got this big dream and I'm gonna do this thing. Like, how do I, is that actually realistic to say those things? Or how do I then use that dream and that image in my mind of what I want to create, what I'm gonna come, how do I then apply that into life to actually making it come true when it seems so far away?

I love this. So I will say this. Everybody's dreams are lies because they don't exist. Everybody's dreams are, they're just making that up. That's why they're dreams. And so the difference though between people who are successful or not is how they choose to pursue those dreams. So let's just say I had a dream to become an Olympian. I always in my mind picture that dream on the top of a staircase. and I have these series of steps that go down. And every step represents a quantifiable smart goal that I'm going to put on there.

-Right.

So, let's say I've got a dream.

-You'Re speaking my language, because I would frame my dreams and goals.

-100%. So, I'm going to get out of bed every day and exercise for 30 minutes. I'm going to get out of bed.

-Step one.

-Exactly. What's step two? I'm going to get out of bed every day Right? And I'm gonna find myself a coach that is from the very... I am gonna... I love what you did when you went to New York City. Same thing Bruce Jenner did. When he decided he wanted to go to the Olympics, he found out where the best people were that were training for the decathlon. He went to San Diego and he started training with them. Step number three, I'm gonna find the best person in my field and I'm gonna be relentless and pursue them and train with them. If that means I gotta pick up their shoes, if that means I gotta clean their toilet, whatever that is. And that is you start putting those steps in there. Now, when you put those steps in, be like, oh, success came. No, they're going to say, no, hell no. Just like they said to you, what are you doing here, Gringo?

You don't belong here.

This is Eastern European handball.

Exactly. Right?

But now you got to say, stop. Don't let that come in. That's where you use the power of affirmations. Stop. We talk in psychology about this thing called centering. Physical actions that you'll see athletes do.

Like a trigger like some like a snap of a snap rubber band Stop.

The negative stop slap in the face whatever it is yeah replace deep breath in you got this yeah, right whatever that is Whatever it is when because you're gonna be on your step your first step I didn't get up today you start again tomorrow so you need.

That mantra or positive affirmation or stopping process and then in a mantra, right? Yes, you gotta stop and add a.

Positive affirmation Make it automatic and recognize that it's a skill. Get your three. You got this. I work harder than anybody. Nobody outworks me. I can learn everything. Whatever it is, get it ready. And then figure out what your trigger is going to be. Don't mix it all up. Get your trigger. A friend of mine was when he was trying to quit smoking, he put it all his hands was always in there because he always jingled coins. Another person always their keychain. Shake, shake. And then it becomes automatic. becomes automatic and that's where you want it to be. I got this. You can't beat me cigarettes. No, no, no, not today. Whatever that might be. But recognize how important it is to ladder up that step because if you put that big dream out there, it becomes so overwhelming. Where am I going to start? Oh my gosh, the tiniest step is the one that moves us towards our goal. The tiniest step.

And then do you celebrate after you reach the next step or how do.

You you've been studying?

I feel like I've studied a lot of sports psychology just through the practice of sports and then reading a lot of books and interviewing a lot of.

People, but I always love everyone's take on it. This is, I think, a mistake that people make is they don't take a moment to make the celebrations. And so they don't ever get to reward it. I just tweeted the other day somebody who graduated from high school, university, and I said, Savor the moment. You're a person from Yale. She will speak about savoring. That's a big component about happiness. And savoring means live in it, feel it, relish it, embrace it. You know when sometimes it's cold and you want to just get out in the sun, you just like, ah, and you just feel it. That's savoring.

Yeah.

Pausing, slowing down, engulfing it. It's almost like when something's happening, like pull yourself out and just watch yourself with your friends and appreciate it.

Because those moments don't happen that often.

No.

You've got to really create those little moments every day in order to make them happen. I remember when I, my whole dream was to be an All-American athlete growing up. And when I took on the goal of doing this in the decathlon, I told you before the show a little bit that I, you know, I had six months to train for the decathlon. My senior year, I decided to do it my senior year.

I waited.

And I remember I got the top eight are All-Americans in track and field in each event. and I got eighth place. And I remember I was like, my whole life I've been dreaming about this. I spent six months of like sacrificing all sugar, waking up at 6:00 a.m., falling on my back on the pole vault, and all these different, you know, heartaches over the last six months. I finally was on the podium holding the trophy. I have the trophy in the other room still. And was like so happy. And then 10 minutes later, I was miserable. And I found every reason why I wasn't good enough. why I should have gotten sixth place or how I messed up this event and how I didn't do this right. And I put myself down more and more and continue to beat myself up. And I was like, you know what? I'm gonna go out to the next goal because I don't feel the way I want to feel. So I gotta go achieve something greater and bigger to believe in myself more. And I kept doing that and realizing no matter how much I achieve or accomplish, I need to savor those moments of Celebration. Not even just at the end of the celebration or the end of the goal, but each step along the way I need to celebrate because it's not about the end.

You have a thing that what we would, I would identify you with a thing what we call maladaptive perfectionism in the world of sport. So we all, perfectionism is a good thing, right? Until it becomes a bad thing.

Obsessive, yeah.

Right? Painful. And so when perfectionism hinders your ability to have joy, to move on, to pursue something because of your fear of failure or you're never good enough or you can't relish your accomplishment, it becomes maladaptive.

What's maladaptive mean? Bad, bad adaptive?

Yes, right? It's bad for your skills, right? And so just, it sucks. And then it inhibits you. And you'll see this in a lot of high performing athletes. who are driven to excellence, that that perfectionism becomes so debilitating that they then can't perform. They can't get in the flow. They can't get in the flow. Cheeks meant to hail a flow.

Yeah, yeah. Right? They can't get in the flow. They can't be present 'cause they're so.

Anxious and worried about everything else. I once had an athlete who, his game just started going down further and further. Every time he had a mistake, oh gosh, oh. I remember he's like, well, I think I should make nine out of ten passes, ten out of ten passes. And I remember taking him and putting Roy Keane, a famous footballer on TV, and showed him how Roy Keane made four out of 10 passes, five out of 10 passes. The very best footballer in the world and you 19-year-old kid wants to make 10 out of 10?

Yeah, good luck.

Changed his mindset. It allowed him to let go of being excellent. Because if you're perfect, then you could be, but then you're not stretching. You're in some place that's comfortable where you can be good and excellent. But if you're moving forward and you're driving to these new places where the skill is novel to you, you're a new boss, you're a new leader, of course you're gonna screw up.

Yeah. Right?

That is the example of you pursuing excellence.

You need to fail in order to grow. You need to mess up over and over again to then see and adapt and change and get the feedback necessary to improve.

Yes.

It is part of the process. You have to fail over and over again.

Amen.

It's how you handle it with a positive affirmation as opposed to I suck, I'm I'm stupid, I'm horrible, I'm never gonna be good enough. It's how you would change that. What's that? What is it you call it in psychological terms when you stop and then add a mantra or what's that? When you mentioned earlier about, okay, when you do something wrong, you stop it with the trigger. Centering. Centering and then you add a positive mantra.

Is that what you call it? Yep. Centering. Centering. So whatever you're centering and all that is, is gets you out of your head center. Here, now you go forward.

In the moment.

Yeah.

Because so many of us are never in the moment. What about this situation when you don't have the skills or the repetitions, you haven't done the steps, but you've got a big opportunity that just came in your lap. You've got an interview for something you're really excited about. You've got a first date of your dream girl, whatever it is. You've got this moment and you're like, Man, but I don't have the reps. I don't have the preparedness. I don't have the confidence, I don't have the skills. Do you just say, I'm not going to go into this and I'm not going to take on the challenge or the speech in front of an audience when I haven't practiced. How do we light ourselves in a positive way to get through that moment and do the best we can without falling on our face?

It's a good question because what your level of preparation in terms of readiness for the event versus my level will always be different. you might have done a thousand repetitions and I did 10,000 and I'm still not ready. So this is true no matter who you are, no matter where you're going into that new and novel situation. And one of the things you have to let go of is being perfect. When you set yourself up to go into that event and think that perfection is the only way to excel, to measure success, it will never happen. One of the things I've always said to myself is this is a process. What am I here to learn? And so that is one of the questions I always tell myself.

But this is a big moment. This is the opportunity. It came to me.

Yes.

What if I fail?

And you're going to embrace failure because that is not the outcome that measures your success. If you come into something and say, Success is only if I don't make a blunder. When you make the failure... You're done.

It's over. You might as well give up.

Exactly. And so reflect on it. It is the reflection after the event. I am in this. I know I'm not ready, but there's lots to learn from me going now. And when I do this, I will now be better prepared for the next time. I'm a new vice president. I've been, I will say, average at best. Oh, I've screwed this up. Screwed this up. I gotta do this better next time. That's always in my head is, man, these are great teachable moments. The next university that gets me for a vice president is gonna be really lucky.

-What am I saying? -The next one, nothing's gonna happen.

-What am I saying? See how I'm interpreting that?

-Yeah, of course. -It's all interpretation.

-Life is an interpretation. -This is true.

So, confident people, they interpret feedback differently.

-So true.

You're speaking like a self-help coach. I am a sports psychologist. I can't help it. -But interpretation, I mean, when I've studied this emotional intelligence training for a long time, out of need of suffering and pain and holding on to past hurts and not healing and Trauma and all these things, where, you know, I was. I realized the interpretation of being sexually abused as a kid, holding on to that for 25 years as this horrible, painful thing is what kept me down. But when I flipped the interpretation and said, yeah, this sucked, and I don't wish it on anyone, but what did I gain from this? And what value did it bring to my life? And how can I improve and make sure this doesn't happen to any other young boy out there in the world? What content can I provide and how can I become a better human being because of it? That interpretation switch gives me more joy, more passion, more love, happiness, as opposed to holding on to a negative story interpretation and Making that my life.

Yes. And recognize that, you know, you were doing what's known as protective factors to protect yourself from that the trauma that that caused. And when you were able to get and embrace that conversation, you know, I can't speak for yourself, but I'm assuming you're able to let go and move forward.

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. And it takes, you know, it can take you a long time if you continue to hold on to that, you're never gonna be truly fulfilled if you hold on to that. And so you've gotta learn how to interpret things differently. My girlfriend broke up with me. You've gotta learn how to say, this is a blessing, not a painful thing. Even if it is. Someone died in my life. This is horrible. How can I celebrate their life and not hold on to the pain forever? It's all about interpretation. Guy Winch, I don't know if you've study, Dr. Guy Winch, he talks about rumination, like holding on to rumination of anything small, big or in between and grieving, you know, holding on to this for a lifetime of ruminating on something that you did wrong or that didn't work out well or what you forgot to do. That rumination process will continue to make you doubt yourself and everything you do if you're holding on to it forever. So that's powerful. I'm curious.

So it's all about interpretation.

When you have a big moment, a big opportunity, you got one shot. Even if you fail, you've got to interpret it beforehand. I had a coach that would. Because I used to get really nervous speaking in front of people. Used to be terrified. I don't know if you were terrified speaking in front of people.

No. On stage.

When I was young, you know, you had to play the piano or the organ.

Oh, my God.

Recitals. The organ. Yes.

Nobody wore to play the organ.

Oh, my gosh.

Oh.

I sweat bullets underneath that seat, man.

Wow.

Yeah.

Oh, my gosh.

My, I had a speaking coach that after years of training and speaking, I would still get nervous in front of audiences. I didn't know why. And I called him before the speech and he said, you,'re still worried about what people think about you. You're still worried about failing in front of people or forgetting to say something. You're going to fail. It's not going to be perfect. He said exactly what you said. and think of your speech as you're here to serve the audience, not to look good in front of the audience. And when I switched that interpretation, I was able to be more in flow and more free and not worried about what people think.

Love it.

But we are so concerned about this, about what people think about us. How do we overcome that opinion of other people? The judgment, the negative feedback, the gossip behind our back that we don't hear. How do we let go of that? fear.

You're asking a question my wife, the counselor, the social worker would talk about right now. One of the reasons why we are so concerned about what other people think and how they look at us and what they think about us is because, to be honest with you, we don't love ourselves. And I know this is like, what the heck? When we are not comfortable with who we are, When we're not appreciated by the people around us, we go elsewhere to find it. But one of the key things is that we do that because somewhere along the line, somebody has put us down, somebody has shut us, somebody has told, and then we've owned that, to your point. Then we've worn it like a cloak of shame. And we're embarrassed or we don't feel good about ourselves. There's lots of things you could go back and you could study psychology and say, you know what? He was in love as a child, his mom or his dad or his sister or his wife or whatever, right? But all of those things we don't have control over. And so it's when we start to just really look at ourselves and embrace who we are, whatever it is, warts and all, when we really try to just get past all the external pressures of who we are and what society wants us to be and can truly love ourselves and appreciate the one skill, the one talent that we might have whatever it is, then we stop performing and needing it to come from Johnny or Sally or Frida out there, whoever that is in the audience, then we don't need it. And then we're okay if we fail. The key though, and you said this right there, is that people will interpret all their skills a little bit differently. And sometimes you need that person, that one person, to just remind you of a cheerleader.

Yeah.

How do you love yourself when everyone and especially you have reminded yourself of how horrible you are all the time? How do you acquire the skill of loving yourself? And then also, how do you love yourself without being too egotistical or too into self indulgence so much?

So let's start with the big one, which is the ego, right? Because I don't believe loving yourself is about telling everybody else. To me, loving yourself is about the things that you tell yourself. It's about how you're putting yourself up and forgiving yourself for your mistakes. It's about how you're willing to look past your baubles and just like, Hey, who's four diving? You know, the other day I was at a job interview, oh my goodness. And the interview started at this time and it was on Zoom and I made the time zone wrong and I showed up a half hour late. I'm like, Holy sugar sticks. And I was just beating myself up. And my wife said, Hey, you gotta love yourself. And she just reminded me, I got other strengths. I got other things. This one mistake does not define who I am. And I think that's really important. And so then I was able to move forward. But I want to make sure that for all your audience out there, there are people that are mentally unwell. Some of those folks might be battling depression and battling whatever different psychological challenges where it's hard for them to love themselves. And they need to either engage in counseling, they need to engage in whatever that process is to get themselves well. I'm not speaking about those folks. Well, just flip a switch because we need to recognize that some people have different chemicals that are in their brain that are really impacting their ability to make rational decisions and rational thoughts. And so I don't want somebody sitting here and listening here. I can't do it. There's something wrong with me. There are many ways and there's processes and systems and you have to get help when you're unwell and you're not able to navigate this process by yourself. And if you've been trying for a long time, engage others. Nobody does anything alone. Just like, put together your team. And so that's an important thing.

He was so powerful. If you're a life team, you know?

Yeah, if you've been struggling and you've been using the tools, the letters, the affirmations, all of these things, recognize and it's hard. There's a stigma with mental health. For me, if you needed to wear glasses, Louis, because you can't see the board, then it's no different than somebody who has to get a counselor or who has to do cognitive therapy because it will help them get to where they need to be.

Yeah.

What's the greatest single skill in developing self-confidence?

Oh, that's a good question. I will say the thought stopping, because thoughts are beliefs and actions. Can I give you a little example of thought stopping? So I want you, we'll pretend like the camera's not there, I want you to share with me for 30 seconds a powerful story, something you're really proud of achieving.

I was in my young 20s and I was terrified of salsa dancing. So I'm a tall white guy in a different culture and a different language and a different style dance that I've ever seen. And so when I went to a salsa club for the first time by accident and saw I was the only white guy and it was all Latinos dancing and having this incredible time, with something I didn't know what I was doing. I was terrified of it. And I would go every week for three months and not try at all until I finally got the courage to try it one time. And when I finally-- Stop there. Yep.

Right?

I just want to think about how bad you were. I want you to hold up your hand, right or left hand? Which one? Left hand. Is that your strong hand?

It's my weaker hand.

Whichever is your stronger hand.

Okay.

And I'm gonna push it down, but don't let me push it down.

Okay.

Ready? Excellent, excellent. All right, man, we're not bad. All right, now I want you to tell you, I want you to-- Just.

Lifted the other day, it's sore.

I want you to tell us the last time you screwed up.

Last time I screwed up.

So this is about fear, this, you know, the other one was almost, you didn't even get to your really strong part yet.

I know, but last time I screwed.

It up, Hold it, don't tell me. Now I want you to think about the last time you cried.

That's when I cried. Okay.

Now I want you to think, close your eyes. I want you to think about the worst thing that you do that you wouldn't tell anybody about. Ready? Keep that in your mind, hold out your right hand.

Eyes closed, right?

Yep.

Okay.

Don't let me push it down. Think of that thing. What just happened there?

Okay, so holding the negative thought in my mind, how does that...

I want now not to leave you there. So give me three things about yourself that you love.

I'm passionate, I'm loving, I'm wise, right?

And I will say this, you are warm, you're engaging, and you're probably one of the best hosts that I've ever had. I've done lots of podcasts. Thank you. Hold your hand up.

Right?

Ready? What just happened there? -Right.

It's changing the thought process.

-That wasn't about strength. I just went there and tore you. I went right to your heart. And people don't understand how important that thought is. People think it was voodoo. Imagine what just happened. Did your eyes start to water? Did your heart rate change? Did your chemical reaction change? Toxins, your whole body shifted. because I induced your greatest and worst thing that you don't want to share with anybody. And I don't know what it is and I'm not asking, but what I'm saying to yourself is this. If you carry that around all the time, what would you become?

The bad stuff, you'd be super weak and sad and emotional and... You would never take risks.

Right.

Right, that wasn't, I'm not gonna be able to lift dumbbells.

No.

Right, right, right.

You would not be able to take risks. You would never put yourself out there because you would be afraid of failure when you would think you were. So when you ask me what's the most important thing that you can do to build your self-confidence? Change your thoughts.

Right?

Stop living in the moments of your failure or what everybody else thinks of you. I'm good at this. I'm good. And then as soon as I just changed that, bam! I didn't even get to the best part of your warm story at the first first time.

Right, right.

Right.

I was like, no, stop it there. Right. He was like, I wasn't that good. I was okay. But then when I did it, you were about to say, I was amazing.

I didn't want to do it because.

I know you've been hitting the weight room.

I need to have a little bit of that movement. Right? For sure.

Yeah.

It's a long answer to your question. No, I think. I think what I'm hearing you say is the greatest skill is to have the skill of positive thought or changing thoughts in any moment that might be holding you back or tearing you down is the ability to think in a clear, positive way. towards what you're proud about yourself as opposed to what you're un-proud of yourself, towards what you're capable of instead of what you lack, towards your vision and instead of towards your failures. When we think of those things consistently on a daily basis, we're going to become stronger every single day.

Perfect.

The ability to acquire the skill of positive thinking is challenging for so many. why is it so challenging to have positive thinking skills consistently?

Well, I think it's this. Like, if you look at the society that we live in, it's all about competition and we're always paired up in a way where we compare ourselves to anybody. The Joneses versus the Volkswagens versus the Toyota. Like, everything that we do, we are not as good. We are othered. I remember when I lived in Lamoni, Iowa, and I was making, I'm making up the number, $50,000 a year. I could, like if I was gonna buy a Porsche Boxer, I would have made it if I could buy a Porsche Boxer. And then I became an athletic director. And again, I'm making up the number. Then the Porsche Boxer wasn't good enough. I needed to buy the 911. Oh, man. And then I became the VP, and then I needed the Bentley, right? We are humans somehow are conditioned to never be content.

Why is that?

I don't know. It's a million dollar question, right? But for some reason, we're not.

Even Canadians? You guys aren't? It would be content?

Bless the Canadians, right? God bless the Canadians. But yes, we are never content. And so your question really is, is why are we never happy and can't put the positive thoughts in? Because we're always looking at what we do not have. We are always looking at over the next hill, the next goal, the next obstacle. And that leaves us always feeling as if we have not created fulfillment or we've not achieved. And it's part of what drives ambition, but it's also what allows us never to really appreciate the moment that we're in.

Wow. That's true. What do you think is your biggest weakness? Even though you studied this for so long, you've given TED Talk with almost 20 million views, you've got books on this, you're the sports psychology guy, you're the national champion Coach, you're the guy on self-confidence. What do you like?

The reason I speak about this is I battle self-confidence all the time. So you would look at me and like, oh, he's won this, he's won this, he's this. I'll never forget the first time I went on stage to speak and Maya Angelou was gonna be there, it was the World Women's Food Service Forum, and I was a mess. Every time I put myself in a new role, in a new position, my belief in myself takes a hit. And so this is a skill that you don't just, you know, it's like, okay, you've got it. Recognize that as soon as you're a manager, it's there. You become a director, it's gone. It's there. So my biggest thing that I consistently work on is my belief in myself, but not from a self-confidence point of view, from a tear-down point of view. Oh, man, those guys don't think you're good enough, though. Stop it, stop it. You belong here. Oh, you got the job 'cause you're black. Nope, stop it, stop it. You belong here. and so I have to constantly work on that. Wow.

Is it Einstein that said comparison is the thief of joy?

Yes.

Comparison, I feel like, is a thief of joy, but it's also you see what someone else has created. Ah, LeBron James is, you know, this great basketball player. I want to be that. It's also a thing that you can see and visualize as a model of like, okay, what are the steps for.

Me to get there?

Because I want to become the greatest version of myself. So how do we use comparison or seeing something we want, not as a bad thing or the thief of joy, but also as a thing that is a positive thing. If he can do it, so could.

I. I like that.

And I'm going to take those action steps. How do we flip that switch in our mind so it doesn't rob us of our joy?

Yeah, and I like that, right? Where you said the best version of ourselves. And so you answered it there is that we do not emulate to achieve replication.

Right?

There is a difference between, you know, this isn't Star Wars where we're gonna create the clone. When we see people, and we use the word role models, which comes from modeling, when we see people modeling the behavior that we want to achieve, we should use it as an aspirational benchmark, North Star, whatever we want, not as an opportunity to create the exact same thing. And this is, to me, this whole world of social influencers, when it goes south and goes awry. I got my kids and they're all.

Watching the-- They're talking to YouTube and everything.

Gosh, I can't take it, right? The duck lips and this and that. And they want to be these other people because they're aspiring for that lifestyle. But we have to remember that those lifestyles are so artificially crafted that we only get to see the pieces that people are willing to pull back the wizard's curtain and allow us to see. we don't see the other pieces of it. When we really become, I'll say, dysfunctional or unproductive is when we only try to do the things that they're seeing, which is the positive and the shiny, and don't embrace and recognize that there's a whole bunch of crap that also goes along with that. And so it's the basketball player who only sees LeBron's A+ games and never saw the benchings that happened. or never sees the missed games, or only sees him now after 30 years of being in the game and is not willing to recognize the hours and the time that he put in the gym at 5 a.m., at 4 a.m., at 3 a.m., all the sacrifices he made, whatever they may be along the way that got him there. And that's when we become unproductive.

Yeah.

Gosh.

It's a full-time job loving yourself.

No, ain't that the truth.

Isn't it?

Ain't that the truth?

And reminding yourself of all these kind of tools and things to use to not go down a dark hole. Because I feel like in any moment we could turn on the TV, turn on the news, open up social media, hear a conversation from someone who's negative and start to say, yeah, I agree with you and yes, and go negative down, down, down. It's so much harder to stay positive and fight against that or arm yourself with these things, isn't it?

That's why I think the most important decision and you're getting ready to make this decision Louis, is who you choose to marry. It is the most important decision. They're around you all the time. Next, who your business partner is, who your partners are, because after your, and sometimes more than your family, your business partnerships and your relationships at work are so critically important. Those are the two. Then the third one is that friend group, because you're gonna have days where it's hard, but those three people around you, those three different groups, they will shape that, how long you live in that place of despair or destitution, how quickly they bring you up, those three relationships. And I mean, I get it, they're gonna be hundreds or thousands or whatever they're gonna be in your groups, those are key. Hopefully only one wife.

Right, exactly.

Or husband, right? But yeah.

What are the three words we should say to ourselves every single day?

For me, you got this.

Right?

That's it. You got this. Because there's gonna be times when doubt comes in. You got this.

That's your, you call it a mantra for yourself?

Yeah.

Yeah. I use, you got this, I use, I can learn anything, nobody outworks me. And I use those three intentionally because when things don't come easy, right? I can learn anything. and nobody outworks me. Okay, that's not, it's like, you know?

You're willing to put in the time, the energy to learn something.

Yeah.

I believe a lot of success is about persistence. I am nowhere near, as you so eloquently mentioned at the beginning of the podcast, I am not a great athlete, yet I've been lucky enough to be coaching at some of the highest levels. I'm willing to do whatever it takes.

Yeah.

Whatever it takes.

Who's been the most influential teacher in your life?

I would say it was a gentleman by the name of Tom Powell, who was the dean of students at my university. You know, God bless his soul, he passed away many years ago, but he was kind, he was gracious, he was generous. He used to use the term he was a kingmaker. You know, today it would be a king and queen makers language, but he was always there to really empower young student leaders. to take on and he mentored us, he allowed us to fail, he gave us enough rope, but yeah, made a huge difference in my life. From a tiny little school in Graceland University.

That's interesting.

Yours?

I would say the people that I had the biggest conflict with taught me the most about myself.

Ooh.

Like the girlfriends I broke up with that you know, a bad breakup, the business partnership that didn't end well, like all the things that didn't work out taught me the most about how I can be a better person.

Yeah.

You know what I like about that answer, Louis, is the, is the reflection, because people don't, aren't willing to engage in the reflection when the things have failed because there's where the growth happens.

Yeah.

Because if they can be open and honest with it, they're then set up for that next move.

Yeah, I think every, I mean there's been amazing teachers and coaches I've had who have given me the tools.

You're all listening to.

Yeah, yeah, of course, yeah. Who've given me amazing tools to believe in myself and just showed up at 5 a.m. and all that stuff. But I think I've probably learned the most about myself from all the big mistakes or the people that have rubbed me the wrong way and the people have had ill emotions towards and I feel like who wronged me things like that, where I got taken advantage of in some way, those are the people that have probably taught me the most. Because I think when people are positive and are loving teachers, it's incredible. But how we can respond to the teachers that we hate or dislike or are uncomfortable to be around and who we can become in spite of those, I think, is our greatest challenge.

If you have the maturity to weather that through that, and that's the tough one.

That's hard, man. That's hard, but... Okay, I got a couple final questions for you. Ask away. But before I ask them, you've got a book out and you've got called youd've Got this, which is your mantra, Mastering the Skill of Self-Confidence, which I'm studying a lot about overcoming self-doubt, because I think doubt is the killer of all dreams. And so you've got a great book on this, Self-Confidence People can check that out online and do you have a website as well?

Yeah, you know what? Sonny, my partner, put it up on our website, drivanjoseph.com, but if you type in your name, Lewis Howes, they'll get a significant discount. I think she worked the magic there. Okay, cool.

Yeah, so discount on the book. If you go to the website, drivanjoseph.com, you're also on Twitter.

Yeah. Dr. Ivan Joseph, are you on Instagram yet? I am on Instagram just recently.

Just up, I think you made that happen.

All right.

We'll be sharing out stuff over there. Take pictures, man, all the time.

Get your kids and post for you. They do, actually. It's good.

22, 21-year-old.

Dad, no!

Do it this way. Drivanjoseph.com, the book.

You've got a new book you're working on, it's not out yet? Yes. It's called the Truth About Lying. It's just going to talk about the science of lying and how it impacts performance and behavior. We'll talk about the placebo effect. It'll talk about the role of affirmations, It's that, yeah, I'm hoping it will be really, really good, but we'll see.

I'm sure it will be. You gotta have a positive mindset. Come on. This is a question I ask everyone at the end called the three truths. So imagine it's your last day on earth, many years from now, and you've accomplished every dream you have. But for whatever reason, you gotta take all your content, all your body of work with you to the next place. And you get to leave behind three things you know to be true. That would be the lessons that we would have from you, but we wouldn't have any other content from you because it would all be taken with you to the next place. And these would be your three lessons to the world and to us. What would you say are your three truths?

Ooh.

One, what you tell yourself, you become.

Right?

Number two, work ethic will set you up for success over talent every day. And three, and it's very related to the first one, but your thoughts influence your beliefs, which influence your actions. Those are the three that I would leave with.

Fourth one, love yourself.

I was going to just say, how did you know that?

Is that what you said?

Yeah, I was just going to say, if I could get the fourth one. It would be love yourself. How did you know that? Did you just read it?

Black, repetition. Not intuition, repetition.

I love it. Repetition.

I feel like it all goes back into loving yourself. If you can think a certain way, you'll feel a certain way and that'll be loving towards yourself. And if we can love ourselves every single day and every moment in the good and the bad, it's like we set ourselves up for success. If we hate ourselves, It's gonna be hard.

Yeah.

It's gonna be unfulfilling in life.

I almost want to say love yourself as you would love others. Right? Take it back to the old book.

Think about the person you love the most in your life and then treat yourself the same way.

Yeah. Yeah.

Good questions. Oh, that's a good, you made me think that.

I want to acknowledge you for a moment and I want to acknowledge you for showing up, for flying here and showing up in the middle of all this craziness and for putting yourself out there consistently. You did this TED Talk, I think eight to nine years ago, on a whim, and you showed up. You weren't prepared. And that one decision you made led to impacting millions of people's lives around the world and then impacting more people from this information, from having this knowledge. And I think this knowledge, when used the right way, can be extremely powerful. And the work that you've done your entire life the failures, the successes have brought you to this place where you can share this information, the research, the working harder than everyone else has gotten.

You to the position.

So I acknowledge you for all the gifts that you have of showing up in a powerful way and giving us this insight. I think it's going to truly transform a lot of lives. And I appreciate the work you put in. My pleasure.

Thank you for having me. You made this easy. So thank you for the kind words.

It's a fun topic. This is a final question. It's called what's your definition of greatness?

Oh, man. I will say this. I want to leave this place better than I found it.

All right?

And so that's for my family, my kids, the people I've served as a coach and an educator. Leave this place better than you found it.

There you go.

Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

My pleasure.

Thank you so much for listening. Welcome to this episode. If you enjoyed it, the power of building self confidence, make sure to share this with a friend. You have the ability and the power to change someone's life right now. Just send them this link, lewishouse.com/982 or copy and paste the link wherever you're listening to this on Spotify or Apple Podcast or anywhere you listen to podcast. Take that link, text a friend, post it on your Instagram story, on your Twitter, on your Facebook, share it online. online because you can impact someone's life today by spreading this message. And please click that subscribe button on Apple podcast right now and leave us a five star rating and review those reviews. And when you subscribe, it really helps us spread the message more. So if you got value out of this, you can do me a big favor by clicking the Subscribe button and leaving a five star review right now. And if you want inspirational messages from me every single week, just text the podcast to 614-350-3960. And every week I'll send you messages, audios, videos, quotes to help you in your life. Again, text the word podcast to 614-350-3960. And I want to close with this quote from actress Blake Lively who said, the most beautiful thing you can wear is confidence. And I want to remind you that you are loved, you are you're worthy and you matter. You know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.