39 - EP39 w/ Brother Jrey and Paul: Expansion of the Mind, Body and Soul, Secrets to Muscle Mass + Acknowledgement of Your Death

Yo, my man.

What is up, Sol Brah?

Hey, boys.

Dude, it is about damn time.

I feel that.

How are you, brother?

Good. It's a beautiful day.

We're both located in the Jersey Shore, New Jersey right now. Paul actually flew out from Oregon to spend like, what, like 18 days out here?

Yeah, something like that.

Yeah, so we've just been getting to know each other before our launch, which is starting to become kind of public on Twitter. And we've just had beautiful weather out here. Workouts have been ridiculous.

Just enjoying the simple things in life. It's been a blast.

Being a few—

The only things in life, right?

Amen.

You can enjoy the simple things. Everything else doesn't fucking matter, really.

It really doesn't. It really doesn't.

That's what I love about both you guys, really. I'm assuming, obviously, because you're working together, you have the same mindset about life and everything. And I really resonate with that as well, I think.

Oh man, dude, we've been so excited to get on this podcast. I know I've flaked a few times, but it's about time. Um, yeah, I mean, honestly, yeah, man. I mean, I'll keep it very real. When I first made my Twitter account, it was because I discovered your page, and I recognized for the first time, I was like, holy shit, I'm not the only person who thinks this way. I'm not the only person trying to sort of like just do something different than the average Joe. Um, yeah, and I, I don't always love this word, but just, just trying to bring something wholesome to the world. Yeah. So honestly, I saw your page, I thought it was so cool, and then I, I made mine. And then after enough time of sharing what I think about, managed to connect with homie Paul. And of course, very much like-minded and really just excited to be working with somebody who shares the same vision because as you know, Sol Brah, it is rare these days. It really is.

Yeah, I think it's rare, but it's also, I think, our role to cultivate that within other people who maybe it's just— it's rare because they have never been exposed to it. It, or they just haven't had that part of them, um, exposed to it. And the ideas that then kind of settle into their head, oh, there's a different way of doing things, or hang on, why do I do that that way? And, you know, I wouldn't have these ideas if I hadn't been exposed to them through, you know, some other people in my life or the books that I've read. So I think it's also we have the capacity to bring that out of people. Not that, you know, I'm a super legend that is a guru or whatever, but just like me telling people that, you know, there is this other option of life. You don't have to live in the kind of perpetual anger, sadness, stress, and, you know, that whole place of letting go in your mind. So if you could talk about that journey for yourself and then how did you first get into it? Because I know you've had a turbulent kind of progression through that, as we all have, as we come to terms and wrestle with that kind of different mindset.

Yeah, yeah, for sure, man. I mean, I come from a very Type A part of the world. My parents met at Princeton University, just very hardworking people. My mother is a devout empath. She basically martyred herself at a young age. She went through incredible pain that I still am learning about in my 30s. And my father is— I love my father to death, Sol Brah, and part of the reason why I did flake on you a few times is because I haven't known how much I've wanted to open up publicly about such personal things. But my father is what they would call a narcissist. However, he is the greatest man I've ever known in my life. But I'm the product of that relationship. So It's interesting to hear you say things like, you know, well, I'm just of the belief that humanity, all of us, we are infinity, we are the cosmos. So if we become aware of something that is going to suggest that we can be living a more wholesome life, we're going to do it. So one, the reason I say that is because I feel like I was born into a reality where like I was born so deeply into delusion where people were, you know, competing with their jobs because they had this trauma they hadn't healed within themselves. And I was kind of thrown into that. I spent, you know, most of my childhood visiting Princeton University and these Ivy League schools and all this stuff. And it wasn't until I was about 18 that I became aware of myself as a person, because I had learned from my parents to just, you know, grind, grind, grind, and that there was no such thing as like presence. So for whatever reason, there are no musicians in my family, but I became this like pretty legit musician. And I'm convinced that it has to do with the fact that I just tapped into a presence for whatever reason that has saved me from the typical life that most people are living. And yeah, man, I was about, let's see, I was about 28 years old, 27 years old. I graduated college, I was working in New York City, very much was like my father at this point. My mind was just always running, I was very competitive. And then all of a sudden, I was 2 years into a relationship with a woman whom I loved dearly. But I just couldn't be the man for her that I knew I was supposed to be. And she left me. And that heartbreak, that sudden— that pain was so immense that I finally looked within myself. And I don't know why God graced me with this moment, but I think it's because of the fact that, again, my parents are on these two very, very potent extremes in terms of personality. When I experienced that heartbreak, I looked within myself and I just suddenly realized that I was not the ego. I wasn't thought itself.

Yeah.

And you know, it sounds crazy to most people. It's kind of a challenge for me to share because I often don't know who's prepared to hear what I'm saying. But I mean, the truth— yeah, the right people will be. And honestly, Sol Brah, that's what I've learned through my Twitter account is because I am very vulnerable on my Twitter and it can be painful at times, but I have connected with people who are so real and so genuine that, you know, that's the positive polarity behind the pain. And exactly. You know, when I realized I wasn't my thoughts and all you've ever known is just being competitive, like, dude, come on.

Yeah.

So after that, like, man, my life shifted. I won't say I lost all my friends. I won't say that I lost really anything 'cause everything is still the same. But man, I stepped onto a path that was not something I ever expected I would be living. Realized that wasn't my thoughts, bought a plane ticket to Montana, quit my job, ended up being homeless for about a year just trying to figure out who and what I was and how— yeah, oh yeah, and how it could be possible that I wasn't my thoughts despite being so attached to my ego my whole life. But yeah, man, letting go for me is, is a, is a foundation of my experience. So yeah, pretty crazy.

And Paul, how do you find that you've come to the same sort of realization if you have and just if you could go a bit into your background as well.

Yeah, man. Pretty much everyone has their own hardships. I think mine just happened earlier in my life and similar to Jack, like we were just kind of in this whole matrix-y world and we had to find our escape. And you can't do that without detaching yourself from from the life you were born into, right? So—

Yeah.

It was really just how you kind of view the world. And externally, nothing really mattered. And for me, I just had to find a way. And it was like such a lonely path. But—

Yeah.

I found my escape through the gym because I didn't know what was for certain in life. I'm like this teenager always asking, what is the meaning of life? So I would devote myself to just saving money and investing in my time to working out. And over time, I would just learn about exercise, nutrition, and now I study it at university. And I had a pretty normal upbringing on the shallow surface. I'd party and just have a great social life, but deep down, like, I knew I didn't want to live in that normal life.

Yeah. And it's very interesting, Sol Brah, that Paul and I have linked up because it feels like he and I are standing on two ledges of the polarity of, like, being a man. He and I, like, where I'm strong, he's weak. Where I'm weak, he is strong. But at the foundation of who we are, we've both identified that what we literally are is something that exists behind or beyond any thought you can ever have. So with that as your core value with the person you're doing business with, it's like, yo, we know we've already won. It doesn't matter if Paul and I really make any money. We know we're going to be changing people's lives just because we're approaching our business and basically our lives from a much more, I guess, authentic and real paradigm than most people that we tend to be around.

Yeah, like, like before we linked up, I mean, I couldn't imagine going through my day-to-day life, but with this such clear vision, I really wouldn't want to pursue anything else in life other than this right here.

Yeah, what else is there, honestly?

Yeah, it's interesting you say that because I think at all business in general, uh, when you are Doing it in a way that is, like you said, authentically motivated and the core of it is to help people. The money will follow. That's just kind of a scoreboard of, you know, creating value for people. And I think that's the byproduct. Exactly. It's always going to be, if you create value for people, that's always going to result in, you know, financial success rather than the soul-sucking way of making money just from a, you know, a big corporation where you go in an office, you don't really believe what's going on, but you're collecting the paycheck. And I think that's probably the root cause of so much heartache and stress. I know amongst my own friends that, yes, the money's good, the company's good, it's a good opportunity, but it's not Ideally, you know, I wouldn't say that they fully wholeheartedly believe, and I'm not knocking that because people need to put food on the table and everything. I understand that, of course.

Yeah, but I, I'm curious, so, like, do you— one thing that I'm struggling with these days in my life is I don't think I'm supposed to directly try to change anybody on the face of the earth unless they approach me with that desire. And I'm curious because when we first started off the I have so much to say that I'm kind of all over the place. But one thing, I have this theory that because we are infinity, you and I both know we are the cosmos self-aware. When you become aware of something hindering you from growth, something hindering you from higher potential, if we just become aware of it, because we are infinity, I'm not Dr. Dre, he's not Paul, these are just sounds, words coming from what?

It's just an identity.

An identity, an id, exactly, an image of the mind for the mind, rather. But if you approach somebody with, I guess, higher awareness, which would be somebody who has healed themselves to the point of being able to see flaws in another, and if you love that person and you approach them with the truth, in my experience, 99% of the time that person looks at you and experiences that advice as criticism. So it's very interesting to me. It makes it very clear how everything is energy, and I need to be conscious, because if I approach somebody with what I know is higher awareness. And even with, you know, I guess I'll call it love, I'm approaching them gently. I'm aware of them. I know how to talk to them. If they're not ready to hear what I'm going to tell them, you can see the demon that comes out of them at the time. It's just reactivity because they're not prepared to hear that message. And I guess I'm curious if you've experienced that given your following and how much you've already done for people and all of that.

So I think it's two different angles with, you know, the online following versus maybe real life when I've made attempts to help or whatever. So with the online, you're putting stuff out there, people follow if they choose to, and then they can take away bits that are relevant and helpful to them. Or, you know, if they're struggling with fat loss, they'll, they'll search specifically for fat loss, and then there's tweets from— yeah, it's more filtered. Yeah, it's more filtered, and you've only got people that are really, I mean, hopefully following you because they want to learn something they like what you have to say. And so I think that that's, that's already you're sub-selecting from people that want to change, or they, they notice that something isn't quite right there, and so they're much more open to receiving something. It's like going into a library, picking up a book and reading it and being like, ah, and getting annoyed. That doesn't really happen as such, but with in person because, you know, you like to think that, and obviously with higher awareness, you just become more and more aware of your more and more flaws in a way, which is a good thing. But it also, like, I've tried to lead by example and that's always like the best you can do. And if you're not especially with people that knew you before the progression and internal work. Like, I've always found that with my closest friends, I'll tell them straight up and it doesn't matter. Like, we can have that kind of level of discussion without them getting upset. Or I'll just say, hey dude, take it or leave it. This is my take on, you know, your diet, your exercise. You could, you should do this if you want X, Y, Z results. And just leave it at that. And then that's an information point for them to digest that comes from someone that knows what they're talking about in that regard. And then it's up to them. And you, you leave the trail of breadcrumbs, and if they're interested, really, uh, then they'll come back to you. But even then, it doesn't always happen. And I think what I've realized is you have to lead by example and be there and have the breadcrumbs. But if you go and try and shove bread in someone's mouth, they're going to spit it out, you know?

Yeah, yeah.

And that can be frustrating because you see or you know, like, man, this is a way of fixing your problem that you have.

And I want to see you— it's right there, it's right there.

Yeah, I want to see you happier and healthier. But ultimately, and I think this is a very important distinction as well, if you try to solve someone's problem for them, you are denying them the lessons to be learned.

Oh yeah, right.

So they have wisdom that their particular physical experience has to learn to then be attached to their soul and be true knowledge for them to take forward. And if someone comes up to them hands you a step-by-step guide of how to avoid this problem and then they do it, maybe they fix the problem, but they haven't learned it, right? And that goes through all things. It's like when the homie has his first girlfriend and he starts simping and texting all the time and, you know, buying her things and you just want to go, bro, please don't, like, she's just gonna freak out, you know? Um, but he's not gonna learn until she fucking stops texting him and he'd be like, whoa, what happened? Yeah, dude. Yeah, I'm on way, way, way too strong, you know. So it's one of those things, I think.

Sure. Yeah. And this, this to me is such an interesting conversation, especially given money Twitter, because one thing that I think about regularly is like, to me, the internet is, is almost 99% delusion. You can find anything in infinity. And honestly, like, the internet is infinity. Everything is up there. So you can find truth if you go looking for it. But I'm always it just fascinates me what's going on, bro, in this money Twitter community. Because part of my story is, you know, I told you I was homeless for a year. There's so much to unpack there. I just— it makes— it can bring out some crazy emotions. But one thing that I started doing out in Montana when I really— all I had was like a laptop and the library, I would just hop on Reddit and I would just start posting things that I thought that I knew were unusual. But I started realizing that they were helping people just to sort of understand themselves. So after enough I came to Twitter with the same intent, and it has been so much fun. But all the while, I've just had in the back of my mind, like, people, people have lost themselves to the internet and to social media. They're in, in some way, there's like this, this general mind virus that people pick up when they, when they find themselves on the internet. But at the same time, there's a place like Money Twitter where there are so many individuals who are unusual with their awareness of what is And I'm so fascinated by what happens when the truth meets the internet, because the truth always wins. We all know that. Yeah. So what happens when more and more of us start sharing the truth and living it and not saying it in a way where we're like trying to change the world, you know what I'm saying? Of course, that is my fundamental intent with basically everything I do at this point, because I don't know what else to do. What else is life? Yeah, but Yeah. It's just so cool to me to see what we have building on this part of the internet. And I know I talk about it all the time with my tweets, yada yada, but it's just fascinating. It really is. To me, it's just so interesting. And I really do feel like an impact is actually being made on the world through our little community on the internet, which is only growing. 100%.

And you saw it in the last year and a half, that's when this higher awareness sphere, and it probably existed and it definitely existed in people on various social medias before us, of course, but particularly this area with its own, you know, unique blend of self-sufficiency, ego awareness, um, acting with integrity, like those kinds of themes that came up, like that hasn't really existed on social media before, and I think that's what's so refreshing, good about it, and I think it's indicative of a larger energetic awareness and shift in the population because online communities, online stuff, it's not going away. That this is, you know, this is the world now, um, and to have a section of that world where that aligns with your values, that is better than not engaging with it at all. Um, and I think, you know, the whole lockdown, everything that's happened has accelerated that, and I think I think that it's important to, just like it is in real life, to always speak your mind, always be nice to people and share what you think is going to help and just do that in an online way. And I think that's what's resonated with a lot of people and I hope helps, you know, if you can get to— we need to get to the critical mass of people being aware and once that happens, it all flips.

That's where I feel like we're trying to get to.

Yeah, 100%.

And it's a special platform we're doing it on because you can reach so many people and just let everyone come to their own conclusions by not being imposing, but rather just leading.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. What do they say? I read this saying recently. It was like, it kind of tripped me out because I still do, I have to admit, you know, I still, of course I have an ego. The ego never goes anywhere. Kind of, you know, I still try to be a leader. And but I read this quote the other day that's like, the best leader in the room, or rather the only real leader in the room, is the one who doesn't, doesn't want to lead. He's not against it, but it's not something he's like choosing. Yeah. And it's because it's just unspoken. There's no ego. It's like, oh, okay, you're the most aware, you're the strongest, you're going to be our leader. And we beneath you, because we are no longer interested in sort of the tyrannical archetype existence, we're going to respect you. We're going to respect you and look up to you and follow the leader, which is actually such a cool thing to bring up because it actually brings me to— we can sort of shift topics here, but with what this venture that Paul and I are doing, we're just trying to bring back Sol Brah. And I know you'll align with this. We're just trying to bring back that Arnold vibe, that Arnold Schwarzenegger like community in the gym vibe where like we just fundamentally respect each other. You see a guy who's bigger and stronger than you, and you look at him and you're like, damn, I want to be like that dude.

I don't know about you, but I've had my fair share of steroid accusations. Like, it is so much easier to just get motivated rather than jealous and just, you know, as a cope, to talk shit as a cope. You can just get inspired and have it yourself. And, you know, these meatheads that seem like, you know, they're assholes, they're, they're the most humble. They are the most humble and nice guys, and they are so willing to just sit down and help you as much as possible.

So true. Yeah.

And, um, I think that's just the, the world we live in is just a lot of insecure people that don't have that, that brother, that mentor, you know, someone to lean back on.

Yeah. But like, that too leads me back to you know, my theory that as infinity, once we become aware of a higher, a higher truth, like we sort of naturally start guiding ourselves that way, you know what I'm saying? I feel like people are so blocked with insecurity, which has come from social media and, you know, yada yada, that people are just not willing to see the light anymore because it just scares them too much, you know? In the same way, like we were just talking about how you approach somebody with advice, they often feel it as criticism. It's like, why is that? Let's unpack that.

It's because You're popping their little comfort bubble.

Exactly. It's really just we get used to the state of life that we're in, the state of living, the day-to-day, when deep down all of us knows that it's not where we want to be. We don't want to be stagnant. We don't want to be living in this victimized mindset. But so many people bring that victimized mindset to a place like the gym because they're there to work on themselves. You know what I'm saying? So it makes sense that people bring this sort of insecure vibe there.

But well, so I think it's more, um, the people that are actually like, oh, you're on steroids, blah blah, it's mostly social media. It's mostly people that aren't at the gym. Like, how many people have come up to you in the gym and said, hey, uh, how are the steroids, bro? Like, you know, that doesn't happen.

Fantastic point.

So I think Like anyone in the gym has got at least a base level of, you know, there are the outliers, of course, but there's a base level of, hey, I'm here, I want to improve. And that's a great thing. And, you know, this is why I want to one day open up a gym, you know, on the beach, The Compound, and have it and cultivate that kind of fraternity vibe there, because I know that there are people that don't have that at all. And if I can help cultivate that kind of community, because community needs to be cultivated and It needs to be— you need to input energy to create an energetic field that then helps others. And if you can intentionally curate that, I think that that's a great thing. And bodybuilding is just a vehicle, and training in general, that's a vehicle and a shared community thing to do that through, which I think is very important. And that's— it's gone, like, probably because of the mass-produced nature of fitness in general. It's like money came in, money needs to be made as much as possible. It's just always the case with, um, when things get bigger. And then there was no— it's all the sterile environments, the, the chain gyms, like that kind of stuff takes away from what I think, you know, we look at back at the golden age of bodybuilding with rose-tinted goggles. None of us were there, but I think we can all agree that that was probably a better time and a better vibe where, you know, the bodybuilders say everyone helped each other, there was no competition outside of, you know, the actual competitions. And I think that that is a place that everyone should strive to get to, even outside the gym, is if you see someone struggling in life, or just, you know, if you can offer some advice that, you know, there is no competition because the competition arises from the egoic nature of, you know, the biological brain thinking, hey, am I good enough in my standing of the tribe? And compared to that person, am a better, more potential mate. Uh, you know, that's where ultimately it all comes from, is trying to put each other down or do better than your neighbor because you want to have a better reproductive chance with, you know, the women in your tribe. And we can rise above that. And just being aware that that mechanism is something that we can ideally transcend as a human that has a higher level of awareness for all those things.

Yes, I guess that's ultimately— and I wouldn't be surprised if it was yours, but I'd say ultimately, if I had to say I had a goal before I died, it would be to create that community, you know, where people, people have stepped beyond sort of the tyrannical— I guess that's something I, I should just briefly talk about, because who knows how many of your listeners are aware of what that is. But, um, as you know, Sol Brah, there's the tyrannical archetype, and then there's the philosopher king, good king.

Yeah.

And in my experience, having learned from my father, whom I mentioned earlier, what a powerful guy, you know, he's such a smart dude and he knows how to get things done. But emotionally, he didn't— he hasn't yet come full circle. And in my opinion, like the tyrant, the tyrannical archetype is the most common path of the modern man. And it's born ultimately of insecurity. But once you see beyond that, you recognize what's going on and you recognize that you're the one running away from yourself because of these insecurities and that actually the man you want to be is the one who has let go of that pursuit entirely, of the ego's pursuit entirely. So in that sense, what I've learned in my life is that the life that I aim to live is actually so much simpler than I ever thought it would be. And the way that I recognize that is by doing a whole bunch of unlearning So personally, I've had to just, just let go of almost everything that I had learned, you know, my whole life. And then I recognized behind that guy is this very quiet, very honest me. And I had never known who that person was until I did this letting go and finally let myself be, you know, one of the people of the world who acknowledges where he's been tyrannical. Because honestly, it's that tyrannical aspect of us where we're like seeking to fulfill the insecurity that our ego tries telling us is so important. Yeah, it's like, that's not really who you are, and it never was. It's, it's quite a trip to become aware of. At least it has been in my experience.

Yeah, for sure. Um, I want to speak a bit more about the training because I haven't had as many like bodybuilder-focused guys on the podcast.

Oh yeah.

When you guys are training together, what kind of stuff are you doing? Like, what is elevating the training sessions to— I think you said a tweet where you were doing shoulders and you threw up, you know, like what kind of stuff? What kind of stuff are you doing in there? And, you know, how is the dynamic with having, you know, a fully engaged training partner? Because I've had training partners briefly at college, you know, when I wasn't also as serious about training as I am now. How does that, you know, raise you up? And if you just speak about the kind of training you guys are doing at the moment.

Oh, hell yeah. So before I even landed in Jersey, I told Jack, I mean, look at the way Arnold's training with Frank. And despite the height differences, that's kind of similar to what we have going on. And Jack, how tall are you?

Almost 6'2". 6'2".

All right.

So I'm 5'9". And that height difference, I think it symbolizes something in a training partner where there is no competition. We're here to make each other better. So when we're lifting, I mean, we're going forced reps, like heavy, going until past failure. And something like incline dumbbell pressing, like there's no way you can truly push past your limits safely unless you have a training partner. And, um, since day one, I mean, I got off the plane and 3 hours later we're in the gym and, and we, we literally have not let off the gas pedal.

And, oh yes, baby.

Yeah, so just forced reps, supersets, drop sets, and, um, and we'll hit compound lifts really hard, but we, we will isolate the targeted muscles and pre-exhaust that prior to the compound lift. And I don't think Jack's ever been exposed to this kind of intensity. And it's quite refreshing for me because I do this on my own, but with a training partner, it really takes it to the next level.

Yeah, Paul's out of his mind when it comes to the workouts that he writes up for people. I can't say that I'm not out of my mind too when it comes to that. It's like, and Sol Brah, I'd be interested if you'd agree with me on this. I feel like there's something very, very cool and real about like the spiritual bodybuilder. Ultimately, Yeah, I identify as spiritual. I know that there's no such thing. I am spirit. But because I've recognized that I'm not the ego, I've seen beyond myself as thought. So I just feel that I'm able to tap into a deeper sincerity anywhere I want to. If I'm standing in line at Subway and people are giving the cashier a hard time, I'm like, what is going on? How could you ever? And I just drop that and I bring sort of like a positivity that I know is going to heal the moment. When I'm in the gym, I'm able to let go of my ego that would say, man, I feel really weak today, or, you know, I'd compare myself to the guy next to me. I just let go of that tendency completely. And by doing that, I tap into this, this unusual— I know it's an unusual mind-to-muscle connection. Yeah. And I know it's unusual because I, I probably look like a freaking weirdo at the gym compared to most people. Like, I'll close my eyes as if I'm praying to God before each set.

Yeah, just channeling that inner energy. And I think that's why these workouts have been so fulfilling. It's beyond the pump. It's a release. And it's actually kind of funny. Like each time we go into the gym, there's always like an older guy that like comes up to us, daps us up and just gives us respect. And yeah, and no, not much exchanges in words. It's just an energy.

Yeah, we— Paul and I exchanged very few words in the gym, and if he wasn't around me, I mean, you know, since that experience of seeing through myself, so I, uh, I don't know, man. I've kind of brought this same intensity to the gym every day thereafter because I don't really— that's what I know now. But I just think it's so funny, man, because I get so many DMs from so many young, young men asking like, yo, what is the secret? Whether it's a steroid or something you're eating that people don't know about. And I think there's, there's, there's a few answers, of course, but I think the most important ones are like, first of all, genetics. Keep that in mind. We all have different genetics. Some of us have elite genetics, some of us have bullshit genetics. Just is what it is. You got to work with what you got, you know. But beyond that, there's this level of intensity that all of us can tap into, and which I believe all of us have tapped into, but which you can only tap into regularly when you have seen beyond yourself. And in that sense, like, what I tell kids— and who knows how many kids I'm, like, pushing away from the gym experience by telling them this truth that I have— but the way to get there is to acknowledge your own death. You really have to just look at the fact that you're going to die one day. And this isn't— this doesn't just apply to bodybuilding. This is applied to business. This is applied to being the— everything. The best man for the relationships, you know, everything. Because once you acknowledge your own death, no matter what you do, tap into a level of sincerity that you know you have been missing. And so, yeah, man, ultimately, like, what separates me and Paul's workouts from the rest? He and I are two gentlemen who, unlike I'd say the average man, are willing to acknowledge our own absence, which has allowed us to tap into sort of a heightened presence in the gym, which I personally believe results in sort of a lack of glitching of your energy, which is, you know, if you're lifting, it's going to result in a deeper mind-to-muscle connection.

Yeah, I forget who it is, there's a bodybuilder that said you have to be willing to die in the set. And yeah, I got to figure out who that is.

That's, yeah, that's 100%. That is absolutely it.

Yeah. And I think— You go, Paul, you go.

And to bring that mindset every day, I mean, just living life the way it's supposed to be as if you died tomorrow. I mean, why wouldn't you want to live life that way?

Yes, I think it's thrown around like, live every day like it's your last, but genuinely, if you knew you were facing the executioner's block tomorrow, what would every day feel like? You would wake up, you'd look at the sunrise and be like, goddamn, this is the last time that I'm gonna be able to see this beautiful rising of this giant orb of light and energy, and that's the first thing on your day, and you look at it and you go, that's amazing. And then you'll go into your kitchen and you'll brew a cup of coffee, or you'll make your breakfast, and you're like, this is the last time that I'll be able to do this for myself, that I could, you know, taste these, these delicious eggs and fruit. And you would just have a, a very sincere appreciation. And imagine the workout that you would have if you knew you were going to the execution 'Oh, let's go, bro.' You'd be like, 'What?' 'I'm gonna die because, you know, I'm dying tomorrow anyway, so it doesn't matter.' Um, yeah, so I think that's— there's so much— all these, um, you know, all these sayings that people throw around as— what's the word, um, Clichés, platitudes, you know, someone— the thing about platitudes is someone can look at a platitude and it'll just pop into their head, and then they'll think about it, and it'll just click with something, um, and then they will genuinely have, you know, have that more conscious in their mind, or it'll just remind them of something they've forgotten and benefit their life because of it. And the same clichés, I just— they're again clichés for a reason. But if you can genuinely meditate, and I think this comes down to maybe awareness and consciousness as well, as if really actually meditating on the fact that live each day like it's your last, and you will lead a more thorough life, and you're not gonna be pushing off conversations for tomorrow you're gonna grab your partner and say, "I love you, you know, I really appreciate having you and I value the time that we've spent together so far and thank you for being with me in this journey of life." Like, imagine the power and closeness of your relationship if you vocalize that more often, whether it's a girlfriend, wife, or even just a friend as well. Like, because one day you're not gonna see that person again, unfortunately. That's just the reality of life and when we're young we can skip over that and, and really think, oh yeah, there's next time I'll see them. But even if there is, if you come back to the present moment as much as possible and try and exhibit your truth and your feelings in the moment, um, you know, there's a richness to life that becomes, you know, the default. Or, you know, you try and lead that default if, again, if you meditate on the fact that this is a temporary thing, you know, this moment, this time will never come back to pass. So if you're not engaged with it and if you're not really thinking about it and being present in it, it's gone, it's wasted. And I think once you internalize that, you know, your life becomes much more rich.

Much more rich. And it's just, it's so fascinating how by acknowledging your own death, you actually discover your own life. It's like by finally facing the thing that you just sort been so afraid of because you were born into this reality where, you know, whether it was your parents, your teachers, your coaches, or all of them who would just throw you one-liners that suggested the root of their existence was that they're terrified of death. Like, that's all of us. We all have been conditioned to fear our own absence when in reality the way to live holy is by accepting your own absence and getting out of your own way.

And I actually just realized something I actually got a head start. I don't know if you know this, but I'm 21 years old and my fake ID has been working since I was 17. And most people think I'm older, but I genuinely think I got a head start because of seeing my dad, his work ethic, the hardships he has faced. Most of our problems are very fucking easy to resolve. Life is so simple. And when I hear about my dad, about how he escaped the military and, you know, traveled from boat to Malaysia while he was in Vietnam, just all this crazy shit. Yeah, that alone, just remembering that fact has allowed me to stay the course and stay true to who I am while I'm living in this external bullshit, going through schooling. And because I've been able to stay that course, I've manifested everything I've ever desired. You know, I'm thriving, I'm flourishing in health. And, um, and I think that is so important for people to, um, acknowledge that you can take your pain and champion it and actually use it to empower yourself. And, and it's, it's really a unique advantage Without my dad being the man he is, I wouldn't have that leverage to set myself apart from the rest.

Yeah. Yeah, I'm very— so I'm nearing my 31st birthday, but my friend Paul here just reached his 21st. And it's funny, man. I consider myself the lucky one to be working with this kid because he's not a kid. He's a full-grown man. He went through a lot of pain, not just physically, but I mean, you went through a lot of pain at a young age and you let yourself, for whatever reason, maybe you're just an old soul, you let yourself see it, bro. And because of that, you developed at a younger age and I value you for that. But one thing that I would love to just briefly touch on, brother, because I feel like this is like the greatest thing that I can give any audience, especially today, is like I've spent so much time thinking about my own death at this point. And one of the coolest things that I've discovered within it is that by, as a man, by approaching my own death, I have discovered these two polarities, which is again the tyrant, the tyrant and the good king. So when we do approach our death, one thing that we do realize is, wait, holy shit, if I step out of my own way in my mind and I recognize that I'm not the ego and I let myself kind of just be for a little while, there's this inherent internal power that I feel coming alive. It's like it becomes more and more vital the more and more quiet I become. And that unwavering quiet within all of us, it is what all of us is. That's what pure being is. It's fundamentally silent. And when we tap into it, in some sense, quote unquote, you are dead, right? Because the ego has been silenced. So when we stand as being, we do find this this, this, you know, this incredible power to lift weights extremely, or to tap into this mind-to-muscle connection that's profound, or to sit down and tap into this cognitive focus that's unusual, you know what I'm saying? When there is no glitching from the ego telling you what to do, you just do what you know you need to do. That to me is discovering sort of like— you're— for a lot of kids these days, they discover the power and it leads them to sort of the tyrannical type. But the other end of acknowledging your own death, despite that cool power that you realize, is you can't help but recognize the simple moments in your life that you've been overlooking because you've been chasing something that wasn't you. So I'm one of the more emotional, I guess, bodybuilders on the timeline. But one thing that I, I saw recently, because I, I'm only 30 years old, but like I said, I've really been working on acknowledging my own death because I, I do know deep down that that's the man that I really am and I want to live as. So the other day, my poor mom, who I've mentioned is— has martyred herself, um, one of the kindest, sweetest, most selfless people I've ever known— I looked down at her hands, bro, and her knuckles on both hands are— they almost look all broken. And the reason for that is because my mom has worked so hard in her life, whether that be, you know, getting all 4 of us boys— she had 4 boys boys to practice at the same time, running around, you know, being a crazy mom, or just working in the garden and doing all the heavy lifting that she shouldn't have had to do. Yeah, I didn't see her as a kid. I didn't see her doing those things because I was so caught up in my story. So that's one thing that, you know, having come home for a little while here, I'm spending a lot of time around my mom and I'm like, damn it, I want to be there for her. Yeah, well, there would have been a chance that I wouldn't have even seen that until I did take on this sort of very, very deep acceptance of my own death, I would have missed out on that. I wouldn't have recognized that I wasn't there for my mother in the way that I want to be before I die. So in that sense, when we do acknowledge our death, we are given the chance to see what it means to be that good king, or rather the good man that we know we all want to be. So I don't know. That's just to me right now the most fascinating thing on my mind is just really actually just sitting there in quiet and looking at your own, your own absence. Because who, who does that? Who's ever told you to do that? Nobody ever told me to do that, but it just feels so right. I don't know.

Yeah, there's, there's another way of living that really unlocks when you first dig into the spiritual side of yourself, and that's what makes it so addicting, at least for me. It's like you read another book and that there'll be a paragraph that really just sits you on your ass and you're like, fuck, man. Like, it just puts into perspective a whole lot of things, enables you to appreciate things more. And I wanted to mention that, you know, the physical spiritualism that I— that's been in my bio since, you know, I started Twitter is because I know that feeling of when you are deep in the set and you want to give up and everything's burning, but you know inherently, like, I could do a few more. Like, it's, it's, it's just a feeling. The pain, the muscular fatigue, like, it's just a feeling. And the spiritual side of it is being able to endure that pain, knowing that the harder you go and the longer you go, the more muscle cells you unlock. And that's, I think, the principle of bodybuilding in a way that makes it so spiritual. And, you know, I'm sure it's the same with any endurance sport or things that are very hard physically, is that it becomes a— the ultimate presence is like you're not worried about anything else when you're under 300 pounds in a squat and, you know, it's your last rep of the set. Like, it just doesn't enter your mind. And I think a lot of people, that's the the avenue that they get into presence and awareness and the realization that, you know, the mind is this kind of simulation plaything that we can mold and we can be aware of. And I think that that's, for me, what the gym has done, and I'm sure for you guys as well. Um, and it just flows into everything else, and I think Bodybuilding is a way through that, you know, your incline walk that the Dre walk. No, man, through that, uh, which, which—

no, it's true. Yeah, it's true. It really is true. Oh, you haven't tried it yet, bro? Is there a reason?

Uh, I'm a bitch.

You nervous? I was trying to get that out of you, but I wasn't expecting— no, no, no, I feel you. I feel you. It is brutal. Brutal. It is brutal until you've done it enough times to the point where it's just like anything else. You're like, oh shit, I've ridden a bike before, I can do this. But it's just, yeah, here I am, I'm taking another step back. Just like, man, I, you know, I— here I am talking about accepting our own death, but it's not like I just fell upon this kind of thinking. There was a stage before this, or a phase before this kind of thinking, which was Yo, I want to be jacked. And so that was like, that was the kind of beauty I was seeking prior to the beauty of becoming, in my eyes, like a real man. So I don't know, I just feel like the gym, there's something special about pushing the body and having this like place we can all go to where we just crush ourselves and ultimately are seeking something beautiful. We're trying to change our bodies or trying to gain strength, all of this This is beautiful. And like, yeah, go ahead.

It makes you feel fucking alive. I mean, you're literally triggering your central nervous system. Vital in a, you know, survival mode.

Yeah.

And it just makes you feel alive. And the more comfortable you are in that discomfort, you leave the gym and everything in life is fucking easy.

Yeah, 100%. For me, to make it a little more personal, like, um, my parents, we have a very— other people have said this, it would be weird for me to claim myself, but we have an attractive family and my parents have done very well, um, in this beautiful home and everything. But growing up, it was always, wow, the, the Reynolds family, you guys are the family on top of the hill, you guys go to the best schools, yada yada. But deep down, man, I did not feel like I compared to my father on any level. So I just developed these profound insecurities at quite a young age. Yeah. Um, and for me personally, they came out as an eating disorder. So at a young age, it made no sense, but I just ballooned up because of all these damn Doritos I would come home and eat or whatever. But, you know, instead of Doritos chips—

oh my God, I had to eat a lot of them.

Oh my goodness, chips, Burger King. I mean, non-stop, bro. Yeah, that was my childhood, really. So, you know, by the time I was 18, I found myself at 200 and some pounds. But anyway, I ended up going to college to play football where I ballooned up to about 300 pounds. I was one of the strongest players in the field, but—

Dad, it was crazy.

But if you look at my family, it's like, wait, Jack was never supposed to be so big. Where is this coming from? And of course it was insecurity coming out sideways. But, um, anyway, I found myself in the gym a few years later and I started this incline walk thing. And I did it because I had this friend who's a very, very intense bodybuilder, and he had told me if I do incline walk, then I'm not going to burn any muscle. I did not know the science behind it. I had no idea really what I was doing, but I just said, screw it, I'm gonna do this. So I started walking, and then, you know, a year later I'd lost 100 pounds. So I went from fat to fit in a year and ended up actually doing a brief stint as like a fitness model for a few major brands. But I'm really convinced that through that journey just shifting my body, just kind of getting totally disgusted with myself physically and just saying, all right, like a radical fuck this, I'm never gonna let this happen again. I'm not gonna be this man. I'm not gonna be overweight. I'm convinced that through that shift of weight, it kind of introduced me to what it means to like shift your soul, become more aware of your spirit. So it really is true. It's like through the gym, if you let it, if you let it be a tool for your internal expansion. It really can be, and anything else can be. But for, you know, as a man, it just seems like the gym and picking up heavy things and putting them down just seems to make sense.

Yeah, it's— the physical training has been a core of, you know, masculinity going back to the ancient Greeks, you know. I'm not sure before that, in the caveman eras, when if you could pick up the biggest club or rock, you were the big dog of the tribe, you know. It's, it's kind of inherent inherently coded into us, which makes it feel so primal. But it's interesting you say that about, like, go back to our conversation before, like if someone had shown you how to lose weight, maybe through diet alone or just like coached you through it, you wouldn't have had the same radical transformation that is now fueling you to, you know, have the mindset that you have. So, you know, all of spiritual ascension, you have to have your roots, uh, going down to the abyss below. You know, the Tree of Life rises high, but the roots need to go down into the darkness just as much. And I think that that's key in, in spiritual growth, is realizing and acknowledging the shadow within ourselves and harnessing that power rather than shying away from it. And, you know, Jordan Peterson speaks about this, is you have to have the capacity for outside of yourself, acknowledge it. Otherwise, your, your potential is, you know, it's lacking. It's, it's 2D and it's only one-sided.

Yeah, 100%. And I can admit, it's very simple for me to admit, that I personally fell for the love and light trap in the same way that I sort of like very quickly and radically shifted my body type when I started going within, eventually I started seeing some light within myself and it felt so good that I got attached to it and I just fell for the same trap but in the other polarity. Yeah, but it's just so true to me. I mean, there's so many unbelievably amazing people on money Twitter and they make sure to express the message that like, yo, you need your pain. Don't run away from your pain. If anything, love your pain. Acknowledge your pain, feel your pain, accept your pain, because without your pain, you don't go anywhere. In the same way that we have to put gasoline in a car and without it, we're not going anywhere. Without this sort of discomfort, without this sort of— and it doesn't have to be an egoic discomfort even. Like, it can just be sort of a feeling that you acknowledge. Without that feeling of discomfort, it's like there's nothing to get you to the next level of your existence. So in that sense, it's just, it makes so much sense to me that, you know, what you're saying, it's like, yeah, we are the light. We are, you know, we're all, we're all the cosmos, but we all have to always remain vigilant and aware of our darkness. Because if we don't, you lose yourself, not to the light, but actually to the darkness that you're overlooking.

It's funny. That you can— it's like there's so many layers and you find yourself, yes, I'm the spiritual guy, and then you get attached to that, and then you fucking realize, damn it, that's another ego trap.

Every time you identify, you find yourself losing. Yeah, yeah, you just have to let it all go. You just have to let it all go and see what's still there.

Yeah, it's, it's a balance, right? Because I think a lot of people will try and completely destroy the ego, and like you said earlier, that's not going to happen. It's always there. It's about recognizing it for what it is, realizing that as a human you need that to interface with this 3D world that we're a part of. Otherwise, you know, you kind of drift and go insane, as, as some people see if they get too deep in the spiritual. Ah, I'm real, and then they, they stop eating and things like that. So it's both being aware of that, but also coming back to real life and cooking your meals and working a job and still taking care of this physical vessel that we inhabit temporarily in this life. Otherwise, you know, you're away with the fairies. And I think there's, there's a danger in trying to become too spiritual because you're performatively rising to this image again, identifying with being a spiritual dude, but also you're just existing in that realm and end up not achieving anything. So it's a— it is a balance of using the ego and trying to not let it control you.

And if it's true that— if it's true that in order to get in touch with the core of who you are, you have to sort of inevitably detach from the identifications that you had been attached to previously in life, if that is really the way to get in touch with your core, then how can it not be that all of us are in fact one? Because, you know, if I don't have this story about who I am and where I'm going and what I'm doing, if all that just kind of disappears, even if it's just for a second, and I'm able to tap into that pure being behind all of it, that pure awareness, like like if all of us is in that space and we're all just aware of each other, not as the thoughts that we're typically used to, but as this new experience of like being the silent pure being, you know, how could it ever be that we weren't anything other than one this entire time? And it was only sort of our thoughts and our delusions that separated us. And we all continue to believe in it, but of course we do, you know.

Yeah. Well, it's, it's, um, Um, these, these truths become evident with people that are deep into the spiritual world. And the way I think about all this stuff is like, these people that have spent their whole lives thinking about these things, meditating, uh, being more aware, reading, you know, the monks, they say these things that we're all part of the same thing, and it's a truth that becomes you know, many different people from different walks of life come to the same realization, regardless of the religion, regardless of the particular sect of spirituality. When there is a common truth that exists between communities, there has to be something to it. Just like in a scientific world, if the hypothesis is be able to be proved by multiple people with different experiments, you can genuinely say that that's legit, you know, it's, you know, a scientific truth to some level. So, you know, when— there has to be something to that. Now, I've been having these thoughts recently about humans being a part of the greater energetic collective. We are focused on our individual little jobs and we— our lives, and we think we are separate spirit in that sense. But on the whole, we're all working in a city for, you know, creating these things like ants create anthills. You know, each ant, is it aware that of what it's doing, or is it just doing its little job? Now, I don't know how insects work particularly, but at a grander level, it can be said that the Earth, Mother Nature, is this organism in itself. Of which we are the little microbiome that's running around doing our things individually, but on a grander scale we're affecting the globe. And that, I think, is a very important thing to internalize, because when you realize that, you just naturally become much more nice to people and you want to help because you have that realization, "Oh, I'm not separate to these other people. They're just different expressions of me and different levels of energy that I can have a positive impact on or a negative impact on. So really, what do I want to do and help with these people, if that is the case? Which I think most spiritual leaders or people that have had these experiences, they come to that realization.

Yeah, yeah, I would agree completely. It's so interesting to hear you talk about that, bro. I would I would do anything on the face of the earth to be able to have these conversations with you in person one day. I'm just saying, just putting it out there.

But for sure, um, soon, probably next year.

Yeah, yeah, don't share too many details, but that's all I needed to hear. Yeah, um, yeah, dude, it's just— I just have so many insights every day, it's almost overwhelming. Um, but yeah, I swear it.

Tapped in.

I'm tapped in, bro. Maybe a little too much sometimes. That's what you guys—

fuck the ganja.

I know, man, you just gotta let go. But, but it almost seems to me that the degree to it— so many people on the face of the earth say they're kind, right? And they quote unquote act kind, but that to me does not imply true kindness. Like, to me, true kindness is like when you do something that's very supportive and valuable for somebody else, not expecting anything in return. That's like, that's what I would call like true kindness, right? And it seems to me that the degree, at least in my experience, because I love people more than anything, I love getting out of myself because I was so lost earlier in my life, which, you know, implies kind of being very selfish. And I, I never really saw the people outside of me that once I finally did, especially lastingly, I just fell in love. So one thing that I've noticed is that the kindest people in my life tend to be people who have sort of for whatever reason, whether by choice or whether by experience, and they just sort of had to deal with it. It's like the degree to which you have actually authentically accepted your own death is the degree to which you actually give back to the world that you're in. Because the degree to which you are willing to let go of yourself is the degree to which you are going to see that this self that you're letting go of, that you think you are, is the world. It is the world. None of us are our names or our thoughts or our jobs or our identities or where we're going or what we're doing, yada yada. Fundamentally, we are all the same essence. And like, it's so weird to say that to somebody, as I do all the time. You know, I fuck with people. I say these things in passing just to kind of get an idea of if I say this incredibly deep truth to this random person and it resonates, and it resonates, I've changed their life. I mean, otherwise they Yeah, just looking like I'm a crazy person. But I've just noticed that like most people nod their head along to you when you share truths like this. So like on some level all of us know it's true, but the people who really fuck with it, which tend to be the people who've experienced a whole lot of pain, those are the people who, who, those are the people who always do the right thing. They always wait for for you. They always are willing to listen to you if they know you need to be heard. And it's just so interesting to me, like, I've really thought about this, bro, like, what's the one thing that I really want to bring to this podcast? And, and it's just sort of like an awareness of the value in approaching your own death from a place of love and grace. Because I can promise anybody on the face of the earth that if they feel unfulfilled if they feel like they haven't figured out what it is or they haven't found the right person to bring into their lives, whatever, that lack of fulfillment is actually subjective. It has nothing to do with the external. And where we're missing, where we're missing from life is really just getting real. And to get real, if you feel lost, because I felt so lost before that I thought, I let myself think that I didn't even know what real was and what unreal was. Like, dude, I have I fucked with myself to an unusual degree to figure out what's true and what isn't. But I just know at this point that all the world is detached from the truth that we're all going to die one day. Because when you, when you are a man who allows yourself to accept that, like truly, truly accept that, yeah, your whole reality is going to change in the way that you see everything, including what you are, is going to change.

Yeah, I think it's a symptom of how we treat death in Western society now. And, you know, most traditional communities, there is a celebration of life in the funeral aspect that is different in Western societies where it's like, it's a sad thing. Once you die, you are gone forever, you know. And there's much, you know, there's a lot of wisdom and teachings from other communities and other peoples that say, okay, death is the end of this physical body that we're in. That's all it is. Your soul, your energetic, whatever you want to call it, that thing, whatever that was before your birth, whatever you were before your birth, is what you return to. Now that doesn't mean you're gone. That doesn't mean— it just means you're not in this 3D plane inhabiting that particular physical body. Now, I, I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of it. I haven't done as much thinking about the process of death as a lot of other people have. I'm just going off, you know, what, what other people who are deeper into this space have said, and that is you know, they said they've spoken to their father who's previously passed on in deep meditation or séances or whatever. So, you know, I think that because we believe that death is the end, we think that it's this hugely scary thing, and so we never want to consider it, we never want to think about it, and it's this fear-based mindset to do with death. And I think that that's at root root what is, you know, making us have this mindset. You know, very spiritual monks, they will take their own lives in a very calm way because they realize that, you know, this is just one plane of existence and they'll go back to whatever it was before. And I'm not saying that that's the correct way to view things and, you know, all the rest of but I do think that there's a lot of unexplored issues and questions. And the mentality that death is the end, forever, for good, it just doesn't sit right with me. And I think if you again meditate on, you know, I'm here in this physical realm for X amount of years, let's do as much as I can within this body with the time I have, and then whatever happens after that, I'll find out. But again, the present moment is all you have. To be scared of the end, which, you know, if you think it is the end, the end, then you're not gonna care, you're gone. So whichever way you look at it, you are— the, the logical conclusion is to not worry about it. Either, yeah, if you go on to the next realm and you're just chilling in the ethereal space, cool, let's go, great. But if you're gone, gone, what was it like before you were born? Nothing. Then, then why worry about it? And why, you know, it's removing the fear and the shackles that you have about it enables you to be more present again in this realm that we are in now. So whichever way you believe in it, it doesn't make sense to be scared of it.

Yeah, it literally makes zero sense whatsoever, and which is so— which makes so much sense to me because I know that the ego makes no sense when you really start unpacking it. But it's, it's so interesting, and it's so cool to me to hear you say that because, um, I think it was Alan Watts who said it. He was like— I was listening to one of his lectures probably 5 years ago. There were 2 things that man said that just shocked me into a different reality, but the first thing was anxiety and laughter are 2 sides Two sides of the same coin. And then the other one after that was, damn it, Sol Brah just said it. And I'm going to black out on it, I'm forgetting. But it's one thing that I think has made me think so much about death this past year is COVID. And being somebody who has approached death relatively young, I really am okay with it. So when this global epidemic approached, I was one of the few, as I'm sure you were too, and same with Paul, we just approached it with a totally different energy, a totally different approach. I just refused to be afraid of it, you know? And it's just so interesting because anywhere I would go, if I didn't seem afraid of it, if I didn't want to wear like a mask over my face or whatever, most of the the world would, would stand against me, which made me take this kind of thinking even deeper. Um, but, but yeah, no, I think, I think, I think it's very obvious that most the world currently is stuck in sort of a fear of the unknown, which, if that, you know, if that's true— because here's the thing, like, I'm 30 years old, I expect to live another 70 years. The rest of my life is unknown. Does that mean that I'm afraid to live? No, it excites me. I don't know what's coming. I know who I am, but I don't know what's coming. And so that excites me. I know how powerful I am. I'm in touch with myself. Um, but if you're afraid of the unknown, can you imagine— can you imagine living in that mind space for your entire lifetime? Because I do think that that's been kind of normalized at this point.

But courage—

encouraged, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And even beyond encouraged, it's like you're bullied if you stand against it.

Yeah.

Which is something, you know, I'll never, ever, ever, ever stand for that kind of approach to anything. So it's just really, really interesting and it's really exposing to me of the state of the world because ultimately the way to live your best life is to embrace the unknown, is to embrace that which you otherwise would have been afraid of.

100%. You know, it's— and I think it's all encouraged, it's all by design to have people living in fear, right? Change is always gonna happen. Things don't stay the same. You could argue that the present moment is never— well, it is never in a fixed position where everything is good, everything is— or, you know, the reverse, everything is bad forever. You know, it's, it's a moment of change, it's an ebb and flow, it's a stream. It's not a fixed position. So if you can have people constantly afraid, you keep them in this lower vibrational mindset, which brings on sickness, which brings on, you know, they're burning all their energy through worrying every day. Then they're not going to have the capacity to rise up as a force against you. That is the aim of these things. Things. And that's the aim of the last year and a half, 2 years' propaganda and all the rest of it, is like this fear-based ruling. Because if you, if you can make someone scared, then you control them, or the fear controls them, and they're never going to act out and stand up for what they believe in if they're scared of what's going to happen. You know, a lot of people are getting these experimental medical things because they're afraid afraid to stand out, even, you know, against the crowd or whatever. And it's all because of the media brainwashing. I think, you know, the first thing to do is obviously turn off the TV, turn off the news, and you will find that that alone is gonna remove your cortisol fucking 100 times.

But oh my God, it's— start eating well, turn off your damn news, start filling your body with healthy foods, put your feet in the grass, start exercising, get sun every single day. Get your sleep, don't sleep too long. I mean, it's just living outside of the state of depression that's been normalized. And it's almost bizarre. My mother's favorite movie growing up was Wizard of Oz. And I think of the state of the world and how this kind of bullshit can be maintained and how what you're saying to me is just so blatantly true at this point that there is this desire by, you know, I have no idea who and I'm never gonna name name, but it does seem like there is some quote unquote force that does wanna almost prevent our ascension as a collective because these narratives and these systems that we have in place that keep us stuck in thinking about the same kind of shit that does keep us stuck. It seems intentional. And it brings me back to the Wizard of Oz because ultimately, ultimately, how do we get beyond this as a humanity, you know, as the light, quote unquote? Not that I identify as it, because, you know, I have bullshit in me too. But we have to— it's like we have to really see how this is going on, because it's really just a bullying tactic.

So there's—

because in the Wizard of Oz, there's two ways to think about it.

It's like there's— well, the best way to think about it all is that this is the event which is enabling us to confront the darkness. Before this whole thing, people were happy just living their lives, and it wasn't particularly impacting— like, even if they're— because this whole thing has been in process for 60, 70 years with the propaganda and everything, and that's a whole different story. But if you have this blatant issue where now you can't even leave your fucking house that's— you're a prisoner now. That is so blatant that you have to confront it. So what you have to view all this as is an opportunity for you to really see what you're made of. If you genuinely want to rise above, then this whole thing is the dojo. It's the training ground to to ascend. And you have to view it that way because it's happening. It is— it's this thing. You can resist it and try and get even more stressed about it, or see it for what it is, see what the best thing you can do in this situation is in order to be the strength for other people, and crystallize, metamorphosize into the butterfly from the caterpillar that was unaware, just doing its thing, fucking eating Doritos and watching TV. No offense to Doritos.

No, you're very accurate. No, it's, it's, uh, oh man, I— this is why I love you, bro. This is why I love being on Money Twitter, is because I'm human, you know, and I still, I still, you know, I'll think the wrong thing sometimes. I'll believe in the wrong things. And then you have somebody show up who's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Yeah, although that's true, what if we shift that up with just a little bit? What if we put a little different flavor a little twist on that because it's true. It's like there really is, that's what's so beautiful about life is like here we are talking about COVID and all the darkness of the world, but even so I'm smiling all the while because deep down I know that despite all of this, there is always a silver lining. And most of the time I'm not even, you know, really aware of that silver lining, but it really is true. Like, Sol Brah, I can't say that I would have become the man that I know I am now and, you know, and whom I am still becoming had I not been somebody who did take a step back and question this, this whole virus thing, this whole pandemic from a different, different standpoint. Yeah. Um, so in that sense, it really is like an alley-oop from the cosmos to kind of slam dunk my ascension. That's really, that really is how it feels. And on money Twitter, sometimes I feel like we're almost like making a joke of it, you know, people sending these tweets out there. Like, I saw some guy wrote a tweet the other day that was like, I I don't even really know if it's true, but having spent enough time on money Twitter, I'm kind of convinced that there's like this shadowy cabal that is, you know, pedophilic and doing all these awful things that is slowly trying to take over our world. And he's like, I'm going to do everything in my power to stand against it.

Yeah.

And whether or not it's true, I don't— I guess I don't even really care at this point. It's just an opportunity for all of us to, to, I guess, unite, to really just kind of let go and, and tap back into the meaningful things.

Yeah, I mean, whether or not it's true, and I think there are some nefarious players, whether they're all connected or they're just various warring factions trying to make more money, which I think is more, more likely, but you know, for all intents and purposes, for people that are against that kind of thing to band together to stick up for what's right and to stand against it one in a more spiritually aware and conscious place, that's a good thing no matter what is happening. And you know, the way I think about these things is like, whether or not it's true, if you take steps that are going to help you be more independent and aware of things— you know, governments have been trying to fuck over the people since governments existed. That's just what happens, you know, whether it's the government themselves, whether it's the people, the unelected officials officials that are giving down health guidelines that somehow now the whole world has to adhere to, you know, whether or not those people themselves are literally trying to, uh, you know, affect a little person for their nefarious reasons, or they just think they're doing the right thing. Regardless, it doesn't matter because they're taking away your freedoms, they're taking away your autonomy as a, as a human being in this world. So it has to be resisted either way. And I think just be aware of that and help those around you and yourself become more resilient as a human per— as a human being and, and grow. And, you know, that's all we can do. And eventually, uh, the light will win, as it always does.

It can't not. It can't not.

Exactly. Well, boys, I think I think that'll wrap us up. So thank you, Dre. Thank you, Paul, for a beautiful conversation on the Soulcast.

My brother, it was a long time coming. I value you so much as a friend and just as a person that I get to learn from every day and just appreciate you being open to letting us on. I know I can talk for days about this stuff, but what a pleasure.

What a pleasure. Appreciate that, bro.

Yeah, man, of course.

Where can people reach you before we go?

Oh, I appreciate it. Yeah, yeah. I'm new to this, man. So this is the first time I've, like I said, bro, I was like nearly home, I was homeless for quite some time out in Montana and have never launched a business before, that is for sure. But my friend Paul and I have spent the last many, many months just trying to get something off the ground that is really coming from our core and which we know is the truth. But people can find us, actually, if you head to my bio, it might not be today or this weekend, but this Monday, which would be, I think, like the 26th, 26th, in my bio on Twitter, we'll have a website. And on that website, people can click it and go to our page for our business, which is called Muscle, which is muscle and soul. And yeah, man, we're gonna be training some dudes from, I don't know, just trying to train people to become their most aesthetic versions possible. And just trying to connect with them on an unusually deep level all the while. So really excited for what we have coming.

Very good. Me too. Thanks again, boys. I'm sure we'll do this again.

Appreciate you, bro. Hell yeah. All right, man. Be well.

All right. Ciao.

Later, bro.