Ep84: The Rehab Edge: How to Become the Go-To PT for Pain & Injury with Nick Stevenson

What is going on, everyone? Matt here from the PT Profit, Leverage and Lifestyle show. I've got an amazing guest with me today, Mr. Nick Stevenson. How are you this morning, mate?

Doing fantastic, mate. Thanks for having me on.

No problem. So Nick, actually, he did a amazing coaching call for us last week for our clients and thought I would get him on the. Get him on the podcast to give even more value to you guys that. That tune in. So Nick, for those who don't know who you are, can you give us a bit of background on what you do now? I suppose your, your background story just to give people some context.

Yeah, well, I suppose they just like, I suppose try and make it my story as short as possible because I could talk about it for ages. But I come from a. I, I sort of went through school and I didn't really know what I wanted to do, but I've always been a very like athletic and sport orientated person. So I went and did exercise and sports science because I didn't know what I wanted to do. So I was like, I'll just, I'll do that. And even when I went through uni, I still had no idea what I wanted to do. And then I, then when I got to the end of uni, I didn't. I did a couple of internships in Melbourne with some of the best SNC coaches in Melbourne. And then that's when I quickly realized I was like, oh yeah, like this is exactly what I want to do. I want to, I want to coach people. I want to make people help people get stronger, help people get faster, help people get like more athletic. Just. And then like I was training gen pop, people would like just get people feeling better about themselves as well. And even at that stage I was working with some people that had injured. Like, like if you've ever worked with athletes before or most. A lot of PTs have an athletic background. Even like you experience a lot of injuries and niggles and troubles and it's like you can be like, you're not a very good athlete if you actually can't play on game day no matter what your sport is. So I went down that path and I was like, yeah, this is exactly what I wanted to do. So then I started my own business. I started coaching out of a CrossFit box. Wasn't doing CrossFit myself, so don't hold that against me. But I just, I started my business out of there and I just purely coached athletes like weekend warriors. I had, I had some really high level athletes too. I had a Moto3 athlete. I had like ocean champion kickboxer, state champion golfer, state champion boxer, had some pretty high level athletes that ended up coming to me. But I kept coming across this thing of like, yeah, like athletes experience pain and injuries and things like this and those were the things that were holding them back. And I, I realized in that I was training gen pop clients as well and they're experiencing the same thing. Like a lot of the time the thing that was holding them back was this issue or like I couldn't get their technique right or they'd have this pain or like XYZ was popping up and I'd always refer out and I just didn't know what to do. So. And then it'd come back and all these problems were still there. Like they'd have a little bit of relief but nothing there. And I just, I wanted to get better. So eventually I just, I was lucky enough to very early on in my career, like probably 18 months into coaching to come across some amazing mentors and it just completely shifted how I, how I coach people. And I went down that path and I just loved it. I was obsessed with it. Like understanding injury under, understanding the musculoskeletal system, more understanding rehab and then how to tie that into strength conditioning for athletes and for Gem pop. And yeah, it just completely shifted how I saw the body and how I started training people and assessing people and started allowing me to do things that I realized that other coaches and other PTs couldn't do. And it really allowed me to stand out. So from there I just started learning about it and I got so good at it that my mentor is like, can you come teach for me? And then it just. So I stepped in from like coaching clients and then I started going down this pathway of actually coaching pts as it relates to their skill set and becoming like really high value and becoming good at what they do. And I've been doing that for like since, since 2018 and I do that all around Australia, fly around Australia, coach pts, do it with the big and, and our, a lot of our clientele are in person pts as well. So like good lives, club lines, big commercial gyms. A lot of the pts have come to us. So yeah, that's the mission that I've sort of been on. And I love this industry. It's where I started, it's where I built my passion for helping people and so much, there's so much potential in this industry that I think a lot of pts don't actually realize. And you probably See it too, Matt, is like how, how good you can be in this industry, how successful, how much money you can make, how much impact you can have in this industry. But pts just aren't set up for success and they're not given the tools to actually be able to do it in the skill set side and the business side.

Yeah, for sure. And yeah, super interesting about your journey over the, you know, the last or however long it's been. We're obviously talking a little bit before we started recording about the obviously having the skill set to, you know, train gen pop and athletes with injuries and injury prevention and all that type of stuff and then how it can, or how you can really stand out as a PT to kind of get people to come to you rather than you trying to attract.

Yeah.

People. I'd love to kind of dive into that a little bit. And then of course how that kind of relates to business with, you know, retention. Of course, obviously if you're able to help people with injury or prevent injury, then obviously they want to, they want to stay with you for longer. Right.

Yeah.

So I love to kind of whatever you want to go through first. We can probably, I suppose for the people that listen to this, they're probably face to face trainers in like, you know, good life, club lime anytime fitness, those type of clubs. So they're probably training a fair bit of gen pop, to be honest. So I suppose what are some of the trends that you're seeing with some of the trainers that you have coached? What are they doing and what should they be doing instead?

Yeah, it's a good question. And this is a lot of like what I spoke about on your coaching call with your clients last week is you've, you've got to find a way to stand out. Like we know that the PT industry is flooded, but big thing that we say, so you've got to find a way to stand out because when you find a way to stand out, it's still flooded but then it's not competitive. So if you can find a way to stand out, it's not competitive but because all you got to be able to do is you got to be able to deliver more value than your competition. And you like we talk about the journey of going from like being one of many. When you're one of many, then you're sort of doing things and you're solving problems and you're giving value the same way that everybody else does and then you go to being one of many to being one of few where you actually start Giving more value and you can do things that other people can't do. And then eventually you upskill yourself even more to eventually becoming the one. And when you become the one, then you become someone that doesn't have to refer out all these times when these problems come on your table like come across to you, you actually become someone that people start referring to. And this is for, for us, this is what most of our PT start becoming known as. They start becoming known as like rehab guy or the injury guy or something like that in their, in their gym, in their good life, in their club lime, in their anytime fitness. Like we work with, we work with people across all of these franchises, but that's the common thing. They start becoming known as this, this rehab dude or this. And if anyone walks in the gym and they're like, oh, I've got a knee injury, they're like oh, go, go see Nick or go see Conrad or go see whoever the, like the, the FMA coach is in that gym, they start becoming known as that guy through like and everything like that. And that's the thing, like when you look at gen pop and those types of clientele, like how many of them have a knee injury? Or it might not be an injury specific, but they have like knee niggle or a knee pain or a back injury or a back pain or a shoulder pain. Like if you walk the gym floor and there was 50 people on the gym floor, so how many of them do you think would actually say yes to a problem like that? It's probably like 99 of them. So as a, as a, as a coach, it's like you're, you're on the forefront, like on being on the gym floor and working with those people. So like it sort of makes sense to be able to be someone that can help with those problems. But the truth is that most pts can't. Most pts don't understand anatomy mechanics. Like, and it doesn't have to be, you don't have to be like this biomechanics PhD or anything like that, or this anatomy PhD or this like physics PhD or you don't have to be anything like that. But you need to understand the basics because like these are the people that you're working with day in and day out. And if you can solve problems, those types of problems that other people can't, other PTs can't. And either, even, even other allied health pros can't because their job is like in a clinic on a table, their job isn't on the gym floor where this Stuff is sort of happening in real time. Then when you can do those things, then that's what really allows you to stand out. And when you can solve those problems and you can stand out and you can do things, then people, especially when it comes to pain, like, if you can solve pain and get people out of pain, like, they will throw their credit cards at you. Like, literally people will do anything to get out of pain. And it's pretty wild. And that's what, like, your value increases because you're solving bigger problems and then you can charge more money as well. And as it relates to what you're saying around retention, too, is like, clients constantly have problems that pop up, and it's your job as a coach to be a problem solver and be able to guide them and be able to lead them. So when you can constantly solve these problems, like they might, if they're, if they're a weekend warrior athlete, they might be playing sport on the weekend and do an injury. They might be playing with their kids and do something to their knee, they might be at work and, I don't know, be laying concrete and do something to their back. Like, this stuff happens everywhere in all different situations in life. And that's the thing that, like, we're talking about, increases your retention because no matter what happens, you have the skills to actually be able to solve those problems. Otherwise, what happens a lot is they go to a physio and each time you refer out, you're throwing money out the door. And also, also the last, the last piece of that is a lot of. This is me generalizing. But a lot of people, when they go to Allied Health Pro for an injury, what do they typically say when there's an injury in terms of what they should do at the gym? They're like, okay, you probably need to take two months off training and just. And just rest and let it settle. And then you've lost the client for two months because your client has more trust in the physio as it relates to the injury than they do you. So, yeah, there's a lot of ways that it plays out.

Yeah, it's a really good point that you bring up there because, I mean, I've experienced this as well as a trainer. Like, I've. I've still done well, but I don't have a big skill set in the biomechanics and that type of stuff. So I've had to refer out plenty of people. And you're right, literally, they're like, I can't afford PT anymore. I'm paying for the physio. Oh, okay. Yeah, Cool. Well, I'll see you around. Next minute, you never see them again because they never get their problem solved.

Yeah. And definitely not definitely, like, definitely don't try and fix things that you don't know how to fix. But it's either, either you have to refer out or it's like, do you want to build the skill set so you can actually solve those problems so you don't have to refer out?

Yeah, for sure. With, with the injury prevention and that type of stuff, the gen pop. What are, what are some of the common. I know probably most people have niggling injuries, but what are some of the common things that you think pts can pretty easily improve their skill set to improve their value and then obviously help more. Help more people.

Yeah, like, the biggest thing is your, like you're only as good as what you can see. And in, in terms of what you can see comes down to your ability to be able to assess what's going on. And this, like, this, this was where I was at pre, pre, like learning this stuff as well, is I would see something like, I could see a squat or I could see a deadlift and it. And it wouldn't really look that great. It'd be like, oh, like that looks ugly. And then I'd see one like, oh, yeah, that's like, that's really good technique. Then nailed it. But then I like, if something didn't look good and I was like, oh, like we've got some work to do here and I do some technique work and improve that technique. And that's what I find the industry these days is very good as it relates to technique, especially as if we talk about like the big lift, squatting, benching, deadlifting, like strength training has become like really mainstream, like through everything, through social media. So I find a lot of pts are really good when it relates to strength training these days, compared to like five, 10 years ago when I was first in the industry and people were just horrible, horrible at it. But it's just become so mainstream now. Like powerlifting is a big sport, all these things. But the biggest gap that I see now in pts is that they just don't have the ability to assess further. So they can see a squat doesn't look good because they understand what good technique is and what, like, what and what isn't great technique. And this is a saying that we have as well, is you must first understand, like, what is good, so then you can see what is, like, what is Wrong, essentially. But yeah, the biggest thing is, like, when you see something looks wrong, it's like Most coaches and PTs don't have the ability to be able to assess further to actually determine why that's happening. They just have these sort of blanket terms of like, I think it could be ankle mobility. They have these like, these tricks up their sleeve that works for a certain percentage of people, but they actually are just essentially throwing at a wall and hoping it sticks because they don't have the ability to actually determine where it's coming from because they don't have a proper assessment process. So even if we look at like a squat, for example, there's so many things that can cause a squat pattern to go out of, out of like just terrible technique. And we talk about the foundations of movement in the body is the ankle, the hips and the thoracic spine. So it's your ability to assess like the, the talocr joint, it's ab ability to get into closed chain dorsiflexion for looking at. And like you looking the hips, its ability to get into hip flexion abduction, external rotation, and ability to get into thoracic extension as well. But you need to be able to assess these positions as it relates to the movement as well, because the movement is the assessment. So there's certain ways that we like teach you how to assess. Like, okay, how do we get rid of everything in the body and how do we just bias the ankle? We want to assess the ankle, so how do we just bias ankle. And just look at that and then maybe you want to look at the hips. So how do we get rid of everything else and how we just bias the hips as it relates to hip flexion abduction, external rotation to be able to do a test to see if someone has the range there or. And how do we do the same thing in the thoracic spine? So then you can actually determine where the problem is and then we can apply an intervention to that area to actually create improvement. Otherwise people are just guessing, oh, it might be ankle mobility or might be a glute weakness or it might be a hip restriction. You don't really know unless you have assessments to confirm what you're seeing. And that's probably the biggest gap that I see with, yeah, with, with most pts is that they're just having a, a guess. Sometimes, like good coaches, it'll be educational guess. And they've seen these similar patterns play out in clients, but it's still a guess. They haven't. They don't have an Assessment process to actually, we like to. I like to call it like having a sniper approach instead of a shotgun approach. They're just like firing and hoping they hit something rather than having the sniper approach of knowing exactly what they're doing, which then saves a lot of time because you know you're going straight to the, straight to the heart of the problem.

Yeah. And also, also obviously from the member or the client's perspective as well, if you can identify the problem pretty quickly, it's going to be a much better experience from them and they'll probably stay with you longer.

Yeah, yeah. Especially when you can understand their problem and piece things together better than anyone that they've ever had before then it makes a lot of sense. Like, I think I was sharing this story on your coaching call as well. I was running a workshop for a bunch of pts a few weeks ago and there was a young girl in there, she was about 25, but she'd had shoulder pain for about 10 years and she'd been to, she'd had like 6 or 7 pts and like in the hope that that would get her shoulder better, like strengthen it up, make her feel better and everything like that. And she'd also been to see like five physios and Cairos and different allied health professionals and everything as well, and she still hadn't been. So she just, she'd almost surrendered to the fact that she was going to be in shoulder pain forever. And that's a reality for a lot of, a lot of people as well. Like a lot of clients is that just members that being in shoulder pain for six months, two months, and they've tried all these things and they just end up giving up and then just like, I'm just going to train through the pain, like I'm just used to it now. And that's what she was like as well. And then through just seeing, be able to dial into the shoulder and see what's happening in the shoulder, but then look at her whole body and look at everything that's contributing to the shoulder problem because usually where the body's experiencing pain isn't the problem. And that's a hot tip for like everyone, I'd say 90% of the time, 95% of the time, wherever the body is experiencing pain isn't the cause of it. Still need to deal with it because it's a symptom, but it's not the cause of it. So if you just deal with that, the pain will keep coming back. So with her, like all we had to do Was like, adjust her pelvis, and then that got rid of her shoulder pain. And that's just being able to assess all the things that could be contributing to the shoulder pain and determine, like, what's the biggest. Almost like, what's the. What are the biggest rocks that could contribute to this. And this, this where we just have a process of, like, proximal to distal. What's the most proximal part of the body, which is the core and the pelvis is in that area, and then everything emanates out from there. So it's just having a process. It's actually very easy. Like, it might sound, like, complicated. Be like, oh, like, how did you know to adjust the pelvis to, like, fix the shoulder? It's actually really easy because there's a whole system on proximal, distal, on how to assess each individual area. And all you learning to do is, like, gather the pieces of the puzzle to put a really clear picture together to then know what to do with that client moving forward and how to help. So, yeah, it's actually. It's actually really simple. It's just all I've got to do is, like, show people the pieces. And like, this, like, this is the pieces of the puzzle. This is how you put it together. The only reason why I'm, like, great at this stuff now is because I put the puzzle together like, thousands of times, like, by now, because I've been doing this for so long. But that's the only difference is time and experience. Like, we show everyone, like, we don't really hold anything back. It's like, show them all the pieces, and then you just got to go away and get experience with putting the pieces together. And it becomes really easy to solve problems because there's a system and there's just these patterns that play out in the body, and there's these things that have influence over other areas of the body. So it actually. Yeah, it. It actually is really easy. And that's why it's about taking really complicated things and making it really simple. And that's. That's why you don't have to have like a biomechanics PhD or anything like that. It's about making complicated things really simple.

Yeah, 100% agree. And then just going back to what I was saying before as well, because more than likely the. The client's going to think it's super complicated as well when you're doing all these assessments and whatnot. But if you can simplify it down and just be like, oh, this is essentially what's happening, then again, they're going to obviously think really high highly of you. And as you said before, pretty much 90, 95% of people have niggling injuries or niggling pain. And you know, especially people with like, you know, kids, they want to be able to move around with their kids pain free. That's a big, big selling point. Yeah. My question to you is, obviously you've been doing this quite a long time. How long do you think it takes? Let's just say like a brand new pt. Obviously they're not going to teach this, this stuff in much detail in the course and obviously they don't teach the business stuff very much as, as we know. Yeah. How long do you reckon it takes in terms of experience before, like, you become quite skilled and proficient with this type of stuff?

I mean, it depends on who you learn it from. Like, that's, that's my biggest thing is like, you can go learn this from, from different people. You can go try to learn at university where you can go do it. Like, I've had people that too, an osteo degree and a, or a physio degree and then they do their PT and strength conditioning. And that's like four years, five years, six years. Because you're sort of trying to learn how to piece all of this together yourself of like, take the rehab side and then take the S and Z side and you're like trying to figure it out yourself. And people can do that. Like, that's, that's okay. I've come across people that are amazing at this stuff. My biggest thing is like, if you're like, no matter what you want to get good at, if it's like this relevant to what we're talking about, or you want to get good at business or you want to get good at nutrition, like, no matter what it is just like, find someone who's the best in the world at that, at what you want to get good at and then go learn from them and then you will accelerate your learning so much quicker. It's the whole point of mentoring. Whole point of mentoring is to turn decades into days. What someone's taking someone decades to learn, you can learn in days because they've held on to the information that's actually relevant and they've got gotten rid of all the information that's not and it just doesn't work. So for me, like, when I started learning this stuff, I was just like, this is exactly the type of coach.

That I want to be.

These are the problems that I want to be able to solve. I want to be able to do this stuff because it's a constant roadblock for my clients. These injuries, these niggles. So I want to. So I was like obsessed with it, like listening to it every day. It's like you can always like think of like the Bruce Lee effect. Like Bruce Lee like died when he was like 30 or something like that. And there's rumors going around that he trained like still known as like the best martial artist ever. And there's like rumors that he would train like 12 to 14 hours a day, which is like absolutely insane. But like that's, that's the thing. It's like depends on how much time you put into it. If you look at the say like 10,000 hour rule to actually become good at something, it's like you can do 10,000 hours over 10 years or you can do it in a year, like if you're like just, if you're just obsessed. So but I like as a general rule, because it depends on people's lifestyle. Some people have kids and partners and all this other stuff. And then some people are just young, they're single, they've got no other responsibilities and they can just obsess over this stuff. I would say usually like to get a decent level of proficiency, like six to 12 months. And that's not saying that you don't know anything for six to 12 months, but to really know how the puzzle comes together and how to piece it together really well and efficiently without having to think about it too much. And you can just see everything like yeah, six to 12 months of consistent learning.

Yeah, Love it. Let's talk a little bit about the effects this could have on business side of things. We talked a little bit about obviously retention. A little bit. What about. And we haven't really touched on it too much. But what about like how much you're able to charge if you have this type of skill set? Yeah. What are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, it's. I mean there's. I talk about three things that you need to be a high value coach. One is to be in a high value environment, like your facility and everything like that. Because if you think about going after the players with money, people with money, then they want to be in an environment that's congruent with their lifestyle. Like if you think of like, I don't know, just think of someone high end, like a high end lawyer or corporate people or anything. Like they're not going to go into this dingy, dodgy gym with like Cobwebs and everything like that. It's just, it's so against their identity. So high value gym, sorry, high value environment is 1. The next is you want to have a high value skill set, which is sort of what we've spoken about. And then the third piece is you need to have a high value mindset as well. So I'll give you my story because I've actually never come across anyone that's ever beaten me in this sense in terms of the prices that I charged when I first started training and. But when I first started training. So this was back in like 2015 probably when I first started. No, probably 2014. Yeah, 2014 when I first started coaching after my degree and everything. And I went in and I did the classic thing is I looked at the other pts in that gym and I was like, okay, I can't charge more than them because I'm less experienced and I was in a very low socioeconomic area like originally from Victoria. So I was out in the west of Victoria in like low socio economic areas, like some of the lowest like highest robbery areas that would pop up on the news and everything like that. Like it was pretty, pretty area. And the PTs in the gym at that stage, there's two of them that owned, that owned this gym and they were charging $40 for 45 minutes. So in my mind, and I come from a background like I grew up with my family being bankrupt and everything. So we had all this mindset stuff, all these money stories, all this going on and I was like, okay, well I can't charge more than that. So I started off by charging $30 for an hour one on one, which is like, yeah, that is just. I can't believe it actually, actually did it. And I tell that story a lot. But now like the thing that's really being able to for me and everyone's journey is different but the thing that really allowed me to build confidence and competence in myself in terms of what I can charge is I know I can solve problems now that other people can't with the skill set that I have. So based on that, I actually don't see myself as a personal trainer now because I do things that personal trainers don't do. So I can't really identify with being a personal trainer. And I also do things that ally health pros don't do. So this has been like a journey of experience, like of journey of growth, of mindset work, of skill set work, of up leveling my environment and all these things. But like to work with me now, one on one, I'm 350 an hour. So it's crazy because I can, I can solve problems that other people can't. And I know that I deliver more value than 350 an hour. Like I charge 350 because I know I deliver $350 worth of value. I actually believe that I deliver like probably 5, $600 worth of value and I charge 350 for it based on me being able to solve problems that take people, takes people years to solve. I can solve in like 15 minutes. So going back to what you're saying before even like I had this client one time who'd been in shoulder pain for like two years and he couldn't even pick up his kids. Like he had like a two year old son and he couldn't even pick him up. He tried cortisone injections a couple of times. He had, he had like two of them and they'd last like one or two weeks and that was about it. And he been to physio, a physio and a Cairo and just like when you be like, build this sort of brand and this reputation, then these are the types of people that start coming to you. You won't get these people straight off the bat, but they start coming to you when you build this sort of reputation. And like I got him just through doing some assessments and working out what was going on in his shoulder. I got him out of pain in like 10 minutes and that was just in a consultation. Now he didn't even end up being a client. But it's like what does that do for my brand? What does that do for my reputation? Because a lot of things you can talk about but when you actually get hands on with someone and they're in front of you, like you can't, you can't fake that, you can't fake getting someone out of pain, you can't fake getting someone better movement. Like you can talk about things, sit down in a consultant and talk about things, but you can't fake getting someone out of pain because they're feeling it in real time. So you, when you have this type of skill set, I feel, and you're in the right environment, I think the only thing that you're limited by in terms of what you can charge is how much you believe you're worth. And then that goes into a whole different conversation of identity and self belief and self worth and all these types of things. But I think that's the only thing you're limited by. Yes, you're limited. Like, like environment's a big piece because if you like I could go to one gym and charge 350 an hour and I could go to another gym that's not in a great area and no one would be willing to pay me that because it's not in an area where people actually have money. So that's where environment plays, plays a big piece. But yeah, like when you, when you can deliver. Like I, I used to have uni students that would pay me like $250 a week for like semi private training because they just saw so much value and that was then probably giving me like super 70% of their income. Like, like. But because there's so much value there.

Yeah. Well it goes for the saying, right. If, if a homeless person wants a Louis Vuitton handbag, they'll, they'll buy one, they'll find, they'll find a way to, to get it. They'll save up their 5 cent coins that they get from people and they'll eventually get one. It's the same with. Yeah, if people are in that much pain then they'll, they'll find a way.

Yeah. I think that's the biggest piece though is like you, you can charge prices that aren't PT prices when you can do things that other PTs can't do. Otherwise. What I tend to see is there's sort of like two brackets. There's like this 70 to 90 range which people tend to sit in for a long time. And then there's the more premium PT that might charge like 100 to 120. Yeah, most like, most of the people that I've sort of mentored and get good at this stuff charge beyond 120. And it's because, yeah, they don't, they don't compare themselves with a PT anymore. So they just, they choose what they charge because they do things that other pts don't.

Yeah. And obviously that, that belief obviously comes over time. Right. When you solve bigger problems. Yes. You obviously get a lot more self worth with seeing the transformation of other people as well.

Yeah, like my, my 350. Like a few years ago I really, this is when I really started belief, like believing. I think I was charging maybe like 250 or 300 and then I was like, I upped it a bit more because I had one of our students in our course at the time, she had this knee problem that she'd been going to see like a physio for like, I think it was about six months or something. Like every fortnight and paying him like 400 or $500 a session. He was like a knee specialist, physio. Then she, then she'd be going to see like this specialist knee surgeon. She wasn't any surgeon for him, but she was getting some type of treatment from, paying him like she'd seen him for a few months, like once a month session, paying him like $600 a session. And I quickly worked out she had this knee problem. Like she's a IBB pro black bodybuilder. Like, she's. Yeah, she's one of the, one of the top in Australia. She's amazing. And I quickly worked out it was coming from her foot. I did some stuff with her knee, worked out what was going on with the foot, helped her with her foot. And then this was probably 20 minutes, 30 minutes max. And then she was out of knee pain. And then in my mind I'm like, okay, I can't compare myself to pts, but even if I was to compare myself to someone and I compare myself to these specialists, these specialists that are charging 5, $600 and they're not fixing these problems. But now I can, I can solve a problem that they can't. Like, in my mind, that's where that I can justify that I bring five, six hundred dollars worth of value, probably more because I'm solving problems that they couldn't. So me charging 50 a session, I'm like, I could charge way more than that. But like, that's that just where I, that's where I leave it. So, yeah, like, it's just like, how much value do you actually believe? If you believe you bring $1,000 worth of value, then you can charge anything from zero to $999.

Yeah, well said, well said. And you're obviously working with a fair few trainers all around Australia, which is, which is perfect. So if people want more information on, you know, doing workshops with you or working with you or doing the course or whatnot.

Yeah.

Where can they find more information? Do they search you or is there a website or anything that they should go to?

Yeah, I mean, they can search me on Instagram. Like, I'm mostly on Instagram, which is Nick stevensonx. Fmas on Instagram as well. But like, we're not, we're not like, FMA is not super active on social media. So you can, yeah, reach, you can look at FMA Strength Institute on social media. There's, there's a bit of stuff on there, but if you're keen to learn more, then, yeah, just Connect with me on social media and I can, yeah, I can give you access to our free course and everything as well. That starts breaking things down and starts showing you how to see the body, but the body in this way to really be able to assess things and have that sniper approach. But yeah, you can reach, you can reach us either way on that.

Yeah, yeah. Legend. And then what's kind of, what's kind of coming up for you? Obviously you've been doing this for a fair while now. What's the kind of the long term goal for you? Are you going to keep doing what you're doing or is there another thing you're going to work on in the next couple of years or so?

Yeah, I mean I've got it, I've got a lot of things like so many ideas like flowing through my mind over the last month or so. But yeah, I love the health and fitness industry so much. Like it's really, there's just so much potential here and PTs and trainers and coaches are really, I mean a lot of everyone's, everyone says it but they're at the forefront of health in Australia and in the world. So I've had this massive goal to really completely shift the trajectory of the industry because PTs are looked down upon in terms of, in terms of their level of understanding, skill set, their qualifications, they've really looked down upon. So I have this big goal to really change the perspective of what the health and fitness industry is and the things that coaches and trainers can do to be able to actually get them seen in high regard. Just like an osteo or physio is seen in high. Regardless, that's one of my goals for pts is be able to get that level of professionalism in the industry and it's what the industry needs, it's what clients need, it's what members need now more than ever is really highly skilled high level coaches that can solve these problems because it's in your face, it's on the gym floor day in and day out and people need this help. The people need these high level coaches that can solve these problems because no one else is doing it for them. So that's, yeah, that's the big thing for me is just to really work away at that and just create high level coaches that can shift the identity of the industry.

Well said. Well everyone listening and make sure you go follow Nick on Insta and yeah, we might wrap it up there. Thank you again for jumping on today. Heaps of value as always. And yeah, I'm sure we'll be connecting more soon.

Awesome, man, awesome. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

No worries.