Designing Within the Code: Glazing Compliance Essentials

How can home owners identify non compliant glazing materials?

All windows, all doors, they all come with a glazing liabilities of using non compliant glass.

Hey guys, welcome to the Builder's Edge.

I'm Norm Wales from Norm Wales Constructions. Now for me, the whole purpose of this podcast here is, is to bring a little bit more awareness around the construction industry. I've been feeling for many, many years that there's not enough helpful information out there to support you guys to make the right choice. Now we are a smaller family independent building company and we're not here to build everybody's home. But we would definitely love to be able to work with you to facilitate your dream home. But if we don't build your new home, we want you to be able to make the right decision in choosing the right builder for you. So hopefully the information that I'm able to provide through this podcast can be informative and helpful that you can now create your dream home. So I hope you enjoy and thanks for watching.

So Kerry, before we dive into this podcast, tell us a bit about yourself and how you got to where you are today and then why you care so much about helping families build their dream home.

Yep. Well, my name is Kerry and I've been in the G. James family for 23 years now. I started in the factory floor, working my way up slowly and got into the quoting side with, you know, commercial estimating and stuff like that and moved my way into domestic side of things, which was really good. I, I love every day of it actually, because going out and talking to other people and the Smithson Joneses, it's really great, opens your eyes up, you get to see the countryside, help people make the right decisions. It's really good.

Yeah, no, look, mate, it's 20 years, you know, 23 years in the game there, like obviously you're seeing a lot of stuff there and you know, mate, that's like you said, one thing I just took away from that, like it, you know, the G. James family. Yep. Do you know, I mean, and I, I resonate so much to that there because that's how I operate my business. It's a family operated business. And that's right, people that work within the business there, they are family, you know, and the relationships, you know, you form with your customers, with your trades, your suppliers, the whole thing, you know, it goes beyond just having a job, you know, it's those relationships and things that you forge there that it's lifelong memories, you know, so. No, that's, that's amazing. You Know, mate, like it's a fantastic thing that you, you guys are linked that way and that's how you all connect. So, you know, hats off to. You know, I want to sort of jump into a couple of things here and sort of just sort of talk to you like, like how can home owners identify non compliant glazing materials in their project and what do they look for probably?

Well, the first thing they look for is every glazing, like all windows, all doors, they all come with a glazing like stamp or sticker which denotes their wind rating, how much water they can take and where they should be really. And same with safety glass, it'll always have either a etched on safety glass decal which will state that it's a grade safety glass or an Andy Tamper sort of sticker that that is on that glass.

Yeah, no, look, and you obviously having that sticker there that you see down into the bottom corners and things like that, that's really important for the homeowner to understand that obviously that is compliant, you know, not to go peeling those sorts of things off. That's right. But you know, it's, you know, at least assurance that the product that's gone into their home is actually, you know, meeting standard.

Yeah. And that's what a certifier will look for when he goes to certify that home. He'll actually go to each window and check that sticker to make sure it's got corner pressures, things like that. So anything within 1200 mil of a corner of a house needs to be rated at a corner pressure. So these sort of things are all taken into consideration when quoting and planning all that sort of thing out. So. Yeah, that's what they definitely look for.

Yeah. No, and like, what are the potential risks and liabilities of using non compliant glass?

Well, for the homeowner, you know, they could easily get hurt if they, if a window blows in. So if you've got like, if you don't have safety glass in a door, you walk into it, the glass breaks. That's catastrophic sort of things. And, and people can be liable for that sort of damage.

Young ones and that running around.

Yeah, definitely. So within bathrooms or bathrooms and wet areas and now kitchens, they all have to be rated to safety glass, you know, because that's, that's where you're most liable to trip over and.

Yeah.

Hurt yourself or fall into a window.

Yeah, no mate. And like, have you heard or experienced of any stories around that there that you know, there's been a home constructed or Renovated out of, you know, non compliance glazing. And you know, have, you know, what's been the extent to the owners for that?

Well, I've, I've heard of a story that happened probably about 10 years ago where a glazing company went out and reglazed the door in clear glass. They didn't put a motive on that door, which is a plast, it's a sticker that basically goes on the glass. So that denotes that there's glass there and this gentleman accidentally walked through it at night time.

Yeah, yeah.

That's cut his, cut his nose and like nearly half off.

Yeah.

Well, quite catastrophic things can happen if you walk through plate glass.

Yeah. Yep. No, I might definitely don't want to be sort of having any run ins with glass. It's one of those things that obviously I've seen your factory and how the safety processes and things you have in place there.

Yeah.

And yeah, you don't want to have an accident with glazing, that's for sure.

That's right. Even on like patios and like stairwells, when you go down your stairs, if you've got a window adjacent to that. So if you fell downstairs and you pushed your hands through it, that has to be actually safety glass as well now.

Yep. No, that's all very handy knowledge and know there, mate. Like what questions should families ask their builder to ensure compliance?

I think probably the first question that they should ask is that block of land, does it, will it have sound corridor issues? So if you're building on a block of land that's on a busy highway that might fall into sand corridor levels where different glazing must be used to subdue that noise. Probably the other thing is.

Bushfire attack levels.

Yeah.

So bushfire attack levels. If you've bought a block and you've got trees around that block and you've, you don't want to remove them or you're say, at Moore park, there's a good chance that you're going to have a bushfire attack level in that area which will change your glazing screens, things like that.

So like I, I guess where you sort of go down with like, you know, bushfire attack levels and noise corridors and those sorts of things there. Like do you come across, you know, building companies there where when they're quoting projects that they're actually just getting to quote a, a plan that's standard glazing, say. Yeah. And they haven't done the due diligence to say they've got these other attack levels. You know, or noise corridors in place there. Yeah. And then they're preparing a building contract for the customer and I think they're going to have everything done all above board. They sign these contracts and then before they know it, then the tens of thousands of dollars in variations due to the builder not doing his due diligence and looking up fire attack, you know, zones and, you know. Yeah. Like, have you come across this.

I would come across that probably once a month I'll get a plan, just a draft saying, okay, this is, this is where it's going to be, this home, and just quote it up. Clear glazing, C2. And then you, you, you sort of recognize, well, you sort of, when you're quoting up all the time and you start knowing where these homes are going and certain areas of Bundaberg or anywhere really, you pick up where, you know, these areas are that could fall into that bushfire. So I've, I've actually quoted a few of them up and I've also wrote in like, you know, put in the clause or in the scope of works, this may not be compliant as this area could have a bushfire attack level.

So do you think builders are taking that approach there, Kerry, due to one, lack of knowledge of the area, you know, two, you know, just trying to go in at the cheapest price they possibly can to win the job and then it blows out for hidden costs down the track?

Definitely, definitely. I think they, they run with that just to get the job look locked in, get some contracts signed, get the, you know, get the signed over on the dotted line and then variations come in later on with, oh, we didn't know or things like that. So it's scary for the homeowner to have to front up for these extra charges once a project started.

Yeah.

It's also very unethical for any company to be operating that way. And I guess that's for ourselves. We only work off full plans and specifications and we do our due diligence as detailed as we possibly physically can to be able to give the customer the right information. But I guess, you know, you're seeing this so regularly and you know, we're out there doing the right thing and there's others not doing the right thing. Yeah, but then that's going to be very hard for the actual consumer to be able to understand a quote that is prepared to them from, you know, let's just say ourselves and, you know, build a. Being sealed, for example, there if they're not complying and actually comparing things equally. Yeah, yep.

Oh, 100%. Like I'll get that a lot as well where I'll go through the scope of work, so. Or you, you'll get the idea that actually you'll get a plan drafted to you and you'll get a scope of works or energy efficiencies, different things like that with engineering. So I'll go in there and actually do everything 100% correct and then I'll, I'll get a reply back saying, oh, the other window company has, is about six grand cheaper. And so sometimes that's a bit hard to swallow but then you say, well, can I have a look at the plan? You can wipe out the prices and whatnot and in 90% of the time it's, it's not apples for apples. Yeah, they've, they've given a non compliant quote. Really.

Look, it's unfortunate those sorts of things are happening there but like that's where, I guess where, you know, while we want to bring awareness, you know, to people that are looking at building there, that they need to be able to compare things apples to apples. Yeah. You know, and then understand that sometimes, like if they think they're going to be getting a better price, are they actually going to be getting the same quality product? You know, so, you know, like really from there, like, you know, what are the warning signs that a builder may be cutting corners with the glazing?

Well, it's sort of hard for the customer. They're not really going to be aware until they've got their windows in their home or their shower screens already in. It's a bit of a tricky one, but if they're asking the right questions from the start, making sure that, you know, if they know that it's a C2 win code for that area, if they're asking the builder that and making sure that they're actually complying to the rules, that's probably the best, you know.

So obviously like choosing the right builder to start with and everyone thinks they choose the right builder, but I guess that's doing the research on the builder and understanding that, you know, they are, are delivering what they say they're going to. The projects aren't sitting there for six and 12 months, you know, not, not moving along there. But like with builders sort of cutting these corners, you know, is it also then that, you know, do you work with, you know, building companies that are with you one week and then next month they're down the road to a opposition that's, you know, maybe a little bit more competitive in price but then it's not the same thing. Like, and then, you know, the customer thinks they're getting an. A gray product, but they're technically not. Is that fair to say?

Yeah, definitely. 100 I, I do have, I have seen and I've dealt with builders like that. Yeah.

100 so would you say that they're doing that there because they're not just trying to win a job and pull the wool over the customer's eyes by putting a less superior product in the home? But is it sometimes that they're having, you know, maybe monetary problems in their business that they're skipping around other suppliers?

Oh, definitely. 100 they might be with two or three suppliers. They might tap out their account, who knows? And then next thing they, they're knocking on our door again, trying to get house lots and stuff like that.

So do you think it's a little robbing, Peter, to pay poor when it comes into, you know, hey, I don't have no money to pay this account, so go to that account.

Yeah.

And so if that's the case, is that the point that, you know, as the builder, you know, not fully understanding, you know, how to quote a job properly to start with, or is it they not really good with their money? Like, what do you think the main problem?

Well, they're usually the builders that will jump in and give that gun ho. Sort of plan out without any specifications until, you know, and then they'll win the job and that's when the issues come into play.

It's real interesting that. It's a shame that we come across that. But like, but I guess, like, from what we've just discussed and gone through there, like, what would you say would be the biggest takeaway that you could give families, you know, a bit of advice on what to look out for when, you know, choosing a builder, you know, and you know, I guess making that investment in building a new home.

I think just doing that research to start with, having a look at testimonials from other, other customers and previous customers to make sure that they were happy, that they got good service, they got good turnaround. You know, honesty is a big thing with, with builders too. If they're not, you know, up front with the, with the owner with certain things, it can sort of cause trouble.

But yeah, I'd say, yeah.

No, look.

Mate, I, I think the information provided has, you know, been extremely helpful there. You know, I mean, but like going from, you know, understanding not using compliance glass and the safety features of that in itself, you know, like, that's something you've got to always be protecting your family and I guess your asset. And you don't want to be paying for things twice at the end of the day either. Yeah. You know, as it's the biggest investment you normally make in building a new home. So you want to do it right the first time.

That's right.

You know, so potentially, you know, if we think we've got something that's too good to be true, you know, it might be too good to be true. So it might be best, you know, reevaluating that budget to see can you spend that extra $6,000 that you mentioned before and invest in a better, more superior product.

Well, longevity wise, you know, if you spend that outlay, might be two grand more, something like that, you know, you're going to have that longevity. You've got, you've got race rollers with ball bearings in the windows. Just things like that, that, that can really give you that longevity and, and you know, you can actually feel that that's going to last.

Yeah, no, mate, that's amazing. Share and look, Carol, like to thank you for coming on the show today and you know, being so informative. But before I wrap up, I always just like to ask one little last question and.

This is always the, the fun part of it. We get to sort of know who we all are a little bit further, go a little bit deeper. So mate, I've got here. What's an experience that completely changed your perspective on life?

Can you read the question again?

Okay.

So mate, I've got.

One question just to wrap up. What's an experience that completely changed your perspective on life? So one experience that's changed your perspective on life?

I don't know.

Yeah.

Not too sure. So one thing that's happened in your life that's really changed how you view things.

I think over a certain amount of time, like doing the job that I do, that in itself has given me a better outlook on, on dealing with people and helping people and, and just looking after people.

Yeah.

It may not be one specific thing that has happened to change my point of view on things or change my life, but just doing that, 12 years of looking after the general public, it's just open my eyes to, to how if you treat people good and you look after them, they'll give you growing reviews. They'll be. You'll have Google reviews that are. Yep, he was great to deal with and you get more work from doing that. So I think just, just looking after people.

Yeah, man, I like that. Definitely looking after people, doing the right thing. It's. Yeah, karma is a wonderful thing and what comes and goes around and, like, I'm a big believer of, you know, I guess, making sure that you. You always do the utmost, best you possibly can, and good things happen.

Yep.

All right, Carol, mate, I just want to thank you once again for coming on the show today, and we're looking forward to having you again.

Okay, thank you.

Thanks, mate.