10 Proven Strategies for Generating Passive Income with Build-to-Rent Properties

I've avoided real estate also. Yeah, I always said, oh my God, it just overwhelmed me and the thought of owning more stuff, to me it represented owning a headache.

Yeah. I want people to invest for the long term. This is not a six month thing. This is a building of a solid portfolio, a solid soldier that you can lean on for many years to come and maybe even pass down to your kids.

I think one of the first things, worst things you can ever do for your children is give them free money.

Yes.

Right.

2004, Hurricane Charlie went through there. Really sad, decimated. I had some relatives there. And after 2004, the rules changed on.

Building requirements in the case of a hurricane. If you're prepared, you know, and you do the go through the process and you understand also the success indicators, you know, you're protecting yourself from the downside and knowing who you're building with so you know, the materials are handled properly.

Everyone, welcome to Capability Amplifier. This is Mike Koenigs. I'm here today with my good friend Jim Shiels. Now, our most popular interviews on this show, believe it or not, involve family things, family values, family stories. And it's where I get the most comments. It's where you reach out to me. If you've got my, my text number, I get all these compliments and saying, I really loved the show last week when you talked about blah, blah, blah. Well, I originally met Jim Shields through Genius Network and Strategic coach. And one of the things that I was most impressed with is how committed he was to family. And he and I never talked about business, but eventually he invited me to something called 18 summers. Now, Jim's going to tell you more about this in a moment. But I ended up taking my son Zach, who's now 20, on a trip to Utah with some other families. And not only did we create great connections, I was able to deepen my relationship with my son. Now, through this experience, I was profoundly affected as a parent and I know Zach was too. But finally Jim and I started talking about business and I asked him what he does and he explained that he doesn't have to work because he has passive income coming in from real estate and as a partner in a development company. Well, I got my ears perking and this summer Jim and I were talking and he said, I'm growing and it's finally time for me to build my platform because I have 5,000 lots to sell. And my goal is to help other families achieve what I have and that is to get enough passive income coming in so they never have to Work again and then they can spend more time with their families. And I thought, well, now this is something I can really get behind. Plus he's got a really smart system. So Jim is going to tear apart his entire system today. So he's going to go through the mindsets, the rules and how you can achieve passive income like he has. And full disclosure, I'm going to tell you something that I'm really embarrassed to say right now. Now, I'm a great earner, but I've invested poorly. I've invested in lots of startups because that's what I knew. But very few of those have ever produced passive income and very few have produced cash flow. And I was always afraid to do what Jim is going to teach you today. So the majority of my investments are high risk, zero interest, angel investor loans for indefinite periods of time. Like for example one of them, I just got paid out after 15 years. I've got three more that are getting close to exiting but they're already at the 10 year mark. So if I had one regret, it's not meeting Jim sooner and learning from him. So, Jim, first of all, it's great to have you here today. I've been looking forward to our time together.

Yeah, me too, Mike. It's great to be here.

All right, so. So I think the first place I want to begin with you is tell us a little bit about 18 summers because I think that really provides a good way of understanding how your brain works and what's important to you, what your rules of life are.

Yeah, 18 summers really became a mission for my wife and I working with so many entrepreneurs and professionals. I wanted to see him not only be successful in business, but successful at home as well. And that's not always the case. You know, our, our number one focus is creating a legendary family life. I made that very clear. That is, that is my absolute focus and that's what I want to get out of this time that we're here. And I believe that we can create multiple streams of passive income in real estate. So, you know, you can have that active freedom now today, so your someday can be today. And you don't want to miss that time because it does go by fast.

Sure does, yeah. Now, I was just in Colorado, in Boulder visiting Zach this week. He turned 20 and our 18 summers are officially gone now and we're planning ahead. And he's resistant. There's always something going on, a reason why he can't. And just for everyone who's listening, what percentage of time do will you have spent with your children by the time the 18 summers are gone compared to what you have for the rest of your life. What's the typical numbers?

Yeah, this is a really powerful statistic. Yeah, almost 85% of the quality time you'll ever have with your child happens by the end of the 18th summer. And when you stop to think about it, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, sure does. They're going off to college, they're going into career. They're not at your side like they are when they're 10 years old. So it does change. Now, the thing that I like about this, that we really tried to outperform the norm. You know, I don't think you have 15% more time with Zach. I think you have 20, 25, 35, because you're being very intentional in some of the things that we teach to help support that.

Yeah, that's absolutely true. And that's a big takeaway. I.

I raised him, you know, I used to play Cats in the Cradle, that song, which haunted me for many years. And I just said, zach, this is how I don't want to live my life with you. And he was really. He has that. He brings it up. He writes about it when he writes letters and notes to me that, you know, we're not going to have a cat's in the cradle relationship. But thank you, Cat Stevens, for that bit of poetry. But let's also, I think there's one more framing issue I want you to describe, which is your relationship with your father. And that was a big motivator for getting us to like what you're doing right now and your other mission in life.

Yeah, my dad and I had an interesting relationship. I remember he, he put a greeting card, one of those, you know, greeting cards of a nice looking couple in an all white outfit walking down some beach in the Caribbean. And, and inside it, he wrote to my mom, he said, you know, this is going to be us someday. We're going to travel to these places and spend time here with us and the family. And it never happened. Mike, he never got the time. It wasn't lack of desire, it wasn't lack of integrity. He. He just never had the space. He never had the passive income. He never had the act of freedom. So he didn't get to do those things. And I wanted to live my life differently. It was a motivation to say, I'm going to live the adventure. And that's something that we've really stuck to our guns on.

Right on, right on. Well, the cat's in the cradle and the silver spoon.

Well, let's get into the how part. Just for everyone. Let's go through some of the stats. Because you've been in the real estate game for quite a while. You reached a very, very what I think people would regard as enough money that you can't spend it all every month, Although we always find a way to do that. But the. In terms of your passive income that's coming in, not to mention the equity that you have that you could borrow, you could leverage at any time. But talk about the firm that you have and what you have under management. Just go through some of the stats here. So people have a framing on your background your know how and wisdom.

Yeah. So our. The first goal was to get myself through different types of real estate investments we'll talk about to a certain number. And we didn't even start to create the system until I had that first check for 40,000 in a month. And that doesn't mean my other businesses. That's passive. That's things that are coming into seeds I've already planted. And so we wanted to create that same thing for other investors. And so we built our real estate investment company around something called Build to Rent, which we're going to talk about. And we've been able to achieve some pretty high remarks, my business partner and I, you know, 637 million under management, under asset management right now, 44 million in recurring annual revenue for our investors, 158 million in equity we've created for them. You know, we have over 1033 investors. 7500 units have been built. We're housing over 8200 residents right now. We've got a magic team of 162 people and growing every day. That number might be different by tomorrow. And then we're looking last year at 182 million in property sales. And with this mike in our 18 summers message, because everything we do, I'm really interested in building people passive income. But I think the cherry on top is having that legendary family life. And with that combination of our mission, our message, our investments, we've impacted over 375,000 families.

Yeah, no, it's great stats. And I think getting back to you and I both know plenty of miserable rich people and the regrets are I wish, I wish, I wish. I think building the legendary family life is a theme that I've always resonated in all the time I've known you. So I think one of the things I asked you to do Today was put together some scenarios because my brain would be going, is, okay, well how specifically how do these deals work? How's the passive income? What's the risk? Where do you build all those kinds of things? And historically I've avoided real estate also. I always said, oh my God, it just overwhelmed me and the thought of owning more stuff, to me it represented owning a headache.

Yeah.

And now I'm really on the other side of that. As you know, Vivian and I have been developing property in Mexico.

My intention is to get involved in your projects as well because they just make sense now, the more I dig. But maybe before we break down and do some of the case studies, let's just go through the who this is for, so the typical Personas and then let's get into some of the rules and also the success indicators. You know, what are your mindsets that you enter into that you follow and the rules that you ruthlessly follow to be successful?

Sure, yeah, we'll get into those for sure. Because that's really important if you're going to step into things the right way. And it's something that took us 25 years of blood, sweat and tears to create. But what we've come down to, Mike, again with the solo focus for the most part, is the build to rent model. People hear about it out there, the hedge funds are talking about it, they're dying to get in with us. And we've chosen to go a different route, working with a more sprawling group of investors, you know, individuals, and it's built a more solid company. But the build to rent has allowed people to get into properties in high growth areas with great fundamentals, less headaches, less, less maintenance, repairs. All those things that you had those fears of you and Vivian for years getting into.

Yeah. Getting a call in the middle of the night, my toilet's broken. And having to figure out all property management just seemed like a total nightmare and a low quality.

Low paying job. So I was like, screw it, I'm just not going to touch this stuff.

Yeah. And when, when you have that Mike, you're not looking to correct. Create a second or third job. Most of our people, business owners, busy professionals, they're doing pretty good in their career. They want a little passive space, you know, to have that active freedom now. So if they're going to create a second or third job, then the real estate's not doing its job.

Yeah.

And so what we want to do is create in a way where it's systemized, where it's been tested and proven and they can just step in and run with us from there.

Right, that makes a ton of sense. So in terms of the Personas, what is there anything else that your ideal. Right. Fit people have on their mind or want and don't want that you're able to communicate with them? Or should we just dive into the build to rent investment rules?

Yeah, again, they don't want to start from scratch. They have an interest in real estate and they want to have that legendary family life. When we've looked at some of our star clients that have gone on to build these passive incomes, they really did share that core value of us saying, I want to live my family life differently than maybe I had with my parents, or maybe that I thought was the norm. And that's been a common theme.

Right on. Okay, so let's get into.

The investment rules. So the frameworks, the mindsets that you found the most successful people all share in common and what you've developed over the past 25 years?

Yeah, so we came up with, with 10, there's 10 really build to rent investment rules. And these can be used with a lot of real estate. But especially with our niche and model which has, you know, made the most money for our clients. The first thing is you invest for the long term. Every everyone talks about timing the real estate market, Warren Buffett as a saying, you know, if the market closes down for 20 years, I don't care because I'm buying for intrinsic value. This is not a six month flip period. This is when you look at real estate for the long term and when you can look at real estate for the long term, anytime you're not trying for a quick and desperate entry or exit, you've been able, as long as you're following certain fundamentals which we'll talk about, you're able to have a steady growth both in cash flow, both in equity, both in positioning. And that's really important. So I want people to invest for the long term. This is not a six month thing. This is a building of a solid portfolio, a solid soldier that you can lean on for many years to come and maybe even pass down to your kids. But this is absolutely long term.

Okay, number two, and number two, you.

Know, there are five different ways you can make money in real estate. You know, at least five different ways, but five that we focus on now. Cash flow is important, of course, you know, and that's a starting point. But there's also things. There's the value increases, there's the rent continuing to increase, there's A lot of tax benefits, from cost segregation to other things that can help you. There's principal reduction, which your tenant is paying down the note you have against from the bank. And they also can allow you to refinance. And now this is a great thing because refinancing, you can pull money off of a property tax free, put it into another property or use it for another business or whatever you choose. And you're not paying the bill like your tenant is. Yep.

That's how rich people pay for their lifestyles. Right. You borrow against your equity, take it as a loan, and, you know, ideally find ways to make sure that that's a loan you never pay back. Thank you very much. All right, next, what's number three?

Yeah, you're going to invest in good areas and good neighborhoods. Y this sounds too simplistic, but it's really important. A lot of the old things out there were, you know, get into a cheapy, rough neighborhood that's again going to probably create that second and third job you don't want. What I've actually found is this more middle of the road around the median income, median price of a home. If you can get into the right markets there, you're going to have less turnover, less headaches. And there's also going to be a better saleability down the road and a better value growth overall in all five areas that I just talked about.

Right on. Okay, next, what's the number four?

Yeah, this one's not going to be too popular, Mike, because it's on all the shows. And that's the fixer uppers. Fixer upper rentals. Now, I survived 2008, which was not a fun time for real estate investors, but they say if you can almost like New York. If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere. Yeah, you made it through. Oh, wait, then you have some pretty solid fundamentals and you probably learned some lessons. One of my biggest lessons, I had a lot of properties and a lot of them I bought with deferred maintenance. That means there was stuff that needed to be fixed up on them. And the problem with deferred maintenance properties, well, that bill normally gets called in the bad times. You don't want to be getting a bunch of repair bills and a lot of turnover bills. The tenants leaving in bad times. It's also harder to rent that property in a bad time because one of our things is. I'm always looking at the upside, Mike, but I want to protect the downside. One of the best ways to protect the downside, if I was talking to my brother in law, like right now, I called the brother in law rule. I'd say, and I like my brother in law, some people might not like, yeah, I would say own less, a better quality with less leverage. You know, get into it, right. And then don't have a bunch of repairs sitting around because they get called at the least time you want it. So get into good repairs. That's why we went into new construction. Total game changer on those fundamentals.

Yeah, that makes, to me, it makes a ton of sense. And number, number five.

Yeah, number five, you're going to let experts manage your properties. Right? We're looking here for passive income in a legendary family life. I can't tell you how many busy professionals, business owners that got into real estate and it might not be in their backyard. They're like, gosh, I shouldn't have gone outside my backyard. They're trying to manage properties from afar. Well, they've just created that low paying second or third job. Let the experts manage your property. When you get a good expert, it's property management pays the least and I think is one of the worst parts of the game. So if you can sub that out, it's one of the best things you can do.

To me, it makes a ton of sense. Stuff I never want to do. Okay, number six, and this goes right.

Into rental properties are for cash flow, not for charity. Let me explain this. So I started my career right up in Bakersfield, California, right up the road. And when I first bought my first dozen or so properties, I was managing myself. And Mike, I wasn't really smart. I started to combine my rentals with my, my charity. And let me tell you how that happened is a tenant would call with an issue or something's happening, and my heart was bigger than my head and I would accept the excuse, and I can tell you dozens of times of doing that, never once did it work in my favor. Never once. And I wasn't able to give anywhere else because I was giving all my charity to my rentals. And the one thing I tell people they have to remember is no matter what you do, you can't call up Wells Fargo and say, hey, can you delay my mortgage? It's not going to happen. So you got to keep a certain line on your rental properties. They're there for a certain reason and it's not charity. Keep your rentals and your charity separate. I believe in both, but now I keep them separate.

Yep, I couldn't agree more. What I always tell everyone I work well, the classic no good deed goes unpunished. Yes, and that is, it just doesn't matter. You'll end up with resentment. And if you give an inch in this, you never let the inmates run the asylum. That's another good one. But I've, I've said this for years and it sounds coarse and harsh until you live through it a dozen or so times, which is if you work with a broken broken or you'll, you'll wind up broken broken too. And that's why it's a lot better to find someone who's great at delivering charity. Give to a charity, let them distribute, and they know the signs of fraud. And in this case, having a professional management organization making the call, not you being once removed. And that's why, in my opinion too, you don't want to negotiate your own deals. You bring in a professional because you're going to get emotionally hooked somehow and someone's going to know how to manipulate you and push your buttons.

Exactly. And that can be avoided by the step before this of hire the expert. Now you're separated and there's really not even a chance for you to do the charity because they know better.

All right, this next one, couldn't agree with more.

This became a big one in the last two years. You know, obviously in the good times you want to be able to collect your rent. In the bad times, you really want to be able to collect your rent. So things have to be looked at state by state now, and you need to look at investing in landlord friendly states. If you're in an area where you can't collect rents and you're sitting on your hands for 10, 12, 14 months, that can really start to eat into you. Instead of these feeding you and giving you that legendary family life and active freedom, it does the opposite. So this is a simple rule, but something that I've really learned. That's why we're in Florida, which we'll talk about. You want to go where it's landlord friendly?

Yep, that makes sense. The worst partner you'll ever have is the government in any business for sure. All right, next.

Yeah. You're going to plug into a support team. You know, I know you and I have had lots of conversations about business on the sidelines and it's like, why can't I just plug into something that's already there? I don't want to create a lot of low paying jobs like you were just talking about. You get manipulated by a tenant. Well, you're not an expert at credit readings. You're not an expert at searching for past criminal activity. You're not an expert at, you know, verifying income. Or do you want to really do those jobs or do you want to be scouring through to find the deals to work, the pulling of permits, all these little things that go into it. Plug into an existing system, otherwise you're going to create that second or third job. That's what we're trying to not do. So I always encourage go for a vetted system. Plug in.

Right on. All right, next up, we've got number nine.

Yeah. With going into Build to Rent, we're going to get more into the fundamentals. But Build to Rent really did change the game. It took so many headaches out of it, gave so many more dynamic fundamentals. And you do want to do this, though, just because it's Build to Rent, you want to make sure they have a track record. Do they have a profitable track record? If someone is saying, hey, I'm a build to rent company, we're going to build you a few homes, wherever it is, you say, how many have you built? And they're like, oh, we're about to build our first three. It's never a good idea to be the first guy in. You know, you want to look to someone who's built at least a thousand properties, and I think then they've had the chance to work out the kinks, work out the systems, and probably give you exactly what you're looking for with this passive income without a second or third job.

Right. And you want someone who's survived a couple down cycles. Because I know just historically speaking, the stuff that breaks, the stuff that falls apart, the stuff that turns into a problem, usually isn't going to show up until three, five, ten years later. And you got to know what you're dealing with.

Yeah.

So, yep, that makes tons of sense. All right, number 10.

Number 10. Mike, in real estate, you never stop learning. I'm going into my 24th year full time. I'm still learning, I'm still digging into different readings, masterminds. You never stop learning. So that's why you want to usually plug into a support team that is going to give more learning to you, provide more learning to you, keep you up on the cusp of what's happening. But don't think that you can just close your eyes. You want to keep learning this. Yes. You can delegate a lot of the work, but you want to keep learning of what you're investing into.

Yep. Well, and, and just full disclosure, one of the reasons I wanted to have you on is right now I'm doing everything I can to get educated. It looks like you and I are going to end up doing relationship, you know, collaborations for the long haul here. And I really feel like anyone who's got a platform should get you on the platform. They should be interviewing you and talking to you, especially if they want passive income. This is to me one of the smartest, long term, safest things, especially given the fact that demand right now for residential real estate has never been higher. You've got big, big, big money starting to move into it and the fear smaller individuals might have is, well, there won't be room for me. What if all these big hedge funds come in and swallow everything up? What if the big private equity goes? And you know what, there's always opportunity for smart entrepreneurs who think like smart entrepreneurs.

Yes.

So you also have number 11.

So, yeah, this is the bonus. This is kind of the cherry on top, the super glue. You know, now is the best time to get your kids involved in the money game. Yeah, we've spent a lot of time together with our families. I think people come to us for the real estate and passive income and they stay because of the family blueprint that we share. You know, we have a very different family life when it comes to how we run things. Our relationship with money, their involvement. You know, my wife, as you know, she is the dynamic enterprise leader of our five children at home, but also does have involvement in some of our biggest decisions in the real estate business, some of our bigger strategy and our children, our teens, well, they sit in on our accounting meetings. You know, they're going out to the projects with me. They're starting to run their own businesses and then reinvest back into real estate. And I think it's really important this active learning is going to create younger, active freedoms and that's what we want for our kids. I don't want them to suffer like that. I'm not going to do the push ups for them, Mike, but I do want to teach them in a different way. And the family blueprint that we've designed to help our real estate investment family has really been kind of the, again, the superglue that brings us all closer together and it brings a little deeper meaning to that legendary life we all want.

Yeah. No, and I look at this now through the lens of, I think one of the first things, worst things you can ever do for your children is give them free money.

Yes.

Right. I no trust fund people. And they're so miserable they're, they're just. They're literally in a prison because they never learned how to make more and they're stuck with what they have, and it's just a miserable world. So I'd never want to create a family environment where my kid doesn't have useful skills.

Exactly.

And I'd also say if this is something I would have learned, let's say, when I was just starting out, so around my 20s or so where my son is right now, I could have eliminated 20 or 25 years of pain as a business owner, entrepreneur, if I would have understood these principles and been able to implement them sooner and be able to build towards smarter passive income. That has a long tail value component.

Absolutely.

So that I think is a good reason to move over to why Florida. And also, what have you found? You put together the predictable success indicators. And again, I think there's a lot to be learned here, a lot of depth of wisdom. So let's hear the five.

Yeah, well, Florida, you know, just to go back to, first of all, build to rent is what we focus on. Right. We are building investment property for ourselves and investors in high growth areas. High growth areas have less risk. Why? Because there's fundamentals and wind at our back instead of in our face. Right, right. So these are very simple principles, but it's something that a lot of people completely don't look at. They get really excited about the look of a house without looking into the numbers, the underlying market. And there's indicators. And we want to make sure that people look at these indicators, no matter where they go, for their passive income. But the first thing that you want to do for Florida. So why did we go to Florida? Well, Mike, I go through these five indicators. If I don't have all five, I'm not going there. And these five have proven to be a winning formula for us. When I've followed them, I've won. When I haven't. We know how that goes. So the first thing I always look for is economic growth. Economic growth. Is the area growing in the local economy? Are there more jobs being provided? Are businesses being incentivized to move there? And also with economic growth, is there economic growth just in the field of real estate right now, in the industry? Well, the answer is, as you know, we talked about, we're talking about a huge amount of houses that need to be built. Between January 2012 and 21, there were 12.3 million American households formed, but only 7 million houses were built.

Yep.

Okay, so we're way behind. And that's been behind since the meltdown of 07 08. So I'm always looking for that. So there is a shortage in demand. Florida, for example, for population growth, which is number two, that is the fastest growing area in the nation right now. So you want to go where the population's growing and you want to go where economic wise. Again, I don't want to go to a town, Mike, where there's one business or one army base. I want to go where there's a multiple of industries thriving and with people growing there. So the first one is economic growth. The second one is population growth. Is the population growing or not?

This will end up answering why maybe Austin, which has been a high growth area for a long time, might not be the right place to move to. And the same thing for San Diego, for example. You know, you look at San Diego.

This is not right now a good place to build. And it's not because of economic growth or population growth. It's some of the other reasons when.

We'Re looking to make monies in those five ways. And we'll do San Diego at the end of these predictable passive income indicators. Let's test San Diego on why it might not work. It's pretty interesting how that works. Now, the third thing, and this is what it has to do with, is affordability. The affordability index is absolutely key for having that success indicator and keeping yourself out of trouble. So, for example, we're in Florida. High growth markets in Florida. Let's start with Jacksonville. Jacksonville has been our hub market since I moved there from Bakersfield, California about 17 years ago. Now, the median price for a home in Jacksonville right now is about 298,000. Okay. The median family income in Jacksonville, just over 60,000. Let's go back closer to you guys to Salt Lake City. Salt Lake City is a really great market. A lot of California people going over there to invest. A couple of problems, though. Let's look at affordability index. The median family income for each household there, Mike. Just over 60,000, same as Jacksonville. But guess what? The median value of a home is a lot higher. 585. Okay, so you're almost double. Almost double the cost of a home with the same amount of family average income. These are the things that you want to look for to make sure you're getting into the right market. Because when you get in at a good affordability index, which means the median value of a home and the average family income is in a healthy relation, that means there's normally going to be more growth and cash flow, because this is about including cash flow in your investments. Other areas, you won't be able to get that.

Okay. All right, well, let's get into the last two then.

Desirability. You know, I learned for Florida people like to live in warm weather. They like certain amenities. And are. Are those there? This is a pretty easy one. But is something drawing them to the area? Warm weather, lifestyle amenities. These are things that I look for and a lot of people overlook that. I don't want to just buy cheap in a place where no one really wants to live or there's no draw going there. That's a very dangerous situation. I want to go to a place that high, has high desirability.

Yep. Hey, action taker Mike Koenig's here, and I just wanted to interrupt for a second and let you know that if you're ready to reinvent yourself and your business, go to connecttomike.com to learn more and book a conversation with me right now. All right, back to the episode. All right, so let's talk a little bit about number five. What is that and why is it important?

This is the old economic rule, Mike. Supply and demand. I don't remember much from college economics, to be honest with you. That was the one that stuck out. You know, you want to go where there's more demand than there is supply. So that's why we're in Florida. So before the lockdown, Florida was already behind on housing. So, for example, southwest Florida is the fastest growing area in the nation. And we got a report from the municipality down there, which is the county, about needed rental inventory. You know, rental properties for the amount of people moving there. And before the lockdown even, they were three years behind on needed rental inventory. So that means it was going to take them three years to build up to what they needed that day. And then all of a sudden, we had more people moving there. So that's why I like high growth markets. If I'm a builder and we're building houses and investment property for our clients, obviously I want to go where they can't keep up with the supply of housing and there's more tenants than there is property, that's a great position to be in. That's someplace we always go. In fact, we won't go into any of our 14 markets in Florida until all five of these indicators are hit. And like I said, let's go back, though, for that question about San Diego. This is pretty cool. So San Diego, economic growth. Absolutely, right. Absolutely it does. Population growth.

Yeah.

How could you not want to live here? Number three, affordability.

Definitely not the price, average price of a house. I don't even know what it is right now, but it's insane.

This is a big one. This is like having a nice sports car and only having three wheels. Right. This is a big one. You can't have this one off. The affordability is out. Desirability, terrible. Absolutely. Supply and demand, huge. There's not enough housing. But that, number three, this is a huge thing that people overlook. If your affordability index is out of whack, the odds of getting cash flow and being able to have that safety position and, and be able to make money in all five ways goes down significantly.

Yeah. And. And right now, given between interest rates, all the other factors, there just isn't enough upside.

Yeah.

There is one other thing, too. I don't know exactly what it is right now, but in terms of population growth, for at least a good chunk of time, the inflow, outflow was pretty similar.

Yeah.

It wasn't growing at a significant pace.

That's true. That's true. So.

And honestly, I don't even know economic growth. Well, the bottom line is it's not spiking like Florida. And even though I think the desirability is very, very high here, it's just, you know, the ordinary wage earner is struggling like crazy here, and you don't want to be around a bunch of strugglers. It means you probably won't get paid. So all that makes sense. So what about. So we talk about Florida. In the case of right now, we just had a significant hurricane. So what about hurricanes? What about weather? How have you protected against that downside?

Yeah. And I showed you that video the other day of Punta Gorda, Florida. So let me tell you a little bit about Punta Gorda, Florida. 2004, Hurricane Charlie went through there. Really sad. Decimated. I had some relatives there. And after 2004, the rules changed on building requirements. So remember when you and I used to go out in high school and your parents like, don't drive fast and put your seatbelt on. And you're like, oh, yeah, whatever.

Yeah, sure, whatever.

But then you actually got in that fender bender and your seatbelt was on. You're like, I'm really glad that they told me to wear my seatbelt. Right.

Yeah. My first fender bender, I wasn't wearing a seatbelt. It was before. We just regularly did it. And from that day on, I wore myself because I had a big old lump on my head. But yes. Well, that lesson.

Right. Yeah. The hard way. We. I've learned the hard way too many times in real estate. So we want to avoid this for ourselves and our bigger client base. We have over a thousand people we have to keep safe now and the best performing. So, gosh, we got to bring in all this extra dirt. We got to build to these higher requirements, these extra fasteners. This costs so much money. Then a hurricane comes through. Yeah, they changed it in 2004. So all our new construction has to be built to a higher standard. That's huge. And that video, if you watch and we'll include it, I'm sure in some.

Of, we'll drop it into B roll for anyone who's watching this. And if you're listening, head to the show notes so you can watch the video.

Yeah, it's really fascinating because this shows the day after Hurricane Ian, which is the hurricane we're talking about, went over first Fort Myers and then over Punta Gorda. And you're going to look at the video, Punta Gorda and go, gosh, this doesn't look bad. There's some wind. And why? Well, because the whole place was rebuilt to the new standards of today. Now the sad thing is you go to Fort Myers, which was old Florida construction, built 40s, 50s, it really suffered, which is sad. But these new dynamics of building requirements are huge and help give a safety score. So what we do is we actually had a couple hundred projects going on in southwest Florida. We're building in Fort Myers, we're building in Punta Gorda, where the eye went right over. We didn't have problems. In fact, after a few hundred projects, it's about 287 projects down there. We had four properties under construction that we needed to file insurance claims on. So our construction business handles that through our insurance. And it was just over $5,000 with no flooding. Now, in hurricanes, you don't want to flood. Flooding is the major damage causer, not even wind. So what we learned was this. Gosh, I'm really glad that we got held to a higher standard. You know, the old parents, wear your seatbelt, build to a different standard. Also, the majority of our property properties, Mike, are built five miles inland, even though they're in coastal areas. I'll explain why underwriters of insurance know what they're doing. They have their big thick spreadsheets, right. Of how to analyze risk. All these things happen.

Worse at the coast and less five miles inland. So we build more than five miles inland to lower the risk. Also, your insurance payments go down because they're underwriting your insurance and that helps add to your cash flow. So hurricanes are something that you need to be aware of. You know, I went from California and got used to earthquakes and I had to handle hurricanes once I went to Florida. But now we've learned after a big stress test like that, if we're still building to today's standards, staying away from the older homes and building five miles inland, that was a really big test with Hurricane Ian and we're very, very happy with how we came out of it.

Yeah, no, that's, that is a great story. And you know, I'll say here in San Diego, well, in California, I joke with my family about this. I'll take an earthquake over a blizzard any day. To me, they're little tummy tickles that you wake up to in the morning. But in the case of a hurricane, if you're prepared, you know, and you do the go through the process and you understand also the success indicators, you know, you're protecting yourself from the downside and knowing who you're building with. So, you know, the materials are handled, modeled properly. So that is, those are, that's a great answer. Now, before we get into some of the case studies, I'm going to just tell our listeners, our viewers right now that you can get the deck and a bonus webinar from jim@jjplaybook.com so if you want to download, look at some of these stats, see some of the graphs that Jim's been talking about, they're all embedded in there. So it's something I definitely recommend is head over to JJPlaybook.com, we'll also make sure that you've got a transcript of this show that you can dig through if you weren't able to write all these things down. So why don't we dive in, Jim, to some of the case studies because I think these really get into some real life scenarios and we'll get into some of the real money as well. You've gotten permission from these folks to talk about them where they are because nothing makes it more real than real life people.

Yeah, absolutely.

So let's dig into the first one.

Yeah. Let's start with Tom Tusenot. Tom's great guy, former Air Force. He owned his own mortgage company. He came to me through, through a referral and he said, I really want to step, take a step back from my mortgage company. And he bought into some new construction rentals, did really well with them invested.

How many properties did he start out with? Let's put that Into.

He started out with five properties. Properties. So our. Our most successful people that are building a portfolio usually start out with three to five properties. And then the plan from there is you invest in three to five properties, and then within a few years, you refinance and you take some of that equity and you dump it into more properties. It's how I built my wealth. When people say, how did you go from less than zero to over 40,000amonth? That was one of the major vehicles. So that's what we try to do for our people. And this is what Tom followed. Yep. And it was a real.

Oh, go ahead.

Oh, no, you go ahead.

Oh, well. What I was also going to say, I think this is another important thing, is the way your deals are structured. We don't have to get into the real meat, but they're very low down payment. And then.

You don't have to continue additional investments until the properties are completed being built. So you've de. Risked them considerably as well.

Yeah. This is a good example. Tom knew about real estate, and I remember one of the first things he says, oh, do I need to get a construction loan? Because anyone who's built a home out there, you know, there's all these extra paperwork, and it's more risky, and there's a lot more interest payments that you have to make. The way our system was set up, Mike saying, mike, you're buying five houses with us. All you need to do is get a permanent loan at the end. We're going to cover the construction. You got to put up your deposit, of course, but all you need is. Is that one permanent loan at the end. So Tom was saying, ah, that's great. Okay, you guys are taking care of that. So you're on the hook during the building period if our hurricane comes through, you know, if. If anything happens, I don't need those extra fees. Awesome. So that's what Tom did.

So great. And. And you've got people in there renting almost immediately. So it's. So the. The whole idea of cash flowing with minimal amount of risk, this is, again, I think it's a brilliant part of your business model. If I were in this business, I'd totally knock what you're. You guys are doing off in a heartbeat. But keep on going. This is awesome.

Yeah. So let's talk about numbers. And then the bigger picture, the superglue. So Tom threw his properties in four years, over a million dollars worth of equity, over $11,000 in about the estimated monthly cash flow right now of what he's making. And he texted me, Mike day of my adoption of my fifth child, which might come up on this conversation. Not this past summer. And I think they'll probably show it on the screen. You know, he was asking how the adoption ceremony went, and he wrote to me, hey, I retired from Fairway Mortgage yesterday. And you played a big part in making that happen. That felt really good. And he had just told me six months earlier that the new plane he got, his last rental property, he bought just so it could pay the payment on the plane.

Sweet.

So this is, again, the legendary family life. And that's where I can't really explain our business model completely, how the family ties in. It just does. That's why we're here. And Tom and I had also something in common. You know, 11 years ago, I donated a kidney to my father. Profound moment in my life. Well, when Tom came into my life about six, seven years ago, his wife was needing a kidney donation. I was able to give them a Rolodex number of a couple people at the Mayo Clinic, introduce them to different things. I wish I had known. And obviously, this was a bonding experience. And I'm glad to say, especially with my wife involved, you know, how she's just such a guiding light on the. So many things. They became personal friends, know our family well, and. And they're living that legendary family life.

Yeah, no, I think it's great. And.

You know, people come for the money, they stay for the community, they stay for the family. And that's really the sign of a great business. And anytime. Anytime you can get either a private plane or a private jet out of a deal, I'm all for it. I'm all for it. You like flying private now? Well, it's. It's.

Owning a time machine is really what it is. It's a time machine.

That's true.

So let's dive into case study number two.

Case study number two. Amina Goodwin. She is an absolute sweetheart. Immigrated to The United States. Dr. In New York. Loves her family. In fact, they've come on some investment tours with us, the whole family, which was really fun. But she wanted a little space. She does very well as a doctor, but we wanted some space in that passive income for that active freedom. Her children were young. She wanted to be there. She worked really hard to get where she was. So she started investing in properties with us. Invested in properties. Her first three properties. She started with three properties, has grown into a few more. And now in the first two years, Mike, she was up 638,000 in equity and her cash flow is around $5,700 a month today. That's a real support to give that active freedom. When we're saying where's that extra money going to come from? What's going to give me space? This is it. I know it did it for Amina and it's great to see it. Couldn't happen to a nicer person.

Yep, yep. No, it's, it's good. I love Nothing hooks me better than, than immigrant stories. It's what makes this country great. Next up. Well, it's number three.

Number three is Adam Hamilton. So, Adam, this is a really interesting one. Adam, again, a referral for us. He called, he asked a lot of questions, a lot of questions. But I could see he was a smart guy, very interested. He had done a few properties in Utah where he lived, but he wanted to make sure that he, you know, he'd never invested outside his backyard. He'd always managed his own property. We've heard about these shams of really crappy properties that, you know, aren't going to cash flow and you're going to get stuck with. So we actually said to Adam this was a little bit of a whim. I said, look, we just bought the house next door as a vacation rental. Why don't you and your wife come to to stay in it and see the properties? He did. His wife came, who's a sweetheart, but at the first wanted us to prove ourselves and started to ask a lot of questions. Well, long story short, they started with five properties and they've gone on to buy several more. His wife bought their own properties. She's a realtor, referred people to us. Adam also got involved in our family masterminds. He had three young kids. He wanted to follow some of the systems and strategies that we were using because he was really impressed. Our son started tutoring his younger children. So it was a very intertwined thing of both real estate and family. What's cool too, being in our family masterminds. You know, I opened up my Rolodex. I just try to introduce people like you, Mike. And with some of the introductions, I was able to meet with Adam. He went on to do other deals that I wasn't even involved with with and I know comboing with those. Adam is now up to over $20,000 a month in passive income. He's created two and a half million dollars in equity. And that was just starting with five properties.

Yeah, that's a, that is a great story. And I think, you know, one of the objections that I would have, you know, would be like, okay, well, I'm out in San Diego. I'd be afraid, at least until I got exposed to how the systems work here, of having property in Florida. And you can, can get past that hump.

Yeah. You know what I remember Adam saying he was looking to work with a couple of different real estate groups when he called me. And again, he asked a lot of questions, but they were all fair questions. He said the absolute killer for him is when people would discourage. This is important for people to hear. If people discourage from you to visit their operation up close and personal, huge red flag.

Yeah, for sure.

Now for me, we love visitors. Please come visit us. We want you to visit us because our retention rate once someone visits, 95 plus percent. Because they meet the team, they see the operations, they go into the market, they get a feel of everything. And that's a key element that you want to keep an eye on. Anyone encourages you not to come visit. Big red flag.

Yeah. Well, I think one of the things that will pop in to B roll here so folks can see it are like some views of the properties and the neighborhoods and some of the drone shots so they can see the construction. So I'll make sure that my team is dropping those in as well. Now, one other person that you've worked with is someone that I indirectly know through a mutual friend of ours. And you got introduced to him through another mutual friend, Daniel. But let's talk a little bit about David Phelps because there's. This is a different relationship. And again, my goal in asking you to do these case studies would be not just to show the folks you're working with, but the people you partner with too, because there's some great opportunities for collaborations inside of here.

Yeah, this was an interesting one. So David came through mutual friends of ours. And David runs a group called Freedom Founders. And his mission, retiring early as a dentist by investing in real estate was to help other doctors and dentists do the same thing. So he has a very exclusive mastermind group for high net worth doctors and dentists. And his goal is to.

Strengthen their finances and their life overall. Really a phenomenal organization. And the way we first met, he said, hey, will you come in and give one of your 18 summers talks? I went in, gave one of my 18 summers talks, made friends with a lot of people in the group, and he tapped me on the shoulder and said, what is this? Build to Rent. We've been wanting to get into Build to Rent. So long story short, that was a Few years ago. Now, David, with his collective group of doctors and dentists that I've worked with for a few years now, a couple of things. Right now, they've bought a few dozen houses. Their cash flow, and almost $12,000 a month. They've created $2.7 million in equity. They're also involved in one of our private real estate funds, so they invested about $9.2 million into it. It's performing at 12.2% right now for the last few years, which pays them out about $9,300 a month in dispersible income they receive every month. So the good thing for this is when David forms a group and wants to get the best for him, his job is to vet. So being able to vet someone that shares his values, because family is very big to this group and someone that has a track record, been there, done that, in a hot industry like Bill Durant, was a great combination in marriage. David's become a good friend. I love working with him.

Yeah, no, it's. And again, I wanted you to share this just because one of the things that you're really, really good at, it's the way we met is starting with the family values component. And invariably, people get to know you and they do exactly what I did, which is, all right, great. How do you manage? Like, I remember meeting you going, is this guy. I thought at first you're basically a trust fund kid.

Yeah.

Because I saw you were. You had a great lifestyle. You never talked about working. I didn't see you working. I saw no indication of it other than I'm, you know, I'm like, okay, it's 18 centuries. There's no way you're making any money doing this. And I'm like, do you make any money doing this? You go, no, I don't make any money doing this. I'm like, trust. Something doesn't. Yeah, something doesn't add up. And then once he told me, I was like, all right, I've. You know, the holy grail of true passive income is usually my BS detectors just flashing like. Like heck.

So let's.

What I'd like to do. If you want to pick one more case study, let's do one more case study that you think is relevant. And then I'd like to go through the playbook.

Sure.

You know, the. Actually, the. The final rule set that people can model, and then we'll give them some more resources to grab as well. So what else do you want to pick?

Well, first, I want to give you a little credit oh, so let's talk about a past conversation. Because it was this weird thing that I had in the first real ten years of, of doing my real estate investments and then starting to get into helping families. I kept the world's completely separate.

Yeah.

I have no idea why. Like you said, I thought he was a trust fund kid. I never talked about my real estate to people who I helped family wise, like you. And then people I did real estate with. I never talked about family. Then all of a sudden five years ago, going, gosh, this is getting really confusing. Keeping these worlds separate. And I started to just do them together. Hey, this is what I do. And I remember me bringing it to you. Do you remember that conversation? I'm like, Mike, you know, you didn't know about the real estate. You only knew this. And everyone told me you can either do one or the others. And you were like, that's stupid. This is who you are. These are your values. Lead with them. They both go together. Anyway, that was a huge encouraging conversation, so thank you very much.

You're welcome. Well, it was it, it seemed to me, and I think it's why we've been working together is when we had the last conversation about it, I'm like, dude, I think this is the best way to build and grow this business is to lead with that first. And they should be mixed. And it's a great way to get.

You know, people who aren't empty nesters together, but also people who are empty nesters to think about what comes next. So you've got something that can appeal to a 30, a 40, a 50, 60 year old someone or other.

Absolutely.

You know, at some point, I suppose it just depends on what your revenue is. I know if I were in my 70s and I had more money than time, I'd be like, if I could trust this up, that's the way I'd do it. It'd be like, what a great way to pass along some smart wealth to the family and still maintain some control over it.

That's the beauty of real estate too, because if you're passing along a niche business, it's very niche. It's very hard to understand possibly who's going to rental property if it's in the right area, taking care of the right way, been maintained, has good management, and it's a lot easier to hand that off, especially in the residential realm than other type businesses.

Yep, totally. I think it, I think it just makes a ton of sense. So pick one more case study here. Who, who else do you have in your, in your arsenal of success stories.

Let'S, let's talk about Don Winter.

Okay.

This was a pretty interesting. A little one of more of our, our bigger ones. Don is 38 years old and has quite a business called DLP. Right now they have 4 billion under management. 4 billion under management. I was introduced to him through a family talk. He read my book. He called and said, my wife read your book before she read my book. I think it's only because it's short. That's the reason. But he read it. I've been invited back four times now to speak at their annual event for all their investors. And I've also become a consultant for their leadership team on family value values. What comes from that? You're saying? What does that have to do with real estate? They've invested over $40 million in our deals. Not only our build to rent venture, but they're also our partners on our famous RV resort, which we might talk about today, one of our special projects. But Don came in love the family values family guy. And that value again took us into over $40 million worth of deals together. That was a really fun account and something that I look forward to growing. Moron.

Yeah, no, I think it's, I think it's a great story and that's. This is a good segue into just summarizing. What you and Jamie have done is put together the passive income playbook. That's part of the giveaway we'll have today when we send people over to jjplaybook.com.

And I think I know where I, I want to take this, but why don't you go through your five steps y that really encapsulate the philosophy and the mindsets you use to be successful.

Yeah. So this is really important because this was over 20 years of work all boiled down. And from the holistic view, not just the passive income, but the family side. How do we get the lifestyle to blend with it so one's not taking over the other? And there's a really good integration of the two. And that's what the passive income playbook does. It's going to get you clean to start and then start putting the weights on the bar slowly that you can start to lift more and more and more with less pressure and get you in the position that you want to be in again? My whole career now, especially over the last five years, people are going, how did you do it? How did you do it? Can you please just share? We see you going away on six week adventures. We see you Going to do service projects in all sorts of third world countries. It seems like you're really enjoying yourself. And I'm like, I am. They're like, well, how this is how this is the playbook. And we've tried to simple it down into five steps that we go into depth on. That's going to give you exactly the direction of where you need to go and how to get there.

It's great. All right, so let's go through them.

Yeah. Step number one, you got to go make sure. What's that saying, Mike? Remember the thing? Nothing's worse than running in the wrong direction enthusiastically? Oh, yeah, that one. Always. Because guess how many times I did that. Way too many times. So we want to ensure the real estate deals you're going into, they pass the passive income rules and the success indicators. We started to go over those. Right. You want to make sure that you're checking off and it's following those rules. And if they do, great, if they don't, don't go running enthusiastically in the wrong direction. This is the first step to keep you clean and moving forward.

Very good. All right, next number two.

Once you're clean, once you're understanding these. These indicators and these rules, you're going to start by investing in three to five properties. If you're serious about this and you want to grow it, you want to get to where I am or Adam or someone like that, you got to start our most successful people three to five properties. That's going to give you the leverage to start moving in the right direction. So you get five, three to five solid properties to start planting the seed in the direction on.

Okay, I like that. And. And why not? For the, you know, somebody who's just dipping their toe and they go, well, I want. Only want to do one. Why would you tell people three to five. What's the pushback to that?

Yeah, the pushback to that is if we're going back into your garden and we're going to. We're hungry, Mike, and we want to plant. You got to plant more than one seed to kind of get the right crop. What we've learned is I'm not going to go out and say, hey, you got to start with 20, because that's not true. That's not what I did. But three to five, by looking back at our biggest success stories, the people that have gotten the real momentum in a short amount of time and been able to grow to the passive income they want started with 3 to 5. That gives just enough leverage and positioning you know, if you buy one stock in something, you're not going to get that much positioning.

You go deeper. One share.

One share.

Yeah.

I'm sorry, one share. You know, it shows I'm in real estate.

Right.

But you go through to five properties. That's a positioning in a market with growth patterns at its back. If we've done our job with step one, that's going to be able to give that, you know, exponential growth a lot easier than starting with one. Look, one is better than nothing. I have tons of people who are, you know, they've been going to the real estate classes with me for 20 years. They're about to do their first deal. Nothing worse than that. But if you start with a solid three to five, that puts you in a real solid footing and direction to get where you want to go.

Yeah, that makes a ton of sense. And it costs a lot less than you'd expect because the way the financing, how you guys structure these deals as well, I was surprised at how little it was. So that. That makes a ton of sense. What's number three?

Yeah, number three. Every three to five years, you're going to start to roll equity into new deals. So that's the beauty. Remember we were talking about the five ways to make money in real estate. Well, besides the value increase and the cash flow and, and the taxes, you also have the chance to refinance. So you can pull money off your equity. Right. Of that property that's going up in value. And you can dump that money into more property, maybe into a real estate fund, maybe one of the special projects. That's what some of our people that have had the best results have done. But what they've done is they've taken that money off of their existing three to five properties and dumped it into more. This is where I saw the biggest growth and explosion in the right direction, but for my own portfolio was doing just this.

Yep, that makes great sense. Number four.

Number four again is refinance. Just went over that right now. You're going to roll equity into new deals. Where's it going to come from? Sure, it could come from your salary or your business earnings, but you can refinance, pull it right off your existing equity, and that again, could pay for your lifestyle. Tom bought his new plane with it. Right. You might want to put it into a place you've always dreamed of living, but you can use that and have your tenant pay the bill. That's what I like the best. And tax free. I like to have things tax free, especially when it's big chunks of money, and this is a way you can do it, you're going to be able to use the refinance to your advantage to grow your wealth.

Yep. Not me. I love 110% tax. That's my goal. I kid. I kid. Do you kids? All right, number five, number five, Number five.

You know, after we've insured, you've gone through the rules and the indicators, you, you've bought those first three to five properties, you're rolling every three to five years. You're using the power of the refinance to dump into new deals and projects. You got the legendary family blueprint. I couldn't not include this, Mike. This is what it's all about. This was my focus. This is the promise I made to my dad. He didn't get to live the life that I wanted to live. I'm living it. And we've been able to break it down into a simple blueprint again. This is why people stay with us, because of the difference we've made in our family life. I don't think I'd be in this chair necessarily. Yeah, you like real estate, but it's what you and I did on the family side. So we share our legendary family blueprint. Because if we're going to be legendary anywhere, why not be in family life? I want the adventure, Mike. I don't want it to end. I want to go all in. This blueprint shows how to make that happen.

Yeah. Very good. Well, you and Jim, you and Jamie are doing a great job for sure. And she's been, I've loved getting to know her better, and she really is an amazing partner for you. I, I, I love how you love each other and how you build this together and the commitment you have your family. So let's talk a little bit about.

Jjplaybook.Com that's where you can get the transcript of this. Downloads of the passive income rules, success indicators. We've got the deck there, a bonus webinar. Also, talk a little bit about scheduling a discovery call, which is also@jjplaybook.com for someone who wants to learn more, more about this and find out if this is a right fit for them.

Yeah, so if, if they're looking to get into real estate, they want to put the playbook to work. You know, just set a discovery call. We've been able to help, again, over a thousand investors run this play. And this is a really easy play when you have the right questions asked up front, get very clear on what you want to do how you want to do it, how fast you want to go, and then we're able to back you in and help identify. One of the best things that we can provide is the product and the management to be able to get you on your way. There's not a lot of groups out there that can do that. And especially with new construction, no one really wants to deal with new construction. It's too hard, too much work. We've taken that hard, long road, finally gotten there, we can offer it to others. So the discovery call is going to give you a clarity on that, a game plan and a starting point and you can see results a lot quicker than you could ever imagine.

Good. And what about, you mentioned the specialty funds. What are those?

Yeah. So a lot of our, there might be people out there that are not interested in owning their own properties. They've been there, done that, they've sold out of a business and they'd rather be more passive, even more passive than having us manage their properties for them. So they might want to go into one of our income funds. You know, we've been having doing income funds for a number of years now. Our 14 prior JVs or funds have averaged anywhere between 14 to 16% IRR net to the investor. Built around our principles that I shared with you. So you're going into the front engine of our build to rent venture. And something that's extremely passive gives you a solid predictable income for five years and then allows you the chance to roll it elsewhere. We also have special projects we come up on. Our RV resort was a really popular one where people know this is an $8 billion industry that's only grown since the lockdown and it's a great way to travel. I've done a lot of RVing with my family. One of our adventures, and that's one of our projects as well. So you have the opportunity. As you grow your portfolio, we encourage you to start, especially if you're starting out in the properties. But some people want to go, nah, I'd rather just give you the money, earn a high interest or hey, I'll look into a long term project and it'll take a few years to get off, but man, there's a good payout at the end. So that's kind of our menu of what we do. And again people say, Jim, how did you build it? How did you build that? Real estate investments to get a check for 40 grand a month, whether you're going in or not. And the answer is the builder rents the real estate funds and the special projects. That's what I invested into and that's where my checks come from.

Yeah, that's. It's a great story. So that's one more time for you jj playbook.com that's where you can get all the goodies, the downloads and also schedule call with Jim and his team and learn more about Jim and Jamie. And is there anything I should have asked you that I didn't to wrap up or any other final asks?

I think the one thing to keep in mind. It's not even a question, Mike, it's saying, what advice would you give? Maybe overall the solution doesn't have to be as complicated as we've made this problem. Not if you plug into systems. And that is one of the biggest lessons I've learned. It doesn't take 25 years to do what I did because I didn't have what I had 25 years ago that we can provide for people now. So don't let the solution become more complicated than it needs to be. That's my best bit of advice to people out there.

Well, it's great. It's great.

So build to rent real estate funds these special projects and this passive income has allowed me to live out my passion, which is to have a legendary family life and keep the adventure going.

It's awesome. Legendary family life. I love that. One more time, head on over to JJPlaybook.com that's where you can get all the downloads, the goodies. Also, schedule a conversation with Jim and as usual, what I'd love from you is if you know of anyone who a would just love this content. Love to learn more about real estate investing and also the family aspect. Share this episode I'd love it. If you'd like, comment. If you've got my contact information, go ahead and send me a message. Just go to mike koenigs gmail.com send over any comments that you have about this episode or or if you want us to forward a message to Jim, we'll do that as well. Otherwise, head on over again to JJPlaybook.com this is capability Amplifier. This is Jim and Jamie Shields. Thank you so much for watching Jim. Let's say goodbye to everyone. Bye bye guys.