Art Shamsky- MLB New York Mets Champion- Miracle Mets 1967

Mike Hartman, performance mindset strategist. This is Develop the Mindset of a.

Champion with former Stanley cup champion, Mike Hartman. Welcome to another episode today. My guest is Art Shamsky. Art is a former major League baseball player who played for the Cincinnati Reds, the New York Mets, Chicago Cubs, the Oakland Athletics, and I did mention the New York Mets. We're going to get really deep into that. He tied a major league record by homering four consecutive executive at bats. Art, great to have you on the show today.

Mike, it's great to be with you. Thank you for inviting me.

So we do a lot of this. What we do is we share stories. It's called Stories to Develop the Mindset of a Champion. I really enjoyed our time together here in New York. We spent a little bit of time together during that commercial that we did together. And I love for people to hear your story, how you grew up as a youth athlete in St. Louis and you worked your way up to the major leagues. I'd like to hear a little bit about that.

Well, St. Louis was my home. You know, I still have a sister that lives back there. I grew up in a family where my dad was a frustrated athlete and had me throwing a baseball from the time I could walk. And he was really the catalyst that got me involved in the game. I really loved other sports, followed other sports, but baseball was really the one thing that I was really enamored with. A big fan of the St. Louis Cardinals, and my hero was Stan Musial growing up. And so, so I was a baseball junkie as a kid. And, and you know, when I decided to become a professional and move away from St. Louis, it turned out to be in my mind the best thing that happened to me. I played five years in the minor leagues and it's unfortunate now there is no minor league season. And who knows what's going happen to. To happen in the future because of what's going on with the coronavirus. But those years in the minors were really great years for me. Made some wonderful friends and really learned the game of baseball. But, you know, St. Louis was my home. I still get back there once in a while to visit my sister. But it's funny because I've been indoctrinated in New York City and the pace in New York is so much faster than anywhere else in the country that when I go back to St. Louis, I'm there a day or two and the pace is so slow. I just can't wait to get out of there and get back to New York because everything Is kind of slow and delivered back where I grew up and now in New York is much faster pace.

So going back to your St. Louis day. So you lived my dream As a young boy growing up in Detroit, My dream was to be a baseball player. So I played baseball every single day. And I lived right behind. So there was my house in Oak Park, Michigan, where we lived. And right behind it was a baseball. Baseball field. And when people were on the field, my grandfather, when I was five years old, would throw me the plastic. You know, we had that plastic pet bat. So I, I was a lefty and then in throughout the day. Actually, the funny thing was my father would come home from work and if somebody was practicing on the field when I got to be like 10, 11, 12, he would throw me high flies in the trees and make me catch it. I don't know if it's the smartest thing. Could have hit me in the head a couple times, but it's. I, I love baseball. So take me back to your St. Louis days. Did you play a lot of. Was it. Was it like pickup baseball with friends? And how did you get into baseball?

Well, I had good friends that all they wanted to do was play baseball like me. I think that was really the. The thing that got me started. We would go out in days, in the summer when it was really nice. And of course it was much safer back in those days, the years decades ago. But we would just go to the park and make up games. And we didn't need nine guys on each team. We could make up games, six, seven guys. And. And we love the game. And we all, we all really kind of all had desires to make it to the major leagues. And we all were big Cardinal fans, like I said earlier. But that was really the thing, I think that really got me going because my friends, that's all they wanted to do. There was nothing else that we didn't do. We either worked out, we played some basketball, we did other sports, but baseball was really the thing that we loved. And, and back then there wasn't any indoor facilities. So in the wintertime, you were kind of. You weren't able to work out and do the things. Not work out, but play baseball and practice the game. So we did other sports. But really baseball was really the thing that I loved and my friends loved. And the programs in St. Louis growing up were really good. The amateur programs from what we call the Corey League, that was the name of the little Leagues back then. And then you had American Legion ball and of course high school Baseball. And so all the guys that I played with were pretty good athletes. Unfortunately, none of them made it to the major leagues. But I did play against wonderful players who eventually made it to the big leagues and some big name players. And so the whole organization of baseball in that particular area was really good and developed players. I remember When I was 8 or 9 years old, I would, I would go with my dad, who was a Sunday softball player, kind of a frustrated athlete, loved softball. And they would bring me out to the park and I would just throw the ball up in the air and catch it myself. And one day they were a little short of players. And so somebody said, well, why don't let Art play? And it turned out that they wouldn't let me play because I was better at 8 years old than I was than any of those guys who were in their 30s and 40s. So I didn't get a chance to play in those games because I was better than them. But I started doing things that were just phenomenal. I thought from developing my game, I could take a bat, the ball, hit the ball up in the air like a fly ball and throw the bat down, pick up my glove and then run out and catch the ball. So I was able to do things. And I'm sure you did it as a hockey player where you could do things that other kids couldn't do. And I knew then that I had some ability and I just wanted to develop it and see where it would take me. But never ever thinking that when I was 13 or 14, that I'd ever make it to the big leagues. Even though I had the dreams that every kid has a dream for and to make it to the major leagues and still a big Cardinal fan. And as I started to play at that level at 13, 14, 15, I knew that I had ability, but I still wasn't as good as some of the best players in the leagues that I played in. And so it really made me, or forced me to really become a better player, work on things to, to, to develop myself as a player. And then when I got to be 17 at that time, there was no draft, so you could sign with whatever team you wanted to. And, and I had a bunch of scouts talking to my family about possibility of me playing. And I ended up signing a contract with the Cincinnati Reds for no other reason than they really treated me great. I love their uniforms. That was the vest, uniforms back then. But they took me to the busch Stadium in St. Louis and had me work out on the field with the big leagues. And I was just turned 17 at the time. And what a thrill that was for me. And they showed more interest in me than anybody else, even though there was a number of teams that were interested in signing me. So I ended up signing with the Cincinnati Reds. And then that winter worked out, tried to get a little stronger in. My first year in the minor leagues was when I just turned 18 and I played up in New York State, Penn League, which was Geneva, New York. And that was the beginning of my baseball career in the Cincinnati organization and eventually got traded over the Mets and was part of that World series team in 69. But those years in St. Louis were very formidable years for me. And I think the best thing I can have to say is that my dad got me out there playing at a very young age as soon as I could walk. But my friends who didn't do anything else but play baseball and sports really were the ones that were the catalysts in me developing the game. And really without them, I don't know if I would have ever just stayed in that focus of wanting to be a major league baseball player or minor league baseball player, at least to begin with. And I think they really were the special friends that I had growing up.

Yeah, you never forget those relationships. So you're in the minors, you play five years in the minors. And I know it could be tough down there even today with what. It's not even the money so much what they make or don't make, but it's a tough grind. And trying to crack that major league lineup. Was that. Is it any time in those years in the Miners, did you say, you know what, I just don't want to do this anymore?

Well, it was. You're absolutely right. The Miners were tough. And back then, remember, there was less teams. When I signed a contract, there was only 16 teams. And so it was much more difficult to make it to the major leagues. And then they expanded in 1962 and went to 20 teams. That's when the Mets came into existence, as a matter of fact. So they went to 20 teams and. Which really opened up a little bit more room. But my first year in the minor leagues was just an incredible year. I played on a team up in Geneva, New York, and I was on a team with Pete Rose and Tony Perez. And Tony, of course, is in the hall of Fame. And Pete got more hits than anybody in history game and probably should be in the hall of Fame. But here's the interesting thing about that. We were so bad as a team that we got the Manager fired. And that's how bad we. We weren't. We were suspects. We weren't even prospects back then. And it's interesting because both of those guys, the next year played another year of Class D. This was the lowest classification of baseball you could go to. They moved me up to Class B. My next year was in Topeka, Kansas, still with the Reds, but always with pretty good players. And then as I got another three more years after that in the minor leagues, playing against really good competition and was playing with some great young players, that was really the beginning of where I really thought I could have a chance. Even though you're playing against quality players, the fact that it was. That the competition was tough. And I think different than. A little bit different than now, where you rush to the big leagues, where, I don't know how it is in hockey compared to baseball. But in baseball, if you have a good year in a ball, you're in the big leagues the next year. They don't waste a lot of time with you. Whereas back in those days in the 60s, you had to pay your dues in the minor leagues. It just wasn't enough room in the big leagues. And I remember my next year I went to AAA. I played in 61. I played at Topeka. The next year I played in Macon, Georgia, which was. That was an interesting story in itself, playing in the Deep South. And then I went to AAA for two years. And my first year in AAA was in San Diego, which was a great place to play, and I had a terrific year. But here's a very typical thing of what happens to you back in those days. You have a great year in AAA and you go to spring training in the big with the big leagues and you have a good spring. And all of a sudden they say to you, well, where are you going to play? They had Frank Robinson in right field, guy named Veda Pinson in center field, guy named Tommy Harper. Rose was playing left field also. So they said you got to go back to aaa. So I spent two years in AAA even though I was qualified to be in the big leagues. But here's the good part of that scenario is that I played against guys who were in the same position as me who couldn't make it to the big league because there was no room. So consequently you played. I played another year in San Diego, which was a great place to play AAA baseball. But the whole league, which was Pacific Coast League, was with players who were not. Were close to the big leagues but couldn't make it because There just wasn't room. And so you played against these quality players which forced you to become a better player. It just made you want to work harder. And that was really the story. And finally made it to the big leagues in, in 1965 and, and spent three years with the Reds and then got traded over to the Mets. Which is really the best thing that happened in my baseball career because I was part of that 69 Miracle team. But the minor leagues really shaped my baseball career. Playing with and against some of the great players in baseball who went on to have great careers. And just in my early years with Cincinnati, mentioning Rose and Perez and Frank Robinson and Johnny Bench was there and a lot of great players. So I was lucky to play with and against some great players. But those early years really shaped my baseball life and, and made me. Enforced me to become work at it and become a better player. And I think I'm always be grateful for those years.

That's a great story. So you mentioned with hockey what happens is you. It's the same thing. Back when I first started there were 21 teams and, and in the NHL 10% of the players. So there were 400 players in the National Hockey League from Europe they started bringing Russians over, but 10% were Americans. So there were 40 or 45Americans playing. And your salary out of the gate isn't that much. It's a six figure salary. But you sign in, your first three years is a low salary. Then the bonus part is good, but not even the money part. It's really tough. And you mentioned something, the numbers are tough. So like I'm sure you thought this. I know there were guys better than me and sometimes I'm saying okay, how did I make it? Did you ever ask yourself like I want you to share that first big league game with me. And you're, you're, you're planning and what did you say to yourself?

Well, I think like everything in life, it's all about timing. I paid my dues with two years in AAA. I went to spring training in 1965. I believe I felt like I had a really good chance, although you never know, to stick with the club. I spent two springs earlier hitting, doing really well and just not making the team. And again the right, right field. Frank Robinson was there and they had basically the same outfield. But I think they saw that I hadn't played two years of Triple A and I, I was ready to, to, to, to make it to the big leagues. The thing I, the problem I had was that and they had is that they didn't want me just sitting on the bench the whole year. I batted 90 times, but to be in the big leagues at that point was still really great for me. And I ended up playing winter baseball that year because I only batted 90 time. So. So. But I felt like it was time coming off two really good years in aaa. And so I would have really been. I would have really been frustrated and upset if I didn't make it the third time after spring training those two years. And I'm not sure what would have happened. Knock on wood. Was able to make it and the rest is history. But. And then Frank Robinson got traded that next winter and I got a chance to play more and had a terrific year for Cincinnati in 1966 and then eventually was traded again over to the Mets. The winner of 1967, my first year. 68. But I think at that time, Mike, I really felt like I was destined to make it to the big leagues. And my very first bang, the very first game, believe it or not, was in St. Louis against a great pitcher by the name of Bob Gibson. And so yeah, I didn't start the game pinch. It took a called third strike and was devastated. Got called out on strikes and my first at bat was a strikeout. But it turned out that, that I would face him again not too, too much later, maybe a few weeks later. And then I hit pinch hit home run off of him in St. Louis again. So my. I was indoctrinated into the big leagues by one of the best pitchers in the history of the game. But, but that's okay. At least I can say it was against a great pitcher. But you know, baseball is a funny game. You're going to fail more than you succeed. You just got to find a way to learn from those failures and try to compensate when you do not have success. But it was a great experience for me to be playing in my hometown and, and I went back to have some great games against the Cardinals and, and so it all balanced out well.

We're going to fast forward another year. So then in 1969 you're the world Series champions and New York Mets, you batted. If I'm close to it, somewhere around 300 with 14 home runs. I mean and you mentioned failure in baseball. If you're batting.300, you're here, you're. That's not failing. You know, seven out of 10 times, you know, coming to the plate and hitting and hitting three out of. Out of ten. That's, that's pretty good. So share that experience with us because I got a World Series New York met story I didn't share with you when we, when we met that time here in, in New York. But I love to hear tell me that experience and the mindset you are in to win the World Series in 1969. What was that like?

Well, let me just take a step back because it's important to understand that when I got traded to the Mets, which was the winter of 1967, I had come off a year that I was really injured bad the year before. I had a terrific ratio home runs per at bat. I think I led the majors in home runs per at bat, 20 something home runs and only 230 at bats because I got hurt. And that's when I hit the four home runs in a row. That and the bats in the hall of Fame for doing that. But. But when I got traded to the Mets, my first reaction was, oh no, this is the worst team in baseball. I don't like New York. It's too big, it's too crazy. Team is awful. Known as the lovable losers. And I was in shock. And then when I got over here and met the players and really went to my first spring training camp with them, I kind of felt a lot more comfortable. That was the first year for myself. Gil Hodges, the manager, came over that year. Some great players, Tommy Agee came over, Al Weis, JC Martin, we were all new to the team in 68. And the fast forward though in 68 we didn't play great. We finished ninth a half game out of last place. So going into the 69 season, I remember spring training. Gil Hodges, our great manager, said, you know, you guys lost a lot of close games by one run. If you find some way to win some close games, you're going to be a lot better off than you were last year, finishing ninth. And it just made sense. It was pretty obvious. And even though we, we didn't start out great that year, we saw that we had some terrific young pitchers at Tom Seaver, Jerry Kooseman, Nolan Ryan, Tug McGraw, Jim McAndrew. I mean we had great young pitching and some really good young players. And so when we started the season, nobody ever thought we would even have a chance to win a division. That was the first year of division play. In 1969, National League and American League went to division play. So we're still not playing well as we get into the middle of the summer now we know we have a better team than last year. We're winning a few more close games. But going into August, we were still nine games behind the Cubs, who were leading the division, that National League east by. By nine games. And so all of a sudden we took off and we were unbeatable from the middle of August on and overtook the Cubs in some great series against them and wonderful games. And then went into the playoffs against Atlanta and we swept the Braves in three games. And I had a terrific series that year. Not to blow my own horn, but it's important because I didn't get a chance to play much in the World Series because he was platooning players. And I had a great series against Atlanta, seven hits and 13 at bats, and then went into the World Series. Didn't start the first game because they were pitching left and he was platooning myself and Ron Swoboda in right field, which collectively, we had great years, but individually, it really hurt us because if you couldn't put up the numbers, you couldn't do a lot of things. If you got into a hot streak, you just had to play and then sit out a game or so. It was an interesting scenario, but it turned out we won and everything was great. And winning in 1969, that October 16th day changed my life. I'm still in New York because of it. So many great things happened to us. And really the reason that that team still is relevant 50 years later and last year we had the 50th anniversary, Mike, is that the team was so bad in the early years, known as the lovable losers. Every year, team lost 100 games. And so for us to turn it around and win it all in a year that in the year where the jets won the super bowl, that we won, and then the Knicks won the NBA championship, all in that period of time. But also we're in a world that's upside down now. But back in the late 60s, the war in Vietnam was tearing the country apart. City New York was going under financially, socially, morally, spiritually. And what we did as a team helped people get through some tough times. And I think that legacy has been passed on from generation to generation. And being part of that team and winning a championship for me changed my life. And so so many things positive have happened to me that. That. Because I was part of it, you know, I played 13 years, and for all intents and purposes, nobody ever talks about the other 12. It's really about 1969. And even today, you know, I'm doing this podcast and people talk to me about. About. They want to talk to me about 69 while I'm interviewing them and people are calling me about talking about 1969. And I understand all the significance is because it did affect so many people. And those people who are still around have passed on their story about that team to their children and their grandchildren. And even though some of the stories have been embellished a little bit, the reality of it is it was such a phenomenal year for all of us, and we affected so many positive people because we were on that team. I'll tell you a funny story, which I talk about a lot over the years. I probably had 100,000 people tell me they were at that final game in October on the 16th. And I said to myself, well, that's great. I tell them it's great. And I realized that ballpark held about 53,000 people, Shea Stadium. So either they were there or they weren't there, but it doesn't make any difference, because if they were there, in their mind, it's all that's important. And I feel like I'm so blessed to have been part of that team because I think that once you can tell yourself that you've affected people in a positive way, there's nothing better in your life. I mean, if you've helped people get through some tough times. And because they listened to a ball game or because you did something good. I had Vietnam veterans tell me they fired off their weapon in the worst place in the world because they heard that we won or they happened to listen to the games. And I'm saying to myself, oh, my gosh, how did we affect these people in a positive way? And I think that's been passed on from generation to generation. And that's why that team, that 69 Met team, kind of resonates with people, not only just in New York, but there's so many transplanted New Yorkers all over the country, and people remember that. And I still get questions about it, and I still love to talk about it. And it's like, I never played those other years, but it doesn't make any difference because that year was so special for me.

There's nothing like winning a championship in New York. In fact, in hockey, as you know, the Rangers, we won in 94, and I got traded here, and I played very little. As soon as I got here, they said, hey, you're going to be an insurance policy. And at the time, you don't want to hear that. But when you're on that roster all year. And what. What our leader said, Mark Messier, is he says, we're going to walk Together we had, we got the key to the city. We just had the big ticker take parade. And I'll never forget it. It was just on TV this past week and I still have a tear in my eye when I watch it. And my girlfriend says, you ever get bored of watching this? I said, no, like, is like winning in New York. There's nothing like it. And I'll share a New York Met story with you. So we had a tough coach. Probably the toughest coach that ever coached in the National Hockey League was Mike Keenan. And what he did is he brought us the 30 players. He didn't have a big training camp because we had a neutral site to exhibition games in England. So just before we were going on our flight, he brought the 25 players that he had on the roster to this hotel where we had a meeting. And he didn't say a word. All he did was he showed the Mets winning the World Series and what it was like when the New York Mets won the World Series. That's one of our stories. He didn't say a word. He just turned it on and had us watch it. Like what happens when you win in New York? And that's, that's our New York Mets story.

That's a great story, Mike. I tell you, you're talking to a die hard New York Ranger fan and a big NHL fan. I, I love hockey. I think, I think it's hockey, Playoff hockey is the greatest. I love the, the up and down of skating and, and each rush could be the difference of the game. And I think hockey is so exciting. I'm, I'm hoping they get the season off this year. I'm, I'm a big Ranger fan. I was lucky enough to become friends with all those guys who played for the Rangers back in the, in the late 60s and early 70s. Roger Bear is a very close friend of mine and all those guys, Vic Hadfield and, and the Stemmer. Remember the Stemmer and all, what he did? Yeah, he's still around. And I remember watching Guy lafleur play and with the Rangers and his hair flying and I mean it just, I love it. And, and I think I'm so happy to hear that story. Was it the 86 series or the 69 series? Do you remember?

I think they showed both. I think it was the 86, but they also showed older footage of just the Mets. I don't know why it was the Mets. It's funny, my, I don't want to tell you. My grandfather grew up in Brooklyn and we grew up baseball people. In fact, my grandfather said, can't you play baseball instead of this hockey game? I said, I just, I played up to about 14. But yeah, it was. They were.

You made the right decision.

Well, I don't know, but the. Just looking, looking back, I can't remember. We were in the room and we didn't say anything. It just showed celebrations of the Mets. It showed an older float. So it had. It been back in 69 and it's maybe showed also the, the team in the, in the 80s, but I have a feeling it was further back and we didn't see, we watched. There was a parade. There were people going crazy in the streets. And that was the first thing that we did. So if you ever talked to any of the guys, and I see a lot of the guys here, you know, Raj Shilbert's a, what a, what a gentleman he is. And they're big baseball fans, really good, love baseball because they talk baseball all the time. So yeah, it was something special like, like we said here to play in, in New York and, and especially meeting you. I really enjoyed meeting you. I don't talk about. I know you're a baseball player and not a Jewish baseball player. We're so much alike because I say the same thing. I'm a hockey player. I'm not a. I happen to be Jewish, but I'm more than honored and privileged to be in the Jewish Sports hall of Fame with you.

Ah, thank you very much. Thank you.

More than honored. Yeah. And if you could just leave us, I know you have a book that came out. I don't know exactly when it came out. Do you want to share a little bit about your book and a little bit about what you're doing today?

Well, last year my second book after the Miracle came out. It really was a testimonial to the future 50 year anniversary. My first book was written in 2004. The Magnificent Seasons was about that season that year when the jets won in, in January, we won in October and, and the Knicks won in, in May of 70. But this book was really about the relationships that were developed over the years and how we've maintained those relationships and, and really wanted to do something special. So many books have been written about the 69 Mets. So I wanted to do something special and knock on wood, it became a New York Times bestseller. And it really is a book about how all these, the guys, even though we've lost 10 or 11 guys from that team was in the World Series, how the guys stay together and, and still maintain their relationships. Because part of the reason that we are like that is because we were such a bad team, and losing really kind of held. Held us together, and then winning held us together. And I think if you didn't have that feeling of losing and. And how hard it was to get to the top, then I don't think it would have been the same. And I think that was all part of it. And. And so the book. Yeah, I thank you for mentioning, is called after the Miracle. And I still get people going to my website wanting to buy it and wanting a. An autograph, a personal signature, and I'm always glad to do that. And. And so. And so it really, again, I played all those years, but 1969 stands out because of what we accomplish as a team, what we did for the city and the country. And at a time that was just a horrible situation in the time and going on in the country. And so I'm very proud of that book. I'm thinking about doing another one, you know, trying to stay busy with this new podcast. I'm doing that just to stay relevant and stay busy and stay connected to people. And still, I think that's really important, Mike, to stay busy and say things like, you're doing this show that you're doing, connect with people, because without doing that, we just kind of get lost. And I think the reality of it is if we can maintain some sort of connection with everybody, we're going to be a lot better off. And so hopefully we will. And I love doing these kind of shows. And thank you for having me on.

Well, we say it a lot because we work with many businesses. We tell businesses that winning a championship, and I've learned this. I won a couple championships, one of the minors, and I had won a championship here, which I always say I was a small piece to a big puzzle, but it's the same thing in business. And I tell people that life is built on relationships, and everything we do is around relationships, whether it's in sports or business and life art. I want to thank you so much for joining again. It's been an honor. It's been an honor meeting you. And again, just to, you know, being next to you in the Jewish Sports hall of Fame means a lot to me, and I'm a big baseball fan. So thank you so much for doing this, Mike.

My pleasure. If anybody wants to contact me or check on what's going on the podcast or get a book, they can just go to my website, archampsky.com and. And now all the information will be there. And anytime you need me to be on or anything else, just give me a holler.

No, we'd love to have you. So it's so it's art shamsky.com and yep, I and I recommend everybody go in there. And also the podcast. Is the podcast there as well?

It's on. The podcast will be there. They'll see all the information about where to go. It's on iHeart. It's on Spotify, but they can get it on my website. And they can also follow me on Twitter at rcamsky. So a lot of things going on. So whatever they would like to do. But the website's probably the best thing to do.

Art, thank you so much, and have a wonderful day.

All right, Mike, thank you. All the best.