The Secret to Successful Franchising with Dan Olsen

The biggest thing we look at is the people behind it. How likely are they going to succeed? Do they have the right mindset? Have they had success in the past? A whole long list of things. Because they're the ones that are going to need to manage it. And we're setting up a completely new business for them. They're used to running their business, which they've done great at, obviously, to get to that point, but now we're setting up a whole new type of business. How much more successful would you be.

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This is Business Lunch with Roland Frazier and Ryan Deiss. Hey, business owners. At Scalable, we know there are three key steps to getting your team clear on where they are in relation to your company's goals. The first step is to identify three to five metrics that tell the clearest story on how this team is helping the company hit its growth goals. The second step is to create clear targets so your team can declare in advance what winning looks like. And the third step is to measure these targets on a weekly basis. When your team is forced to interact with the numbers themselves, they begin to truly know their numbers. If you want to see how we track our numbers here at Scalable, you can get a free template@businesslunchpodcast.com dashboard. That's businesslunchpodcast.com dashboard.

Hey, everybody. Roland Frazier here with another episode of Business Lunch. And my guest today happens to be a relatively new business partner as well, and it is Dan Olson from Fast Track Franchising. Dan, welcome to the show.

Oh, wow. It's a pleasure to be with you, Roland. Sure was good to meet with you the other day. Thank you.

Yeah, it's great to have you on. Would you do me a favor and kind of tell people, like, you've got a really cool history with some pretty significant franchises and some pretty crazy growth? Could you kind of give us a little bit of a background on kind of what your entrepreneurial journey is, not just with, like, the franchises that you've done, but maybe kind of just a quick overview of Dan's entrepreneurial life?

Oh, wow. Thank you. I'll be as succinct as I can. I spent 12 years in the corporate life with Big national bank, working my way up the ladder, and I just couldn't continue to do that. I wanted to be in my own business. I tried all these different things back in the day. You did the mail order. I did direct marketing, I did real estate.

What'd you sell by mail?

You name it. A lot of fun things. I learned a lot. But then one day when I moved to Arizona from Colorado, I had a neighbor that moved in exactly the same day. We got to know one another and I told him about my business quest, and he says, you should look into franchising. And I thought, well, I don't know anything about it. And he said, you got to check this out. So I looked into it and never looked back. I got into a little company back then called Money Mailer, Direct mail advertising out of Southern California. We grew that up to about 600 locations. Worked with Zig Ziglar and had the whole crew there for a while. And that was my introduction. And they trained us very, very well and got out. And I started to be able to go out and do some of my own things at that time. Then I jumped into Fantastic Sam's Hair Salons. I ended up owning the master franchise with some partners in San Francisco, built that up.

Oh, wow.

And exited out of that very profitably. I mean, there's a difference in the franchise world with master franchising versus just owning a single unit. Probably talk about that. And then, then I decided, you know, I'm going to just build my own consulting company. And so I started consulting, helping franchise companies grow. And it became the number one master franchise consulting company in the world at that time. And we helped a lot of people grow and thousands of people actually. And so I got a call, actually a couple of them were Health Source Chiropractic. It became the fastest growing new franchise company in the United States for two years in a row, 2008, 2009. And I got a call one day also from a guy who said, hey, Dan, I heard you could help me grow. And I says, well, what do you got? And he said, oh, I got a massage company. And I'm thinking, I don't know if I want to get involved with massage. And he's, no, no, no, this is legitimate. This is legitimate. You got to look into this. So I did, and the rest is history. We took massage injury from four locations up to about 600 in five years. And now it's about 1200 and a billion and a half in sales. And I actually owned three of their master franchises back then. Cleveland, Michigan and Philadelphia built those up, exited out of those successfully. And I've owned, actually now about. I'm on my 12th now, maybe 13th master franchise. And we've exited out of Most of those. And it's been exciting run. There's still a lot more to come with some brand new things. And so I kind of semi retired out of Arizona a few years ago and moved up here to a little bit cooler climate here in Utah. But then people started saying, hey, Dan, let's do this and Dan, let's do that. And so I couldn't retire and I don't think I ever will now because we're having so much fun building these new brands. We got some amazing new things that are cool and just growing like crazy. And so how can you retire and not continue to work when you have a lot of that fun stuff going on?

Right? Why, why do that? So you mentioned a couple times, master franchise. Let's talk about just generally to kind of define for people because I know a lot of people have heard franchise, but what is a franchise? Who are the players? And then what is this master franchise thing that we keep talking about?

Yeah, that's exactly. That's what I got rolling. I got kind of scared. This franchise thing, all this big investment and all these things going on. But you know what, when you think of franchising this way, if you can go out and you can buy brand new, nice car, you can get it also into a franchise. So that's going to return you some investment. So there's ways to get into different sections, different levels of franchising, I'll call them. There's four main levels that you look at and there's a kind of a fifth one that we can talk about if we have time. But there's four main levels to get into. Franchise number one is a single unit ownership. That's what most people see. When you see a massage envy out there, you see an Orange Theory Fitness or you see whatever it is out there, you're thinking, oh, okay, I'm going to own that and I got to put up all this money and do all these things. And yeah, there's some investment there. But following your lead. I'm going to digress here just a second. Following your lead, what you've done with acquiring businesses with little or no money down. I was able to do that in a couple of franchise situations. So don't be afraid of it is what I'm trying to say here. So the idea is a single unit franchise. Typically it's going to cost if it's a brick and mortar, anywhere from maybe 150,000 to 250, maybe 300,000, total startup costs. You can come along if you got fairly decent Credit the SBA or other lending sources. And there's a lot of different ways to grab funds to put in there. A lot of people using HELOCs or whatever it is, instead of letting the money waste away in the equity in their homes that's shot up, they're taking some of that money, putting it in an asset that's increasing their net worth even faster. So you might need anywhere from that 50, 60, 70,000 as a down payment, just like you would if you were buying a home that's a single unit. Then the other things people think about is, oh, wow, I don't want to be tied down to this. I mean, I'm not looking to buy a job. That's not what we're talking about here. Some people like that, they might want to go and operate their franchise like a job, but they still have investment and building some net worth. But what a lot of people want to do is they want to own it. What we call semi absentee owned, which can lead to absentee owned at some point. So that way they can keep their job, they can keep their business, they can add another stream of income. But it's going to take them a little time, usually maybe five, ten hours a week, whatever, what fits you, and of course the franchise. But it allows you to build an investment on the side, putting a little bit of time into it and seeing some tremendous returns on your investment versus putting it in the traditional way to invest your money. So that's a single unit franchise. Okay. Then the second level is what we call multi unit. That's where you'd acquire two or more. No, I want to get into this bigger, a little bit bigger. I want to own more. Two, more than one. I want two or three. But there's a time frame for you to do that. So they're not going to pressure you into making sure you do it. Some franchisors will, but some won't. You have to know the right ones, but you own more than one. Third way is what's called area development. That's where you own an entire area. Your area might be all of Carlsbad and Oceanside or something like that. In San Diego, you own those. Only you have the right to put those franchises in that area. No one else can come and put them in as long as you're meeting your production schedule. So that's called area development. Those are a little bit more rare. But the arena that I played in is that I like to play with the big boys. And I've been able to do it, because I've had a lot of support, a lot of mentors, a lot of people along the way that have helped me, and I appreciate that very, very much. That's what we call master franchising, or the correct legal terminology is you become an area representative, in other words, a partner with that franchisor. They've done all the work, they've set it up, they put all the money into invest. You come along and buy a piece of real estate, like say San Diego and Imperial counties, and you own that. Or it could be the state of Arizona, which I've done, or the state of Colorado or Orange County, California, but you own that territory. It's like buying a real estate. All the money that comes through that company in that area comes through you. So that means you get a portion of the franchise fees, you get a portion of, of what we all want. And that's the royalty income, ongoing residual income. It's huge. And you get a portion usually of some wholesale distribution income. If there's products going through that, you're getting pieces of that sometimes. And fourthly, you can also own your own franchise. You can put one in, have hire a manager, run it, have the manager report back to you and generate income at a lower cost because you're not paying as much royalty because you're the master franchisee for the territory. And then of course, you can own real estate and release that out to your franchisees. There's a lot of other income sources with that. So. And you can also. The cool thing about it, Roland, is you can operate it from your home with very low overhead, so you don't have to go out and get a big office space and put all the money into it. Sure, you have to invest in it, figure out a way to get your investment capital into it, but you become a partner. It's what I call the best kept secret in business today.

So you hear about, we got like Shaq and a lot of these Magic Johnson and a lot of sports and entertainment personalities that'll build up dozens or hundreds of franchises as an investment. And obviously they're not working in them. So how does that work as a passive investment? Is that, is it a good thing to do or is it just kind of only if you're a celeb or how does that work?

That's a great question. Yeah, it's a really good thing to do. But if you've only got enough capital to get like Rick Shack, obviously they have some capital behind them and, and they bought into in a big way and they're able to hire managers to do that. But if you're starting out scratch, I'll give you example of a friend of mine who was working at Walmart a few years ago and he wanted to get into something bigger and better. And so he saved up a little bit of money and he invested in to one of our fantastic Sam's Hair Salons franchises. But he still continued to keep working at Walmart. And so he was putting in that five to 10 hours a week, just managing it, putting it together. It started to produce the way we expected, all expected and produced that cash flow. Now what happens is when you go back to get your second location, the SBA is even more lenient with you. They're going to give you even more money to work with. And so there's lesser of a down payment. In some cases, depending on you and the franchise, it could be even zero down payment to get started in your second and third. So he got his second one and then he got his third one and fourth he ended up getting like 12 of them up and running. And of course he hired a whole big, had all the cash flow coming in and he had a staff running it for him. He could just go retire and not do anything, anything again. So you can kind of build to it unless you have the capital up front, then you're able to hire the managers to run it for you. So you can call it an absentee owned business.

Okay. And so is that the key is basically just if you can afford to have a manager, then you don't really need to be there. And the five to 10 hours that you're talking about is kind of if you're not willing or can't yet hire somebody to do that.

Right. That's typically there's all kinds of different routes and everybody's different. And we can tailor make our team actually helps people to tailor make that right strategy so you can get to your goals at the end.

Got it. Okay. And then as far as you said that you had done a couple of deals with these master franchises with no money out of pocket or consulting for equity, which is one of our favorite things we like to talk about here. Can you share some of your stories about that?

Yeah, actually I did. I'll share a past one and I mean a current one right now is when people come to the table and like I've had before, I'll give you one example with one of my Massage Envy master franchise that I own. Well, I'll do the fantastic Sam's one because Back then I had no capital. The price for San Francisco for Fantastic Sam's because it was a little bit more well known name and Los Angeles was knocking it out of the park. That that guy had 180 locations in Los Angeles. There you imagine getting a little a piece of every One of those 180, that's a lot of money. And he never, I can tell you this, he never came in the office. He came maybe once a year because he had a really good director that took care of things. So we said, let's do this, let's do San Francisco. So the partners that we put together, the price of it was 600,000 to jump in. And they said, hey Dan, we need you because you're going to help us with the franchise sales. You're going to help us build this. Okay, great. So what do I get out of it? I just don't want a commission like I normally do. I want to have commission and I want to build some equity. So they said, okay fine, we'll give you this much equity when we reach this plateau or when we'll give you this much equity upfront and you reach this cap and you can get even more. And so I think I ended up with like 15, 18% of that whole deal. No money out of pocket. And I just helped consult and do the whole thing that I did. Then we exited out. It was amazing to do that. So now I have people all the time coming to me and I say, hey Dan, I don't think I can really do this the way that I need to do it.

I'm a.

For example, I have a doctor, he's a doctor, he's doing great and he's, he's doing work with his clinic or his hospital he works for and he doesn't want to leave that right now. He does in the future. So he says, hey Dan, can you help me? And I says okay, I really like you and I think we can work together. So tell you what, I'll buy this, I got the money to do it and I'll give you X amount of equity and you help me grow it and we'll work it together. And that's what we're doing. And this just happened like four or five months ago. He already has his first franchise done. The second one's on its way. This first one's getting this training done later the next, actually the first of next month and will be open their doors and that residual starts flowing in that quick and so I get a piece of that. He gets a Bigger chunk. And pretty soon as it grows, he's able to leave his hospital job and do what he wants to do and have that more freedom. And so certain situations I can team up with people. And there's a lot of different ways to structure deals. As you know, Roland, you've structured hundreds and hundreds of them. So the same thing applies with the franchise.

So, and I know I've referred you an electric vehicle repair shop that's got a couple of locations and a real estate brokerage. When somebody's thinking about would it make sense for me to expand using franchise, what are kind of the key characteristics of, like, that's going to work as a viable strategy.

So that's the fifth way to get into franchising. And so I talked about four levels, single, multiple area, and master. Now, the fifth way is actually the most lucrative way, the highest percentage of return that I've seen. But you got to be able to put a little more work into it. And as a franchisor. So I've helped well over a hundred companies do that and figure that strategy out. And yes, the ones that you and I have talked with are amazing concepts that we can turn into franchises. In fact, one already is we just want to take it and grow it even further. And so the idea here is we look for, we dive into three main things that makes a difference in a company to whether they'll succeed as a franchise company or not. Number one is differentiation. What's different about it? So you can't just have another pizza place that's saying, okay, I want to do my pizza and here's my pizza. But there's nothing different about it. But if you have differentiation on it and you're in this unique niche and you can create some real value, then that's the biggest thing we got to look at. And fortunately, the things that you've referred to us have that differentiation at a high level. At a very high level. So we're excited. Not just another real. This is not just another real estate company. This is a above them, as you know. You've looked at that very carefully. It's got that differentiation about it. So that's number one. And here, let me just say something more on that too, Roland, because it's very, very important. A lot of people don't succeed in business because you don't have that unique selling proposition. You've heard about the USP all along. You got to have that domino's. Had it right from the start. Other people have had that unique selling proposition. So you walk in the door, this is different, and there's value there, and people want to be part of it. But the problem is most people can't come up with that unique selling proposition so that they can set themselves apart in the world. The ones that do can succeed, and if they find the right program to attach to and grow it as a franchise, the potential is obviously billions. It's $2.3 trillion in sales that goes through franchising every year. So there's opportunities for everybody to do that. So maybe I spent enough time on differentiation, but it's huge. So we got to take that. But then as a franchise company, we have to take that differentiation and even expand on it and put more value to it and put together a package that is irresistible. When someone sees, oh, man, this is so cool, what do I sign? And they want to be part of that franchise. That's number one. If you're also considering looking as a franchise, as a strategy for your business, number two is it's got to be replicable. So therefore, we got to be able to train quickly. We can't normally have six months worth of training to do a special thing. It needs to be quick, like a week, two weeks, maybe three weeks, where we can train someone to come in and do exactly what you've already set up. Replicable number two. And number three has to be profitable. There has to be really decent numbers. That's the first thing I look at, and I'm sure that's what you. You as well, Rowan, when you're looking at a deal, okay, show me the numbers. Let's look at the numbers. So you jump in and you see the numbers say, okay, here's the revenue, and here's where the trends are going. And it doesn't have to be 20 years worth of numbers or even five years. It can be three months worth of numbers like the one you referred to me that we're working on, the automotive deal.

Is there a profit percentage that you kind of need to be able to have, like, a minimum margin or something like that to kind of make it work the way that you would ideally like for it to?

Yeah, that's a good question, because, yeah, it's different in every industry. Like the food industry. If you have an 18, 19% margin, then you know you're doing pretty darn well, because when you put the royalty with it, then obviously it's going to reduce a little bit of that, but it's worth it because the sales will almost always increase with the franchise system. Okay, so that's Worth it. So but when you look at a service business, we'd like to see that 25% plus, plus profit margin and if it's continually going up, then that's great. Like the one you referred to me that, I mean, They've had a 62% increase in the past few months, as you know. So that's tremendous. We love to see those increases and especially during the past couple of years in the pandemic, if we're seeing those increases and we're seeing those businesses survive during that time and now they're out of it, those are awesome because now we can call them pandemic and recession resistant businesses.

Right. So we've got differentiation and we've got replication. Right. And then we've got an ideally profitable. Anything else.

Well, those are the three big things we look at. And then it takes some time to really analyze some of the other aspects of the business. And we have a whole set of fairly long a list of criteria that we look at and we look at ratios and we look at all these different things and those things, if they match up, we can pretty much tell whether it's going to succeed or not. I mean, it's just nothing's 100%. But we have something that predicts that success. But here's the predictor that we don't have and that we look at very, very carefully. And that as we go through the system and as we work with those people, because it's not an immediate thing, it's not like, okay, let's franchise a business and next week we sign an agreement, we're moving forward. It's a marriage really. It's like would take some time to go through that. Of course, it's a quick marriage. It might be two months to go through the process and make sure it's the right thing. But the biggest thing we look at is the people behind it. How likely are they going to succeed? Do they have the right mindset? Have they had success in the past? A whole long list of things because they're the ones that are going to need to manage it. And we're setting up a completely new business for them. They're used to running their business, which they've done great at, obviously to get to that point. But now we're setting up a whole new type of business that we're going to help them on, of course. But the people as you know, are just critical to that.

And one thing I think that would be helpful too is just to clarify is so does this really only work for places that have multiple physical locations or can you have a franchise that is virtual or doesn't have like territories in specific cities and things like that?

Yes, we've done several of those over the years. And so I categorize when you jump into a single unit franchise or even multiple units unit, there's two main categories. There's the brick and mortar. So that's when you think of Orange Theory Fitness or you think of any type of fast food place or whatever, that's obviously a brick and mortar. But when you think of a non brick and mortar, what's all that about? That's where you're operating out of your home or small office. I think one that comes to my mind, it's been very successful. Brad Sugars with Action Coach International, you know the name, I think he's. Doesn't he live around close to you? So he's created Action Coach International worldwide, 1200 locations at one time. I don't know how many he's got now, but those guys were putting in 45 to $75,000 as a franchise fee. They're executives that wanted to be in their own business and he taught them his program and they helped coach other businesses and helped them succeed. Very satisfying. But they could work out of their home, small office and have that ongoing revenue coming in which gave them the freedom. And so there's businesses like that.

And so in that case it was more of like a system that they were getting than a territory. Right?

It was a system also. It was the support a lot of those people jumping in there. They, they didn't know how to run a business. They had run a business for someone else in the corporate life, corporate world. And that's where most of our candidates come from. They're used to following the system, but they also had the higher ups to kind of back them up and support them. Now they jump into a business of their own if they start it from scratch. That's why there's such a low success rate with startups, because 20% success rate. Because you don't have a lot of that mentorship and you don't have that step by step system. You have to create it. And you also have those mentors that are going to come in and make sure that you succeed. Because when you succeed, you're succeeding too. And so there's a real big incentive for that to happen. On the franchise world, is there a.

Stat for franchise success, like for franchisees, like there is for business failures for startups?

Yeah, there's a statistics there's all kinds of different statistics. But when I think about the different types of franchises, you can see some of them might have a little bit lower one. They might be 80% plus. But what I like to think of is if you have a 20% success rate in a business startup, switch that around to a franchise, you're 80% plus. So if you want to go to gamble, Las Vegas or wherever, and you put your money down and you have a chance to succeed, 80% on that table is a little bit better. But it also becomes more in your court because you're controlling it. You get to control it. You don't have people jumping in and harming your business because they want to make sure you succeed. But also the success rates I've seen go as high as about 89% with a single unit franchise. When you get a multiple unit franchise situation, it goes even more closer to 92, 93%. Because if you have three locations, for example, look what happens. You got one that's doing good, one over here that's doing phenomenal, and one here is doing so. So it all balances out because you have that diverse diversification. And with a master franchise, you really can't fail unless you do nothing at it because you're operating out of your home and there's basically no overhead to it. So that success rate goes up even higher. Plus the fact that you've invested the money into it so it allows you to successfully even at a higher rate.

I love it. The last thing I kind of want to chat about with you is what are franchises like from a standpoint of acquiring somebody that like. So there's the franchisor who creates the system and sells to a bunch of different franchisees, and you can be a franchisee. What if you want to acquire the business from an existing franchisee? Is that a difficult process or any particular things that people should be on the lookout for as they think about doing that?

Yeah, those are obviously what we call resale franchises. And so in certain franchise systems, those can be a little bit challenging to sell off, especially if you're not at the standard of where they would expect you to be in profitability. You know how that works. So they become a little bit more challenging. But I'll tell you the biggest challenge I've had as a master franchisee and seeing my master franchisees is this. If you go out and sell 20 franchises in your territory as a master franchisee, you're going to have at least one of those come back to you and say, hey, Dan, I'm just not making it. After a couple years, I'm bleeding so I'm having to put more money back in. I just can't keep doing that for my family. And of course we're concerned for their family. We do not want to see them have harm their family in any way and put them into any financial challenge.

So.

So what we have to do as master franchisees is help them figure a proper way to exit the business. And usually the best way to do that is we take the franchisee who's over here next to them and say, hey, look over here, this guy's struggling a little bit, he'd like to go ahead and sell. Would you be interested in picking up this extra location? And a lot of times they do. So they give them a little bit of money down payment or maybe it's no money down payment. Sometimes, yeah, I'll come in and I'll put my people from here that's working over here to help support it. In most cases they turn that around and build it up. So there are fewer and fewer franchises for sale out there because a lot of times they get bought up by the internal franchisees that are already there now. Sometimes you'll see some big name sandwich places. I won't name any names. You'll see them for sale. Business broker, franchise broker, whatever has it. Business broker, more likely in a territory. Hey, well known franchise, here's this sandwich place, it's up for sale. And the challenge there is a lot of times those places are already sold out. So even if they sell it as a business, there's no more opportunity for them to expand and they can't get two, three, four, five more and really build a mini empire. So why take over someone else's headache and their job? So it's best sometimes to go find a brand new fresh franchise where you can create it from scratch, build it and not worry about having it. And that's probably the biggest single thing is when you buy someone else's single unit franchise like that, you're creating a job for yourself unless you've got the infrastructure behind it to kind of help support it. And that's why existing franchisees usually will. They'll jump at the chance to grab that for little or no money down and turn it around. And they usually do because they've already been successful.

Awesome. I love it. So if somebody's interested in finding out more about how to franchise the business they've got or to acquire franchise or just has general questions and would love to get in touch with you. What's the best way for them to do that?

So yeah, you know, with all of our new team we're putting together, Roland, I know they've changed around a lot of things on how that's done.

But tell you what, probably just, I'd probably just have them, if you're comfortable with it, have them email you or.

Yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to give for your, for your team members. I'm going to give them out my actual email address. Just do my email and it's simple. It's the letter D@CoachDano.com CoachDano.com Got it.

Okay, this way folks will have a way to reach out and just say, hey, I saw you on business lunch or heard you on business lunch and got a question.

Yeah, and please tell me a little bit about yourself too. When you send that email and what you've done and what you're looking to do, it doesn't have to be super long. A couple paragraphs would be great. That way I can help you better and get you to the right person as well. Who, if it's not me, obviously. But we love helping people. And as you've seen too, Roland, over your years in business, the best paycheck of all comes from helping people to succeed and seeing the happiness and excitement that comes from blowing it away in the business that they've acquired and helping their family to really achieve some great financial freedom. That's the best paycheck of all.

100%. Awesome. Cool. Well, thank you for taking the time to hang out with us today. Appreciate you being here and everybody that all you guys that are watching or listening, definitely reach out if you have any franchise questions. Dan is the guy and we appreciate you listening and watching and would always appreciate you subscribing so you don't miss out on anything cool. And if you enjoy what you're watching, feel free to give us a five star review and tell people that you like us. That's it for today and we'll see you next time.

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