Get Your Body and Mind Healthy with Gratitude: How Women Create Lasting Fortitude

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Welcome to Women to Women and my podcast with Marcel. Pick everything. Hormones, weight loss, and adrenals. So today I've got a special guest and we're going to be talking a little bit about gratitude. So let me tell you a little bit about her. She's so interesting because she's really talking about the notion of how does gratitude really change our lives. Her name is Holly Bertrand, and she's a breast cancer survivor Shimoto's Warrior, and number one Amazon bestselling author and host of Grateful Warrior podcast, which I love. I love that name. Holly patron. Holly spent 25 years rising through the ranks of consulting and federal government services before her failing health shattered her corporate dreams. Since then, she's learned leaned into her path of true purpose and fulfillment as a gratitude and mindset coach by helping women view their cancer or autoimmune diagnosis as a gift so that they can unwrap their resilience to build fortitude with gratitude. So I think this will be a very, very exciting time that we can really dig into a little bit more about gratitude.

So, Holly, thank you so much for being here today to teach us a little bit more about gratitude. And let's kind of start off. I'd love to hear a little bit more about how you ever got interested in this. I mean, gratitude is kind of everywhere. And we talk about it. I talk about it a lot on my newsletters and I also talk about it in general. You know that it's something wonderful to start the day off with. So how did you in particular get interested? Gratitude.

Oh, thanks so much, Marcel, for having me on the show. I really, I really appreciate it. And yeah, you know, it's funny. People talk about, like, gratitude's kind of like the word water. Like, we hear it all of the time and are like, yeah, like, I say thank you or I make a list of three things and I really want to just kind of say, that's great, that's awesome. But I want to leave your listeners with a whole different perspective on gratitude by the end of this episode in a way that they've never thought about before. So. So I'm excited to share.

But really, it all began my 39th birthday. I was diagnosed with breast cancer, and it was er, PR positive, HER2 negative, if anyone's listening and interested. And I went through the traditional surgery, chemo, and radiation. Now, before cancer treatment, I was an Xterra triathlete and I was the chief of staff of one of those three letter federal, three letter federal government agencies. They make TV shows About traveling everywhere, drinking margaritas with my girlfriend, living, living what I thought was like the perfect life. And after that diagnosis and especially being diagnosed on my birthday, I use humor as a coping mechanism. So I kept saying, you know, oh, some girls get flowers and some girls get earrings. My gift was breast cancer. Like, you know, as joking, sarcastic, trying to find humor in a very traumatic situation. And I think I said it too many times because I actually started to believe that breast cancer was my gift. And that's kind of where it all started. Growing up. My mother would always say, it builds fortitude. It builds fortitude. She was diagnosed with Addison's when she was pregnant with me, and she, she just had a lot of bouts of good health, a lot of bouts of bad health. And she always kept a positive attitude and she always said, it builds fortitude. And I thought that that just kind of meant going through the tough times in life. So, you know, I have this cancer diagnosis and I'm like, it builds fortitude. I'm thinking, I'm going to be strong. And it wasn't until years later I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's thyroiditis a year after breast cancer treatment and dealt with chronic fatigue and migraines and ibs and all the fun symptoms. And it wasn't until years later that I really just kind of started into a gratitude practice. I had gone gluten free and worked on my nutrition and removed toxins, and it moved the needle a little bit, but it didn't move the needle a lot. And when I started really kind of diving into the scary things like emotions and trauma and all of that, and really unpacking that, realizing there's a level of gratitude in there. And that's when I started the research and the science and all of the things. And when I really started digging into gratitude, number one, from kind of that scientist mindset and really understanding the research behind it, and then number two, for my own personal practice and what was working and what wasn't. And then number three, when I introduced it to my community and I realized that it's not just, it builds fortitude from, you know, the top, going through the tough times in life, that it's actually gratitude that builds fortitude. It's that mindset of not just being grateful for the good things in life, and it's not just a mindset even of being grateful for the bad things in life. Right. It's just going from that place of gratitude being something that you do, gratitude being that list of three things, or saying thank you to it actually becoming who you are 24 7, and knowing that it's not just about being grateful for the good things. It's not even just about trying to find the positive and the bad things in life, but it's about having that gratitude and, and that fortitude that, you know, tomorrow is going to bring something. We don't know what it is. And it's okay whatever it brings, because you've got gratitude and you've got fortitude, and you're good to go with a positive mindset and mental strength. And that's kind of where it all began.

So it's interesting, Tony Robbins, I just did an event with him, and one of the things he talks about a lot that I really share with my. My participants in the programs that I do, as well as patients that I see in my practice is how is life doing this for me instead of. To me, it's the same idea. And also, if you look at the work of Joe Dispenza, I mean, that's his whole premise, is that, okay, we are where we are. How do we shift that dynamic? And I think what I love about what you're talking about is one of the things we don't talk about a lot is the trauma of our lives and how that impacts us physiologically. That's been something that has been something I've talked about since I went online in 2001 and was one of the first online to talk about our stories do impact our biochemistry. Let's take that a little bit further. How do you think that that made a difference for you and what are you seeing in people that you work with that this concept changes?

Yeah, absolutely. And I actually want to reference one of your previous episodes, actually from a few years ago when you interviewed Dr. Medea said, and she actually goes into a really good background on stress and inflammation and how it impacts the body and, you know, kind of how gratitude can reverse that. So, you know, I encourage you, after you listen to this episode, your listeners, to go back and Dr. Medea seed is literally one of my favorite people on the planet. She is just such an amazing human being. But really it is from that place of, you know, kind of in 90 seconds or less that, you know, stress and inflammation creates that disease state, whether that's environmental stress or food or trauma or mold or anything, and creating that inflammation, creating that disease state and that disease state, typically then we're making poor decisions. Right where our amygdala has been hijacked. We're making poor decisions, Poor decisions. And then we do things like eat a pint of ice cream and binge watch Netflix and then we're on the couch and then we gain a few pounds and then we feel tired and then we don't get up and move. And then it's just this cycle that repeats itself. And, you know, I really look at gratitude as that pattern interrupt that can break that cycle and start reversing it from all aspects of our lives. Like, we all know, we all know, like, okay, we should probably eat better, right? We should probably eat some more fruits and vegetables. You know, we should probably move a little more, sleep a little better, drink some more water. Like, we all kind of know the basics, right? So why aren't we doing it? And that's where gratitude really comes in. From that perspective of looking at it from all of the different life arenas and how, you know, it's. It's not just one aspect, right? And again, not gratitude being. It's not just something you do, it's not just a list of three things, but really becoming who you are. And when you're in that state of gratitude and you're looking at your food choices, the food choices somehow get a little better when you're looking at a state of gratitude and how your body actually works and runs and functions. And then you have this choice of what should I eat or should I get out and do my movement activity today? Or oh, it's raining, I don't feel like going outside, right? Or it's cold outside, it's winter, I don't feel like getting in the car, going to the gym, whatever that is, right? We start making decisions that are better for our health. And gratitude also helps to reverse or to reduce that inflammation, to reduce that state of stress, to reduce the sympathetic nervous system and turn on the parasympathetic nervous system and put us in a state of rest and digest, really helping to reverse that entire cycle of disease state into a cycle of good health. And that's really where I see gratitude fitting into, you know, the big picture of our health.

So it's really taking time to acknowledge the things that are also working. And even if there is a situation that comes up that's problematic is looking at, okay, so it's not happening to me. It's happening as perhaps a wake up call on many different levels. Now, that's not to say that, you know, breast cancer is something that people want to have in their lives because they don't, or any other diagnosis like that, or any kind of cancer for that matter, but there Is my experience has been over the years, because I started a practice in 1985, a very long time ago. And we really talked with our patients because we had a lot of cancer patients coming to us at the time about, okay, yes, we need to change the diet. Yes, you may need chemo or radiation or whatever, but how on top of that, can you shift that mindset?

Right?

And that, I think is crucially important because it really makes a huge, huge difference. I think the work of Joe Dispenza, because I'm really kind of looking at that now. He's got the data to show it makes a difference. And that's what I. I'm a geek.

I like to see the data.

You know, did it make a difference? Did we change, you know, some of the lab work? Did we change some of the cancer markers? Did we change those things? And indeed, we are starting to see that. So that's incredibly hopeful for people to know that, you know, along with the conventional pieces, we can do some other things that make a difference. And gratitude's a piece of that, Puz.

Absolutely. And, you know, and the other thing, too, that I see is that, you know, so many of us, when we are faced with, you know, any kind of health challenge, that, you know, we start viewing our bodies differently. You know, if you're going through breast cancer, maybe you've had surgery, or in menopause. Or in menopause in general. Right. Or, you know, whatever, you know, maybe hair sting a little bit or, you know, whatever the, you know, disease is causing kind of those. Those outward symptoms in. In your body, we start looking at our bodies a little differently. And even just aging in general as our bodies change.

When we start looking at our bodies from a place of betrayal, or my body's fighting against itself, or I hate my body for what it did to me, our cells are listening.

Our cells listen to every single word, every single thought, every single emotion, in addition to the food and the water and the sleep and the movement and everything like that. And so what if we started to look at how we partner with a disease that we may have been diagnosed with, or partner as we're aging and things are changing, or partner with our health in general a little bit differently and partner with a state of gratitude versus all of the negative self talk? Yeah, I'm a big Joe Dispenza geek as well. No, it. Absolutely. I mean, it changes the chemistry of our body.

I think that's so important that we bring that up, because I actually wrote an article on a patient of Mine who went to Joe Dispenza and went in a wheelchair and actually left walking and actually hiked two weeks afterwards. And she had metastatic breast cancer, actually. And I've got an article on my website, marcelpig.com really telling her story so I, you know, I can share the details. And that makes a difference. I mean, it really, really makes a difference to change our, to change our mindset. But one of the things I think that's so hard for people when they're in the middle of it. It's so hard to do.

Right, right.

So hard to do. So it's just knowing that there are avenues now, like you said, and also reminding oneself that, you know, we, we, we do have things in life that are amazing. We do have. Even if you can't think of anything, it's you. I've got a roof over my head I put on the table. I can breathe as, you know, take baby steps until you get there because sometimes it's not an easy journey.

Yeah.

I was to say one of my, one of my clients went from basically not leaving her apartment and she lived in a walk up, so she actually had stairs to get out of her house and not leaving because she didn't have the energy to go out for a walk, let alone up and down the stairs, to taking short walks every single day. And in less than 30 days. I mean, it was a short period of time and just so beautiful to see the power of, you know, you hear so often it's all in your head and you know, and it's kind of dismissed. But I'm like, well, it actually kind of is, but in a different way. It's how it's, it's how we talk to ourselves, it's how we view ourselves, it's how we think about ourselves. And again, it all starts with gratitude. Can I get into kind of the, the why the three way. The three list of three things doesn't love to.

Yeah.

Is that. Because I think that's really important is that when people hear gratitude, you know, they think, oh, I'm, I'm grateful. I say a list of three things or make a list of three things or you know, I'm thankful or I feel, you know, I say, oh, I'm grateful for something. But there's a difference between gratitude being just a, a check the box activity. Gratitude being something that you do versus who you are and who you become. And I think so often in this day and age where it's just go, go, go. Right. And you know, it's like, check the box, check the box, check the box. And we just live in that society of, you know, throwing something in the microwave and 30 seconds later it's done. That's not gratitude. Gratitude is, is going to take time. It's not an on, off switch, you know, like with meditation, kind of the same way to just quiet your mind, you know, it's, it's not like you're going to feel good in the moment, right? Your, your, your chemistry does change in the moment, but it does take time to really build that practice. Just like going to the gym, doing a push up and then expecting to have beautiful arms or you know, expecting your trainer to do the push up for you and then you have beautiful arms. Right? It's kind of the same concept and you know, kind of the same concept with meditation too. If you want to think of your mental exercises that it's something to practice on a daily basis. And like I said, just really feel, really feel the gratitude instead of just making the list, just feel it and be in it a hundred percent. And you know, and, and with my clients I, I start with, you know, obviously the, the good things. It's easy to start with the good things, you know, and then we transfer into, okay, some of the negative stuff and you know, some of the lessons that we can learn. But I think that's one of the biggest challenges is so many people, when they join my community, they're like, well, I'm already grateful or gratitude's not really for me and to just really think of it differently. And I always like to say, I like to flip gratitude upside down because it's just like I said, it's like the word water, right? We all think of water and water and water and it just is water. And if you think of gratitude in that way, it's just going to be water. But when you flip it upside down, when you actually realize the power that it has, I mean the power to literally change your life from the inside out, then you start to have a little more respect for it.

I think other people would call it, call it different names, but it's the whole notion of how do we change our neural pathways, how do we change the way we respond, how do we really start to be aware of our instant emotions? I do several groups and one of the groups, I asked the women, you know, to just count in an hour how many self deprecating comments they made to themselves. And some of them were 20, 40, this is just one hour. And it's all of that, that we can actually change because that does change our biochemistry, which increases cortisol. And cortisol is an inflammatory hormone. If we have too much, but we have to have some. But that then triggers many of the adrenal issues that so many people now talk. So it's incredibly important. But it takes practice. We can't just do it just like that. It just takes, oh wow, listen to what I just said to myself or how do I kind of take this from a different perspective and not have that automatic response? So I love that kind of work and it's fortunately now it's something a lot of people talk about but perhaps need more practice with.

Yeah. And actually I have a funny story. If we have time to share it really kind of drives it home. I was knee deep in my gratitude practice and I was always back in the day, not anymore, but back in the day, very reactional reaction to poor customer service or rude people or things like that. I would always react. And.

Not things I'm proud of, right. Things coming out of my mouth, like my brain would just hijack my mouth and say things that I wasn't proud of and obviously no longer that person. But that was something that I was really kind of struggling with and dealing with. And you know, I was kind of like, does this gratitude thing really work? And I was in the gratitude practice and I really wasn't seeing any significant changes. And my ex husband and I were on a cross country road trip and we were coming back. We had been traveling, driving for I don't know, 12 hours. And we're in the middle of, I think it was like Kansas or something. And I called ahead to the hotel because we're in the middle of nowhere. And I called ahead to the hotel and they're like, yeah, yeah, we have a room. So we stop and it was probably 7 o' clock at night. We've been driving all day. It's summer, it's 90 degrees outside. And we ended up having to wait probably 10 minutes to actually talk to the manager. And then he's like, oh, your room's not ready, like what? And it's not like we could just go across the street. I mean, we would have had to drive an hour to the next hotel. So we finally get to the room and we go up and the air conditioner was broken. Now it's 90 degrees outside, it's the middle of summer. And the air conditioner wasn't just broken, it was. You know how when air conditioners leak and it's carpet and you're Walking on wet carpet. And it's like slosh, slosh, slosh. I don't even want to think about the mold, right? It's like. But it was just. It was so hot. It was disgusting. The room smelled the whole thing. It was the only room they had. So we're like, okay. And my ex husband, he kept looking at me, was like, okay. Or, you know, waiting for me to react. And I didn't say anything like, okay, let's get a shower and just go to bed. So we go into the bathroom, there's no towels. Go downstairs. And at this point, he's just like, you know, like grabbing the, you know, imaginary popcorn, right? Like, okay, I'm ready to watch my wife in action, right? Like, you know, exorcist fit, please. Split pea soup coming out of her mouth and head spinning around. So we go down and I talked to the manager. Well, the. I guess the staff of the hotel was kind of on a mutiny and they just all left. So he was on his own to fend for the entire hotel. Figure it out. So he was like, there's no towels. I am so sorry. They're all in the wash. And you know, and. And my husband looked at me and was like, just waiting, right? Because he knew. Fiery redhead. Like, let's like, this is going to be some entertainment. You know what came out of my mouth?

I looked at the manager and I said, I am sorry to hear that you are having such a rough day. Don't worry about the towels. We'll figure it out. I just really appreciate Roof over our head and, you know, we'll get a good night's sleep and hit the road tomorrow morning. And I hope your night goes better. And I hope your day tomorrow is better.

And I didn't even think. The words just came out automatically. And I was like.

Who is that girl, right? Who, What? What this words me. And that was when I realized the power of gratitude. You know, it. It changed me. It changed how I responded. It changed how I showed up. It changed how I treated someone. And not just that, but that was a gift for him that he received. Probably on a day when everyone was yelling at him. He received kindness.

Yeah.

And he can then turn around and take that kindness and share it with someone else. And that was my pivotal moment of, wow, this gratitude thing really does completely change who you are.

Well, it also changes, and I think I want to just teach the audience a little bit about that. The way that works is if you normalize your cortisol production and if you normalize a hormone called dhea. What happens then is you don't have the road rage. You don't have that extension of, oh, my God, I can't stand it, that kind of experience. And it's like meditation also. It just calms the nervous system, puts you into parasympathetic very quickly. So there is a biochemical reason for it as well, which is pretty exciting because it does mean that we can change that state and don't have to always be in reaction, which is what you were saying was true for you, which is fantastic. So anybody listening can, can do that and really shift that. You know, I talk about adrenals, hormones, and weight issues in particular, and that can make an enormous difference with the biochemistry of the body. So it's very exciting. Yeah. Congratulations.

Thank you. Yeah. And I was going to say the other thing, too, kind of that I want to address is, is that level of the balance with gratitude and toxic positivity because you hear so much, oh, just be grateful and, oh, just think positive. And I just, I cringe when I hear people say that. I'm like, yeah, I'm a gratitude and mindset coach. I host a podcast called Gratitude Builds Fortitude. Like, gratitude is my thing. Right. And I just cringe when I hear people say that because it's so dismissive and it so like, oh, just right, that, that, oh, just in front of it especially. There is a time to be in the fields, to be human, to experience, to, you know, acknowledge the motion, the emotions going on, to acknowledge the experience that you're having and to be present to it. But then there's also a time to say, okay, it's time to, you know, put up, put my big girl pants or my big boy pants and let's, you know, let's, let's get it on and let's move on. And, you know, and that's really when gratitude can open the door. And it doesn't even have to be. I mean, it could just be a crack, right? Just a tiny crack to kind of go from that place of being in the funk or being a little bluesy to that tiny little crack and opening the door. And then all of a sudden, before you know it, it's wide open.

So what you're really talking about is pattern recognition because we have patterns of behavior, and it's really shifting that pattern to a different way of being, which is. Is so needed now in culture because people are so reactionary all over the place. So we, we need what you have to say for sure. So, so if there's people are interested in finding out a little bit more about you, how. And any kind of last words also, let's start with that first and then we can kind of look at how they can get in touch with you.

Oh, yeah, absolutely. And you know, and I, I started with a list of three things. Right. It's. I'm not saying there's anything bad about it, but I think to leave, to leave your listeners with let gratitude meet gratitude where gratitude is at and let gratitude meet you where you're at. Right. Because we're all going through something different and to try to have this gratitude as a one size fits all. Right. To think that it's the end all, be all. I mean it, I personally think it can fix all the problems in the world. That's me.

But, but to really view gratitude not as a one size f all fits all, but really to meet gratitude where it's at and let gratitude meet you where you're at and to partner with it as your best friend on your healing journey, it really becomes a beautiful place. And when you can marry that gratitude and marry that partnership with things like meditation, with things like your religion or faith or spiritual practice, and then that's when it really becomes your superpower. So that's, you know, I guess, really what I would like to leave everyone with. But yeah, to find me, obviously, we're listening to your awesome podcast. So head on over to the Gratitude Builds Fortitude podcast while you're on the platform and come say hi to me over there. And then I'm also on Instagram, Holly Bertone, and you can find me over there as well.

Awesome. Well, thank you so much and thank you for this work because the planet needs you very badly right now.

Thank you.