Redrop: Carrie - From Doing It All to Saying HELL NO

This is the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I'm Marcie Muensterman, and this show is for travel advisors who wanna run profitable businesses, charge what they're worth, and stop following outdated bullshit advice just because someone in the industry told them that that is the way it has always been done. Each episode brings real talk, practical strategies, and real stories from fellow travel advisors, because sometimes the best way to learn is hearing how someone else figured their shit out. So let's get to it. Hey everybody, welcome to the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I am so excited to have Terri with me today. Terri Blackwell is with Terri on Adventuring, and she's been a travel advisor for 2 years. She's also a full-time nurse who just got a bam chicka wow wow of promotions. So we're really excited for her.

Thank you.

And she's going to be chatting with us and telling us lots of fabulousness. Before we begin, I want to reintroduce myself, Marcie Muensterman, your 18-year veteran travel advisor, burnout survivor, now podcast host. And I'm bringing you your real talk around what is going on in the travel industry with your colleagues. It's a lonely business and sometimes it's nice to be able to find connection. within our community, and that's what we're here to do. And that's why I have, um, beautiful Carrie with me today, and I'm so excited to chat with you, girl. So tell us a little bit about yourself and what's going on with you right now. And are you cold?

Yes, it is. It is 6 degrees here today. Definitely cold and no snow. It's just a bitter 6.

Awesome. Yeah. Where the air hits your face and you're like, I wish, you Yeah.

Yeah.

Like, well, I know it starts to turn a corner here as we head into the last-ish month of winter, but in the meantime, you're a full-time nurse. You're doing all the things. Yes.

So I am a full-time nurse. Um, I've been a nurse for 12, almost 13 years. Um, I just got a promotion to clinic administrator, so I'm now running the clinic.

Yay, thanks. So awesome.

I work, um, 5 days a week and 40+ hours a week as a nurse. Um, doing that and then travel, um, on the side for—

Love it. Yeah, I love it. So tell us how you got into travel. I know that you didn't have a lot of travel experience prior to diving in.

Yes. So. I was, I don't know if I would say sheltered, but my mom didn't really like to travel much and we always like, she likes the beach, so that's where we always went. But it was the same beach, you know, my aunt lived there growing up. So, you know, whatever convenience. And it's not like these days where people take their kids traveling. Out of high school, got with my ex-husband. And was with him for 12 years and he was basically a stick in the mud. And it was never the right time to do anything. To go on vacation? No, it's not the right time. To buy a house? It's not the right time. To get married? Like, we didn't ever, in 12 years, we went on 2 vacations together and one of them was with his work. So—

Not a vacation.

Yeah.

That's not the definition of vacation.

Right. So anyways, we never did anything until I met, well, until me and my current husband got together. Very adventurous.

You guys have lived all over now and done all these crazy things. Tell us more.

Yes. So, um, Scott, he, when we started talking and, you know, getting to know each other, whatever, dating, I guess he was an aerial photographer. So he is, got a. Degree in GIS, geographical information, something. I don't know what the S is.

Sounds very smart and fancy.

Yep. It's mapmaking and surveying and different things like that.

Oh, okay.

So anyways, he was doing aerial photography for this company and he was basically all over the country. He lived in Canada for like months, um, and would just go up in a plane and take pictures and then make maps of them. And this was, I don't know. So anyways, when he wanted to get more serious, he couldn't be traveling. So he moved close and then we, the first trip we went together was to Alaska to visit a friend of his. And I just, I don't know, fell in love with traveling. I mean, Alaska was out of this world beautiful and I was just in awe.

Mm-hmm.

And as soon as we got back from Alaska, we booked a trip to Costa Rica to visit our other friends.

Costa Rica is— we talked about Costa Rica a couple episodes ago. Awesome. It's incredible.

I love Costa Rica and our friends have lived there for, I think almost 10 years we came up with the other day. They just picked up, sold all their stuff, picked up and took their dog down there and moved and they haven't looked back since.

So. I have a girlfriend whose parents did that. For retirement. And I just thought that was so cool. So they go to Costa Rica now all the time. Yes, definitely one of those magical places on earth.

Oh my God. Oh my God. It was, it was so cool. So like, yeah. And you just are in awe of everything around you and you're like, well, this is not, I don't know.

I don't know.

I just never thought all of these things were in our world and you could see it. You know, I don't know, growing up you just saw things on TV. That's just TV. Like, that's not real stuff. And then you start seeing it. And so it was just so amazing. So then we came back, we booked a trip to Mexico to visit my friend in Mexico. Um, and then in 2021, was having a change in my nursing job. Uh, it was October. decided then, and Scott had been trying to get me to like move and go on the road and do other things, but I didn't want to. So.

Where were you guys living at that time?

In Florida. This is when we lived in Bradenton.

We had Anna Maria in common.

Yes.

So this guy lived in Bradenton. Yes.

So, and he actually wanted us to really move to Costa Rica, but I was way too scared and Mm-hmm. You know, I was not, I had never moved away before, like away from my hometown.

Right.

Nothing like that. So I was way too scared to move to Costa Rica. So we picked up and moved 8 hours south to Bradenton, Florida, and lived there for 3 years. And so, which is lovely, the beach is beautiful, but after a while we just called it ocean locked because It is ocean locked there. Yes.

Especially that area.

So to travel to do things, you had to like travel 12 hours, you know, 8, 12 hours to do stuff.

So, and no nonstop. We don't have any nonstop unless it's to the Caribbean. And even then you kind of have to go, right, Orlando to get more options. Yeah.

So anyhow, at the end of 2021, I said, fuck it. I worked. Selling our stuff. We wanted to buy an RV, but we kind of did this on a whim and the RV idea didn't work out. But, um, we sold most of all of our stuff. We put some of it in a storage, um, thing. After 2 days after Christmas in 2021, we packed up our Jeep Cherokee with our 2 cats and left Georgia. And traveled 4 and a half months, um, across South US.

Wow. Oregon.

And so we lived the entire month of April in Oregon. And along the way we did 18 national parks. There was like 12 states, 13 states.

Wow.

So yeah.

Yeah. Oh my gosh. You've done so much of the US. It's like, yeah. I think people do forget sometimes how spectacular the US is. Like, yes, there's so much to see. There's so much different topography.

Oh my God.

Everything you, uh, you know, beautiful lakes, mountains, oceans.

Yes.

Desert. Like really covers the spectrum on diverse areas. I bet, especially if you didn't travel a lot as a kid.

No. Yes. And we lived in Seattle for 6 months, which I absolutely loved. God hated it, but I just loved it because it was just a beautiful city, like on the water and all the hills and things like that. I mean, there was some terrible things about it, but we lived in Seattle for 6 months and then we were supposed to, um, take mid-October to Thanksgiving to travel back from Seattle to Georgia, hitting, you know, Montana and some of those other places. Well, we found out right before we left Seattle that Scott's dad fell and hit his head and was in the hospital. So we did like a quick fly home trip to see how he was doing. Um, he was doing okay. So we flew back home, packed our stuff up. We were going to continue on, but then as we continued on, he didn't progress so well. So we kind of just skedaddled. We did. And so I guess like we got home November 1st or something.

So wait, when did you decide like, okay, I've done all this traveling, I've been in a lot of new places, I can, I wanna make some extra money. Like what was the decision-making process like for you before joining a travel agency?

For the trip to Costa Rica and to Alaska, like I poured my heart into everything and planned it. All the stuff, researched all the things, did the same thing basically all across the US. Like I wanted to know everything about everything, learn about it. I want to know all the things. What are we gonna do? Have a backup plan. And so when I was working in Seattle, cuz I was working as a travel nurse during those 6 months and my coworkers, you know, were like, girl, this, this is, you need to do something with this. I would totally take a trip that you plan. And so I was like, is that a thing?

What do you mean?

And she's like, I don't know. Like, aren't travel agents a thing? I don't know. I have no idea. So I love it. Anyways, I had just happened to be on LinkedIn one day cuz we were transitioning and I needed a new nursing job anyway. I was just on LinkedIn, but happened to find, um, an, a LinkedIn ad for a travel agent with this MLM host agency.

I mean, a couple of the other guests we've had, same situation, like started Googling and so the ads pops up and—

Yeah.

So interesting how, uh, their marketing has really hit the mainstream. Sometimes the first and only place you land. You said in your survey that you were at 80/20 commission split, but there really wasn't a whole lot of training beyond just getting as many certifications as possible. Is that kind of how it felt? What was that type of messaging like?

She, you get on, you sign on with them and she is like, okay, so I am your mentor, but she is also a mentor of like thousands of people because everybody she signs on, she's a mentor of. I did not know that. So it's like a pain in the ass to ask questions. Um, yeah. And they pawn you off on somebody else, but that somebody else Also has thousands of people. Like, it was crazy. And so to make invoices, like, they don't give you a CRM. You're not accessed to a CRM. So I don't— like, she says, watch these videos from this girl that works with us that made some videos. And so it's get on Google Docs and make an invoice. And this is how you make your proposal on Google Docs and you just Cut and paste some pictures and you put a little whatever in to make a cruise proposal. You like just do, oh my God, it was like the craziest thing. To get a credit card authorization, you need to send them this form and they have to print it. Like it was literally like 1990, print it out. They have to send you a photo of their credit card. Front and back, like it was nuts. And so, yeah, I, it—

Okay. So this is interesting. I will say I've heard almost the polar opposite of this too, like where there was zero guidance, like no Google Doc, no credit card authorization. So I mean, it seems like there's just a lot of inconsistency with these brands. I don't want, we're not going to name names, but we just want The listeners to be really cognizant. And really the more I do these episodes, the more I realize just how little research and how little time travel advisors spend educating themselves before signing on somewhere.

Yes. And honestly, the only reason I think I got that little bit of training that I had was because the mentor that I had, this was one of her like mentees and she made how-to videos because like within this post it was like your mentor was in a group and you were in the Unicorn Kitten group or whatever it was. And everybody in this group, you had certain mentors and then these people were below that and then these people.

Were you then also encouraged to become a mentor?

Yes.

Oh God. Okay.

So that was—

Nope. I'm not ready for that. No offense, Keri, but no, I've been a travel advisor right now for 2 years.

Yeah, exactly.

One of the things you said though was that they just told you to go get every single certification so that you could sell as many types of vacations as possible that come your way. So how much time did you spend Getting quote unquote certified.

She sent a spreadsheet of like all of the, um, oh, I re— just recently deleted that thing. I wish I would've kept it.

We really need a copy. I know.

But it was a whole spreadsheet and it would be like destination after, like all the destinations. I mean, just all the way down and all the trainings you could do for whatever it would link there. And then all the cruise lines, all the trainings, all Disney, all Universal, they said get as many as you can and post them everywhere, all over your website. Every time you get one, post it to your group, post it to your whatever. Tell everybody that you're now a specialist in this place. I honestly thought after I did all of these trainings, I'm now a specialist in these places.

How do you feel in hindsight? Like looking back on that time, I mean, so glad you took these trainings. Don't misunderstand me. I mean, part of what we do is take destination trainings. And certifications. It's part of the training. But how do you feel about calling yourself an expert or certified or whatever after a couple of trainings after you like now have had where you've moved forward? Like, how do you look at that time? What did you take away from it?

I honestly spent a lot of time doing things like I should have been doing other things instead of all of those trainings right then, because honestly, like I've got a notebook of all of the notes that I took from them, but like, you don't retain that information after you're just learning this and this and this and this. And I didn't have any kind of any workflow in place. There was nothing in place to do anything. So if somebody contacted me, I would, okay, sure. And then you just flounder and you're like, sure, let me just learn the certification on this place real quick. So you learn that certification and you're like, uh-huh.

Yep.

And then you make them this quote with 3 to 5 hotels and send it to 'em.

And then they don't book. So many options.

And then they won't book. And then it's, it was just a mess. And all of this is right after my husband's dad passed away.

So sorry about Scott's dad.

Thank you. So we were living with his mom. I was trying to do this. I was also trying to find a nursing job because Scott wasn't working. I mean, he couldn't, he was in no shape to work. I can't not work. Like we have to have money. I mean, yes, we're living with his mom, but that doesn't, you know, so I was trying to get money this way. Also trying to find a nursing job. I was always on the computer doing stupid shit. Stupid, stupid shit.

I'm sorry, Carrie.

Yes.

Yes. Sounds exhausting. Like even you talking about it and rehashing it right now, it seems like it's elevating your blood pressure so much. Oh my God.

Yes.

Let's just like bring it back a little bit because I know you guys have been through it and after being on the road and having to thwart your plans and, and come home to be with family, I know that that's very stressful. Those transitions are not easy. So you didn't give up though. What made you decide like, I can do this, I want to do this, I just need a different way?

Well, I was like, this is my business. I started this, I want this, I'm, I, I want this to succeed. And ultimately I started this with the goal of one day this being my ultimate, you know, my sole source of income and I don't have to be. A nurse full-time. I can, you know, so, and they don't tell you when you get into the travel industry that you are now a small business owner.

Yep.

I was determined not to be a failed small business owner. I want to succeed. Whatever I need to do, if that means I'm not taking clients for whatever, because I need to Focus on this and get my systems in place, then that's what I need to do. So.

And how did you decide you were gonna do that? I know that you and Scott were fighting a lot because of how much time you were spending on the computer doing these bullshit certifications. So how, what? Yeah. Are you just like, I have to set, you know, a hard reset? Was it?

Well, I somehow stumbled upon the Maximize group on Facebook.

I was Break that down.

Yes. Yes.

Well, and now it's so big.

Yes, me too. Because without that, I would not be here. So found the Maximize group and just all the advice and, you know, you need to get away from shitty hosts. There are better things. It's not how life is supposed to be as a travel agent. You're not supposed to be doing all of the things all of the time. I really was like, hmm, I didn't really do my research on a host. So let me do some research. And I dove into some hosts and looked up different ones and switched to a new host in October of last year.

So we like this host.

I do like this host. Um, I'm still at an 80/20 split because once you get $5,000 in commissions, Or calendar year. It bumps up, but I didn't do so much last year because I was just learning, relearning.

Yes. Well, and let's talk about that. A lot of the conversations I have are around fair commission splits. And one of the things that people seem to get real like up in a twist about is that, you know, I really do think 80/20 is the minimum we should be making. Obviously there are opportunities at 70/30. Sometimes there are leads involved and things like that, but I do think if you are a new travel agent Coming in and getting the support you need is worth it. If you are getting what you need from that host, sometimes it's worth 30%, but anything less, I get a little antsy in my pantsies. So I'm just not feeling it. But I do think having a tiered system that is reasonable, which is to me, $5,000 in commission is right around $50,000 in sales. You know, that's the average, right? Right. When I was Hard and soft numbers. Yeah. So you're just short a little bit.

Yeah.

And you can really look at this as Carrie, as like your second full year was another first chapter for you. You were resettling into a new place. You were relearning what you didn't really know the first time, and you had stumbled upon Maximize, which is like drinking from a water hose sometimes. The amount of stuff that's in there.

Yeah.

Can get really overwhelming. How did you navigate? Kind of the next steps of scaling.

At the same time I switched hosts, I invested in Propose to Close. So I did it at the same time and used that as my new business flow.

Yeah.

Workflow.

Propose to Close is my very best course.

Yes.

It's like having a favorite child and—

Yeah.

He's a—

yeah.

Love P2C. That workflow is legit. Yeah.

Well, that's what I used and did calendar control and did all of the things niche down. And so yes, I've been doing, I, I mean, I slip up here and there on, you know, but I've been doing a, a better job, I feel like, of managing the travel and my home life.

Has that helped with your nursing and your relationship?

I mean, I definitely, it is exponentially better and I don't feel like We fight near as much. So that is good. And I do feel like, yeah, because I would get in there and, you know, I'm ADHD. So, you know, if we get in the zone, like we're in the zone and you may be talking to me, sure. But I don't hear a fucking word you're saying because I'm doing this. And so I've tried to get better about, yes, I'm still doing this, but he's also here. I, need to talk to him and pay attention to him too. So I've tried to also balance that. Like I can work in the living room, but I still need to talk to him in between and not just be so—

Yeah.

Zoned in.

Okay, y'all, let's pause for a quick break. I need you to know you have never been trained in sales. Yeah, you might know how to use your CRM and book a preferred vendor or post on Instagram. But none of that teaches you how to close the damn sale. And if you're tired of hearing that travel sells itself while you watch prospects take your hard work and book elsewhere, it's time to fucking change that. I am introducing you to the Propose to Close Sales Course, a no-BS step-by-step program designed to help travel advisors like you weed out tire kickers, stop quoting in the DMs, and finally close sales without feeling pushy or salesy. This intensive 10-hour, 9-module course will teach you how to qualify prospects, send one fabulous proposal instead of 5, 10, 15, build real connections very quickly, and close the sale in under a week. Whether you're brand new or a veteran stuck in burnout, this course will give you the skills and confidence to transform Your travel business and your fucking life. So if you're ready to stop spinning those wheels and start running a business that works for you, head to my website to grab the Propose to Close sales course. And don't forget to check out the show notes for an exclusive coupon code. Okay, now back to the pod. I totally understand that. I also wanna address, we'll just keep making things hard for you today, Keri, but it, you know, you have a lot of really good things in your story that a lot of travel advisors can relate to. And it really does start with kind of being all over the place, not really knowing where you're gonna land, signing up with the wrong host, challenging to balance all the different things. But also you were often very discouraged when you would see new agents or any agents saying how busy they were or their inbox is overflowing. And I know just because we have known each other for a few months now and from our time in Momentum, which I loved so much. Like our full one-on-one was so good. I really feel like you have come so far in the imposter syndrome feeling and the comparison game, how you have turned the corner on comparison. Yeah.

Well, and I did when I first started, like everybody, oh, I have all these leads. I'm making all this money doing all these things. My inbox is overflowing. And when I first started out, I did have inquiry after inquiry, you know, but I would, Proposal after proposal, send whatever, and then they don't book. Then you never hear from them. I would get really discouraged when that would happen. Why, you know, why are they doing that? What's wrong with me? What, you know, all the things. After Propose to Close, I also took the Facebook course. I was like, I really do need to decide what I love and where I want to focus on because You can't know everything about everything. And yes, I'm gonna need to say no to people, but if I'm not excited about it, then why, why do I, why do it? Somebody bef— right before I did all this, somebody reached out to me to do Disney. I was like, not into it. I hate Disney. Don't like kids. Don't have kids. Hate Disney. So I was not into it, but I was like, I'm gonna have to do all this training to do this. My God.

Like, do not do Disney if you don't Like Disney.

I mean, oh my God, wait until you hear Faran's freaking podcast. And all of my Disney people now go to Faran, trust me.

Yes. Y'all got to be together and figure out what all of us do.

Yes. Yes.

Because it blows my mind, like the differential of your actual disdain for Disney and her like literal love for Disney.

Yes. And I love that cuz like my childhood got perverted. I know. My childhood best friend reached out to me and was like, I wanna do Disney. She's got a heap of kids. I was like, uh, no thank you. I'm gonna send you to Farren, so you have fun with her.

I mean, Farren will tell you. Well, yeah, Farren knows all the things. Yes. Yes. Incredible opportunity to build those relationships.

Really, after starting doing that, like I just felt like it gave me more confidence to do the things. That I like to do and that when I do have a client, I'll be more confident about this. You know, Costa Rica is, you know, definitely, um, a special spot. Belize. So I feel like Central America has kind of come into what I love. And then I do US destinations, you know, Alaska, Hawaii. I am super, super in love with Portugal and Iceland. Like those are my top 2 European destinations that I just love and wanna visit. I Just pouring my heart into those 2 destinations. And then I'll do—

are you in Elena's group? Elena has, Elena Christensen has an Icelandic group for us. And she's an Iceland expert and—

Oh my God.

No. She should come on the pod to talk about it, but she's amazing. Brilliant. We'll drop it in the show notes and I'll send it to you, Carrie.

Yes, please.

But she's amazing. And so if you're into, you know, freezing your ass off and going up to see the Northern Lights, this is where it's at.

Yeah.

I'm happy that you were able to in a very short time because having the tools and resources that just are not available through our hosts. And it's not that they're not trying. I do think a lot of hosts are trying, but there's just not this specific sales and marketing training that so many of us need because they're so hyper-focused on product, destinations, and meeting your BDMs, which are all incredibly important aspects. But if we don't focus on how to sell ourselves, our brand, and what we love, we're not ever gonna sell anything, which is why it's impossible to sell in the DMs. It's impossible to sell even something you've taken a certification in if you aren't passionate.

Yeah.

Right?

Like totally. And I feel like the last few vacations that I've sold that I have been niched in. The, these people have really loved it. They have, you know, I have, um, last people I had travel, or the last clients I had travel were in November. Um, and she has referred me 2 people already.

Where did she find you?

I actually worked with her at Zach's back in the day.

How did you reconnect?

We've been friends on Facebook and, um, yeah, so, and I think I've recently bumped into her when we, visit our hometown, like at a craft fair. I posted all my travel photos to my Facebook thing. So people, you know, following me for my travel stuff. But I did actually refer one of the clients that she referred me to wants a Greek vacation. So I referred her to Renee instead.

Okay. I wanna talk about this. Oh my gosh, this is so exciting. So for those of you who don't know, because I have not really addressed it on the pod, is in September I hosted my first Travel Advisor retreat called Momentum Retreat to, um, Costa Mujeres, Mexico. We went to Majestic. We also had a hurricane hit in the middle of the week, but luckily, which was a whole thing that I should be talking about.

Yeah.

Um, the first few days were fantastic. The women who attended Momentum Retreat have built some incredible relationships with each other. They all work at different hosts or agencies. They all have different specialties. Different ages, different lengths of time as travel agents. And what I saw happen there was like literal magic. And I'm just so happy. So Keri has addressed 2 of the other women who are on that trip that she's actually been referring business to. And I think we have this, this idea that the more we give and the more we don't gatekeep or that we don't hold on so tight to every single lead. I think this is such a great example, Carrie, of like realizing it, what it is you do and really wanna sell, and then knowing and having those connections to be able to refer out to someone who has similar training, right? Who believes in the same type of service product that they're going to be providing and who are passionate about their niche. I just, I have goosebumps right now.

Like, yes.

Yes. That's pretty cool that. You guys all are still connected and have those relationships beyond Momentum.

Yeah. Yeah.

I love that.

And I, I do, I love that I have somebody to refer to and I always tell the client, you know, please think of me if you wanna do something in my niche, but I want you in the best hands possible. And I don't know anything about grease and I don't wanna, like, I love grease, but I don't wanna deep dive into that. So I will hand you over to someone who knows that and Renee will take great care of you.

Renee is. That's really great. I mean, having lived in Europe and having all those personal experiences. That's so cool, Kari. And I'm proud of you because I'm sure at first when you started handing off leads, it might've felt like, oh shit.

Yeah.

I could have this client.

Yeah.

Realizing how challenging it is to do everything alongside being a full-time nurse. I know you guys like to travel.

Yes, definitely. And Scott, the first couple times I was like, well, somebody reached out about this. I told 'em no. It's like, are you sure? I was like, yeah, I don't wanna do that. I, yeah, you'll thank me. Like, no. So it's worked out.

I think he gets it too, having come to Momentum as your guest. Like, I, that was really enlightening and I love a supportive spouse partner because it is, if you could see my cat right now attacking the screen, like. He's below the video, but it's like I can't get him off my chest right now. I'm just glad that he was able to, you know, kind of witness why you also love this and seeing all the other advisors kind of come together and build those relationships. It's a really, it's a really cool environment that we have both in Maximize that has also then expanded.

Yes.

It doesn't feel as lonely, I think. For those who have those extra connections. Right, right.

I do feel like I have a, a better support group and a, a better community of people to reach out to and ask questions than— look at him. I love him. Big guy.

He's a big guy. He is a big guy. Okay. Well, I'm really excited about all of that and it just seems like, are you feeling more confident and better as you kind of move through? Those decisions as like the CEO of your business.

Yeah.

I'm making these decisions.

Yes, definitely.

I feel good about it.

Good. And I'm like, I'm the now feel like I am confident and I'm the CEO of Carry On Adventuring. And now I am like big badass boss bitch at my other job too. So I love it. Yay.

I'm happy for you. So yeah, I'm just really, really glad that We have been able to have this conversation because I think what you've brought to light is what so many travel advisors experience and they don't know how to talk about it. They don't know if they can talk about it.

Mm-hmm.

And really highlighting kind of the harder parts and the loneliness that I think comes along with being an advisor. And especially you and Scott's relationship is such a dynamic part of this because so many people don't talk about that piece of it. Like if you're a workaholic. Somebody is paying the price for that and it's usually the people closest to us. And, you know, as a recovering burnout survivor and working 60, 75, 80 hours a week, when my kids were small, I can completely relate because my husband especially got the brunt of that at that time. So I can relate to that so much. I'm very glad that you've been able to even take on a bigger role at work and still feel comfortable and confident enough. And I think one of the questions that maybe some of the listeners will have is, well, what do you tell your clients if you're working all day? Like, is what, what do you tell them?

I, I work another full-time job. I mean, I had a consultation the other day and she's like, what else do you do? I said, I work Monday through Friday, most 8 to 5. I have another job, so I will get to you. When I get to you, I mean, and when we had like, we had all this crazy stuff happen on Friday at work and I was supposed to get back to her and send her an email and I didn't get to it until like 10:00 PM. So she was probably already asleep, but I was like, hey, sorry, but my full-time job got crazy today. And you know, I didn't get a chance to do it until now. She was completely fine. She still paid my fee and we're continuing to work together.

I am obsessed with this because I think one of the big things that agents really worry about is what are our clients thinking? We won't know what they're thinking if we don't tell them the truth.

Right.

If we try to cover it up, hide it, you know, bull— you know, balance it with a, oh, I, I just made, you know, like don't tell the truth. I can't even lie on the fly right now. I can't even make something up instead as we're talking, but the idea behind What, how I was trained was you're just always in a meeting. And I'm like, I'm not in a meeting. My kid is fucking having a meltdown. Putting on his coat. Like, I don't have time to lie about this. And it's just, you know, to always come off as professional. And I'm putting that in quotes because I think there is just so much to be said for being fucking honest. To me, that is the most unprofessional thing you can do. Right.

Professionally.

Yes.

You can act.

Transparent. It makes us real humans. Yes.

I also have a life. Like, you know, work is not everybody's life. And even if travel was my full-time job, like you have a life, you have a family. There's things that you are gonna have to do. I cannot be at your beck and call 24/7. Your emergency is not necessarily my emergency, so we need to, you know, Set boundaries.

To manage those clients who are traveling and you are working during the day, because that is the other thing we hear from agents. I mean, let's be real, Keri. I don't know a single agent that doesn't do another job. And as someone who has always had 2 jobs and still does travel alongside coaching and course writing and podcasting, all the things. A lot of people, you know, my flexibility is a lot different than your flexibility, and I'm able to stop what I'm doing. If I had a call right now, I could be like, hey, Keri, we gotta go cuz I have a client stranded at the airport, but right, who might not be able to do that? So what does that look like for you?

Honestly, I haven't had that experience yet.

What's your plan, girl? We need to know.

I have somebody traveling in February, so we will see. Um, because now I really am the boss. Let's talk.

So what your plan is, because if it were, if we were coaching right now, I would tell you absolutely have a plan B. For them, have a pre-trip call so they know that, you know, you are going to be at work. However, maybe it's getting with another colleague who would be emergency only, or if they got insurance, there's probably a concierge phone number attached to their insurance. But what's like the worst case scenario? And then work it back from that.

Yeah.

And cuz that's I would say it's a rarity, knock on wood, that there would be the truest form of crazy emergency in our business. Now, this winter has been shit.

Mm-hmm. And the hurricane season also.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Definitely be thinking about it because I do think that that piece of the business has to have, you know, that service piece has to be there. But I do also believe in transparency and honesty, and I do think clients who are properly prepared can often handle the majority of things that may happen. But I also think with weather, we knew this winter storm was coming for like 3, 4, 5 days. So if something like that happens, you can always say, hey, I see that this weather situation is happening. And maybe at work you can balance having some extra time that day or ask somebody to help back you up even at your full-time job in case something happens.

Right.

Right. Right. I think it's a team effort. Team effort. But as far as 24/7, no, that is right. That's the lie they've been telling us since the very first day travel.

Yes.

I think that this has been awesome because I think it's like the real stuff that we experience. And so many of us work multiple positions and haven't had the proper training and I, right. I think this is gonna help a lot of people, so I'm excited about this. But yes, now I want to hear your top 3 pieces of advice that you would give an advisor who doesn't have a ton to invest, but like wants to step away from this particular episode and be like, I can go do this right now and it will change my business.

Ditch the intake form and—

Wait, wait, don't, don't keep going. Did you have an intake form?

Yes.

How detailed was it?

Oh my God. So detailed. And you wanna know how many hours I spent on all of those Google Forms? Like, yes, no.

The anxiety just went through the roof for you.

Ditch that thing and get on a call so they can see your face.

And— So not just a call, y'all.

A Zoom. Yeah.

Yep.

I get nervous and I get scared and I'm like, I don't know this person. I feel like it makes it so much better and I can get a better idea idea of what they want. You don't have to do so much back and forth with email, and you can find out if one, you really like this person, do you really wanna work with them, and are they serious? I am done with sending out these quotes and nobody books.

So, I mean, I have been coaching, officially coaching for 2 years, and yesterday I saw in a No intake form, no quote. And I was thinking, mm-mm. Are you—

no call, no quote, no proposal.

Every single time to come in and like give a Marcie moment anymore. But that's how I built Maximize was on the backs of these types of advi— this type of advice, because this is the advice we're given. Fill out an intake form. You guys, an intake form is like the beginning of a horrid tire kicking ghosting situation.

Yes.

They do not know how to fill out that form and you're planting ideas with each question and they're thinking, I have to know this answer, but you're supposed to advise them through each question, right? That we don't use a form to have a conversation.

Yeah.

And in fact, I have insane qualifying questionnaire guides included in Propose to Close and also in the Etsy store. Because I think part of the issue is y'all don't know exactly what questions to be asking to really get to know your client, to be able to truly qualify them. And so let me see, when someone says, I wanna go to Costa Rica and you're like, why? They're not even gonna be able to— well, because I heard it's beautiful. Well, it's also the most treacherous terrain. Are you okay driving 3 hours into the volcano area? Because, and, and on the most unpaved Curvy, right? Mudslide roads. Because the very first time I realized that's what it was like in Costa Rica, I was like, holy shit. And so you have to be able to match someone up and them saying, I wanna go to Aruba for $2,500 because you put Aruba as an option next to the possibility of even talking to them about $2,500.

Right.

A bad idea.

Get oh terrible, terrible.

You ditch the intake form.

How well are you doing? Well, honestly, I feel like I've actually closed all of the inquiries that I've had since ditching the intake form. And you don't get ghost people like somebody may say I'm not ready for this now, but at least. If you've known and you haven't done any work, because I literally might have booked like 3 out of 10 vacations on an intake form and I would do all of the work and send over a proposal, like, you know, and do all of this stuff and then not have anybody book. And so then I've wasted all of that time and all of those hours on clients that haven't booked when I have clients that have booked and then you— Left them hanging to dry. So yeah. Yeah.

I love this. Okay. What's your next one?

The next one was niche down. Find out what you love and—

The freest thing you could do. Yes. You are not everybody's TA.

You do not have to sell everything to everybody. You cannot get 1,000 certifications and know all of the stuff and be good at it. So if you want to be a good TA, find what you love and only do that.

Yeah, I have no comment. That is like a mic drop moment and I wish we were done with that.

Yes. The third one is workflow. Please find a workflow because listen, I floundered. I'm like, I don't know what email do you send now to who knows? I don't even know what I did for my first year. It was just not okay. And every type, like cruises have one type of workflow and all-inclusives and FITs, like everything in each location, like it all has a different workflow and you need to get it organized and just put that into place.

A workflow, you guys, is a step-by-step system that from the time that you start working with somebody To the time that they return home, there are about 75 things like that you have to do. And if you are sitting there going, I only do 3 things, we have a huge problem.

So like, we're lost.

With this, Propose to Close goes with this and Close to Home. Now, this is not just me saying, go take these courses. You really can create your own workflow. It is a procedure that you do. So if you sit down with it, And what Kari is saying, just get a Google Doc out, get an Excel sheet out, and step 1, step 2, step 3, what are you doing? You probably have a workflow of some kind, but maybe there are holes, you know? And so use the resources available to you at your host. If you have a mentor, talk to them about this because if you don't have a workflow, that is when Mm-hmm. mispayments happen. That is when mistakes happen. That is when things get neglected. Expensive.

And yeah. And if you're anything like me, it needs to be like literally like you need to send this, like you have enclosed, like follow up 24 hours later. You need to do this like literally because my brain and I'm like, sure, I'll contact them tomorrow. And then tomorrow comes and 8:00 PM and I was like, fuck, I was supposed to contact that person today and I didn't. And that was cuz I didn't have work done.

What tool do you use to remind yourself?

Um, so I have, I have Trello and I was using Trello, but I just recently revamped my Google Calendar and now Trello and Google Calendar and all my tasks. I have like put them all in there because I need to do all like work tasks and stuff too. So like, oh, you know, every week you have these things and so I've I've put it all in my Google Calendar with color codes and that's my new thing.

My favorite thing about the calendar, looking at all the different colors. Now sometimes it makes me sick to my stomach, but sometimes I'm just like, thank God. And here's the other thing that Carrie just said that is so incredible. The 2 tools that she's using are free. The Google Calendar is free and the Trello, the base package, you can have up to 10 work boards. And I know Trello is very overwhelming at first. But if Carrie and I, ADHD queens of America, can figure out Trello, that actually is so ADHD friendly because you could literally pour yourself into it and learn everything. It has power-ups, it has due dates, it has color coding. You can make the background pretty.

You can have as many things as you want. Yeah.

So it's, it's a great tool if you are willing to learn how to use it, because that is the other thing about what? We have access to as advisors. There are so many different tools. Some of them cost some money and some of them don't. And I'm a big believer in keeping your bottom line low. And if you do not have 200 clients, I don't necessarily think a CRM is the answer. Like you can keep track of that in a Google spreadsheet. There are different ways to keep your bottom line low. And I love that the tools you're even using are super affordable. Slash free and keeping you in check with everything you have to do for each client.

Yes.

That's fantastic. Okay, great. Thank you so much for that. Now we like to end on like, you know, cuz I'm the pot stirrer and everybody thinks I'm just like whatever over here, uh, stirring it up. And so I'm asking my podcast guests to stir it up a little bit and tell me your unpopular travel advisor opinion about our industry.

Um, that we are not useful, that there's no, like, why would you use them? You can book everything online. You know, I just, when I see in all these travel groups and it's like, why would you book with a travel advisor? I don't see the benefit of working with a travel advisor. I don't, you know, you can just go to Expedia, you can go to Costco, you can do all these things. And yeah, like we are still here and we are still very useful and, um, very beneficial.

Well, then AI. Because let's just talk about the fact that the other day I was messing around on AI and it had not been updated since 2021, the information that they had on that destination.

Wow. Yeah.

And so a lot of people are using AI and Google, um, just typing in a question, which love, don't stop using Google, but definitely make sure you cross-reference with the tourist board because it was giving the worst information about Turks and Caicos and their requirements. And I was like, this is old. Because I mean, right, I am a Turks and Caicos specialist and I know you haven't had to have a COVID test since 2021. And the information that came out onto the AI on Google was like, must fill out a COVID form, da da da. And then like, no, I don't think so. Right. And so be so conscientious of that because, and when you see that as a travel advisor, do not get imposter syndrome. Don't believe what you read that nobody needs you. Like, right, we are more needed now than ever because of AI, because of online tour operators. And some of the stuff we see as travel advisors is completely fake. Like, yeah, don't exist. So some people will call us and be like, oh, I saw this resort with 14 water slides down the side of a mountain. And I'm like, that's not real. That doesn't exist. Not only are we useful, we are Valuable. And so we're worth the fees, we're worth whatever you wanna charge for your time. I'm so happy for you, Carrie, because I know that you were thinking about throwing in the towel.

So, yes.

So glad.

Yep. I thought about it quite a few times. You know, I was like, I've invested so much time and so much money into this already. This is my business. This is me. I want to be Carrie on Adventuring, so I'm, I'm gonna keep going.

And you are. I'm so happy that you joined us today. Thank you so much. I know people are gonna love this episode because it's so in touch with like the real shit that we go through as travel advisors, especially in the first 2 years. And girl, you are going to blow it up. Here she is. Yes. Yes. So thank you so much, Carrie. I hope you have a really good rest of your day.

Thanks for having me.

Bye. That's a wrap on today's episode, friend. Thanks for hanging out with me again on the No BS Travel Advisor Podcast. I hope you're leaving this episode feeling fired up, inspired, and ready to take back control of your business. And let's be honest, your fucking life. If today's episode hit home, do me a favor and share it with your fellow travel advisors who need to hear this, and don't forget to leave a review. Your support means the world and helps me reach more badass advisors like you. And hey, if you've got a story to share or some no-BS advice of your own, you've taken a course or two of mine, maybe you've been a coaching client, I want to hear from you. Head to my website to apply to be a guest. I'd love to feature you on an upcoming episode. Until then, you fucking got this. Keep Keep being bold, keep being unapologetic, and keep building the business you fucking deserve. This is Marcy Munsterman signing off with zero fluff and a whole lot of heart.