CIARRA: New Travel Advisor with an Adults Only Niche

Hey everyone, welcome to the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I'm Marcie Muensterman, your no fluff, no filter, tell it like it is coach. I'm so excited to bring you the stories, strategies, and straight up truths right from the mouths of your colleagues. So glad to have you here. Let's get to it. Hey everyone, welcome to the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I am Marcie Muensterman and this is episode 2. I'm really excited to dive deep into the real talk with Sierra St. Arnold today. She is with Hidden Gems Travel and Excursions. She's 3 years into this travel journey and she's had some tick success. So we're gonna talk about that today. But she also got really burnt out very shortly after starting her career, so We're definitely gonna dive into what it's like to get burned out early, cuz 3 years isn't very long, and how she's transformed and overcome the challenges she was experiencing in her business. If you don't know me, I'm Marcie Muensterman. I'm an 18-year travel veteran who burnt out, just burnt everything to the ground halfway through my career. And now I am a recovered, recovering workaholic back to help travel advisors. I don't know who I think I am, but help travel advisors improve making more money while working less hours, having the life that we all desire and deserve because this business does not have to suck the life out of us. It's supposed to be fun. And that is what the podcast is all about. And I'm so excited to have you here with us. So welcome, Sierra. How's it going?

I'm good. How are you?

I'm good. It's— I'm so excited to chat with you today and tell a little bit of your story. And I hope that we can all walk away with some fresh ideas and excitement to tackle our next challenge. Why don't you tell us a little bit about being a mom to a toddler and why you got into this crazy business?

Yes. So I have a 5-year-old. 15, almost 16-month-old that is like the center of our entire universe. Um, always been like a, I'm never having kids. And then I had her, I'm like, this one's good. I just need one. We're good.

We love it.

I don't have any more hands for any more kids because she is crazy and she's like, like I said, 16 months going on 16. So I'm just like very busy with her all the time. She has decided all of a sudden that she doesn't wanna sleep in her own bed, so I'm sharing that now.

Um, okay.

Never getting a good night's rest ever.

Yeah, I, I wish I could tell you it was like gonna get easier, but now that I have an almost 16-year-old, it feels worse cuz I'm like, where is he? What's he doing? He's with his friends and like he's not even in his bed. I'm like, what is happening? So I wish I could tell you it got better, but, um, enjoy this time as they always say.

I've like accepted defeat at this point because we, when I actually first started my travel agent career, it was like totally on a whim. I went to school like for criminal justice. I was like, I'm gonna be a crime scene investigator, like all the Yes.

What is your favorite true crime podcast? Because I need to know.

I love a lot of them. I like Morbid. I don't know if you've ever listened to that one.

I like that one. It's dark for me though. I'm not gonna lie.

But I also listen to like pop culture podcasts that cover true crime because they're like a little bit of everything. So it's not just, oh, everyone's dead.

I, I could appreciate that.

The whole time. It's like they talk about it and then we move on with our day.

Yeah. I won't lie. I'm a total crime junkie. From the beginning, I'm always totally into Ashley Flowers, but I like that. I didn't know that about you, so that's exciting.

So that's what I went to school for. I like got a big girl job. I graduated during COVID so like there was not much out there.

Yeah.

I ended up working in child support, which was absolutely the worst job I've ever had. Um, and I realized very quickly, like, this is not the rest of my life. This cannot be what I do forever. And then my husband wanted to move out west because he does what I like to call cowboy shit. He like trains horses and does like hunting trips.

Wow.

So we like packed up from little old North Carolina, like right after we had bought a house and got married and all the things and like just shipped ourselves off to Colorado.

Oh.

Didn't know where we were going. So I was like, okay, well I'm gonna have to find something for work and I don't know where we're going, so it's gonna have to be work from home. So came across the travel agent job posting or whatever and I was like, see what this is about. Like had never been out of the country, like, Myrtle Beach was like my family's idea of vacation every year.

Sorry, what was that?

Myrtle Beach.

Like, Myrtle Beach.

That's where we hit.

I mean, it is a very hopping tourist spot.

Uh, yeah. So like, that was my extent of travel knowledge. So I was like, okay, fair enough. I'm not paid out for this, but we're gonna give it a go. And we moved out west and we lived in an RV for like 2 years, which was crazy. And the whole point of the story is my kid had her own room in the RV and now we moved into a house and she has her own room and she wants nothing to do with it.

She doesn't wanna be in the RV bed. That's so funny. But you moved back, you moved back to your hometown.

Yeah.

You're, you're back there now.

Um, when I found out I was pregnant, I was like, I cannot do this without my mom. My mom has been on a plane approximately twice in her life and it was to come visit me in Colorado. And I think that if I begged and pleaded on my knees, she would've done it again, but she would've really rather not have had to do that. And I'm an only child, so like she doesn't have like other biological grandkids. So I was like, This is for me, but also for my mom.

I love that. Well, I love that you have such a good relationship with your mom. My dad also like hated flying, and so he always drove to see us, and it was always so dramatic, like all the things that would happen if he had to get on a plane or if there was bad traffic in the 1,000-mile ride, you know? So I can appreciate wanting to be closer to your family for sure.

She surprised me for my birthday in Colorado, and I had no idea she was coming. I like literally Never in a million years would I have thought I would've seen her at my doorstep in Colorado. And she knocked on the door and I was home by myself and I like peeked out the window because like where we lived was the middle of nowhere, kind of sketchy. And like, I just didn't open the door for random people.

You're like, I do not wanna end up on one of my true crime podcasts, so I am not answering the door.

And I looked up, I like saw her out the window. I was like, that like kind of looks like my mom. I was like, that's weird. And then I was like, no, that means my mom. I was like, what are you doing here?

That's completely outta context too. You're like, yeah, don't fly.

Like, he's like, what just happened?

This is crazy. Awesome. So I love hearing about this. This is what this whole podcast is about, is like connecting with each other on the most random things because we do work by ourselves in these little spaces at home and it can get really lonely. You had decided to become a travel advisor, never really having been anywhere. How did you choose where you were gonna end up? Like, How did you, did you research? Did you take the first thing?

I didn't really know all of the like different hosts and all of the things as far as like what being a travel agent actually like entailed. So I honestly had no idea. I just kind of went with like the thing I saw cuz I was like, oh, this seems good. Like training seems fine. And like the people that I had talked to through it, I was like, okay, like I feel like these people know what they're doing. I could learn a lot from them. So I didn't really do a whole lot of research. And I mean, it worked out like I really liked the people that I worked with. I mean, everything's worked out, but I honestly I mean, I feel like that is a theme with so many travel advisors.

We're like, oh, it sounds fun. Let's just pick the first thing and go for it. So in terms of training and things like that, how did you feel? You said that they had a good training department and you were able to get your feet wet.

At the beginning, like I said, I, I didn't know what to expect. So like, I didn't have anything to compare it to. So I was like, this is fine. And then it was like the further I got into it, it's not that the training was bad, it's just that I didn't know what to expect. Bad by any means. It was just, I felt like it wasn't what they were wanting me to like tell people and how they were wanting me to do things is just not how I would do things in real life. Okay, we're gonna have to like do something about this. And it wasn't like a hard and fast, you have to do it this way. It was just like, this is what's worked for us. Like it'll probably work for you too. And so I tried that for a little bit and it was just, like I said, like it just did not feel— when I would write these posts, I'm like, this is literally not how I would say this. Like this doesn't sound like me.

Yeah. Like you weren't feeling like yourself.

Yeah, it was like, I, I was, I'm trying to put on this professional whatever and like professional.

I like how that is in quotation marks. Like, like trying to be professional.

Yeah. Not that I'm not professional, but I'm not the wear a blazer and do my hair and makeup and talk to you proper. Like, that's just not me. Like, I'm hoodies and like hoodies and sweatpants from my couch. Like, that's how I am. That's how I'm gonna show up on a call. I don't know. I was just like, this doesn't sound like me. I'm very like sarcastic. I say Things, as soon as it comes to my brain, it's coming out my mouth. And if it doesn't, you're gonna see it all over my face.

We don't know anyone like that.

Yeah. So like, I just realized very soon, like people, if they like see my posts and then they talk to me on the phone, they're gonna be like, this is not the same person. So I had to kind of like figure that out for myself of like, how am I gonna do this to where people know that it's me and it's not just like a standard post that everybody's making? Like, how am I gonna stand out from everybody else?

Right.

And I like started TikTok totally on a whim. Like it wasn't, yeah, things where I was like, I'm gonna get this huge following and like get all my clients. I was literally doing it cuz I was like, oh, it can't hurt to try. And I went to Mexico for the first time.

Where in Mexico? Like, let me interrupt you. Sorry. Before we get into the TikTok story, cuz I am so excited about that. You're at, never been outta the country.

Yeah.

This is your first trip. You've been just creating posts and then you're like, I'm going to Mexico. Where do you, where do you choose to go as a new travel advisor?

So it was supposed to be a fam trip to Planet Hollywood, which, okay.

Okay.

Knew nothing about it, but it ended up getting canceled. And so we had, but we had already bought like our flights and stuff. So there was 6 of us that put it together. And keep in mind, I'm brand new, so I have—

I'm excited to hear this story.

Um, no idea what any resort is. I'm like, cool, it's cheap. It'll be fine. We ended up at Golden Parnassus. Shots in the corridor. No, never book that for anyone. And it's so funny cuz I do know people from my hometown that go there all the time and love it, but Not for me. Not for you. As an unseasoned traveler, never need to go back there.

Okay. As someone who lived in a fucking RV, you're like, I'm not going back to this resort. That makes me laugh so hard. And also, yeah. My goodness. But what an experience.

I mean, I went to Xcaret or Xcaret, however you say it. I went to that. That was super fun. But yeah, the resort, I mean, it was fine, but I wouldn't pay to go there again. So that was—

Totally understand. I mean, we all have to learn our lessons the hard way.

Exactly. So I was like, I'm gonna go and I'm gonna get all this content to post and whatever. I'm not promoting this resort cuz I would never send people here.

Oh my gosh.

So it had like—

I love that you like were right away, this is not the right property for me to sell. It doesn't mean other people can't sell it. It doesn't mean other people can't travel there, but just wasn't right for you. And I think learning that so early is Huge because we learn really quickly what we want to sell if we're paying attention, if we're being super self-aware. So I love that. Is Mexico one of your specialties though, now that you—

I would go back to Mexico every month of the year.

We love Mexico. Yes.

I've been other places. I'm like, it's just not the same.

So how much do you love Lori Gould?

Um, she's my favorite person ever. And if you're not in Mexperts, you're missing out because if it wasn't for her—

100%. Get your ass to Mexperts.

Yeah.

We love Lori, but honestly, her content and all the shit she teaches us, you cannot learn it anywhere else. She's the best at what she does. I've been selling Mexico. It was also one of my first international trips. And since I became a travel advisor and always have had the same kind of feedback on Mexico, you know, news issues and things like that. But being around Lori really solidifies that decision to continue to support Mexico tourism because It's fantastic, first of all. And second, there's so much more to learn about it that never could find anywhere else on the internet, let alone the news. Awesome.

I have a lot of people that come to me and they're like, we wanna go to the Caribbean, but no Mexico.

And I'm like, Mexico?

Oh, why?

I'm like, have you not been? That's such a typical response.

They're like, I just don't think it's safe. And I'm like, and then we go, go down the whole rabbit hole and I'm like, and then they, what is safe?

And they flip into free crime.

They didn't wanna go back 500 more times. I told you.

I'm so happy that you got to go to Mexico and still have a good experience. experience and want to go back just by one resort, which also says so much about having an open mind, right? So even if you go once and don't love it, there's always opportunities to expand and explore those other places that exist because Mexico is a big country. As far as becoming a Mexico expert, and I also noted here that you are a huge fan of Virgin Voyages. I mean, you have a 1-year-old. Are you like a family specialist or adults only? What do you do?

I do adults only. So my Facebook group is actually Adults Only Vacations. Do you not do families?

I'm like, I will.

It's just not my thing because I am not a kid person. I have my kid and I like her, but I don't like other people's kids. Girl. And before I had my kid, I'm a one and done for me. I want to go on vacation. I wanna relax. I don't wanna hear people's kids yelling. I don't want, mm-hmm. hear some kid complaining about their cheeseburger or whatever that kids do. It's just not for me. Every trip I've ever been on, for the most part, with the exception of like one fam trip, has all been adults-only places. And most of my clientele are adults that either have grown kids or don't have kids yet.

You jumped right into niching down, like you didn't explore all the things or take on all the clients. You were like, I want to work with adults. That's a big decision to make early. Did anybody give you any pushback or did you get any negative, hey, that's not the way to go, you gotta take it all?

Yeah, I, to be honest, I don't think I really did it on purpose. That's what I was posting about. So the people that were perfect for that came to me for that.

Yeah. Wow. Your marketing was in line with what you wanted to sell. Imagine that. So yeah, exactly.

So it just kind of worked out. I wasn't ever like, I'm not doing family vacations. It was just, that's not what I posted about. So when pe— and I was doing TikTok, so when people were looking for adults only, my stuff was coming up because that's what I do. That's what I knew about. That's what I was learning about. That's the places I had been. And even I stayed at Majestic, which is family friendly, but we stayed in the Elegance Club and we literally saw 4 kids the entire 5 days we were there.

Majestic Club is awesome.

Even though I was staying at family, like some family resorts, I wasn't catering to families. Like I wasn't. around the kids. I wasn't looking at like the kids clubs and stuff like that. I think it kind of just happened naturally. It wasn't like a decision that I really made on purpose, but it did. 'Cause when you deal with people and their kids and all the things, it gets very complicated. It does.

Like, I'm a family specialist. It's a very complicated decision. Like, I know whether a kid has anxiety or gluten allergy or all that.

Yeah. It's not, and since I didn't have kids until a year ago, I couldn't relate.

I don't.

why certain things are a big deal. And like, obviously I wanna take my clients' needs and things seriously, but it's harder when you haven't been there. You don't understand why it's so difficult. I didn't want my clients to feel like I was just pushing their needs and wants to the wayside to give them what I wanted to do for them. I can happily refer you to someone else or, you know, whatever.

Oh, you were referring out your family business? That's amazing. Good for you.

I would just tell them like, hey, this is not what I do. This is not something I feel comfortable with and I do think very early on, like I, not as much as I do now, but I was very much, I don't wanna just send you on a vacation to send you on a vacation. I want it to be something that you're going to enjoy and that you're gonna come back and be like, oh, that was great. I didn't want people to come back and be like, that was the worst 5 grand I've ever spent.

Really just being honest, being authentic, really telling it like it is, but also taking ownership of what you're good at, what you really relate to. Because so many travel advisors have a hard time picking a niche because they're like, Well, what if they want this or what if they want that? And what if they don't come back if they, if I don't do that for them? Well, that is a scarcity mindset we cannot live in because there is business right around the corner and there's enough for all of us, but also it opens an opportunity for someone else to thrive when you chose to say, I know somebody that does this and she's going to take so much better care of you than I can because I don't understand your needs. That is a huge decision, very CEO-esque to make so early. I am so excited to hear this because having a niche makes you more successful. Being more exclusive, narrowing down who you serve and knowing who you serve is such a key component to what we do every day. And understanding their needs is number one to be able to provide them with amazing vacation. For sure. So proud of you. That's so awesome.

I like it cuz people will come to me now and they'll be like, hey, I wanna go on this kind of trip, but I don't know if you do that. If you ever want all-inclusive or cruise or whatever, I can do that. I'm like, I can do that in my sleep. But—

Right. I don't think that we have to be an expert in every single property or every single cruise line. So I also love that you've really narrowed down to Virgin Voyages because that is An adults-only brand, you can be excellent at that and know it inside and out. But you said that TikTok made you successful early in terms of getting clients and leads. What was that like for you? You said it was accidental, but nothing is truly accidental. You made a decision to get on TikTok. You said, why not? Like, what kinds of things? You said you were posting what you knew, what you wanted to sell.

Before I went on my trip to Mexico, I had sort of started. I didn't have photos and videos. I wasn't part of Mexper. I hadn't felt I had nothing to post other than stuff I found on Google, which I was, nobody wants to see this. People wanna see it from my point of view because otherwise I'm just another person posting pictures from Google and nobody's gonna care. I followed all of these like strategy accounts and not really like diving into it, but just if it would come up my, on my For You page, like I would look at it, I would listen to it, and I was, I'll kind of save this for a rainy day type of deal. When I went to Mexico for the very first time, never having traveled internationally, I have all these random clips from when I went and I literally just threw them together, 5-second long videos of Things you need to know when you're traveling to Cancun, because a thing I was taught early on is people don't know what they don't know. So it seems like obvious to me because I do this every day. It's not always obvious to everybody else. Kind of that like education piece, which I know you talk about a lot in your groups and like always away for free. Give it away.

Give it away.

How it was worded to me when I was finding it on like on these strategy accounts, but I was, I'll give this. And then they were always, oh, the series videos will have people come back to your page over and over again. I made 10 videos of random things, even just You have to take your shoes off at TSA in some airports and some will just let you walk on through. If, yeah, little stuff like that that today me would be like, nobody cares about that. But people did. And I got a lot of followers very quickly and I didn't really know what to do with it. And it was kind of hard to keep up with, but I was like, screw it. I'm just gonna keep making videos and we'll see.

So what's a lot of followers? As someone who's not super active on TikTok, I mean, I've tried, but—

I mean, it was a lot for me. I like no one else. I, I think I have 15,000.

What? You have 17,000 followers? I, that is amazing.

But yeah, so I did at least a—

That's a lot.

Yeah, I did a lot of videos like that. What to know before you travel to X destination. At first I was like, I'm just making a TikTok account. We'll see where it goes.

I love that though.

I did like cruise packing list, where you can travel without a passport. Once I started traveling more, I would post about the places I was staying and like 5 things I love about this, 5 things I didn't really love about this. I got like kind of some hate about videos I would about things I didn't like and then—

We love some hate around here.

It grew my TikTok. So thanks for the hate comments.

We love a hate comment.

I appreciate it.

It is amazing. Well, I love that, but as we both know, that is really hard to maintain.

Yeah.

And you were getting a lot of leads, so that's amazing. But it's, there's always a consequence to every decision we make in business, good and bad, right? Tell me a little bit more about how this kind of was the start of your burnout.

I was 4 and a half months into being a travel agent when I started my TikTok. And like I said, it blew up very fast because of just the videos I was making. I think other people weren't doing that. I was getting a lot of leads my first year as a travel advisor. I would say probably all of my business minus maybe a handful of clients came from TikTok. And when I say a handful, I literally mean 5 or less clients.

Wow.

It was literally everyone from TikTok, but they were all very low budget clients and first-time travelers. And not that there's anything wrong with that. I was having to handhold a lot and I was having a hard time being the one that was in control. I was living in a camper. My husband was working away from home. I was by myself a lot cuz we lived in the middle of nowhere. I had no friends. We were brand new in this town, so I didn't have anything else to do but work. So I literally worked like, I feel like all day, all night until my husband came home and then I would stop for a little bit so we could hang out and he was gone again.

I can feel it again. That is super duper lonely.

Yeah, it was for sure. I don't think I felt that at the time cuz I was like, I'm built up. Like one day it won't be like this. And like, I think in the back of my mind I always knew that it wouldn't be like that forever, but it was definitely like, dang, I wanna go out and do something. I don't wanna sit on my computer all day long. I looked up and the whole day has passed and I haven't done anything but sit on my laptop.

What have I slept on? Yes, been there, girl.

So it's like, dang. Uh, I was doing a lot of like small domestic trips and, you know, mm-hmm, just not making a lot of commission off of that. And so one of my like travel advisor colleagues was like, well, why don't you just start charging like a very small fee? And when I say small, I mean like $25.

How much? How much?

$25.

Oh my God, girl. Coffee costs that much now.

Yeah, literally. So this was, this was 2021, so it was like right after COVID, but yeah, not nearly enough.

I mean, I, I must commend you for charging a fee because I do think when you're new and you're kind of bringing in a lower budget client, sometimes you can't, you feel like you can't charge. But then if they give you $25, are they easier to work with?

Not always. And I learned that very quickly too. Like, it's $25, who cares? Yeah. For a lot of people during that time, and even now, like $25 is not a lot for people that are out. willing to any extent out of the country, in my opinion.

I agree. I mean, not trying to undermine someone's budget, but at the same time, $25 is not technically skin in the game. It's not a buy-in to your time, right?

Exactly. And so I did have a couple people were like, yeah, I'm not paying that. I'm okay, that's fine. Like, which, if you're not gonna pay $25, then you're definitely not gonna spend money to go on this vacation that I wanna send you on. So. I did that for like a couple months and I, I mean like a couple, and then I upped it to like $50, which still not really a whole lot of skin in the game if you ask me.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

But it weeded out a lot more people than I expected it to. And I got a little bit nervous cuz I was like, oh shit, like now what am I gonna do? Like now I don't have any inquiries. Like what's going on?

Because you're like, oh my God.

On my form, like, hey, I charge a $50 fee and if you don't agree to it, then basically don't fill out this form. The people that were coming, like that still wasn't a huge deal. Like they would pay it, but they still didn't have like a huge budget. I'm only 25. When I started, I was 22. A lot of my clients were my age and like nothing against 20-year-olds, but we're all broke. We don't have money to go on.

It's a hard time in our lives.

I mean, yeah, like we wanna go and have fun, but we also don't have the money to do that. So I understood the struggle of I wanna go on a vacation and have a good time.

Right. But you have to make a living. Right.

But I also don't have any money to do that. I also had to have those conversations of like, you're not going anywhere for $1,500.

Like.

Sorry, it's just not happening like that.

Not real life. It is not 2005.

So we have to bring it to now and what it costs.

It's always the worst when you're like, but my, my client says that their parents traveled to Mexico in 2005 and they only spent $700 total. It's like, well, the pandemic has happened and now everything is different.

I've had to have that conversation with a lot of people. Have you seen the price of milk lately? Because That's went up an atrocious amount. Your vacation is no different. Like you're doing all, and you want all these things and I want to give you all these things. Mm-hmm. I can do it for that budget. This is where I can send you for that budget. And they would, oh, I don't think I really wanna do that. I'm like, okay, well come back to me when you do wanna do that or when you have a better budget. But I wasn't always very good at saying it like that.

Right.

Not that I wanted to hurt people's feelings, but I need—

Oh, of course not.

I'm a very blunt, honest person. Like if I say it or if I think it, it's coming outta my mouth. And if—

So you at this time were not being the Sierra Uh, sitting here in front of me now. Yeah. So, well, we all are nice to our clients, but you weren't being as direct as you wanted to be.

Not being direct.

It's exhausting. Yeah. Let's be honest. That alone can cause the burnout.

The phone with them. And then I'd like text my travel agent friends like, listen to what these clients want. There's no way I can make this happen. Why did I not just tell them that? Like, right.

Why did I, you know, ground it? What was holding you back from telling them the truth?

I think. I don't think it wasn't that I wasn't telling them the truth. I think I was just kind of beating around the bush. I didn't want people to think I was being rude. I didn't want people to be like, oh my God, that girl wants me to spend all this money. And like, I don't even know her. I found her on TikTok. Especially like I did have some older clients. And when I say older, I just mean old enough to be my parents, like not in their 20s.

Girl, I could be your parent, but we can talk about that another time. I'm not saying like every time I get on there, I'm like, I, I'm still 27. I feel like— I get what you're saying though. So like people who were older than you—

Felt like they weren't taking me serious. And honestly, it was probably all in my head, but that's how it felt.

That's okay. I mean, it's probably a little bit of both because our reality is our reality, right?

Yeah. So that was, I think probably the main thing is like, I was like, I don't want people to think that I think I'm like better than them because they can't spend this money. 'Cause at the time I couldn't spend that money either. I'm not like dogging you because you don't have the money for it. It just felt Very harsh and rude, and I never meant it to be that way. I would say stuff like in my head, and even when I talk to people now, don't mean to like be a bitch, but I'm just trying to be honest with you. A lot of times, if you don't just come out and say that's not going to be enough money, people think that you're gonna twist and do all these things to make well.

You're going to try to find the unfindable information, and I say this all the time. I see it in Facebook groups every single day as somebody coming in saying. So-and-so wants to go to Aruba on Christmas break for $2,000. And I'm like, where did they ever get an idea that they could do that?

Yeah.

Was it from your intake form? Because you had $2,000 as an option for a budget and then they also clicked Aruba. What the fuck is going on? We, we have to bring the most authentic, honest conversations or we're going to waste our time and theirs. And there's potential there that the trust can be eroded because they're like, I thought you could do this.

Yeah.

You know, and that's worse than being direct and saying, we need more money for this vacation and we need to think outside the box to get you there, but there are other options. I can imagine where the burnout was really coming from, especially working alone, not having a whole lot of support people to bounce things off of. What was it? You're doing the TikTok thing, you charge a fee, you're doing some changes here, but what was the moment of I need real change and how did that come about? Okay, y'all, let's pause for a quick break. If you are sick of spinning your wheels on social media and want a real way to grow your travel business, the No BS Facebook Groups course is exactly what you need. I have been running my business 100% inside of my Facebook group since 2018, selling $600,000 to $1 million in gross sales a year, working just 20 hours a week. And now I'm teaching you how to have the social media business that grows your network and brings in your most aligned clients. This self-paced course is built specifically for travel advisors, covering everything from starting your group to boosting engagement and connecting with clients using my proven 3-pillar strategy. Plus, you'll get access to my members-only Facebook group and reusable content calendar through Trello to jumpstart your business. I know you're ready to ditch the social media hustle. Grab my course now and don't forget to check the show notes for an exclusive coupon code just for my podcast listeners. Okay, now back to the pod.

So I kind of stayed in that area for a very long time until honestly, until I found out I was pregnant because I was okay. Pregnant. We're still in the middle of nowhere. I'm still work. I was better about my boundaries, but not perfect at them. And not that I'm perfect at them now, but much better at holding my. These are my business hours. If you text me after this time, I'm not answering until tomorrow or whatever it is.

And where did you get these ideas on your own?

I think it's just the the culture of being a business.

You start to just be like, I have to make these changes.

Yeah.

I love a moment in your life when you're. I can do this. It doesn't cost anything.

Yeah.

And I need to make this change.

Yeah. I'm about, baby, like I can't just be working all day, every day with a newborn. My parents growing up were small business owners. They've owned a business my entire life. My mom owned a restaurant. My dad's an electrical contractor my entire life up until now. They still own the electrical business. And my parents were literally at everything ever. All my practices, all my games, all my school events, my field trips, like barely So supportive of your business.

They're like, this is exactly what we want you to do.

Yeah, they were always there. Some of my friends didn't have that. My friends would be like, oh, my mom can't make it to this game, or they're not coming on the field trip. Growing up, that didn't seem like a big deal to me, but now that I have my own kid, I don't ever want her to be like, oh, well, my mom's not gonna make it to this. I cannot be a workaholic. I cannot work all day, every day. Like, I want to, I'm at home. I might as well spend time with her and make time while she's growing. And then once she gets school-aged and play sports and does whatever she wants to do. I wanna be there for that because now as an adult, I realize like that was a luxury that not every kid had. And I'm like, that's crazy. My parents were so involved.

Parents were not workaholics. It's not like even though they ran their own businesses that they just worked all the time. 'Cause that's something you hear in entrepreneurship, the hustle, the grind. Whenever somebody says those things now, I'm like, that for, for a millennial term or a Gen Z term, is that gives me the ick.

Yeah.

You do not have to work 24/7 to have success, make real money. And spend time doing the things that we love, and that's being with our family and traveling and things like that. I mean, part of the reason you become an agent is to travel, right? I love that they were at every game, which means—

Yeah, like I saw them working and I knew there's a time and a place for everything. They're not just gonna be able to like do whatever they want all day, every day. But it was like when it was time for an event or whatever, it was like, hey, we're done working. We're going to the event. Or every summer we'd go on vacation. We, I knew no matter what, we were going to the beach over July 4th.

Myrtle Beach.

Yeah. Myrtle Beach.

We love Myrtle Beach. You were saying earlier you're from a small town, and of course I forgot to, to ask you about your hometown, but same thing. My dad took us to Myrtle Beach when I was a senior in high school, and it was like one of the best trips ever until my sister and her friend snuck out one night and got us in trouble and we had to leave the next day cuz my dad was one of those like black and white parents. Like, you broke the rules, we're all going home. And it was my senior Trip.

Oh no. Fuck.

I was at Myrtle Beach for the first time having a blast. Anyway, sorry. Okay.

So, but yeah, like he would like each of them would tell him, hi, I'm on vacation. Like, I'm not gonna be able to get back to you for, mm-hmm, until I'm home.

And like, great representation.

He would like call like his right-hand man that still works for him. Hey, you need to take care of this. Or like, if you can't, like, we'll get—

Love it. I love it.

And like, same thing. I didn't realize then, like, that's such not something you see all the time.

I'm not.

It's so random. You know, smartphones and all the thing. Like my dad's still rocking a flip phone.

We love a dad that rocks a flip phone.

Yeah.

And also tells people to F off when he's busy. I love a small town dad. I think it is a testament to how you're raised and then the things that affect you as an adult. We're taking that into our choices. So as you're getting burned out, like what do you decide? Like, yes, you're setting boundaries, but what makes you into training and things like that?

I think it was literally just being, I cannot do this anymore because if I do, I'm literally not gonna do it anymore. I'm gonna have to go back to another job and I don't—

I'm gonna throw in the towel.

Yeah, pretty much. I think I just got to a point where I was, this is not sustainable. And yes, I was making money, but I was also, I don't wanna say I was miserable cuz that seems like a stretch, but I was definitely not as happy as I felt like I should have been in a job like this. You know, I'm going on the trips and I'm doing like, I'm doing the FAMs. I've always enjoyed those. I've never felt like I have to do these. They've always been so much fun. But then it was like I would come back and be like, Or I'd be on the trip and be like, oh my gosh, I gotta answer this email, or I've gotta text this person back. And it's, I just wanna enjoy my free time. The little free time I do have on this trip, I just wanna be able to enjoy it. Or when I would come home in the afternoons and my husband would be gone, like, I just wanna sit down and watch TV and not have to worry about somebody else. I can't do all of those things that I want to do if I don't start really hard and fast. These are my business hours. This is my process. If you don't like it, then you can leave.

There are. Right.

Thousands of travel agents out there, and I'm sure one of them will be happy to let you do it how you wanna do it, but that's not me. So. Right.

So you decided to jump into the courses, but you did have some hesitation. What was your hesitation?

I've always been a huge money warrior and I credit that to my mom. I don't mean that in a bad way. It's just, she's always been very good with her finances, or at least from my perspective, she has. Like, you need to save this much from each paycheck and You know, when you're gonna spend X amount of money, you need to make sure that you have enough for this and for that and whatever. If you don't have a certain amount in your bank account, then you don't have any money to spend. And so it had been a very slow period in my business because I had just had a baby. Um, and I was spending time with her and that was great, but I also wasn't working, which I think looking back, like I definitely deserved that time, but I didn't prepare to pay. So I was like, okay. Do I have the money for this? Maybe I do, but should I really spend it? Probably not. But I thought about, I was like, if this helps me like get my process in order and do something that I'm enjoying, because I'm on social media, I'm on Facebook all the time anyway. Well, do something with it.

So you were on TikTok, so what attracted you to the Facebook Groups course?

Um, TikTok was, it felt like TikTok was just a lot more work because I was having to Find the videos and put the videos together and, you know, do the voiceovers and show my face and do all the things. And I have to do those in Facebook too, but I feel like it's easier to work around with my schedule, if that makes sense.

It does.

TikTok is very much like post 3 times a day, every single day, or like that's how I felt it was. And I was like, I just don't have the mental capacity or the time to carve out hours and hours for this every single day. Now that I have, cuz you gave us the content calendar, a lot of those are copy paste and change a few things and add in my own. And I can go and I can schedule the whole week and be done with it in hours. And I don't—

So is that how you do it, Sierra, when you're working in the Facebook group? Yeah. You are blocking time. How much time does it take you to schedule a week's worth of the content calendar that's provided?

So it kind of varies. I do it, I used to do it all in one sitting and then I would come back and be like, oh, I wanna post this. And then I felt like I was posting way too much and I was like running out of extra stuff I wanted to talk about. Mm-hmm. I'll do all my engagement posts for the week in one sitting. That literally takes maybe 10 minutes. Like that's super easy. My personal posts, for the most part, I kind of just do those as things come up. So those, again, it's for the moment it happens and I take 5 minutes to type up the post and post the picture.

Done.

The stuff that takes me the longest is definitely the business posts, but again, I have gotten better at that. So I would say it takes me a few hours in total. But I kind of separate it out. So I would say maybe like 2 hours.

Yeah, I think that's one of the bigger FAQs for the First Class Community course is very much like, is this going to be super time consuming? But I do think in comparison to how much time I spend creating a reel on Instagram or even trying to recreate that exact reel and with a different trending audio on TikTok, which I have been trying to do, it can get very overwhelming and bogged down and I You know, sometimes the app crashes and then they're like, oh, you should do it outside the app, then uplight it and put it in the new. And I'm literally over here like, holy shit. Too many things. All I have to do is take a selfie and put it on Facebook and I'm, I'm gonna get it. Yeah.

Facebook is my people. TikTok is anybody and everybody. And it's sometimes that's fine, but other times I don't wanna talk to the strangers.

That's the way—

I go on TikTok, post about my kid, you know?

Like, yeah, it's not gonna— Exactly.

Even though it had my face and my voice, it didn't feel quite as personal. To me as through COVID, which I like was trying to get more into. Like I've always been very personal with my clients, but this just kind of like took it to a new level, I guess.

How is that now that you have transitioned some of your energy, or it sounds like a lot of your energy into your Facebook?

I don't post on TikTok anymore, to be honest. I actually was looking at like hiring a social media person to do it for me cuz I did get great clients that I still have now. Obviously I had some not great ones, but I do have a lot of repeat clients from that that do submit to me and are my ideal clients. I don't wanna just like give it up completely, but I just don't have the energy to do all of it. I'm like, if you can just, here's all the pictures and videos I have. This is what I wanna talk about. Can you just make it sound good?

I love that you have shifted from the money worry to I might hire a social media person.

Yeah.

That is a huge shift in mindset in 6 months.

Yeah, for sure.

That's amazing. I'm so excited for you. So. And is utilizing the First Class Community course working for you? Are you building connections and, and getting leads and things like that?

I think I'm connecting with more people that are actually my ideal client. And that's not to say that everybody in my group is. I think my course is like—

It's the 80/20 rule, girl. Yeah.

There's people in there that I know that will probably never book with me because they either don't wanna go on the type of trip I offer or that I specialize in, or They don't wanna spend the type of money that I want them to spend or whatever the reason is, but they engage with my post. I know like what their favorite color is, or I know if they like the beach or if they hate the beach, like just little things.

You never know when they might refer you.

That's like, I definitely get a lot from that.

So you're still creating that space. There's room for everybody in the group as long as there is an understanding that you are catering to, marketing to your aligned client in every single post. I'm really excited for you.

Asked me, she was like, can you post more about Europe travel tips? I would love to do that, but one, I've never been to Europe. I don't really book Europe because I don't know enough about it. And at this point, like, yes, I could do all the trainings, but I just honestly don't wanna make the time to do that. I would rather focus on what I know that I love and enjoy and am very, very good at, in my opinion, than try to take on something else that I don't care as much about.

It goes back to niching.

I mean, like, I, I pretty much feel that making that decision.

I love that.

I mean, I would, I would love to, but that's just not something I'm an expert in. I don't feel that the information I would give you is anything more than what you'd find on Google because that's what I'm gonna do cuz I don't know. Right. I definitely like niche down for sure, even in the group and like in my posts, cuz I even used to post family resorts like that I had toured and stuff. And not that I wouldn't book those resorts, but that's just not who I cater to. And most of the people in my group again are not People with kids or are not traveling with their kids. So why am I even doing this? I don't enjoy it. Nobody here cares about this. Like, let me post about something else.

I love this very specific niche idea and like that you keep coming back to it because it's the driving reason I believe for you that you have been successful early and been able to attract a very specific client that is now going to spend more money. Because you've transitioned away from focusing on some of the budget pieces as much as, you know, moving into a more higher end or mid to high end price point for what you sell. And I think making that decision is only going to serve you better even moving forward. And you can always add things later when you have time. And I didn't sell a European vacation until after 2020. I mean, It was a huge change to shift away from the Caribbean and Mexico market and learning it and understanding it. You're right. It is like a whole—

Yeah.

Very different bucket of change. So I'm very proud of you for recognizing that so early and deciding, I'm just not gonna do that. And I think, you know, in the beginning I thought the theme of this episode was really gonna be about how authentic you are, cuz you are very authentic, but what's really coming to light Is that you are very specific in who you serve, how you serve them, and where you are sending your clients. So I think that is incredible.

Okay.

So congratulations on finding your way in really a short time, but in the timeframe that it normally takes, 3 to 5 years is a very typical point of success for people. And I think you're really probably gonna hit your stride as you head into year 4. When we're talking about the courses, you've taken all of them except for Commission with a Comma. So I'm curious, like, what has been the biggest impact since investing in the courses despite the money concern? And have you felt it was worth it? Did you, do you have ROI, the return on the investment?

For sure. I think the biggest thing, well, one of the biggest things was the confidence to just be who I am. I'm very blunt. I'm very sarcastic. I'm very honest and I don't ever mean it maliciously, but I do understand that some people probably take it that way because I know that that's not my intent. How you interpret it is not my issue. So I think that with the whole budget thing, I used to do like the inquiry form and how much are you willing to spend? And I would do everything I could to like find them something that would fit in that budget, but maybe didn't meet all the other things that they wanted. It's given me definitely confidence to tell them, hey, for, for what you've described to me, this is what you're looking at. And when they give me that like, Like that.

Oh, 'cause you're in person. 'Cause yeah, like you gave up your inquiry form, your intake form.

And it's funny because right before I took Propose to Close, I had literally changed my inquiry form like 10 times and I was like, I just don't like these because every time someone would fill it out, it was missing information. They didn't answer the question right.

No, you have to talk to them. You have to qualify them.

Them on the phone. But it was just like, this is not it. I'm like, what the fuck? Why do I even have them fill out the stupid form? Just schedule a call with me.

I love that. I love too that you're having like these aha moments as you're kind of even probably going through the course.

I would ask, I had on there, what is your preferred airport? And people would put American Airlines. Well, that's not an airport, so that doesn't help me.

Well, thank you so much for telling me.

They are very different.

That's not what I asked.

Yeah, exactly.

It goes to show that people aren't trying to be confusing, but they don't understand the form. They don't understand.

Exactly.

Yeah. And a lot of people don't understand how much it costs to go on vacation. And so the inquiry form plants seeds that don't exist. Yeah. And therefore we can't provide them with what they've filled out, which is why we have to talk to them. And doing so in person is like this, like right now what we're experiencing, which I get to see your face. I get to see when you're about to say something, but all, not only that, you're planning a vacation. It's supposed to be fun. Like this is more fun. It provides more connection.

Right.

So I love. That you decided to take these courses despite the investment. And did you get on the payment plan? Like, what did you decide to do?

Girl, I picked the longest payment plan I could. I was like, let's spread this out.

All the payment plans.

Well, I'm glad.

No, that's exactly why they're offered, cuz I understand it's an investment.

Mm-hmm.

And having been an agent for so long and understanding like the payout is so slow, and that's something I don't think our clients fully understand is we do not get paid until they travel. And if we're not charging fees, then we're We're not getting paid sometimes for maybe a year, maybe longer, depending on how much lead time you have on their vacation. So investing in something can be really challenging. So I'm glad you took advantage of the payment plan.

Started charging more fees, like not more, like I still charge everyone, but what I charge is more now. I got the confidence to do that too, cuz I was like, this $50 is really not doing it for me.

No. And then you can put that money back into your business. You can. It's not just a fee that is charged because you feel like you're owed it. It's more, this is an investment in me so I can continue to invest in my business. If you shift your mindset on fees a little bit and look at that fee as a way to give back to your business, whether it's maybe you do upgrade their transportation or you do invest in a course or go on another fam with that money, it is meant To grow your business, it's not just here's a fee and you're just pocketing the money. But even if it's to pay the electric bill that month because you haven't been paid your commission, that is okay. So I'm so I'm just so impressed. Honestly, you're a young travel advisor, literally, and then you're a new travel advisor making big CEO decisions that really matter. So is there anybody like in your life that's these courses are not it? I just love to hear this because I want to know like what are people saying? Because we know not everybody agrees with the course situation over here. Yeah.

So I'm a huge, I'm like, everyone needs to take the courses. They're great. But I also realize that not everybody's ready to take the courses. And I was pretty much like in the mindset of like, I can't do this anymore. I gotta figure something out. And this may not work, but we're surely gonna give it a shot. I had some like travel agent colleagues that I work with that asked me about them and I was like, oh, I love them. They're great. I've implemented all these changes and everything's going wonderful. Um, I have one that's like a very dear friend of mine. I always joke that she's my second mom. And so she, I think she bought Propose to Close. I don't know if she bought any other ones, but she bought that one. And she, I just went on a trip with her actually. And she was like, I just don't think they're for me. We didn't really talk too in depth about it. She books a lot of travel. She's been an agent, I think for 5 years, but she's very much like, what I'm doing is working, so why change it? Not that she's not open to making changes. I think it's just that she's like, this is working, so why do I need to change these things that are working? But, and I've told her this, so I don't care to say it, or I would tell her this, but like we were on the trip and she's like, I've gotta book this trip. And I'm like, mm-hmm, relax. Like, I don't wanna do this. And I told her I was like—

Because you guys were on a work trip. Yeah.

We were at Ascend with ALG. It was kind of a big deal. Like we didn't have a ton of free time, but we were on conferences. I just wanna take a nap or go eat or do whatever. I'm not working. So she was like, I've gotta get this done. I've gotta get this done. And I was like, listen, I don't, I'm not working because anybody that needed something from me, they were told that they needed to do it by this date. And if they didn't, I'll get to them. And she even said to me, she goes, all right, Marcie. And I was like, okay, well, at least she heard me.

I can appreciate it not being for everybody. I would just say it's in those moments that sometimes they're not ready yet because they're just so used to this particular way. That it's, well, she has to get tired of that shit, you know? And until she's tired of that shit, then it's probably not the right time. But I'm glad she has it for when she is ready. So I was just like, I'm not working.

I'm not doing that. And then she was like, well, I just don't want them to book it on their own. Honestly, uh, cuz I think it ended up being like a $150 commission cuz it was a cruise. It wasn't anything crazy. I was honestly, if they wanna book it themselves, I'm not worried about their $150. She was like, well, I was like, we just don't have the same views on this and that's fine. Like you do what you got.

No. And scarcity mindset is very challenging. to get rid of. And that's why I do the mindset piece in almost every single course. Well, I do the mindset piece in every single course because getting into the mindset of being okay with them going off and booking it on their own is what will actually open all the doors and windows. So even if you are a million-dollar agent, you can still continue to be a million-dollar agent with aligned clients who will wait for you to get back to them because you are saying no, you aren't rushing off and missing something else that you'd rather be doing. To make $150. It's like, I can walk away from a $2,000 commission and I would tell you that's the best thing you could have ever done for your business because it releases you of that desperation to close every lead you get in case another lead is not coming. When in fact, if you were willing to say, that's not right for me right now. If you want to wait, I'll be back here at this time. Otherwise, if you book it on your own, I hope you have a great vacation. Offers the right client a space on your roster.

Yeah.

You know, and I think like if we could just get to a place where we are willing to say no, and I do think high-performing advisors struggle with this the most because we have like brainwashed ourselves to think this matters, every sale matters, and it's exhausting eventually. I hope that she's listening, that she'll take advantage of the mindset module in Propose to Close. It's a bonus module and it's really, really powerful. And it's a lot of goal setting too, where you can set those ginormous $1 million goals and work less hours or work less when you're traveling. Because the other thing is splitting our brain is not good for us. I always think about that whenever I'm— I cannot focus on doing well at one thing if my brain is in 4 different places.

Yeah.

And I think when we're on conference especially, you're learning all this stuff, you're drinking from a fire hose, you're meeting all these people.

Yeah.

How are you supposed to really serve your client at the best way and not make any mistakes?

Yeah.

You know, rushing back to the room to just book this one thing that turns into looking at your email and then getting on your social media and it snowballs, right? So I am, I am proud of you for really taking a stance on your boundaries because I think it's really difficult to do anyways, like on a day-to-day basis, like Like where you were talking about like going to every softball game and going to every event at school. I'm like, oh, I am the queen of saying no to all that shit too. Like if it does not fit me, I'm not doing it. I love my children, but I miss things sometimes because, oh, that doesn't actually fit for my schedule. It has nothing to do with work. Like I am going to get Botox that day.

I just literally don't want to.

I can be all anybody wants, but yeah. What's, um, so powerful about what you have shared with us today is that you did a lot of stuff before you got to the course fees. And most of it didn't cost you any money. So what are 3 things if you were to give a travel advisor advice, like right now that they could take away from this episode and not spend a penny, just their time in listening, 3 things that they could do right now to have immediate change or transformation?

I think the first one is obvious, finding your niche. And it doesn't have to be, I mean, if it's as specific as mine as I don't do family vacations really, and we're only going to the Caribbean and doing a Virgin Voyages cruise. Even if it's not quite that specific, just knowing where you are. You don't have to know all the things. You don't have to book all the things. You can find what you like and be really good at that and be the go-to. And if somebody wants something else, then find, find a good partner that you can, you know, trade back and forth with. Like, I don't do Disney. I don't book Disney. It's not my thing. I don't get excited about it. It's just not for me. And so when I have people come to me for that, I have a really great colleague that will Yes. Be thrilled to do that for you.

That is a window open. Good karma, girl.

All inclusive, reverse charges, and then we'll talk. But until then, I cannot be excited for this trip. I don't know anything about Disney. I don't really wanna know anything about Disney. Mm-hmm. And I'm very honest with people about that. So that kind of goes into like my second thing of being honest and being yourself is the easiest thing you can do because before I was trying to be that professional, whatever, and not, yeah, not professional. Like I'm organized and I'm detail-oriented and I'm professional in those ways. But again, I'm not the like wear a dress and heels and do my hair and makeup. I'm sitting at home with my hoodie and that's what I'm gonna look like on our Zoom call. And if that's not for you and me being very blunt and straightforward, if that's not for you, that's okay. But there are people that are gonna be good with that. Just little things like that make it so much easier because I, like I said, if I think it's coming out my mouth or my face is gonna show it, so me having to try—

That's why we have to be on the Zoom.

Like not say it, not show it on, like, like I literally don't have the energy for that. And people—

That's why you like me, Sierra.

Now I understand. You're so right. It totally is because that's literally me and someone's doing it and people like it. Like, okay, cool. And it's funny because when I would go on fam trips or like be on Zoom calls with my like travel agent team or whatever, they're like, you're just so honest.

We love that.

But then when I was doing it with my clients, I was like, no, they won't like it. I'm like, people are literally sitting here. Just be that person.

And I'm like, okay, 100%.

So it's just too difficult to try to be somebody that you're not. So just be yourself. And if people don't like it, that's okay. You're not everybody's cup of tea regardless of how you act.

Mm-hmm.

You're never gonna please everybody. Find your people. Please those people that you like and you get along with and that value your service or whatever you have to offer. And anybody else can kick rocks, honestly.

The fucking rocks. Okay, so what is your last piece of advice?

My last one is the calendar control. That is such an easy change that I didn't realize would be such a big deal, but blocking off all the, like my Google Calendar is my best friend. If it's not in the Google Calendar, it does not—

Girl, I love a color coding Google Calendar.

Oh yes. Like it honestly It needs more colors cuz there's not enough.

We're so limited. It runs out and I'm like, that's just a lighter shade of yellow and I need like, yeah, I need something else here. So yeah.

Everything goes on the calendar. I only do appointments, client calls. I only do it by appointment and I only do appointments on certain days. And obviously if that doesn't accommodate to somebody, I do make exceptions on occasion, but it's not a for everybody thing. I'm not answering text messages after business hours. I'm hanging out with my kid. I'm going to dinner. I'm doing whatever I'm doing. I'll get back to you tomorrow. During business hours.

Because you are hanging out close to your mom in your small, like, cute little North Carolina town.

So like, I'm not, I'm not doing all that.

Gotcha.

From 10 to 4, Monday to Thursday, that's when you can reach me. Anytime outside of that, you're gonna have to wait unless you're traveling.

And unless you're traveling, we always have to say this because somebody's gonna go, well, what if they're traveling? And it's like, of course I'll answer.

And, um, when you're traveling, if it's not an emergency, Don't call me at 2 in the morning because—

I know, I know. Educating clients on what an emergency is, is also something down the road I had to learn and be more honest. This wasn't really an emergency, but like this sleeping with my phone. Okay, I'll answer the phone at 2 AM. And I mean, I did have a legitimate client emergency in October that was middle of the night. It was like so crazy. Electricity was off, hurricane was hitting, and my phone rings and The only reason why I heard it was because I was sleeping with my headphones because the hurricane was so loud and it came through.

Like rang through your headphones?

Bluetooth. Otherwise, I don't think I would've heard it because, I mean, our electricity had been off for 7 hours, but she was in a legitimate crisis and I was, it was like fate that I had my headphones on. So of course we answer the phone if we see a client who is traveling at 2 in the morning call us. We're not trying to operate at 11:00 PM texting about—

I'm not answering. I had a client text me yesterday to ask me if the resort had a buffet and it was way past our business hours and I was, this can wait till tomorrow. And then she texted me back and was, nevermind, I found it.

Just hit the pause button, right?

Yeah.

That's why I love that module in Propose to Close that basically tells you to slow down. You do not have to like And it's not to say that we don't want to respond. Is this the right time?

Our phone is down.

I'm trying to make dinner. Oh, my kid is doing homework. It's okay. And yeah, you leave it for a few minutes. Every client relationship is a little different, but understanding your own boundaries and what is going to keep you above water, right? We just don't want to be drowning in tons and tons of texts. It's not like we don't want to help you. I also really want to always offer benefit of the doubt to the clients that text after hours because they're after hours too. Maybe they had a long day and now they're thinking about their vacation. It doesn't mean though that they're expecting— the right client is not expecting an answer right this second, right? So like tracking that client too that might still text you, but you're not expected by them to respond like this. And if you have those, You need to set the expectations, right? Oh my God.

A lot of people send stuff without the expectation of a response. They just don't wanna forget to.

Exactly.

Because I know that I'm like that. Like even with my nail girl, I'll message her and I'm like, oh my God, it's 10 o'clock at night. I'm like, please don't respond to me right now.

Right? And so that's bonus advice that you can start today is just to stop texting back after 6:00 PM. Like make rules, set an alarm.

Just gonna forget. So please ignore me. Respond to me when you're back at I know I do the same thing.

And so that's why I'm always like, it's not me expecting a response. It's just that sometimes my brain is like going in the bed and I'm like, oh, I gotta do that. And hopefully she'll just respond tomorrow. I can— it's not just a client's being super annoying. I think too, just offering that benefit of the doubt is huge in the relationship part of what we do. So, all right, Sierra. Well, I have loved this episode and I hope that If you're listening, you do as well. We're going to put Sierra's, you know, connections and information and all of her IG and TikTok and, um, stuff into the show notes. And I hope that you guys enjoyed this and give us a 5-star review. That's a wrap on today's episode, friend. Thanks for hanging out with me again on the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I hope you're leaving this episode feeling fired up, inspired, And let's be honest, your fucking life. If today's episode hit home, do me a favor and share it with your fellow travel advisors who need to hear this. And don't forget to leave a review. Your support means the world and helps me reach more badass advisors like you. And hey, if you've got a story to share or some no BS advice of your own, you've taken a course or two of mine, maybe you've been a coaching client of mine, I'd love to hear from you. I want to hear from you. Head to my website to apply to be a guest. I'd love to feature you on an upcoming episode. Until then, you fucking got this. Keep being bold, keep being unapologetic, and keep building the business you fucking deserve. This is Marcie Minsterman signing off with zero fluff and a whole lot of heart.