060 Winning with Part-Time Agents and VA Staff with Jessica Boswell

Jessica Boswell's goal is to build the first female led team to be number one in units sold in the state of Connecticut. And she is off and running here. In this conversation you'll get lessons she's picked up in the journey from being an agent selling about 100 units herself to building an organization of 22 agents and counting, including why it makes sense for half of those 22 agents to be part time agents. How and why she built her staff of VAs, including an executive assistant, TC listing manager, leads manager, and two marketing staff. How and why she developed develop systems as if she was running a 50 agent organization even though she only had a few agents at a time. Systems that give agents a ton of leverage and give clients a concierge white glove experience. How she thinks about profitability, how she thinks about reinvestment in her still young business, how she evaluates lead sources, how she decided to change brokerages to LPT Realty. That and so much more. Right now with Jessica Boswell on Real Estate Team os.

No matter where your business is today or where you want to take it, you'll get there faster and more profitably with an operating system. Welcome to Team os, your guide to starting, growing and optimizing real estate team. Here's your host, Ethan Butte.

Jessica, I love your sweatshirt and I'm super happy to have you here. I'm so glad we can have this conversation. I'm excited about the journey you've been on and I'm excited to learn more about how it's gone kind of behind the scenes. Welcome to Real Estate Team os.

Yeah, thank you. I am so honored that you asked me to come. Really, really happy.

Cool. Well, we start always with the same question, which is what is a must have characteristic of a high performing team?

Of a high performing team? A high performing team leader. Yeah. A team leader that will not accept anything other than their own personal best and somebody that's willing to lead by example. Yeah.

Cool. And what, like, what is that example for you? Like, did you go through the exercise of defining your values and your mission? Like when you think about what you're exemplifying and what you're trying to represent to people so that you're modeling the right behavior for them as a high performing team leader yourself? Like, how formal is that?

So it's funny, when I first started the team, you know, I didn't have, you know, the values that my values mapped out and I didn't have like a mission or a vision statement that kind of like that gelled like several months in, when I realized, right, that's, that's necessary. But I have always been a person that throws myself like 120% into things. I've always been a hard worker and I'm extremely. Like, I'm just critical of myself. Like, I, you know, even when someone, you know will say, good job, like on your accomplishments, I'm always like, okay, but I can do more. And there's more and there's more and more. There's more. And so I like to think that I model that for my team, that like, I accept nothing but excellence. And it is my ultimate goal, you know, to, to really elevate the industry as a whole by delivering an exceptional experience to my agents and my clients. Right to agents in the marketplace. And, and you know, we so often think of, you know, just offering our buyers and sellers an exceptional experience, but I think it's important to also give that to our agents. So that has become my mission statement. And by doing so, I will become the very first female led team to be number one by units closed in Connecticut. I know that I will. We're on a great trajectory.

I love your goal. I love the clarity of your goal. I don't doubt just by, you know, we've had a couple of conversations. I don't doubt that you'll get there. It's just a matter of when and how. I have so many follow up questions on the language that you were using around essentially customer experience and agent experience. But I think for context, what I'm going to do is go straight to characterizing your journey. Like when and how did you get into real estate from being an art history major who is doing lab work in the pharmaceutical industry. Like, start with your journey into real estate and when team dawned on you.

Sure, yeah. I was involved in biopharmaceuticals for over 10 years and I did study art history along with that. And I just found over time that it was not fulfilling and I wasn't sure why. I just knew that I wasn't happy. I worked for, I don't know, four different employers and worked up the corporate ladder and was paid more with each job and had more responsibility. But I always felt like there was, you know, like I was, I guess that there was a ceiling, maybe because I never got my PhD. I don't know, but. And the work was, I think ultimately I found out that it just didn't suit my personality. Like I, I am actually not an introvert. Like, I mean, I'm not. And I really enjoyed talking to people and doing something different each day. And in. In biopharmaceuticals, it can take 10 to 15 years to realize a goal. Like, and that's if, you know, if it's realized at all. And so with real estate, it seems much more immediate. Of course, building a team, like, you know, takes longer than, obviously, achieving a closing, but. And so I guess the long and short of it is we moved to St. Louis from Connecticut for my husband's job. We had our first child, and when he was about a year old, I found, you know, I was pretty lonely. And I loved being a mom, but I wanted something else. And so I literally chose real estate because the houses were beautiful and it would offer me flexibility as a mom. But, you know, there's that, like, dichotomy, right? Like, there's the side of me that just, like, throws myself into everything, and that's what I did. I chose to be on what was, at the time, the number one team in St. Louis, and I got incredible mentorship from that team leader. I feel like I would never be where I am today without them. So I took that away from being on a team. We moved back to Connecticut. I joined another team to kind of learn the Connecticut market. There were a lot of things on that team that I didn't like and just that I saw going on around me that I didn't like. And, you know, I was essentially asked to leave after having my second child. I think she didn't think I was going to work hard enough. And that's when my business really exploded, and I got up to about, I don't know, 100 or so transactions a year brought on a TC, and frankly, I had so many leads and a huge lack of balance that I said, I'm going to do this team. It's the next logical step. And I just. I want to see if I can do it. Like, I know that sounds like a crazy, like, reason, just people want to see if they can do it, but it's morphed into this really big, meaningful, like, passion project for me at this point. Cool.

You hit a number of the things I was going to kind of double back on to and introduce some new ones as well. I guess what I'd love to hear next is, when did it click for you that you were going to be really good at this? I mean, you know, your. Your personality type is that, you know, you're going all in on most of the things that you're doing, but, you know, you also are a little playful in And I'm sure you've, you know, in your recruiting conversations talked to some version of yourself with like, I want the flexibility. This is a really cool product that I think I know a lot about or something because it's pretty. So you kind of played both sides of that. Like, so when in, like in dabbling into real estate in the beginning or did you just throw yourself straight into it regardless, when did you realize that this was something that was going to really be good for you and that you were going to be really good at it?

My. My very first phone call that I ever made, it was to a for sale by owner and I set an appointment and then I was hooked. Like, I was just hooked. I loved it. I loved the rush that I got. You know, I love people kind of telling me something was hard and that I couldn't do it. And then I did it. And then I did it again. I did it again. And. And being. Being able to help people solve problems, like, I just, I like get immense satisfaction out of that. And that's. Yeah, that's essentially when I knew that like, this was, this was the right thing to do and it would be exciting for me. And literally every day is different. It was as an agent, it is as a team leader. And I love that. I love the unpredictability. There's something about it. And in my conversion con talk, I talked a lot about how I grew up with unpredictability and I thrived in that environment. And I just think it suits me for whatever reason.

Yeah, good. Okay. Please characterize your team as it is today, however you wish. Market size, you know, agent counter, staff size, structure, culture, anything that you think helps characterize your team. Just for context, for folks to know where you are today. And then we'll kind of build into it in terms of how'd you get your first few agents and what were some of the other staff positions you added? But like, where are you right now?

Right now? Okay, so right now I have a really beautiful panel of VAs that work full time. I have a domestic marketing manager who also does photography and videography. We have 22 agents and counting. Half of them are full time and the other half are part time.

I feel like that's relatively unique. Part time agents. Talk a little bit about the philosophy there. Why did you decide? Like, because people in your seat on this show, I've heard explicitly, as soon as they say part time, you know, essentially the conversation's over. So I think it's really interesting that you've created A space for that. What was that about for you and how do you, what's your experience relative to a full time agent?

Sure. The market's really difficult in Connecticut and there are a ton of agents that have other jobs and they come to me saying I really want to transition out of this other job into full time real estate. And I can't ignore all those folks if they have the right characteristics. Right. I just feel like I can't. And so at the beginning I would have once weekly training with them. We would call it squad and we would have it every Wednesday at 5:30 for an hour and I would have them report their numbers to me and all of that. We also use a learning management system where everything is self paced. All of the software we use self paced, learning listing presentation, buyer presentation. And then I've just always been a team leader that's been very available. Like if these people need help writing an offer, I'm there. You know, if they. And, and at the beginning I was also accompanying people on listing presentations. As a matter of fact, they would set the appointments for me, they would come and shadow me. Right. And they would of course get a percentage of the commission. But that's how I, that's how I taught them. And I have part time agents. There's this one woman that I always refer back to, she has a full time job, she is going to school for marketing and she sells as much as some of my full time agents. It's how people use their time. I have a gentleman that works full time ADP sales. He's crushing it. Like he's made it top of our leaderboard. And then of course I have the people that like, maybe they're just not cut out for it. Their time management skills aren't super hot and they weed themselves out. So I try not to say no to anybody that presents well and is intelligent and you know, is eager to please.

Love it. I love that openness to what is possible. And it's probably part of your problem solving skills that you've developed over the years. Panel of VAs. Tell me about that. When did that occur to you? What are they doing? And even I guess maybe start with the language panel. I like that. Language.

Yeah. Like, or an army or. Yeah. So I had had some domestic admins, three of them to be exact, you know, in a row that just had a lot of trouble keeping up with me. All right. And they were pretty costly. Right. I have to have them on payroll. I have to, I, at the time I was funding my own 401k. I had to offer them a 4, like all of that stuff. Right. They come up with a lot of expenses and so when I fired my most recent one, I decided to, to look elsewhere for help. I mean I needed it. We were like rocking and rolling. Like I needed help. So I brought on an executive assistant and then a TC and then a listing manager and then two marketing staff. And that's, I mean that's evolved over time, like who's been in what position. But it's amazing. They. Oh, and now I have a lead manager too. They work full time plus some and all of their salaries added up or less than a domestic employee. And they work with a smile and you know, and, and my executive admin has the equivalent of her J.D. in the Philippines. She's brilliant. Like if I could bring her here, I would. I absolutely love her and she has been a catalyst to this team's growth. You know, she really is my implementer. Like I couldn't find that here.

Interesting. Are you still on the hunt for that? Because you know, I think if you're going to get to 100 agents, I don't know, I feel like Domestic might need to be there in terms of that integrator role. But maybe not. I mean, again, you're a creative problem solver, so maybe not.

I mean, we'll see, we'll see. We have all of our lines of communication really open and she's pretty much able to do everything I've asked her to do so far. I mean, whether it's, you know, researching a new software or you know, going through lead, you know, lead sources or you know, troubleshooting, data analytics and FOB or you know, I can bring anything to her and you know, if she can get it 85% done and I can finish the last 15, like that's, that's worth it to me. But of course, yes, like as we, as I grow to, I mean 100 agents would be amazing. Yeah, we'll need to, we'll need to probably have domestic staff but cross that bridge when we get there.

Yeah, yeah. One more follow up here in VAs on behalf of viewers and listeners and specifically to email subscribers. People can go to realestateteamos.com, subscribe sign up, you get weekly emails and get subscriber only episodes and stuff. So some of the replies I've gotten to those emails are, can you ask this guest more about how they built their vat? I think there's a lot of interest and maybe misperception and confusion and Even just general, sincere ignorance about the best way to get started with va. So did you use a, you know, one of the companies that specializes in real estate and all the people are like partly real estate trained out of the gate. Did you use an upwork or like, like how did you start with VAs? And has it that. Has that been the consistent way that you've added folks as well?

Yeah, so I started with Sphere Rocket. I did, and I really dug into all of their resources. Right. They have a very specific list of things that I needed to do in order to have my VAS be successful. And I did them. Like, I was a good student and I made sure to get all of the software that they recommended, whether that was project management software, time tracking software, communication software. And I trained my VAs like they were a domestic employee. Like I, you know, and I manage them like they're domestic employees and they are part of my team meetings. You know, they're very much a part of the culture. I mean, they're helping me build the culture. They're so I feel like as long as we, you know, train and treat them as domestics, like you really can't go wrong. And then in so being, you know, using Sphere Rocket, then, you know, VAS that I had then, you know, introduced me to friends and family members that, you know, were like, interested in getting into it. And my executive admin is now training people that are also working for her business in the Philippines. She owns her own business in the Philippines, not a VA business, but. But yeah. So I've just been really blessed to, to have these people show up in my life at the right time as a result of putting in the work to make sure that I get good people. And yeah, Sphere Rocket's program makes it really easy. Like if somebody, for whatever reason isn't working out, they make it easy to like find a replacement. You know, let's go all the way back.

So you were doing about 100 units, you brought on a TC, you had leads. So pick up from there, like for that, that aspiring team leader or very early stage team leader, you know, walk us up through that first phase of growth to like, the next time you looked around, you're like, oh gosh, I look what this team is now. You know, whether that's like, you know, three buyer's agents or like, whatever that is, like, what was that first phase of growth? What were some of the key decisions you had to make? Any missteps that you caution people about when they ask you about this period of Your career?

Yeah. So it wasn't people first, it was systems first. And I did my best to develop my systems as if I was already running a 50 agent team, you know, and it was super overkill. And, you know, admins at the time were like, is this really necessary? And I'm like, yes, we're going to build it out the right way. All of the administrative systems, the sales systems, the lead gen systems, the follow up, like, all of that I put as much energy and attention into as possible, like hundreds of different steps. And like, I'm a perfectionist. So I had to stop that. Like, I had to stop getting ready to get ready to get ready to get ready. So that's where I would caution people because the minute I decided to like, just, just do this, build the boat as you row, it will figure it out. Have faith in yourself that you're gonna figure it out. Like, that's when agents started showing up. So in much the same way that I, that I would get personal clients and referrals or how I got agents, they would see my activity on social media and they would see that I formed the team and they would come to me. And so I got a lot of organic growth at first. And then of course with joining residency and John Chaplak circles, like, he teaches you how to recruit like a beast. And like I do and I love it. And that's really how we've grown. I mean, I've brought on in the past two years over 30 agents and we have about 22. And you know, the goal is to double production this year to get to 300 units. So I'm not stopping until we get there.

Okay, cool. I don't doubt you at all. Let's go to like when you were getting ready to get ready to get ready to get ready, which I love that language and I actually, I personally identify with it very much as well, not necessarily exactly in your context, but like getting ready to get ready to get ready. Like, been there. It's like, how do I break out of this? Usually someone else has to break me out of it or I just like kind of wake up. But what were you building at that time? Like in your mind? Was it, what are, like, what do I really, really need? Like, like if I could have the best systems for myself and my business? Or was your mindset like, as you were building, you know, as you're thinking about what you needed to build, was it like, okay, what are other people going to need? That I've just been kind of doing by default was it just I'm just gonna doc document in the greatest detail possible. And so like the getting ready to get ready was like add more detail to sub point sub point sub point sub point sub point eight bullet points there instead of just three. Like, like what was that? Like like what were you in your mind? Like what were you building? And at what point was it good enough? Because one of the reasons I'm asking this is there's someone right now who has a similar size team as you, but they don't have your systems and it is halfway off the rails and they probably won't be able to double production because even though you feel like it was maybe overkill at the time, it I'm sure, I'm sure time has proven that it was a worthwhile investment. At least, you know, most of it was. So like what was your approach to building out and hardening those systems? You know, even if it was a little bit early. See what your contacts are doing on Zillow. Monday, December 8th join follow up Boss for a sneak peek webinar where you'll be among the first to see how to get Zillow searching, browsing and saving insights for the contacts in your database directly inside Follow Up Boss so when a past client client of yours gets that late night and extra bedroom would be really great right now. Kind of feeling you'll know before anyone else who's showing high intent to buy or sell insights about what's happening right now so you can deliver a personalized touch at scale. See what your contacts are doing on Zillow. Monday, December 8th at 1pm Eastern 10am Pacific learn more and sign up through the link in the description below. If you you're in your podcast app, check out the description of this episode right down below. It's the first line and the first link. Now back to the conversation.

Yeah, so narrowing down like my value prop, right? I just like, I just like wanted everything to be like exceptional and detail oriented and yes like very much centered on what the clients and the team agents wanted. So I developed this white glove concierge like way of thinking about things and all right what would I want as a really busy seller or you know, as a brand new agent, which I love bringing on brand new agents or as a buyer that's nervous and so with my sellers, I mean I've, I've decided to offer everything from a staging consultation to a deep clean to like the full marketing package. You know, not just photos but floor plans, 3D tours, videography when called for. Drone shots when called for twilights, virtual staging renderings and for our, like, for our nicest package, also a pre listing inspection and a home warranty that covers the seller and the buyer. It's transferable to, to the buyer. I mean all of these different things like listing showcase, like a laundry list of stuff. And then. All right, so this is just, you know, seller, not necessarily buyer. Right. I have a buyer version of this too, but. And then I said that's gonna be super attractive to agents. They can't pay for all. That's a lot of money if like fork out up front. Right now I have to set up the staff that's going to manage all that for them because I do not want them scheduling all these things. I don't. I want them to hand my staff the listing agreement and the next time they hear from anybody is, all right, your draft is ready for your review so that they can use all of that time then to go and get more sellers and go and get them at a higher commission because they have all of this exceptional value in addition to their knowledge of the market. And I mean things that any agent should be doing standard. Right. So I think that that's the way it progressed. So figuring out exactly what I wanted to offer the client, lining up the staff that would be able to help my agents get there and not waste time, and then using project management software to say, all right, like you know, who needs to be called and when and what will that trigger. Right. So listing paperwork, check that triggers. The phone call to the photographer, check that triggers. So you know, automating as much as I could. Like I'm, I'm such a nut for making systems like as efficient as possible and finding gaps. I think that's where like my science background comes in. Super detail oriented. I wrote standard operating procedures for a living. Like that's what I did. Right. Like roman numeral subset 2 ABC. Let's indent that, let's add. So yeah, I mean, and what makes it so hard for team leaders or for people that are wanting to start a team that are still in production is really just taking the time to sit down and do it, you know, because we're, we, we're so busy working with clients and needing to like bring that money in that it's really hard to settle down and settle in. So outsource it. Like find somebody to help you do that, find that personality. They don't have to be a full time employee. They do not have to be an admin, a director of operations, like you can contract, work it out and lever. Like, I love leveraging. I love leveraging people. I love leveraging software. I let like, I leverage as much as possible and I think that that's helped me like obtain some degree of balance and freedom. We're never really balanced doing what we do, but to as much as possible. Which is why I'm wearing this sweatshirt, because I went and did some like testing to help me with my trail running, you know. And so, yeah, it allows me to do that instead of just being in the mix and in, in the weeds and getting bogged down. Like I said, if somebody can do it 85% and you can finish it and put the, put the shine on it, like, do it. Yeah, do it. It's a good investment.

Really quick, simple follow up question because you've mentioned it twice, like, get it to 85%. I think what some people miss in that and they're feeling like this isn't getting to 85% is that they're probably not doing enough. There's something on the front end too, right? So when you have a project and you want it to get to 85% before you do the review and the polish up, and I'm sure there's some iterative, iterative phases, you know, maybe at 25%, 50%, whatever. How much are you doing in advance? Because I feel like a lot of people are like, well, you know, I told the person what they, what I wanted and it only came back at, you know, 25% of what I wanted. VA's don't work, you know, and that's not the right conclusion to draw. But my gut, part of my gut is you're probably very clear in scoping what you really need and want and are probably available for iterative steps to the, up to the 85%.

Yeah, very much so. So I use my time on the treadmill to brainstorm every morning and my time driving and I brainstorm. I get the idea of what I need. We have like the introductory meeting about it. And again, like, I'm just, I'm open for questions along the way and revisions along the way. I like to think that I'm pretty clear about, about what I need. And then, yeah, if something comes back to me incomplete, like, it's because I didn't do my job explaining it well enough. That's all. That's what it is and I just own that. And I'm learning as I go. So definitely not perfect, but really good.

Okay, two promotional messages for folks. One, we've Mentioned Jessica's sweatshirt a couple of times. We do. If you're listening on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, we do also put these on YouTube so you can see it. We also do social stuff on on Instagram, so you can see it there, too. In addition, if you want more on VAs and some of this kind of talk, my conversation with Shannon Yousefi in the Inside Whissel Realty series. She is director of operations there. And we talk quite a bit about working effectively with va. So if you like this conversation, you want more, that's another one to go to. And just a couple of buttons on this and then we'll move on to another topic. One, I think you very unique in that you loved your first sales call and you were really good at it and you got it closed. And at the same time, you love building out these systems. And so I would say to that person who's a great salesperson, but a lot of the operation is like, like really loose, and you need to, like, harden this stuff up, whether it's just for yourself or whether you do aspire to build a team or you've got a team going and you need to. To harden it up. I love your recommendation, Jessica, of bringing someone else in. And to your point, it doesn't have to be an expert, anything. They don't need to have done it 50 times before. But the process of someone sitting next to you, you know, one hour at a time over the course of a series of sessions, saying, and then what? And then what should happen? Someone's smart enough to ask the good, like, you know, you know, and then what? And then, you know, gut check it with maybe some of your favorite peers around you, whether they're agents on your team or agents within your, you know, team or brokerage, if that's the situation that you're in. So a lot of really, really good stuff there. Profitability. You know, I heard you mention it would be really difficult for an agent to put together this concierge package and offer all of this stuff at the same time. You're building massive leverage for those people to execute your system. So what I hear in that is that, you know, you've made some investments and so, and you were doing a lot of this before you had, you know, 20 agents to take advantage of what you've built. You know, at the time, you maybe only had a couple talk about profitability from, you know, you and a TC to where you are today. How have you thought about it? Where were you maybe willing to give a Little bit. Knowing that you need to sacrifice some of that for just straight up growth and that the economies of scale would come in to give you that return back in the future. Like, have you thought about it over the years and through some of the phases and maybe what are some cautions you'd give some folks?

Yeah. So I started this thing in 2023. We are still a new baby burgeoning business. I put every last penny back into my business. I'm not gonna lie. I mean, there, there are things like, you know, that I've done like buying an office and stuff like that, but I'm not taking elaborate vacations on my, on my profit. I'm putting it, but I'm pouring it back into the business because I want to offer just super high quality and I know it will attract agents and I know it will attract clients, and that's going to take time to build up and frankly, I'm okay with that. So, you know, I have a really strong support system at home and we have income properties and you know, like, it's okay. Like, I get that I'm that in this messy middle and I've heard it from so many people that you're not always as profitable as you want to be. And it, you know, and it's funny, like, it's silly to think about, but money was never like my driving force in real estate. Like, it just wasn't. My final walkthroughs were everything. People's reactions were everything. The commission, like, sometimes I wouldn't even pay attention to whether or not it got like, put into my bank account, which is, I don't know. So honestly, like, I, I have believed all along that putting people first will result in profit along the way. So. Yeah. Am I, like netting a million bucks? No, I absolutely am not. And I don't feel that people at this stage should, like, I just, I think that that's what people need. They need to get honest with themselves that one, you have a brand new business, you're not going to be uber, uber profitable. And that's all right. And we should be putting money back into our businesses. All right. And then so as far as cautioning people against overspending, I mean, I have 21 different lead sources and some of them work and some of them don't. So I would caution people to be constantly analyzing exactly how their lead sources are performing, like, especially the ones that you're paying for, regardless of whether or not your agents are closing them, and just be ruthless about it. This year, I've had to be. I've had to get rid of certain lead sources that just aren't working for me. But I still believe that practicing all over the state with as many lead sources as possible, especially pay at close, just is the way to go. I mean, I think that that's how we're selling. We sold twice as much as we did last year. Like that's how. So yeah, economies of scale, growing the team to at least 50 agents will get me to the point where all of this hard work makes sense.

Yeah.

Long winded answer.

No, no, it's good. I mean, it's an important topic. And you broke down all three of the kind of things that I ask. I tend to ask questions in groups, so you did a great job. And by the way, we've had that story on the show a couple of times. The first one to mine here is Kyle Draper in Southern California who said the same thing. He was like, I wondered, I wondered, I wondered. And then, you know, I got to 45 agents. We kind of hit our next stride and I literally the words you just said, like it was worth it, you know, so really good. I also appreciate to this idea of reinvesting into the business and being real about that. I want to talk lead sources a little bit more and what I'm most curious about is how you think about it. And I'll just explain how I would think about it as someone who has never had to assemble lead sources for the benefit, not just of myself, but for a team of people and then evaluate which ones are working. But in general, you have that initial conversion and you maybe put a time on that. Like, you know, you can say this lead source converts at X percent, but you know, is that within. Are you doing that within three months or in six months? You're actually giving it like longer legs to 12 months. Like when do you say that this lead, which is one of, you know, 500 of its type, from this lead source, air quote, didn't convert versus hasn't converted yet. So there's that. And then the other thing that I think is interesting about lead sources is and it's definitely too early in your business to really do this in a meaningful way. But I'm curious if you're thinking about it is yes, we convert. This, this lead converted. And it was one of, you know, 50 of the 150 that I got or 250 that I got. So let's say it's 20%. That's like, I guess it's probably high conversion by source but still walk that out and pretend that that's a real thing. 50 out of 250. The more interesting thing isn't like, that we converted 20% and it produced this much, you know, gross commission income. Instead it's, you know, of the 50 of the 250 that converted from this source versus the 50 of the 250 that converted at that lead source. Like, cool. They're both at 20%. But, you know, we got twice as much repeat and referral business over the past two years from this, from these 50 people than then then from these 50 people. Like, that's probably over complicated, and it's probably a bit in the future for you anyway. But I would encourage people to continue keeping original lead source as part of, you know, your conversion puzzle overall. But I laid a bunch of pieces out there. How are you thinking about it when you're saying I need to kill this or we should double down on that?

I'll address, like the last part of that first. Right. So it's. It's really easy to think of leads as, like, not these human beings, like, just on the other side of things. Right. The lead source doesn't matter. Like, they're all human beings coming to us for help. And so if the agent does a good job, they should be getting a referral, period. It doesn't matter what source they come from.

Love it.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, as a solo, I was using a ton of different lead sources. I love Internet leads. Like, I wasn't big on, like, friends and family. I used my. I used Internet leads to establish my sphere, and then they referred. And I even have agents on my team that, like, I helped buy and sell. So. So I've been able to get referrals from lots of different sources that I was using before I started a team. I believe that my agents should as well. And so developing a system for getting great reviews and getting referrals and nurturing and all of that, like, that's yet another.

Even getting a referral when you didn't get a conversion.

Oh, yeah.

Which is, I think, at some level, kind of a reciprocity player. Like, actually, I changed my mind. This isn't the right time for us. But I feel guilty about it. And we've established enough rapport because you're a great agent that I feel slightly obligated to, you know, to recommend somebody who is. Yeah, right.

Yeah.

Like, and I don't know, I have no idea how common it is for people to track that. But, like, it's not A conversion on the list of leads we got. But it's business that was produced that you never would have had if you had not been produced to that, introduced to that person who didn't convert.

Definitely, when approaching things in a selfless way like that, not getting upset that you haven't converted a lead, like, that's when the magic happens. And then as far as how I look at lead source performance, like, I don't. I don't think it's appropriate to give it any less than six months. And frankly, it should be a year. And, you know, I got started in 2023, so we were coming out of, you know, the end of COVID and interest rates going up. So like this, you know, the 2023 market was completely different than, you know, Covid. So I can't even compare it to that. So it's really a year. And then with Connecticut, it's interesting, right, because we have spring and fall that are really, really busy times. But then this crazy. The crazy shift with interest rates and inventory has also made, like, winter a very busy time for us, too. So it's really just. It's following trends. We have leads in our database that are 3 years old that are just now converting. And so I'm using fub, like, extensively to keep track of all of this stuff. And we use Excel spreadsheets and, you know, and then also there are, like, different personality types that convert different lead sources different ways. There's so much to look at.

Yeah. I mean, taking some responsibility on your side, like, maybe these three agents would be best on this source versus these other ones.

Yeah. And, you know, when I first started, like, I only worked with sellers. Like, I worked on a team where I was a seller specialist. And my second team that I worked on, I was. I was also a seller specialist. So, you know, I'm okay with my agents trying to convert seller leads. But many of them realize it's not as easy as it looks. It's not easy, and it's not easy once you get them either. So, yeah, I try not to compare my agents to my conversion, which, you know, over the past several years has been about 20% with online leads. But, you know, I think it's just going to take some time. It'll take some more time to figure out, you know, top of the funnel versus bottom of the funnel, who is patient enough to nurture down to the bottom of the funnel. And the sources that I've gotten rid of, you know, are mostly, like, way top of the funnel or like, we get A lot of feedback that people are like, where did you get my phone number? Things like that. Like those are the ones. Or like they're really nasty. But it's funny, like some of those lead sources now the leads that have been sitting for two, three years are engaging with our tools, our lead conversion tools, fellow Real Scout Homebot. Like they're engaging. So you know, things. Yeah, there's, there's, there's a longer cycle for lead conversion now. It's obvious.

Yeah, that was great. And you know, part of what I hear in there too is I'm inferring this from what you said, behavior based triggers as reasons to reach out based on some of these tools that you're using and the fact that they are in fub, just keeping an eye on essentially who's raising their hand through their real behavior so that our agents are taking advantage of that opportunity while they are acting like they're interested in buying or selling. Hey, thank you so much for listening to these episodes of Real Estate Team os. If you're like me, you're listening to a podcast conversation and sometimes you have questions or you want to go deeper or it reminds you of something that someone said on the same podcast two or three weeks earlier or two or three months earlier. Good news for you. If you go to realestateteamos.com bot, that's/bot, you can tap into the collective wisdom of every single one of our guests. Use text mode to type back and forth and get your questions answered. Get 5 tips to improve your recruiting, for example, or go to voice mode and you can talk to it back and forth, interrupt it, redirect it, ask follow up questions. It's totally free. It's available to you@realestateteamos.com Bot that's realestateteamos.com bot. I know you'll find it just as useful as the rest of this conversation.

Yes. Yeah, I mean my smart list build out is pretty extensive. I have, you know, leads in the last 24 hours. Then I have my, my ISA hot handoffs that haven't been communicated with for a certain number of days. And then we have active, you know, the active buyer filters. So buyers that have interacted with, you know, Real Scout or something else in the past 14 days that haven't been called within seven days. Same thing with my sellers. They have the, you know, certain tags, things like that, zero to 90 days. And then we have people we haven't spoken to yet. And so we also have a pond system. We have seven day leads 30 day leads and shark tank. And agents are encouraged to go into that shark tank because those are the people that are converting. Like, nobody's falling in our laps anymore. So I've made it easy for agents to identify. Out of the tens of thousands of leads that we have, the ones that are most likely to transact. I mean, these tools are beautiful. You can tell when somebody has looked at a listing three times. And, like, when they did it, all right, like six hours ago, Mary Jane looked at 123 Main street three times. Like, time to reach out. Right. Like, I love how much easier these tools make it for agents to do their jobs. And I'm really, like, happy and honestly, like, proud to be able to offer these things to the agents on my team. And it's there that's another, like, white glove experience that, you know, a team leader that, like, cheaps out. Like. Like, they're not gonna get with that. Right. Like, I don't want to cheap out. It's like the worst feeling. So. Yes. Is it more expensive? Yes. But I don't think I'd feel right doing it any other way, frankly.

You just kind of brought back something that I didn't follow up on when you introduced the. The topic as part of a different answer, which is value prop. What was your value prop, you know, a year and a half ago or so, versus what is it today? Like, because you have invested significantly in. And it's clear just in this conversation that there is a lot of value, and I would assume some of that is unique value in the market, at least to the degree that you can communicate it to somebody effectively and they understand the value of it, which is a missing link. A lot of people think we have so much value, but it's like, that's great. You can have all the value in the world, but if you can't translate it to someone else on the other side of the table, it's not that useful. What was your value prop then? What is your value prop today? And I guess, kind of in parallel. How has your role changed over that time too?

Yeah, totally. All right. So, I mean, you know, aside from these buyer and seller programs, these really extensive programs that I've seen put together for my agents, they do have access to reside, you know, founded by some of the most, you know, prolific people in real estate right now. And they get to be coached by them, and I think that that's lovely. So they get training by them. I get leadership training. Right. So my value prop, it's funny. So I think that A team leader's value prop, like, should be a good percentage them and their evolution as a human being. Right. I have evolved so much in my way of thinking and the way that I feel about, you know, other people and this business and myself and so being able to model these behaviors and model, I don't know, like, growing up and just being a better person to these other people that kind of like they want what you have. I think that that's a huge value prop. And then there's like the solids stuff, the buyer and the seller programs and the staff and the training that reside brings and the coaching and the. And then, of course, I don't know, like our, our new office. I mean, I think that that's a really great value prop. It's situated in the hottest town in the hottest county, hottest real. Real estate market in the country for the past two years, as voted by realtor.com that has nice frontage. You know, I've always been super accessible, so. And I know that that will change over time the more agents that I have. But I care enough to put systems and people in place to make sure that nobody's left by the wayside. I just think I, you know, having somebody that like, genuinely cares about other people's success, like, that's important. I think they're. There are over 300 teams in Connecticut, and to be ranked in the top 10, like my first year out the gate, to me, like, that says that what I'm putting out there as a person and as with systems is doing the right thing.

I love the way that you broke that apart, like the, you know, the real practical things, and you have a lot of those. But then also this personal story, it's definitely been a part of a lot of the conversations here on real Estate Team Os of like, you know, where'd you get your first five agents? It was like I sat down and I told them what it. What I was doing to be successful. I shared them enough of my best tips, told them there's a lot more where that came from. Do you want to do this? And they said, yeah. So like, and, and, and there's. There's no faking and no hiding the sincerity behind, you know, whatever your motivation is. And what I'm getting from you is I want this to be done the right way. I'm not going to stop until it is done the right way. And by done the right way, I mean for you as the agent who's considering joining this team and for your clients and all of our fellow Teams, clients. Like, I don't.

You hit that perfectly. Like, you hit the nail on the head the right way. I'm, like, very much. And there's. There's lots of right ways, I guess. But, yeah, like, I want to. Like, I'm sticking to my guns.

Yeah. I like this. Not cheaping out is other language I picked up for me, like, that people can feel that difference. Right. It's when you go into new construction and it's done solidly, or you go into new construction, it's like you got the cheapest hardware from the cheapest vendor, and it's like, it's a good location, it looks nice, the layout's good, but all the finishing is, like, it's trash to the touch.

Yeah. And we've. We've been in some of those places. As opposed to, like, a custom build, maybe, that the builder themselves lived in. Right. Yeah. That's how I feel. Like, this. This is. It's a custom build, and I've taken from other people's systems and models, like, the pieces that I really love and fit best with my personality and my values. Yeah. And I'm creating this really beautiful thing. I am, like, just genuinely excited to see where this goes and to see how far I can push myself. Like, every week that goes by and there are, like, significant ups and downs, but in general, like, the trend is up.

Question for you that I haven't really. We've talked about, like, changing brokerages and being brokered by different companies with folks on the show, but my understanding is that you pretty recently switched to LPT Realty, and I would love for you to talk about that just as a project. Like, when did it occur to you that there might be a different opportunity? How did you evaluate how much time did it take? Who else did you bring into the decision, you know, rebranding all of your materials? Like, we've never gotten into that at all. And I know that we're, you know, we're not at the beginning of the conversation here, but, like, share a little bit about that from, like, a. From the. From, like, thoughts and motivation and guidance. Like, you know, who did you seek to kind of, like, validate what you were thinking or feeling? Like, is this right? And then go a little bit to the practical side of, like, how much work was it? Like, you know, and maybe what was easier than you expected or harder than you expected?

Sure, sure. So first of all, just start by saying, like, I didn't leave Exp because I was unhappy, happy. I didn't. I didn't I wasn't moving away from negative. I, I moved toward positive and potential. I love new and I love challenges. Like, I just, I love anything that feels, feels cutting edge. And so I saw opportunity. I mean it took months to, to make the move. Just like my move to EXP actually took like couple of years of convincing, but it took months. And I was able to meet Robert Palmer. Like he's a genuinely good person and I'm really excited to see what he does. I feel like he also throws himself like 120% into the things that he does. And I really believe in the agent choice model. I think that, that in this time in this really difficult market, there are a lot of agents that just need more money in their pockets, right. And there are those of us team leaders that see ourselves building big teams, building down lions, building this family. So that's awesome for me. But like what about like just a normal agent that wants to do 12 sales a year? Like I want them to have more money in their pockets and so that the move to LPT was to help my agents bring more home and it was also to be more attractive to other agents evaluating what team to join. They also filled a void in my business with their paper products. The listing power tools is really, really neat. I have people on my team that old school door knock. Like I door knocked. I don't want them to have to pay for their own materials. You know, being able to send postcards is huge. And with the TCPA regulations going into effect, those old school ways of doing business are coming back. And I think it's really smart. Like I just, I, you know, the door knocking, the brochures, the human to human interaction instead of the texting and the phone calls, right. Half of our database is on the do not call list, right. In addition to that, he has systems that you know, help teams grow, which I love. Coaching and systems in addition to reside, it's like complimentary to reside. I'm like, I love learning. Like anybody that I can learn from, like, I'm like, give it to me, give it to me and let me process and take what works. What else do I like? I think, you know, the fact that there are no monthly fees really help agents, no sign on fees, but the value is there. You know, having the CRM, the website trainings, having our intranet, that's really, really easy to find. Ordering marketing materials, super duper easy marketing materials where we're front and center has always been super important to me. Like my brand has been really important to Me, I'll never sell. I'll never pay a split to support somebody else's brand. I just can't. I can't do it. And you know, frankly, being able to build a downline and accumulate pre IPO stock, just no brainer, right? Pre IPO stock. So like the same reason why people joined EXP and were excited about joining exp. I have that same thing with lpt plus some. Yeah, it's exciting.

So from commitment to live, like when you're like, okay, I've heard what I need to hear. I made my decision. You sign something like, what does that window look like? And how. I just want to. Like, from your experience, how distracting was any of the kind of nuts and bolts stuff relative to your service to clients and service to agents?

My staff took care of so much that it was hard. Like honestly, it was fast and furious. We did it in a week. LPT replacement, all of my existing signs and my swag and like all of that, like no time was lost. I did not. Yeah, I mean I, I devoted time each day of that week to make sure things were getting done and have meetings and we have huddles every morning with my staff. So we just made sure to keep the lines of communication open. They made it crazy easy to move stuff over. I paid license transfer fees for the agents already on my team. Like it just, it was, it was relatively seamless.

Well, congratulations. Continued success in this year ahead. I don't doubt you're going to hit your goals and if you don't, it won't be for a lack of effort. We are subject to probably less outside force than I think a lot of people. I mean like you, for example, doubling your business in what was a down year. You know, this is just a testament to the fact that it's not just external forces. I think a lot of people over lean that way. At the same time, you also can't totally muscle your way into, into success when like the headwinds are 100% against.

I can't. Yes, I can.

Yeah. Well, regardless, I'm excited to, to see how this goes for you. I know that you're going to put your all in. I appreciate you making time for this conversation. Before I let you go, I always have three fun pairs of closing questions so you can answer one or the other. Some people choose to do both on some of them and you're welcome to do that too. But what is your very favorite team to root for besides your own real estate team? Or what is the best team you've ever been a member of besides your own real estate team?

Reside. Yes, Reside.

Okay.

Yeah.

Oh, by the way, I forgot to throw in this promotional message. Sunit, Preston, Nick, and John have all been guests on the show. And someone besides you has also, I think, mentioned Reside. It might have been one of those four. I can't remember. But in any case, good call. What is one of your most frivolous purchases or what is a cheapskate habit you hold on to even though you probably don't need to?

Cheapskate habit. I have clothing like that I, that I acquired, I don't know, 20 years ago. Cheapskate habit. We drive cars that are really old and we like not having car payments. Cheapskate habit. And then my most frivolous purchase. It's funny because I'm really careful about spending my money. All right, that's good.

Like, by the way, I don't regard driving an 18 year old car with, you know, 200,000 miles. It's not cheap. That's just smart. Well maintained too, by the way.

Well mean, seriously. And hardly needing anything in that time. I'm thinking of two things that were like crazy expensive, but they weren't frivolous.

Yeah, that's fine. You know, I've had that too. People offer something and I'm like, well, you know, you did that for the benefit of your family so you could have more time together. Like, like I don't think buying that ranch was all that frivolous at all.

I know, like, like you like. Yeah, I was gonna say like my 10 year anniversary trip, which was freaking amazing, but really expensive.

That's cool. Where'd you go?

Went to Curacao and we stayed at a luxury resort. And yeah, like we got crazy and like rented a private yacht for a day. Like it was insane. We loved it.

Like, that's awesome. There we go. And that's why it's not frivolous.

Yeah.

When you are investing your time in resting and relaxing and recharging, what are you doing? Or when you're investing time in learning, growing and developing, what are you doing?

I'm trail running and spending time with my kids. Those are the two things that really fill my cup. And then learning. I adore going to conferences. They recharge me. I get to see what people are doing at a very high level and I get to meet people that are working at a very high level. Those are my two main things. Yeah.

Cool. Any highlights on the. You know, we're recording this in early 2025. It'll release. I think in, like, I think this is going to go in, like, early March. Anything on. And I just offer that to say there's time in the calendar ahead. Any highlights in the year ahead in terms of places you want to go to spend time in person. Conferences.

Oh, conferences.

Yeah. Anything that's on your calendar right now that you're really excited about?

Yeah, it's not on the calendar right now, but I'm always excited about chat block events. Chat block Tahoe I go to every year. And I cannot wait until he schedules his next maverick. And then Conversion Con will always be, like, near and dear to my heart because it was my very first speaking gig. So all of these, you know, getting together with people that I know and getting to hear these really high operators, you know, share their wisdom, like, I just. Yeah, that's what I'm excited about.

Jessica, this has been a pleasure. I appreciate you so much. I'm motivated by your own, like, you know, attitude about the work that you're doing. If someone else feels similarly and they want to connect with you or learn more about your team, where are some places you'd send people to follow up on this conversation?

Yeah, I'm easiest to find on Facebook. Just search Jessica Boswell. You'll find my headshot Instagram Boswell Team email Jessica Jessica Boswell, team.com. yeah, pretty easy. We probably have mutual friends on social. I'm friends with everybody.

Cool. Those things are linked up down below as well. Jessica, I appreciate you and I hope you have an awesome rest of your day.

Thank you. You too. Thanks so much for having me. Thanks for checking out this episode of Team os. Get quick insights all the time by checking out real estate team os on Instagram and on TikTok.