#264 - Hiring & Retaining Top Talent w/ Julie Holbein

You are listening to the Independent Dealer Podcast with hosts Luke Godwin and Jeff Watson.

Hello and welcome to the Independent Dealer Podcast brought to you by Buckeye Dealership Consulting. Luke, we are just right on the verge of convention season.

Yeah.

Favorite time of the year.

I thought tax time was your favorite time of the year.

It is also my favorite time of the year. Depends on what time of the year we're talking.

We're in the middle of tax time and now we're looking forward to convention season.

Yeah. So with that, obviously you guys know buy her pay here United coming up at the end of April. April 30th, correct? Yep.

The Bellagio.

Yeah. In sunny, beautiful Las Vegas. This beautiful leader, Julie, is going to be presenting. Julie, introduce yourself to the podcast community and tell us why you're here. I mean, talk about a non connected business or industry, but we have a connection.

We do have a connection. So thank you guys for having me. I really appreciate it. I am Julie Holbein. I am the VP of Talent Development for Big Lots. So Big Lots, based here in Columbus, Ohio. And my team, we're all about building capabilities for Big Lots. Right. So anything from how to run a register, stack a truck, leadership, all those competency culture things my team is responsible for. So that's what I do. And how I got here is a very interesting story. Former manager of mine at a former employer reached out and said, hey, there's this opportunity. Would you be interested? I was going to do this and I have a conflict and I think you do great and you love this topic. You're passionate. So it was easy to say yes. And it's Las Vegas and it's the Bellagio.

Exactly. I tell you, this is the hardest thing we do as a company, especially over the last, the last 24 months. Julie, I'm sure Big Lots has had the same issues we've had, but this is such a poignant topic to speak about and that's, you know, hiring, training and retaining employees. I'm so glad you, I'm going to get educated right now talking to you. So, so glad that you're trying to educate some dumb old car dealers.

That's what's really cool is, is, is it's like, I get it, you're not selling cars, you're not in the auto industry. But that's so it's so good to have people from outside come in and educate us on how kind of the quote, on how the real world works. Right. Like we're in such a little echo chamber. And Luke tells Me his advice, and I tell him mine. But then to have someone from corporate America come in and be like, hey, guys, you're both wrong. Here's. Here's a better or more correct way to do this. It's really, really cool. So I look forward to it.

It's, you know, people are messy and, you know, people are people. So we're hiring in our stores or DCs or corporate headquarters, very similar skill sets than what, you know, you guys are hiring just transferable skills. So we're all fighting, if you will, for the same people. It's just the industries people gravitate towards.

How many people are you, I guess, in charge of recruiting each year, Julie? How many people, how many employees does Big Lot have?

Big lots has between 34,35,000 associates across the country. So just over 1400 stores, five distribution centers, and then our corporate headquarters based here in Columbus. And, you know, we fight turnover like you guys do, right? You know, retail average turnover is 100% in a store. So you're turning your store every year. Every year you're turning it, you know, D.C. is a little bit less. Corporate headquarters, of course, a lot less. But it's all the same. Every industry right now is fighting that war for talent.

Is it. Is it that whole great resignation thing that I hear talked about in the news where these people are, you know, you see the charts and it says if you, you know, wage growth and people that stay with the company are like, down here on this lower wage growth and people that are chronic job hoppers make more money because they're constantly looking left and right to go to a job with that pays them more. Like, how do we battle that when our employees are always looking to upgrade on us?

Yeah, it's very interesting, right? You know, the great resignation that. I hate talking about it. I'm done with it. Right.

Me too.

Me too.

People, you know, they jump for what they viewed were greener pastures. I will tell you, the big talk in the HR industry right now across the board is, you know, the great boomerang of, you know, 20, 23. I can't tell you how many people have boomeranged back to Big Lots after leaving in the last two years going, wow, yeah, was. Was pretty good. And that extra, you know, two, $3,000 I got wasn't worth what that, you know, it wasn't worth the culture over there. So that's happening.

I have a big question about meaning because, you know, maybe, maybe it's small business and small thinking people sometimes, and me being one of those that I feel like, I don't like to hire people back when they leave me like that. Is that my pride getting in the way? I mean, tell us the correct way to handle that. When an employee comes back and wants.

Their job back, you know, it's one of those things. And I think the title of my presentation, it talks about there's no magic wand, silver bullet, or fairy dust that's ever going to work for everyone. It's situational. I don't know if it's your pride. It all depends on how they leave, right? If you know they're a turd when they walk out the door and they burn a bridge, I wouldn't want them back either. But if they leave the right way and when they come back, they are truly sincere in, you know what? I messed up. I'll give you a second chance.

Yeah, but, you know, it seems like during the great Resignation that people left so quickly and did burn bridges. Did y' all see that at Big Lots?

We did. We did. It was almost like this crazy epidemic that happened. And, you know, not to talk about pandemic, but this big epidemic of people just started talking to friends. Well, I just left. I just left. Okay, well, don't expect to come back, right? So I don't know if people just lost their minds because they were cooped up for two years and didn't think that behavior mattered, but it really does. It really does matter. And how you come in and how you work and how you leave are all equally important when it comes to employment because you get a reputation. You guys know. Your industry, I'm sure, is as small as our industry.

People talking.

Yeah.

Yeah, for sure.

People know people. So what's your brand? I always tell, you know, I talk to a lot of college students, and I'm like, you have to protect your brand. How you come on board, how you work, and how you leave are all equally important because industries and towns are very, very small.

Yeah.

You know what's interesting is I always like to have them come back, Luke. But I just make sure that I stick something in there to really get them. Like. Like, I pay them less or I take away some sort of a benefit or something just to make sure they know. No, you know what's so interesting is it's like. It's like we don't remember that. Like, oh, yeah, you left with no notice or you left with like. Like you're talking about your brand. It's like you just don't. Nobody remembers who got their house foreclosed on in 2008 because everyone was doing it right. It's like, wow, whatever. Like, we all quit, we all move, we all jumped ship and now we're all back. We're just going to act like nothing ever happened and just kind of keep moseying along.

Yeah. And that doesn't work. We all know that. I mean, it's again, your brand. We're going to remember how you left, especially if you're disrespectful.

Hey, everyone. And starting to break in. This is an awesome, awesome episode, Jeff. I'm getting so much out of it. We're talking about Buy Here, Pay Here United. Probably the keynote speaker here. And Julie is just wonderful. I do believe that you'll learn something when you come to Buy Here, Pay Here United. Just listen to her. I'd be willing to bet you will get you back, get you a hire a couple of people, right?

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, so make sure you're signed up by Here, Pay Here United. Registration is going on right now. So it's what? It's 499 for the first attendee and then 199 for each dealership attendee after that.

This is good. This is, in my opinion, very affordable. The most affordable thing you'll get in the, in the automotive space when it comes to registration. So.

Yeah, I heard Bellagio room.

Yeah, I mean, BHPH, united.com. i think, Julie, that can go both ways as well. Your brand as an employer matters a whole lot too. What, what are some of the things that Big Lots does to your brand itself is a good place to work and what can we, how can we do that in our own business?

Well, it's one of the things I'm going to talk about in my session out in Vegas is do you know who you are? That's the key thing. And we talk about the employee value proposition. You know, when you interview folks, it's not what that person can bring to your company, but why the heck would they want to work with you? So understanding yourself first is really the key. And at Big Lots, you know, we have some amazing perks for associates. I mean, you think about going into a Big Lots, we have everything from candy bars to sofas. You know, all, all the, the good stuff. Seasonal is our big thing. Every associate gets 20% off. Like that's, that's a hook in itself. Right. When you want to buy a new sofa or a mattress or something big, 20% off is a big deal. So those are some of the perks, benefits. But the biggest thing about Big Losses is culture. We are super nice. We are collaborative. We don't hire people who are mean. And you know, there's a book out there about a holes, right. We don't hire those folks. We don't. And if you are difficult to work with, you will not last at big lots of. Because we are super collaborative and people love it. We have videos of our associates talking about how they feel like family. And that's the culture we try to create. And that's the stickiness, the retention piece that's important to us.

Can I ask you about. In. Can I ask you about perks? So I continually battle when I'm doing a compensation plan or trying to build some sort of a pay structure and incentive. Is it your opinion that employees look at things like perks better than a bottom dollar amount or a pay. Because I look at it and I say, okay, I can either pay for your health insurance or I can give you an extra $3 an hour or I can either. You know, like, we do a gym membership for everyone, right. It's like $20 a month per employee. But for some reason that's like such a big deal. Like, what do you. What kind of advice would you have for us on those? Like, is it. Is it better to give them free candy bars and soda in the break room, or is it better to give them an extra dollar raise?

Yeah. And again, that goes back to people are messy. Everybody has something different they want and they value. And it's figuring that out. You know, I would say it's an and versus an or. You have to be competitive and pay. Right. Or you're not even gonna get people in the door. So you've gotta be competitive. You might not be the highest paid in that upper quartile. If you stick in the middle, you're probably good. Then it's the perks on top of that. Right. So in addition to being in that median pay range, what else? And it's really what I value. Right. So I know some competitors or some companies now are. Have their base wages and rates and benefits. Then they have like a menu you can choose from. So some people might want the gym membership. Right. Others might want something else. Right. So what is that out there that they want? Maybe they want membership too. I don't know. I can make like, where it's more. Yeah, that's interesting.

I've never heard. I've never heard that aspect of having menus when it comes to hiring. That's.

Yeah, like sort of a la carte benefit.

Yeah, that's it. That's interesting.

You got your steak dinner, right? But, you know, maybe I don't want French fries. I want, you know, know the asparagus.

So that's true, because I have a lot of employees. Like, I provide health insurance. Some of them don't care. They don't want it, they don't need it. They've got their own thing worked out. And other people are all about it. And same with the gym membership. Some people are all about it. Some people don't care at all. So, yeah, it would be interesting. It sounds really, really messy to manage and keep track of, but interesting concept.

Yeah, that's a downside you don't hear about. Yeah, that's the downside you don't hear about is the messiness on the back end. That's why it's a. It could be a simple menu of. Here's your three a la carte items.

Same. Same question on the. On the lines of, like, incentives or, like, special achievements, like, at big lots, do you guys have, like, if you're trying to reach a goal or some sort of a fun promotion or something, we battle, like, okay, if we get to a thousand reviews on Google, what are we going to do? Well, we could all go bowling. Oh, we could do a weekend in Vegas. We could do, you know, water slide, like. Or just cash.

Yeah.

Is that just it? Like. Cause that's always what it comes down to for me. Well, like, everyone doesn't want to take a day off and go bowling with us, so how do I battle? Like, just throwing cash at incentives and then being like, no, we need to all go bowling together to create a team, to be buddies, to, like, have a. A night out on the town with whoever wants to show up. Like, how do you reconcile that kind of stuff?

Yeah, it's an and versus an or. Right. So, you know, if you have a couple different things that you celebrate during the year, one is, you know, ask your team, what do you value? You want bowling? Do you want ax throwing? Do you want cash? Do you want. If we reach this gigantic milestone, do we all want to go out to or have a crab feast brought in? We. We just celebrated one of our DCs. I forget how many days of no accidents. Like, it was a mile. It was years. They brought in lobster and steak dinners for the entire DC crew.

So my argument is they would all always pick cash. Right. But is it better to force them to say no? Guys, this time we're doing lobster and steak dinner because it creates a thing. It creates an Event. It creates a togetherness. Is that. Yeah. That wrong?

I think it's up to you. Right? It's, It's. If that's what you value, do it. We just, My team celebrating. We just got through a large leadership development initiative and we're. I'm forcing them to go to happy hour. So we're, we're doing a team happy hour and some like it and, you know, so everybody enjoys it, but some would rather have cash. But I don't have that option of giving cash. Right. Like, I can't say, oh, payroll, can we pay everybody else, you know, extra hundred dollars, you know, a week for this? Now I can't do it. So we're going to have.

Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense because I'm kind of the same way. Could I give them cash? Yeah. But I can tell them I can't give them cash. So you can force them to do something. You know, we've heard for, you know, the last, I guess, maybe three or four or five years about how it's these, these younger people in the workplace don't act like us Gen Xers. You know, Jeff may not be a Gen Xer. He's a, he's a baby. But it, what do you, what does Big Lot see when it comes to hiring Millennials and zers and all these people who maybe don't like work as much? What, what, how is Big Lots of battling that? Because I know I'm battling hiring those folks.

Well, it's interesting. That's one of the big components I'm gonna be talking about in Vegas is what do these new Gen Z and Millennials want? And I'll give you one little tip. And I can't give everything away, but purpose, purpose is important to them. And what I mean by that is they want to feel like they're a part of something and that they're giving back. And so one of the things that Big Lots is known for is its philanthropy. So we have two paid days off a year to all associates to go volunteer and do something like that. So we are big into philanthropy, and that fills their purpose bucket. You know, if you're, if you're sitting in finance every day and putting numbers in a spreadsheet, I mean, you might feel a great sense of purpose and that I would rather stick a fork in my eye, but, you know, they're filled their cup up with maybe they're volunteering at the animal shelter or maybe they're doing, you know, pelotonia. We are big into philanthropy and that fills that purpose bucket. So from a Millennial and Gen Z, when you look at your dealerships, what do you do for your community? What are you offering them as part of that employee value proposition? Right. Why would you want to work for us? We are big at supporting, you know, education in our community. So when you join us, we go volunteer at the schools or we do this. So it's something to think about. Right. Because that will attract those younger generations.

And how do you. And I guess doing that over and over again makes them stay or is there anything special that that makes that group of, of individuals won't want to stick around to have a career?

Yeah, it's a cocktail. It's not just that. Right. And I'm not going to go too much in detail because I'll give it away, but there's a cocktail out there for the younger generation. They have four key things that they really, really want from an employer and it does make them feel a little more connected to their employer. So purpose is one. It's really important to them more than any other generation that's out there.

Speaking of BHPH, united.com and all the sponsors for that, Primalin is a sponsor of ours. Jeff Primalin is a, is one of the original organizers of the Buy Here, Pay Here, United and the Summit. Paxton has got a, a speech or talk when he's out there in Vegas on Monday. Primaland helps dealers. They've been helping dealers for years. And it's not just about loaning them money. It's about getting everything straight so they can get to a finance company. Because a lot of people grow so fast they don't know what's going on.

Right? Yeah. And it's part of also like when you come to these things, you're able to have those conversations one on one with the guys. I know that fellows at Primal and will talk to anyone. They will, they will chat your ear off all weekend long and tell you and advise you on everything you need to know to make sure you get your financials in line now. So that if you do need capital or if you do want to buy the land that you're building sits on, you can go to a company like them and have your ducks in a row make the process quicker, easier, simple for sure. Back to the episode. So it's interesting when you say purpose, I always thought that in purpose, like it had to be internal to my company. Like I had to somehow convince them that us selling vehicles is some sort of a greater calling and purpose. And you're. You're helping people be mobile. Right. And I don't know, in Big Lots, it's like, hey, you're selling overstocked lawn furniture. That is. Go get them. We're saving the world.

Right?

You know, like, no, but you say there can be external purposes, like, hey, we sell cars, but we also support these charities on our days off or on our paid days off. So maybe the purpose inside the dealership is not really your passion, and you can't get all excited and hot and bothered on selling, you know, 2001 Ford focuses to people. But you can get excited about the fact that we sponsor a, you know, a local kennel or a homeless shelter or something. That's kind of interesting that they would. They would stick with your company because of your connection to that charitable effort or their ability to support the charitable effort by working with you. That's interesting.

Yeah. I mean, cars and sofas, right? Like, who gets too excited about selling a brown sofa?

Yeah. So changing the world, you're not.

We're not changing the world one ground soap at a time. But we do, you know, a lot of our point of sale campaigns for, you know, American Cancer Society and some of those other things, those really get our associates excited. And we have contests to help them drive donations, and they feel excited when they can put their sticker up on the wall from the customer who just donated $2.

That's interesting. I agree, Jeff. That's. I've never thought about it the way. The way Big Lots is thinking about it.

Yeah. It's like, hey, our purpose is our purpose, but we have this external, you know, thing that we've latched onto that is. That is also ours in the. You know, Tell me this, Julie. So some of our friends or say there might be a dealer, like a Luke who's maybe kind of a little old and ornery and grouchy. Where does the. How does a guy like that create a culture? That is a massive coffee mug. Is that a Big Lots mug?

It's. It's Ohio University, and some days it's not big enough.

But, you know, if you're watching this on YouTube, so. But. But I get, like, the culture, right?

Like, oh, it's fun.

We're young, we're all having a great time, everyone loves each other, and we're this big, happy family. What if you have, like, grumpy Uncle Luke hanging out at the dealership and he can't create that anymore. He's not there anymore. Like, how do you get that kind of. Is it just, like catching lightning In a bottle. Like, you just have to have the right group of people at the right time to like, really enjoy coming to work.

You know, I, I think Luke and I would get along well. I'm, you know, can be grumpy some days. You know, it's really the. It's all about being dis. Genuine. Right, Right. So if I know Luke is grumpy, I'm just gonna accept Luke for grumpy. But it's up to the leadership team within the business to create that environment. Right. So it can't just be rest on the shoulders of one person or it's never gonna be sustainable. You might have your, you know, moments of brilliance, but it's. If you don't have a team there to sustain it, it's not gonna happen. So when I think of my team, I have some great managers on my team. And where I lack in the, you know, sometimes empathy and dealing with the younger generations, I have people who complement me on my team. And I think that's one of the biggest things, and we'll talk about this out in Vegas, is how do you create this team that's full of compliments that aren't all the same? Because I think about the strengths I bring to a team. That's very big picture. I can create a brilliant talent strategy, but I can't see obstacles to save my life. So I need to surround myself with people who can point out, hey, you're going to fall on your face here if you don't shore this up. So it's creating that team of compliments that makes a win. Team.

Julie, you must have read my text messages this morning. I come from the old school that you work. That's what you do. You come to work, you work, and you go home. I mean, that's. It's just the way it is. And, and I don't have much compassion for people that are. I mean, they just. People who don't have backbones and people who don't see the value in hard work and people who whine about things. I just. That doesn't work for me. So I sent a text this morning and luckily I've built this team that you're talking about, Julie, of, you know, people, my leadership team. And I sent a text to the leadership team that said, I'm done with X employee. I mean, I just said I'm done. And then I start getting pushback from the team.

Hold on.

You might be done, but you don't understand this person's situation, this, that and other. And if you are. If you live in an echo chamber, your employees don't stick around.

Right.

Right.

And so I got some pushback, and then I got some more pushback. So I guess I am not done with this employee.

But.

But, you know, it. It took me 20 minutes of talking to my employees, realized that I wasn't seeing. I wasn't seeing everything.

Yeah.

So important. So it. And it's hard to build that in. In small businesses. It's probably a lot easier to build that at Big Lots.

Right. You know it. Every team is small, though. So you think about Big Lots. We are a bunch of small businesses, bunch of small teams that come together, but those teams have to work together. So, you know, just like in just HR alone, I have one small segment of the human resources team at Big Lots. You know, there's our associate relations, there's comp and Benny's and. And those types of things. So every team has to work together. But then the leaders, like you said, your leadership team, my peers and I, we get along amazingly. So it does allow that opportunity for that different point of view. One of the most powerful questions. Because, Luke, I think we're like, I don't know, brother and sister from a different world, but I. The best question I've ever learned is help me understand. So when I have somebody who I'm at wit's end, unlike you, I'm done. The most powerful question that I would ask a leadership team or someone who may be working is help me understand why they are doing X or why this happened or because then you surface other things and if you. And you can't say it sarcastically, it's got to be genuine. Hey, help me understand. I really want to understand, you know, why this is going on. You'll get many more points of view which could tweak your.

That is. And that is such a powerful question in our business, even relating to our customers, because a lot of times we deal with customers who. They don't have perfect credit, they have bad credit. Right. And they make decisions that we cannot understand. And so all the dealers out there listen that are in the buy here, pay here. And you have a collector or multiple collectors on your staff. That is a question that your collector should be asking multiple times a day. Help me understand your situation. Help me understand how we can help you. I have short patience with employees when it comes to that. But I'm glad you brought that up because it's. You know, how many accounts have I saved, you know, in my 30 years by asking that question? It really Matters.

Yep. And employees are the same way. Right. They all have different situations. And so really just diving in a little bit to their situation can maybe have to change your point of view.

Yeah. I think it's interesting, Julie, when you say that, you know, the corporate level. Luke almost seems harder with teams because Julie doesn't always get to pick her peers. She doesn't get a pick. You know, she might because she's the one actually picking people to be there. But a lot of people in those corporate teams, like, you're just thrown together and it's like, you got to figure it out, you know? Whereas with Luke, like, Luke literally picks his team, like, yeah, if you decided you really didn't like that employee and you were done with them, you would say, hey, guys, appreciate your input. Please give them their two weeks, you know, notice like, or show them out the door at five o' clock today. Like, you can literally pick your team. So I think that's one thing that we need to remember, too, and I always say this when I interview potential hires, is we spend more time with each other than we do our own family. Right? We are. I'm literally interacting with, you know, my main office area almost more than I interact with my own kids, you know, because I'm there eight, nine, ten hours a day. So it's so important that you get along. It's so important that you have people that you enjoy being around, in my opinion. And I don't want to come to work, like, dreading an interaction with somebody, especially when I'm the boss, you know, like, I don't. I don't need to come to work and have to interact with this person on my team that is maybe annoying, awkward, odd, creepy, whatever it might be, you know, like, not functioning. Or I'm, like, frustrated with them. Like, just switch. And maybe that's my question, too, Julie. And we've said this before, and I've asked Luke, this is like, during that whole thing or even right now, our employees will leave us over a dollar an hour, right? They will literally no call, no show or text us and be like, hey, I'm out. Peace out. Later. I'm going to work over here for, like a dollar an hour. But what happens when we want to upgrade our talent? Like, what happens when we go like, hey, you know, you're a really great employee, but guess what? Susan here is even better. So you're out. Hey, just one more time. Buckeye Dealership Consulting. You guys know, title sponsor of our podcast and always behind the buy here, pay here. Industry and one of the key organizers of Buy Here, Pay Here United, where we're going to see Julie. So if you haven't already got your reinsurance, set up your side bsi, everything, you do it now. Come out to Buy Here, Pay Here United, sit down with the guys at Buckeye and make a game plan.

It's, it's about building wealth and it's about building that cushion for these rainy days that, that are ahead. Because our industry, we got a bunch of good stuff coming up. But let me tell you this. Rainy days do come. Having that cushion of your reinsurance money has helped all of us when we needed it.

We.

I had this discussion this morning, horrible. With our leadership team. And I said, why is it. Because I go for this person's job. I said, start advertising that job. And Julie, I'd like to hear how Big Lots does this because it's so poignant for me this morning. Why is it, why is it so bad that as an employer I start advertising jobs, but our employees can shop for jobs all day? How do you all deal with that at Big Lots?

You know, so going to. Let's go to the exit question. So the talent upgrading talent, we focus internally, right? We look, are they in the right job? First of all, right? We all have our strengths and what gives us energy. And if they're not performing at a peak, the question is, why not? Is it because their strengths are better somewhere else? You know, do you have them in sales and they should be in service, or do you have them in one role where they might do exceptionally well in another? That's the first place I look. Right. So is there another role within the organization that would help them excel? That superstar that you're talking about, Susie, right, Susie Superstar. Can she help train this person? You know, maybe give her energy because she gets now to mentor and train someone. And then you have a real conversation with. I'll make him up. Joe, right? Who is. Okay, but he's not lighting the world on fire.

It's always Joe.

Joe, right? Yeah, it is always Joe. So having that real conversation and seeing what he wants, going to. What was your other question? I'm sorry?

Advertising jobs.

Advertising.

An active, an active ad listing. When like your salesman sitting right there and you're posting the ad, they're like, you know, I can see that. You know, I see what jobs are available. And this, this guy just walked in and asked about the sales position and my salesman's right there. It's like, hey, boss, what sales positions open?

Yeah, yours.

Well, first of all, post and wait is not a strategy. Right. So posting a job and waiting. One of the ideal things that I would recommend I do this. We do this well at Big Lots is everybody is a recruiter. Like, everybody is a recruiter from your salesperson who goes to a soccer game and is talking with someone and they find someone, oh, this person might be great for this role or even in the future, keeping that person warm. Right? You might not have a role today, but you might have one in a month. So everyone is a recruiter, and that kind of avoids that awkwardness of posting and the person's still in their seat. Because if you have these warm conversations, you have them on the stove. It's easier to pull them off the burner and bring them in when you already have the relationship. So that's one of the things that we do really well, especially in our corporate environment and Big Lots. If we had an opening tomorrow for any type of role in hr, I know three or four people I could pick up a phone and call just because I know their work ethic. I know they fit in well with the company.

So. So I can't advertise a job. It's my city.

You can.

Yeah, I know, I know, I know.

It's. I just like to keep the ads up all the time, you know, like, you just, oh, oh, hey. Yeah, that's always up. Or hey, it's always. I don't know, it just seems like you're always kind of looking. Right?

I mean, and that's what Julia's talking about. Yeah. Always recruiting, always talking. I like that idea.

That's the one thing with having a job posting. Here's I'm going to pay like devil on your shoulder versus angel, you know, if I'm a candidate and I constantly see that you have ads up, you know, what's wrong with you?

Yeah, okay, that's.

It's an easy answer, right? Like, we always have it up because we're always looking for great talent because.

There'S always something wrong. What's wrong?

And that's the answer, too. We haven't found you yet, Susie, so you're the reason that we have to get your attention.

And Julie, that's, you know, it seems like with my team, when. When we do have those conversations about, hey, should we get rid of this person or not? And I. I tend to think that by the time we start having that conversation, we all know. Right. Every time we. We start that conversation, we end that conversation at some point by. By getting rid of that person. Hiring someone else, we always look back and go, wow, we should have done that sooner. I, I'm sure y' all experienced the same thing, correct? How do you get past that?

We implemented when I, I said, I've been at big loss, it'll be five years this summer. So when I joined, we started implementing more regular real performance feedback. Like not just the weekly. Hey, how you doing? You know, how, what's your goals, what obstacles you facing? We do that anyway. But we do quarterly check ins. And in your business, since it's a little more fast paced, you might want to do monthly. Right? So your weekly touch base once a month. Let's talk about performance. Let's talk about where I see you're doing well. Let's talk about where I need, you know, a little more development in this area or you're lagging behind. So it's really focused on performance. It's not just how you doing, you know, those types of things. And we have individual development plans. Every single employee at Big Lots is to have an individual development plan to work on something throughout the year. And in our quarterly conversations, that's when they update it. Hey, you were working on your presentation skills this last quarter. How you feeling? You ready to take that off and move on to something else or do you want to continue to work on it? So we have regular touch bases on performance and development, not just daily tactical stuff.

I think if anybody, if dealers take away anything, individual development plan sounds like just something that super easy to put together and talk to that, that person about because you know, you know, we're, we're small, mom and pops, a lot of us, we look how many cars they sell last month and that's about it, right? But saying, okay, you sold that many last month. This is where we need to get to, this is how we're going to do it. You've got to, you've got to do it and I've got to do it to get there. Probably a lot of us out there don't do that. And to set this in motion, I think something that would really, it's going to help, it's going to help my people, I promise you that.

And it doesn't have to be complicated, right? So if you have, if you use Outlook or any type of calendar and you have it scheduled in there, just write your notes in the calendar date so you can go back and reflect on it doesn't have to be really complicated, it just be simple, but something you can reflect back on.

So true. Julie, we've taken up way more time from you than I said we would. And I know you've got a big old coffee cup that's. You got to rebrew that gallon of. What kind of machine even produces that much coffee?

You'd be surprised. You give him a Big Lots.

I know it's a good place to buy one.

So real quick, I want to tell this antidote. Before we started. So my grandfather, he's been dead for. For a while now, but back in that. When did Big Lot start?

Back in the 60s and actually was automotive parts. And then it moved into more of the, you know, overstock and bargains and treasures. So.

So. So I think maybe in the early 80s. Mid 80s, probably. Early 80s, yeah. And so it started really, I think, growing, I guess then. And my grandfather was the king of buying things he didn't need.

Right.

And so we lived in this small, small town about 30 minutes north of Columbia, where I live now. And I remember as a kid going to Big Lots and thinking it was the greatest thing on the, you know, in the world because there's all these things we had never seen before. And it was really before Walmart had taken off and in our area anyway, so I just remember it's a good memories of every time I think of Big Lots now, I think of my grandfather and that's. It comes from that. Going to that store as a kid.

Well, that warms my heart because that's really what Big Lots is all about. Right? It's help people live big and save lots and then those bargains and treasures. Yeah. Every time you walk in, there's a different find like, oh, I didn't know I needed this, but I need this. This is awesome. So that's what we're all about. So thank you for sharing that because that truly is why we're here.

Good. Awesome, Julie, thank you. We look forward to seeing you in Vegas and what, like 60 days or something?

Yeah, I look forward to it.

Right. Take care, guys.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

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