Hello Neighbor! with Special Guest Matthew Cordell - A World Kindness Day Special Episode.

Welcome to The Neighborhood, a Mr. Rogers tribute podcast. I'm your host, Rick Lee James of rickleejames.com, and I run the Mr. Rogers Quotes Twitter account and now Instagram account found @MrRogersSay. As we again walk into this podcast neighborhood, I want you to know that no matter where you are from, you are welcome here. I'm glad to be your neighbor. Every daughter, every son, every tribe, and every tongue, in the spirit of Fred Rogers and the life of welcome that he lived, welcome to the neighborhood. Matthew Cordell is the Caldecott Medal-winning author and illustrator of Wolf in the Snow and the illustrator of numerous highly acclaimed children's books, including The Only Fish in the Sea and Special Delivery. Which was a Washington Post Best Book of 2015. He wrote and illustrated Another Brother, Wish, and Hello, Hello, a New York Times Notable Children's Book. His new book, Hello Neighbor: The Kind and Caring World of Mister Rogers, is the official authorized picture book of Fred Rogers. Matthew lives near Chicago with his wife, author Julie Halpern, and their two children. He stopped by for a visit on our podcast neighborhood today, and I'm so thrilled about that. Matthew Cordell, welcome to the neighborhood.

Thanks for having me, Rick. Great to be here.

Well, I am so glad that we had a chance to do a little visit on this Saturday morning. It's a— it's at least here in Ohio a beautiful day, and I'm sure that there's many things you could be doing with your time, so I am just grateful that you chose today to be a day to spend with me for a little bit. I want to say congratulations on this wonderful new book. I just got my copy in the mail a couple of days ago and was able to read through it, and it's just a beautifully done book. So I just want to congratulate you on that. Sure. As we begin, I'd love for you to tell our listeners just a little bit about yourself.

So I, um, as you mentioned already, I'm an author and illustrator of many books for children Started out as an artist, visual artist, and I've always drawn, loved to draw and paint ever since I was a little boy. And I ended up getting into children's books because my wife, who my girlfriend at the time who I met, is a children's librarian. At the time she was in elementary school, but she's worked in middle schools and both middle and elementary, but she sort of reintroduced me to children's books in my 20s when we met, and I just loved, I loved everything about them and ended up, you know, she and I submitted a book together that she had written and I did some sample illustrations for, and it ended up getting published, and I just loved everything about it. The audience of children, the wonderful world of publishing for children, and drawing, painting, and ultimately ended up becoming an author as well. So my first book was published in 2004, so it's been a nice ride so far. But I grew up in South Carolina, a town called Greenville, and now we live in the suburbs of Chicago, and we have two children, a 12-year-old daughter and a 7-year-old son. And yeah, it's great. Life is great, and it's been really exciting to talk about and share Hello Neighbor since it came out as well. Sure.

Well, it's interesting you say Greenville. I actually, I'm a musician and I played at least one or two concerts in Greenville over the years, so I'm a little a little bit familiar with the area.

That's great.

Yeah, nice. And how long ago did you say you moved from Greenville to where you are?

So I moved, uh, into, into Chicago, uh, in 1999.

Okay.

It's been, it's been a large chunk of my life. Yeah, it's been— at this point it's been about half and half. Sure. Life in, in the South and half here in the Midwest.

Two really different perspectives on life for sure, but both, both wonderful places to live for sure. So, well, that's terrific. I appreciate you sharing a little bit about yourself and sharing your story with us. What I would really love to know this morning, and I'm sure our listeners would like to know too, everybody who comes on this show, they seem to have their own Mr. Rogers story about a special way that Fred Rogers in some way impacted their life. And I have found that sometimes it happened when they were very young, sometimes it happened when they were adults. And I would just love to know, uh, what is your Mr. Rogers story?

Well, I, you know, I was born in 1975, so that was really, really prime time for Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood, you know, sort of right at the center of its height, I would say, you know, because, you know, it started in 1968 and it was really going strong in my youth. So I was raised on a lot of those really rock-solid PBS children's television programs, you know, Sesame Street, Mr. Rogers. At the time there was Electric Company, you know, that there were really only a few at the time. Now there's so many to choose from and so many different networks. But so Mr. Rogers was a, was a really, a really important part of my childhood and, you know, those preschool kindergarten years and You know, as I grew up, you know, my interests changed, of course, as I became an older child and a teenager and college. And I did think about Mr. Rogers from time to time whenever he may come up in conversation or in the public eye. But I didn't really think about him a whole lot, again, until I became a dad myself. My daughter was born in 2008, and what had happened was we— she, you know, in those early years we weren't watching any television. You know, there's just not really any, any need or want to have your child, your really— your infant, you know, in front of a television set. But as she got to about 2 years old, we were letting her watch a little more TV, and I would have PBS on in the mornings and in the afternoons whenever there was, you know, children's programming on. And so there was one afternoon when the TV was on, but we weren't really watching it. We were kind of playing in the next room, and I heard the opening music come on from the television, the opening music of Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood. And I hadn't heard that song in years, many years. And it just really, it just, it just really struck me to the core, you know, just very nostalgic feelings. And there's a lot of memories. So we ended up going into the next room with Romy and we watched it together. And I was seeing it through a whole different perspective. You know, I had memories of what it was like growing up, but as I was watching it as an adult and as a dad, I was just astounded by how sincere and real and kind and curious and accepting and open and warm. I mean, it was just so many, you know, in a world that can be really dark and sarcastic and cynical.

Yes.

Here was this man in this program about the complete opposite of that, you know, loving of children and nurturing. And it was just so— it was just refreshing in every way. And, um, and it really moved me, you know. I think I may have even cried a little bit, you know. Yeah, I was just so surprised, um, at what I didn't remember or didn't know, um, about the television program. That I grew up with. So I started to watch it every day, you know, um, sometimes even without my daughter I would just have it on, you know. And, and, uh, I, I just was so just constantly impressed by him, and to the point where I, I wanted to know more about, you know, Fred Rogers, you know. I was, I was learning about Mr. Rogers, but I wanted to know more about Fred Rogers. So certainly I started to look him up and to see, you know, was he really like Mr. Rogers? You know, was this, was this just a character he was playing? How similar to Mr. Rogers was Fred Rogers? And of course, I found out pretty quickly that they're basically one and the same, which again was another surprise. You know, it was just constant surprises. And at that point, you know, being a children's author and illustrator, I knew that I really wanted to bring his story into the picture book world because this was a— like I said, this was about 2010, and Mr. Rogers has always been very iconic, but I would say in those years there was a period of years where he wasn't as in the public eye as, as he is today. I think, you know, there's been a resurgence of of love and interest again in Mr. Rogers and Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood. But in those years, I think it was a little dormant at that time. So I thought, you know, I was really excited about the prospect of sort of reintroducing, as I was reintroduced, reintroducing to families Mr. Rogers, this incredible person, this incredible spirit, unlike anyone else I've ever learned about or encountered. That could bring, that could shine a light of kindness into our world, you know, as, as parents, as children, as families.

Yeah.

Um, in a way that no one else can, I feel, you know. No one, no one has since. And, uh, and it was just really inspiring to me to try to make that happen from that point on. So it was, uh, it was really powerful to, for me to rediscover him and, and for him to be back in my life again.

Truly. Well, I think hearing your story, I can, I can hear some definite similarities with mine too, because I think I too grew up watching him. I'm just a couple years younger than you, and I grew up watching him. Didn't think a lot about him over the years, but then when I became a father, boy, it was, it was something to kind of dive in again. And not only with the show, like you said, but then to learn more about him, and then to find that he was really even more Mr. Rogers off the set than he was on. It's kind of amazing. Um, and, and I think you're right in that he is unique in the sense that there hasn't been maybe quite the voice of moral authority in our world like his, uh, since then. And I've, I've often thought, especially over the last few years that have just seemed especially turbulent in the world, um, it would be really nice if there was a person who was universally a voice of moral authority that could just speak into a moment. Because I feel like in many ways, even though he's passed on, his words and who he was and who he intentionally cultivated a life to become, I think he was that voice of moral authority that was almost this bulwark against the darkness, you know, that just in his loving and very kind and very true being true to who he was, did some amazing things. So, so thank you for, for sharing your story and the way that he affected you. It's, it's something that I, that I hear so many times, and yet everybody has it at their own unique way of the way they've been affected, for sure.

Yeah.

With your, your new book, and, and again, it's wonderful, and I want to let all of our listeners know that I'm going to have links to your book and to your website and everything that we have. If they go to fredrogerspodcast.com, they'll be able to find just with a couple of clicks all of your information. But I want to get into the book a little bit as far as— this is unique in that it is the authorized picture book biography of Fred Rogers. What does that mean exactly? Does that mean that Fred Rogers Productions put their official stamp on this? Or tell us a little bit about kind of what that means, that it has the official authorization.

Yeah, definitely. So when I first thought about making this book, it was important to me to do it in such a way where it was only done with sort of the blessing of— and at this time I wasn't aware of Fred Rogers Productions, I wasn't aware of Fred Rogers Company, it was called at the time, that it was I assume there must have been some sort of company or not-for-profit still in existence, or even if just the family held some sort of proprietary rights over everything. And it was important to me to contact whoever that was and try to make this happen in a very official way, you know. I only wanted to do it if it was giving back to, uh, you know, the entity that was Fred Rogers, you know, because he was such a giving person. It just felt like I needed to do it in conjunction with whatever was out there that was still working under his name. Um, and it, you know, I found out about Fred Rogers Company, and I got in touch with them, and it was a, it was, it was a long process, I would say, because, you know, of course Fred Rogers Productions, they, they are still in operation. They make a lot of successful television, you know, Daniel Tiger's Neighborhood, Peg+Cat, Odd Squad, a lot of popular television programs, and so they're very busy, and they're in the world of television, and I'm in the world of books, so it was, it was sort of a I had to really explain to them who I was and how serious I was about doing this. And again, this was at a time when Mr. Rogers was not particularly in the conversation. So there was no real, I think, sense of urgency to make this happen. So it became a little— it was a little discouraging, I would say, at times, because I was so excited about this and I wanted them to know how excited I was and how perfect I would be for this. But it wasn't as big of— it wasn't as urgent to them as it was to me, I would think, I would say. And so it took a little— it was a little slow going at first, but once I was finally able to cut through and speak with them on the phone and tell them, you know, who I was and all my intentions and Things started to move pretty quickly and I ended up flying out to Pittsburgh with my family. It was over the holidays one year, a couple years ago at this point, and met with a lot of the people that used to work with Fred, you know, a lot of the producers and people that worked on Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood that still work for the company. And at that point, Fred Rogers Productions, they only wanted to make one, you know, one picture book, one official picture book about Mr. Rogers, a picture book biography. And I would, you know, they, they, I was told, you know, at that time that I was going to be the one. Yeah, that would get to do that. And I was just, just so thrilled, you know, it was just so So exciting. I mean, just a huge moment in my life to be able to do this. And it's been such an exciting part of my career.

Certainly.

And an accomplishment. So I ended up doing more research in Pittsburgh with a lot of the friends of Fred Rogers, traveling to Latrobe, Pennsylvania, where he grew up. And visiting the Fred Rogers Center where there's a, you know, very vast archive of materials and things from the program as well as his personal life. Photographs were especially important for me to have, and that's where a lot of the book began, that over the period of a few days where just a lot of intense research and connecting with the people that work for Fred Rogers and, and I would go on over the next, you know, year or so to stay very close contact with several of the people that I met that weekend. Heda Sherapan worked with Fred Rogers from the very first episode of Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood, and she was my main contact. I would share with her, you know, versions of the manuscript as we were working on it and sketches And she would pass them on to Margie Whitmer and Kathy Cohen. And those three women were just essential to the making of the book. So it was quite a journey and it was quite an experience to make this book.

Man.

Oh yeah, it was fantastic.

Well, and you should be proud of that moment because that's amazing to kind of have their blessing as you go forward. So I know that those of us that have read it, we're awfully proud of you and the work that you did, just in the way that you so concisely captured so much of who Fred Rogers was, and not only about his life but about his show. And I love the way that in the book you include so many of the people that he worked with and the people that we saw on the show. And there's just so much in there that really, I would think, would be very hard to again put so, so concisely. And, and really, in just a matter of— I didn't count the pages exactly, but I imagine it's probably around maybe 30 pages or so, something like that. Which really, there are entire, you know, huge volumes of books written about the man. So it's amazing how much you were able to get in with your, your writing and your illustrations. I'd love for you to maybe take us a little bit behind the scenes in the process into the, the making of one of your books. And I wonder if when you're writing a book, not only scripting it yourself, but you're also doing these, these powerful illustrations that go with it, do you start first with a script generally, or do you find —like you start maybe drawing and the story starts revealing itself? I'd love to kind of just hear some of your process on that.

Yeah, it's been—in my experience, I've come at different books from different angles. Typically when it's a book—so I also illustrate other people's books, which is a very, very different experience. But in terms of my own books that I write and illustrate myself, Sometimes I've started with like a picture, you know, that I've drawn maybe in my sketchbook, and it's— there's no story behind it, but I, you know, I have sort of a strong attachment to whatever that picture is that I drew that I want to try to come up with a story about whatever those characters are, whatever is happening in that drawing. But most of my books start with start with the story, start with the words. I just find it easier for me to have that sort of lay the foundation with the text and the idea of the book, the general beginning to end story. I just find it so much easier to start that way and construct sort of the bones of the book and then build the pictures around that. And So I've had some success in both ways. Um, I do find it a bit more frustrating to have a picture first and try to create a story about that because the story for me has always been in a lot of ways the more difficult part of the process, you know, because I grew up as a visual artist. So writing has been kind of an uphill climb for me over the years. I feel much more comfortable with it than I did in the beginning. But it's sort of the part that I want to finish to an extent first, so I have that kind of laid in, and then I can just start wrapping pictures around that framework.

Sure. Well, and I was thinking as you were talking about, you know, kind of starting with the script and going from there rather than just kind of starting with the art and seeing where it goes. It's interesting that I've had a few conversations on some of my other podcasts that I host with fellow songwriters, and we've actually talked about, in a similar way, it's always much easier to kind of block yourself in a little bit with what you're doing, like say for you with a script, and then starting from there and going rather than just being freeform. Whereas with a song, oftentimes Writers will, will start with the idea in mind first and then make some parameters for themselves that they will challenge themselves not to go outside of that because it makes— it forces them to tell it in a better way. And so it's just interesting, I'm thinking about what you've just described too, that, that it also must really apply to that world of making art in the way you do. And I think it's wonderful. So thank you for sharing some of that process. And while we're, while we're just discussing that, I've heard that when you speak to groups of children at schools and festivals and different places, that you have some special pens that you carry with you that you like to show them. And I'm fascinated by that because I don't particularly know a lot about pens. To me, as someone who doesn't do really much art other than trying to help my second grader in his school when he has art, for me, I don't know the difference, but I'd love to know more. Maybe you could tell us a little bit about sort of some of those pens that you carry around and why you choose specifically them for the work that you do.

Yeah, so I, um, if you were to look at the art in Hello Neighbor, in all my books actually, the drawings are done with these sort of old-fashioned type of pen that you have to dip into a bottle of ink. So you don't— it's not a pen that, um, like most pens that we use today were that are just sort of filled with, with ink and then they eventually run out and you throw them away. This is a like a pen that, uh, it has like a metal tip called a nib, um, that you can change out of the actual pen. Different types of nibs that have different flexibilities and sharpnesses and And the reason I use that type of pen is because it— you can draw or write with it, and you can get a lot of different line widths if you put different pressure on the paper. It can be really thick line or very thin line, or it can be a very smooth line or very, you know, rough textured line, and in the sense of drawing, you know, when you're writing, for instance, if you're writing a letter, I suppose you would want that line to be pretty clean and uniform, but when I'm drawing, I want to have all these different variations. To me, that just makes it so much more interesting than to have one consistency of line thickness. And also the purpose of that is I— the type of ink that I use is waterproof, which is important because after I'm finished drawing it, the drawing is done in black ink, so it's just black and white drawing when it's— when the drawing is finished. When I want to add color, I paint those drawings with watercolor paint. So the— it's a kind of a combination of processes, pen and ink drawing with watercolor on paper. And but yes, I do love different types of pens, and I've experimented and, you know, played around with all different types of nibs. That's usually what is the changing, you know, frequency of the different pens is the end of the pen or the nib. And different nibs have can draw in different ways. And I also use— lately in the last several years I've been using some fountain pens that have waterproof— that you can fill with waterproof ink, and it's a similar type of line where you can draw with it, and it can— you can, depending on how you hold it or how much pressure you put on the pen, it will change. And So yeah, I like to, if I have extra time at school visits or book festivals, or if I get to do an art workshop, I love to share with, you know, children the different types of ways you can draw and the different ways you can make lines. And because, you know, it does seem like a pretty simple thing because when you're just drawing, you're just sort of drawing, I think, especially the kids. But if you start to show them some of these, like if you really zoom in and say, you know, well, these lines, you know, I was like really, I was really pressing hard and I wanted those lines to be thick. And on these other ones, it was, I wanted the line to be thin. And you know, it just kind of opens up their eyes to a different way to draw. And so yeah, it's been a lot of fun to go around and I bring some of my pens with me and some ink. Sure. And there are times, you know, when I bring the ink, if I'm flying somewhere, that it kind of explodes on the airplane. So I've learned over the years I have to kind of wrap it 2 or 3 times with bags and jars and stuff if I'm going to be traveling with it to make sure that doesn't happen. But yeah, it's a lot of fun.

So in many ways it's almost more akin in some ways to being a painter, you know, using different sorts of almost brushes that you're dipping in and using than it is just simply if, say, I was to grab a pen and just start scribbling on a piece of paper. And you can tell when you're looking, one thing I love about the way that you draw, I think it must be very intricate and must take a lot of time, but for us to look at it it doesn't look like— I don't know how to say it exactly in the right way— it looks like it just flows so easily in the way that it looks to our eyes. And so I think it can be deceiving, as you were just saying, that, you know, when children might look at it and think, well, it's just a doodle or whatever. But there really is a lot of very intricate, very detailed work that goes into this. And I love the way that you explain that. I, I kind of regret that Fred Rogers is not still with us and not still making episodes, because I feel like what you just described would be a wonderful episode of Picture Picture where, you know, he could go in and kind of narrate for us the whole process that you've just described today, which is fascinating to me. And I didn't know that. I had no idea that was a way that art was done with those pens. I'm gonna have to look into that. I think that would be very neat to find out more. One of my—

one of the things I loved learning that I didn't know before You know, I love Picture Picture, and I love when Mr. Rogers would welcome adults to share about their professions, and I saw that there were several times when he would have different types of artists on, and a couple of my picture book heroes were actually on Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood, which I hadn't realized until I was an adult. Eric Carle Eric Carle, who made The Very Hungry Caterpillar and many other wonderful books for children, was a— he visited Eric Carle's studio, which was just so cool to me to discover that. And Ezra Jack Keats, who did The Snowy Day and many other wonderful picture books, was also on the program, I think more than once. So yeah, I loved when he would talk to artists of all different you know, all different walks of life, you know, dancers, musicians, visual artists. This is so, so inspiring.

Well, I was gonna say that in, in some ways your, your book is almost like a love letter to Fred Rogers and the cast of the show, but, but in some ways it's almost like a, like a very elaborate thank-you note. Yeah, it feels like. And, and what I'm, what I'm looking at is I just have the book in front of me again. I love the way that you put so many characters. There's one particular page that stood out to me where on the one side there's a page where Mr. Rogers is blowing into a trumpet and Mr. McFeely is there in the room. And then on the opposite page, there's what looks to be almost like a picture gallery on a wall, maybe of the house. And you've included people like Mr. McFeely and Betty Aberlin and Francois Clemmons, and just goes on and on. Elsie Neal, Bob Trow, Joe Negri and Neighbor Ape, Maggie Stewart. And I just love the way that you're able to include so much in such a small amount of space that helps us remember. And for those of us that grew up watching the show and then are now watching it with their children, it really is sort of a callback, like, wow, I remember that episode. And you do things like picture picture in the story. And I personally love the page with the, the Johnny Costa trio. I think that's just wonderful because I'm a big fan of the music that Johnny Costa made over the years. And you not only include Johnny, but you've got the other players there, and you include them by name, Bobby and Carl. And I just think that's wonderful because we're getting to see some of the people that really— I think even the biographies don't get into that much, you know, when you, when you're reading about Fred Rogers So there really is an impressive amount of information that you've kind of supplied of what it takes to make an episode of the show.

And yeah, thank you. One of my favorite things about the book, you know, when I first wrote it, I have such, such love and passion for, for the work that he did and the things that he did and said in his, in his personal life as well. That I just made. When I first wrote it, it was like really, really long, you know. It was like, yeah, just sort of very exorbitant in terms of a picture book for young readers. But I really just wanted to say as much as I could. I wanted to say everything that I, that I wanted to say. And then what I ended up doing was figuring out ways to move that text, whether it be part of the illustrations, like, you know, in terms of the jazz trio, the Johnny Costa Trio, instead of, you know, naming them within the actual body of the text, I would sort of draw it into the picture itself. And there were so many— there's so many wonderful things about little stories, you know, little anecdotes that all of us, you know, adults especially, I think we learn over— we've learned over the course of years of, you know, whether it be from memes, you know, there's so many internet memes with like, yeah, quotes or things, you know, little anecdotes. And, and I wanted to sort of include a lot of these things, but it was— the text was so long. But my art director for the book suggested what we could do is, is do what we ended up calling a visual glossary. So in the back of the book instead of calling out all of these different little things that are in the pictures, we have this little section where there's a tiny picture and it's referencing something from the main part of the book, and that there will be some text that goes on to describe what the significance of that picture is. For instance, I drew this little car, I drew a little car in one of the pictures where there's like a lot of sort of a collage of a lot of different iconography and things from the program. Sure. And you might wonder, what does this car have to do with anything? And you go to the back of the book and there's the car. And the story is that— and this is a true story, and it's one of the things that I think it really speaks so much. I mean, it wasn't a place to put this in the book. Sure. It just didn't have that sort of importance. But the story itself is so significant, and it really summarizes the life that he lived and the way that people felt about him, Mr. Rogers, Fred Rogers. And the story is, is Mr. Rogers' or Fred Rogers' car was stolen from the street one day. And he, you know, it was, you know, just like a typical, you know, crime, except because it was Mr. Rogers, it was on the Pittsburgh news. You know, this made the news. And so it was— it was really well, uh, it was, it was, you know, very publicized. And within a, within a day or two, the car was returned to the exact spot where it was stolen from. And there was a note in the car from the thieves that had taken it, and they said, um, we're sorry we stole your car. If we'd known it was yours, we wouldn't have taken it. And, um, right, that is one of— I mean, that, that That story moves me every time I tell it, and it just— I knew it had to get into the book, but it was just the book was getting so long. Yeah, that I had to, uh, I had to make some concessions, and I was— I'm glad we were able to fit that in there somewhere. But, uh, yeah, I mean, I think there's so— there's so much to celebrate about Mr.— about, about Mr. Rogers, Fred Rogers, Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood that, uh, I probably could have done this and 3, 4, 5 volumes, you know, but it was, it was a fun challenge to whittle it down into a picture book length.

Yeah, well, I mean, you did a great job. Again, it's amazing you were able to get so much into the space that you had to work in, for sure. And I almost feel like there could, it could be a follow-up of the visual glossary just as a book, you know, just different little facts like that, because that is really a cool part in the back. And I was just looking at the green car that was stolen, that was Fred's in the back. And that, that too is one of my favorite stories and just shows to what kind of impact he had on people, right? And, uh, that's, that's terrific. Yeah, well, we're, we're getting a little bit low on time on my end, but I just have a couple more questions, uh, to ask you. Uh, we had talked about your, your pens a few moments ago, and I, I always wonder, I, as a songwriter, I always try to have a pen or some kind of recording device in my pocket at all times for when inspiration strikes. Are you one that also keeps like a pen in your pocket at all times?

Oh, absolutely, yes. I, you know, I always need to have something to write with. You know, I usually have a pen. You know, it can't be one of my drawing pens, of course, because that would be a lot to carry around, a big mess. But I do keep just a favorite sort of more, you know, commercial type pen in my pocket. And I always— that's one of the things I always tell kids too, is I often tell kids is that you never know when inspiration is going to strike. And if you're walking around and you don't have anything to jot some sort of idea that pops into your head, it might just sort of vanish by the time you get back to your car or back to your bedroom and you have a pen and then you can't remember exactly what that wonderful thing was that you were thinking about. So never be without a pen, you know, it's kind of one of my mantras. Keep a pen in your pocket at all times.

Yeah, very good. And that's excellent advice to anyone who is a creator. And everybody's creative in some ways, no matter what they do. I think it's always a good idea to write down and journal and things like that. So Well, this was a wonderful insight this week, Matthew, and I really appreciate you taking some time to do a visit with us. I really just have one more question that— this is not so much a Mr. Rogers question, but it's just because I'm a comic book fan and I've read about you that you have always been a comic book fan as well. And so I'm just wondering, who are some of your favorites? And it doesn't necessarily have to be favorites to read, it might be some of your favorites to draw. I'd love to just hear your thoughts on that.

Yeah, so I grew up loving superhero comics. You know, I loved— when I was young, I loved X-Men. That was probably my favorite. Yeah. But also Spider-Man, I think, was my absolute favorite. I just loved Spider-Man. Atta boy. Yeah. And as I got older, you know, I still have kind of a soft spot in my heart for the superhero comics, but I've, I've grown to love sort of more graphic novels. And, uh, you know, there's so many different ways and different— you know, back then I think the majority of comics, or at least what I, what I was exposed to, was, uh, was the world of superheroes. But, uh, as I've gotten older, I've just— and I think more and more creators have, have, have experimented with the form of comic books as storytelling, that it's just a massive— it's just, there's so much to discover in comics now. So I love to read all different types of comics now. And you can, if you look at my work, it's really rooted in comics. You know, it's sort of a different style of cartooning, almost like the style of like the type of cartoons you might find in like The New Yorker. Sure. You know, that sort of cartooning, but it's all rooted in that sort of simplifying of facial features, simplifying of the form of backgrounds, and I just love that way of telling stories. I just find it very approachable and very, just a warm place to discover a new story, so it's something I've loved my whole life, comics, and in different ways. So yeah, definitely. I still love Spider-Man though. Yeah, I just love that. That's such a, such a great story, I think, um, of Peter Parker.

Yeah, he's, he's definitely my favorite Marvel character for sure. I've read him for a very long time. I've got more, more Spider-Man comics in my basement than I should probably admit to having, but they're, they're very good. So yeah, well, uh, as, as we close out the show today, I, I just want to remind all of our listeners that you can find all of Matthew's links. And I'm also going to be putting links to Holiday House books on the website that we have at welcomeneighbor.podbean.com, or you can just put in fredrogerspodcast.com. Don't do the www. because that won't take you there, but if you just simply type in fredrogerspodcast.com, it'll take you to the page, and we're going to have all of these links there. And also, this podcast is corresponding the week of World Kindness Kindness Day, which is on November 13th of this year. And World Kindness Day is a day that is really— it's a global day that promotes the importance of being kind to each other, to yourself, and to the world. And so we're happy to be able to provide this podcast with Matthew and be able to feature his book as a part of World Kindness Day this year. So mark your calendars for November 13th because it's going to be a wonderful day., and we're going to be taking some extra time on the @MrRogersSay Twitter feed this week to kind of highlight World Kindness Day and highlight a bit what Matthew is doing through his great work. So again, we thank you for stopping by today for a visit here on our podcast, Neighborhood Matthew. You're welcome.

Thanks so much for having me, Rick.

Well, to all of our listeners, thank you for joining us here this week in the neighborhood. Music featured on today's podcast was Nouvelle Noel by Kevin MacLeod. I would do want to say a special thanks to my guest Matthew Cordell and Holiday House Books for making this possible today. And I want to thank the @MrRogersSay community on Twitter and Instagram. It's always wonderful to journey with all of you that follow there. I'm your host Rick Lee James. My personal Twitter account is is @RickLeeJames and my website is RickLeeJames.com. Another podcast that I host in case you're interested is Voices in My Head: The Rick Lee James Podcast. And I look forward to being with you again next time. But until we meet again, remember, you make each day a special day. You know how? By just your being you. There's only one person in this whole world like you. And people can like you exactly as you are.