Jeezy: Escaping the Streets, Building a Music Empire & Manifesting Lessons from Jay Z, Kanye West & Rihanna! EP 1480

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Welcome back, everyone, in the School of Greatness. Very excited about our guest. We have the inspiring Jay Geezy Jenkins in the house.

My man, how you feel it.

Good to see you, man. Excited about this. We've connected on social media for a while. You have an amazing new book out called Adversity for Sale that everyone needs to get. But you've been on the scene for a while, a couple of decades. You've been in the music scene, multi-platinum award-winning, all the different things that have happened for the success that the world has seen. But what I think is interesting is most people we were just talking about don't see the darkness and don't see the failures necessarily. They see the money, they see maybe the success, they see who you're working with, all the talented people you get to collaborate with. But I don't think everyone gets to know about the adversity that got you to where you're at and actually how it's the failures that give us the most information on how to be successful. We're talking about your younger years where you went through different adversity, Grew up, your parents were separated, you're in and out of boot camp style institutions. And you had some darkness early on.

Yeah. A lot of it.

Now, were you successful before, in terms.

Of the music world? Were you doing music and having stuff out there before a lot of the darkness came?

Or no? Let me give you a little, a little humble bragging. so my father was in the military. My mother and my father married young. I have a sister. My older brother died, and me and my family were abroad. So I lived in Japan and Hawaii, too, right?

Yeah.

So that was the beginning. My parents got divorced because, you know, my mom was, you know, she. My mom was a little spicy at the time, you know? I mean, my dad was how he was. And I don't think they can put it together because I don't think there was therapy, all those things back then that I know of. And they just divorced. And it was like one day we was living this life, and the next day I was back in the hood with my grandmother, living with my grandmother. And then I tried to live with my grandmother for a while, and there was a lot of people in the house. So I ended up moving with my mother. And when I moved with my mother, it was a really a little dysfunctional because I look just like my father.

She didn't like your father.

No.

So she didn't like you?

No. At all. And so we just kept bumping heads and one day I was supposed to go to school and this is around the time I was getting in the streets and I was just like, I ain't going. And she was like, oh, are you going to school? And I'll never forget it. We got this big, the biggest argument we ever had and I looked up and she had her, she had a little 25. It was like a chrome with a A little pearl handle. She put it in my face. She said, you gonna go to school? You gonna, she said, you gonna go to school, you gonna go to hospital.

And I just remember- Put the gun in your face. Yes.

I looked at her.

Your mom?

Yes.

How old were you?

Maybe about 14, 15.

Holy cow.

Yeah, maybe about 14. I couldn't have been 16. I just wanna make sure I get the title.

Sure. So she puts the gun right in your face, like closer.

Tells me, you gonna go to school, you gonna die today.

Oh my gosh, yeah.

And I believed it too, though, 'cause my mom wouldn't let me play with it. Like she was serious. She was serious business. And I knew what it was. I was out of control. By this time, I'm 13, 14 years old. I'm selling drugs. I'm into a lot of things that kids shouldn't be into, right? But because this is where I felt like I had a place you know, because they treated me different. He felt more accepted there.

Yeah, yeah.

So in the streets. That was, yeah, in the streets.

That at home.

Right. Really? And so when I left her, I went back to stay with my grandmother. And that's why I say I relate to you on the sofa thing. I stepped on the sofa a lot of nights. Whole childhood, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, and the thing about my grandmother, she kind of let me do what I wanted to do 'cause there was so many grandkids in the house, like she didn't really have any control, so I would go out. stay out as long as I wanted to and come in. And so I was able to start, you know, building my, building my foundation to be what I was becoming, if you will, because I didn't have any restraints. Right. I was, it was, it was game on. And, you know, that's not a good thing. You know, it's crazy. I say that all the time because my grandmother lived right across the street from this basketball court.

Right.

And every Sunday, everybody would come to this court from all the towns around and they would play basketball and they'd be like all the hustlers and all the cars and you know, all the women and you just like, and I used to be so tired because I was up hustling all night that I used to sleep on the sofa. So I would be sleep while they're playing ball, right? But I would listen to everything, the conversations and everything I could hear because I had phone more. I didn't want to miss out. Sure.

Right?

And that was like my thing, just laying on that sofa and just listening to everything. And then one day I was just like, man, you know, I can't wait till I can pull up in front of this park in a yellow tester roaster and hop out and be this big guy and all that. And the crazy thing, that was my vision. Then, you know, of course it wasn't a big deal.

That was the dream.

There you go. And I ended up doing that, but my grandmother passed before she got to see it. So my point in case is, Everything that she thought that was gonna, you know, send me to prison and get me killed actually gave me the foundation to be who I was. And that's why I relate when you're saying about your brother. It's like you have to go through things to start to understand why you're here. And for me, it was like, I could do this. But it was a real game because it's like this ain't Pac-Man, that's something you playing. Because if you lose, you know, it's death or jail. Yeah, man. So now, now I'm picking up skills. 'Cause what do you have to have if the consequences are dire? Now I got discipline. Wow, you know, I'm smart. I'm thinking things out. I'm problem solving.

You learned this from the streets.

Yeah.

What were the three most powerful skills you learned hustling in the streets that you still use today?

Oh, sure. Discipline is. Discipline is real. like, it's like you can do anything in the world with discipline. And if you don't have it, the world can do anything to you. You know, discipline is key. The second one I was thinking would be, it's problem solving. Like, it can be chaotic. I'm the calmest person in the room, and in my head, I'm already putting together how I'm gonna solve the problem.

Right.

And the second thing, I mean, the third thing would be. understanding that you don't need anything to make something, right? You just gotta have the drive to do it. You feel what I'm saying? It's like you don't need a product to make money, right? You just need an idea and a drive to get it across. And I learned that in the streets really quick, you know? 'Cause if your personality is good, are you a good person? People will do things for you that they wouldn't do for somebody that they feel like Might try to take advantage of them, rob them, take something. It's almost like, I really like you, I wanna help you.

But could you fully trust everyone or anyone in the streets as a 16, 18 year old kid?

I'm gonna tell you something real. I ain't never trusted nobody in my life.

Even today?

No.

Today you don't trust anyone?

No.

Not even your wife or kids?

My wife, but like nobody I know. Wow, but let me say this from.

My past, from your past. Okay.

But what I had to learn.

And.

Earn was to get only quality people around. Yes, because I just kind of brought what I had with me to the table. And everybody don't got the proper etiquette.

Sure, sure.

So it's like it wasn't the right table. Right. And as I started to lose people on one front, I had this very dark space where I was trying to figure out who I was because these are the people that made me feel like this is my support system.

They accepted you on the streets. They were there for you when you were struggling, when your parents weren't there.

Right. So this is like- They brought you in. This is my support system. Man, that's so tough. Right. And then now I'm getting to this space where I'm making different decisions. and my support system is like, and by the way, my support system is not like, it's almost like having a pack of wild wolves. You know what I'm saying? I'm just being honest. Like, yeah, man. Feed them every day. And then when the food starts slowing down, they get hungry. They start looking at you. They get hungry. You know what I'm saying? So now I'm having to navigate this, and I'm having to, you know, separate myself, so to speak. But as I'm separating myself, I'm losing my power. How so? Because I don't have control over anything else. I got control over the streets. I'm not in corporate America yet. I can't make any decisions or no moves. I'm not right over here of nobody.

How old are you at this time? This time?

Or this is actually after I put out my second album.

Okay.

You know what I'm saying? And I just started to see things happen. And I talk a lot about it in the book. This was my, my, my, like you graded what you do, right? And you know all these people in this community. So you got resources. But if I just took you and put you in the White House, you might be a little like- what do I know?

Right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It was a lot of that. And as I started to transition, so you brought your crew with you as you started to do music. Correct. Right.

You started to- I really didn't have a choice.

Yeah, it was all you knew. Well, no, because I was still doing what I wasn't supposed to be doing. Oh, you were still on the streets.

This is my corporate job. While you're trying to be- While you're.

Trying to be credible. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So this is my company, right? This is how the bills are being paid. Sure. This is how We're staying afloat. This is how I'm paying for the music. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But once I go like, okay, this ain't really working, I gotta lean more towards the music and I'll never forget, I went cold turkey. I just kind of, like one of my friends said something to me about it and I'm like, you know what? I don't wanna go to prison 'cause I'm not prison type. I'm keep it real. I'm too fly of a guy for that. I ain't got time to be wasting my time, you know what I mean? And I didn't wanna get killed. because it was like, you know, I was losing, you know, 30, 40, 50 friends a year, like clockwork. Really? Yeah, still to this day, right now, right now. Wow. I just lost three people that I know that I'm affiliated with. So all three people in the last two days.

Do you know anyone who can be successful doing hustling the streets while staying alive, not going to prison after 10, 20, 30 years, and feeling peace in their heart?

No.

Why do people do it for so long? I get it when you're like a teenager and there's, you know, you're getting, you're getting brought up in it. But why keep doing it?

Because in their eyes, that's the closest they ever been to success. In my eyes, it's the closest I've been to success. I paid for, just to put, just to put a understanding of it, like this room we in, right before my mom kicked me out. I bought a trailer, a double wide or a single wide trailer as big as his room. That's as big as it was. Me and my mom, my sister stayed in a space like this for years until she kicked me out that I paid $3,500 for. Wow. When you think I got the $3,500, the streets.

Right.

So just like how's that not success?

That's how you made it.

Yeah, yeah. How's that not success? Right? I'm doing something for my family, I'm doing something for my mom. I'm not even thinking about the consequences.

Right.

Right. I'm not thinking about what could happen. I need to eat now.

Right.

But when you, but let's say, you know, for those that stay in that game for five, ten years and they see three to five, ten friends a year die or go to jail every year. What's the motivation for saying, oh, it's not gonna be me. I'm gonna be fine. Or I can outsmart the law or outsmart the bullets.

Okay, so that's why I'm doing what I'm doing. Yeah. Because I'm, I'm, I'm the one that I'm the only one that made it from what I know, right? And that's why I'm telling my story because I had to make a lot of decisions that weren't favorable, that wasn't cool, that wasn't like what you're supposed to do when you're in my position. I had to go against the grain. And that's when I realized that I'm a disruptor and I'm a visionary because I see, I could tell you in 10 years what I want to be like, man, what I can tell you in 20 years where I want to live at, you know what I mean? I could see it. Right, and then I can tell you what I'm not scared to go up against to get there. Right, and that's why I wrote the book because this success is like we equate success with money. Yeah, I don't care how much it is. You know what I'm saying? If I got more than I had yesterday, I'm successful. Yeah, but that's not the truth.

What is success for you?

Success to me is peace. It's peace of mind. It's being able to get up every day and live your life, you know, to the fullest with making memories, doing things that you love to do without, you know, having to be told what to do because you earn that and you put yourself in a position where you're able to go do something that you actually love. Right. It has purpose for you, right? Because this book and what I do is 'cause a lot of people get caught up in the G-Zee like the rap. I ain't never been a rapper.

Really?

No, I'm him. I ain't his mother, his daddy, his brother, his cousin. I'm him. I'm the guy who walked out on the streets and showed all these kids in this generation coming up that you can be from where I'm from. I'm gonna leave the back door open for you. You just gotta get in there.

Now that's the first part. You gotta be disciplined to make those decisions.

Yeah. Right. But that's not where the game starts. Where is it start? Now you gotta stay alive. Now you gotta stay free. You see what I'm saying? 'Cause that's what's going on with culture and entertainment. These kids are going to jail like it's nothing. They're dying like they're in Vietnam or something. You feel what I'm saying? So that's my purpose and why I'm here and why I want to tell my story because I had to make some painful decisions to get here and I'm still thriving and trying to get to the next level. But this is bigger than me because I'm gonna have to sit down with somebody one day and tell them, hey man, you know, you might wanna try it this way, you know, 'cause it missed so many calls where, I've had some kids where, I wouldn't call them kids, but young guys that I really respected and I would go talk to them about certain things and they'd be like, yeah, I could see that. And then next week they're gone.

They don't take it, they don't listen to you, they don't take action.

Well, the thing is, you have to package it right. Mm-. You feel what I'm saying? Because I'm coming to you and I'm looking clean and buttoned up. I don't look like one of you because I know how I used to look. You know how I used to be, you know what used to be around me. Yeah. You know, you respected what was around me because you felt like I was leading men that you respect. Now that that's no longer around, you kind of second guess what I'm saying because that ain't the ideal you got for yourself, right? Mm-. Until you start to get in that place where you start to get things that you actually really care about. Kids, wife, family, career, you know what I'm saying?

Sure.

And now you're like, oh, what do I do? Because now you have to start making those, and the thing is you have to evolve. If you don't evolve, even in the streets, I knew that going in. It's just like, I'm not staying here. I just need this to be, you know, the vessel, because music is my talent, which I stumbled upon. But business has always been my passion. I always saw myself with a plane, a watch, wedding band, three-piece suit. Really? Yeah, that's me. That's who I am. Clean cut, good skin. Smelling good, right? That's me. And that's what I strive for. Wow. So I was never caught up in the stigma of the streets. Like I understood it, but I understood what it was too, you know what I mean? So I'm like, I can't come from the streets and walk straight into the boardroom. So how do I get there? And then I started to map out this plan. The plan was to go from where I was to figure some things out, to establish myself, establish my credibility. They started to get into this music. I started as a CEO at first. I spent a lot of money. That didn't work. My artists went to jail. One of them got killed. And now I'm stuck with all the studio equipment. I'm like, I gotta do it myself. I do it myself. It takes me 10 years to build it. Boom. Now I'm a success. But then I got all these bad things that are coming with me because now nobody ever cut the water off, you know what I mean? So I gotta start a transition in that. But this is a thing, they don't understand already out of vision, I'm already going where I'm going. You know what I'm saying? I'm going there. So as you start to get closer to where you're going, people start to fall back. And they're like, I don't really like what he's doing anymore. They like the music he's listening to. Why is he eating clean food? What are we doing? You know what I mean? So it's that, and the thing is, you know, I think the sad part about it is, you know, everybody's supposed to have their own vision. And my vision and your vision is supposed to align so we can get to where we're going together. Whatever I can do to help you, like we talked about earlier, and whatever you can do to help me, that's when the vision's align. When everybody's just kind of walking behind you just to see where you gotta go, and they're not knowing you're going there, as you get closer to it, they go, I don't wanna be over here. This is where I'm good at. But I'm like, we can be good here today, but I don't know about tomorrow.

Right?

Right. And that's what happens when you have people that get into the streets and stay in it. They don't have a vision. They just needed what they needed right then. And as you get more comfortable with getting what you get, then you get this thing that I talk about in the book, this mindset of, I'm glad it ain't me. So you hear about somebody getting murdered, I'm glad it ain't me. Hear somebody go, somebody going to prison, I'm glad it ain't me. But the whole time you rolling the dice.

Could be you any moment.

Yeah.

Tomorrow.

Wow.

You know, and I'm not trying to paint it like this dark cloud because I love so much in the streets. Like I give the streets everything. And I mean that, like even to this day when I'm out and I see people, and you gotta understand, like by far I'm not the biggest rap star, I'm not the biggest, but in the streets, I'm everything. Yeah, I'm everything.

Today.

It don't get no bigger. Really? Because they all, either their fathers, New me, the older brother that's in prison, the cousin from the block, that somebody got a cheesy story about why they love me. Wow. It's almost like Bob Marley. You go to Jamaica, seven miles where he's from, everybody's gonna tell you a story about Bob.

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How he helped him fight the bully at school, how he helped somebody jump their car off, how he gave somebody bail money, how he paid for kids Christmas. That's who I am.

Wow.

And I've been that. And like for me, you know, that's what it's about. And throughout the streets, the streets taught me about integrity, right? And that's like the big one to me because it's almost like, If you ain't a man of your word, you're not a man. You know what I'm saying? And it's like you wanna keep your word when you play with people that are just as dangerous as you are.

Absolutely. They're not gonna play.

You know, right.

They're not gonna play around.

I'm trying to tell you.

Break your word, they're gonna break you.

Right.

So you mentioned, you mentioned your mom, I mean this, I shouldn't be laughing about this, but it's just kind of crazy to think about. You mentioned your mom put a gun in your face when you were 14, 15. How many times have you had a gun in your face since then?

I got pretty slick after that. I got pretty good at seeing the energy and knowing like- Escaping it, yeah, not putting yourself in a situation. And I was telling somebody this other day, like I think in my mind, I just built up this superpower of just not getting caught up in that.

Really?

Yeah, I just been so good at that. You know what I'm saying? Like my whole life, like people tell you right now, I still move militant. like I moved militant before Barack Obama. You feel me? Oh yes. Because I'm not exempting anything. I'm not. You know, we just lost Nipsey Hussle. We just lost this one now.

Like you're not exempt. Even if you've had a good track record for a certain amount of time, and even if you're being in integrity.

To the right things and being of service. One thing about it, if you have El Chapo Guzmán, you still have El Chapo Guzmán.

You know what I'm saying?

Wow. It doesn't go away.

The people don't really.

Something from 10, 20 years ago might.

Still catch up to you. Absolutely. Really? Yeah. It's real. And I don't mean it in the sense of, I mean, you're still dealing with individuals. You're dealing with people.

Emotions.

Yeah, you're dealing with people holding on to stuff. And people see you moving different, right?

And they see you enjoying your life.

And they think, oh, I should be getting a piece. Right. Or not even just that, or just.

Like, oh, he ain't the way he used to be.

Therefore he's not, you know, or he thinks he's better than her or whatever.

Right.

And just jealousy. wow. My coach is. It's the real deal. Really? Oh, yeah. You lose your life about that easy. I mean, that's nothing.

Even if you didn't do anything to someone, but just that you came from somewhere, you made it, and they didn't.

The crazy thing, you ain't got even make it. It's gotta be there when the energy's off, and they jealous and they mad.

Or they upset, they got nothing to lose.

That's it.

And.

And I got nothing to prove, right, right, right. So. I know better. And I think that, you know, I carry those lists of rules and morals as I continue to navigate the world. And I think people that are around me don't understand why I still think that way. Wow. You know what I'm saying? But I just know better. And it's not like I'm scared, I'm worried, but I'm not gonna go nowhere I shouldn't be. I'm not gonna hang around. I ain't going to Roscoe's, I tell you that.

2:00 AM, Roscoe's, you're not jumping out.

I'm not doing that.

Wow, man. This is my assistant, you know, I'm just- so- you-'re very intentional. I'm mindful about your environment, people you're surrounding with.

And that came with not trusting anyone. Wow. You know what I'm saying? Because I couldn't, you know, and people around me might look at you and might tell you if they sat down with you, like, that's not true because this is like, nah, I didn't. I know how to play the game. I love you. I still love you. But I know what you're capable of, right? And at the same time, I know what's going on with the dynamic. You see me moving in a different direction. You don't like that. you're never gonna like that. How could you possibly like that? You know what I'm saying? So now it's like the love I have for you, I can't allow that to let, you know, me be vulnerable in a certain sense. How do. And I know it sounds like.

Yeah, sure, but. But it's like, how do you have peace, inner peace, emotional peace, and self-belief and self-confidence while also knowing that. people that you grew up with or, you know, you're losing friends to death or jail or. And still happening today. How do you feel peace, calm and confident?

What?

Running a business, running your life, traveling with your wife, whatever it might be. How do you feel those things?

I feel peace because I know that when it's all said and done, my kids gonna know that their father was a great man. I feel peace in knowing that there's no better husband in the world. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm that guy. I'm saying because this is something I strive for. Like, I wanted these things. I know that when it comes down to my culture, there's nobody that's realer than me because I'm not a rapper. Like, I'm not, I'm a prophet in my mind. I mean, I'm here to share what I've learned, and to share what I know and hoping that it can change lives. Wow. Right. And save lives because that's the only thing I can do at this point. You can give me a billion dollars, I'm gonna live the same life. Of course I want it. Right, right, right. But I'm gonna still be the same person. And for me, it's like I get peace in knowing that I got good friends now that I can build with. You know, I just have my homie lost, one of his nephews and the other one lost his cousin. And but it was a time where as black men, we couldn't even talk to each other about how we felt. I'm in a circle of people now, I can tell them like, man, I'm, man, I don't know how I'm, and we all come together, and we talk about this, and I ain't judging you. Yeah. It didn't used to be like that. I used to have to keep all my feelings and everything that I was feeling balled up inside and deal with it myself, you know, which caused me to go outside of my comfort zone to find the answers, which was a great thing. yeah. Now I can call, you know, one of my brothers or somebody and say, hey, look, man, well, you know, my man, I finally his nephew died. And then next day, my other man's cousin died. And it's just like, now I gotta make these calls. But the calls are like, they're, they're intentional. Hey, bro, if you need to process this, you know, you need to just sit down, like, you want to smoke a cigar, let's just talk, you know? And, and that's a different type of piece. Yeah, right. Because now God an outlet. And then what gives me pieces is I started getting mentors, whether it was my, 'cause I had TD, a mentor of yours.

And Bishop Jake's isn't an amazing- Bishop.

Jake's one of my mentors, John Maxwell.

Oh yeah, I just had John on his crew.

Robert Green. Robert's amazing. Tony Robbins. Yeah, man. You name it. You know, these are my, this is my circle. Yeah, it's me down. Wow. And for me, it's like, these are people that I can reach out to to even help me process stuff I need to help process for the people that I love. Wow, I love that. I want help, right? 'Cause now we all got this. You know what I'm saying? It's not just mine, right? And what brings me peace is knowing that, you know, my decisions can change lives, right? Because my decisions have took lives. Meaning like I've been a part of things that- Wow. you- know, but now it's not like I just turn this new leaf and I'm just, in a different space. It's like, this is who I am. This is who I was evolving to be. I just had to go through the fire. Wow. Right. Just to understand, because I can't look at you with a straight face and go, I wouldn't do that. I don't think that's good.

And.

And I never did it. I'm gonna be like, yo, I'm like, yo, man, like, I I've been there. And that's why, when my brothers come to me, if they going through something or whatever, I can sit down and have a intentional conversation. about, you know, processing it and understanding where we at. And then we can. And here's that street sense kicks in again. Oh, you ever thought about this? And you should sit out with such and such, and y'all figure that out.

Sure, sure.

And that's how it works.

How old were you when you started to be able to open up and have these types of conversations about your emotions, about your feelings, about your thoughts, as opposed to just with yourself? Because I never spoke about any of my emotions till I was about 10 years ago when I hit 30. It's when I started to process and heal and be able to talk about these things that I was like, no one could ever know this stuff.

I would say when I was 40. Really? Yeah, it's less than five years ago. Wow.

That's when you started to be able to say, all right, let me start.

Processing or opening up.

Well, what happened was I was living in Malibu and my music was changing. Louis Farrakhan hit me, brother Farrakhan. And he was like, Jeezy, brother Z, your music is changing. The enemy is coming. I'm just like, my enemy is in my neighborhood. They ain't coming where I'm in Malibu. He's like, I'm just telling you, get off the phone with him. Next week, I'm on tour with Khalifa. Young man gets killed by my tour bus, and they locked me and my crew up. So now I'm sitting in LA County Jail, 10 million dollars in bail. you know what I'm saying? Cause there's 10 people on the bus. Oh, I didn't do anything.

First time in my life, I didn't do anything.

And I'm saying, you're on the bus.

Yeah.

Well, actually, I got off the bus. Oh, wow. And went to a hotel room. And then I came. But it was your bus. On the bus the next morning, they followed us to the next venue. Oh, man. That's where they got me at. Holy cow. And now I'm sitting in jail. 10 people in jail, million dollars a piece, 10 million dollars. And my team came to get me out the first day. Right? And I go, I can't leave them in LA, in jail. I cannot, you know what I'm saying? So let me figure out how to get everybody out and then we'll get out together. So I got everybody out on bail 'cause we still had to go to court. I had to pay for all that. Wow. Flying everybody back and forth, field to court, whatever. Shout out to my lawyer, Blair, Blair Brash, she killed it. But the thing was that one last time, I was depending on the people that was my people to make sure that my family and my people were straight. And when I got home, when I finally got out, nobody did anything. Really? And I was, 'cause I've been to bed for everybody. I don't pay for things that ain't got nothing to do. It ain't even my business, right? And I was just so devastated 'cause I'm like, yo, what if this would have been it? What if I would have passed? Like, you're not gonna make sure my kids are good? Y'all not gonna check on my, dollars a month, y'all gotta go do these things. And it's just like, I've done that for y'all, right? And I'm not pointing any fingers, I'm just saying, I know what I would do, right? And that's when I started to learn, I can't put my expectations on anybody, right? Right. So now I gotta do what's best for me, because now I feel like I'm all alone. Wow. So I was it. I cut everything. And then that's when I went on my mission to just start, and one of my business partners, we used to always just sit down and talk, have a bottle of wine, smoke a cigar, and he's like, what do you wanna do? I was like, I wanna do real estate. He introduced me to real estate. I started doing real estate that did well for me. I wanna do spirits, so this is all what we did. So I'm like, why don't I just do that in life? So I, Robin Green, I call Robin Green, we go to the LA Athletic Club. Sit down, have tea. I asked him seven questions. And he started giving me this game.

Wow.

John Maxwell, who came and married me and my wife. Wow. you- know, in my backyard. That's amazing. Right. And one of my best friends, and me and John talking, he gives me, this insight and I just started to move towards the light, you know what I'm saying? Because I just wanted to get a different perspective because I didn't have anybody around me to give me their perspective and TD Jakes same thing. And I'm not just saying it 'cause these are established people. These are men that have done well in their lives and their community and their relationships. And their relationships that want to share something with me that I didn't have any access to. Wow. And that that's what made me start to open up and start to understand and start to be in peace and start to do all these things because now I know it was okay.

Holy cow. Before five years ago, when you would face a challenge or a verse.

Let me say this too, though. I met my wife on set when I went to do her show because she works in television to promote an album I was working on. and I told my publicist, I said, yo, I'm gonna marry that woman. But I knew that I had to do some work on myself.

Sure, sure.

So this is the five years that I would have got myself together. Then I came back and I was like, yo, you know, I'm actually ready for you. Like, wait.

Holy cow.

Yeah.

So you met her right around that time five years ago or whatever.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

So this is fascinating because did you kind of let go of all those people in your, your life around that.

Time that was I mean, I wouldn't say let go because it wasn't that easy, but I just think we grew apart and things just started to happen differently.

They didn't want to go on the same path as you. Yeah. So naturally, they're not going to be.

Spending as much time as you. Yeah.

And then it just, you know, it got a little crazy for a while.

Imagine that.

People don't like watching someone else change and doing things differently, especially if you've known for a long time.

Right. And you're used to doing certain things with them. Well, they want you to be the old you because it makes them being comfortable. Yeah. The new you makes people be uncomfortable. and for me, I just kind of felt like the hardest decision I ever made in my life, hardest decision I ever made in my life, was to walk alone. Hardest decision I ever made in my life. It was like, I meant for the first, I way, third motivation came in. For the first three albums up until my album, the Recession, I had so much survivors remorse and I was so like, in a bad place. Like I was drinking like you wouldn't believe. Really? Oh my God. I was 260 pounds. Skin was bad. I was just like, you know, 'cause I thought I was going to prison the whole time. I'm just 'cause everybody around me started to get indicted. So I'm like just waiting. It's coming. Like if me and you hanging out and you get indicted. I'm like, yeah, they got Lewis. That's my man. Right. You know what my y'all would do? Yeah. And they were just like the whole thing. So, A lot of the music and why it was so strong and the requisite, 'cause I just wanted to be heard. In my mind, I'm just like, I'm gonna be gone, so this is my only chance. So I really focused on the music, put everything in the music, 'cause I was just like, I just wanna leave this behind if I'm not gonna make it out this. And I was in such a, and this is the thing, I didn't have the verbiage for all these things I was going through.

I didn't have the communication.

I didn't know what, depression was. I didn't know what anxiety was. Like, I didn't know these days. I didn't have no, why you think I can go to the next room, one of my homeboys be like, I'm feeling crazy. I think it's, I think it's anxiety.

Like, yo, man, drink this, smoke this.

Hey, chill out, bro. You wuggin'. And on top of paranoia, on top of paranoia, one of the cops coming in, once someone come with a gun, everybody I would see, I would just think, you know, that the agents, they're this and that, all these things were going on. I'm trying to make music and I was just so depressed. I was just drinking so much and I, I was like, waiting. waiting till the day. Like, I would just go to sleep sometimes and be like, okay, if it's today, I'm prepared. And remind you, the whole time this is going on, because I'm built the way that I'm built, I'm distancing myself farther away from my family. My sisters, my cousins, my dad, my mom at the time before she passed, because I'm preparing Right. Because if I go, I don't want to be like, I can't be a weak link. Wow. You know, 'cause I missed the outside of my mom, my family. So I'm mentally disconnecting myself from them 'cause I don't want that to affect me if I gotta go to prison. Holy cow, all that's going on. And it was one day I never forget, I started to work on the recession and I was dealing with this young lady. We had this breakup. She was public, she was a public person. We had a breakup. and I just went in the studio the same night and I didn't come out until I wrote the recession. And what I was doing was, I was reading books. This is something new for me.

What year is this?

This is '08. '08, '07. Going to '08, right? Reading books, I was watching the news, I was working out. Now I'm in the gym. I don't know how to work out 'cause I don't like to be told what to do, so I ain't wanna go with a trainer. Now I'm YouTube and videos, you know what I'm saying? You know, YouTube was my best friend. And I learned how to eat clean, you know, how to stay hydrated. I'm drinking water for like, I go months without water.

Oh my gosh. Yeah.

It was Cristal. Oh my gosh, man. Cristal and Waffle House. That was it. That was my diet. And I was like that, and I lost 60 pounds. And I wrote the Recession, which was one of the best albums in my opinion than I've ever written life because it was dealing with politics, the world, the things were going on. I wrote My President is Black before Barack Obama. Wow. Right. This was before he won. This was like six months before he won. And then he won. So that made that song go even crazier. I had put on with Kanye West. This was the first verse that he did since his mom passed. And now I'm going to do shows. And when I used to do my shows, it used to be like all the gangsters and gang members and the drug dealers in the front row. Now I'm down, I'm like 190, 185, right? And I'm doing shows and it's all women in the front. Really? Yeah. And I go do my first show on the recession tour.

They think they're looking at our shirt.

Right? Yeah. And I'm doing the show and I come out on stage and all stuff start flying on the stage. I'm looking at my security guard, like, yo, what you gonna do with this? He said, Boss, I said, what's going on? He said his bras and stuff.

I was like, oh my God, panties and bras.

Right.

You know what I mean? And from that standpoint on, I was like, oh, I can be better. I can look better, I can be better. And this is when I came into stardom. This is what I did myself. Yeah, this is the first time. My third album was the first time in my whole career where I said, you are a bona fide star. You have to go out here and you got to do what you got to do, and you can't worry about your past. You have to be what you become. and that's when I fell into like cheesy, right? Wow. That was the first time I felt like I was worthy. And then- yeah, 'cause before then, I'm like, I'm thinking it's a fluke, you know? I'm like, huh, you know, I'm selling a few records, but it ain't the type of money I'm used to. Let's talk about that, you know what I'm saying? And how long was it really gonna last? You know what I'm saying? And you're not even really an artist, so you know, you can write a hit album and be talented and can't write another one. Right. A lot of people did that. Right. So now I'm starting to process that 'cause I'm like, okay, I got one. What happens now? You know? So now I'm trying to stay in the studio, but I'm not living the same life that I was when I was writing scratches. Right, 'cause now I'm on the, I'm transitioning, so I'm seeing things different and, you know, nobody wants to hear that. So what are you gonna do? Right.

How many, how many people in, in the, the music business that you interact with truly believe that they're worthy of love and peace and success.

I can't really speak because I know for me, I just feel like, I just feel like I'm just a grown man. And I don't group myself in that.

Sure, sure.

Not that I have any disrespect for it. Right. But it's like, you know, it's like if I go to a golf club and everybody there is, you know, well off, I might wanna play golf, but I don't wanna be in their group. Right, right. And I think that it's hard to get to know somebody when they don't know themselves. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's hard, you know, 'cause they're living out who they think they are, who people told them they are.

A false identity.

Yeah, you know, you can't get to know them because they're going by a name that they made up and that is who they are. And that's how people perceive them in the world.

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Right.

And, you know, not to say that anybody's a bad person, But it's almost like you go to a wrestling match, you gotta know the Undertaker ain't the Undertaker at home. Right, right, right, right, right. You know what I'm saying? You gotta know that, right? But I think that's different because I'm cheesy at home. I'm cheesy every day.

Like it ain't got nothing to do with the music. The music just happened to be a part of what I'm doing. So, I mean, the music, you said this earlier, you weren't never, you never.

Trying to be an artist. You were never trying to be a musician, an artist or rapper, and you weren't trying to- I love the music though. you- love that. That was the thing because I learned and I talk about that a lot in the book. I learned a lot from like Tupac's core because he had morals and values before I knew what they were. He stood for something. He was a revolutionary. I didn't know that you can even have an opinion about this stuff. You see what I'm saying? He stood on that. He died for it. He's like, what's the difference between him and anybody else that was assassinated? He died for what he believed in, right? And the things that he believed in gave people like myself, some type of moral compass. 'Cause I knew I couldn't do that 'cause POC said you couldn't do that, right? And then I knew I shouldn't do that 'cause he said somebody did this to him and that's how I was starting to pull things out of the music. So I loved the music. So I was listening to like the POCs and the Master P's and the 8Ball MJG's. I didn't listen to the music just to hear it and enjoy it. I listened to the music like sermons. Wow. I'm trying to find the the word in there, the message. The message. And that's why I love music so much.

And it was like, but you weren't.

Trying to be a musician? No, I was trying to be, honestly, I was trying to be an entrepreneur before I knew what entrepreneurship was. Because the guys that I saw that was doing it on a major level was the Master P's and the Cash Monies. You know, they were living this crazy life. And I was hustling, trying to get the stuff that they was getting. Like, I bought Lexuses and Rolex watches and all this stuff. at that time, like I was known for that, you know what I mean? Like, people know, if you know me, I had the latest car, I had the best watch, and this is before music, right? But these were the entrepreneurs, and I'm like, well, I can do this. I just gotta go find some talent.

So I was- so you're trying to be the label. You were trying to find the talent.

I was dealing with some guys out of Florida that I was kind of getting some money with in the streets, and they, they, They had a record company that they was building, right? And we went like to this Black Spring Break in Daytona or something. They had like the Winnebagos and the cars and stuff on their t-shirts. And I was just like, I could do that. So I went back to Georgia, bought a studio, went to the neighborhood, got some artists. There wasn't artists. There was the homies, you know what I'm saying? Got artists and put everybody down. My man was with me as well. and we put everybody in the studio and we was trying to make records and we was trying to get our name out there and it just didn't go that way. And then the charges came down, people started getting real time, so on and so forth. And now we stuck with this studio with no artists and everybody like, well, look, you really lived the life. You might as well talk about it. Wow. I was a little reserved because I'm already, again, good over here. The last thing I want to do is go over here and look corny, right? Or 'cause I don't really truly have talent. Like I'm not writing sorrows every day. However, when I went back to my childhood, I had to realize my wife is gonna kill me about this, but it was a girl in my class when I went to school in Hawaii, right? And she was different than this or whatever. And I was just like, wow, you know, 'cause I had never seen, this is my first time out of the hood, like I've never seen this, right? So I'm like, so I started writing her poems. And then the more I wrote her poems, my dad would come in, like, what are you doing? I'm like, I'm writing another poem. He's like, man, come on. So I wrote her poems, like, every day, and then she ended up becoming best friends with her, of course, girlfriend with her. But I realized that the way I can articulate myself when I write was something special then, because you're feeling what I want you to feel.

Yeah, I'm getting the result.

I can see that. You know what I'm saying? I can see we're connected. Right. And I just remember that. Interesting. And then when I started to understand how to put my life into words, it started to be therapeutic for me. 'Cause now it's like, oh, I did deal with that. Oh, that is trauma. Wow, I did go through that. How did I overcome that? And now I'm putting it in my music. And that's why my music has always been about motivation. It's been about inspiration. It's been about how can I help you with my pain? How can I prevent you from feeling what I felt? And even if you do, How do I make you feel like you're not alone in this? That's where the music came from. Because if you go back to Pac, Thug life was a movement, but if you listen to it, you think it's about killing and robbing, it's not. It's about standing for something, right? It just made it make sense to us. 'Cause we all feel like we was living the Thug life, right? Wow. So I came back and my first album was Thug motivation, because I wanted to set it up like a class. That's cool. This is something you sit down and you, and then my second album was the inspiration.

Right?

And then my third album was the recession. So look at the, you know what I'm saying? And the crazy thing is, I got the recession from being in a room with these guys. I went to this little private dinner. I'm in a room with all these guys that got all this money, and they were so concerned. They was like, yo, the recession is coming. I'm thinking about selling this and doing that, and I gotta get rid of this business. And I'm going like, you guys got a lot of money. Like, what are you worried about? He's like, do you know what a recession is? I'm like, yeah, but I didn't. So I went back and Googled it and I'm like, huh. So I'm asking questions now. What happens with this? How does this happen? So when I wrote the recession, that was me running back to tell the culture what I just learned. Because we know what a drought is. A drought on the street, meaning ain't nobody working. But a drought on the money is totally different. So that means there's no money nowhere. Right? So if you think you're living bad now, you're gonna live even worse, right? So that was my, intention is when I wrote the recession to tell people what was going on. And I just caught that moment in time where it hit and that music was like the soundtrack for what everybody was going through.

And it was the recession.

Right. And it's right when I dropped it, that's when they announced it. And it was huge. When I say huge, it was crazy. And every interview I did after that, I started to really notice again, hear those words, because now I'm writing about what I'm learning instead of just what I'm doing. and I'm putting it together, and now my interviews are different. Like people are asking me real questions. They're not asking me, what's up with Lil Ray Ray? It's like, what do you think about the president? Have you ever met him before?

Right?

And I gotta tell you a crazy story about that too. So my past, so after I did my president as black, he won the first time, right? So he invites me to a correspondence that Ray in New York. Go by a Tom Ford, get myself together, and I fly back to New York and I go to the Correspondence Dinner. I'm watching my peers go in, the Correspondence Dinner. And I'm getting out of the car and I see my security talking to Secret Service. And there's like, no, no, he can't, he cannot. I'm like, can't be around you. Right. And yeah.

So he invited you, but he couldn't.

His team invited me. I couldn't get in. most embarrassing day in my life. I'm told everybody I'm going, like I'm telling everybody, right? And now I'm sitting in this hotel room in this hotel called the London in New York, and I'm just sitting there and I'm going like, all the good I do, all the things I'm trying to like, how you like, I'm a good dude. Like how you gonna like you like, this ain't even real. Like, you know what I mean? My past is my past, but I started to understand how big and deep my past was and if they went and dug into it, what they would have found, right? And I never forget I was on tour, maybe like, so it was year one, so this is like maybe like three years before we got back in the office again. And my mom called me, I'm in London on the tour bus. She said, hey baby, you see what the president talking about to you? I was like, what? She's like, yeah, the president was just talking about you. I said, no, no way. She said, yes. I said, he's talking about me? She said, yes. I said, okay, yeah, my sister sent me the clip. He was at the next correspondent dinner. He said, my first term, I went with Al Green. My second term, I'm going with Young Jeezy.

Wow.

Like, plain as day. And he looked at Michelle, he said, she likes when I sing that to her. And that's when I was just like, okay, I get it. He got some ice in his veins.

He see me, I can't feel no way, right?

Right. He gave you a shout out. He gave you props.

Yeah, yeah. But here we go.

Here go that life again. I had people like that too. I'm in my own light, I'm doing my thing. You can't be right beside me. You stealing the things that they don't. You know what I'm saying? So that was his way of showing me, I see you, you know?

But I can't be.

I can't be. It's gonna be a little while before we able to sit down. Right, right, right, right. Have a cocktail, bro, but I see you. And to me, that acknowledgment, not just because he was the president, but because he saw me. Publicly. Right. That made me- Wow. You know, I was just like, okay, cool. Which I took a page out of that, and even guys that I know from the streets that, you know, we have some history, I make sure if it's still that type of terms that I still see them. -huh.

'Cause sometimes people just wanna be acknowledged. Absolutely, man.

Wow. Have you got a chance to sit down with him? No, actually he came to Atlanta to do a rally for Stacey Abrams. We got a chance to chop it up right quick. I don't think the Secret Service still trust me yet.

It was like looking at me up and down.

That's just like, oh look at that.

Wow, man. This is fascinating. So how did you get the confidence knowing that you weren't a rapper or an artist or musician? How did you get the confidence to, obviously you're writing down your thoughts, what are really poetry in your way and sermons in your way, motivation and teaching, and you're putting it into an album. How did you sell so many records and get your name out there coming from the streets? How did you promote yourself and build a brand record after record? When you didn't know what you were doing.

That's the thing. That's the good thing. That's the golden thing about his trees. You don't gotta know what you got. You don't gotta know what you're doing. As long as you do it. Cause there's no, and that's, like I say back to the book, there's no straight path. After we trying to get through, you gotta navigate these things. I think what gave me the confidence was survival. And that I knew that I was studying before, like say for instance when Again, when people just be listening to the music, I'd be looking for the word, or I would be a young guy to go sit around a bunch of old guys and just listen to them talk to see what I can learn from them. And that just kind of was my school. It kind of gave me confidence because I knew more than the average kid my age, right? And I was learning how to move because my older cousins was in the streets before me and they was pretty big. So I watched a lot what they was doing, a lot of people that was around them, and I was like.

Okay, and I'm just, I'm spoiled. Your brother was performing in the streets.

No, no, my cousin was in the streets. Gotcha. They was doing this and that. They were doing big. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They were the guys. And I was just watching what they was doing. So you observed and then you recorded it? Yeah, it was a sponge, a sponge, a sponge. And that's what gave me confidence because I just felt like I knew more than everybody else, right? And then I wasn't scared to go ask the questions. And then going about building a brand. I watched and studied how music worked. and even from the cash money era, the Master P, Master P and them had the tanks on and all that stuff. I'm just like, what is that for me? And I had this necklace with this big diamond and crusted snowman on it, right? And it was like, it was the craziest thing ever because it started as a chain, right? And then people started calling me Snowman, right? And now I got a brand. And then when I put out my first album, they took the Snowman and put it shout out to Shawna Ayers, she was helping me with it. They took the Snowman and put it on the CD cover. It immortalized it. And now this Snowman is everywhere.

And everyone wants to wear a Snowman.

So the shirts were made for branded and marketing. And I gotta go back to how I branded and marketed myself. The shirts was made for branded and marketing, and we only made a hundred. They blew up so much, we ordered a thousand more. Then, out of nowhere, I promise you don't know what happened. It went from some shirts that we were sending out to you go anywhere on Harlem, anywhere on 125th, whatever, every store got different version of Snowman shirts. This was all around the world.

Wow.

So now Jay-Z calls me 'cause he's the president of Def Jam. He's like, I'm going to the magic show. You should come with me. So this is the magic show out there, the clothing show in Vegas. so they got the Rock, Rocket Wear booth out there. Yeah. Yeah. And he like, yo, let's just walk through it. So me and Jay-Z walk around the, the, the magic show. What year is this? This is like, oh, 06. Okay.

07.

Yeah. Yeah.

06. And we just walking around it and people keep running up to me going, cheesy. No, I'm with Jay-Z they're like, cheesy, man. Thank you so much. We love you, man. It's, you're the realest. This is great. And I'm just like, so after the.

First fifth person, I look at him.

You look at me. It's like, what's going on?

That was saying anything to Jay-Z yeah.

But not even just that, though. We both looking at each other like, what's going on? Because I don't know what they're talking about. You know what I'm saying? Right. And I asked the guy, I said, yo, what do you mean? He's like, yo, everybody's making money off these snowman shirts. Because now they sell them in bulk. Oh, man. You know what I'm saying? Like, because they're selling to all the mom and pop stores. So we went to one guy's shop. He had them to the ceiling. And one of my guys back then told me when I first did it, I should trademark it. Yeah, but I'm still thinking like that. I'm like, nah, it's whatever. and I never traded. Oh man, craziest thing ever. And the craziest thing was, but it's a double-edged sword. So I didn't trademark it. However, I think that made my brand bigger than life. Wow. Because everybody had access to it and they were selling it and they were making money, which means that I was helping them help me.

Yeah, and they were probably getting out there faster than you could.

1000%. Wow. Now goes back to how I started branding myself. so what I would do when I was first trying to figure out where I was going, I was doing these mixtapes with DJ Drama. He's like a big deal in the culture as far as street tapes. So what I would do, people would do street tapes and put them in stores and sell them for $5, $10. What I did was I pressed up like 100,000 and gave them all out.

Wow.

I went to this club every week on the east side and I gave them out that we were around town, gave them out beauty supply stores, beauty salons, barber shops. And I did that. That was the first tape. I saw the need to move a little bit. In Georgia. In Atlanta. Yeah. Then my second tape was Trap or Die, right? So I pressed up 500, 000 of these. Oh, man. And I just started giving them out, giving them out. Best thing ever done. Because my grandmother always told me, if you want something, somebody else, give them something first. Right. Best thing I ever said, I could still do those songs right now any stage. Wow. Because it was like. It was like Grass Roots and now. I'm getting everybody starting to know who I am. And then I put this DVD of all the footage of me just running around with the Chapo Diet tape. And when I knew it was real, when I used to walk into my, we call them trap houses. Sure, sure, sure.

So I just go with my friends.

Trap houses or whatever, like my homies or whatever. And I go like, you know, just go through there, holler and whatever. And they would be watching my DVD. Wow. In the shower room, it'd be like 10 people in there looking at the DVD and you looking like, y'all know me. It's like, oh, this is crazy. You know what I'm saying? They're watching me. and that's how I knew. And then it went from there, 'cause I used to hang out a lot, just being all the premier clubs, wherever, 'cause I used to wear my jury, drama clothes, 'cause that was my marketing. Like I just looked like the guy who was already successful, trying to be successful. And I never forget when Trap-A-Dy came out, I was walking in the club, man. Remind you, I'm a street guy, so I'm not used to people just walking up on me. And this is back before you can just take pictures of anybody, anything. and people come up on me like, yo, cheesy man, I love what you do, man. Like the sixth time somebody came to me, it just felt like somebody was paying them to say this, you know what I'm saying? Cause it was weird. I never, sure.

You know?

And it just started happening more and more. And I'm like, oh, oh, oh, I'm on to something. Interesting. This is real. And then I started to go out like the malls or whatever, and be just doing regular stuff. People come up to me, yo man, I really love you man. I love what you're doing. I'm just sitting there, I'm going like, This is it. I got focus now. And I started recording my debut album. And while I'm recording my debut album, I was paying for it myself. And they come to me about a deal. So I take the deal with Def Jam. And while I'm taking the deal and working on the album that I'm paying for, that they're gonna reimburse me my money. I don't know how to perform and I'm not taking care of myself. And so now I do this show in Jacksonville at the Super Bowl, like in a club, nightclub, and the system is terrible. And I had polyps on my vocal cords already. And I tore my vocal cords. Oh man. So now I'm one foot in the street, one foot out. I got some buzz as an artist and I gotta get surgery.

Oh man.

And I don't know if I'm in the whole conversation is, We don't even know if he's gonna sound the same or how he's gonna sound. So now I'm like, it's going down, you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't know what to do, you know? And it was probably one of the scariest moments of my life because now I gotta go in there behind you, I don't even have a shirt. So I put on my surgery with a brown paper bag.

Oh my God.

So I put on my surgery with a brown paper bag. and so I made it through that. And then right after that, I want to make sure I say this word right, because somebody said, I didn't say it right last time. I got hit with Bell's palsy. And now. Wow. My mouth is crooked and my face is. This is, like, the second thing.

After the surgery.

After the surgery. Holy cow. So now I'm like, I'm hiding because I look crazy and. I was scared. I remember talking to my mom. I was just like, Mama, I don't know what to do. But then I realized quickly too that I wasn't taking care of myself, right? And at the same time, you don't have people around you that are taking care of themselves.

They're not. You know, people are drinking, you're eating bad.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not sleeping. Yeah. And you couldn't, you was too paranoid. Like, I couldn't, man. I can go off before these days, I can go off like an hour and a half asleep. Oh my gosh, any day. That was my thing. I sleep when I die. Right. Yeah. because you couldn't sleep, you know what I mean? Because you had so many things going on and your mind is in so many different places, but you're trying to navigate it. And that's why I say, you know, the new rich is peace. It is, you know, because, you know, you can have a billion dollars, you know, like my uncle used to say, you can put somebody in the Rose Wars. He's still gonna have the same problems. He's gonna have those problems in the Rose Wars. And I think once you become in this place where you just at peace with who you are, who you're becoming. And like I say again, I had to give myself permission to evolve. Wow. Because it was almost like I wanted to grow, but I couldn't grow because of my surroundings.

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Around this, these weeds and these things that will hold me back. And when I started to clean that out, I started to, like, grow and bloom and blossom. And I just started to understand, like, wow, like, the air is different up here. Like, you know, the, the, the, the, the, the thought process is different. Yeah. You know, like, I like getting up at 5am in the morning. I used to be, I wouldn't go to sleep until 6am.

Wake up at 2pm.

But I love it now because it's like, and even some of my friends, they ask me, like, what are you doing now? And it's crazy because people ask me, a lot of things about life that I'm surprised because they're older than me, right? And they're like, yo, so what are you doing now? I'm getting up at five, I'm doing this. What book you read? I'm reading this book. I'm reading that.

And they come over my house, I.

Give them a copy of the book. It's weird, it's cheesy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Sure, sure. You know, he's the guy who used to pass you the blunt, now he's giving you books. He's like, ah. But I take pride in that because it's my piece. I love when I go through my phone and one of my guys hit me like, yo, chapter 10. Oh my God, it's mind blowing. you know, again, wait, you get chapter 12.

But right.

Mine. That's my piece.

Wow, man.

And I had to work so hard and do so much work on myself just to even get a taste of that.

Yeah.

Right.

How did you get. I mean, how did you get to a taste of Peace? How did you start to even heal your thoughts, your emotions, your body? Because I'm assuming 40 years of some type of psychological or physical trauma. whether it be not sure where you're sleeping at night, mom's pointing a gun in your face on the streets, who knows what's gonna happen every day, sleeping an hour a night, doing that for 40 years.

Yes.

Seeing friends die, seeing friends go to jail, doing that for that long. Having surgery. There is no peace. There's no healing. There's no time to think about, let my nervous system calm and relax. let me process these memories of my past, from parents to childhood friends to other stuff that maybe you haven't talked about and really allow my body to feel whole.

Right.

When did that start to happen? And is that still a journey for you?

Yeah, still a journey. I learned that when my mom passed. I didn't grieve right. Really? Because I'm numb.

When was this?

My mom passed three years ago. Yeah, I'm numb. Like, I'm. I'm. I'm. I've been through it so much, I don't feel that part. I gotta be honest, I don't know how to connect with that, right? And that's something that I'm working on every day because it's like when you going through all these things, it becomes normal life to you, right? And then you have to understand this is what's gonna happen. You gotta deal with it, you gotta keep it moving, right? And when my mom passed, I knew that I didn't grieve right. I was just like, something's not right. We sent me on another mission. So to answer your question is how do you get to that? I'm still working on that now. And that's why I'm even opening up and being transparent about what I'm going through. But I think at some point, it's black man, we all in that space, bro. We ain't come from a certain type of life. And for me, it took me to get around other people to understand that everybody's went through something, right? And you got to be different outlets of how you can, you know, just start to dump some of that stuff off. And the craziest thing is, you know, and I'm not just saying that, Even when I started listening to your podcast, John Maxwell's and just different people, I just respected their perspective. I started to get a lot of information about how to deal with those things and who I should reach out to, which is why I'm so passionate about the book because there's information in there, right? There's information in these shows and these episodes that you do that you wouldn't even expect people to pull that from and go, man, maybe I need to, maybe I should sit down with somebody and, like, I didn't know what processing me, right? You know what I'm saying? I didn't know that something from my childhood could affect me worse in my 40s, right? I didn't. I didn't know all these things, but I'm working on those things every day. I'm working on trust. Wow, man. You know, I'm working on emotions. Like, I love my kids, right? And I'm. I'm just making sure I'm intentional about connecting with them, because I know there's sometimes with me where I get caught up in my world. and I'm thinking about everything that I got going on, that I might not be present. But then I didn't know there was such thing of being present. So now I gotta check myself on that.

So now- It's gonna be present.

You're always hustling for the next thing probably. So now it's checks and balances. Wow, man. And it's in the information. And that's one thing I do like about social media. At this day, I hate all the other, like it's terrible. But there's a lot of information there if you know how to sort through it. So like YouTubes, like books, like podcasts. There's information that we need that we just can't get from people that are around us 'cause they're searching for the same thing. and I think that's what helped me get on the mission of healing because this is the thing, I didn't know I needed to heal. I felt like I was Iron Man, you know what I'm saying? Like I'm good, like it can't nothing hurt me, can't nothing hurt me. I felt like that. And then when I started peeling back the layers, I'm like, I'm like, wow, like, you know, like how somebody gonna feel your devotion if they can't, if you're not, you know, it's how people gonna feel you if you're not even being, 'cause you know, by the way, this is, I would never talk this much. Just go back and look at my first interviews. I'm like, yeah, no, it's like interrogation. Yes or no? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was interrogation. It was like, nah, I don't know about that. But now I feel like, you know, it's my purpose and my responsibility to open up. That's beautiful. Because we don't make it to our 40s and 50s, you know what I'm saying? And we don't make it there being us and still being cool and still being successful. and still being like, you know, if it's a black man, you get over a certain age, nobody cares about you, not even your kids. Really, if you can't give them no money or do nothing for them, it's like, you know, you just get to a certain age, it's so hard for us, right? So you have to put things around you and put things in place to keep you held accountable and that fulfill you so that you can go out here and be the best that you can be. And for me, that's what keeps me going and keeps me on the journey of healing. I don't got a problem saying that now 'cause I got my my friends and people that tell me, you know, things like, yeah, man, I'm really going through this. I'm like, well, I mean, I'm here. Like, we, we, what can I do? Right. So I'm already knowing he need to heal, right? And I, I can understand that. So now I give him space to heal, right? Checking in, you know, let's go have dinner or something. Let's just hang out for a minute. And because the thing for my coach is when you go through things, you isolate yourself. you know, and that's like the worst thing ever, 'cause now you, you know, you, you, you in this, you know, in a wall is for real. Yeah, man. You know, a wall can keep people out, but it can also keep you in, you know what I'm saying? So it can keep the bad things out, but it blocks the blessings as well. It does, you know, and I think, you know, we, I had a wall up for, you know, my first probably, you know, 30 something years of my life. Really? Oh, a big one. I'm talking about like, no, nothing went getting past that wall. 'cause that's how I was surviving. It's different to live for love and to live for survival. And if you ask me, you know, what was the difference? I was living for survival here, now I'm living for love.

Were you able to experience love up until the last five years with that wall?

No. Really? No.

What does love feel like now that you have the wall coming down, or at least it feels partial wall, you know, maybe?

It feels like trust. It feels like a village. It feels like community. It feels like support. It feels like understanding. It feels like grace. It feels like those things because again, you never had it. And not to say that it wasn't there, but I wouldn't let anybody in.

You weren't allowing yourself to experience it.

So now it's just like knowing people. 'Cause you know, for a while you just feel like nobody really, like, really is down with you. 'Cause when you go through, like, a lot of the stuff I talk about in the book, you realize how people go left and right, not really down. You kind of just build that up in your head. You kind of like, okay, all my interactions are like, you know, they want offs. I'm not looking to build with you. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I already know at some point it's gonna go left and you're gonna feel away about something and there's that, right? But what I had to learn is, like, you know, even when I was wrong, you know, I could still go back and have a conversation with somebody who's mentally on the same level as me and be like, you know what, man? I just had a bad day, bro. Like I was doing this and that and going through and you said this and I just kind of feel like I wasn't there. You know what I'm saying? No, it's all good. That's how two men talk. But you coming from a culture where if we don't agree, somebody gotta go. Wow. You know what I'm saying?

Sure, sure.

Oh yeah, somebody gotta go. And I ain't talking about just leaving. Right? You know what I'm saying? Right. That ain't how it go forever.

Yes.

Hold up. That's how, that's how it's set up. And that's, and the thing about it is what I learned in this world, in this world is there's no conflict resolution in this world. We don't have conflict resolution. We don't have an understanding of how this is supposed to go.

There's a resolution. It's just not a healthy one.

Right.

Right, right.

And in this world, there's conflict resolution. There's, there's, I'm wrong. You're right. You know what? There's, you know what? Next time. I try that stairs, you know, you know, you lose somebody, we there for you.

You know what I'm saying?

You going through something, you gotta help. You know what I'm saying? If you, you, you feeling depressed, I want to be the one to call and make you laugh and tell you something crazy, you know what I'm saying? Or if you got some issues with your business, I want to introduce you to my lawyers and my friends and their friends and so on and so forth. And, you know, if I went on a vacation somewhere, like, man, you know, you should go there. I'm gonna set you up with the people. So now you like building this community of we all we got, right? And in this community, you all, you got it. Right. You know what I'm saying? You all, you know, ain't no way around it.

With all the experience you have now from all the stuff and the trauma you went through growing up and the process of healing and the process of trusting in the last five years and processing and all these different things, what would you say is your greatest superpower now? And maybe it's not what people would think it is. And also, what is your biggest weakness still that you're working to overcome that you want to become better at overcoming?

My biggest weakness would be dealing with a lot of my childhood trauma.

Because.

There'S sometimes a little J still comes out. You know what I mean? I have to work on that because either you feel slighted and again, what I had to kind of come to grips with is that what served me then doesn't serve me now. You know what I mean? And it's like, you know, a violent behavior would serve me then.

It protected you. It guarded you.

You had a tough demeanor. It's like, ah, you know. And was it the next one you asked, what am I working on?

The greatest superpower.

Superpower. Yeah. I say the greatest superpower to me is having a good heart, you know what I'm saying? Because I always had it, you know what I'm saying? It just doing things for people makes me feel like it fulfills me. Like, it's almost like, you know, when somebody call me and be like, yo, thank you for introducing me such and such or telling such and such, you know, stop by my business. I'm like, oh, no, it's, you know, I love what you do.

Whatever.

That's, that's a good thing for me. And then also my superpowers problem solving. Yeah, like I love that. Like you can put 100 problems on this desk. I'm scanning through them, okay, this is what we're gonna do. Yeah, that's my thing. And just to add someone to that, I think my biggest super, super power is integrity. Wow. I just, I have to move correctly because I have to be able to look at myself. in the mirror and there's been some times that I couldn't. Right. 'Cause I didn't move correctly. Your past. My past, definitely. I mean, you know, and based off, like, you know, I would lie if I felt like it was gonna benefit me or get me out of trouble. I don't think I can do that today. So I try not to get in trouble 'cause I'm gonna be like, yeah, I did it. Right, right, right, right. But I had learned that a man that's a real man doesn't lie under any circumstance. he does. Wow.

When did you learn that? When did you start that switch of.

I started that around about my late 30s. Wow. Because I was still trying to figure it out. And I. I wouldn't, like, say nothing crazy, but if you asked me something, there was, like, some pressure behind it, like, meaning, like, I could be in a situation or it might not go my way, then I might lean towards sure. What's gonna work for me. But now I couldn't. I couldn't do that. Like, I couldn't look somebody.

There's no peace when you're always telling a white lie or hiding something.

You know. Well also what I learned too, it worked for me because you have to be covert, right? You're coming from this world, you got Bible. Yeah. You can't tell people everything you're doing. You saw 9/11 supposed to tell me next step 'cause they could be there waiting for you, right? So that was how I lived. But when I started to be more transparent, I started to notice that these quality people that I was bringing to my life, became closer to me. They embraced me more. 'Cause you gotta think, like I was the guy that talked about coming over your house for dinner. Oh, no.

Right.

It was, but the more vulnerable and open and honest and integrity and your word that you are consistently, the more people wanna support you who have the same values.

They say, okay, and the more they want to, you know, even give you a lot of the knowledge that they have. 100%. You know what I'm saying? It's just like, and not even, you know, like really pour into you, like really lean into you. And at first, you know, that was a little weird to me because nobody had ever helped me before. So now I'm trying to figure out what's the catch.

Right.

What they trying to get out of? Yeah, yeah. Right. So now I'm trying to figure out what's the use me. They're trying to get something from me. Right, right. And it took a while and I'm just like, wait, hold Wait, wait. So, and then, you know, I'm not good with time. Like, I remember the trauma stuff, but like, 'cause of course I lived a crazy life in and out here and there, so you meet people and see people, but then when you see people, you haven't seen them in a while and they kind of greet you with that love and they tell you, like, I just really love you. Like at first I couldn't believe it, right? But over time, it started to be like, yo, maybe, you know, that's genuine. That's real. 'Cause where we come from, if somebody tell you they love you, you gotta be watching your back. Freely. Yes, absolutely. 1000% with them.

Yes.

You out a nightclub, somebody get in your ear, you know I love those. That's, that's, that's it. That's, you don't want that.

Really?

Yes, you don't want that.

Why?

They could be shooting you the next day or something.

1000%. I've seen it happen more times you can think. I've seen it firsthand, you know.

What is the biggest lesson your wife has taught you?

The biggest lesson she taught me in life is that having a partner is, is, is having somebody that is on the same wavelength of you. And you guys are building it better. The building together is the best thing in the whole world. My wife is smart, super smart, super savvy. you know, fly, let me say that. And it's just like, that's my partner. Like, we can talk about things and she's there with me, right? And then she can also tell me things that I wouldn't take from anybody else. 'Cause there's been times I've been in situations where my wife is like, you ever thought about? I'm like, no, I have not. Let me get into that. And we sit down, we politic, and we talk, and it's just like we're coming with a plan. And I love that. And she can hold her own, and that's what I really respect about it. She has just as many resources and things as I have. And we always put them together to do things. That's amazing. She's very well-traveled and I love that. Like we can go anywhere and she's plugged in and we live a life together that we both sit down. And I mean the first couple months we was together, we sat down, we did a vision board. It was like this big vision board that was in the living room in my condo. And we just doing all these, you know, saw all these ideas and we looked up maybe like, maybe like a year later, we had done everything.

That's so cool, man.

We gotta do another board.

That's cool. That's amazing, man. I've got a few more questions for you. That's okay. This has been inspiring, man.

I could hear your story.

Thank you so much, brother. I could hear this stuff for a long time. But I want to ask, I mean, you mentioned Jay-Z briefly, but you've worked with a lot of big artists over the years, right? I mean, who are some of the names that you've worked with? They've been on tracks with, they've been on your album, or you worked with?

Kanye West. Rihanna to Mariah Carey to, wow, the list goes on. I'm the only person people I ain't worked with that I ever want to work with is Sade and, and Tupac. I think everything else I got covered.

Wow.

Yeah, yeah.

How did you go, I mean, from not being an artist, not being a rapper, not knowing anything really about music to working with the biggest names in the world?

I think it's my connection to the streets and the people and the culture. because again, like when you have your community and you have some leadership there, by connecting and collabing, you get to get these people ears that you never would have got because they don't know you or believe you, but they believe me. Right? So that's the key to it because that's the most reason why people do collabs is to tap into whatever you got, right? And it's just like, you know, when you got people like Rihanna, we done records, you got Kanye West, We done ply records, um, ye got people like Jay I got more records with JaJZy than he has with bigy small, so, like they should think about it.

Holy cow Right.

But that's what I'm saying, so for me, I think we just ta to what each other has, and for me my stronghold has been the culture of the people like I am in the peoplele's tent, you know, and and and and it's way beyond the music, like the music is just a vessel and and in the and and and in the connection to the people, but I think it's more life things to have, 'cause you can track and see where I was in a bad space. You can see where I was trying to figure it out. You can see when I started to come out of my rut, you could see when I started to think different. You see when I started to eat different. You see when I started to dress different. So you see in that evolution and you started to go, hold up, I'm from where he's from, I can do that. He's doing, like, you know, in real estate in Atlanta, like we're really over the world. healing right now. Something I always love. I mean, it reminds me of my old life. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's my thing. And now I got business people come to me, talk to me about real estate. These are people in the culture that's really excited about going out here and doing these things that they probably wouldn't have never thought that they can do, but they're seeing what I'm doing, and they're going like, wow. And now I'm getting these calls from people that, you know, that I used to know in a whole 'nother life. Like, man, I just bought this duplex, man. Like, who can I talk to about managing for me or whatever, whatever. and it's like, these are the conversations I want to have with you. I don't want to have conversations with you.

Right.

That are, you know, that are the old way.

Yeah. Yeah.

I got. I got three final questions for. I feel like I could ask you tons of stuff, but I want people to get your book, adversity for sale. Yes, sir.

You gotta believe.

Oh, hell. Make sure you guys get a few copies of the book. Give them to your friends from Jay Jeezy Jenkins. This question is what I ask all my guests. at the end of our conversations, it's called the Three Truths. So it's a hypothetical question, hypothetical scenario. Imagine you get to live as long as you want to live. You know, you can extend your life for as long as you want, but eventually it's the last day. But you've created so many vision boards, you've accomplished all your dreams a thousand fold, right, for the rest of your life. You've lived exactly the way you want to live. But for whatever reason, in this hypothetical world, no one has access to your content, your information, your music, your books. This conversation is gone. Everything you've ever put out is gone. But on the last day, you get to leave behind three lessons. And this is all we have access of your information, the three lessons that you would share with the world. I call them the three truths. What would be those three truths for you?

First truth would be karma is real. I've done some pretty bad things in my life. And I tell you, man, the man upstairs, big G.O.D., he made me pay. He made me pay. And I'll never go back down that road again. So do right by people and do right by yourself, you know, 'cause karma is real. that would be my first truth. My second truth would be it's never too late for anything. Like you can be how old or you can be in the worst situation in the world. It's just never too late to turn it all around. It's never too late. Like you, you, you, if you get started today, you're on your way tomorrow, no matter when. And my last truth. would be evolve or die. And I don't mean in the sense of the word, but if you're not evolving, you're not living. And the last thing you want to do is take that with you. And they say, you know, the richest place in the world is a cemetery. Because everybody take all these great things with them. And it's just like you might lose a lot evolving, but you'll gain so much more.

Right?

And you have a whole different respect for yourself because we only got one life and your life has to affect more than what you can see or touch. Your life has to affect. I can never thought the end of my life would affect millions, right? And I'm still continuing to to chip away at that, right? And again, when I'm no longer here, I want my kids to know that their father was a great man. He stood for something. And he wanted to help people the best way he could. He didn't actually come in the best way.

Right, right.

But he wanted to help people as much as he could. And I hope, and I pray, by people seeing me evolve and giving myself the permission to do so on my own terms, at my own time, that that helps them understand that there's no judgment if you want to do and become better for yourself, your family, your peers, your community, your culture, your people. You got that right. Because when this life is over, it's a wrap. It's done. And what you didn't do, never get a chance to do that, ever.

Jeezy, I want to acknowledge you before I ask the final question for your, really your ability to look within over the last, you know, three to five years and say, you know what? I'm gonna start talking about things that I never thought I was able to talk about. I'm gonna start opening up and being vulnerable, even though I would have been laughed at, made fun of, kicked out of the house or whatever, growing up, if I would have done these things then. And I acknowledge you for allowing yourself to start to heal and transform and transmit the message that you've learned from. you know, the karma that you've had to deal with in the past from wrongdoings and mistakes and things that you did that were out of integrity to being the best human you can be. And obviously still no one's perfect, but being on that, that process of service, adding value where you can, creating, bringing people together, collaborating. So I acknowledge you for the man here continuing to be coming.

I received that.

The man you're, you're, you're, you're healing into a beautiful man, it looks like. And I hope we get to play some golf sometime. hang out sometime more. And I want people again to get the book. Before I ask the final question, is there anything else we can do to serve you today?

Oh man, just make sure we spread this message and let's just continue to build, brother. And I wanna let you know as well, like you really, I've turned a lot of my friends and my peers onto you and it's like they call me the next day, like, yo, this is amazing. 'Cause you just, like a different episode of what you're going through in life, you can just kind of go through it and pick what you're going through and listen to it. and I listen to your stuff every morning, man. That's me. What you can do for me is continue to do what you're doing, man. My man. The more people that you know.

My man, I appreciate it. Final question, Jeezy. What is your definition of greatness?

My definition of greatness is to be the best version of yourself by any means. It's greatness to me. That means win, lose, or draw. Just be the best version you can be of you. And that's all you got to give is there's nothing else. Like if you good up every day and you're doing the best you can do and you're being the best that you can be, that's greatness. You already walking in the path. It only gets better. You know what they say, good habits, good things come out of that. Bad habits, bad things come out of that. so at the end of the day, if you got a habit of being the best version of yourself, you're only gonna get better at that.

And that's greatness to me. I hope today's episode inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a rundown of today's show with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me as well as ad free listening experience, make sure to subscribe to our greatness plus channel on Apple podcast. If you enjoyed this, please share it with a friend over on social media or text a friend. Leave us a review over on Apple podcast and let me know what you learned over on our social media channels at Lewis howse. I really love hearing the feedback from you and it helps us continue to make the show better. And if you want more inspiration from our world-class guests and content to learn how to improve the quality of your life, then make sure to sign up for the Greatness newsletter and get it delivered right to your inbox over at greatness.com newsletter. And if no one has told you today, I want to remind you that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great. The world's best get better in Ohio.

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