Business Bootcamp: Aaron Zoom Call #3

Welcome back to the Mike Andes Podcast, where we discuss ins and outs of owning a small business. If you're new here, the Mike Andes podcast is all about taking your business to the next level. We're covering season one, episode three of Business Bootcamp, Zoom calls. This week. If you haven't heard, you've been watching four different home service business owners overcome their challenges and build their business into something great. Part of the whole thing is zoom call check ins that they do with Mike. Along the way, Mike has tons of great advice for anyone who runs a small business. So here's what we're getting into. First off is Aaron from AZ Lawn Maintenance out of Scott Steel, Arizona. Their business is currently worth 900k, but he's looking at almost 300k in debt and only 2k left in the bank. What they have here is a major cash flow issue, plus some massive payments being made on equipment they just don't end up using. But, hey, Mike is going to talk to them and see if they can find a way out. This episode, Mike is going to go over exactly what Aaron needs to achieve if he wants to safely acquire a new truck. Stakes are high. As always, you can find all this and more over at the MikeAndas YouTube channel. So without further ado, here's the third call with Aaron from a AZ Lawn Maintenance.

Hey, everyone, it's Mike Andes. And today we're gonna be watching the full video and the consultant call that I had with Aaron. And this is from Business Bootcamp. You can watch the entire episode down below. But this is the consulting call in its entirety. We talk about him wanting to actually get more debt. And I met up with him in person at Equip Expo where he was thinking about buying another truck, he was thinking about buying another boom lift. Just a whole bunch of stuff. And I think the important discussion we have today about debt being something that is addictive, extremely important as you grow your business to not fall into that trap. So again, full episode is down in the description, but this is the actual consulting call with Aaron. Let's go ahead and roll the tape. Cool. I'm just resetting into everything that I knew about your account. Yeah, Jobber, I know. We were talking about prior. So where are we at on that?

So initially my thinking was I was gonna work on it this week, but after consulting with a couple different people, I don't think it would be wise. I didn't bring a computer, so I don't want to do everything off of my phone and then end up duplicating accounts.

Right.

So I'm actually next week I'm going to dedicate a day moving all over just at my house, my office.

And then so this week obviously you came here. Who's managing the accounts now and how are they, how are they done so far, even the past few days?

So it's myself managing as far as putting out the schedule. And then I have my form foreman. I send him to any of the difficult jobs that are just more complex, that have to do with irrigation.

And then I have another crew and they do more of the basic like mowing and you know, trimming bushes.

Okay. Okay, cool. All right, so we're gonna break, we're gonna break this down. Why do you think you need the big trucks? I want to go over this because I saw your comment on YouTube on one of my one things. Yeah, yeah, we saw, we saw that. Okay, so I want to go over that because I agree with you to some extent.

Ok.

I disagree with you on some other extents. Walk me through your logic though. On the trucks, just so I'm clear, there's the 1F450, that's the 1 that when you won the thing from Tigrid, you put that cash towards.

Yes.

And that's the one you owe 120 on approximately.

Yeah.

Okay.

Okay, cool. So that truck, I had already ordered that truck. So I've already wanted a F450 truck.

Got it.

I figured it would be good for marketing purposes like oh, this guy has his stuff together. He has like this, you know, one hundred thousand dollar truck. Like you know, just it gives you, it puts your foot in the door as far as like credibility in addition with everything else that they already may know about me. So that was part of my thinking also. It's, you know, it has.

Like crash detecting. So I know myself, I'm extremely busy. I'm on my phone and I would like that alert like, hey, you need to. Yeah, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep. You know. Yeah, yeah, so. And it actually did save my butt once, you know, where I had to lock up the brakes because I was on my phone texting. So if I was driving my, you know, F350 truck that didn't have that, I could have rear ended someone, hurt someone, you know, so I, you know, that truck saved someone's life, you know, so.

Oh man, I guess you could just not text and drive.

Yeah. But then I couldn't manage everything.

Yeah.

You know, so that was kind of my logic with that.

Yeah. I just overload My vehicles.

Right.

Yeah. So.

Okay. Okay. Cuz, like, what do you think? Well, I just. It's a lot of debt. And I understand our plan is like, to grow out of it. I get that 100%. I'm just concerned in the meantime, like, the next 12 months, like, I think. I think if someone was doing, say, 1.5 million, I'd be okay. 300,000 in debt. I get that. Right. Like, even I was talking with T yesterday, he said he had about 3, $400,000 debt. That makes sense because he does. 3, 4 million plus.

Yeah.

I'm concerned when there's that much debt and such little cash. And then my question is, from a marketing standpoint, could the $1,700 per month on that loan be spent on marketing and actually get more customers than the image that is currently using on the truck?

Yeah, I mean, it could. You know, I mean, I weighed this back in my head too.

Yeah.

You know, everything back and forth.

Yeah, yeah.

And try to think about it. And I feel like I purposely put myself under that. That stress or that struggle. Just be uncomfortable and force myself to get ahead.

Do you think without that discomfort, though, you'd be able to just lock into a gear without that pressure financially or like, is it for you, like, you need the financial pressure? Because I understand some people, do they need that pressure to get up and just like, hustle? Or is it, you know, could you do that without that kind of pressure?

Yeah, I think I can do it either way, you know? Yeah. Okay.

All right. So in terms of doing that, because, like, the only way in my mind is just growth, like, massive growth. What are we taking in terms of steps? Like, obviously job is going to help somewhat systematize some things. Is there anything that can be taken off of your plate so you can just focus on the selling side of things more?

Yeah, I could.

Hire. I need to get another, like, qualified, you know, foreman. One of them I have now, you know, for the most part, you know, he's qualified and he can solve a lot of problems. Customer relationship, you know, issues. Like, he's great. So I needed to find another guy like that. So, yeah, that would make my job easier.

You'd say about 20 to 30% of your revenue now is from the project side. 70 to 80% of it is from the maintenance side. What was that like last year? Was it mostly maintenance and now you've. You're really going after the projects. Is that kind of the goal?

So when you say projects, do you mean like trees?

Trees. Any sort of project like anything that's not recurring, basically, or property maintenance.

I would say.

It'S similar.

Okay.

To last year.

It's always kind of that, but now you're. You're kind of like, hey, I'm going to get into these bigger jobs and really go for it.

Yeah. I mean, I've always liked the bigger jobs. I've just had to.

Rent the equipment to get those bigger jobs done. And then now I own the equipment versus renting it. But I've always kind of put myself. So I don't have a lot of money in the bank.

Right.

That's how I've always been and just like, pushed it, you know, right back towards the business to grow, grow, grow. And it's worked.

Yeah.

But I. It's risky.

Yeah. Okay. As long as you know it's risky.

I do know it's risky.

As long as you know, it's like when they go to the insurance and like, make sure you sign this waiver, you have D. Was it like you said, you don't need a certain type of insurance? Right. That's what I kind of feel it is, like, as long as you know it's risky because it's extremely risky in terms of having that kind of debt and then still growing. Right.

Yeah.

I'm a little worried about December, because December every year, it's slowed down about 40%, you know, 40 to 60%, really, you know, since I've been in business. So, you know, this month I'm going to stockpile a little bit of cash to make sure that I'm going to be able to pay my bills for December. That's my plan.

Yeah.

So. So this, this month has been okay.

You know, I'm gonna have all the work that we've done this month. The payments are going to be coming in in November, and that's where I'm not going to invest back into the business. I'm going to actually save that to make sure that the. I'm going to be able to pay my bills.

Okay.

So.

Okay. Yeah. I mean, go ahead.

No, no. I don't really have anything to say. It is a matter of, like, as long as, like, it's just. It's scary to me, honestly. I don't do as well as that. I don't do as well underneath that financial pressure as you do. It seems like you really put yourself there almost in order to force yourself to just keep kicking butt.

Yeah. I don't know if it stems from childhood, too. You know, I mean, like, when I was a kid, my dad, he used to always put that on us as a kid. Financial stress, like, oh, we're not gonna, you know, have enough money to pay our bills, like. And that did teach me to become a very hard worker because I'd go out there and I'd help him, you know, and I'd bust my ass, you know, trying to make sure, like, our bills are gonna get paid. I've learned that that's irresponsible. I would on my, my children, you know, but I think maybe I still put that on myself, you know. So I think it's kind of like a habit, you know, that eventually I'm going to get myself out and I feel like I'm just going to be rolling in the dough. It's going to be easy. Everything's going to be paid off.

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Tell me a little bit. Steven had said at one point you were really into the drug scene and all that sort of thing. What helped you get out of that?

Really what motivated me was having my daughter. So.

I got into drugs because of depression, self medicating. I seeked help beforehand and it just, it wasn't working. You know, they could only see me like once a month for one hour. And that just wasn't going to cut it, you know, because I had some deep issues. And then, you know, once you get hooked on this stuff, it's, it's evil, it's, it's, it's a disease, but it's, if you want to get off of it and quit, it's extremely hard.

Yeah, I mean I, I'm pretty like tough person, but yeah, it's rough. So I definitely know how it can ruin people's lives.

So you had your daughter and that was kind of a wake up call you needed.

Yeah, so I had my daughter and I, you know, within myself, I just wasn't able to conquer it. Conquer it. But I knew I didn't want to have this innocent child have a Father that's like a deadbeat, you know. So I suffered for, you know, three months. I didn't go to any sort of, like, rehab. I just decided I purposely slept on concrete. Like, I stayed at my mother's house and I didn't sleep on a bed, nothing. I gave my bed to my. My ex.

And yeah, I just, you know, suffered through it and got off of it. Dealt with dreams every night for like a year and a half, like, of using drugs, you know. So, like, there really wasn't much of an escape. And then it slowly started to get better after about a year and a half where you don't dream about it, you don't think about it as much.

You know.

So, yeah, like.

It'S almost the reason I asked is because, like, there's a couple friends I have that I've seen. They have came out of that, and then they really got. They. Instead of drugs, they started putting it on, like, other things, right? And like, putting the focus on whether it be like, my one friend, just like, he bought this crazy house. It was like, stupid. And then he ended up having to lose it because.

Put his identity into the house. Right? And what I don't want to see you do is put identity in the trucks and the equipment. Because, like, that is not the business. The business is ultimately we could look at, okay, what's the cash flow, what's the debt, and, like, the liabilities and the assets. And currently, like, the assets are lower than the liabilities. Right. And theoretically solvent unless a business is going to grow out of that. Right. And that is a scary proposition as long as, you know how. How, like, important it is that we grow and that is it is profitable growth.

Because that's my biggest concern. That is my biggest concern. And I don't want it to be where. Whether it be, you know, you had a daughter and you wake up and like, oh, my word, like, this has all happened. There's not. That's not. Not longer an option when you're providing for your family, right? Like, oh, like, oh, my goodness, like, I have all this debt and the only way out of is bankruptcy. Like that. That's scary. Yeah, right. And so that's. That's my concern, I would say. And I don't want you to get wrapped up into the ideology that equipment makes the business better.

Well, I mean, it does make the job easier. You know, the wood chipper definitely makes the job more streamlined, you know, versus having the guys cut up the trailer. You know, I could have one guy, you know, pay him 160 to $220 per day. Cutting up the trailer with the chainsaw. I am out chainsaw chains. I have to get them sharpened, you know, versus just having a chipper. That same guy can just be feeding the chipper right into the same trailer. You know, the max on the chipper is $50 today.

Right. I guess my concern though is the fact that like, okay, so if 70 to 80% of the business is revenue is coming from the maintenance side and then 20, 30 from the project side. But the project side, let's say it's 20, 30% of what you're doing. So probably 200, $300,000 a year. That is how that, that side of the business is the part that's requiring all the debt. Yeah, like the big trucks, the big chipper, et cetera. And that's the, that 200, 300,000 needs to literally grow to a million plus to sustain that debt service of like almost five grand a month. No, it has to. It has to. Because there's no way that a business, let's just say it's, that's $200,000 or let's say $250,000 in annual revenue that you're doing right now on projects. Right. That's about 33% of what you're doing now. If you're doing 33% of what you're doing now is projects, that's like 250 grand. Let's assume that we're 20% profitable on that. That's 50 grand per year in profit. But then if I just take away your debt service, which is five grand a month, that's 60 grand. So now we're negative on that revenue. So the only way out of that is to grow from 250 to a million, be profitable 200 grand on that. Then I take away 60 grand from debt service and I'm profitable 140. Right. That's why the growth is the only option. If you keep that debt service, just.

Do more marketing for tree work, it's.

Either that or it has to be where you cut those services out. And I agree with you. If you, if the services that you want to provide long term and like really focus on is the big projects and the trees, you've got to scale that. There's just, there's no financial sense. And I believe that every profitable dollar from your maintenance side is being sucked up into the debt service for the big stuff, which is fine. Assuming that we go to a million.

I feel like I need to fix the maintenance part. Of it. I feel like I'm very profitable when it comes to trees, but I'm not very profitable when it comes to maintenance.

But even, let's say you're even 30% or 40% profitable on the projects, it's such a small part of your business.

Yeah.

Right. So like even if you're doing 20,000 or $15,000 a month in projects, if you take that money and it's 20, 30% profit, it's still four or five grand, which still doesn't pay for the debt service. Yeah, right. But growth is fine. Like it just, it's that 12 month trajectory to that where it's like we really got to stay focused because A, you cut all that out and just get rid of debt and focus on simple services or B, you've got to ramp it up to where $5,000 a month of debt service is manageable. Right.

So. Yeah. So would you be feeling different though if I had like $60,000 in the bank right now?

100%.

You would?

Yeah. I'm very concerned though when, when you're, when our revenue like, like payroll per, per month is probably what, like 25 grand?

I don't know exactly. But I do have the numbers probably off the top of my head.

Let's just say it's 25 grand or even, let's just say this, revenues of 60, 70 grand a month. Right.

And 60 to 90 depending on the month.

Got it. And then, but then when I look at the amount of cash in the bank now, that's what makes me scared because If I had 60 in the bank, I know that you have 12 months of debt.

So that's one thing that, where I felt confident in making the decision is because I've been paying like I paid for dental work, you know, $30,000 in the last like couple of years. I paid $45,000 in lawyer fees to get my daughter. As far as fighting for custody to get her. Yeah. You know, and then I also provide for my family. Like I'm the only like one that makes income, you know, So a lot of that, if I didn't have the lawyer expense, that's money I could have.

Yeah.

You know, I knew that my teeth were going to be fixed and then that's no longer expense.

Yeah. But having that expense of say 40,000 for the lawyers, etc. And the other 20, let's say it's 60,000, we basically just replace that with the debt. Right. That 60 grand. So it's not going to change necessarily how much is in our bank account. And that goes back to if you had 60 grand in the bank account. That's a different conversation. I would just be like, hey, how do we spend 60 grand to scale up projects as fast as possible? Right. But when you have that marketing. Marketing. Selling and really trying to focus on how do we get you out of the office and selling, because that is your strength, like 100%. I have no doubt you can build a multiple million dollar business. Business. Not a doubt in my mind. Because you can focus on sales. But when you don't have the cash, what happens is you start micromanaging things because you don't have the ability to like, okay, I'm just gonna let this office person do stuff. I'm gonna hire them and I might lose money on them for the first month or two, but I don't care because I have 60 grand in the bank. Yeah, right.

Yeah.

And so I think getting that cash level, like higher is number one.

Yeah.

You can't have what happened before where they lock up accounts. That's like stress to the math.

Say it again.

When they locked up the account to the bank, like, oh, yeah, that was up here.

Yeah.

And I don't want. I don't want that to happen.

Yeah, it was. I ended up having to borrow money from a friend, you know, just to pay my bills, you know, and then as soon as they release those funds, you know, I was able to pay it back to them. Okay.

All right, so we've established that. Like, honestly, I think we've established the fact that, hey, either A, you simplify and you cut out the stuff that requires a debt, or B, you just keep growing.

I think I'm just going to grow.

So if you're going to grow, then it's a matter of, you know, what are we doing now to fix the cash problem? Because it is a problem in my mind, you can't have that low of cash.

Yeah.

And so pricing wise, before I talk about pricing, though, when you do a job, when you do an estimate, what percentage of them are you closing?

Like most of them, I would say 60%.

Okay.

I used to close like 95% when I first grew. When I first started. Yeah. You know, and then I started to raise my price.

Yeah.

You know, then I got people, oh, that's too much.

How far are you booked out now for projects?

Well, total, I'm booked out about three and a half weeks, so almost a month.

Okay. And does that go lower in December, January, I'm assuming in.

In December. It does.

Got it.

Yeah.

Burn through the backlog.

Yeah. So, yeah, like I probably have like, you know, three to four days in reoccurring work and then I schedule the other jobs for like tree work, special projects. I'll fill those days in. So that way my guys consistently have work. You know, if they need to take a day off because I don't have work, you know, they get to rest up.

Yeah, because I think, you know, if we could raise our prices to the point where we're only closing, say 45% of the, that would probably be where there's enough margin to where we're having some good cash flow.

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Yeah, so.

One thing that I've done too is because I just started getting Facebook leads. I've been going with elite leads. I've changed. Rather than me going and doing an in person estimate, doing it over the phone. But I feel like that affects my closing because they don't see me there.

And then with the higher price, you know, it's, it's a downside, but it also saves me time from all the tire kickers.

Yeah.

You know, so I've debated that. And I've also debated just raising my price with every customer. And then, you know, $20, $30.

How many mowing customers do you have now?

Somewhere around 125. I don't know exactly, but somewhere.

And when was the last time you raised prices on existing customers?

A few months ago, on the lower, the lower customers.

So you had like I say, 125. Do you raise like the bottom 25?

Yeah, like the lowest paying, lowest pain. What I raised. Yeah, I sent him a text, you know, explaining everything.

The other hundred. Do you think we could raise the prices on them?

Well, I raised those the other hundred before that, about nine months ago.

Okay. I'm wondering if next spring though, if we just raise on everybody a little.

That's what I was thinking.

Because if we can even get, if you Even got, let's just say $5 more per cut and you have 125 customers and you have four cuts a month, you're looking at three grand a month in just straight profit. That can go towards the debt service. And I would feel better about that.

But inflation is also going to go up between now and.

Yeah, exactly. And it has been going up.

But same thing with, you know, herbicides. You know, they've almost tripled for herbicides in the past couple years. Yep.

Yeah. So if you go at $5 on, say, lawns that are under 50 bucks, $10 if they're over 50 bucks or whatever and try to achieve like a 20%, you know, bump in price, I think you'd probably keep 115 of them.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah, 100%. Especially if you switch over to jobber and like, they start saying, okay, like they're implementing systems now. I'm getting automated email. I can pay with a credit card a lot easier. They can already pay with credit card. QuickBooks, right?

Yeah. None of them do, though.

Oh, really?

Yeah, I try not to get them to pay with credit card because of the percentage fees.

Okay, Okay.

I tell people it's like a last resort almost, you know, like, yeah, we'll accept credit card, but only if you don't have another way to pay.

Got it. Okay.

All right.

Well, even, even once they start seeing those improvements and those changes, the goal would be that when you do a price increase, they're like, okay, we understand that. We've seen the changes being made in the business. We see the automation starting to kick in. We see the ability to be able to see on a mobile device, things like that.

Right.

I think you'd keep 115 of them. And again, like $5, that is four cuts of literally three grand a month, $20.

So you, you think a number would be better or just a percentage?

I would rather you just do everybody and just say, okay, like, anyone under this certain cut price, we're gonna raise by five bucks. We usually like 40 bucks, you're at 40 below, you're gonna go from. You're gonna have a $5 per cup increase, and anyone above that is a $10 price increase. So if you're at 60, you're not at 70. Right. So just across the board price increase. Instead of getting wrapped up in like, okay, who have I priced increase before? How much did I bring up my lowest 25. Just raise it across the board. So you don't have paralysis by analysis, I guess.

Yeah.

Tear the band aid off Because I really believe more will stick with you than you think.

Yeah.

Even if you did that now, honestly.

Yeah.

I know it was just a few months ago you raised the 25 bottom 25. But if you did it now, I bet you have.

You think I should tell them why?

I would just be honest with them. Like, hey, I can't find people for the prices that we, for the wages that we can offer. And in order to stay, for us to stay in business with the cost of fuel going up and everything, I gotta raise prices. And again, like, I really believe what we gotta do is like literally just think of that price increase as a way to pay for the debt. Because then I won't bother you about debt. Like, hey, if I can go raise $5,000 more in profit, profit tomorrow, cover the debt. Okay. Now let's focus on the business. I'm just very, very concerned by 60,000 plus a year in debt service. Very concerned by that. And so that would be like, you know, literally if, if you raise prices, I guarantee you next week and you'd go from 125 to 115.

So I assume, I mean, you think it's a bad idea if I take out more debt.

I, I would, I. Is there. I do even have a confessional right now, bro.

Well, because I want to get another truck. I'm waiting for it to be built. Another?

No, you already have the order in.

Yeah, I put it in last year. But this truck's cheaper. Check it out. This truck is msrp. So I don't have to overpay for this truck. So I could actually sell that truck for more once I get it.

Are you gonna sell it?

No, that's not the whole point.

How much is it worth?

It's like a $90,000 truck. It's just identical truck to what I have now. You know, when it's made, when Ford gets around to making it. But hopefully by then I'm in a better situation. I know, but I'll have 60 grand in the bank.

This is, this is seriously like, this is seriously like almost like the drug thing. Because it's like I'm always gonna get better. I'm gonna get out of this. I can control this. And it's like, this is just as bad as drugs. It's like a, it's like a financial drug. Like you can always take more debt to get the business keep going on forward.

Yeah.

Like ultimately you can build a five million dollar business, but if there's so much, so much debt, there'll be no profit.

Yeah.

And it'll just be a, It'll just be a bigger mistake.

Yeah.

And so I would. Yeah, I would not be happy with that.

So you would rather see like me buy like a, a cheaper truck then?

I got an F150 truck that has 240, 000 miles on it that we use.

Yeah.

You know that. I know. It's like it's gonna break down.

You know what are you gonna need a new engine?

Yeah, but I don't want it.

A new engine is like 20 grand.

Let's say the tranny, but the tranny. I've been down that road where I've spent, you know, like nickeled and dimed when I first started out on repairing vehicles. I just keep throwing back in. And then you got a broken down vehicle that's always in the shop.

But you don't need, you don't need a $90,000 brand new truck built custom from Ford in order to fulfill the fact that of dependability. You can get a $60,000 four year old truck that'll still pull the same weight, have 20 to 40, 40,000 miles on it, and it'll still last you 10 years.

Okay.

And you can still get debt on it, but I still don't think you need the debt. Just the number is starting to get like really, really difficult.

Yeah.

Because that's, let's say it's 70, $80,000 of debt. We're not talking about 350, 360, 370 of debt. We're not talking About 7, 6500, $7000 a month in debt service.

Yeah.

So even if your business is really profitable, you take seven grand off the top of that, it's getting really, really skinny.

Yeah.

When's that supposed to be done?

I don't know. I don't know, man. Whenever I've been trying to put myself in a position so I can. Because I, I know right now I want to be able to get that truck. If they said, hey, it's built, you know, credit wise. I've utilized too much of my credit in the past year, you know, so.

And then there needs to be a spending freeze.

There does for what, a year?

There's no until you have X amount in the bank. And until the business is doing X amount of revenue, I would feel more comfortable if you said I will not buy any, have any more debt until a hundred thousand dollars per month in annual, in monthly revenue. All right. And 50 grand in the bank.

All right.

Yeah. Now that's.

We need those two. We need 50 grand in the bank, and we need 100,000 plus in monthly revenue. I think you can do 100,000 plus in monthly revenue probably next spring. That's not going to be the hard one. The hard part is, can you put the 50 grand in the bank to feel a little more comfortable so that when, you know, things come up, they just do.

Yeah.

Like, we weren't expecting your daughter to have this. We weren't expecting the dental thing. Like that stuff just pops up. But that can put you out of business when you're running the margins and the cash so low.

Yeah. Yeah.

So, okay, so next week we're switching to jobber or we're gonna be working on it.

100. Yeah, I'm gonna do my best.

Okay.

And then take.

Take a couple days off.

Let's look at 2023, because this is our last week. We gotta look at 2023 and put together the plan of revenue per month, profit per month, and cash in the bank. That's the only three numbers I want for, like, every month. Number, like top line revenue, what you're gonna hit from January to December, the profit from each of those months and then how much is in the bank account? Like, literally you could burn tomorrow and it would be okay.

Yeah.

And what does that number need to get to? And if you get to 50 grand in the bank on that bottom part, we can get a truck. I approve. I approve.

Cool.

All right.

Cool, man.

Sound good?

All right. Thanks, bro.

Thanks. It's awesome, man.

This has been the Mike Andes podcast. Now you have some ideas on how to take your business to the next level. And if you like what you heard, we have tons of lectures, interviews, and more over at the Mike Andy's YouTube channel. That'll be right up your alley. That's all we have for you today. We'll see you next time. Sa.