Voices In My Head Podcast Episode 340: Finding Hope and Healing After Devastating Loss with Guest Ki

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Welcome back to Voices in My Head. As always, I'm your host, Rick Lee James, and I am so glad that you're here with us again for what is going to be another great conversation. Kim Peacock is the author of Victorious Heart. A book which details her handling of grief over the loss of her 17-year-old daughter. It also provides insightful advice for those seeking to support and help those who grieve. Through her blog, Wild Victorious Heart, and her book and speaking, Kim acts as a grief mentor to others in need. Kim Peacock, welcome to Voices in My Head.

Thank you so much for having me, Jane.

Kim, as we begin today, I wonder if you wouldn't mind telling us a little bit about your daughter Nicole, and what are some of maybe your favorite memories of her that tell us what kind of a person she was?

Well, Rick, the first thing that comes to mind when I think of Nicole is wild and free. She, um, definitely embraced life and embraced every moment, but one of the things that I believe defined her the most was the way she loved other people. She saw those invisible people that maybe no one else saw, and she was drawn to them and, and could draw— and had a way of drawing them out of their shells. So that is something, just that she was wild and free. She loved to ride horses. She was an avid horsewoman, and anything horsey she would be drawn to, if it even, even crazy enough, cleaning stalls or or clipping a horse, you know, trimming them up, getting them ready for a show. She loved anything horsey.

Wow, that's pretty cool. And I don't find that everybody rides horses, so it's kind of fun when you find somebody that's really into horses like that. And that must mean she had a big heart for people and animals too.

She did. Boy, we had more pets than we should have had because of Nicole, and that's for sure.

Well, that's great. Well, that tells me a lot about her right away and, and the bigness of her heart. And, and thank you for sharing that. And I know, and I want to say at the beginning of our show today, both for you and for people who may be listening who have experienced a great amount of loss, we don't enter into conversations like this lightly, and we do consider it to be something sacred as we enter into these conversations about grief. And I want to thank you for being able to share your story with us. And you've already told me a little bit before we started that this is part of your healing, is to be able to share. But I do want to thank you for, for doing that, and also to let our listeners know that, that there may be some things that, that may be a little difficult along the way as we talk about today, but we want this to be a safe place for you as you listen as well.

So yes, yes.

So as we're talking about Nicole, and we've already heard what a sweet person she was and how she loved people and how she loved animals, but then came this terrible accident, and, and you were a witness to this accident. Would you mind telling us what happened?

Yes, we were on a family vacation. It was just 3 days after Christmas, and we Tried to go to Pismo Beach in California shortly after Christmas just to unwind as a family, kind of reevaluate our activities coming up. So we headed off for our camping trip there on the beach in Pismo. And we were all there except our daughter Lisa. She had to stay back because she had a basketball tournament. And so we had set up camp on the beach and we went out to ride ATVs. Just on the sand dunes, playing on the sand dunes. And we saw Nicole get disoriented, and she went off a very high dune, and she probably dropped 40 to 50 feet down and landed on her head. And the ATC was on top of her. We all rushed down to her. And, and for me, I remember those days kind of in that day in snapshots. So a lot of it isn't even clear, and I know that that's God's protection on my mind, I believe. But my husband got to her first and pulled off her helmet, and we put her in the truck, and he began doing CPR on her as they drove to the beach to meet the ambulance. Later at the hospital, the doctor told us that she had died. He believed at the beach.

I am so sorry.

Thank you.

I—

how do you begin to even find the strength or the courage to live after such a devastating loss like this? I can't even imagine how you put one foot forward the next day. How did you handle this?

It was really the thing that I feared the most in my life. So I believe, like I mentioned before, God's divine protection. He protected my mind a lot, and it also is just through shock. We were in shock, but I believe that he protected us in ways that we didn't even realize until later. Just kind of to rewind, on the way to the hospital, a ranger took me, volunteered to drive me to the hospital, and he reached over and I was just praying, "Lord, please make her breathe. Lord, please make her breathe." over and over, and the ranger put his hand on my hand and he said, "Don't quit praying." Well, in my mind at that moment, I believed that, "Oh, I'm going to keep praying and she's going to come home with us." But later, kind of fast-forwarding, I believe that that was a reminder from the Lord to keep praying no matter what. And so I would say that was the main thing. We would just— when I would start to crumble, my husband would would see that and we would stop and pray. My mother-in-law, great prayer warrior. So even driving away from the hospital, there were many moments we had to just stop and pray because I was just a mess. And I believe that it was in those moment-by-moment— the Lord gives us these— the strength to do what we need at that moment. He doesn't give us the strength for the whole journey. He gives us the strength to, like you you said a few minutes ago, to walk forward, to move forward. And the Lord gave us the verse Joshua 1:9 very early in this process, and it says, "To be strong and courageous because God is with us." It says more, that is my paraphrase. But that word "be" implies that we had a choice. So, we had a choice to walk forward in our pain, and so I think it was just that moment by moment, and then just asking, "Lord, help us through this day." Help us through this moment. Help us through this hard task that was ahead of us. And it wasn't easy, but through those little steps, he just literally scooped me up and carried me through the most devastating thing in my life.

Sure. Well, it's been 21 years since the accident, but I imagine that the hurt doesn't go away. I've referenced this lyric a lot from Andrew Peterson, who's Rick Lee James is one of my favorite artists and he has a song that is in some ways about grief and he talks about at some point the aching may remain but the breaking does not. And I've always liked— so there must still be quite an ache in your heart even after all this time. But I wonder, how has life changed for you in these 21 years since that terrible accident?

Well, it's changed in ways that my, my faith has been able to grow deeper through my pain. It wasn't a linear journey to where I am, but, um, and you're right, the pain doesn't go away. It's, it is there, but it's less sharp and it's more sweet, if that makes any sense. It's just a thing that I can embrace. Even this morning I heard a song that we played at her service, "My Hope Is You" by Third Day, and even just that song brought back that feeling of that day. But we've since adopted some— we had adopted one son at the time when she was still with us, and we've adopted two more kids. And seeing our kids grow up and flourish, and some of them having kids of their own, Sometimes it feels like time stood still for me because Nicole will always be 17 to me, and, you know, that's a— that's kind of a hard thing. But I've learned to embrace those moments of knowing that, that she's still alive. I really have to focus on that. She's more alive than we are in heaven, so— than we are here, so I have to just continue to embrace that thought and know that I'll see her again. And then that helps me to live with what I call a victorious heart here.

Yeah. Well, thank you for— thank you for sharing that. And again, this is always such a sacred place. I don't know that people do understand if they haven't been through a profound loss that, like you just said, sometimes you'll hear a song and it puts you back in that, that place again, you know, and, and those are very real things. And, um, and the significance, I think, of those, uh, those times and why it's so real and why we have such a loss when those people that we love are gone is, is it really shows the great capacity of love that is there, you know, and the great amount of love that truly is there, that, that this person really did matter so much, and I appreciate what you had just said about her being so alive with the Lord as well. And I, I always wonder, um, because also you, in your book, I know you've written about other sorts of loss as well. My wife and I have, have been through a number of miscarriages together, and I still remember that feeling of, you know, how do we leave the hospital now? You know, I mean, yes, how do we get in the car and get away from this place. And it is interesting how certain things will trigger from time to time of, uh, you're just back in that place again. So, so we're, we're dealing with grief. And in Victoria's Heart, you not only share your story, which I so appreciate, but, but over and beyond that, we can sense your heart for others because you've also written a very helpful guidebook for people who are suffering. Loss, and for those who support people who are helping loved ones who are in the midst of this grief, what do you wish that people understood about going through grief and the grieving process?

Well, I think that to not compare our grief with other people's grief— we can't compare grief. And, and we're all— God created us all as unique individuals, so we're going to feel differently about things, we're going to experience loss differently. So I would say first, don't compare your grief, because I think that a lot of times we— and I know there's a ton of information out there, but we tend to say, well, I'm not grieving correctly if I'm not feeling such-and-such. And I don't believe that that is the way that it works. I think And Victoria's Heart is, yes, my story, our story about grief, but it's also the things that helped me and our family and other, other people through their grief. And I think that that's just to show people that they're not alone, to know that you're gonna make it through this grief. You're not only going to survive, but I believe beauty can emerge from our pain. And so I believe that, that if If I can express that in a way that will help people to understand that they're not alone and they will survive, that is my passion.

Such good words. Yeah, I really feel like that's a trap that we sometimes fall into, or even, yeah, like you said, comparing grief. Like, well, their loss was so much greater than mine, so I shouldn't feel so bad, but you really do have to go through it. It's just as real no matter what the degrees of it are, I guess I would say. So what advice do you have for not just people who are grieving and maybe going through the grief process, but there's friends and family, there's neighbors and colleagues who always are there and want to help people who are going through grief but don't know what to do or what to say?— to help. What advice would you have for them?

I think the first thing is we tend to shy away from people who are hurting because we don't know what to say. So I think the first thing would be to show up. Just show up. When Nicole passed away, ladies from our church, they filled our house. They brought food. They wiped off the counters. Our animals were fed. So many things were done for us that we could we didn't have the capability or even the energy to do ourselves. So just show up, because we— it can feel isolating in grief. So to know that you're not alone, and, and don't worry about the words that you're going to say. I would say, I think that some of the greatest comfort I received were those people who said very little. So don't worry about the perfect words, because there's not going to be any perfect word to take away their pain or fix them. They just need to know that they're not alone. You can even say something simple, just, you know, "I don't know the depth of what you're going through, but know that you're not going to be alone." Or just even simply, "I'll be praying for you." And definitely pray for them, because prayer makes a huge difference. And then I would say keep showing up, because after the service, after everything settles down, everybody goes back to work, and it's kind of out of sight, out of mind. And those are the hardest days for when you're hurting. And so keep showing up, keep writing cards, giving a call, shooting a text, whatever it is that will let them know. It doesn't have to be a lot of words, just say, hey, I'm thinking about you today. People will still text me or call me on Nicole's Heaven Day, which which is the day she passed away, and her birthday. I'll still get messages. And just know that— and they'll say Nicole's name. That's an important thing, to say their loved one's name, because you never forget.

Well, you know, and I'm thinking about the times that we're living in today where, you know, my wife and I have calendars that we connect, you know, we use the same calendar on our phone, you know. So one of us puts in a date and it comes on the other one. And there's great things on there. You can, you can set up, you know, reminders and things. And I was just thinking as you were talking, maybe it would be one idea that might actually be helpful and good is for those that are grieving in our life, maybe we could put on our calendar like once a month, like put a reminder, you need to reach out to this person today, and just send them a note. And, you know, let that be a repeat on your calendar, uh, just to send an alarm. Because you're right, life life goes back to normal for everybody else, and, and that's really the way I think— it's, it's no fault of anyone when we go through those times because everybody has their own life, and it's not that people don't care, but I so appreciate what you said about sort of not forgetting to make contact with those people. That's such, such good advice. And you've talked about the importance of just being there for people, and, and sometimes not saying anything is, is one of the best things we can do, and to just be there. But there are also some things that I wish people would not say when people are grieving, and I wonder if you have any example of those things that maybe people should probably not say to a person who is grieving.

I do. There are, you know, everybody's different, so So what I would say may not apply to everyone, but to even say, "I know how you feel," and start talking about your loss or your pain, I think that that's hurtful because at that moment you feel like no one else can feel like you feel and no one else can hurt like you hurt. Now, you might I may know just a little bit of your loss, but I don't know the depth of your loss. That, you know, will let them know that you have— they have empathy for you. So I would say that. And I would say, you know, God— for me, God needed another angel in heaven. That wasn't helpful because right then I just wanted Nicole with me. Now I do believe focusing on her being in heaven has helped me. But just those kind of things, you know, it's all in God's plan. And I know even— and I do know that that's— that he works all things for our good. But at those moments when our grief is very sharp and very raw, those are things that are hurtful because we just hurt and we just want to hug them and hold them again.

We have a lady that is in our church that I feel like we've had to stop her a couple of times because she has this terrible habit of the Sunday after somebody's come back to church after losing a loved one, she'll kind of bound upon them, "Well, praise God, they're with Jesus. Isn't it a wonderful thing?" And yes, and it's like, it's like, yeah, there's, there's such hope in what you said, but don't you understand this person has got a huge hole in their heart right now, you know, and it's huge loss. And we want to say those things, we want to try to help, but they— like you said, it can be very hurtful in the moment to a person to not acknowledge the grief that they're going through. And so I appreciate you helping us to understand some of those things that maybe we shouldn't say as much as the things that we could be there for them and do. You know, you, you have a blended family, as I've been reading about you and getting to know a little bit more about you from a distance. You have a stepdaughter, and you have a daughter you share with your husband, and you have, I believe, 3 adopted children, you've already said, and you have grandchildren too now.

Yes.

And I'm just curious, I mean, that for one thing shows that you have a lot of love as well, and that you have a lot of care for a lot of people. But I wonder if you could tell us a little bit, how has Nicole Cole's passing affected maybe the way that you raised your children and maybe even now in the way that you care for your grandchildren?

I guess I realize how precious life is, and I don't always do it correctly, or I don't always— I'm not always as intentional as I would like to be, but I do like to purpose times just to enjoy the ordinary. Some of my favorite Memories of Nicole were riding in the car, going to a horse show, watching her ride, not only her but all the kids, are those ordinary silly moments of laughing on the couch till we were crying. And so if you don't create times to allow that, create margin in your lives to do that, it's not going to happen. So I really try to do that. I try to slow down. Yes, we have busy lives. We all have to work, we have to take care of our needs and our homes and all that. But I do believe if we just would not fill every space in with activity and just enjoy every single moment of being present with those people we love— I just had my grandkids for 6 nights, 4 of them, and so I— my heart is full but my body is tired. But I will say it was so fun just to sit and watch them on the swing, or let them, you know, get dirty and make mud and those kind of things. Yes, it's inconvenient, we're gonna have to hose off and clean up, but those, those things are just precious. And that's what makes up the depth of our lives and the relationships that we have.

That's really good advice. Good advice for us all. Thank you for sharing that. I want to get into maybe a little bit even deeper and maybe even tougher question, but I want to get into the God question. And to me, as a person who is a minister in the church and has always been in the church in good seasons and bad both, I of course lump God and the church together. And I wonder if you if you could talk to us a little bit about how did your relationship with God and the church change with Nicole's passing?

I— faith has always been a part of our lives, raised in a Christian home, um, and I think that when Nicole went to heaven, I had to decide if what I believed before was true even in my pain. And that's when it becomes real.

And we—

and everybody experiences loss, and, and we have a choice to stay with the Lord and to embrace our faith even in our pain, or walk away. And so I— there were times that I was angry with him because I really felt like I had done what I was supposed to do. We homeschooled our kids, we had them in church, Bible study, we did everything we were supposed to, in my opinion, and then, in my opinion at the time. But I felt like, why did, why did he allow this to happen to us? Because we were doing what we were supposed to do. And so what, what ended up being that big question of why, what started looming, and I, and my anger towards God caused me to question my faith, which I believe he, he can handle that. That he was not mad at me, he was fine with that. And I think just to be able to bring that question to him and then him put his arms around me and say, you're not going to know on that this side, on your side of heaven, you're not going to know, um know all the questions why, but I'm here with you. And I felt like he would almost literally pick me up in my pain. And so what ended up happening is when I gave that question of why and my anger to him and, and all of that, and just understand I am not going to know why, and I gave that to him, I would feel a rush of his love and his grace just surround me. And it wasn't always easy. And even still sometimes I'm like, "Lord, this is too hard," and He'll say, "I know it's hard, but I'm here with you." It comes back to that, "Be strong and courageous because I am with you." And the Bible never tells us life is going to be easy here. I don't know why we think it should be easy. I don't know why we feel like if we're good boys and girls, then things will be easy, because it's not. And He never promises us that, but He does promise us He's going to be with us. And so my relationship with Him was able to grow deeper, kind of like when Job said, you know, "Before I knew of You, but now I know You. I see You like as I see You face to face." And I think I didn't experience the breadth of loss that Job did, but my world was crushed when Paul went to heaven. I know now that God has so much, his plans for us reach so far and wide that if we would just kind of fall into him, then he will take care of it. And no, it's not easy, and sometimes it's hard, and sometimes it's hurt, but he picks us up in those times when we can't walk ourselves.

And do you feel like this whole experience has made you a more empathetic person? As well.

I do. I used to think, you know, I had everything figured out, and, and the older I grow and through this experience, I realize I know nothing, and I don't know what people are going through, and I, um, I need to just allow them to hurt or to laugh or to grow and grow in the Lord the way that he has for them. Because everybody has a different journey with him. And I think that if, you know, I would just— I think this has helped me to realize everyone has that. They need their own journey with him, and he has his own plans with them. And so yes, I totally agree that it's helped me to become more empathetic.

Well, you know, we're heading into several holidays back-to-back at this time of year that we're in, and whether it be, you know, seeing kids going around the neighborhood trick-or-treating in October or family get-togethers at Thanksgiving or Christmas and New Year's and all the different holidays. It just seems like it's back to back, just starting now, and we just flow into them. And as joyous as those times are for most of us, those can be really difficult times for people who have experienced loss, can't they? Mm-hmm. And I'm wondering, are the holidays an especially hard time for you, or were they especially in the beginning?— and I just wonder what your thoughts were on that as we're thinking about how we can help people who are grieving.

They were, especially in the beginning, the most difficult times. Grief seems to be amplified during the holidays because we're reminded of who's missing. Everything we see is, you know, families gathered around, and there's always someone missing at our holiday tables. So even— and since Nicole passed away 3 days after Christmas, Christmas is pretty particularly difficult. But, and even to, you know, you can kind of feel fall in the air, although where we are it's still hot. But it, you can just see the seasons, the pumpkins are coming out, you know, even Christmas decorations are coming out. And I can feel that pressure in my chest of, oh, it's coming, it's coming, it's coming. And I think those expectations that we put on ourselves during the holidays cause us more pain. And so yeah, it's harder in the holidays, but I would say for anyone that is— has recently especially suffered a loss, allow yourself to have space. Don't compare your, your holiday now to holidays in the past. You don't even have to celebrate if you don't— if you don't have to partake in the the holiday festivities if you do not want to, and just to allow yourself to have that time of healing. And then eventually you'll be able to create new traditions that suit your family in the new way that you are living now.

Well, thank you for sharing that. I know it's going to be very helpful for a lot of people to know. Well, there's so much more we could talk about, but we're running short on our time together today. How can our listeners find out more about you, and where can they get a copy of your book, Victorious Heart?

My website is wildvictoriousheart.com, and there's links to purchase my book on there. And I write a blog of encouragement a couple times a month, and also there's a way to contact me. I do read every email, and if Anyone's interested in booking me for speaking, I get those directly, so you can contact me there. You can also order Victorious Heart on Amazon. You can go to Barnes Noble, Books-A-Million— any of the book outlets will have it. If they don't have it, you can ask them to order it for you, and I know they will be happy to do that.

Great. And we also on, on our podcast website, voicesinmyheadpodcast.com. We also have links to your website and to your book, so make sure that you go online, all of our listeners, and check out what Kim Peacock has, has given us. It's a great gift, I think, to many people who are gonna find this to be a very needed help in times of need. So Kim, it's been a real pleasure to get to talk with you today. And as I say to all my guests as they come on this show, thank you for being one of the Voices in My Head this week.

Thank you for having me.

Thank you for joining me here this week on Voices in My Head. I hope you'll visit me on my website at rickleejames.com where you can find out more about me, get my music on vinyl and CD, follow my blog, and even schedule me for your concert. Concert or a speaking engagement. Better yet, even a book signing in your neighborhood. You can find all that and more at rickleejames.com. Also, it would mean a great deal to me if you could write a review of this podcast on iTunes. The more positive reviews that we receive, the more visible this podcast will be online. And now for the benediction: May the God of hope fill you with with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. God bless you, and thank you for listening to Voices in My Head.