Lansdowne: Going Indie, Signing, and Taking Back Control

All right, welcome to the Make Our Music Podcast with your hosts, Mark Rober, Jim Foster, Johnny Robers, Sean Lichtenstein, who's doubling as a band member today. And we have guests, Lansdowne, which includes Sean and Glenn Mungo of Lansdowne. All right, what's up, boys? How we doing?

Holla.

What's up, Glenn?

Where are you at right now? You at. You're in New York? New Jersey. Where you at?

New Jersey, in my. My quaint little office overlooking a nice, lush field of grass. Got the snow. We didn't know. Yeah, no, all the snow's gone here. So nice. We gotta.

We got a sheet of ice out there. You got to be careful just throwing the trash out.

Yeah, for real.

But, you know, as everybody knows, you know, all the viewers know, Sean's in the band Lansdowne. He's, you know, co co founder, as is Glenn. Right. Glenn, are you initially a co founder? What's the story with that?

It's. It's debatable, depending, but not really. The band was around for like a. I don't know, somewhere between 11 and 14 months. I don't know the exact amount of time. Sean would know better until we met.

Yeah, it was probably about a year and a half into it.

Not. Not more than that. Let's rewind a little bit from both of you on that. Right. So, Glenn, when you first started, you know, playing drums, tell us about that. What inspired you? You know, what age were you to give us all the. The rundown of what made you want to become a rock star?

Oh, man. When I. When I talk about how long I've been playing, I should probably be better at my instrument than I am.

We all feel.

That's how I feel.

We all feel the same way.

I've been drumming for three, 32 years.

No.

Yeah. I started when I was eight. And, you know, it was kind of a combination. My dad loved rock and roll. He kind of was, like, multifaceted. Played guitar, bass, drums, could sing. I did not get any of his singing ability at all, unfortunately. And so one of the things that got me into it, listening to music, was just being able to be in the car with him and watching him kind of air drum, you know, on. On the. On the steering wheel, and I'm like, okay, I can get into this. And then I remember I was. I was eight years old, it was Christmas, and I basically was like, let me ask. You know, it's kind of in that time when you kind of still believed in Santa, but you Knew your parents bought you shit. Oh, sorry, can I say shit? Is that.

Yeah, you can say whatever you want.

I'm gonna get fine.

And I asked him for a drum set. And I got this. And when I was eight, I got this, like, 1990 Tama Rock Star. Like, cherry red Toms that were like 14, 16, 18, that were, you know, this deep. You know, just like a 24 inch kick. And I like. I'm just like. It was like just the coolest thing I ever saw.

That is the coolest, actually.

Oh.

And my dad, come to find out, one of his buddies at the fire department had this thing sitting around and. But long story short, I got that for Christmas and I just started playing. And at that point in time, you know, I was big into, like, the stuff my dad listened to, so. Metallica, Led Zeppelin, the who sticks like it was all over the map, what he would listen to. Right. So, yeah. And so for me, I was like, okay. And I knew I couldn't play guitar and I couldn't sing, so this was my only outlet to be able to play music with all my friends who were learning to play guitar and if I wanted to be in the. In the band. You know, as I got older, I'm like, drums is what it is. And like, so I just kind of fell in love with it at that age. And then that took me through, you know, drumming with my friends and into school, playing in the school band and marching band and just, you know, kind of falling in love with music as I got older.

Nice.

Did you. In the marching band, did you wear one of those cool uniforms?

Oh, man, I am one of those guys that used to be, like, competitive marching. Yeah, I played the Quince, you know, five drums. And I had the hat and I had the outfit. And we would compete in stadiums and big competitions here in New York and New Jersey and so on. And so, yeah, it was its own world where I came from in high school, like, if you were like. Our marching band was 170 people deep. Like, it was massive.

Wow.

Yeah.

That's wild. I didn't realize that. It's funny because you and I have a similar story. When our dad's playing and having the. You know, there was always, like, seeing him play on the. In the car doing all the Rush songs and the who and that's so funny. Is that like. Same with me and Johnny. Yeah, it's so funny. Yeah, it's like kind of one of those things you get early inspiration from, you know, usually your parents. Right?

Yeah. Well. And I Mean, I'm sure you took, like, similar, like. Like your approach. Like, because, I mean, I've known you for as long as I have, and I know your style. Like, I am not a technical drummer where I want to be counting and doing all, like, I am a. It's feel. And I hit really hard. Like, that's it. I hit hard. Like, I know that that's my thing. People come up to me after shows and say, does the drum set owe you money? Like, why are you so angry? Like, it was the theatrics of, like, Keith Moon and John Bonham and, you know, like, it was. The technical stuff was cool, but, like, for me, I just wanted to be on stage. I'm like, they're gonna put me in the back, so I'm just gonna, like, go into my own world and like, anything that I'm feeling, I'm gonna release onto these drums and hopefully it sounds good enough and. But looks cooler that, like, people like, oh, shit, he's. He's better than I thought he was.

That's like a Tommy Leak type of vibe, and I personally love that myself. I love dudes that smash the drums and play 1, 2, 3, 4. I don't care about the in between number.

Literally, someone.

Yeah. Is when Sean said something in his mind. And then I got to figure out how to play it.

Like, yeah, that's what the guitar players turn into drummers. That's what we talk about that all the time. Like, oh, great, here we go. All right, so that's cool. And then. And then eventually, how did you end up meeting up with the rest of the guys now? You know, they were already a band for a year. How did that work out? How did you get there?

Man, MySpace is a hell of a place. You know, listen, we've all kind of been DIY from the beginning of our careers. Even still now, right? Even at this stage in our career, we are incredibly hands on in what we do. And so I was in a band down in Tampa where I went to college, and we booked our first Call it tour with a band I was in called Lives Page, which was like this grunge rock band with my fraternity brother and a couple of friends, and it let us just play. I think we played like, nine shows going. Kind of the play was, I was from Long island, my guitarist was from Massachusetts, from Western Mass. And then our. Our bass player was from Florida, and, you know, one of the guys from North Carolina. So basically we're like, oh, we'll just kind of hit all of these Markets where our friends and family could come see us. And we'll kind of put a tour around that. And so we booked a show at this place called the Crazy Donkey on Long island, which was like, I think it was the.

It was the Village. The Village pub or something. I'm sorry, Amityville.

It was VP South. Yeah, it was VP south, which was like this hole in the wall, like pub. Like maybe it held, you know, I don't know, 200 people on a. On a good day. And on MySpace, somehow I got connected to John and we were talking and I'm like, hey, we need a band. Like, you know, do you want to play? You know, because we were trying to figure out how to pair bands, like to, you know, to find support because we didn't know what the hell we were doing. This is my. No idea how to book a tour. Like, we got in a van, we rented and just drove. And so these guys came down, they played the show with us. At this point in time, we were this grunge rock band. They were basically like Goo Goo Dolls meets like, you know, stuff your mom would listen to on like Kiss fm. And so it was a very unique pairing. And so we played the shows, whatever. And then at that point I'm like, hey, I'm going to throw a party where like I'm 23 years old, 22, 23 years old. Sean's barely legal at this point. I throw a party at my parents house and these guys come back and we threw a rager with like 50 people. The cops wind up coming like, you know, but my dad's a fireman, so they didn't shut the party down. Like they came like, listen, you gotta kind of pretend like it's like two in the morning. Like, hey, quiet up. But at that point we met, we had a. We partied that night. And after that, the tour ended about two weeks later. And I knew that my band was kind of not gonna do much more. It was kind of a side hustle in college and so I was gonna start looking for other opportunities and John and I were kept in touch. And he's like, we need a drummer. And he basically was like, do you want to come play in Lansdowne? And it was either that or I was gonna go to Nashville for this other band. And I talked to my dad and he's like, nah, I like those guys. You should go to Boston, especially if they're gonna kind of change the music up, which I knew they were looking to kind of do. And so literally after we met two weeks later, I moved to Boston and moved into John's house in Wayland and joined Land.

On what level was the band at at that time?

I mean, you know, they were just starting. So, like, you know, I think sonically, even, you know, Sean came from a hardcore. I mean, a hardcore band, screamo band. John was, like, like, classically trained in vocals and sang in chorus. And so, like, as we all came together, what was unique is everyone's background came, and then it kind of. We went through this, what became Lands Down Record to Record, where it was this pop punk thing into this, you know, hey, we're going to kind of go a little more mainstream into we're a rock band, and so we're a hard rock band into, you know, is this evolution? I think that naturally happened once you put all of us together and we started getting older, too. Awesome.

Awesome. That's cool. I don't think I knew, like, all those details, and I've known you guys forever, so that's pretty awesome.

I can't wait till we write our memoirs. It's gonna be great. We'll never talk about any of these stories, but, yeah, yeah, there's a lot

of stuff that isn't making it in there.

Sean, what's your perspective?

Yeah, so tell us.

Meeting Glenn, at least.

Well, I guess let's go even a little further back. Like, what inspired you to play guitar?

Right.

Let's start there.

Like, you know, weirdly enough, like, my first memory of it was, like, seeing that scene in the Mighty Ducks where they're just singing We Are the Champions around. Around the campfire, and I had, like, this, like, toy lacrosse stick that I was watching the movie. I was like, yeah, that's cool. And I would, like, put on, like. I think I put on, like, the Queen. I had, like, recorded it so I could listen to, like, the Queen stuff on, like, a cassette tape. I would, like, jump around on the couch with the lacrosse stick, like, pretending I was playing guitar, until finally my mom was like, all right, let's go get this kid a guitar. We went into the guitar store, and I'm. I'm looking at, like, the Flying V, and I'm like, yeah, that one. And. And she's like, no, this acoustic one, Nylon over here. And I'm like, oh, that thing sucks. I was. I was in, like, group lessons, like, through the school. Like, the guy. There was a music teacher there that taught, like, guitar lessons, and I was in with two other kids that were just, like, week after week. They'd like, learn the stuff. And I sucked so bad. Like, like, how do these kids learn this? I suck. Until I, I, I had a Guitar World magazine and they would put the top, the tabs in the back. It was the best. And I was like, I was like, I was like, I'm learning all these notes. What the heck is this? This is numbers. How do I play this? I don't get it.

It's for dumb dumbs. It shows you where to put your fingers.

Yeah. So I, I brought it in and I was like, hey, like, how do I do this song? And he's like, oh, like, you know, that's blah, blah, blah. And as soon as he taught me that, I was like, going, getting all the Guitar World books and learning all the little, like, songs I wanted to learn. Not Hot Cross Buns on my acoustic, I was learning, you know, like, corn songs and blink 182 songs. And then like, learning, like, Randy Rhodes solos and Steve Ray Vaughan tracks. And then that's what really, like, started, you know, where I really started getting into guitar. When I was able to play stuff that I wanted to learn versus, by

the way, those magazines. I would do the exact same thing, same, same situation. It was, it was good. Good thing.

Yeah.

Absolutely. Yeah. So, like, that, it took, it took that because I was like this acoustic. And these ants go marching one by one, like, what is this? This is not what. This is not what I saw.

I can't jump around on my, on my.

Yeah, this sucks. So. But yeah, once I, I got into that realm, then it was like, okay, this is, you know, this is what I wanted to learn.

Well, yeah, you have a pretty cool story too, about how you got your first, like, real guitar, right? Like your first badass guitar.

Well. Well, yeah, well, that was, you know, down the line, you know, I had, I had, you know, like an Ibanez and like a Strat. And then, you know, my cousin Damien comes from the entertainment world and he, you know, he's a film director out in la, but he came up, like, shooting music videos for, like, Queen Latifah, Eric Clapton and Sting. Like, all these people. He was like the go to, like, video director in New York at one point. And, like, so he was musical too. And he's like, I remember he came into, you know, he was going through with, you know, I don't know how much details I could get into it, but he was going through a thing with one of his films and he needed to burn some cash. He came to my work. I was working at Jordan's furniture at the time, handing out cookies to everybody that came in. Hey, hey. You taking a break? We're going to Guitar center across the street. And he goes, all right, here's the deal. See those guitars? Those are all, like, you know, like. Like 500 bucks. You could have four of those. Or you see these guitars over here? These are all, like, a thousand bucks. You could have. You could have, like, two of those, or you pick any guitar in the store, and you could have, you know, one really nice one. He said, let me put it to you like this. I could have four cars, but I drive one really badass car, but it's up to you. And so he's. He has the guy. I'm like, no, let's get one badass guitar. And he has a guy. This guy's, like, bringing me, like, the PRSs and all this stuff. And then I'm looking up and I see that white and gold Gibson custom. And I'm like, yeah, I think I want to play that one.

Yeah, you do.

And, yeah, he brought it down. I strummed it once. I was like, yep, that's the one.

Nice.

And.

And then I, you know, thanks to Davion, I walked out of that store with that guitar. And that guitar went on. Went on many journeys. Oh, yeah, it's still on a journey. I'm looking at it right now. Yeah, it does. It doesn't go on journeys anymore.

Now it just writes it.

Yeah.

Well, let's jump into that. What was the first time you guys wrote a song where you like, oh, wait a min.

We.

We can write a hit or, you know, and. And, you know, I'm talking about the beginning when your song probably sucked, but in your mind, you're like, whoa, you know.

Yeah.

You know,

the, like, the first song we wrote. So, like, John had songs that we kind of recut when I, you know, it was like the John Richie project. And then when I came to the band, I'm like, yeah, I'm not joining the John Richie project, dude. Like, I'll join. I'll join if we become a band. And he's like, yeah, no, definitely. That's, like, what I want to do. I'm like, okay. So we kind of, like, rebanded some of his, like, solo stuff, and then we wrote this song called Defy the Universe that was, you know, not a. Not a hit at all. But we thought it was the coolest thing we, like, any of us had ever done at the time. It was like, literally had, like, a minute and a half Intro before the verse even kicks in. Right?

Of course it did. Yeah.

And I remember we went to. We were going to. You know, as most bands in this area do, we. We are. Our first record, we were going to do with John Wyman and he. We. I remember playing it and he. And he's like, yeah, we're not tracking that one. And we're like, hold on. We must not have played it well enough. Let's. Let's play it for you again until you say we can do it.

That's hilarious. But he put the. He put the brakes on that one.

No, no, but we. We said. No, we're still doing it. It's a cool song, though. But no, but, you know, from there. Yeah, we. We found our way into the, you know, into the first chorus, verse, chorus, bridge, chorus, out situation.

Which album was this that you got? So as. As a band now with Glenn.

This was before me. This was. That was before the record they did before.

What's the name of that record that

was called Leaving Boston.

Leaving Boston.

Leaving Boston. Then what was the one after that?

That's where your blood came in. That was called Burdens for your Friends.

Yeah. All right. So, yeah, I remember that one too. Yeah. And that was. And that was still kind of like.

That's awesome.

You guys had a similar sound to, like, it was almost like, what's their name? Out of Andover, Mass. Like, it was kind of stuff.

It was like a boys. Like girls, kind of girls, quite pop punk, but, like, towards that end, very like pop rock.

And then when was the pivotal moment for you guys to be like, okay, we're gonna be like, active hard rock. Like, when. And I know it was like, shortly after that, but, like, what. What was like, that conversation? Like, what was like, who made that call? Where did you. How did that. Like, what inspired that within, internally, you guys?

Well, I think it was. It was just like the.

The.

The movement of the. The. The times. Like, you know, when we were doing that pop roc, you know, like, Dashboard Confessional was all over the radio. You know who else. Panic at the Disco. Like, everything was that we were working with. Like, probably the best culmination of that we did was when we went in with ZK and we had that ep, which never even, like, went, weirdly enough, never even went out as a thing. Yeah, we never even released it.

Sessions.

Yeah. And then I think it was, you know, really after that that we started kind of bridging into that direction because that's where radio was heading, you know, that was kind of crossing Back into that. Like, you know, that's when. That's when Daughtry started coming over with the crossovers and Nickelback was. Was at large and. And it was like, you know, we. We had no, you know, misguided notions of what we wanted to be. We wanted to be a radio rock band. And so if that's where radio rock was going, that's what we were doing, you know?

Yeah, yeah, we. I remember we met you guys, like, right before that transition, right? Like, you guys are still like, promoting Burn the Sphere, Friends. And then I think it was a Blue Collar Revolver. Is that the. Was that the first rock.

Yeah, yeah.

So it was the first rock one that, like the full rock record, but it was A Day in the Life.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Because I think that was the release that you guys put out in the. In the CD release party was at Harpers Ferry.

Right.

It's like. Right. Was it that year?

Yeah.

We were playing that show with you guys.

Yeah, yeah. We were burning the CDs in the dressing room that.

The green room. I'm like, guys, we gotta get these out. I was like. It was trying to. I was trying to bring people into the green room to help. I was like, this guy's got a lot. This guy's got to see.

He's got a laptop.

Let's go. I remember that. That was hilarious. Forgot about that. That's so funny. Yeah. So you guys, like, there was. You guys have had quite a few transitions. And then, you know, I feel like during all this, like, just like every other band that's been around for so long, like, you know, you guys have hit some challenges and obstacles, like some major ones. Right. It's like, goes with the territory. It's like the universe tests you to see if you really want to be here. So kind of tell us about some of those. Like, you know, what's. What's 101? Like, immediately, what comes to your. Your mind when I ask?

The. The immediate one that comes to mind is we had this management team that, you know, they had some ties into the. The military. And they were like, guys, we have this whole plan, like, we're gonna, you know, and we've always been supporters of our troops and everything, so it wasn't like a stretch for us. And, you know, military guys and girls like rock music. So it was a. They were going to align us with the military. The military was going to come in with this money and act, and we were gonna co brand with them. And it was going to be this whole thing. We went and we did a two week tour during wartime in Afghanistan, Kyrgyzstan and Kuwait. We came back and we did like, a whole series of, like, we played at Camp Lejeune. We played on the USS Kearsarge for Fleet Week for the Navy. Like, we did all this stuff. And they called us for the submarine.

Yeah.

And they called us and they're like, all right, guys, the deals. The go celebrate. The deal is done. Like, tomorrow we get to work. So we went out, we bought a bunch of drinks, we got messed up, we celebrated, and we, like, talk to

them in the morning.

They're like, well, it's not like, done. It's not like, done done.

I'm done.

Like, what do you mean? You said, go celebrate. You said the deal is done. Like, yeah, there's just a couple of things left to do. And then that whole thing exploded.

You thought you get some of that USAID money.

Yeah.

Right?

Yeah. Elon would have been cutting us from the budget right now if we got it.

Oh, that's funny

mentioned.

You guys did get paid.

Yeah.

So what was the downside, though? I mean, obviously the deal didn't happen, but what did you kind of lose out on?

I mean, just everything that our. Our whole plan at that point, like, it was. We had a pretty good idea of what was happening next. And at that point, you know, the only way you can operate, you know, is by, you know, the money that. The only money you have is if you're playing shows. And that's like, you know, pennies at that point. Right. Or all of us are working jobs and whatever we had, we put in so, you know, for what we could do. We were trying to create opportunities. And when that kind of stopped and, like, went away, we're like, well, now it just.

It just disheartens you, like when you feel like you've gotten to that point and someone says it's done, and then it's not like, yeah, like, it's a motivational killer. Yeah, the energy just leaves you, you know, and then there was a whole, you know, another thing with a. Another woman who, who we, you know, don't have to go into detail with. That came in and kind of like created like a, you know, a weird, like, divide between us. Like, she was, like, controlling us by, like, like making us all feel like the king in silos. Like, yeah, I'm on your side. No, I'm on your side. I feel like, like, like, like really, you know, really manipulating and controlling the. The situation and all of us like, going along with it because she was, like, momming us and, like, buying us

things and, like, literally was like the band Sugar Mama. I mean, that's the best way to put it.

I mean, you know, did bring in some great opportunities. I feel like naming those opportunities would reveal, You know, no bad blood, obviously, but it was, you know, a thing that blew up at one point and, you know, whatever. She. She has a different way of thinking of it and is mad at us. I think it's all under the bridge. But, you know, but again, like, that was a whole. A whole thing that culminated in like. Like, Glenn, me, and John sitting in, like, a conference room at a hotel, like, ready to drop the articles of dissolution in skinny jeans and a tie,

Sitting on that conference call, just being like. And this person on the phone trying to. To lead it while the three of us who've been fed three different narratives and already in the middle of, like, the middle of the us somewhere. I forget where we were. I want to say we're in, like, Nebraska. It was, like, somewhere ridiculous. And she's trying to have this conversation. And I don't know. Needless to say, we're still a band, so, you know, it didn't completely, you know, but you're not really a band if members in the band don't quit at least a handful of times throughout the journey of being a band. Like, were you ever really a band if you didn't quit your band at some point? Like,

yeah, it's like the most. Like, the most dysfunctional family possible that absolutely loves each other, but also absolutely hates each other at the same time. But there's always got to be a little bit more love there in order to keep it together.

If you. If you've never hated someone in your band, you have a hobby, not a band.

For real. 100. Well, you know, that. That's, you know, with all these things, too, like, all these challenges and obstacles, like what. You know, where was the turning point for you guys, where everything's starting to kind of move right, and started heading into a. A direction where. All right, this is. This is positive now. And now where you guys are currently on the trajectory now?

Well, I think it's for us, you know, and Sean, you can. You can add to this, but Sean and I were doing work with another band at this point in terms of doing some, like, writing, recording for a young band out of Jersey. And, you know, there were one of the members of the band. We became close with all the different parents, but one set of parents in Particular became, you know, dear friends of ours. And, you know, at a time in which we were looking to make this next jump, we needed funding. So, you know, we went out and we raised money with the help of them and with the help of them that allowed us to essentially make Blue Collar, you know, and that's when we kind of came into that next level of a band. By raising this money, we were able to make the record and we were able to then find our next set of managers with G and G, with George and George, who were managing Pop Evil at the time. And that kind of was like the next stepping stone for us of being able to grow as a band. You know, that was our. I think that was our big jump. When we raised that money, it became the. Okay, we have a sound at least that we were really into. We had management who, you know, knew what they were doing. They had a band that they were. They've been developing. That got us on tour, which, like, on. On, like, not on, you know, the tours that we would all book as a group. You know what I mean, where we'd go, call venues, like, but, you know, got us a booking agent. That was the turn, I think, for us, the turning point. And when this became, hey, we kind of want to do music, we've had these ups and downs, so. Oh, wow. We got a real shot to, like, build something as a band.

Yeah, you know, I started. And that's when you guys started getting, you know, you went out on tour with, like, Puddle of Mud. I believe it was like Saving Abel. Like, that was kind of these. In Pop Evil, right? These. Where these opportunities started to come from.

Yeah, yeah.

You know, and it all. All stemmed from, you know, like, it did stem from getting that record done. And I think. I think what Jake Livingston was looking at, what was the early iteration of Star Set was Downplay.

Yeah, Downplay. Yeah.

And Paul showed it to Jake. Jake showed it was like, yo, I love this. I have the guys that I would bring in as partners on this where I don't know what.

Jake, skip that. Yeah, yeah, I went one pass.

Yeah. Where it was us and the Georges. And Yeah. You know, really, really them taking it. Like, I. I do credit, you know, it's. It's. It started with having the songs that even got them interested and definitely credit to them of. Of, you know, picking it up, sticking us out with Pop Evil and because, like, the. The music aligned so well, you know, going out on that tour with them was really like a turning point on. On fan growth that I Think has lasted to this day because, you know, when you get something that aligns so well, like, you know, at. At that point, if you were a fan of pop Evil's music, you would definitely be a fan of Land sounds music. It was, you know, right. And right in the same pool there.

Yeah.

And then, you know, that. And they were radio guys, so they were able to get, you know, jump us into radio. That led to the. Yeah, that led to the puddle. The puddle of mud stuff that we were, you know, saving April Blackstone, Cherry King.

Yeah.

So where was the money coming from at that point?

It was basically from the. What we did to raise funds. You know, we basically raised them. Yeah, we raised that money to kind of give the band some Runway. And then we started to be able to. Now we were starting to see money come in, right. Because when radio picked up, we'd start seeing the, you know, checks, essentially. We were starting to see royalties which we never really under, you know, never saw before that. So it became, you know, and that. That's when, you know, that then took us to other producers. Right Then we got to work with, you know, Johnny K. We got to work with David Bendith. We got to, you know, like, that was a cool kind of next experience when he had to create these songs. But again, that costs money. So everything was more and more expensive. And at some point the money starts to dwindle versus the opportunity. And without a traditional label, you're still on your own. And that's when it was kind of like, hey, do we start shopping for a label? You know what I mean? And at that point in time, things happen within the band. And kind of at the tail end of that, I think. I think Jack was born, like, literally at the tail end of that. John's, you know, his first son. And that's when it was like, hey, you know, we have, you know, now we're. We're men, right? We're becoming fathers, we're becoming husbands, we're becoming, you know, so it was like, okay, we may need to, like, reevaluate what we're doing here temporarily and, you know, can we. What do we do next? And that kind of, you know, in for all of us, you know, put us in a position to keep releasing music. But we took some time off from the road and try to figure out exactly what we wanted to do next. And. And for. About. What was it? I would say three years, maybe four years.

Sean.

We kind of at this, you know, we just kind of just put songs out like we were Just kind of putting music out, you know, when we could to try to, you know, feel like we were still doing it. And then, you know, I'm kind of like, you know, shrinking the timeline a little bit, but, like, over that time, kind of releasing, releasing. And then one day, Sean reads an email and, you know, taking it kind of now backtracking the last, you know, three and a half years or so. And we get an email from a record label out of Germany that's like, hey, we're really into you guys. Would you be interested in having a conversation? I remember him calling me, and I'm like, we used to get all those random emails, like, this is some bullshit. What's his name? Like, he's from where, you know? And then we wind up getting on a call, and he's like. And he talks to us. Sean and I finished the call, and I'm like, sean, what if we just, like, ask for the. The world and see what he says? And Sean came up with a bunch of ideas. We kind of put it on paper. We said, hey, what about this? And I remember getting Sean and I saying, I think they're agreeing to everything we're asking for.

To me, that's the beginning of you guys with the golden spoon in your ass. Like, everything you. You guys don't necessarily, in my opinion, you don't work hard like other bands that are out there sweating and slaving. You guys do, like, mental moves that are smart. And it just seems like since that time, things just are working for you.

Well, we. Well, yeah, maybe not. That's my.

That's my impression. I know it's not true.

Well, a lot of that hard work was put in at the beginning, Right?

Sure. Decade of the band,

and it built

that fan base that literally is still there. You could see it through the streaming numbers. You could see it through, obviously on YouTube, like, for years, while you guys are still dormant, that thing just kept growing. And I remember, like, looking at Sean

like, this is insane.

Like, I don't understand, like, how is this happening? And we were like, you know, obviously there was some great stuff that happened on. You know, with the video game world, like, really taking, like, a liking on YouTube to you guys and using that stuff. And that stuff helped blow things up. All the foundational stuff you guys did from touring and all that. You guys kept those fans, kept that. And it was great to, like, see, like, during this, like, hiatus, it just kept growing, and it was like, kind of like one of those things. Like, holy shit, you know, how is this Happening.

And I think one shot happened. No, no, that was before, but it just stayed in. And, you know, I think honestly, if there was. If there was not a Spotify that came out, we would have probably let it go. Because without something that, like, shows you that that fan base is there and that they're listening to the music and showing you how much it's being listened to, we wouldn't have known and we would have just been. You know what I mean? Like, how could you know? And without something feeding that and showing it to other people, like, we would have definitely not been a band. If not, I. I will say that if not for Spotify, we would probably not be a band anymore.

I mean, you're sitting here saying we're doing nothing, and somehow there's people streaming millions of, like, millions of streams happening. And, you know, we're like, how? How do they. And. But then, like, it's like again, like, like what we just went on, right? We ship rocked and we'll get to that after. But like, how many people came up to us? Like, I've been listening to you guys for 15 years. Like, I. When I was. I listened to your Blue Collar Revolver. Revolver was a record for me that changed my life. And we're like, what, like, how, like, it happened to us when we went to the UK for the first time. People were like, it's such an interesting, you know, perspective. Because we're like, there's no one really cares. Because, like, you're like, you're this. This band that exists, but when you take it into Spotify and you're like. And you look at the cities that this music streaming around the world, and you're like, yeah.

And even, even with like MySpace, where you could see the streams, like, you didn't have that data set.

Yeah. That you had no idea where it was coming from.

You had no idea.

Yeah, it's amazing. It's amazing to see. And then how you guys have now, like, obviously taken that. That deal that you guys got with AFM and now have like, sprung board yourself into Europe and now you are building out the European market. Right. You guys, you know, went out on a major tour with ice 9 kills, and from there you like, parlayed into a few other tours and you guys recently just did your first headline. You know, kind of talk a little bit about that.

Yeah, no, I mean, this is where I think everything comes back to. This industry is built around relationships and opportunities. Right. Like, we had a relationship that stemmed to an opportunity through some friends of ours and we got to do that Ice nine run. And that was our first real experience to like, you know, it's interesting. You know, we did the touring thing in the States and we had some great shows, but all of a sudden you, you know, again, it took. I kind of, for me, mentally took me back to those days of being 25, because now, you know, when you would tour around the U.S. you knew what it was like to be in Albuquerque or what it was like to be in Springfield, Illinois. Like, you've been to those places now, you know, is that the shock of we're just going to get. We again lands down just again our mindset. We'll just figure it out. You know, we had a label, which sounds helpful, but at the same time, we brought a tour manager with us that never managed a tour, but, like, we just really liked him and we knew he was good at, like, he was good at organizing and he was good at this. It was like, we're just going to figure it out. So we literally found a van, planned it, and then supported Ice 9 and, you know, playing the, you know, 1500, 2000 people a night, you know, all over Europe. And, like, that was our first European tour, like, you know, a little spoiled to say that was our first one, you know, like, but, you know, with that came a lot of, again, life lessons and learning as to, you know, what's really possible. And, you know, after that, we decided, oh, we want to do it again. And then one of our label mates who went out with Thunder Mother, and they're like, oh, we're gonna do it again. And then we went out, you know, so, you know, four European tours in two years. I mean, most bands don't go to Europe once every, you know, five years at our stage. So it was like, you know, the now where we are. And we've seen that on the streaming side, right? We've seen the growth in Germany, the UK and other markets where, like, people, you know, now we can actually say people all around the world are streaming our music. And the. The stuff we're doing in Europe, even with what's coming next, has been a big focal point for us. But I think, you know, what that did is create this. This new fire within, at least for me. And I can't speak for you, Sean, but, like, now I'm like, you do those tours. You do, like, Shiprock. You're like, I was meant to play music on a stage. You know, like, you realize that. That we have to take advantage of these opportunities. And, like, we're Lucky. Like, we are incredibly lucky that these still exist for us.

Awesome. Yeah, you guys have been, you know, it's been a, it's been a journey to get here. It's been. And it's amazing to see and be involved at some level. Obviously just being as a fellow, you know, touring band member with you guys for years and then obviously working on, you know, you know, some of the records with you guys, but then also just being, you know, just seeing it all. It's just been so great to see the trajectory. Right. It's like unbelievable to see how, you know, you guys come from like, you know, little Boston band that started out regionally, started out, then going national and now. Or take a hiatus and now you guys are crushing it in Europe and now your second biggest market is Germany. It's like, yeah. Holy. You know, and, and so like now for you guys, what's the next move? I guess to kind of. Obviously, I know we're running out of time here, but so like, what's the next move to kind of really get us to the wrap up?

Yeah, I think it's just, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna keep putting out music, we're gonna keep building out those markets that we've. We've started to, to, you know, eye in on. Definitely we're going to start doing some more stuff in the States where people are. People have been a little mad at us. They're like, yeah, it'd be cool. Another European tour. Be great if you would just come. Be great if you would come to Ohio.

Right?

So definitely some stuff, some love for this stateside. There's a couple opportunities on the table in, in Europe for this end of the summer that hopefully come through. But yeah, I think it's just, it's just a lot of the same. But like the, the main thing is being focused on, you know, consistently releasing music and consistently creating, you know, putting a focus on doing what we tell every other band to do, you know, because we often find ourselves, you know, being like the mechanic with the, with the car with no wheels in his front yard, but everybody else's cars are running just fine. So like we, you know, I think the big thing for us is making sure that we're, you know, supporting each release with as, as much content as possible designed to, you know, create social and growth around fan growth, be utilizing the tools that are at our disposal with Fan Flowy, especially, uh, to, to, to assist in that growth and to continue building these markets to be able to, to, you know, our Our goal is to be a headlining act to. And take other people out. Like, like I sign and. And. And Red helped us. We want to now foster that into the younger generation as well, to get into a position to be able to do that now.

You know, one thing that I'd like to get from you guys is if you could give, you know, one piece of advice each to an independent artist out there right now, what would it be? I'll go. I'll ask Glenn first. Glenn, what's that one piece of advice you'd give them?

I think, for the one piece of advice now would be to within today's market, focus on your digital footprint. You know, honing your craft and your music is incredibly important, but with the tools that exist today that didn't really exist in the same capacity when we were all coming up, like, focus on building your fan base online and realize that you can do almost anything on your own without a manager, without, you know, an agent. Like, trust yourself and trust that your. Your fans, if you grow and really cultivate that base, they will help you grow and. And into building a career and making money in music.

Awesome. Sean, what about you?

I would say the biggest piece of advice is go to fanflowy.com and book a consult. But, but I mean, I mean, honestly, the. The tools that we've created are. Are what you can base your growth around. So that's not a bad piece of advice. But additionally, I would say it's okay to grow at the right pace. You don't need a million streams and a million views on your video. The first time you release something. People want to see you grow as an artist. So just because X, Y and Z have 50,000 followers doesn't mean you need to have that. Like, you're on your own journey. Don't worry about how else anybody is getting there. Focus on how you're gonna get there. And, and, you know, don't. Don't stray from that path just because you see, oh, well, this person did this. So I need to do that because I need to get there. You're on your own journey, and it's okay for it to take however long it takes and whatever it takes to get there.

Awesome. Very true, guys. It was awesome. You know, getting the rundown, the full land sound story, some of the stuff I didn't actually know, which is cool, and I'm sure our viewers are gonna love it. And thank you guys for both being on here. Sean, thanks for doubling as a host guest today. And yeah, if anybody is interested in lands down. You know, make sure to go check them out. They're on Instagram, they're on Facebook, they're on YouTube, they're at Spotify, Apple Music. Everywhere you could stream, they're there. What's the website right now? What's the domain?

Landsdown music.com.

awesome. Go check them out.

S D O W N E and

if anybody of our friends from shiprocked are watching this, especially the Askor entertainment team, we really all. We hope to be back next year. Bring us back next year. The whole team wants to come out. Awesome. Thank you guys so much and have the awesome rest of your day.

Thanks.

Later.