Is Joe Rogan Not a Podcast on YouTube? 5 Unique Ways to Grow A Show? | New Media Show 3/13/23

I see no error messages coming up.

That's good. Am I? I think I'm okay. I'm live on my side.

Just about ready on my side. Welcome to the New Media Show, where each Wednesday at 3 PM Eastern, UTC+4, Todd Cochran and Rob Greenlee take their over 30 combined years of leadership in the podcasting space to discuss, dissect, and deconstruct the current podcasting news, forecasts, trends, and predictions. Now here are your hosts, Academy of Podcasting Hall of Famers, Todd Cochran and Rob Greenlee. Hey Rob, here we are.

And we are here, and that, that intro is not going to get taken down by, uh, or cause us to be demonetized or whatever.

No, it's not. And today we are experimenting. And let me look up here at the control panel. And yes, everything is, is going. And we are streaming in a new location today.

Yeah, I think it's terrific.

We've added rumble to our—

Rumble, Todd—

to our destinations. I literally, I mean, I literally set this up. 10 minutes before the show, and then the whole miracle, I went and looked at the live page and it's playing. So, uh, that's awesome. No one knows this on Rumble, but hello.

And there's, there's a fair amount of people out there that don't even know that Rumble exists. Yeah, I think this is probably going to open, open some eyes. Who the heck is Rumble?

So, and of course we're on YouTube, we're on Twitter or X, right? We are not restreaming to, uh, another platform right now because it's just not appropriate for this show, or I didn't have enough restream channels. And we're on Facebook, of course, as well. So we, we are everywhere.

And on LinkedIn too, right? Or are we not on—

yeah, we're on LinkedIn today. So we are literally uh, everywhere we possibly can be. And, um, so Rob, without saying anything, because I've gave you the details, what we're going to be putting on the street— well, releasing Monday, announcing Tuesday of next week if everything goes right in my beta testing this week— do you think what we're coming out with is cool or boring or interesting? What would be your term?

Yeah, I would say it's, it's probably making it a little easier for podcasters.

Be careful, be careful.

I'm not, I'm not going to give any details here. I'm just saying it's, it's definitely, uh, streamlining.

Oh, right. Yeah, I, I think, I think it's good. I personally think it's more than that.

Well, it is, but I, I was trying to keep it less, less detailed.

Yeah. And, you know, I can— I will say this. Do you think it will be copied?

Oh, sure.

Yeah, I think so too. Yeah, I think it will be copied as well.

So, uh, it's not probably a huge tweak. I don't know, um, how much work did it take? I mean, without getting into details here, did it take a lot of work to get this done?

Um, not a lot.

Not a lot. Good.

Yeah, yeah, it was, you know, it was You know, a lot of investigation, testing, a few other things, some key decisions on flow. And I guess I'll leave it at that.

So the announcement for this is coming out on Monday.

Well, it'll be released Monday afternoon and we'll announce it Tuesday. So Tuesday.

Okay.

Yeah. The product pages are probably available 3, 4 o'clock on Monday if everything goes right in the final testing this week. Um, so yeah, I'm keeping my fingers crossed and I was just reviewing the product page for it today.

And yeah, I think it's great because I haven't done this, um, yet for the show that I do. So this will help streamline that for me for the show that I'm doing on Blueberry.

So, okay, be careful.

I'm not saying what it is.

So, uh, for all the interested parties like James and others, we will We will send you that information probably Monday afternoon. And I hope to have a video to go along with it showing what this actually is. So, yeah, you know, and to be kind of frank, it was like Barry, one of our co-founders, you know, came up with this idea and we were like, oh, oh yeah, I think we can do that. And So anyway, and of course then our AI stuff is coming too. So our AI stuff is almost done. I'm making, I got one query that is not really giving me the results I want yet. So I'm tweaking the, I guess the better word, tweaking the language model input to get the output that I want. Essentially the piece that I'm not happy with right now is the, One of the functions of the AI is going to be an email creation, an email promotion, a promotion for the episode automatically. Basically, when you do the production piece, you'll get an email template. It'll have the email that you can hopefully cut and paste, do a few edits. But right now I'm spending the most time editing that email because it's not coming out exactly the way I want it. So Got it. That's the, you know, I've tweaked almost everything else. And of course, this is going to be a work in progress as time goes on. We're going to have to watch the outputs. And but otherwise, our beta testers are like, game changer, saving me time. Awesome. You're going to save me $100, save me $40, you know, done, done, done, done, done, done. So, yeah, and I've talked enough about it that it's, you know, it's not necessarily going to be this big surprise, but We're really looking forward to cutting it loose.

And, uh, that's what all this AI stuff, uh, should do over time. And like you're doing, Todd, you're building the AI stuff into your platform. And that's totally what I think the direction that it's going to go. And it's going to save people money by working with a platform like Blueberry or other hosts that do this, because then they're not going to have to go out and get all these separate subscriptions.

The integration is beautiful because when you get done with the production, you have a draft episode ready to go. Title, show notes, chapter files, you'll have your media file, you'll have your transcript, everything ready to rock and roll. And all you got to do is go in and just do a minor editing in your episode and hit publish. So we— that was the beauty of the integration. Now, for those that are on PowerPress, you're gonna have to cut paste until we get APIs built to send this stuff to WordPress. But for our dashboard users, definitely it's going to— and even episode art is going to be built in there too. So, but the episode art may not be— we don't have an editor for the episode art yet. So there's no— we can't overlay names or stuff yet. So that'll come later. But yeah, we're, you know, we're pretty, we're pretty jazzed about this. So we'll see, uh, see what progresses. And, um, but yeah, and all, all in preparation going to Los Angeles in about a week.

Yeah, it was, it was good that you said that because I was going to ask about that, um, about, you know, your planning for Podcast Movement and, and all that stuff. I'm not planning on going this year. It'll be the first time I've missed a Podcast Movement. Um, so, but it's all right.

Yeah, we are just planning on, plan on being at the next one. We are planning a special live event for Podcast Movement the first day of the show. I think we're gonna go 11 o'clock Eastern and we're gonna show off this new thing that, uh, that I hinted at at the beginning of the show that I can't reveal yet. So I know it drives people's— just shut the hell up is what they're saying there. So we're going to do a livestream event and invite a handful of people that this is going to really, really help. I guess that's the better word, to come see the, to see the live event. And so we're, you know, anyway, there'll be—

you're going to do that from Podcast.

Yeah, we're going to do that from Podcast Movement. And we've already invited a handful of people to come over and take a look. This stuff's already going to be online. People are going to be able to see it. Before the show, but, um, you know, we've kind of previewed to some individuals that are going to be there, specific individuals can be there that want to see it, uh, in action. Um, so I, I think that's going to be fun. And, uh, so where are you going to do that from? Right, right from the booth. Yeah, right from the booth. Yeah. And, uh, be using StreamYard on my laptop.

Oh, you are? Oh, okay. Yeah, I was curious how you're actually producing it.

So, okay, just with StreamYard, and we're going to do it right there in front of, you know, everybody, and hopefully we don't fall on our face. You know how live demos go, what can happen will happen.

Yeah, I think that the big thing, the last time I used StreamYard, I think for Podcast Movement, um, for the new media show that we did on, oh yeah, on stage, I think the issue that I had was getting the audio Yeah, to the experience, right?

I'll have a little portable thing there where the audio will not be an issue, will be direct wired.

So yeah, and you'll be sitting right there with the ability to take that audio and put it into whatever camera that you're using, or—

yeah, just mostly screen share, you know. And I think the main thing is, is, well, you know, will I have to be streaming off my phone because the internet's bad? You know, that's the only thing that's the question is, will the internet support it? But anyway, that's, uh, that's the promotion for today, everybody.

Um, yeah, and we're not going to be doing a new media show live on stage, um, this time.

No.

So it's been almost every— I think we've done a live on stage event at Podcast Movement Evolutions ever since it started, I think.

And I do have to apologize for people last week. The audio was jacked. I was running a little hot. And today we've got the audio dialed in. Rob's both channels are working and we're not, we're not 6 decibels higher than we should be. So that's what happens when you go away for a month and you come back and you don't, you don't, you know, you don't swipe or bang the pots or whatever you have to do to get you know, the crust out of the cracks, um, in order to, uh, to make sure the gear's working good. But yeah, yeah, it's—

it seems maybe a little unusual that all your settings would somehow change while you're gone.

Well, what it is, they're like a gremlin. What— there— the gremlin is in the mixer, and the mixer, there's a solo button, right? And if some reason, doesn't have to be touched or anything, all of a sudden that solo button, it does something and causes channel to drop out. I go over there and rattle the solo button, it, it fixes itself. But it's just because the mixer is, you know, 10, 10 plus years old at this point, and it just didn't want to cooperate. And it's that one channel it doesn't like. So what I should actually do is put you on a different channel, but Oh, you know, it's just life of a podcaster. You just kind of, you don't want to rewire things. Um, but lots of stuff happening in the space. So, uh, Rogan is back on YouTube in full glory. Yeah. Did he publish all his YouTube? Did he make his YouTube videos public or is it just new episodes or what?

Um, I'm assuming that, I don't know that he's published everything over there. I haven't gone to look to see what the depth of his catalog is, but I, what's, What's been pointed out by James at Pod News is that Joe isn't available as a podcast in YouTube, which is an interesting— maybe they just haven't gotten around to it yet. I don't know. But it's not marked as a podcast in there, as a playlist in there. It's just a— it's part of a YouTube channel. That's all it is. So, I mean, it's all in there. It's, you know, but I think what's interesting is it points out really that maybe labeling yourself as a podcast in there really, you know, wasn't a big priority to them. I don't know what it really means that they didn't do that. It could just be an oversight on their part. It's probably the most likely explanation, but it's It's interesting nonetheless that, that, um, Joe Rogan's team isn't seeing YouTube, um, as a place to label their show a podcast. So I think it's interesting.

Hmm.

I don't know. What's your reaction to that?

Well, I think what it is is probably they aren't making enough money off the show, so they're going to put it everywhere they can. And I'm sure, oh, as far as that goes, right? I'm sure that Spotify is going to get a chunk of the YouTube revenue. So, you know, they— their, their, their, their model hasn't worked. Yeah, it's pretty evident by all the changes that they've made. They've, you know, they've had to have a come-to-Jesus moment and try to figure out how to pay for this thing that they spent millions of dollars. And I'm sure Joe's making the money, but they lost all— they lost their shirt and everything else, continue to lose their shirt on what used to be Anchor, you know, and it just being a money pit. And I hear people are pissed off about them removing some features. Another— oh, the main feature people are pissed is that they can't have music recording and editing, right? Yeah, recording, editing, and have music with their, with their talk. That was the main thing with the change to Riverside and removing the editing feature, whatever this part of that platform was no more music. And then I just saw a whole— I mean, a whole Facebook thread about people crying about that. And, you know, it's like, meanwhile, uh, I'm getting takedown notifications, uh, to every 2-3 days from Spotify saying they're removing stuff from music. And, you know, we've got— we've got shows that have licensed music, and they were telling them, hey, it's— they don't allow it. And Spotify's telling them to come over there and put it on as a music show. So, you know, I, you know, you get what you pay for over there. And again, you know, some of these Spotify creators, they need to, you know, at some point maybe they'll put the big pants on and graduate their show into, you know, having full control. And the people are moving. You know, we've actually started to see a few more migrations. It's not a big number, you know, onesies, twosies here and there. But, you know, people never— when people were migrating away versus migrating to, and, you know, so now it's the opposite. We don't see people migrating away. We see, you know, we see people migrating to. So maybe that is just a sign of, you know, maybe the times are changing a little bit over there, but they still are, you know, they still have a huge number of shows they're creating. It's not It's not like that number's decreased any.

Yeah, I've got a little bit of a speculation. I pulled up the page on YouTube. It's basically youtube.com/podcasts with an S. It's really a landing page kind of directory experience for shows that have been designated as podcasts.

Well, it's for very popular shows. You're not going to find this show on that list.

Well, no, that's probably true, but it's an interesting connection to what we just were talking about, about Joe Rogan. So maybe there was a recognition that, um, Spotify didn't want Joe Rogan's podcast, uh, show to be listed on this page for some reason, or it's incompetence. Yeah, it could be. Well, just an oversight. So again, um, well, actually, um, we're showing up live on that page as a recommended show.

What?

Right now. Yeah. Pull it up on there right now. Just go to—

Oh, so now, see, you're really— Okay. Let me show this screen.

Could be just pulling up because of I'm the user, right? And I'm somehow connected to this too. Okay. That's it. If you go down to recommended, recommended right there. What? It doesn't show us live there, does it?

Uh, no, not for mine.

Okay. Well, it does for mine.

Live now. Let's look.

Yeah. But are you a subscriber to, to this show in YouTube?

Do I subscribe to my own channel? Yeah, uh, probably not. Okay, your channel.

I do.

Maybe I am subscribed. I, I don't even know where you find that.

Okay, so we're live there on that screen.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But yeah, I'm seeing it on the recommended. It's in the number one placement off of the recommended area of the the podcast landing page. Huh.

Uh, I don't know if I'm subscribed to my own show or not. I don't even know how to do that with the being the owner of customized. Yeah, maybe.

Yeah, your feed of this show on YouTube is showing up.

So that's interesting.

I'm not a user of your, of your, your, you know, YouTube presence, right? So I'm, I'm considered just an audience member.

Oh, so it is showing up there at least while we're live. Not— yep. Well, it tells you how good that really works because we've got no additional traffic ever.

Well, I'm not saying that this is a highly trafficked page. I'm not even sure that a lot of people know this page even exists because, well, YouTube hasn't, hasn't promoted it, and people don't go to that page because They're on their phones. Yeah. Yeah. It's like any homepage, right? People don't go to homepages. They go to deep links. So, and that's kind of what's going on or they go to their wall and things are recommended based on the algorithm.

All right. We've already given YouTube enough props here.

So, well, it's, it's, it's interesting what they're doing. I mean, this is a huge content consumption platform. So. You know, what they're doing does have an impact on the medium.

Yeah, of course. Again, the podcasters continue to complain. Mike says give us $1,700. Says we won't fall on our face in Los Angeles.

So we won't fall on our face. Well, so, so in the bigger picture, Todd, what is your current thinking on podcast movement, the evolution of it right now?

Well, it's, you know, in all honesty, It's got to deliver this go-round. If it doesn't deliver, we will only opt to go to the event in the fall.

In Washington, D.C.? Yeah.

Right. So this has to deliver and we will see.

So when you say deliver, what is that translation?

Generate business. New— yes, new podcast plans. Yeah, new business. Okay, if it doesn't generate business, um, we will go to wave the flag and we'll take our money elsewhere for other events. I can wave my flag at the big event at the end of the year. There's a lot of— there's not that many, um, if you look at the list. Yeah, I was of companies there that are actually exhibiting. It is not a big number.

Well, then there's only— looks like, um, there's only 3 companies that are title sponsoring the event: iHeart, Podbean, and Triton. That's it.

So, but if you look at the event, uh, let's see here. I find it here. Okay, I'm gonna bring it up. And then you look at— I think, am I supposed to go to who participants? No. Now let's, let's bring this screen. 4, 5, 6. Oh yeah, they want me to register there. But if you— uh, uh, is this everyone that's going to be there?

Um, So where did you see that link?

It's under, uh, About. Um, about—

yeah, yeah, their, their website is a little—

Sponsors and Exhibitors. Here we go. So here's the exhibitor list.

Airwaves participates. Is that what that one is?

So they're sponsoring the event is iHeart, Podbean, Triton, Silver sponsor— oh, they're silver sponsors. Event sponsors are supposedly ACAS, Amazon, Art19, Castbox, Cloud19, Dystopia.

Aren't those usually exhibitors?

Uh, the exhibitors are in a different list. So Airwave, Walter, Arizona State University, Blueberry, Cumulus, Dystopia, Drop Station. Evergreen, Glassbox, Holler, iHeart, Red Circle, Podbean, Ossa, Mopod, Libsyn, Riverside, whatever that is, Rizzle, Roll, Sennheiser, Triton, Steve Lack Audio, Speaker Lab, the Podcast Academy, and StreamYard. So there's one hosting companies, there's 1, 2, 3, for, for hosting companies. If Riverside doesn't get in the hosting business, I still think that there have— there's a potential that they're going to try, but maybe not with the—

well, I think they're, they're partnered already with a— yeah, with the platform. So, right, it's called Spotify.

So, you know, that, you know, that doesn't— you know, if you look at this event sponsors then, so that means YAP Media Spreaker. See, do these folks have booths?

Spotify.

Yeah. Quill Podcasting, iHeart, Magellan, Paramount, Sounds Profitable, Glassbox FM25, Ecamm, Acast, Art19. So they do— they have booths then? Because it says sponsors and exhibitors. So example, Acast is not in the exhibitor list, but they're a sponsor. Amazon Music is in the sponsor list, but not exhibitor.

So are these past sponsors?

I don't know. Art19, CastBox, Cloud10. Again, these are folks that are not in the exhibitor list, but they're in the sponsor list. So do they have—

the question is, do they have booths, or are they sponsors of rooms or something?

Right, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I don't know, you know, but the Yeah, okay, so we're looking at 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 24 exhibitors, exhibitors for the event.

And again, I don't remember how, how it's laid out from a exhibit area standpoint. The AI stuff, everyone's coming out with AI. I saw someone today came out with some AI stuff as well, uh, podcastpage.io or something like that came out with something. So again, these are all gonna, you know, all these platforms are gonna have stuff baked in. I have no doubt. If they don't, then, uh, you know, my opinion of what's going to happen to them is, you know, they're they're going to have a hard time surviving. But again, for our use case, for what we're using it for, it's, you know, some stuff we've tried hasn't worked. Mm-hmm. Or it's not ready. Yeah, but I did hear something interesting and it's not— I actually put it— let me see if I can find it. There was a quote that was made. Let's see here if I can find it. There was a— there was a quote that was made by Sam Altman that wasn't heard anywhere else. And the quote came from a book called Our AI Journey by Adam Brotman and Andy Sack.. In it, two entrepreneurs interviewed Altman for the first chapter. When they asked him what AGI meant for consumer brand marketing, Sam Altman replied, said, oh, for that? It will mean that 95% of what marketers use agencies, strategists, and creative professionals for today will easily, near instantly, and almost at no cost be handled by the AI., and the AI will likely be able to test the creative against real or synthetic customers, focus groups for predicting results and optimizing again, all free, instant, and near perfect images, video campaigns, ideas, no problem within 5 years.

I guess it depends on the training data that it gets, right?

Well, no, this is under the assumption. Mm-hmm. That it no longer is really a model, large language, it'll be a model, but it will be AGI. It'll be true AGI by 5 years, but not in this, what we have today is not AGI.

No, well, it's not. Well, it's also probably a more proper definition of AGI would be more of a neural net.

Potentially, yes. Right. So, so here's what— if this is true, and I don't know if it is, but you know, these— and I've read a bunch of other things by some people very, very smart in this. Mm-hmm. You better be dialed in on what's happening with this stuff or you're going to get left behind. I look at where things have come just in the short time we've been really looking, 6, 8 months, you know, Claude 3 just came out. What they're doing is impressive. So again, you know, how's it—

I think there's more to do on that. I mean, it's, it's also, you know, you may not be able to actually get ahead of it. I think what you have to do is figure out a Plan B and you can use it to create something for yourself, right?

If you're a plumber or a house builder or you, you put, you pave roads or you have a manual labor job, you're safe. But your business owner better be dialed in, right?

You know, You need to have a real-world skill that AI can't replace, right? Is that what you're trying to say?

Exactly. Yeah, no, it gets to this point, if it gets this smart, then, you know, just retire me and let AGI run the company, you know.

Well, they've always said that actually coding will ultimately be replaced by AGI.

You know, our team hasn't found that to be the case yet, you know, because—

Oh no, not— no, I agree, not yet. But I, I, I have heard many AI experts say that eventually it will be able to code as well as a human.

Well, it's, you know, you know, coders are already reusing code. So, you know, we'll see. It's not a stretch, right? But you guys, I know the listeners are probably getting sick and tired of hearing about this, but you know, I tell you what I did. I tell you about documentation last week, Rob? About creating documentation. Yeah. And it's just like, it was so much easier now. So much easier. And you know what's funny is I created 40, believe it or not, 45 pages of documentation to, to basically—

don't you have to still give it lots of prompt data?

Nope, nope. I'll give you a prompt that I gave it. Let me go over here and find it.

Let me refresh this. It needs a way for it to learn what it is that you're doing. Here, here.

Just make it up. Here was the very first prompt that I gave it. I said, um, Blueberry Podcast is creating a podcasting AI production system that collects information about an upcoming episode to help Generate topics and questions for optional and for optionally for guests. We've created an intake form that's used to help create, generate episode topics and listener questions, which will then be used to create a show flow. Create documentation page using this information and the attached image.

Okay, so you give it an image.

I gave it an image of that, of that document.

Of that form that's a website. Now I think in Bing you can submit a URL to them and it will analyze the data on the URL.

So what it did then was, and I don't necessarily want to show this, but yeah, let me, let me just flip this over. We're close enough. Gave the introduction, talks about episode planning intake, how to use the form. Talks about what's in their goals, success, guest link, let's think bio. And then it gives tips, came up with this on its own, tips for effective planning, submitting the form, accessing your saved plan, and conclusion. So it created this from one image. And yes, there was editing that I had to do. There was, you know, I had to go in there, so that wasn't quite right. 'cause, you know, it didn't understand a couple of things. But again, it got it 90% of the way there.

So was the image that you shared was just a screenshot?

Screenshot, yep, just a screenshot of the interface. So 90, it got me 90% of the way there with the documentation. Now I could have wrote probably not as good, and detailed. There's a little overkill in there. So I was deleting the overkill because, you know, some of the stuff is self-explanatory. You know, episode topic, you know, what is the topic about? I don't have to give like 3 paragraphs of how to explain what your topic's about, right? That's— but it didn't do that. It gave a sentence. Um, so again, it's It's just to me, for writing documentation, we're a small team. I basically took all the, all these outputs, put them in a Word doc. I did a, not a Word doc, a Google Doc. I went through it twice, and then I cut Mackenzie and Kathy loose on the document. They went through it each twice, and now we've got it pretty close to where we want it. And what I'll do now is I'll go into WordPress and I will start transposing those into our documentation section so that we have documentation to make live on launch day. Is anybody going to read it? Probably not. But here's the thing.

Someone will. Google might read it.

Google will read it. Exactly. Google is going to read it.

So. So you're talking to a machine. Talking to a machine. Yeah, a machine. You're talking to a machine that then generates something to talk to a machine. That's right.

Yeah, or an AI of sorts. Yeah, and I'm sure I just— and I did this on the public side, so I'm sure I just taught it, you know, taught it about all our stuff. So, you know, that— but that was, you know, it's all going to be public here directly anyway.

Do you use Grammarly to analyze the output from ChatGPT? That's the secret. That's exactly what I do.

I use— so I, I use both tools. I go in and edit, and then I drop it in Grammarly, let it, it edit. Yeah, it oftentimes tears apart.

Yeah, it does.

The output is— and then it comes— then I come back and do a, you know, like, right? Yeah. So really what it's done is I've edited it, then Grammarly's edited it, and then I let Kathy and Mackenzie have it and they edit it.

And yeah. Yeah, so there's still multiple layers of editorial that go into this.

2 hours of work to get 45 pages of documentation? Come on, that took me 3 days.

Oh, that's actually terrific. You know, probably would have taken a lot longer.

Yeah, you know, by the time it gets QA'd 5 times and I get yelled at, and then, you know, the English teacher, you know, Kathy comes in and, you know, gets her red pen and just shakes her head and says a comma is not needed there, and You left a capital here. She doesn't say that. She just, you know, cleans my stuff up. But it's just stuff like this that just is make— it's optimizing. Yeah. Yeah. So again, it's optimizing. And again, you have to read it. And here's what I do. I read it out loud. It forces me to make sure that I'm actually reading and not skimming. I read it out loud and I said, did I say that? That didn't make sense, or that's not true, or, you know, it— because if you just read it, you have a tendency to skim and not really read it.

So I purposely try and comprehend what it's actually right, you know, is it— is, you know, But yeah, and that's the danger of streamlining all this stuff is that you can just take for granted that it's—

oh, you can't. It's, it's got to be, it's got to be heavily QA'd, you know. So yeah, so again, did it, you know, could have I done this on my own? Sure. You know what I've said for guest info, what I've said, fill in the first and last name of your guests, probably I'd have put that exact thing.

Guess link. Also, it saves a lot of time just in basic formatting of a document.

It formats, and the beauty of it is it formatted the same way all, and it learned as I was going through because the second, the second query that I gave it, um, was I said, after this form is completed, the generate feature will create a list of topics. The AI system will suggest 10 topics and allow the podcaster to enter their own topic manually. Analyze this image to create documentation that makes a podcaster understand topic generation and allowances for them to add their own topic. Gave them the image. And it basically said you should review the AI suggestions very carefully. To make sure they match your description. If they don't, you can edit that AI suggested, or you can suggest your own. It even says oftentimes your, your episode topics will be more relevant than the AI's because you have more intimate knowledge of what your content will be about. It came up with that. So I just like, okay, yeah, that's, you know, there's a saying I used that the Navy had, and I've said it on the show before. We had this manual when we flew. It's called NATOPS, Naval Aviation Training Operations or something. Basically, it was the Bible of the airplane. It was safety, emergency, all the systems, schematics, everything you would need to know to basically fly and participate and be aircrew on the airplane. But there was this phrase at the beginning of the book that this manual is not a substitute for common sense. If you are upside down diving towards the earth, it might be advisable to try to get the airplane upright before you restart the motors, right? You know, those kinds of things, right? You know, the common sense part in all of this, this is what people have to be careful of. You know, this is not a replacement for common sense, right? So anyway, enough, enough to talk about that. Where— what other podcast news is going on?

I thought it was interesting, the, the news that came out earlier this week about a female indie podcaster who won a trademark case against another one who used the same name, right? It was a $75,000— big one—

award.

On this big award. And what's the takeaway from that, right, is the, is the thing. You know, I think that there's multiple takeaways from this, and really, really high level, it's just, you know, for a couple of reasons, you ideally don't want to have two podcasts in the directory with the same name, um, just first of all. But, you know, if, if one has a trademark protection on it, uh, you might be legally at risk. Now, granted, they can certainly petition you to, to take it down. Yeah. Or change it. I've been through that process before where a company has approached me about a name of something that I named.

Yeah.

Quite a few years ago. And I, I agreed to change the name. So, and I did because they had an active trademark. Um, I could have probably fought it because their trademark was not— was associated with something that I wasn't involved in necessarily, but they just— it was easier just to change the name.

We have a number of trademarks that actually registered that we went through the process, and some that we did internationally. It's not inexpensive to do this, and, and we're thinking about doing a couple more trademarks too based on some stuff that we're working on, and, um, you have to really weigh, you know, if you use the— if, you know, we've done the research and looked for other products with— make sure we're not infringing when we're gonna name something something. Um, uh, so you— because that way you don't want to be accused of— what's the word? Having a conflict. You don't want to be, you know, if you're in a completely different space, it's okay. But if you are in a direct competing space, you can get in trouble in a hurry. And it's harder and harder now to find product names that aren't being already used. And, you know, and because something's being used, let's say the word, you know, Red Bull, you know, we use Red Bull as the case. Obviously there's a trademark for Red Bull. But there's a lot of— right, there's a lot of products out there that don't have a trademark but have been using the trade name for a long time, and they have a common law trademark is essentially what they have, but it's not as sticky as something else. So you really, really, really want to protect something, you know, you have to legally do the legal trademark. Um, so podcasters, you know, be forewarned. You need to go out and make sure that your podcast name— number one, has anyone ever used it before? And that's getting tougher because there's been over 4 million shows created. Number two, is that show active that is, you know, has the same name or similar name? And number three, are you going to be able to have your name unique enough that it can't be associated with that other property? I'm not a lawyer, and, and I don't even try to be one. Hire Gordon Firemark. He'll help you with, uh, that trademark stuff, um, or trademark lawyer. But you know, you have to do your due diligence. But this gal, she had a very unique name, and someone— there's no— it was blatant. If you look at the name that she was using and someone else was using, it was a blatant use And it's not like it was just some common words.

Yeah, it was actually Financial Foreplay.

It was the— by a certain name, by whatever the— her name was, right? And my understanding is, weren't they using her name as well?

Yeah, I'm, I'm looking at it here, and it's a podcast called, um, Financial Foreplay. And that, that was the one that, um I guess had the trademark. Is that right? I'm not sure here. Let's see if I can figure that out. Um, so because after infringing the name, so a person by the name of Kanna Campbell, yeah, is the one that, um, that violated the trademark. Now, now it wasn't linked to that podcast because I'm assuming it It's gotten taken down. So it probably doesn't have a presence now. Right. But the, the actual existing show was called Financial Foreplay. And I'm, I'm trying to go to their— it's actually hosted on Podbean. It looks like I'm trying to see if it has any kind of trademark markings on the artwork or anything like that too.

Well, if they actually did any of that. Here's the thing. It doesn't matter, has a trademark around it or not, the TM symbol.

No, no, but it's, it's probably smart. Okay, okay, it does have a, a little R around it, R on it, on the, on the COVID art. Yeah, right. So it does symbolize that it's, it's, uh, registered. Well, another layoff.

Rooster trade name. Rooster Teeth, 150 employees are going to be laid off. Um, I think, yeah. So this is, uh, you know, this is another sign of the economy. Parent company Warner Brothers, after unsuccessful attempts to sell the unprofitable fandom gaming and comedy entertainment division, is shutting down Rooster Teeth operations. RT's general manager Jordan Levin announced the shutdown of the Austin-based Rooster Teeth at an all-hands meeting. The closure will result in layoffs of approximately 150 full-time employees, and will throw dozens of contractors and content creators out of work as well. So, um, that's big. I'm familiar with them. They've been around a long time. Yeah, they have. And, um, again, it's more than podcasts though. They do more than just podcasting.

Yeah, so yeah, I think they, I think they do a lot of video stuff too.

So, but the podcast network will continue, right? But I think most of those are independent, huh?

Yeah, yeah. I was just gonna say the unions at Spotify Studios and The Ringer, I guess, have reached tentative agreements with Spotify. I don't know if you heard that, that I didn't hear that.

Oh, it's a miracle. Hell has frozen over. Libsyn has added transcript support.

Oh, right. Yeah. Yeah. I saw that. Well, I believe I'm the one that told Rob Walsh that, that, that, that was happening with Apple. And he was, he was, I guess, shocked might be a way of putting it. And so I'm going to have to look into that.

I'm going to talk to Ted. And that was a week after they were talking doo-doo about Podcasting 2.0 and how no one's going to adopt anything and, you know, how this and that. And they had to eat their words a little bit. But here's the thing, they are so far behind. Users can upload a transcript. You know, Blueberry and others create a transcript for the customers.

So Um, there's not a lot of excuse because there was a lot of— I mean, I did, and so did Rob Greenlee— we did a lot of deep research into transcript services years ago.

Oh, it just never got deployed. I just, um, you know, to me it's— it is a little bit, uh, just a little bit entertaining, um, from my perspective, uh, you know, and yeah, so not, not to say anything, but you know, right in our player we have to build— we have, you know, we have exactly that.

Yeah, so yeah, yeah, I saw there's a lot of podcast activity going on at South by Southwest, uh, here as of late.

Yeah, and I think most of that was backed, wasn't it, by Sounds Profitable? They, they're the one who drove the—

yeah, but iHeart was there with, uh, the iHeart Podcast Awards. Oh, okay. I thought was interesting. All right, great. And I guess the Ambies, I guess, are going to be, I guess, at the same hotel this year as Podcast Movement. Interesting. Prior, prior years they've had it as kind of at their own venue, right?

Yeah. Um, it could be a sign that they're, they're having a hard time getting sponsors.

Interesting.

The, uh, but if we think about—

I guess Movement does do the full production on that, um, on that event.

So, but if, but if you, if you read this Does anybody even know who won any awards from the iHeart Podcast Awards? iHeart won 7 of the 30 awards, including the international winner from iHeart Podcast Australia. SiriusXM Simplecast hosted 9 of the winners. iHeart's Omni Studio hosted 8. Hmm. Hmm. Oh, let me Oh yeah, here we go. Let me pat myself on the back. I've done such a good job. Oh, are we surprised? Oh, this is just the way they've done it.

I think it's the way it's gone down just about every year.

Yeah, yeah. So yeah, surprise, surprise, surprise.

Well, it's, it's its own kind of content bubble community is what it is. iHeart has created this kind of bubble of creators that are kind of all on board with iHeart. Yeah. And so there's a lot of people in that community that vote for shows that are in that community. So it's not necessarily that it's entirely purposely slanted toward iHeart. Um, but I think that that community that's around that event does tend to support or follow or have an interest in shows that are created that are related to those big platforms. Right. So there's jobs to be had. Yeah.

That's the other part of it. I mean, yeah, it's— yeah.

Yeah. So, you know, it's, it's, it's what it is and it's, it's okay to have a bunch of different podcast awards out there. It brings more attention to the space.

But there has been some naughty people out there.. And I know these companies are working on fixing their issue, but embed players by Podverse, Podfriend, and JustCast are being basically— they're preloading, pre-caching the entire audio file when the page loads. So we saw that about the same time as the OP3 guys did.

So yeah, that's not naughty naughty.

That's a time-tested strategy, isn't it? Time-tested strategy to get me delisted and put on a block list. List for, right, podcast apps.

Yeah, not, not to say like that it hasn't happened before.

Not that they were, not that they were garnering that many views, but right, you know. So this weird story, you know, this one here is a very bizarre, and, and I heard we talked about this a little bit about Radiohead FM, but it sounds like a little drama. And I read this the other day, said, boy, there's got to be a good backstory to this. Is after Audie announced it was to purchase Radio FM app on February 27th and detailed why it wanted to buy it on February 29th and how it fit into overall M&A user acquisition strategy on March 4th, decided not to purchase Radio FM after all. The company's announced it was building a feature that skips ads in podcasts scheduled to be launched in January Scheduled on January 15th. Huh. January 15th. In the company's app, that feature hasn't yet launched. So it's a little bizarre that you would say you're going to buy something on February 27th. Why you want to buy it on February 29th and then on March 4th decide not to?

What happens if you do some due diligence, you don't like what you see?

Or why announce something before you have done it? Right. That's probably their number one mistake. You know, as excited as I am about the stuff we've got ready to go, if it's not ready, I'll come back here Wednesday and say, well, we waited.

It wasn't ready. All it's going to do is, if you're overconfident in the deal, all it's going to do is embarrass you is what it's going to do.

So, right.

So, Todd, did you see this article that came out on March 12th? It's basically an article written off of a blog called Media Thoughts by John McDermott. No. Um, and it has a title to the headline, 5 Ways to Grow Your Podcast in 2024.

So, oh, I did. I never—

I didn't read it. You want me to mention, um, the 5 ways that this—

am I about to be entertained? Yes. Oh, absolutely.

Let's have a little fun here. Okay.

Tip 1, date Taylor Swift. Okay. Does Taylor Swift's boyfriend have a podcast?

I don't know. I don't know.

I think— what is it?

That's a football player, right? That's his name?

Right.

I don't think it matters. Okay. There's probably a podcast coming from him soon, probably, is really the takeaway. Probably. And then tip number 2 is marry into the royal family. Actually, your numbers will go down. Well, it depends on which part of the royal family that you're in.

Oh, that's probably true. Yeah, right. Or be Kate Middleton in post-altered images that don't show your wedding ring or something.

Yes, yes, right. I guess Meghan Markle was able to parlay this into a deal that reportedly got her $25 million to do 12 episodes.

Wow. That was good. Good on her for getting the paycheck. Was someone dumb enough to have wrote that contract to begin with?

That's about $2 million an episode.

Yeah. Good. Good job on her part. Let's be honest with you. She was able to do this deal and only do that. That whoever, whoever was behind that deal and inked that deal, I hope they— I hope they're— I hope they're still employed and helping these companies lose money.

Definitely safe to say that podcast is losing money. And then what's the number?

Okay. So we got— so I see some satire going on here.

Right. Number 3 is right show at the right time. So, right.

Okay. Now these are all tips, the 5 most successful tips to growing a podcast in 2023. Right show at the right time. Yeah.

I think it's more than that.

It's not a bad, you know, it's shows that were— when Lost was a movie series, uh, television series, there was lots of very popular Lost podcasts. And, you know, there's, you know, so it's true, that does apply to a certain extent.

It's, it's kind of like timing the stock market, right? Uh, if you buy at the right time just before it goes up, that's right. Um, that's kind of The same analogy here. And then number 4 on the list is, uh, start a Trojan horse newsletter so that you can promote your own podcast. Oh, there you go. Oh, so, uh, tip number 3A is say nice things about James Cridland.

Oh. Oh, okay. We both know what happens when you don't talk nicely to James Criddle. Now let me read something here. Uh, let me read it here. I gotta find it. Let me find it. Let me find it.

Let me find it.

Um, big drum roll. Oh, this is tip number 5. I'll go— you go to— you go to tip number 5 and I'll come back to it. Okay. Oh, here it is. Here it is. Here it is. Okay. Okay. Libsyn has added support for podcast transcripts. Users can upload a transcript in SRT or VTT. Need one? Making? Libsyn's competitor Spreaker offers a website and a desktop app offering free podcast transcripts for everyone.

StreamYard offers transcripts with all of their shows too.

You know, I find it a little ironic. You know, Libsyn has added transcript support and the next line Spreaker offers a website and desktop app offering free podcasts.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Are you implying, Todd, that maybe Libsyn needs to add the ability to create a transcript?

Well, you know, there was, you know, it's a, hang on here a second. Don't eat me, James Krigler. You know, there's obviously a little bit of a, you know, stick the knife in and turn it sideways. Oh, congratulations.

But then stick the knife in and, you know, James would probably be okay with that. All right, go to number 5. Number 5, drum roll. Host a successful late night talk show. There you go.

That's tip number 5. Someone's been trying to listen on Fountain. Yes, we sent out the bat signal that we are live. You don't see the live status? I don't know why that is not going on. Did it not I wonder if they're not observing the Eastern Daylight Time, uh, time change. I sent it out again. Go look and see if it's on now, David. It's very bizarre why it would not be on, right? I sent the live bat signal.

Go ahead. And then the bonus tip, so this would be tip 5A, which would be talk about murders and stuff. Oh yeah, that's a hot, hot topic is violence on the street in X and Twitter these days.

My, uh, my kids are here and my, uh, my daughter's here and, uh, grandkids are here. So past Saturday and Sunday, they love a microbrewery, so we were going around microbreweries and my son-in-law has a client in Grand Rapids, so they met them at a brewery and you know, have some drinks. And, uh, of course, the, you know, the two guys were talking biz and the rest of us was, you know, eating food and drinking. And the, the gentleman's wife, I said, you know, got to talk about podcasts. Oh, I love podcasts. And I'm like, you do? And I'm like, what do you listen to? True crime. She said, I listen to everything I listen to is true crime. And I'm like, oh. And it just, again, it's not surprising Uh, yes, yeah, yes, true crime.

Yes, yes, yes, yes. What is—

what else is going on here, Todd? You know, it's, it's actually kind of, kind of quiet. Um, you know, it's not that, not that much going on right now, so I, I don't know.

You know, it's, uh, what is that, do you think? Why is that? It's just, you know, is it the quiet period before Podcast Movement?

Uh, you know, again, Podcast Movement's never been a place where a lot of announcements are made. There's usually like, um, announcements about signing deals, you know, network signing deals with, you know, with— because it's, again, it's a more of an industry event in LA. So it's usually been about creator deals and that kind of stuff. So if we see anything next week, we're going to see That's probably what we're going to see. We're probably not going to see a lot of product announcements like we do, but maybe.

Yeah, that'll be interesting. Let's see how many people show up for, for Podcast Movement. I'm missing to see what the attendance will be for that this year. Yeah, I mean, I think overall conferences have had pretty good attendance. I know your experience at CES was pretty good, right?

Yeah. Yeah, no live in Podcast Guru, still says pending. Still, I have no idea why. We, we sent the bat signal out, so I don't know why. We're scheduled to go live at 2:55 Eastern Daylight Time PM with an ending time of 4:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time. So the bat signal was sent. I have nary a clue why it didn't go live. I did see a live announcement in one of the Mastodon links, so, um, the live signal did go. Um, right here you can see that the ping was sent, so the ping went to both— both the pings went, um, into the, uh into the ecosphere because this was recorded by Podcast Index. So it's a Podverse issue. So make sure, David and Mike, you guys say, hey, you didn't see. But I also, I wonder, I did the update about an hour before the show went live. So I just wonder if they didn't get the pending notification.

So, Todd, How do you actually trigger that ping? Uh, is it a, a checkbox or something like that that you have to do in the Blueberry?

Yeah, so in PowerPress or in the Blueberry backend, there is a pending, live, and ended. And what we do is you— when I get done with the show today, I will switch this to ended and I will save it, and it will send a ping that says the show has ended. And then about a half hour later when I'm doing show notes, I'll do a pending and I'll update the start date, end date, and I'll send that Again, I'll save a change and a pod ping will go to the index. It says, okay, they've changed the pending date. This live item GUID will update so that it shows it's a new unique event. So that'll stay pending for a week. And then just as we start the stream, I change this to live and I hit save change and it sends the pod ping that we are live. And that's supposed to signal the apps, the podcast apps, that we are— that we're on the air. And I do that for two different— I have two different feeds that that goes to because I have an audio stream and a video stream.

So, so if I was doing my show live on StreamYard, which I, I do, uh, for my Podcast Tips show, um, how would I initiate that, given I'm doing that live through StreamYard.

If you have an HLS link, you can configure the HLS link for the video.

If you know that StreamYard gives you that, but, but we'll have to look.

But so the only place I get an HLS stream is from CloudFront. That's why I still have PlayGloop. And at the very end it says playlist.m3u8. So That's the link. Now my fallback link is the newmediashow.com live page as a fallback link that someone could go to and watch the YouTube embed. But, um, again, the apps are supposed to flip live when they get the pod ping. Um, and again, it went out because it showed up in my Mastodon feed. And that actually how it shows up in the Mastodon feed is that I follow @podcastlive at podcastindex.social, and it shows that the show has— the ping was received and the mastodon picked it up, and then it basically gives the indication that it's live.

Okay, so yeah, it's still a fairly complex thing to get set up, but once it's set up, it sounds like it's pretty Smooth.

Uh, Chad says, I got the lit notification on Podverse on iOS. 1,000 stats from Chad F. So those— these are people that are now listening or watching on those apps that are responding to our conversation. So this is how this live interaction works if you get people trained to go use those apps. And yeah, we're on YouTube, we're on Facebook, we're on Twitter, but we're also live on these new podcasting apps from podcastapps.com. So Podverse is working, so Podcast Guru is not, or so whatever reason. And Chad F, thanks for the, uh, thanks for the report. At the same, at the same time, I can see if anyone's streaming SATs, so we can click on that. And right now, um, well, I got one, I got 2 SATs from Chad that was on Podverse, so he must have went and checked it. He probably was on a different He may have been watching us on YouTube or something and went over and checked it. So we got just a little itty-bitty bit of stats from him for the time they tested. You should stay on there, Chad.

Keep it coming. Do we think that we're going to see any progress on alternate enclosures being adopted? In what way? Well, that's, that's a second-level question. Where, I mean, I think that the ideal way of doing it would be to have an audio and video link in one item in one RSS feed.

Right. Okay. How do you remember me talking the other day that I acquiesced Yes.

Okay. That's all.

That's all that needs to be said. So no, we are, we are going to adopt alternate enclosure primarily for, for live, for people to put in their YouTube link. Oh, very interesting. They will still be able to add an alternate enclosure in the traditional way. I'm not going to prevent them from doing so.

But that's That's not going to trigger a playback inside of the podcast app.

That'll— the podcast app— the podcast app— well, my understanding is, and I don't— no one's done this, so we're going to be the first ones to do it— is we will support that link back to, I would say, any— probably Rumble, YouTube, wherever. We're going to allow them. We'll see what— we'll see what happens.

We'll probably break things. So that could—

that link that's in there could trigger the launch of— it could let those apps play the YouTube embed in the app.

Could.

Oh, in the app.

Good. In the app.

If it's an embed link, right? No, it's not an embed link. It's only going to be a link to the episode. That's what we've been told is, okay, link to the You link to the published episode or whatever you want to call it to an embed experience is what you're saying, right? That is the rumor. Okay, so that would be great. Well, we'll see. And again, uh, we're putting the, um, alternate enclosure in the experimental section.

No one needs that. But that could also potentially work with live too. Um, well, I mean, not able to put in a YouTube link.

Yeah, maybe. I don't know. But again, it defeats the purpose of doing the PodPing. But who knows, you know? But we're gonna let people put an actual physical link. A bunch of people are falling over on themselves right now. They're listening later. Yes, right. Yes, I'm eating shit and acquiescing and allowing it to Be put in the system.

Well, as you can tell, Todd, I'm not, I'm not gloating about this or anything, so you can feel a little bit more rested.

Someone else will gloat. Someone else will say— someone else will gloat. And I thought you said over your dead body. James, take a cue. Yeah, you know what, here is what— here's what changed my mind was them saying that we could link to a YouTube video and basically double-barrel middle fingers to YouTube to allow people to listen to someone's quote-unquote podcast on YouTube, right? We're all mixed up, aren't we, Todd?

Oh yeah, well, you know, we're completely out of control here.

So, so yes, the rails So yes, Blueberry will be supporting Alternate Enclosure.

You can hooray and do backflips. Well, that's a good thing to have. I mean, there's not that many people doing backflips these days. So it's good to hear that people are that enthusiastic about something. Right. So did you see this report from KSNR?

Report podcasts are replacing traditional media consumption. Generation, especially for 20 years, for 19 years it has been.

I guess it's just reached a tipping point now, I guess. Um, so, and it's all pretty much, well, even, even baby boomers, it's significantly taking time away from watching mainstream media.

Well, people that were 35 when podcasting kicked off are now 55. Right. And those of us that were, you know, I'm fast approaching. I'm not even going to say the number anymore, you know, because I don't want this.

That's a big one that's coming for me. Yeah. So I'm already there. So we're all right.

You're going to be okay, Todd. Yeah. You know, I've got another 15 years, maybe. You know, who knows?

Um, by the way, do you have— what you'll find though is that you will start to slow down, Todd. That's just part of how it works. A little bit.

I wouldn't say a lot. Well, I'm doing my best to stay busy. Yeah, you are. Yeah, actually, the last 3 days I've worked harder in these last 3 days getting these ready for these product launches I've worked in a while.

So, well, I'm doing 4 podcasts, so that tells you about my My content schedule is staying—

well, you know, I'm doing 3 plus internal, you know, we usually do like 1 or 2 a week for Blueberry. We do, you know, we try to front load them. I think I've done 4 in the first 2 weeks of the, of the month.

So yeah, yeah. So it's traditional media is kind of struggling right now, I think.

Well, I think all the meat— I think everyone's struggling, especially if you're trying to put money at the, you know, I think, I think it's—

and they make money as a content creator, is that what you're saying?

Yeah, I think it's— I think everyone's suffering. Although our program— I got my programmatic report yesterday and I'm really pleased with that. That's growing about 10, 10, 15% a month. So revenue-wise, I couldn't be more happy with programmatic for the podcasters are getting checked. So, you know, for just flipping a switch and, and I know some of you don't like the pre-rolls, but, you know, podcasters get paid a little bit. Oh, one thing I found, hey, I did a test and Apple has got some magic going on. I switched to my transcript I did have 60 seconds of pre-rolls on the episode that I tested with, but my transcript did not start moving until the actual, um, the content wasn't offset. So whatever Apple's doing within the app, they're doing some magic to detect. So they didn't start playing it with the ad down the timeline, they actually they actually married up somehow and the transcript was flowing even though there was a pre-roll of 60 seconds.

So I was really, really shocked about that. Yeah. Interesting. So it's, are you, what's the significance of that?

Is it more of like a closed caption? No, what it is, is Apple nailed it on the head as far as this implementation. And it somehow, it's marrying up the voice with the transcript.

Yeah. Yeah. I know that YouTube has been doing that for a while now.

But here's the thing, they did it without— there was ads there, which would have thrown most of these other apps, the synchronization off by 60 seconds. But they're recognizing it is what you're saying. Yeah, they're doing some sort of— they're recognizing it starting when it's supposed to start. Oh, so well, it should be able to do that. Well, right, that then raises a challenge for all these other apps that are doing that to be able to programmatically within the app detect when to get those synced at ad spot start. Maybe they're just including them. Yeah, so no mid-roll testing on that, it was just the pre-roll. So if someone's got a mid-roll in their show and got a transcript please, and their transcript doesn't have the ad, please check, yeah, at 17.4 and see what it does.

Thought I was glancing at this, uh, KSNR report that I was talking about that came out on March 7th. Um, there's a paragraph in here that's interesting in this report that says video podcasting is popular That's a controversial topic right there, particularly via YouTube. 45% of their survey respondents responded in that way, which is especially popular among men. So that, that's what they're seeing. And looking ahead, KSNR expects augmented reality, AR, virtual reality, VR, and other interactive features to become increasingly popular, elevating the podcast experience with more interactive and immersive content. So I see this. I mean, if I don't know what you think about this, Todd, but you know, that may be what the future might look like for what is considered to be podcasting, um, is heading down this more, I guess, augmented reality, virtual reality type of experiences in the podcasting medium as we extend even beyond video, which it's a form of video, but yeah.

Our Facebook listeners, uh, Mike said, ah, alternate closure. I'm sure you're looking forward to the torrent of new customers that'll give you. He does a wink. Kyle says, Libsyn support podcasting 2.0? Shocker. LOL. Yeah. Mike said, wow, those tips to have a great show are perfectly non-committal. Mike said he does have a podcast laced with explicatives. There you go.

There's a strategy.

That goes through your show. Yeah. Okay. So sorry I missed those earlier. I was watching YouTube. Thank you for those of you who are watching on the Facebook. So, Todd, what do you think about that projection that this study is making about— You know, if TikTok survives Congress, everyone is watching all kinds of stuff now. So everyone's time is being split across many, many screens, across your TV, across your mobile device, across your tablets. So all of it's competing for a share of voice, share of ear, share of eyeballs, you know. So of course radio, which is typically listened to in the car, um, is, is going to lose. And it's when you have— when you have a DJ in New York that's playing top 40 for Coldwater, Michigan, on some syndicated station. Boring. They don't talk local. There's nothing local. There's talk radio is local. Talk show in the morning might be local, but most of this stuff is syndicated. You've got— or a computer playing songs. There's nothing compelling about that. It's been that way for years. So how, you know, radio is only, only surviving because it's still a selection in cars. Right, right. Do you have a, do you have a radio in your house, Rob?

An AM/FM radio? I do.

It's an emergency radio. It's an emergency radio. I have one of those ones that you crank or you put in the window. I have one that takes batteries and I have batteries too. So, you know, I have one for emergency. Yep, there is one. But guess what happens in emergency now? We all get on our phone, you know, and try to see if a tower's still up. So, you know, radio in my house is for an emergency. My kids— I get in my— I get my kids' cars and they are—

they're listening to Bluetooth. Yeah, it's, it's literally a dying medium. Dying. I mean, it's dying from a demographics standpoint as well as a distribution consumption medium. But this, this KSNR article continues and says, in this podcasting landscape, we're witnessing a profound shift, particularly in the loyalty and influence of super listeners. So I'm, I'm not sure what this means, but yeah, I do know that there's renewed interest in focusing on community in podcasting. And, and I'm not sure what they're trying to say about super listeners, but, um, you know, ones that are highly engaged, highly connected to the program are certainly something all of us aspire to. And, and it, and this person, uh, from this research company continues to say it's an exciting time for podcasting with boundless possibilities on the horizon. So, you know, that in combination with what they were talking about, about these new technologies like AR, VR, and, and, you know, creating more interactive, immersive content. And that's— that could be a little bit of a reflection of why we're seeing a resurgence in interest in live too.

Right.

So, you know, which kind of takes us back to a little bit of a radio experience too. But it's, it's it's a little more interactive, more immersive. And so you start thinking about how humans want to connect with each other and this kind of shift, increasing shift towards building community around your podcast, not audiences, but building community. Um, you can kind of see all these things may come together.

Yeah. Rob, I got a hard out here at the bottom of the hour. I got dinner in 30 minutes. So the show's going to be a little bit late to publication today.

Probably tomorrow morning.

Um, okay, let's, let's head out the door then. Yeah. And so what say you, ladies and gentlemen? Oh, what? Oh, I got some more comments here. Hang on. Uh, radio survives because the long-term legacy client sponsors that don't foster change until the leadership board changes. It is and has been a ticking clock for radio, which is why the radio heads are trying to desperate to smash all the perspectives of podcasting and radio together to be more like radio. That way they can use the akin terminology and have people assume that they know what they're talking about when in fact they really don't. That was a good one, Mike. Thank you so much for your feedback. I think you're about right. Right. Yeah. All right. Todd at blueberry.com, at Geek News on X, Geek News at Geek News, at GeekNews.chat on Mastodon. With any luck, Tuesday will reveal all this secret stuff I've been thinking about. I think you will be— a certain segment of the world will be happy, Rob.

Yeah, I would say so. And you'll be eating more crow.

No, just kidding. No, not at all. Not on this one. But I do have a saying that I'm looking forward to using. Yeah, I'm sure you do. I do.

I have something 'cause I wait till next Wednesday. Okay. All right. Well, I do, do like it, Todd, that you guys are aggressive. I'm talking about Blueberry kind of in yourself are aggressively pushing the envelope on adding new features and innovating and that kind of stuff. I think it's a, it's a great position that you're putting yourself in.

I think there's a few people that are going to say, I wish I would have thought of that.

Yeah, but they will probably go over there and take advantage of that. Yeah, right.

Yeah.

So yeah, so you can find me on Twitter, X as well, @RobGreenlee. You can send me an email if you want, robgreenlee@gmail.com. You don't have to use the dot if you don't want to. It still gets to me. So, and I have a website, robgreenlee.com. I do a live show on StreamYard every Thursday night at 7 PM Eastern. Uh, was that 4 PM Pacific, um, called Podcast Tips with Rob Greenlee. So that's a live show on all of the live consumption platforms. So it's also an audio and video podcast that's hosted by Todd.

It's all, you know, Todd hosts all my stuff now. Awesome. And, uh, we will get you more information of where we are on Rumble. I'll get that kind of figured out tomorrow and, uh, see if you guys want to watch us over there too. All right, thanks everybody. Thanks for being here. All right, thanks for being part of the family. We'll see you next Wednesday. Bye-bye. Okay, bye.