Episode 045 - It's All About Risk

Do you feel that your business is just sucking up a lot of your time with repeat tasks that you wish you didn't have to do? And things like appointment reminders, email follow-ups, and all the other things in between, let alone that feeling that you may have leads falling through the cracks. I'm Shaun Whynacht, one of the hosts of this upcoming podcast and founder of Blue Cow Marketing. Both Jodi, my co-host, and I help clients overcome these challenges. We're both social media experts and certified KEEP professionals. Now, if you haven't heard of KEEP, it's an amazing tool that helps you and your business get organized. Follow up with your leads and clients effectively using email, text messaging, as well as a dedicated phone line so that you can keep your business and your personal calls easily defined. Now, we love automation and we love small business, and we want to help you. So we invite you to go to bluecowmarketing.ca/automate and book a consult with us. Now let's enjoy this episode. Yeah, let's be frank, you're dealing with humans and human behavior and reactions, you know, and for anyone to even come out and say, you know, we can, can market your business and do these 5 things and you will get this result. It was ludicrous to even think. Okay, here we are, episode number 45. We're going to be talking about risk. Now, business You know, if you're in business, it is a risk. You know, it's the unknown, and that's what we want to talk about is, you know, good risk, bad risk, you know, all kinds of risk. And Jodi, you came up with this topic, so I think you have a lot of risky questions to ask in this. I know nothing. Again, that seems to be our theme. I know nothing about what we're going to talk about until it actually happens.

Yeah, makes it way more entertaining that way.

It's a risk I take.

Okay, all right. Um, I think firstly, it's risk is about adapting, right? So when you think about taking risk, I think there's that kind of, um, assumption or negative association with it because, you know, it, what stops you is fear. And if you know how to adapt and you learn to adapt, or you're not afraid of adaptation, then that completely eliminates that fear.

For sure. You know, and if you've been in a traditional job, you know, a lot of times it's, it's trying to mitigate that risk or eliminate the risk or avoid risk and those type of things. But in a business, the only way you're going to grow is to take, you know, risk or risky decisions. And there's a difference between, I think, you know, taking, um, like risky decisions or taking risky chances that aren't calculated, where you don't know, you know, what's going to happen, uh, in a negative way. Right? It's, it's, you have to look at both sides that if this fails, then what's my backup plan?

Exactly. Yeah. And I mean, even just before you make a decision, you know, what good could come out of this versus what bad? And if the good outweighs the bad, then you take the risk, right? Like, it's, it really is a simple equation when it comes to that, you know. And if you don't have kind of a contingency plan in place, if you know, it does turn out to be, you know, the worst possible outcome, then you shouldn't really make that risk or take that risk either, right?

Yeah, and I mean, we do a lot of stuff with content, and I think that's where we're gonna really focus on is, you know, we're talking, not talking about, you know, should you start a business or shouldn't you? I mean, if you haven't even decided to start one and you're listening to this podcast, you're really ahead of the game with it. But, you know, a lot of times risk could be as easy as, you know, do I post a video or do I, you know, Do I start a podcast or do I, you know, take a position on a certain topic in a certain way? All those can be risks in different sizes, right? So, I mean, my question back to you is, you know, have you seen or taken any risks in your life in, you know, in the marketing side where you didn't know how it was going to turn out?

Yeah, definitely. I mean, every single idea that I have is, you know, for any client in terms of social. It's, you know, it's trial and error. It's risk. You know, some videos are going to flop and some posts that you don't really expect are, you know, turn out to have, you know, the most comments out of any post you've done. And you're like, okay, well, I'm going to keep going with this. So that risk was worth it. But the 500 other posts that I did that, you know, weren't that sweet spot weren't. And I think that that's just acceptance. And now it's is not even a thought in my mind, I guess, when I come up with a new idea like a contest for a client, which is something that I do often, and I've taken all kinds of different approaches based on the different industry and the context of the actual situation and what we want to accomplish out of it. And I think honestly marketing in general is just a trial and error You know, it's based on failure, I guess.

Yeah, let's be frank, you're dealing with humans and human behavior and reactions, you know, and for anyone to even come out and say, you know, we can, can market your business and do these 5 things and you will get this result, you know, is ludicrous to even think, right? I mean, people are always changing, you know, the market's always changing, you know, and what you even tried this month may not work in 4 months or 6 months, right? You just gotta keep trying. You know, you do those experiments, you know, in any type of even advertising. You know, we do what are called split tests. You know, we, we put out 3 or 4 things, and the one that performs the best, then we cut off the ones that aren't, and then we reiterate those ones that are doing best and try to improve on them, right? Each one is a risk. And, you know, I think the biggest learning that you can take from this is If you're going to do some kind of marketing for your business, which you should, you know, you need to be okay with losing sometimes, right? There's going to be some loss, some loss of time, some loss of revenue, or, you know, or money out of your business to just try it. But the more that you find out that doesn't work, the more you're left with the things that do work.

Exactly, yeah. And I mean, the more you know about your target market, or, you know, Even just, you know, ruling out one thing that doesn't work is progress and it is a step in the right direction, right? And I know it's really hard to have that mindset sometimes, but you know, where we're in marketing, that's the mindset we almost have to have, so we're used to it, but it's definitely harder said than done.

Yeah, that's what it is. Yeah, take a risk. Come on, just put it out there. It's easier said than done. Yeah, harder said than done.

I knew it wasn't right, but anyways, we got there eventually. But yeah, I want to kind of circle back to the experimenting part, because I think that's so important with any business, you know. I feel like that really is at the center of every business is just experimenting, you know. You present your clients or your customers with a solution to their problem, and you have to play around with that. The first solution isn't going to be the best one, you know, and Learning how to get it out, get your message out there, the marketing of your business. The first thing you come up with isn't going to be the best, you know, you just— and when you do find the best one, it's not going to stay the best one.

No.

You know, so your product and your services are constantly adapting and you have to constantly change them and kind of adapt them to the changing market and to your changing demographic. So it really is all about experimentation.

And I think one thing when you said like the best one, a lot of people will look at this as I'm going to try these 3 things and the best one is the best one. And I, I'm going to argue that point. It is not the best one. It is just better than those other 2. Right. So now you take that, that what you called the best one and you try to make 2 more that are better than that one. Right. So you're always trying to continually improve. Right. And that's something that I've tried over the years and there's been several times where it's just fall flat on its face, and it was a, you know, it was a risk, and, uh, you had to live with it.

Yeah, for sure. Now to get into the juicy questions.

Oh great.

So I, I just want to know, uh, from your perspective, perspective as an actual business owner, you know, what's the biggest risk you took that actually ended up with a negative outcome? And, you know, what did you plan for that? Did you know, um, you know, how to deal with it when, when it presented itself?

I mean, I'm fortunate enough to say that there hasn't been anything that's almost sunk in the business. There has been something that's taken the attention away from it, and it was several years ago, and there was a gentleman that worked for me. He was a good friend of mine. We were doing a lot of video stuff, and he had experience in the video transfer business, which means taking VHS or reel-to-reels and turning them on the DVDs. And he said, you know, when I worked for a company in Halifax, You know, this was big business for them, and it's pretty easy to do. So I thought, you know, here's an opportunity, let's take a risk, let's buy some equipment, let's promote this. It kind of falls in line with what we're doing with video production. You know, we, we went to a home show and put up a booth and everything, and, you know, a lot of initial interest, but the sales never came in from it. So in the end, I put a lot of focus and energy that I took away from the, the main core of the business, and in the end decided, okay, this is going to work, about a year into it, and said Okay, we're just gonna sell off the equipment and go back. So there was a loss of money and loss of time, but when I look back and think about it, it might not have been the idea of that part not working. It might have been that the approach I took to it might not have been the best, right? I could have, if I really wanted to spend more time, what I needed to do was have somebody dedicated to that, or somebody dedicated to keep the other side of the business going so I could focus on it. Right. So basically I just, I created a whole new business with the exact same amount of time that I had to run my other one.

Right, right. So what brought you to that final decision to kind of, you know, ditch that and kind of not look back?

Oh, I mean, it just came down to the amount of time it was taking for what it was coming out. It came down to the numbers. You know, we look at, you know, selling a video transfer for $20 and the amount of time for people to drop them off and then you transfer them and edit them and put them on a DVD and give them back to them, you know, to what the main core of the business was actually doing. And it wasn't that enjoyable, you know, in the end. It seemed like a natural, hey, here's a way to just grow the business into another division, but in the end I didn't have somebody that was passionate to continue it on. So that's what it came down to.

Right, so, you know, on top of the actual kind of numbers, you know, looking at is it, you know, numerically worth it, you know, when you look at the actual profit and what it's bringing in. But then there's also that aspect of, you know, is, is this making you happier? Is this, you know, what you view as success? Because it's not, you know, just as simple as am I making the most money? You know, it really does come down to what you enjoy as well.

Absolutely. You know, and just one that we're currently in right now has been, you know, getting back into doing webinars and online training and group training. We held our first webinar 2 weeks ago, after about over 2 years of me actually doing one, and I went into it knowing it was not going to be a success in the way that I wasn't going to get like 100 people, I wasn't getting like 10 new customers or anything from it. It was in the first round a way for me just to get back into the flow, test the systems, test the software. We had 6 people register, which was fine. I mean, if we had 1 person or even 0, I still would have went through the motions of doing it. And, you know, knowing that it was a way for me to get started. So it was a, you know, we're in the initial phase now. It's like, okay, what can we do next? And we're kind of changing the focus. So, you know, I know that if I was to like say, okay, green light, let's go, let's promote this, let's try to make clients, and we do at least 3 and we get nothing from it, then it's time to pull the plug and this isn't going to work, right? So that's the me looking at that risk of the amount of time and effort to put into it and say, okay, 3 goes and then I'm not going to do it anymore. Right.

Okay. So you consistently refer to yourself as an ideas guy, which is 100% true. You know, almost every day you have a new thing or a new idea coming and, you know, another opportunity to take a risk. So how do you kind of filter those out into like the ideas that actually are worth it and become tangible?

Well, I don't think I have an exact science or way of doing it. I've been getting better at at stopping myself in my tracks and trying to figure out, you know, should I pursue this? But I mean, up until probably about 2 years ago, you know, an idea will come to me in the middle of the day, and then the next thing I'm just off trying to build up that idea, right? And I'm just having that squirrel moment of jumping all over the place, right? Um, and now it's just looking at, you know, is this something that I could legitimately see somebody needing first? If that's a yes, then it's like, okay, well, is it something that they're willing to pay for?

Right.

Two, obviously we can't do it all for free. And then three, how much time is it actually going to take before we can get it to that point where somebody's willing to pay for it and it's going to give them a result from it? I think also in business is important for you to also have ideas that you want to do that are fun for you, that you're going to get the gratification out. And that's where there's certain things that I like to do every, every year or so that is, you know, not revenue generating, but it is enjoyment generating.

Yeah, I love that. Not revenue generating, but enjoyment. Yeah, right on. Now, to kind of flip the question over, what's a risk you took that, you know, you kind of had that weird gut feeling that, you know, it was a really good idea and then it paid off in the end?

Well, you know, not to say that I'm saying this because you're on the podcast, but for years I'd always wanted to hire somebody and I just, you know, I never really knew you know, how to fully take that, that leap with confidence. For one, it was, you know, is the person going to, you know, be a fit for the role? You know, are— what's their motivation? You know, I tried to put out ads before in years past, and, you know, I'd get people from, you know, an hour away who wanted to work, you know, fully remotely, but they only wanted to do one aspect of it, or they— you could tell it was just a stepping stone. So you know, that risk of how much time do I put into this person and then have them like leave and go to something else, right? And then you're back to square one. So, um, you know, when I decided to hire you, it was mainly— I wasn't looking for that first. I was looking for an intern, um, as a part of a program. And then you said you were looking for employment, and then I started to look at programs. And the next thing was, could I afford it? And that was the biggest thing, um, in that. And knowing to go into it that it's never going to be, you know, revenue positive, you know, in the first several months to even a year. There is— it's an investment into that person before you can get them to that stage. But I was lucky enough to qualify you for a program that covered a small percentage of your wage, which was a help. And I took that leap. And to be honest, when I made that decision that yes, you know, there was a point of like, I hope this is going to work, right? Like, I hope that this is a good fit. And to date, I mean, it's been a great fit. So, you know, that was a risk that has paid off. I felt a lot less stress off of my back in certain areas. It allows me to focus on other stuff in the business, which again brings more stress in that area, but still it's stress that I enjoy. Right.

Well, I'm glad to know that I have been the biggest reward of the company. Might go to my head a bit, but. All right, well, that was pretty much everything that I wanted to touch on about risk. Did you have anything else?

I think just listening to this episode is, you know, obviously you're probably in business and a lot of times people will overanalyze, you know, the risk of what they want to do. So let's just take, you know, starting a podcast because that's really kind of something that we're top of mind at the moment. But, you know, I hear people say, I should really should do a podcast. I really should do it. And, you know, I don't know where to start. I don't want equipment and I don't know. You know, who I should interview or what kind of format and stuff. And I'm just like, you know, just do it. Like, take out your phone, hit the, the audio app and record something, get yourself down and get it out there. You know, you're searching for perfection is never going to get you to start, right? And we call it like analysis paralysis is the fact that you overanalyze so much that you, you can't make a decision to move forward. And the second kind of point is Strategic Coach was a great program in the US. I had a client who was very much an ideas guy. He's in the financial industry in Ontario, and he always come up with these ideas. And he went through that program, and they implemented something called an impact filter. Anytime he has a new idea for the business or direction, he has to fill this out, like what's the benefits, what's the negative, this. And then it goes to the whole team, and they all have to sign off on this, right? So they all can say, oh no, this is going to impact me negatively or positively, and then they make that decision based off of that. So, right, you can't just like jump right away. You've got to have something in place, right? Um, so if you have another team member or an advisor, you know what, run the ideas across, you know, in front of them would be helpful.

Yeah, for sure. And I mean, you know, I've always been a big believer in teamwork because, you know, the more minds you have, the more, um, opposite opinions, the, you know, more unique and probably beneficial the outcome is going to be, right?

So yeah, and one last thing just popped in my head too is it's not necessarily always decisions for you to do new things in your business. Taking on certain clients may be a risk, right? So understanding what are those red flags with those, those potential people that you're, you're, you know, doing consults with where you're like, okay, if we brought them on, that would be a negative impact to how we work. So that's a risk, um, and just making those decisions very quickly. Let's say you're not a fit, let's move on.

Right, yeah, for sure.