#256: PR on a Budget for Authors with Saundra Dalton-Smith

Welcome to Kingdom Writers, where we help equip and empower Christian writers of all genres to share your unique gifts with the world. We're your hosts, C.J. and Shelley Hitz.

This podcast is filled with spiritual encouragement as well as prayers to help you overcome the resistance you face as a writer. Your story matters.

Welcome, everyone. We're so excited to have you here today. And we have a very special guest with us, Sandra Dalton Smith. And she's a medical doctor, but also an author. How many books do you have now?

Three. Three that are three books.

Probably, I think one of your most popular is Sacred Rest. But she has really done amazing things as an author through her own publicity, and we have been friends for years. We got connected with a Christian writer group years ago, and it's just been so fun to watch her journey. She now also helps authors and has some courses and masterminds, but we're just so excited to have you. Welcome, Sandra.

Thanks, Shirley and C.J. yeah, this has been to say that this is not what I expected I would be doing at this season in my life, you know, 20 years after practicing traditional internal medicine. I just really. I love it. I love helping people get their word out. I remember what it was like, you know, when you and I kind of first started kind of searching for that community and then kind of feeling like you found your people and then actually being able to kind of see those next steps, to really start seeing some growth. It is just amazing.

Yeah, yeah, go ahead. So we're just going to be talking about a little bit about PR on a budget for authors, and I know a lot of our members and those that are going to be tuning in on the podcast, you know, they do have a limited budget. Right. For marketing. And we would just love for you to share. Like, first of all, how did you even start. Start to get into this whole area of publicity and share a little bit of your own success before you dive into some training?

Yeah, absolutely. Well, you know, with my first book, My first book, all of my books have been traditionally published, but my first book, when it came out, you know, and they started talking about, oh, you have a publicist with the publishing house, and they're going to set you up some interviews. You know, I had no idea kind of what to expect. I just kind of was like, okay, they're going to set them up, I'm going to show up, I'm going to talk, and that's going to be the end of it. And a lot of books will be sold, and that just isn't the case, you can go on a million radio, tv, podcast and still not sell a book because you haven't thought through the process of how to keep that reader engaged, how to continue that relationship with them. And so it took that entire time of pitching and trying to, you know, really figure out the dynamics of how to successfully use priority for me to even start thinking about what am I doing wrong here. I've gone on, you know, like 20, 30 interviews, and I don't see any, any change. I don't see anything coming from it. And I think that's why so many authors give up on pr. They think that it's not beneficial, that it's not going to help build their platform. They look at it oftentimes as more of a pride thing that, oh, I don't really have to be in the public eye, or I don't really have to get on TV or radio or any of those things. I'm good just writing my book. And. And I don't think many of, many of us see it as what I call it, as marketing evangelism. You can only reach the people that you get in front of. So if you have a great message that God has given you to share, but then you're only going to share it with your friends and your co workers and the people that are within your immediate platform, it's only going to go so far. But if you want it to go further, you need to be in front of those people in some way for them to be able to know your book even exists. And that was the very first thing, kind of changing my whole mindset. And for me, once I changed my mindset and I started taking kind of ownership of, okay, I've got to at least send an email, ask somebody if they'd like to have me on their podcast, be more intentional about actually having a lead magnet and getting people on my email list. Once I started doing that, the results were phenomenal. My last book, the Sacred Rest that you mentioned, the traditional publishing contract was five times the amount of what my first book was because I'd started the process of building my platform and getting in front of more people with this book. My email list has grown by over 30,000 just with that one book, just by getting out the message and having a lead magnet and being able to get people connected with me in some way. So even if they don't buy the book, we're connected. And then I can continue to send them things through my email so that if that at some point what I'm Offering is what they need, then it's in front of them. So to me, that's really what the platform is all about. It's just about being able to reach more people for Jesus and being able to do that more effectively. When I really combine my efforts with that of people who already have large platforms, which are the podcasters, the news people, all of these different media, they have the platform, they have the audience. And so if you have a message that he's given you to share, why not connect with them?

Yeah, I think. I don't know if you'd agree with this, but.

There might be this misconception that those who are traditionally published just have this nice easy road where everything just works out, their platform magically grows. That probably isn't the case, is it? That whether you're self published.

Or traditionally published, you have to do some legwork in terms of building that platform either way, correct?

Absolutely. And I'll give you this example. Like I mentioned, my first publisher actually helped me get media. They booked 20 plus, you know, interviews. I didn't know how to convert it. They didn't teach me how to convert those interviews into people on my email list. All their job was, was just to get me the interviews. There was no training, there was no instruction. There was no guidance on really how to turn that into building my platform. My second publisher did a really good job with like, marketing on, like, social media, but did no interviews whatsoever. So if I wanted interviews, that all came to me. My third publisher, which I mentioned, gave me the largest amount of money to write. The book is one of the, what they call the big five publishers. And did not. Didn't solidify. Well, I take that back. They solidified one publicity opportunity. One. And they. And in my head I was thinking, you have just paid me a fortune to write this book and you get one. And that was with the publicist supposedly pitching thousands. And so every interview that I received was once I got myself with that book. And Shelley, you've seen it on the social media as I post kind of different things that I've done. I booked myself on over 100 interviews in one year myself, with no help from the publicist, because they weren't giving me any help. The very first year the book was out. They. I got one interview based on the publicist from the publishing house, no other interviews. And so at that point I was like, okay, this is ridiculous. If I want to get this book out, I'm going to have to actually be bold enough to send them myself to these podcasters or TV shows. And that's what I did. I started learning the trade. How do you write a good pitch? How do you pitch the publicist or a publisher?

Producer rather. How do you pitch a producer for a show and have them say yes? What is it that turns them off? What is it that gives you the yes? How do you then take that opportunity and get those people on your email list so that you can continue the conversation? So, absolutely. I don't care how big your publisher is, I don't care how much money they paid you, you have to end up going out and doing this work yourself. And if you're self published, traditionally published, hybrid publish, every author has to take responsibility for their own platform growth and their email list building. And honestly, their book sells.

Yeah, I love that. And I really like how you talked about marketing evangelism. So tell us just a little bit more or maybe even share a story or two of things you've seen God do as you like with butterflies in your stomach. Put yourself out there, you know, and doing the things you don't always want to do. Because a lot of authors just want to write, you know, and. But talking about. Talk a little bit more about that mindset shift, because I think a lot of us might need to hear that today.

Well, you know, that's the thing. I'm one who have always thought I don't really want to be in front of cameras. I speak and I do a lot of this stuff now because my mindset has kind of changed in what God can do, even if through your imperfections. And so I've always felt like, well, I don't really want to be on camera. You know, I'm not. I'm not one of those ladies who know how to do their makeup just, just right and their hair is like perfect every time they hit the stage. I don't do that. You know, I'm a doctor. I put on a white coat, no makeup, no nothing. I just walk out the door. So, you know, it's one of those things where I always felt like that's not who I am. And so if that's who I have to be on the camera, then I'm not going to feel comfortable doing it. And so really one of the things that helped me is when I started thinking about marketing evangelism, it stopped being so focused on me and I started thinking, what can I share doing this conversation so that the focus comes off me and onto the topic that I'm sharing. And then it opens the door for Holy spirit to do whatever it is Holy Spirit wants to do within that moment. And so the way that helped me is I started telling the vulnerable parts of my story about my own burnout, about my own. The relationships, problems that brought. The things that happened kind of in my past, that brought me to that place of feeling as if God wasn't trustworthy to be able to rest. So I had to keep burning myself at both ends to do it all. So I started sharing those vulnerable parts of my story, not worrying about if tears fell in the middle of a TV interview or I got the sniffles in the middle of a podcast. Just being real with people. And it's amazing how many women have will respond back to those imperfect interviews and say, I was bawling with you.

Now.

I was right there with you. I'm experiencing that right now. And I could tell you weren't just talking from your intellect. You weren't just talking from someone who has studied this and knew about it intellectually, but you've experienced it because it comes through and how you share it. And I love that because that's really what media is all about. You know, the people that you really connect with when you see them on TV or radio are the people who you feel like you're having just a regular conversation with them. You don't feel like they're coming off fake and phony. You know, they're all perfect. You can't relate to that person. None of us can, because none of us are really like that. You want people who can just truly be authentic.

Yeah, I agree. I think we're living in a culture and a world that does crave that authenticity, because we've seen that social media can very easily be paintbrushed. And, you know, you can always put forth your best foot, making sure every hair is in place, you know, before you take that picture in right by the waterfall that, you know, I mean, just this ecstasy, you know, and. And it really. I think that's part of why our culture begins to even get a little depressed, like, oh, I don't. I don't measure up to that picture, or, oh, man, I wish I was there. It's not really for real in a lot of ways. And I think what you're saying is, man, the authenticity is what draws people and allows them to hear your message in the first place. It gives them sort of an extra incentive because, quite frankly, it's different, you know, today.

Yeah, I think. I think it really. I think it really is. I think people can really understand and feel that when you're just, you're doing the best you can with what you've got. You're using what God's placed in your hand and you're not getting overly, you know, bent out of shape in if it doesn't look perfect.

Yeah. So now let's go into a few tips and I want you to kind of think back like if you were a first time author again, you know, with the knowledge that you have today, but you have no platform. You know, most of my followers have small platforms. They haven't really grown it as large yet. And so, you know, take us through just some of the. Your tips on what you would recommend for an unknown author with a small platform to do to really, you know, reach people to have that opportunity that marketing evangelism to get their message to more people, but also on a budget.

Yeah, yeah. Well, the very, you know, the very first thing I would sell every author is you have to have some idea of what it is that is at the core of what you're sharing. What part of Jesus are you sharing with the world? Because the thing is, we all. And who are you sharing it with? You know, the thing is we all want to share his heart, but what part of his heart are you sharing? Are you sharing the healing part? Are you sharing the teaching theological part? Are you sharing the loving part? You know, what part of his heart are you sharing? And then just to make sure that what you have in your website and what you present on your author Facebook page, not your personal page, you do what you want on that, but on your author Facebook page that it aligns with whatever that is. And it doesn't mean you have to kind of only write certain types of books, but look at kind of the core heart of what those books are about, because chances are they're reaching and touching a specific part of a either pain point or a hope or a dream, some part of someone they're touching and see if there's some commonality among the different things that you're writing and sharing so that you kind of get really clear about what it is you're sharing and then really get clear about who you're sharing it to. There's only one book that's for everybody and that's the Bible and none of us are rewriting it. So at this point, we have to be clear of who that audience is, because otherwise it's very hard to relate to someone when you don't know who you're relating to. So if I'm speaking and I'm speaking to A podcast that is specifically related to mom and all of my examples are about dads. I'm not going to have a good connection there because I'm not being very clear about who I'm talking to. No difference. When you're on a stage, if you're talking to a group of attorneys, you don't share medical stuff, it's not going to make any sense to them. So you have to just be really clear about your audience. And so that's the number one. And number two, the second thing is when you're trying to build your platform is to start thinking about how is how when someone first goes to your website, what is it you're asking them to do? Because if you're not asking them to do anything, if you're not directing them along some path on that page, then they're just going to get lost and click off people. You know, people are already mentally overloaded. They don't need to then be further mentally overloaded when they hit your website. So it's as much as we all say, oh, we hate those little pop ups that say join my email list, most of us still fill it out. If it's telling us that we're going to get something that we actually think would be beneficial so that, so have a lead magnet that your audience can't resist, that they would automatically say, absolutely, I want to have that. But because that's speaking to a direct pain point or hope or dream, and then when that happens, it pops up on your webpage, they want to fill it out. Now you're connected. Now you have someone that you can quickly get in contact with if you have a new book coming out or want to tell them about a new event that you're doing. Another thing is when you're applying to really be in the media, either it's to a podcast or a radio show or tv, when you're approaching that producer, you want to make sure that you are letting them know what you would share from your book. But you don't want to just talk about the book. Because if you just, if every other word is my book says, and in my book and my book this, they're not going to invite you on. Nobody wants to hear you talking about your book. People want to hear you sharing your testimony, your life experiences and what you've learned. And so rather than actually continuing to talk about the book in your pitch, you, you actually will get a better response if you specifically talk about your journey, what you learned and how you're going to share it. With their audience. And then at the closer you say, you know, you can put, I'm the author of such and such and such and such, where I talk about this in detail because the producers aren't stupid. They know you want to share about your book, but they also need to see that you are able to have a conversation with them, but without every other word being about the book.

Yeah, and I think that's, that's an important point. We want to say, okay, how can we serve our audience and yet also have calls to action? So my followers tend to be servers, so they want to help and serve, but you know, it's harder to put in those call to actions of like, you know, this is the next step, but it's also helping people. Right. I always say selling is helping because you're helping them to be able to apply. You're helping them to be able to go deeper with you if they sign up for your lead magnet, if they buy your book, if they, you know, do all of those things. And so, you know, you said when you wrote your first book, you got like 20 interviews, but none of them converted. So what is one of the things that you've learned that really helps when you do get those opportunities to help.

Them to convert that lead magnet? Having a way of connecting it during the interview. So, for example, if I'm doing an interview about my current book, Sacred Rest, so some point during the interview, I'll make the statement, and if you're curious about which of the seven types of rest you're deficient in, you can visit my website@restquiz.com to take the free assessment. Well, every time I do that, the number of people who visit the page and sign up to take the quiz shoots through the roof. Because now I have given them a very quick, easy to remember URL to go to take something that they want. They're listening to the interview, they're interested, fill out their email address. I get the email address on the other side of my mail server. They get their quiz results, which is what they want. And now I can send them an automated response where, you know, for the next three to five days or whatever, I'm sending them little tidbits of information that, to kind of help them in that process of understanding how to get more rest in the different areas. And so there's so many different ways to do that. A quiz is one way. Another way is if you have like a free checklist. I don't, you know, depending on what you're talking about, a free Checklist that maybe someone can use to help them be able to identify something. You can give the URL in the middle of the interview. And if there's never a time where it seems to come out kind of organically, most producers at the end will say, is there anything else you'd like to add? And you never say no.

And you'd be amazed how many people do that. No, I think I've said it all. This isn't an interview for a job, you know, you don't say, no, I've said it all. You come up with something to say and if nothing else, you say yes. You know what, I have this great resource on my website that they can get for free, but always they tend to ask ways that they can connect with you. And so you want to be able to give that lead magnet as much as possible.

Yeah, another thing I've been seeing a lot specifically with, say, shoe companies. You know, you go to their site and then right away they'll put that box up there and in exchange for your email, you get a code for 15% off your first order. And it's like they get me every time especially really interested because, well, if I sign up for their list, get the code, there's a chance that here, in another month they're going to send out another email that has a nice sale. Especially if it's a product that I'm, you know, I'm liking. So, yeah, it's giving your, your audience something tangible right away almost is just this nice way to give them a great feeling in the beginning and kind of earn some trust with them.

Yeah, and I think, like, as authors, you know, a lot of times we have these like, grand thoughts that, oh, if I just get on tv, if I just get this interview, if I just get this amount of eyes on my book or, you know, if I just get this and this, then I'll sell more books. But like you said, you can get the publicity. Like I remember, you know, I did an interview on CBN and it was just like nothing crickets afterwards, you know, and it was like it had a big reach and it was with a fairly large, you know, television company, but it didn't help me sell books. And so, you know, I think, you know, just first of all realizing that just getting the publicity isn't enough. It's also thinking through, like, how can I serve that person that's listening in a deeper way. It's all about the know, like, and trust. So if they get onto your email list, then like you said, you have that autoresponder sequence. You're not sitting at your computer sending out those emails, you know, every minute you have an automated. No, you have an automated response, and then you're. But they're getting to know you. And then how many people buy the book later on, you know? And I would say most people probably aren't buying it just directly from the interview, but probably, you know, even, you know, after they get on your email list. Do you have any statistics about that?

No, but I do believe that's true because, like, for the most part, you always have some people who automatically, for whatever reason, after an interview, if they really connected with it, they'll buy the book. So, you know, you can see how some particular interviews where, you know, you go to Amazon and you can see the little spike in the numbers and, you know, someone bought books. What I find actually is after an interview, it's like the 14 days after it is when I can kind of how really that particular interview hit, because they're getting the autoresponder, and I spread mine out over 10 days. So they get a couple of emails kind of up front. Then I wait a little bit, and they get another one. Then I wait a little bit, and they get the last one ten days later. And what I find is people have to see things a few times, and you have to. So the autoresponder, I don't say the same thing, you know, over and over again.

Right.

The first one, I'm kind of talking about just morning rituals to kind of get you feeling better in the morning if you're someone who's chronically tired. The next one I talk about how to integrate work in life. So two completely different things. You know, if you're a homeschool mom, the second one probably lost you all together because you're like, you know, I don't need that office information that you just gave me. The third one, I kind of redirect back to kind of more of a spiritual aspect of it. And so each one, I'm kind of talking specifically to a different audience. And depending on which one you kind of really associate with and you really kind of get, it would be the one where you decide, oh, I need to buy this. You know, so everybody has their different ways of receiving information.

Yeah.

And I think it's important in the autoresponder to kind of. To do that sometimes you may have to have one that has a video. Maybe the next one is just all writing. Maybe the next one is a podcast interview that you did. But kind of vary it up so that you're hitting all of your target market. And so they have plenty of touch points to decide if the book is right for them.

So when you're doing those emails from the very first one, when they get the results of their quiz to the follow up, are you putting a call to action to purchase your book in each of those or like, how do you, how do you personally do that?

There's a picture of the book with like a little link that to click to purchase on every one of them. But that's kind of like, you know, like on the sidebar, like there's a link, a picture of the book with that. At the bottom though, what I put is I put every type of lead magnet associated with that book. So it has the YouVersion 5 day YouVersion plan. It has one of my courses that I have related to it. So if somebody's really kind of, kind of intellectually brained like I am, and you're like, oh, I want to go deep in the science of it, which isn't half the world. You know, that's only a few people who want to do all of that. But I have kind of an in depth course that goes into kind of all of that part of it. And then I share a free 30 day challenge that they can do. So for 30 days they get like a little prompt. So these are all freebies. So I'm like, here, here's all the free goodies you can try. And that's why I feel as people and you can see those things getting clicked kind of as the days go on. But I think that's where the sales come from because they're continuing to get kind of all these freebies. And you know how it's like a taste and see, once you've tasted something enough at Sam's or Costco's and you're liking the flavor of it, you end up with that thing in your cart whether you like you forget I'm low carb. But why do I have this cheesecake in my car? Because you tasted it 10 times at Costco. Now you've like, you're bringing it home. I think the same thing happens with books.

Those samples get you every time.

Yeah.

So speaking of freebies, one of our members, Deborah, asks, would it make sense to have a free freebie offer for every book that you have? What would you say to that?

I do. I have a freebie for every book. Now the freebie can be, you know, like a, for sometimes, for particularly for fiction authors, it's like, well, what exactly am I gonna do? The freebie can be the first chapter. But this is why I don't particularly like the first chapter freebie, because you can get the first chapter on Amazon for free. So why sign up for your list if I can get it on Amazon for free, there's no need to. I just go to Amazon and take a look at it or wherever and take a look at it. So I always like, for fiction authors, when they're thinking about their freebie, if their book specifically is related to, like a cause or, you know, some kind of bigger picture, it's about abuse, it's about family relationships, whatever. To write up something completely individual, separate from it, where maybe they're giving kind of their tips on how their character worked through this family ordeal. So it's not in the book, but the character is someone who's dealing with abuse. And so they may kind of have this little side thing where they're talking in the voice of the character. So it kind of keeps the person drawn in, but they're sharing a part that never made it to the book. Now that would make me want to, because now I'm getting the author's writing style. I'm able to kind of taste a little bit of what the author's like. Plus I'm getting kind of the backstory of the book before I even buy the book. And so I like just kind of using some creative ideas. I mean, it doesn't have to be this big, long, drawn out thing. We were talking maybe a thousand words to get that across to somebody.

Yeah, yeah.

You see that with movies as well, where they'll have these extras.

Yeah.

Extra scenes they show you that, you know, never made it to the movie.

Yeah. And for those of you that are Christian Book Academy members in the platform module, I have a whole lesson on lead magnets and lots of ideas for both nonfiction and fiction. So definitely check that out. And I'm always, always encouraging authors to set one up. And they're always resisting it. Why do you think we resist it so much?

I think because we don't know what to do with it after we have it. I find a lot of authors say, well, what do I. I got it. Now what? I put it up on my website and nobody's coming to get it. And I always ask, have you shared it on your social media? Once a week on your social media, there should be at least one post where you direct someone back to one of your lead magnets. At least one. It's just a link. I mean, it's not like you're, you're asking for them to go buy something, you're trying to give them something to bless them. So you put your favorite quote up or your, your prayer or whatever it is you're going to be sharing on social media and you can put, hey, if you have, if you'd like a free, if you'd like my free gift prayer guide visit.

And so you're sharing it and so that keeps it out there. And then if other people share whatever it is that you posted on social media, they're sharing your lead magnet. So your platform is growing just because other people are helping you by sharing it. And then to make sure that you do occasionally put it in your newsletter when you send it out. And you know, if you have any media interviews to make sure that you mention it.

Yeah, yeah. And I think, you know, it's, it's so easy to feel overwhelmed by all the things. And just starting with one, like just what she said, like just, you know, schedule once a week, put a repeating reminder on your calendar, you know, share about my lead magnet. And you can do it in different ways. Share a story of something that you went through this week and then, you know, share that resource. And with, you know, with the link, I mean, there's so many different things, like you said a quote image, there's so many different ways that you can share that. But just taking a small action, just doing something on a consistent basis and not feeling like you have to do all the things. But you know, as we're kind of closing down the interview and that sort of thing. You also have like an in depth course that teaches authors how to be their own publicist, right?

Yes. I've had now over 100 authors that have gone through and it's just been amazing because I have one of the testimonials on there from Susan and she talks about how she's booked herself in the first couple of months and on over 29 different interviews. I mean, the thing is, it is so simple once you understand really how to approach the producers. Most of us, we just don't know how to package the pitch in such a way that the producers give us a yes. And then once you kind of orchestrate what that pitch should look like, you just copy and paste. You don't rewrite the pitch for every producer, you just copy and paste. There's some simple ways to actually find where to pitch. I think that's the other thing people are concerned with. You know, I'm not A publicist. So I don't. I won't know how to get in touch with these people. I booked myself on, you know, daystar. I mean, that's a major Christian network. And I got on all three of their different shows. So when they booked you, it wasn't like one time, one show, all three of their, their main shows on their network. I booked myself on Dr. Oz, which is a. As a Christian to a non Christian organization, through an email. I mean, I didn't have a publicist. I didn't have his phone number. It was through an email. I booked myself on Jamie Ivey. I mean, this. There's these huge shows that people are like, oh, I'll never be able to get on without having a $5,000 a month publicist on retainer. Just not true. I mean, we have to take the limits off of God. God wants to bless some of us so beyond anything our mind could ever imagine, but we are still in this little box of what we can do and what he can do through us. And so I say ask. Ask big. You know, that's all a pitch is. It's just an ask, ask, and then let God give you the answer. You know, sometimes it's a yes, sometimes it's a no, sometimes it's a pitch again in a year. Because some of those biggest shows were pitches that I did a year later. First I got a no. I felt like, okay, I still want to be on that show. I'm going to ask again. And you just put yourself out there. Don't fear rejection, fear not asking.

Yeah, you know, it's that sort of that persistence, but also that idea that it never hurts to ask. And I'm not afraid of a no. You just keep coming back, like you said, with that persistence. And it's kind of like that gal that kept knocking on the door, you know, in the middle of the night, you know, she eventually got what she wanted. But I had one more question for you. Just myself. Shelly might have more, but specifically, you know, you had, you've mentioned this, you had quite a few speaking engagements lined up in person ones all through this last six months, and many of those, most of those canceled. What would you say, though.

Now that you can look back would be one positive that you've seen that has impacted your. Your ministry in business, you know, even in the midst of this Covid season that we've been in.

Oh, God's just blown my mind in the midst of COVID This has probably been my best year as an author, and I haven't published a book this year. Well, I take that back. I did two compilations with guidebooks I shouldn't say that wasn't publishing, but I haven't published directly a book myself this year. The entire year has been focusing really on letting God just show me other ways outside of what my preconceived notions were of how this year would go. And, you know, I started off with these specific, oh, I want to have this happen this year and this happen. I want this many speaking engagements. And this and all of that, you know, went out the window in March and every speaking event got moved to 2021, and everything changed. But then what I found was when I was then was forced into. Well, now I have to look at virtual speaking and doing everything that I was doing before virtually. It's like the. It's like the floodgates flew open. Interviews in like, in countries I've never even heard of, can't even pronounce that are asking me to speak that I would automatically would have had to say no to because I can't fly there with my kids in high school and meeting their mom here. But now I can do those international talks that I would have never been able to do. So, you know, it's just. It's one of those things where you just have to stay flexible and have to stay open and have to stay grateful even if everything dries up. Stay grateful that if it's all drying up, is making room for something else. Because that's what happened. That is what happened for me in 2020. Everything dried up. And I had a morning period because everything dried up. And I'm like, God, I don't know what you're doing, but I'm going to have to trust that you're doing something good behind the scenes. And then it was like somebody just opened the gates and the flood spirit flew in there. And so, you know, this. Just stay. Stay in a place of trusting. Even if you can't figure out what he's doing in the moment, sometimes that that lull in between is the rest. Before it really gets. Gets big and overwhelming, before he really kind of opens it up to all that he has for you.

Yeah, it's amazing when we're put in these positions of not having things work out the way we expected to see other things come into the picture that blow our minds like that, that God does. You know, it's just amazing. He never leaves us hanging. He never. He doesn't just sit there and say, well, you know, those are dried up. Have Fun. I mean, he gives us other options and alternatives, and he never lets his kids down. It may not be exactly what we were expecting. We may have a questioning period, but there can. Can be a positive in the midst of a struggle as well. That's great.

Absolutely.

Yeah. And so those of you that are here live, if you have any other questions for Sandra, just post them in the comments. But I have been, you know, through her course on how to be your own publicist, and I definitely recommend it. I'm actually an affiliate for her, so you can also check that out@trainingauthors.com publicist but while we wait, just to see if there's any other questions that come through, do you have. Is there anything else just, like, burning on your heart that you feel like you want to say to the authors listening right now?

I would just say get out there. There's so much opportunity, particularly with podcast and honestly, with virtual speaking, because so many of us were kind of. Especially if you're. If you're considering yourself an introvert and you don't really like being in front of audiences or people. What I find is that, you know, with podcasting, for the most part, no one sees you except for whoever's interviewing you, so no one really sees you. So it's a great time to kind of practice getting comfortable doing interviews and speaking. And so start small. And if you've never done it before and you're like, well, I don't even know. I have no media training. I don't really know how I'm going to do an interview. Start with a small podcast because it gets you a chance to kind of get your feet wet and get comfortable with answering questions. Come up with a list of questions so you can provide that to them so you don't get surprised. There's just a lot of ways of making it so that you don't let fear and insecurity hold you back, but you allow yourself to keep growing in the process and. And really reaching more people with the message God's given you.

Yeah, Deborah says, I really needed to hear this. I think sometimes we wait on God without putting feet to it.

So true.

And like my friend Shay says, that God can't direct a parked car. Right. Sometimes we have to take a step. We have to start getting out there, do the things, and then God will begin to direct us and begin to open doors. And yet sometimes we're just sitting in our chair, like, waiting for the heavens to open. Right?

Yes.

And I love that you mentioned Shay because. Yeah, I'VE been on her podcast recently sharing a little bit about my story. But one of the things that I wanted to make sure I say because I don't really know what all your different authors write about, but the world is looking for Christians to step up and actually bring biblical answers to the world. My book is very overtly Christian. I mean, by chapter three, I'm talking about Jesus. I'm talking about science and research and medicine, medicine and all of that. But I'm still a Christian and I'm sharing my faith. I even say in one part of it that to not talk about him would be inauthentic and that would stress me out. So I'm going to talk about him in this book. I'm talking about having a no stress life. And so I think it's important to realize that just because your book is a Christian book doesn't mean it doesn't have, it doesn't have biblical truths that the world needs and can recognize that they need. I got invited to be on TEDx. TEDx is a very non Christian organization and they specifically wanted me to talk about my Christian book. That doesn't make sense. But they needed the answers on how to rest better. And so they, they were okay with the fact that it said Jesus even though it states that most of my virtual speaking is with corporations, including corporations in the Middle East. Now think about that. My last corporation I spoke with, they had the, I don't even know what it's called. The ladies. All, you know, all their heads were covered up. I mean, they were speaking languages I couldn't even speak, but they spoke English and they wanted to hear what I had to say about this resting. So if God's given you a message and giving you answers that the world needs, don't feel like you're limited just because your book's a Christian book with a Christian publisher or that it's self published in a Christian book. People need answers. And right now the world's desperate for answers that make sense for truth. So get out there. Get out there and let God use you.

Yeah.

Amen.

So Lana does have a question and she just says how effective is a blog post then shared to social media for book sales?

Depends on what exactly the blog post is sharing. Because the thing is, with a blog post, it has to be very powerful and or it needs to have extraordinarily great graphics that draw people to wanting to reshare it to other people. So I've seen that successfully done with someone who had blog posts, but they had like, really great Pinterest type pictures and Instagram kind of pictures. And so they shared like, what's her name? Ann Voskamp. I mean, that's what she did. Her blog posts are like visual art is what it looks like. And so because they're able to share the artistic part of the blog, that is what gets reshared oftentimes. And then people read because they're drawn to the artistic side of it. So I think it can be done, but it just kind of has to be tweaked a little bit.

And then again, you have to think through the strategy of how to incorporate your free offer, your lead magnet into that blog post in a way that makes people want to sign up so that you have chances to follow up with them.

So true.

Yeah. And one more question. Just how to integrate the reverse of what you just shared. So a regular not Christian book, but to share Jesus as you're given opportunities with your non Christian book. Does that make sense?

So the book is a non Christian book, but you're a Christian.

Yeah, yeah.

Christian in the writing, but I see.

So, yeah, so that's when it's a great opportunity to, to like pitch a Christian podcast, a Christian TV show, radio show. And when you're pitching it, you share your testimony, you share the Christian aspect of that within the pitch. And then you put, and I'm the author of xyz, whatever the name of the book is. And so I would assume that some way your faith tied into the book, even if you're not talking about your faith in the book, and so you're still able to discuss the topic and without having to make them feel like the book is going to give them Bible verses every time you're sharing the information without having to necessarily feel like the book has to have all of that.

Yeah. And so like she said, not limiting yourself if you wrote a Christian book to just Christian audiences and not limiting yourself if you have a non Christian book, a secular, you know, just secular audiences, that there's ways to connect with both and to really just allow God to be leading you and guiding you in who to pitch to, you know, and. And really, even the lead magnet, because that's a really key part of it. That's the really key piece, you know, of that strategy and know that it's a marathon and not a sprint.

So true. So true. And it does. That's so true. Because, you know, the book sales have been fantastic, but it wasn't like a million books sold in one day. It's like you get a little burst here, then you have a lull, then you have a little burst here, then you have a lull, and then you have kind of a. What I call. It's. What is it called? Kind of the peak. You, all of a sudden you have like this. What happened? All of a sudden there's a whole bunch of books selling, and I didn't really do anything. I think you have to understand, you have to just kind of keep building layer upon layer and just let it kind of keep building as you go and not thinking about, I got to get all these cells and the pre sales, and if I don't get that, then my book's a loser. No, your book's out there for life. So keep. So keep marketing it for life. Keep, Keep sharing that lead magnet related to your book that was 10 years old. Because somebody still needs that word. Just because you wrote it 10 years ago doesn't mean it's irrelevant now.

Well, and you know, we live in a world right now where if certain of certain person that has this gargantuan following gets a hold of your book, somehow reads it, is impacted, it's nothing for them just to throw something out there in their Instagram or their Twitter or their Facebook. And you had no idea. That's where you look at your sales and be like, whoa, somebody just, you know, like, we just had, you know, 5,000 sales, you know, in the matter of a week, you know, or whatever it might be, all because one person that you have no idea shared something. Now they might tag you, but if they don't, that that's just the kind of world we live in.

So true.

I'm a believer. We could be praying for those people to get a hold of our books somehow, some way, because that helps promote our books better than it. Than we could ever promote those books.

I think that's a great prayer. And I think that's a prayer that most of us are probably afraid to pray because then if it blows up, am I ready for the expansion, am I ready for whatever that next thing God might throw me into? But I think that's a prayer we should be praying.

We've actually talked about that ourselves. We actually will look at each other and say, how popular do we really want to be? Or do we just want to be stealth bombers, you know, under the radar?

Well, and it's also a mindset thing, like you said, like, you know, sometimes we limit ourselves because we're uncertain of what that, you know, could bring. And yet God is able to do immeasurably more than we can even think or imagine. Ephesians 3:20 is one of my favorite verses. And last month we got a royalty report from IngramSpark. I don't really see sell that many books on IngramSpark. We usually sell through KDP and it was like a thousand extra books than normal. I know. It's like. And I was like, is there any way for me to figure out where these sales came from? And there really isn't. And I was just like. I'm like, where? I wonder what happened, But God knows. And we just pray that those books bless people. It's the broken crayonstool color book. And, you know, it's just, you know, that's the thing too. Just being obedient to write the books that God has given you to write. You know that he will. He's the best publicist. Really?

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I totally agree with that. Yeah.

So as we begin to close, I definitely want you guys to connect with Sandra. Check out her website. You can go to trainingauthors.com publicist. You can take her quiz restquiz.com see her process of how all that works out. But, Sandra, would you just be willing to pray for us and the authors that are listening right now?

Absolutely. Father, I just thank you that you have called us to this time to be able to take words of hope, of healing, of advancement, words of encouragement out into the world. And I pray God, that you would just make us bold proclaimers of your love and of your truth, that you will take away any fear, that you will take away any insecurity, that you will take away anything that is, any strongholds that have been holding us back from fully resting within your ability to do exceedingly and abundantly above all we could ever ask or think. I thank you for CJ and Shelly and I thank you for the work that they do. I thank you for the authors that have come up under them, for the way that they have led and the way that they are taking publishing into the hands of authors and letting them be able to get these words out into the world. And I just pray for every author that is associated with them, God, that you will continue to open up their ability to see beyond, to see beyond whatever they have seen as their stopping point, to see beyond whatever they've seen as their success, to see beyond anything, any preconceived notions of what you could do in this time and with their life, and allow us to be able to go into the deeper waters with you, Father. Right now, as I'm saying this, what comes to mind is the water, the river flowing from the temple. And they started off ankle deep and then knee deep and then waist deep, and then they were so deep, all they could do was swim. God, we want to be the authors that all we can do is swim. In the grace of your blessings on our writings and being able to go into the deep waters and the deep hearts of those who are in need of the messages that we have and to be able to understand that it's not for us, but for your glory and that you're able to use it in ways that we would never understand. And if we're able to do that in any way, whether that's through our writing, our blog posts, our social media, whether that's through podcasting, whether that's through interviews, whether that's through one on one, just talking with people, Father, show us the way and show us how to do that in a way that we are able to get into the deep water with you unafraid. In Jesus name we pray. Amen.

Amen.

Deb says, this has been great. Thank you. Margaret says, thank you for your time, information, encouragement and sharing. So thank you so much for being here and just sharing that encouragement. And I think it is just so easy as authors to get discouraged, right?

Oh yeah.

To be isolated or to feel like, oh, I put all this hard work into this book. Is anyone ever going to read it or see it? And so I just thank you for your encouragement. And again, I encourage all of you to check out her course, Be youe own publicist@trainingauthors.com publicist. Check out her lead magnet@rustquiz.com that she has put together. And I always say success leaves clues. So.

You know, and maybe you can also benefit from what she's offering in that as well. So thank you so much, Sandra. We appreciate.

Thank you guys.

Blessings.

It's been a pleasure.

Blessings for everything that you're doing.

Thank you. You guys take care.

You too.

Thanks.

Thank you for listening to this episode of Kingdom Writers. We believe that you as a Christian writer, have a specific role to play in the Kingdom of Heaven to impact lives for eternity.

And because of this, we choose to pour out our lives into encouraging writers like you to not only tell your stories, but to take the courageous step of self publishing your stories in books that will outlive you and leave behind a powerful legacy. This podcast is sponsored by Christian Book Academy where we help you give birth to to your books. We invite you to join our community of Kingdom writers.