Ulta Beauty’s Karla Davis on Loyalty, Brand Growth & Beauty Experience

Up today, we're going to be speaking with Carla Davis, Vice President of Integrated Marketing and Media at Ulta Beauty. Carla is an award-winning global marketing executive who was named to American Advertising Federation's Hall of Achievement in 2020. Carla, how are you today? Great to see you.

I am doing well. It's great to see you as well, Matt.

Thanks so much for joining. Really excited to dive in here. You know, I was doing a lot of research on your background, and one thing that stuck out right away is that you actually got into the marketing field in terms of your interest level at quite an early age from the movie Boomerang. So tell us about that and what that has to do with your initial interest.

Oh my gosh, you so went into the crates. I'm glad you found that story. So yeah, like I tend to talk about the opportunity that to come into marketing really came through the passion of that movie. So for those that are not familiar with Boomerang, It is a movie in the '90s. It was Robin Givens and Eddie Murphy, and they had this— and Halle Berry had this— yeah, like love triangle. But the more interesting thing to me, exactly to your point, was that they worked in a marketing agency and they were doing a beauty brand, a fragrance brand, Strangé, if you remember that. And of course, and that is what just sparked to me. I was like, I don't know what that work is. I don't know what you call it, but I love this idea of like bringing identity and emotion to marketing and bringing things to life. And I think even more so, like, I saw people that looked like me that were doing this, right? Right. And so it just made it feel super attainable and like, and something that I could do. And, and so that's what got me off and running. So, yeah.

And was the world of, of beauty and fashion something that I guess always interested you, just generally speaking, in terms of how you spent your free time?

You're exactly right. Like, I always was already a beauty gal. Like, ironically, my mom had a, a clothing boutique as I was growing up, and I was one of the little models. Now, I'll tell you that this was like grown women clothing. And so it probably was interesting for me to be wearing it, but it had always been a part of my world. And so seeing how that could manifest into an actual job every day, like really kind of became a passion and a focus for a career.

Yeah. And as most often is the case, that path that maybe you had dreamed for yourself growing up, it doesn't always work out quite that way, at least not initially. And in your case, it's not like you went right out of college to go join a beauty company. You spent a good deal of time at both Pepsi and Kraft companies in the packaged goods and food space. 2 companies that we work with and know well. How did you end up working for companies like that and what were some of the core learnings you had in the earlier stages of your career?

Yeah, no, you're exactly right. Like, I definitely took a meandering path of it to get ultimately to the beauty space, but it's been such a great journey in service of like learning what I needed to ultimately come into the space. So the way I got into it actually was right out of undergrad, which is fairly uncommon, where Johnson Johnson actually had a, the first level program they ever did of marketing leadership development program. And it was bringing in undergrads into programs and into teams that were typically like MBA started, but then they overlaid for you a bit of a supercharged MBA. So it was like 6 months in a business. You go out for 3 weeks, you take some classes at, at a local university, and then you'd come back into the business. And so it really was a learn and, and try things, learn and experience all the way through. So So that's what really got me started and then gave me the opportunity to get some of that, you know, more traditional foundational marketing acumen that I could build on, especially going to places like a PepsiCo where you get a chance to do so much more brand building type of work and you learn how to build big, amazing brands and make them have connection with consumers. And so that's what's been great about working in food is they know how to take something that you might not have cared about in a lot of places and make you care. And that is something that like—

bananas, just everyday household items, right?

Like, if I can make you love oatmeal, I can make you love anything. And I think that that's what I took away from that experience, for sure.

Yeah, a lot of people who we've interviewed on the Speed of Culture podcast have gotten starts at places like PepsiCo or Procter Gamble. And, you know, it's a common theme that they really learn the core discipline of marketing, of brand building, and then they'll go on and do something slightly more specialized. But it's that core experience, almost like an extension of your college experience, to really prepare you for what's next. Yeah. And then in 2015, which is, you know, is, seems like it must seem like a world away for you at this point here in 2023, you joined Ulta. I was just looking at Ulta's growth and they were about a third of the size in terms of revenue, you know, back then when you joined them, where they were today. So I imagine you've seen just tremendous change and growth firsthand. You had a front row seat to it over your span at Ulta. What, what led you to decide to land at Ulta? And, you know, tell us about sort of how you got started out there.

Absolutely. Yeah. And it has been such an amazing journey. Like the last 8 years have felt like 3 different companies because of it, but all in good ways, right? Like growing on itself. And so when I think about how I got in, so actually, you know, the spirit, the what's kind of core to the way I think of growing my career is connections and networks. And that's what got me to Ulta Beauty. I actually had a connection with— so my previous boss, Shelley Haas, she actually used to work with me at Quaker. And when she moved over to Ulta Beauty, she'd been there for about 6 months and she said, hey, I'm coming over to this little place here. We've been looking to build some brand, wanted to see if you would be interested. And because of the relationship we had there, I said, yeah, let's try it together. And so when we came over, there was no brand strategy, brand management team. It was essentially creative services because they've got an amazing guest, you know, like experience from an in-store needing to really ensure that like, you know, how we're building the guest experience. There was merchandising, which is the, you know, business part of it, but what the brand of Ulta Beauty was supposed to be and how that manifests across everything had never been built before.

And so— which is completely different than where you were prior, right? Exactly. Pepsi, Kraft, these are, you know, expert brand builders. And here you are entering a place where it really— there was nothing created at that point, right?

You are exactly right. It was like I had to plot it, right? And build it and even remember some things of like, how do you do some of the fundamentals that had always been in place? But it gave us a chance to really put our fingerprints on it. And it's been an amazing ride to your point, like to be able to continue to grow the business.

So if you recall, like what were the first steps that you did to help kind of establish the brand equity pillars and the original direction of what Ulta would eventually be in the minds of consumers?

Absolutely. So I think the first thing was to really understand what makes Ulta Beauty the place that it was and that it could be. And really going back to what was that foundational insight, consumer insight that made the business work. Because even when we got there, while it it didn't have some of these elements as from a functional perspective, it was doing really well as a business. And it's because the insight at the base of Ulta Beauty is that there should be places that look like, especially from a beauty category perspective, that look like the way that a beauty bag looks, a person's beauty bag, right? It has all these different categories in it. It has high, like things you get at department store, but it also has things that are in a Walgreens, right? Like there was no place that you could do that. And those that built it, actually some really smart guys from Osco Drug, said, why not? And really were at that place of like, we can be category changers by saying, why shouldn't there be a place that looks like this?

So their merchandising strategy was built sort of on the habit of the consumer, where they know the consumer shouldn't have to go to a high-end store and a drugstore and all these different places to fill their beauty bag. Let's basically be who they want the category to be and bring it all to them in a convenient way.

All things beauty, all in one place. So that's what we had to do was go back to that, that consumer insight, really crystallize it into what is that benefit that they were ultimately portraying? And then how do we now communicate that in a really meaningful and elevated emotional way? Because it's like, yes, we've got this great functional benefit that does have emotion to it. Let's bring it to life. Sure. That's what we needed to start to do.

And in addition, often when companies don't have a brand strategy, they lacked they're in— they lack their ideal customer profile. They don't really know who they're selling to because they don't have a brand. Did you find that there was a core view of who the core consumer was at that point, or is that something that you had to quickly establish after you joined?

Yeah, I mean, I would give a ton of credit to the merchandising team that they did have a thought on who they were building their business for. And again, like I said, the business was doing really well. What we did recognize was there was an opportunity to touch more people. Right? And to really say that, hey, if we are talking to a larger group, or if we elevate the way that we're talking, we can actually get this group, get this group and this group that we haven't already gotten. And that's where the growth— and truly where the growth has come from— is expanding on that consumer base pretty significantly over the last 8 years.

So how would you define that consumer base today?

Yeah, so now it's gotten younger, it's gotten more diverse, right? It's gotten into kind of beauty-loving people that were at the core there, but really we could harness more of them when we really started elevating what is this benefit that we bring that's so unique in the marketplace. And so while we would have had a decent amount of that in the base, I think we were able to like, like explode those that are a part of the base and bring in more when we could really say like, no, if you like beauty, this is the place to be for beauty, right? In a really meaningful way. Mm-hmm.

And since you've been there, on top of establishing a brand, you've obviously been able to leverage a lot of different tactics that have helped you continue to build the brand, expand the business, drive the growth, one of which is the loyalty program, which I, you know, I couldn't believe you have 38 million members in your loyalty program.

I will actually tell you it's now 40 million. We are larger than the country of Canada. Larger than the country of Canada. Just so you know.

So, so how does— how do you look at loyalty and why has that been such a huge driver of of the company's growth over time?

Yeah, great question. So first, I think, you know, we as Ulta Beauty think of loyalty as an effort for all of us. It's not just a program, it's what we're trying to build with the guests. So yes, we have a loyalty program like the Ultimate Rewards where there is a point system that you can build, but we are really looking at all of our touchpoints on how we build loyalty through a full guest experience. And so I think those are the things that are really unique to us because it's one, it's completely embedded in how our associates think about the guest and talk about like why they should be connected to Ulta Beauty. So it's so embedded in how they work. When we do our marketing, we're talking about like the emotional benefits of Ulta Beauty, but we're also talking about and look at these great ways that you can get more beauty because essentially our loyalty program is this idea of how beauty loves you back because you can use your dollars that you spent with us to get anything that you want with beauty. And so that prospect of like, yes, shopping with you, engaging with you gives me an opportunity to engage even more with beauty has been incredibly sticky with our guests and has been what has tremendously grown that business and that loyalty program year over year over year.

Absolutely. And one, one thing that I think a lot of marketers are salivating over these days is first-party data. And I imagine your ability to harness and aggregate that much first-party data from your consumers has really been a huge boost to all of your other marketing efforts that you're doing outside of the store.

Yeah, we would absolutely say that like our 3 main drivers of our business are our people, our brand, and our data. And when you have that amount of data at your disposal and can get smarter and smarter about using it, you are at an advantage in the marketplace. And we're really excited to keep building that.

And another thing that I know Ulta has leaned into pretty heavily is your retail media network. And it's obviously a huge trend that's going on right now where a lot of CPG manufacturers are now saying, well, we should put more money into retail media because it's paying off. It's closer down the funnel, especially in this, you know, turbulent economic environment. How has the retail media network benefited your, your partners and why is that an important part of your overall strategy?

Yeah, we are really excited about our retail media network, which we call Ubimedia, and it has been such a build up. It's been We're going to do that one over. Okay. I'm pausing. Exactly. So we are so excited about our retail media network, which we call Ubimedia, and it is where we really take— harness the data with consumer insight that really drives that like right at purchase opportunity for our brands. And what we found with it is you're exactly right. When we think of how brands are building their business, they continue to want to get closer and closer to the point of purchase.. And there are very few ways that they can do that outside of connecting with a retailer like ourselves that has the amount of data that we have in service of ensuring that those dollars are working really, really hard for them. And not just working hard and being placed out there, but being actually able to understand what it's done for you. And that is one of the, you know, game changers when we think about how we build our brand, which is at the head and at the heart. It's like you got to build a brand, but at the end of the day, you got to know how you are driving it from a performance, attribution, it's everything, right? And so it's got to be the one-two. It can't be either or. And this is what it gives our brand partners the opportunity to do.

So just to double-click on the retail media network. So, so the way I'm envisioning it for, for your business is that you have essentially in-store placement of media as well as online placement of media for your brand partners who can actually come in and get more exposure and awareness of what they're selling at the point of purchase, essentially.

So we essentially have it online currently. So we're about a year and a half in. So it's really focused mostly in our digital spaces. So it's how you can— got it— you know, on-site. But there's also off-site because of a lot of our connections in paid social and in display. We actually can leverage our data for brands into those spaces as well.

That's where that loyalty data fits in. So you have a network of 40 million consumers you can reach anywhere, and that gives you sort of an advantage to allow your partners to say you can reach them anywhere too. We know more about them than anybody. And that, and that's incredibly strong. And has the role of just privacy and everything that's happening with Apple, like, how has that impacted the way that you look at that moving forward?

Yeah, I think the changes in the industry are actually going to make our proposition stronger because we don't have to worry about the fact that there's this degradation that's happening. And our guests and our brands can trust that when we are connecting you to each other, it's because you've asked for it or you're, you know, it's in the connection. Right. Exactly. Permission. Absolutely.

And I know that you've done a lot about content on the content space as well. Building a content engine, you've said, is everything to us as a business. I'm a huge believer in content marketing. I always have been. How do you, how do you look at content? What gives you sort of the inspiration to understand which content to lean into, what's working, etc.?

Yeah. So we, I mean, we talk about content is king, it's content is queen and all other royalty around here because it's what makes a brand matter to consumers, right? It's how you weave yourself into their lives. Into their moments, not into your moments in an evergreen kind of way. So that's a high level how we think about it. And so the way that we do that is a couple of things. So first, I think about where we have to ensure that we understand their media habits and what they're trying to do at what points, right? The consumer journey conversation is absolutely a part of this because building content that matters and being a brand that matters means you're doing it at a place where they care to hear about it, right? And you understand where to not put it. And so what is the content that they're looking for when they're exploring or looking to discover when they're in a different place of like, all right, I'm just trying to find this thing and how do you make it easy for me to find the thing? And so that's a lot of how we look at it is across the journey, what is the consumer trying to accomplish at those different moments? And then how do we connect not just at the like, here's a product, but like how do we tell a full solution at those moments? So we think about like they're not coming for always for like, how do I find that concealer? They're coming for prom. Right? They're coming for a full look, right? And so it's ensuring that we're also being as additive in those moments and adding value when we're talking about it and not just kind of coming at it as a one-off idea for them.

Absolutely. And I know that you've also worked on some pretty big campaigns. Last year, you were behind the Beauty and campaign that you launched, which seemed like it was a massive undertaking for the business just because of how many tentacles it had. Talk to us about how a campaign like that comes together, why big campaigns are still super important and, you know, what, what the campaigns accomplish for the business.

Absolutely. So there are so many reasons why those brand, those big brand moments still matter, because consumers will tell us, they probably told you too, that 85% of brands could go away and they wouldn't care. Right. And so there is definitely this need to seed a reason to be in consumers' lives, and it's got to be connected to their insight on them. And for us, it's a human truth. And so the Beauty and campaign kind of comes out, comes out of a couple of different truths. It's one, we understand that beauty has some very real power in people's lives, right? Like we've learned it even more during the pandemic where people are at home and it's like the only thing I can do right now is like wash my hair and it makes me feel better about myself at the moment. Like it's self-care. It's my one way that I can take care of myself. We also know that it helps people express themselves and we know that it's a way that people connect to each other. Right. And so we know that beauty has beauty is such an expansive role in our lives. That's what's at the core of this idea of like Beauty and. Let's celebrate the expansive role that it has in our lives and that it can have even more so in our lives. And so out of that came so many great things. It was stating that and creating a rallying cry around it, but it's also like showing it in very relatable ways. So we had an amazing partnership with TikTok for Good, actually one of their first partners, to really say like, hey, let's talk about some of the intersectionalities that live in beauty in ways that haven't often been talked about like, let's talk about men and makeup because it doesn't have to feel weird or different. Let's talk about the fact that like sometimes it's beauty and fitness. So we had a, the world champion deadlifter in our ad and then talking to her about like how she uses beauty as part of her like prepping, right? Because these things don't have to be mutually exclusive. And so it really was a pressuring across so many channels and so many conversations on why beauty does have this expansive force. And so you should both feel good about it and recognize that you can use it in all these different ways.

Absolutely. Sounds amazing. And I can see why that was very impactful to your consumer base. So let's shift gears a little bit and talk about just the industry as a whole. So, you know, you mentioned the pandemic and obviously that had a profound impact on every industry, including the beauty industry. We saw a massive shift, obviously, to e-commerce during that, which in a lot of ways has reverted back back to the normal kind of growth trajectory. First and foremost, in terms of your business, I know the majority of your sales still come from retail, if that's, if that's correct. Uh, it's about 80, about 80%. Um, so do you see that shifting over time? And I also know that in terms of the channel strategy, you've had quite a lot of growth in, in BOPUS, buy online, pick up in store, which a lot of brands have had a lot of success with. So how are you looking at the overall channel strategy for the business with, especially as you, you know, gear towards more younger consumers moving forward?

Absolutely. I think the pandemic just supercharged what was going to be the way of the future. And it's that consumers want to be able to engage with you wherever they want to, whenever they want to, and however they want to. We used to jokingly say, I don't go shopping, shopping comes to me, right? It's just like it is in the flow of my life. And so that is something that we have completely taken to heart and really activated across all the different ways that we show. So to your point, first and foremost, we still know that the in-store experience does matter. It has reverted right from being all online to back in store because especially— Absolutely. There still is a touch, feel, sensorial dynamic that has been still hard to replicate, even though we have some really interesting tech to support it, but it's hard to fully replicate. So we do still believe that the in-store experience will absolutely be fundamental to beauty. But we also know that that needs to feel seamless with online because consumers will be shopping in your store while they're looking at your website and looking at a social post about a review, right? And all these things have to feel very connected.

Multiple touchpoints.

And simultaneously. And so that's where our omnichannel, just growth is really focused on is, is making that guest experience seamless. Seamless. And then definitely to the BOPUS part of it is saying, again, I want to be able to grab it when I want to and how I want to. And that is one— again, that is one of the core elements of being able to do that.

Absolutely. And just in looking at your website and your product set as well, just going beyond the channel strategy, the company seems very prescriptive in terms of the brands that it carries and the categories it goes into. You're unique in that you have your own private label brand, the Ulta Beauty Collection, as well as service other brands. You know, how does that play a role, I guess, in your marketing strategy? Because that's definitely unique. I mean, there are a lot of retailers that are going into private label, but it seems like that's a pretty core part of your strategy. So how does that play into how you go to market overall?

Absolutely. So the Ulta Beauty Collection is by far our favorite brand, right? Because it is a manifestation of our, our retail environment into a physical space. Right. And so we do a ton with ensuring that that first and foremost, it is the strongest product that it possibly can be, really ensuring that it connects with especially our younger consumer and the things that they're looking for, looking for clean products, looking for an opportunity for something that helps them to explore without like violating their pocketbook. So we're very mindful of the price points of that, of that brand to ensure that it's at the right place for discover and for play and to build onto your arsenal in a really meaningful way. And so we find that it's one of the, the key the key proof points for a lot of what makes Ulta Beauty special because it also connects from a brand perspective on it being for everyone and ensuring that it feels very inclusive across the board, be it shades, colors, the, you know, subcategories that we focus on as well. Yeah.

And speaking about being inclusive, inclusive, I know a huge initiative that Ulta is behind is about championing diversity. Another section of your products is about Black-owned and founded brands. You know, as a woman of color, of color in this industry, I'd imagine that you take special pride in an initiative like this, and it's clear that it's been successful. You know, talk to me about your role in this and why it's so important to Ulta as a business.

Yeah, this is very important to me. I have a 6-year-old. She'll be 7 in a month. I also say she's, you know, going on 27. And as I think about being in beauty, like, that is what I think about. I think about how I create an industry that feels like it's for her as much as it's for for everyone else. And that comes through in a couple of different ways. It's in the branding, in how we build imagery, in how we create our messaging and all of that. But it's absolutely in the brands that we carry and how we ensure that the assortment feels like no matter what your needs are, we will have something to address them and to ensure that you are getting the same experience as everyone else. And so it's a really core part of our, our business. I'm so proud of our organization for how we've gotten behind it in really meaningful ways. And in sustainable ways, right? This isn't a we did it now and now we're not. We're continuing to grow in those efforts and it's showing in the business as well.

Absolutely. And you're not only making the product, you know, more diverse in terms of the audience you're attracting, but you're also not limiting your product set to just the big established brands in beauty. You have Sparked at Ulta Beauty, which is open to more up-and-coming small businesses, which I just think is awesome. I think something that more large retailers should do at just giving people more opportunity because small business is just a huge engine behind our nation's prosperity. So how does that program, I guess, become executed? What's the process behind deciding who's going to be included at Sparked?

Absolutely. So Sparked is definitely that. And it kind of— it builds on the fact that like in beauty, so many of the brands are founder-led brands, started small. These are business owners, right? And so in retail, I think that's something that even makes me excited about the work as well is you are touching people's lives when you help them build their individual businesses. And that is something that we take very seriously, as you know, with our brand partners. And so Sparked really is an initiative where we find these up-and-coming brands that really need a little bit more handholding to ensure that they are ready for retail, because that's the other thing about— be it, you know, whoever's behind it, Black-owned, minority, or otherwise, like We want to make sure that we don't just bring you in to Ulta Beauty, but you can be successful. So we do that in a few ways. We've even built actually an accelerator. It's our Muse Accelerator that does focus on minority brands specifically because of the girth there. But it's in service of all of that, ensuring that you really have what you need to be successful when you come into these environments and not just be there. And so that's part of it. That close connection to build that successful nature.

Which I like because you're not just doing it to show others that you're doing it. You're really doing the work to make sure that these people can be successful and you're basically setting them on a path where they can be independently successful even beyond the work they're doing with Ulta. So, so you mentioned earlier about getting younger and every brand's looking at Gen Z right now. It's right now 20% of the entire population in the US and, you know, all the tenets that we spoke about, whether it be omnichannel or diversity, you know, this brand and this company, you can tell why it's set up incredibly well for this next generation. What are some of the other things you're doing in terms of the new ways that Gen Z consumes content, whether it be TikTok, whether it, you know, them being obviously mobile first, all that stuff. And, you know, if you have a young daughter, which you do, you obviously are seeing firsthand how how younger people are growing up in this era are different than, than the eras we grew up in, right? So, you know, with an eye towards the future, what are some of the new things that, that, that Ulta is looking at in 2023 and beyond?

Yeah, so there are a few things because this, this group, even no matter how set the size they are, the reality is the influence and the impact that the Gen Z group has on the overall culture. Like, that's what we're looking in. And there are a few things that we are really doing to ensure that we are connecting with them. And you already called it out. Social is where they are, where they want to be talked to. But I think even more so, it's really looking at the interplay of bringing your authenticity and allowing them to actually be a part of building your brand authentically too. I think that's probably the biggest takeaway for us. And with every year, with every generation becoming more and more like, how much more can you give your brand away and be okay with the co-creation of it? This group is asking for it in a way that has never been asked for before, and it takes us to push outside of, you know, you might have said your brand is XYZ, but consumers want you to be funny, or they want you to be less buttoned up, or they want to be able to have a conversation with you and know that you're listening in a way that wasn't the case before. And so those are the things that we're leaning into so much more in allowing to the, um, the consumer, and really the Gen Z consumer, to feel like they are a part of us. And that has been a fun exercise, uh, because sometimes it's humbling. It's like, oh, okay, we're not doing that All right, we hear you. Okay, we gotta do something different.

That's okay. And you don't really have a choice because younger people are getting content now, not from large corporations, but by— from other people. And if you want those other people who people are learning from and hearing about products from to talk about your brand, you have to give them ownership in it, and you have to relinquish some level of control. Yeah, but that's so different than the beauty brands of the '90s and 2000s when everything was very polished and stark and not diverse, and there was these carefully crafted billboards and Anna Wintour and all this stuff, and it was very inaccessible. And now it sounds like you're trying to pull down some of those barriers to really allow consumers to touch and feel and ultimately own the brand.

You are exactly right. Like, at the end of the day, these brand— the Gen Z need to feel like they are building the brand with you and they are not watching you build. And this is not a one direction. And I mean, it hasn't been one direction for a while, but I just think the level of expectation there just continues to supercharge. Charge.

Absolutely. Yeah, 100%. So to wrap things up here, you know, you had a great quote that, that really stuck out when we were doing our research about just the death of beauty trend culture and that like about the death of the trend, like the half-life of what's new will continue to shorten and it'll be truly hard to call something a trend, which I agree. I think it's especially with the younger generation, it's so fickle. Things are coming in and out. What did you mean by that and what are the implications of that towards the future of the beauty industry?

Yeah, I think that these, these, these kids, you know, this Gen Z group, they don't want to be defined and they don't want to feel like if they aren't on one path and they are on the wrong path. Their thought is that I will pick my path by day and sometimes by moment. And I think that is what we've got to understand. And kind of back to your even point of like there was a point where, where especially in beauty, we made the point of view. You had to go with this point of view or you were out. Out. That is no more, right? The pushback is I decide day by day what is going to be meaningful, what is going to be authentic. And we as brands have to just be there to help them enable that more so than try to push in any direction is what I see. And so that is where we are. Our role plays differently. We are enabling them to build what they want to be. We are facilitators. Creators, and we can't— we aren't— we are no longer the creators.

Yeah, I mean, I, I wrote a book, Youth Nation, and I wrote that the future of brands and culture isn't dictated from the boardrooms but from the sidewalks, right? It used to be that you had these big media companies, Viacom, News Corp, and then Clear Channel, saying this is what the kids are going to like, this is what they're going to hear, this is what's going to care about. And they— MTV— they could dictate it because the young people had no voice.

No voice.

Now it's the complete opposite. Now, now the only voice is of people. So, exactly right. So, so to wrap things up here, you've obviously had an incredible career and, you know, you're— it sounds like you're just getting started in terms of everything you're— you want to achieve at Ulta and in the industry, etc. What advice would you have to younger people that want to get into the beauty space, that want to end up where you are at your point in your career? What are some of the steps you've taken along the way that you would like to impart on to others?

So, the first one would definitely be don't be afraid of fail— failing, of not doing things right. We have just started using a mantra around our group. It's, "We win or we learn." And if I had learned that earlier on, where you're willing to challenge the status quo because things can always be fixable or changeable, you will be such a smarter innovator. You will be more confident. You'll realize that, like, little things aren't going to matter, so you'll push more. So I continue to tell folks kind of coming behind me is like, learn that early, lean into that early. It will pay dividends. I think the other one is the, is the, the power of network. Back to how I said I even got—

Yeah, you mentioned that earlier.

Exactly. Like that one has been core for me. You build these relationships and it doesn't have to be perfect and you don't have to have a 1, 2, 3 strategy for it. But authentic relationships that you keep connecting will continue to build and grow.

In ways you never have dreamed of. Like, I just find like when I started Susie, like the people who would first buy the product when no one heard of it. I called my friends and the people who I had relationships with who trusted me. Totally. And I trusted them. And that's how you get off the ground when you— when people are looking for a new job or they need help with anything, that's who you lean into. I find that a lot of people make the mistake of only focusing on the parts of their network that can help them in that moment.

At that moment.

Exactly.

Right.

And, and that's not what it's about. And then what— and if you just do that, then I think it becomes a very transactional in nature. Nature. And transactional relationships are never really authentic relationships that last.

Totally agree with you.

Absolutely. Yeah. So, and finally, uh, Karlyn, this has been such a great discussion. I can't wait for our audience to hear it. Is there a sort of one mantra that, that you live by that sort of like drives what you do every day and how you look at your career and your life in general?

One mantra for my whole life? That's a big question. But yeah, I do have some things that I've kind of played— I've played around. Whatever comes to mind first is Yeah, I think it's actually live in light and not in fear. And I think if you do that, that is something that will continue to propel you forward. It's something I've been looking to own more and more. So live in light, not in fear.

I love that. Well, we're going to leave it at that. You heard it here first, everyone. Live in light, not in fear. And I'm going to do my best to do that as well. So thank you so much, Carla, for joining us. This has been amazing. On behalf of Suzy and the Adweek team, thanks again to Carla Davis of Ulta for joining us today. Be sure to subscribe, rate, and review the Speed of Culture podcast on your favorite podcast platform. Till next time, see you soon, everyone. Take care.