12: Is Your Thyroid Health Holding You Back from Living Your Best Life? with Gina

Welcome to Modern Thyroid and Wellness, the podcast that explores the intricate dance between health, wellness, and thyroid, unraveling the threads that weave our vitality together. I'm your host, McCall McPherson, and I'm so thrilled to guide you on this journey to optimal wellness. Gina, thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to be here today to encourage other people to share a message of hope and healing that I know can be a little challenging to find in the thyroid world. So I'm so excited for you to be here. Thank you so much.

I'm honored to do this with you. So thank you.

I wanted to kind of allow people to understand a little bit about your thyroid journey, kind of where you started and as the process went along and where you are now. So I want you to kind of start us off and tell us where you were in your thyroid journey before we ever met, before you ever found out about Modern Thyroid Clinic, and fill us in on life.

Wow. Well, my thyroid journey started clear back in my early twenties. And fast forwarding. That's why I was attracted to you, because I knew that you got it. So, you know, I was in my early 20s, I had young kids, and I just was exhausted. I did not feel well, and I really couldn't pinpoint it. And I would go to the doctor, and they're like, you're just a mom with young kids. It's just your age. It's just your things. And we would do labs and everything's fine. Go home, eat more vegetables. I. You know, it was just so frustrating because. And this went on for a very long time. I would be so exhausted, I'd fall asleep on the couch. Having, you know, little kids. I remember one day I woke up and my kids were outside in the yard, and they were gone. And it scared. It scared me, but I was just so tired that. But then when I hit about 30, things kind of hit a. It had to. Something had to happen. And I remember going to the doctor that day, and I went to my OB gyn and he looked at me and said, if you'll just get your depression under control, then everything will be fine. Sent me off to some psychotherapist, I don't even remember. And she gave me this horrible medication. And the sad part is I believed him. That was the sad part, is that I really just believed him. And I took that medicine for a few days and thought this was not helpful at all. I was a zombie. I was. This is not my problem. But it still went on for many years. I'd go to the doctor, and nobody. Everybody's like, you're fine. You're fine. At some point in there, I did start taking level, which I'm sure we'll get to the T4A. That everybody just, you know, here, just take some of this and shut up kind of thing. And they put me on that. And then they would just keep raising my dose up just to, you know, appease me. Well, let's just try more. Let's just try more. Let's just try more. And then in 2015, I actually had my thyroid removed. My daughter. I found out that year that my oldest daughter also, she had thyroid cancer. And so it kind of started this whole ripple effect with the family history. She had her thyroid taken out that year. I also had mine taken out that year. It was just kind of a big. But from that point on, I have never felt so terrible in my whole life. I thought it was bad before. Oh, no, that was like. And I'd go to the doctor and be like, your labs are fine. I don't know why you're so tired. I don't know why you're so tired. Everything's fine, Gina. You just need to. And again, more of just the appeasement. I'll just give you some more, basically, to shut you up with how I felt like, I kind of wrote doctors off. The guy that even took out my thyroid. I remember going in, I called him one day and I said I needed more medication. He wouldn't refill my medication for me. He told me he was no longer taking care of my medication.

So it's not a big deal.

It's not a big deal. You just go to the primary care physician, they'll take care of you. And I was like, are you kidding me? You just took my thyroid out and then you leave me hanging? I was just bummed. I didn't even know what you can do at that point. It was. And I kind of just wrote it up. I was like, you know what, Gina? You need to just get over this. You need to just find a way to push through. There's obviously nothing wrong with you because you've been to doctor after doctor after doctor. And so there was a long period of time there that I didn't do much with my thyroid because I was just getting so tired of people telling me there was nothing wrong. And then a couple of years ago, I made a commitment to myself that I was going to get my health under control. A friend of mine had went back to school and have become a PA And I thought, well, maybe I'll go talk to her. Maybe I'll start trying, you know, different things. And, you know, at this point, somebody was listening, but she still didn't know how to treat me. So that's when I found you. That's when you came into my life. I own a business, too, and I felt like I needed to go out on TikTok, and for my business, is what I thought anyway. I was like, I. I felt like I needed to go on TikTok, and lo and behold, here is this woman, this beautiful woman, telling me all the answers that I've been looking for all these years. So that's kind of how. And from then, it's been a. It's been a beautiful year. It's been almost a year now, so.

It doesn't seem like a year ago. You know, I think so many women. I feel like it's stuck right where you described, where it's like, well, I just sort of resigned to the fact that this is my life. Like, everyone's telling me it's not my thyroid. Everyone's telling me nothing's wrong, and then it ends there for so many women. And that makes my heart actually break because, you know, I know how much they resign to suffering, like, for the rest of their life. Like, every day is a struggle. It hurts my heart even more. Like, whenever I was in my thyroid crisis, I was similar age, but I did not have kids. You know, it breaks my heart that moms are missing out on these, like, sacred years that we want to be able to enjoy. Like, there's some of the most beautiful years when we look back on our lives, but we're busy in, like, survival, trying to get from morning bed back to bed, you know, and our lives are filled with that for sometimes our whole experience as mothers. I mean, so many of my patients are like, look, this started after pregnancy of my first kid, and now all three of my kids are gone off graduated college. Yeah, that breaks my heart.

I found your playwright class. That's how I first, like, met with you and started talking with you. And I loved that course. That was such an empowering moment for me and a healing moment all at the same time, but an angry moment, too, when I realized there was one medication that could have changed my life.

And you've been missing it.

Well, I'm an intuitive healer, and I do a lot of spiritual coaching. And so I meet with people every day, and I help them change their lives. And this was actually such a frustrating part for me, because here I Am in all these other areas, doing emotional healing and spiritual healing and. And mental healing. And there's this one part in my life I just can't seem to get together. Like, the pieces just not fitting together. And so it was when I met you that that all changed. Like, I mean, this last year has been beautiful for me. I'm 45 pounds down. I feel amazing. So many things have changed. I think it was in May when you started your class of last year of 2023. I think it was when I had already been listening to you. I went to my pa. That was the other thing is, I went to her and I said, look, I need some. I need some of this T3 that I'm hearing all this about. And she sends me home with 50 million. Right.

I have to tell that story because that was crazy. In Thyroid Empowered, which is like my online course, I take everyone through. Like, we take you through everything you need to know about your thyroid. How to understand how it's working, how it's not working, how to influence your Hashimoto's. But it all culminates with you getting laughs. And then you meet with me now it's one of the other clinicians are moving forward. It will be with another clinician at Modern Thyroid Clinic. And we tell you, listen, if you are our patient, this is very specifically what the plan would be. And our plan was to put you on a little bit of cytomel, increase it over time. We can't prescribe it because you weren't our patient, but you could take that back to your clinician, which you did, who really wanted to help you. Well, your clinician mistook 5 micrograms of Cytomel prescription for 50, which no one should ever be on 50, not even if you don't have a thyroid gland. They shouldn't make 50 micrograms of cytomel, by the way. So reality check. If you have that prescription in your pocket for anyone listening. But, yeah, I was like, wait, I need you to repeat that. When you told me that, I was like, you're. You're. She prescribed what? So glad that we sorted that out.

I was so glad too, because the thing that it did give me, there was one thing that I did get from that. The anxiety was unreal. Okay, well, let's just throw that off the table. I was like, I need some Xanax, like, yesterday, like. But the. The good thing that came out of that is I got to feel that going up.

Yeah.

And being up where I needed to be for a minute. And so that was an empowering moment to feel that I actually could feel good now when I got over the top, that was like, okay, we can't do this anymore. And I remember telling my pa, I was like this, Something's wrong. Like, something's really wrong here. We need to fix this. And she's like, well, dude, like you, you asked me for this. Because she literally just does. They just don't know. They don't know how to prescribe it. They don't know what to do with it. And at that point, I was on more of the level, too, than I've ever been on in my life. I was up to 200mg of level at that point in my. Which is huge. Like now working with your clinicians, I'm at 100. Like, you know, there's a kind of difference in between there.

At some point, it does more harm than good. Like, it starts messing with your inhibitory hormones and all of that. But, yeah, I am so glad you came to see. And then after that is really when you transferred to us, the Modern Thyroid Clinic. And you actually don't see me at Modern Thyroid Clinic. You see one of our other clinicians, Hillary, right?

I do. I sent my daughter to go see you. She flew to Texas, did all the things. We flew her down there. I was so grateful that I found you, actually, because I realized three out of my four kids have thyroid issues. Two kids now see you, I guess my one daughter sees you, and then my son and I have been seeing Hillary. It's been a life changing moment to realize that, oh, my gosh, this is a family issue. We need to get some things under control here. Cause I don't want my kids to have to do what I've done all these years. I just don't want that to happen.

And like, as you kind of described, that moment of when you have a thyroidectomy is such a pivotal moment. And I always tell people, like, because clinicians will tell patients to have their thyroid removed for Hashimoto's to have it removed because they can't balance their hormones, I'm like, whatever you can do to not have your thyroid removed unnecessarily, do that.

And that was so frustrating for me too, because I told you about, you know, going and seeing the specialist. And there was one day that he told me, gina, if. If you were by today's standards, I would have never taken your thyroid out. And this was like six years down the road after I'd been fighting this for six years. Like, I'd never been so tired in my whole entire life. I had never felt my legs be that heavy. And my husband and I love to travel. We love to go do all these things. And every time we'd sign up for a new trip, I would have to sit psych myself up to have the energy to go and do these things. Because, you know, we go and travel all over the world and we love to go. And, you know, we're walking tons and tons of miles every day. You know, we've been to Machu Picchu and we've been to all these places. And I am going to tell you that story because I actually, when I was in Machu Picchu, the elevation is super high there. And the minute that we got into Cusco and all of these places, we were at 13,000ft. Like, I could not even breathe. I almost passed out when we got off the bus. It was terrible. And that whole time I was beating myself up. Gee, if you were just 30 pounds lighter, if you were just all these things, because I just felt like it was my fault. And it's not like I hadn't tried for years and years and years. Right. And it just seems to be creeping up. I could eat next to nothing and maybe lose a few pounds. But the minute I ate something that wasn't, that was gone out the door, like, so I was so frustrated with myself and I came home and I was embarrassed. I was with my family. They were all out walking through the city streets and doing all the thing. And I'm like, I can't even get back to my room. But it's been really cool because since starting, that was one of the first symptoms that went away for me. And if you would go read anywhere as what a normal thyroid, that's not usually one of them. You don't see that. Yeah, that was an empowering moment. In fact, that my husband and I were just talking yesterday is like, need to go back to Peru. We're going to go do a do over.

I want to know how that goes.

We'll tell you. Because I've been up higher and I was like, oh, my gosh, we've kind of like creeped up higher because it's usually up to 10,000ft. I've been up until 11. I've been up to 14. And I remember standing there going, I'm not going to pass out. I mean, getting so excited with my husband. Like, it wasn't all those things that I thought it was.

Yeah. And now you can go and do the things that you enjoy and not have to psych yourself up for them, not be unable to actually do them. But, yes, air hunger is kind of the words that I used to describe it. I've had several patients, some, like elite athlete, tennis players, that couldn't hardly do any physical activity. And again, after one round of treatment, never came back. And that was in, like, 2015 or 16. That is so cool. People are asking. So I asked on social media today, like, what questions do you have for Gina? And one of them was like, what were your biggest symptoms that you were struggling with before you found us?

It would have to be definitely the fatigue, the brain fog. Dry skin has been my thing forever. And dry, brittle hair. My hair would just break off. I've had my hair short forever. I'm finally at the point where I'm like, you know what? I'm going to grow it out. Because I never grew it out before, because it would grow in some places, but it would just break off and be brittle in other areas. And so that was a big thing for me, you know, not being able to hike and not being able to go do the things that I love to do because I just felt so heavy and so tired. And now we're headed out of the country in just four weeks again. We're doing it again. I'm doing it like, we're going. We're doing all the things because it's time, and I'm excited to do it. We kind of took a year off last year, and because we've been doing so much of it, but I'm not even worried about it this time.

And it's so exciting that, like, while you were basically on bed rest after knee surgery, you lost 45 pounds.

I lost 45 pounds.

Like, I mean, how incredible is that? When normally that would create so much anxiety for a thyroid patient.

Yeah. And I haven't worried about it at all because I just know that I'm right where I need to be and I'm doing the things that I need to be doing. And I'm not afraid anymore. Like, I used to be so afraid of food. I used to be so afraid of. And I'd beat myself up over every little thing, and none of that's even an issue anymore.

So that makes me so happy. You know, hands down, number one question everyone asked and wanted to know on any platform that I posted this on was, how long did it take you to see results, improvements, and what have been your biggest improvements?

This is what I tell people because I talk to people about this all the time now. People. And it's interesting because people in my circle, people that I work with, I noticed I attract a lot of thyroid clients, which is very interesting to me because I get a lot of people who I'm like, you know what? You need to go get those looked at. And I can actually say, now, here. Here's what you need to do. Some of them still trust so much in the medical field that they look at me like I'm freaking crazy. And I'm like, you're wasting your time. I promise you, you're not going to get the answers. But hands down, the biggest thing that I remember is it was very subtle. And so we kind of want to, like, shove it off to the side. But here's what I remember. Last year, after I did your course, you started working me up. And so I kind of stayed with that workup thing until I got to the point that I was ready to go see Hillary. And the first thing that I remember doing was during the summer, we have. We own a cabin, and I do retreats at this place that we own. So I was doing a day retreat and a weekend retreat, and I was debating whether I was going to hire someone to clean, if I was going to do it myself, because in the past, I felt overwhelmed, and I felt like I just couldn't get it done. And I was just so dang tired all the time. Like. And I remember we went up to the cabin one weekend, and I was like, you know what? And I buzzed through and I cleaned this place, and I changed the sheets. I did all the things, and I was sitting down that night because we love it up there. It's a beautiful. It's gorgeous. It's out in the middle of nowhere. And that's the other thing is, like, I have to debate whether I'm going to bring someone up there or not, because it's a challenge just to get people to even do that. But I remember sitting there, and I was like, I'm not even exhausted. And I just cling this whole place top to bottom. And that was the moment for me. I was like, oh, I do feel better. It was very subtle. I had noticed just little changes in my sleep pattern a little bit. That was the moment that I realized, this is working. Yeah, it's working.

And women, sometimes they push through for so long, they're just so used to pushing through, they. They kind of don't realize that, oh, my gosh, I'm actually not pushing through anymore.

I didn't have to push through. It yeah, And I wanted to do it. That was the other thing is, yeah, who wants to do that crap? Like, because I had the energy to do it and I felt like I had to do before, it was always a trade off. If I do this, then tomorrow I won't be able to do this. So there was always a big trade off for me of where do I want to put my energy into. And that, of course, was never the top of the list because it was like, then I can't do and spend and do the things that I want to do and I can't work tomorrow and I won't be able to do these things because it was always a challenge. But that was the one moment for me that I realized it was absolutely working. And it's only gotten better since then. I actually just met with Hillary yesterday and I'm to the point where I got to choose whether I wanted to do one more bump up or not. Of course I said yes. Cause I was like, heck, yeah, I want to try that one last. Let's get that little last bit in there.

Like, yeah, but you're almost stable. That was another question. Like, how many treatment cycles did you have to go through before you are kind of stable? Which it's probably been, I mean, I don't know, six to nine months.

I think I really started taking the right amount of dose, we'll put it that way probably in, so May of last year. And now the time of recording, we're here in March. So, you know, and I just did those on my own. And then I started meeting with Hillary and I've met with Hillary three times now. So now we're at the point where the hormones are like, kind of having a little freak out. So we're working on those. It's nice to know that it's not going to chill here.

You kind of peel back the layers, right? We start with the outer couple layers. I estimate people that come to Modern Thyroid Clinic, 95% of people feel improvement in their first round of treatment.

Like lately. Yeah, absolutely.

I am shocked when people are like, yeah, no, I don't feel different. It's rare that that happens. So I'm glad to know.

I was telling my daughter this because we've been talking about it and she's like, mom, I don't know. But then she called me and said, mom, I didn't have to go take a nap today. And I was like, see, naps are.

A great objective measurement.

I was like, see, there's your. There's your point, right There of saying.

And then any. Any side effects. I mean, I know obviously, when you were grossly overmedicated by the person that put you on 50 micrograms of cytomel instead of 5, you were probably a little anxious.

A little, yeah. The anxiety has probably been the hardest part for me because as you edge up, and I remember even that first round of, like, real normal dosing, I was like, oh, my gosh, my body. It felt like my body had been asleep for so long. And that was probably the hardest part, was, like, waking it up because I'd been in this dormant stage. My hormones had been dormant for so long, they didn't know what to do with this new thing that's been kicked in there. And so that was probably the hardest part of the whole thing. But I was so ready to feel better that I was willing to get through that. And the other thing that I love about you is that I hear you say it all the time. You're. It shouldn't be over the top. You shouldn't be having heart palpation. She shouldn't be doing all these crazy things. It should be a little uncomfortable for a couple of days. And so, you know, I always kept that in my mind. And if I ever got to a point where I was like, I can't deal with this. Just back down for another little bit and start bumping it back up again, like, you know, so my biggest thing, too, is you've got to learn to manage for yourself, got to be empowered. And I know for so long I was not empowered, and I just allowed the medical field to tell me what I needed to do, which was absolutely the wrong thing to do, looking back now. But, you know, we. We put so much faith in these people who, we think. We know they think we think they know what they're doing. But there are certain things about medical, or in the medical field, thyroid, they just don't understand. They just don't get it.

No, I agree. You know, I really do. And. And part of. I mean, what I tell our patients, and I'm sure what Hillary told you, is we want you to get to a point where you are able to make informed and empowered health decisions with us. But also, one to 20 years from now, you know, I want you to understand the nuances of the. This is okay if you feel this way. This is where the threshold is, where I'm not okay with that. This is what to do in that case so that you know how to navigate this. Because, yes, like, the feelings of, like, that stimulation, anxiety, pretty common. Like, 50% of people experience them during those transitions. And just like you said, it's okay if it's, like, noticeable and it's transient. It shouldn't be disrupting your life. It shouldn't, you know, and if it is, hey, you let us know. Hey, you. You have our permission to reduce back down if you need to, you know, and having that allows you to take some ownership and ability and control to navigate this in a way that you're actually able to.

The other thing that you guys have that is marvelous is this lovely portal that I can just go into and go, hey, you know what this is? Something's not okay here. What. What do I need to do? And even with my surgery, Hillary is like, hey, I got some things you could try. Do you want to try them? I'm like, heck, yeah. I'm all in. Like, give me all the goods. Like, I'll do it all. Because anything that I could do for inflammation, swelling and all those things, anything that I can do to help myself, absolutely. Let's empower ourselves here, and let's do some things differently. So, yeah, I love it.

I've got a couple more questions that I'm curious to. Anything that you want to add? Everyone is so afraid almost to come see us. They're afraid they're going to show up on day one, and we're going to be like, okay, listen, you're going to be Paleo for the rest of your life starting today, so you can't do this, this, this, this, and this. And I want you to tell us your experience at Modern Thyroid Clinic as far as lifestyle changes. Everyone wants to know, did you have to go gluten free right away, all of those things?

No, I haven't done any of that. And actually, it was really interesting because when I met with Hillary yesterday, the first thing she said to me is, oh, my gosh, Janae, look at your face. You're swallowing this down now. I. I don't eat a lot of bread. You know, you asked me about gluten, and you asked me about these other things. I'm not a. I like bread. I don't eat a lot of bread anyway to start out with dairy. I do. Like, dairy would be really rough on me, but I haven't felt that need to go there yet because. And maybe it will change later. I don't know. You know, it's like. But for now, I think we do common sense things, and that was what I loved about you. I didn't get in there and was like, all right, totally. From this day forward, this is what you're going to have to do. And I've heard that from other people, like, they are so ill about everything that's going on in the world and all the things that can harm you and all these things that we can and cannot do. And that was what I was drawn to modern thyroid clinic about, is this. I want to say, a conservative approach would probably be a good word to thyroid health. Yeah. And it's not all or nothing. It's not all. Or we start here and we get feeling better, and then maybe we change this because we notice this, and then maybe we do this because this has happened. And. And that's what I really liked is, you know, this more conservative approach, and I didn't have to feel guilty about still doing the things that I love doing and that I want to do and, you know, having a day where I go eat the things I want to eat or not eat the thing. You know, it's just like. It's just more of a. A natural approach to me is what I really, really appreciate.

You know, that's the thing is, like, we don't dangle this healing journey over your head and say, well, unless you do these things, you don't get well. In fact, you know, we really advocate for, hey, you, feeling well is our job, and we want to make you feel energy, clarity, motivation. And then what you do with that energy, if you create more with it because you feel good and you want to eat better and you want to exercise and move your body. That's all. Bonus. First and foremost, it is our job to create that energy in your life, and it is not contingent on you doing anything up front.

Well, and honestly, you know, I got hurt back in October in a biking accident. There has been little to no exercise since all that happened. My staircase is my biggest exercise these days because. And now I'm to the point in physical therapy that I'm doing that 10 or 12 times a day because it's all for getting that strength back in my knees. So, you know, if we're being honest, I've lost the bulk of my weight. In fact, I remember from the time that I went and saw my surgeon, and it was not quite four weeks when I had the day I had my surgery. And I went in there that morning, and she asked me what I weighed, and I told her, and she goes, wait a minute. You decide. Your doctor. Like, she was baffled. She's like, you've been on the couch for. And I was like, no, I'm not going to justify it with you. Like, I don't know you an explanation for what I'm doing. Because I think I had lost about 10 pounds in that short time. And she was just blown away by the. How is this possible? Because in her mind, that is not possible. Like, you know, we gotta be doing all these other things in order for all this to happen. And so, yeah, it was kind of an interesting experience, I bet. Oh, I bet. I bet she was shocked.

You know, one question that I thought was cute, that I was curious what your answer would be with was, what did you learn at Modern Thyroid Clinic.

That surprised you that the T3 was the answer?

Amen, girl.

And it almost made me so furiously angry that that was the answer that, you know. And the moment that I understood how, you know, the TSH is not the all the almighty TSH was not where the answers lie. Everybody, the medical community wants to tell you that it is really little or no.

Especially when you're on Levo or Sup. It's actually pretend like it, it means nothing.

That was on my years of being gaslit for so many years and being told that, you know, this is just your problem. I'm like, are you kidding? No, this is a hormone issue. This is, this is. My body is lacking the one major thing that it needed and it has completely changed my entire system by doing just that. Like, just that one thing was a major game changer, honestly.

I mean, it's not the answer for everyone. I get that, like there is no one size fits all right. But is the answer for thousands of people that haven't come to Modern Thyroid Clinic just like me, just like you, where it's a light switch that turns on and they get their lives back and without it, that light switch will never actually turn on. You can never lifestyle your way out of it. You can't. Nothing, nothing you can do, no supplement, nothing. If your body is not making enough T3 and then you give it T3, the whole world opens up.

Yeah, absolutely. Because it has been a game changer for me. That's been the life changing moment for. And to not have it for so long and then to finally get it, it's like, oh my gosh, I've never been my whole life. Where have you been my whole life? Right?

What's one piece of advice or a couple pieces of advice that you would give people that are on their thyroid journey that might be stuck or that might feel a little hopeless?

Stop trusting your doctor with every little thing. You know, my Husband and I have even talked about this year with so many other things, he's had some issues going on and he went in, you know, trusting, being union with, and found out that it wasn't. The doctor never even brought up what his issues really were. He found it by reading his own, his own result. So we put so much faith in the medical community thinking that they have every answer and that simply is not true. You're not going to find your answers there. You need to go to functional medicine. You need to go to these other areas. You need to find someone who knows what they're doing. The other thing that we really haven't talked about here today is what I love about modern thyroid clinic is everybody has a thyroid condition. Yeah. And they understand what it's like to get feeling better. It is priceless.

Yeah. Medicine assumes thyroid conditions are not a big deal, that they're easily treatable, that people are fine because it's so common. And you know, and I know it can single handedly ruin your life, our life, the life of our family, our marriage. I view it as generational. You know, it is like it can affect generations. It is that powerful. And that's why my work is so sacred. That's why this message is so sacred. Because we are not impacting one life. We are impacting lives of the mothers and wives and families and children and grandchildren. And our. Our pouring into this lives on in so many ways. Thank you for sharing this message.

Yeah, it was really just my journey of how I got to where I am. And it was that moment that I realized I did it. My manifestation for the year, for the last year was to manifest my health.

Well, I'm so proud of you. I'm so happy for you. What are you going to manifest this year? I'm so curious.

We actually just manifested something and I love it.

And where can people find you?

I have. My website is gina sterl.com so I'm super easy to find. All over all the social media platforms is Jeanna Stroll, Intuitive healer. So my podcast is the Intuitive Healing Connection.

Thank you so much for being here today. I so appreciate it. Thank you for taking the time to pour into people that you might never even know whose lives you impacted.

Well, it's an honor to share my story and you're a big part of that. So thank you. Thank you for all your work because without you, I wouldn't be sitting here today.

Well, keep in touch and take care. Thank you.

Thank you.