Fighting Human Trafficking with Remedy Drive's David Zach - Episode 409 Voices In My Head (The Rick

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Welcome back to Voices in My Head. As always, I'm your host, Rick Lee James. Rick Lee James, and I am so glad that you can be here with us again for what I know is going to be another great conversation this week. My guest this week on Voices in My Head is David Zock. For nearly a decade, David Zock has worked undercover alongside operatives from the Exodus Road to identify perpetrators and fight slavery in Southeast Asia and Latin America. His 13 deployments with the International Anti-Trafficking Organization have inspired the music and mission of Remedy Drive and have given Zock a platform to speak at colleges and festivals across the country. He's been a guest speaker at the University of Minnesota, University of Wisconsin-Green Bay, Drake University, Vanderbilt University, and the University of Arkansas, among other institutions. To date, Remedy Drive's fan base has contributed more than $350,000 toward rescue efforts, technology, vehicles, and expenses for frontline operatives. Remedy Drive has garnered 12 top 20 singles and released 12 critically acclaimed recordings since their inception in 1998. The band's music has been heard on NBC, Speed TV, and VH1, as well as Middle Tennessee Hyundai Dealers' Music That Drives promotion. Remedy Drive's latest album, Imago Amor, the band's 13th full-length recording, released on January 29. David Zoch has stopped by the podcast for a visit today, and I'm so glad that he has. David Zoch, welcome to Voices in My Head.

Hey, it's great to be on the program, Rick.

David, congratulations on this new album. I've been really enjoying listening to it, and I am so glad to have a chance to be able to sit, not only to talk about the latest release of Remedy Drive, but to talk more about the great work that you have been doing for some time now with Exodus Road. I am so glad that, uh, that Brian Smith reached out to me about the chance to talk with you because you are doing such important work. And I'm so glad to have a chance to share with my listeners here on the Voices in My Head podcast about the good work that you are doing today. So let's dive right in and tell us about the significance, first of all, of the album title of the new Remedy Drive album, Imago Amor.

Well, um, Imago is Latin for the phrase "the image of," and amor is Spanish for love. So I think more than any time in my lifetime, seeing both up hand when I'm facing trafficking in close quarters on the front lines, but also the image of love being attacked on the airwaves as well with dehumanizing language. Marginalized people groups being further marginalized by those in power. And so it's a meaningful title to me to remember that we are all designed so intricately and so precisely, not only designed in love but also designed to love as well.

Yeah, yeah. And even the lyrics of that track, the title track of the song, that really emphasizes the way that we are made for each other, and we are made in the image of love. And it really is a call to recapture the image that we are made in. And you even deal with some of the things that we're going through right now. It was interesting that from— there's a line that talks about from interstate to quarantine, from dust to dust, and you talk about the fragility of humanity in the song. And it really is a lot of relevance in the time that we're in right now. So it was nice to see so much of, you know, the present moment that we're in and recapturing the moment of our humanity that we're in on this album. I've just really been enjoying— musically, it's a masterful album, but even lyrically, there's just so much in it, and it's so interweaved with the work that you are doing with anti-trafficking as well. It's hard to talk about one without talking about the other, just because of the way that you have so woven the lyrics and the music with the work and the mission that you do with The Exodus Road together. So it's almost hard to know how to talk about one without referring to the other. So I wonder if we could talk a bit about some of the work that you do with The Exodus Road. And throughout this podcast, I'm going to try to edit in some of the music from the album along with some of the stories, maybe about some of the work that you do as well. And we'll just see how it all kind of edits together in our conversation today. I know that the title, um, of the album is about recapturing really the image and the love of humanity that we are made in. And then there's the first single of the album, which is Dragons, which is another really great track. And I know that there's a video that you have on YouTube where you talk about making trafficking dangerous again, and there's this section on the video that really just broke my heart when I watched it. And I'd love if you could tell us a little bit about it, because there's a line in the song Dragons that it says, we're turning numbers into names these days. And you reference that in the video when you're talking about the work that you are doing in anti-trafficking. And I wonder if you could share a little bit about the meaning of that line, we're turning numbers into names these days, because you reference in the video all of these young ladies who have been kind of put behind glass and they have numbers on them and some of the significance of that, of turning numbers into names.

So Dragons, I wrote a year ago. I started writing it in Thailand, and I visit a lot of red light districts. Like, the second verse of that song says In the valley of the shadow, it's the starlight that guides us in the alleys of the neon glow and the pathways of the righteous. And it's been the highest honor of my life so far to accompany brave and courageous and righteous women and men into some of the darkest areas in the world. And in that video, you see, um, you see a shot from a, from a cell phone. That I put in my pocket 8 years ago. And then you see other shots from hidden camera footage of a particular kind of brothel that they used to sell teenage girls out of in Asia, and it's called a fishbowl, and there's girls behind glass like in an aquarium.

Hmm.

And this is the case in those type of establishments that I've been in a lot of those, but also in some of the dance clubs, in some of the commercial red light districts that exist to meet the demand of foreign tourists heading to that area. Sex tourism is, is, is a real thing in many cities in Asia and other parts of the world, and there's demand coming from the United States, from Australia, from men from Russia and Europe will go to these places to get away with taking advantage of young teenage girls— where in many parts of the world that's going to be a lot more dangerous, it's going to be more expensive, it's going to be risky, but it's not risky here. It's easy, it's inexpensive, it costs $50 maybe for an hour. And what's startling and alarming when you first start doing this work, and something that I've gotten used to, is that most of the handlers inside of these clubs, inside of these establishments, don't know the real names of a lot of the girls in there. And there's a high turnaround rate sometimes too. And I'm meeting 14-year-olds, 15-year-olds, and in one of those particular shots you see a girl with, with a circle and a number pinned on her bikini top. And that's just normal. Men will pick out a girl by a number on her bikini top. And that idea, I mean, there's— it can be overwhelming. To know that this is happening and that there's 40 million people being enslaved. And those statistics are daunting. But for me, you know, that number that's attached with that girl when she shows up and they pin that on her, like, I know her story. I know her hopes and dreams. I know about her mom. I know about what she wished she could be doing if she didn't have to be stuck here in the city. By some fraud, some force, some coercion, she's been caught up in this thing by no fault of her own. And she should be a kid running barefoot in the countryside, but instead she's forced in these high heels and forced to go with strangers on a daily basis.

Hmm.

Wow.

And so the work that you do really is is this sort of— you're like an undercover operative that when you're on tour, say with Remedy Drive, you'll go into these other countries and you'll go into places like this, maybe with a camera, and you'll be able to— and you'll be able to explain this, I'm sure, much better than I can, but you'll be there really kind of doing some sort of reconnaissance work, in essence. Am I kind of explaining that correct, to be able to get information about these women who are in slavery there to bring back, to try to find ways to set them free. Is that in essence kind of the work that you're doing there?

My, my time overseas is separate from the band. I've never done work with the Exodus Road while on tour with the band, even though we have played in different countries.

Okay.

But the purpose of what we do at the Exodus Road, I participate in it in short-term deployments, 2, 3 weeks at a time.

Okay.

And I joined the work of the real heroines and heroes of this fight, are my friends from the countries that we're operating in that do it on a regular basis, funded in part, like you mentioned at the top of the show, by the generous community of the Remedy Drive Nation.

Okay.

Our fans help fund spy gear, help fund vehicles, but the purpose of us going in there, sometimes it is reconnaissance. We're tailing gangsters, we're tailing criminal networks, we're finding out where they're operating, trying to, trying to get as much information and evidence against them that we can take to local or regional or counter-trafficking law enforcement or sometimes Interpol, United Nations, whoever it is that will partner with us to take action against these, these sometimes individuals, but oftentimes criminal networks. And so as a result, it's not simple. It's not like an Amber Alert where it's like, this girl's, you know, we have to, we have to pretend to be customers in order, in order to, to prove that something illegal is going on here. So that's our, that's our purpose in going into some of these establishments, um, is They're not— sometimes it's kind of in the open. I remember 7 years ago, it was, it was oftentimes you'd find 14-year-old girls on the streets in, in broad daylight. Um, but they, they know that it's dangerous. They know we're looking now. We're a thorn in their side. We're making it more expensive for them to do what they're doing. We're making it dangerous for their customers. We're making it dangerous for them. They have to pay off corrupt cops, corrupt politicians in order to stay open. And I, You know, I record those conversations. I talk to bar owners about how they're able to stay open. One of them told me a year ago, he's like, yes, he right up there. I had 5 of the top cops in the city sitting right up there, you know, 2 hours ago. I wish I could introduce you to him. And so I'm pretending to be corrupt myself for the purpose of shining a light on what they're doing. And then we have to be real careful and establish meaningful relationships with law enforcement that we can trust so that we can not only help these women and help these girls and boys escape this, but also the goal is to dismantle these criminal networks. And that sends a message that somebody is watching.

Well, that, that brings up another question that I was thinking about. Does it ever present any sort of danger, say, when you put out a YouTube video of yourself talking about something like the Exodus Road The work that you're doing, or if you go on a podcast, or say when you're with the band somewhere talking about the work that you're doing with The Exodus Road, is there a chance that your face gets out there? And do you have to be maybe disguised when you go places and do work like this so that you aren't spotted and that somebody sees, hey, that's the guy that, you know, is doing this work and we know him, or something like that? Or is there Is it just that it's far enough removed from this part of the world that there wouldn't be a chance of you being spotted? Or it just seems like the world is so much smaller now with the internet that there'd be more of a chance you might be noticed or recognized.

Yeah, I don't want that to happen. And in the ways we can be, we're careful. You know, I can change my appearance to some degree, but at the same time, we're If I'm working out in the rural countryside of Latin America or in Asia, I don't recommend it as a strategy for people that have a public face to do this work. But at the same time, I'm recruiting people into this work. And I think that's my larger contribution is shining a light and spreading awareness and bringing people to the front lines. Whether it's law enforcement that I've met at concerts or ex-military guys that I've met at concerts or the funding, all of it, I think I would not feel right about asking somebody to lay their life down and possibly put their life on the line if I'm not willing to do the same.

Sure.

And so we're careful, we're wise, and we use We use discretion, we have best practices, and my biggest fear would be, you know, ruining an ongoing operation. So I'm careful about that for sure.

Yeah, well, good. And you know, while we're talking about that, I do want to take a chance to be able to let you share with people who might be listening before we're done how they can maybe find ways to be a part of this work too, because I know it's so important. But I also want to ask you to— I also wanted to ask you, I know that your family and your wife especially is a part of this story of you doing the work that you do with the Exodus Road. And whenever you had decided that you wanted to be a part of this, and the person who started Exodus Road, I've forgotten his name right now.

Matt Butler.

Matt, yes, that's right, Matt Parker. The story that you tell, Matt had said, well, I want you to talk to your wife first because she needs to be on board with you doing this kind of work first. And maybe you could tell us that story too, because your wife is actually a big part of this as well, and your family, and kind of giving you the blessing to do this work.

Yeah, so I met Matt, I was in the middle of writing Commodity, He didn't know that we had already started writing a trilogy of albums about this. I didn't know it would be a trilogy at the time either. And we just left our record label to focus on this. And he found out about the band from the radio. Our song from 2008 was one of his favorites all along. As I'm talking to him, I got that sense of like, how can I just sing about this? And I'm frustrated at the time, and today too, at the overemphasis on singing and the massive underemphasis, the imbalance on action, on tangible action on behalf of representing the poor and the powerless, the marginalized, the exiled. The enslaved people that I love so much, that we're designed to love. And by love, I mean action. And so I said, Matt, I can't just sing about this, man. I got to join you. Is there any way you can take me with you so I can see it, so I can be informed? And he says, well, you got to talk to your wife first. And he came over for breakfast the next morning, and he's telling us about the work. And my wife, through tears, said, David's going to join you. This will be our legacy.

Wow, that's awesome. That's, that's a— it sounds like you have an amazing wife that, yeah, she would, she would give you that kind of blessing too. That's great. Well, you know, in, in the video that you shared online, and, and I'm gonna actually put a link on our podcast website so people can find it too, but the video about Make Trafficking Dangerous You talk about that you're not a person who necessarily has a special set of skills like Liam Neeson in the movie Taken, and, and that everybody has their own gifting, that everybody has their own way that they can help. And the people who are listening right now might actually have their own special ways of helping to fight against slavery in their own ways that they can join in, in the anti-trafficking movement., and it may even be something that until right now they haven't even thought of. It may just be something that, hey, I can do this, you know. I wonder if maybe you could just talk to our listeners right now and maybe give them a way that, that they can just— maybe by helping them go to the Exodus Road website, or a way that they can just take some action right now and find out some more about ways that they could learn more, to find out how to become a part of this anti-trafficking movement?

A great place to start is if you text REMEDY to 51555, you'll get updates on your phone when we make, when we make raids that result in arrests and that result in freedom for the survivors of trafficking. And that's so exciting. So it's REMEDY to 51555. And you'll get a chance to participate too, to some degree. And a great place to start is, is, you know, contributing a monthly amount, you know, the cost of a couple cups of coffee. Or for, I think, around $40, you can, you can, you can put your stamp on one night of investigation. So one, one team out in the field We usually spend around that, um, on transportation and overhead. And that's a way to just be in it. And I think those small steps, sharing, sharing successes of the Exodus Road online, following us on our social media, um, those small steps build a muscle memory in us. And what I have seen and what I believe and know to be true is that you do have a unique and special sphere of influence, set of skills like you mentioned. It might not be playing music like I do, but I have decided to spend the currency of my rock and roll band on the modern-day abolition movement. And everybody has a currency. Everybody has their own creativity, their own particular, um, way of approaching things. And there's something that you already love doing, and I believe that you can do it in the direction of freedom. And where it starts is this, like, I reference, uh, Liam Neeson, even though that Taken movie is, is really not a, a, a accurate in the sense of kind of what trafficking looks like normally. That's kind of a, an exaggerated, um, and a very unique incident where, where girls are like taken at the airport like that, and that sort of violence is used to So, and that's good. It did help bring some awareness to the issue, a lot of it, and that's important. But there is so much disinformation surrounding the trafficking, you know, the trafficking, the business of trafficking, what it looks like. And it's been frustrating, especially in the last 7 months, how much disinformation has come out and how the sensationalized, exaggerated headline-based trafficking, it has created a real distraction and a hindrance to the real work of fighting trafficking. So I really recommend inform yourself from an organization that's doing work, not just from an organization that's, you know, posting stuff. A lot of those posts are exaggerated and the facts are twisted and the accusations are are unsubstantiated, and it gives, it gives everybody that looks at it a reason to dismiss this work. But find an organization that's doing real work, uh, that you're— that the organization— and I stand behind the work of The Exodus Road 100%.

And, and you've been working with The Exodus Road long enough that, that you, that you know that they are a solid organization and they are giving good information too. And I, I just wanted to re-emphasize emphasize the importance of having good information that's out there too. And you had just quickly said about, you know, a lot of the posts over the last 7 months, there's been a lot of misinformation that's been going out that's actually been claiming to be information about trafficking that's actually been harmful to the work of trafficking that has been coming from bad sourcing. So I just wanted to emphasize that again too. So find places like The Exodus Road that actually does the work and knows what they're talking about and is actually doing the actual real work of anti-trafficking for information like that. So, and we are going to make sure and put all of these links on the website at voicesinmyheadpodcast.com for sure, along with all the links to Remedy Drive, so that we can make sure with easily, easily with clicks be able to find all this information on here. Well, this is, this is great, and I really appreciate that you've taken some time today to be able to tell us more about the good work that you are doing to help us understand better ways that we can, can help with the anti-trafficking mission. And I really appreciate your heart because a lot of us just don't know. I can remember, it's, it's been less than probably 15 years ago when I first through a news report heard that this was even a thing that was going on in the world. Like, just talk about living in ignorance. I just didn't even know it was something that was happening. And talk about living in the privilege that I was living in, in my own little world here in America, and then to come to find out it was even happening in the US in places that we wouldn't even realize. And so I just so appreciate the way that you are helping us to understand and bring to light, and especially as as people who follow Jesus, ways that we can help to be a part of this so much. So we just really appreciate the good work that you are doing, and I hope that you will continue to help us do that in the coming days. And I want to remind everybody one more time, 51555. If you'll text the word "remedy" to that, you will get updates on your phone. So I think today, David, I think we're going to close out our time together today by playing one of the tracks from the new album, which is Imago Amor, is the new album. And I think we're actually going to close our time together today by playing the title cut, Imago Amor, because I just really love that song. And I so appreciate you taking some time to be here today on Voices in My Head podcast. And I thank you for being one of the voices in my head this week.

Thank you, Rick. Thanks for having me on the program. I think Mago Amor is a perfect, perfect ending.

You and me made for each other in the image of love. Strangers and neighbors and wanderer, we are all alike. Captivated and exiled under the same stars tonight. We made peace when we were younger. Before we learn to fight. Every grain of sand is numbered in the first light. We're made for each other in the image of love. The image of love. You and me, made for each other in the image of love.

Thank you for joining me here this week on Voices in My Head. I hope you'll visit me on my website at rickleejames.com where you can find out more about me, get my music on vinyl and CD, follow my blog, and even schedule me for a concert or a speaking engagement. Better yet, even a book signing in your neighborhood. You can find all that and more at rickleejames.com. Also, it would mean a great deal to me if you could write a review of this podcast on iTunes. The more positive reviews that we receive, the more visible this podcast will be online. And now for the benediction: May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. God bless you, and thank you for listening to Voices in My Head.