Ep. 122 Training vs Keynote: 4 Critical Differences

Yes, sir.

Good.

Yeah, you got the Barry White thing going on. Okay.

Hey there, Mark Brown and Ed Tate. We just finished mastering virtual presentations and thinking about this. There's a big difference between when I give a keynote and when I give a training. But for people who aren't clear, I thought it'd be really cool. You guys are pros at this as well. We love working together. We love having our event and helping people. Because training is. Is different. There's different tools, different. So we thought it'd be cool if we went about, Talked about the 4, 4 critical ways training is different from speaking. Mark.

I can't wait to get into it with the master trainer himself, Ed Tate. Let's do this.

Anyone can give a presentation. Few deliver unforgettable presentations. What's the difference? You're about to find. Welcome to the Unforgettable Presentations podcast with your hosts, world champion speakers and coaches, Mark Brown.

Mark Brown, your life tells a story and there's someone out there who needs to hear it.

And Darren Lacroix. And Darren Lacroix.

Stage time, stage time, Stage time.

Ready for some powerful presentation. Ahas. Let's dive right in.

All right. Hey, Ed Tate, welcome.

Thank you for having me back to the show again. I'm shocked. I'm surprised, I'm sure that I reduced the number of downloads on your previous episodes and you've invited me back again.

Yeah, we invited you. Anyway, we wanted to give you a second shot or a third shot.

Okay. So like it's the holiday season and there were no other guests available. That's. Let's call it what it is.

Hey, hey, hey. Let's not be worried about the details. No, seriously, we just finished an event. Mastering Virtual presentations with the three of us do a three day event where we literally transform the way people present and there's things that people already know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I need a good mic, I need lighting and help me with that. But there's so much more. And Mark, we gotta admit that we have learned so much about training from Ed Tate. So this would not be as powerful if it was not for Ed Tate. So we just won't mention his name in the bio so we get more downloads. If you're listening to this, we're friends, we're brothers, we've been working together for 20 years, so forgive us, we love to tease each other. Ed Tate, let's just dive right in. So training versus keynote speaking. But let's just talk just for a second before we get into the critical 4. What's the difference between virtual and live. Like live training. Virtual training. Live speaking. Virtual speaking.

First of all, live versus, you know, virtual is, it's, as we've said before, 10 times more difficult. I call this presentation prison. If you've ever seen like one of your favorite law and order type of television shows, a, the attorney visits their client in prison and they're behind glass. Well, guess what, we're behind glass. I've got a painted glass. You've got a painted glass. And, and Darren, please share with us your favorite aphorism about the dulling of connections.

Virtual dolls. Connection.

Whether you're doing a speech or if you're doing training, you know, so you've, you've got to do whatever you can to break through that. Break through the glass. The training gives you more opportunities to do that. Training gives you more opportunities to build a connection. We spent three days, that's right, three days virtually with people. Now if we were boring, no one would stay with us for three days. So they wouldn't, it was just like there would be crickets on the other end. But what we have mastered is one of the main concepts of training and that is engagement and interaction. Speaking is a, it's a, it's a higher level of abstraction as Patricia Frib says, whereas training is all about engagement. It's all about people closing that skills gap. If they have a gap in their skills ability training, the purpose of it is designed to fix the gap.

Darren, mark your thoughts.

Well, having done speaking, having done training, having done both virtually and in person, and I was so thrilled to do a live in person on stage keynote a few weeks ago.

Woo hoo.

Yeah. The key is how well you can engage. And I know we're going to dive into four critical ways that training is different from speaking, but please bear in mind that the difference is magnified when you're in a virtual environment. Happily, I've had over the last couple of years many opportunities to share with you, Darren and you, Ed, the wisdom we have learned from the mistakes we have made continuously to help other people become masters at virtual presentations. So hopefully when we're done here, somebody will consider, hey, we'll go to their workshop and see how they do this for three whole days to keep me engaged. But the key to remember is that training and speaking are different. We're going to dive into four critical ways that is different and help you as our viewers and listeners. Listeners become more adept, more skilled at seeing a difference, handling a difference, so you can be on your way to being unforgettable Darren.

I love our first aha. In the event. When we're doing the event, we're doing the training, we're doing it virtually, obviously, because that one you gotta do virtual because it's mastering virtual presentations. I love the moment when we poll people. We stop, we just getting started, we set the groundwork, we did an exercise, we had them in a breakout room. They talk, we're engaged, and then I stop and say, okay, quick poll. How many slides do you think we've used so far? And it's 0 to 20, 20 to 40, 40 to 60 or more than 60. And most of the people always say 1, 2 or 3. Rarely, unless they're a repeat seat where they're coming back again do they ever say more than 60. And it's maybe in the. I don't remember exactly how far into it, but like within a half hour or so and we've done 100 slides and you can see their brain go. And when you and I train and you and I speak, and I mean you and I listening to this as well as Mark and Ed, my rule of thumb is about three times as many slides because you gotta keep it moving. But it doesn't feel like that to the listener, which is why we get the aha when people are shocked and now they're like leaning in, wanting to know more. So I think that's also critical in a speech or in training to kind of like, oh yeah, maybe I don't know everything. We gotta like open the gate and open the door. So Ed, we're gonna dive right in here. Let's start off. You're the master trainer, we're gonna follow suit. Critical way number one, Ed Tate, we're.

Gonna call that intention. So a speaker, their primary intention is to inform, to persuade and entertain. That is their intention. A trainer, again I alluded to it earlier, is to close that skills gap is to change their actual behavior. It can be said that if you gave a speech, you would introduce your high level ideas and concepts and you would use a training or workshop or breakout session to actually execute those high level ideas.

Yeah, and Ed, you got a little lag going on. Just FYI, the irony of what we're talking about here, doing, doing this, recording this podcast on Zoo. So say again one more time, just because I want to make sure it's clear. As far as intention, what is the intention for a keynote again, versus training?

The intention of a training is to change behavior.

Change behavior versus inform, educate and entertain. What happens if you're doing a high Level training and something like this happens, you got to work with it, go with it. It's true life improv. Mark?

Yeah. I like what Ed said earlier about closing the skills gap as one of the reasons why we do tr. Because with that mindset, yes, a keynote, you want to inspire the audience, you want to tell great stories, you want them to laugh and entertain them. This is not to say you do not want to entertain your audience or your attendees at a training or a workshop session. I'm not saying you don't want to do that, but the intention specifically is to close that skills gap, to change the behavior, to provide the instruction that will help them become more adept and more skill, more skilled and more proficient at what they have to do to learning new skills, new concepts, how to apply those particular techniques, those. Those concepts to the particular process they're involved in. So training does change the behavior. It broadens their understanding of something and it closes that skills gap between what they now know and what they need to know to become better at what they do. So don't forget, the closing the skills gap piece is also critical. One critical way that speaking and training markedly different.

Darren and I've had my training and speaking actually be the same subject. So sometimes I do it inspirationally, so I pull out some of the details, I put in more inspiration, sometimes I do it as a training, so I've got to give some more specifics. I might still have a story that inspires and sets the tone up front, but I'm actually using different tools, so we'll talk about tools a little later. But it is different. So even though it's the same subject, I'm structuring my content differently because of what Ed says, the intent. Because the intent is different. So different tools. We'll talk about that shortly. Ed Tate anymore on intent? Number one?

No, I think we've covered that topic pretty well. Number two, how the things are different are the duration. So a keynote can be as short as. Well, nowadays we have TED talks, if you will, and they can be short, as, you know, 15, 20 minutes. The longest I've ever given a keynote is 75 minutes. On the average, it's about 45 to 60 minutes is typically the range A training, on the other hand, it could be 90 minutes, it could be a half day, a full day. It could be. It take place over several days. So the length is definitely a difference. Darren.

Yeah, And I also think there's a lot of keynoters who think because they're amazing keynoters, that they can just Be trainers because they're great in stories and they miss the mark. Terribly, terribly guilty. Back before I started working with you, Ed, I kind of was in the same category. Oh man, I had to learn from you. I'm like, oh, it's different. Training is different from keynoting for sure. So duration. Yeah. And we'll talk about how you handle it differently. Mark, your thoughts?

Yeah. Regarding duration. We are still in the virtual and the hybrid world and Darren, you and I have done something regarding training and the duration that needs a little bit of attention and that is the multi week training program, the four week or the six week or the 10 week or the 12 week online training program where you actually meet your attendees for maybe an hour or two on a Tuesday and then a week later with assignments, you come back a week later and you go through a two or three or six week. We did that a couple of times as well. And I'd love to know what you and Ed have to say about those multi week trainings, particularly in the virtual environment.

Again, it's all about skills gap and improving and getting better. I've actually facilitated those six 12 week programs and the thing I have found satisfying is you can actually see the transformation. You know, training is about the transformation. That's what truly separates training from speaking. It's about the transformation. Well, you know, a speech, we can be impressed with the speaker, but a trainer, I want them impressed with themselves. I want them impressed with the fact that they've changed their behavior, they've improved their confidence. There's an ability they didn't have at the beginning and at the end of the 12 weeks they can see for themselves how they have improved. It's about progress. It's never about perfection. So that's been my experience and the benefit of attending a longer program because you will make a transformation if you attend a 6 or 12 week type of program. Now I will say this, in this day and age, 6 weeks is more likely than 12 weeks. What I've also noticed that the 12 week program there is, I'm going to say at that eight or nine week period, that's when people, some people trail off and some of attendees don't quite make it to the finish line, if you will. So it's been my experience that I don't know it's because the environment, I don't know because I know it's because it's virtual. I honestly don't know the answer But I think six weeks is a lot cleaner than a 12 week program nowadays.

Yeah, I'm a fan of the six weeks for what I do now. Every industry is going to be a little different. Some people be more opposed to training, some people will be more that prisoner that they have to go to training because my boss requires it. So there's going to be differences in every market, in every industry. We're just talking about from us. Four weeks I like, six weeks I'll do. But I think and Ed, speak to this too if you can. To me, the advantage of doing a six week course is I can give you some training, I can give you some direction, but now you have the opportunity to do homework, to actually go get quote unquote experience and then bring that experience back to next week. So we can adjust it a little. So you guys know my formula for mastery, which is effort times direction plus correction. You know, feedback from the mentor, from the guide equals mastery. So you can master anything if you have effort times direction. Here's what to do plus correction. Well, I did it, but I kinda didn't do it right. And what do you think? And now getting that feedback. So in our program, in our three day mastering virtual presentations, one thing we talk about that Mark brings up brilliantly is about the stories right on your phone, the pictures and the images on their phone. So one night we give them homework to go look for stories in their phone. What's cool is they come back the next day, they got an image and they have three new stories that were right in their hand the whole time. But because we've given them the direction, here's what to do, then they bring it back. If they do the homework, if they don't do the homework, if they don't put in the effort, there's less transformation.

Ed, one thing I like to talk about is called the illusion of learning. And the illusion of learning is this. You attend a speech or you attend a one day or half day training, you take copious notes, you're enjoying the coffee, et cetera, you feel really, really good, good about yourself and what happens is you go home and those notes never see the light of day. That is called the illusion of learning. Whereas in a multi day program, the six week program, guess what? Hey, I've got homework coming up. You know what, by the way, I participate in many of these programs. This is like, it could be like sometimes it's the day before, it's just like, oh man, I didn't get the homework done, I better get cracking the night before my notes, you know, this is like, oh, okay, okay, okay, okay. Because you don't want to be embarrassed and you don't want to be not ready for the next session.

True. And regarding duration, I have one more point I'd like to make. Everybody listen up. Especially new and emerging keynote speakers. Listen up. There is a reason the duration is different for a keynote. One of the mistakes many people make when they're starting out is they try to dump everything they know in a 45 minute keynote. Ed, I can see a reaction. What are you thinking, man? Right. Everything I know I must give my audience everything I know in a 45 minute keynote. That is not possible. Do not do that. And the beauty. I'm going to digress for a second, but I know Ed again has mastered this. When the audience understands that you can only give them so much, you give them a reason to then hire you to deliver a training program that may take several days or several weeks and you add value that way. But please, please, please, you cannot, if you're an expert, you cannot impart all your wisdom in one 45 minute keynote. If you're doing it now, you want to revisit your process and change the way things are being done.

Ed, I use keynotes to get me training and consulting business. And the reason I do that is because for me, training, consulting business is significantly more profitable than just a keynote alone business. Now, there's nothing wrong with you having a business model where you get, you just do keynotes. Now typically that's celebrities or the, our hall of fame speakers. And there's a small percentage of people in our business who have that model. However, I, for example, I've had customers who've been with me 13, 8, 9, 10 years because initially they hired me as a keynoter, but they also wanted me to implement these ideas inside their organization. And I have literally earned hundreds of thousands of dollars as opposed to 10 to $15,000 by implementing that model. So that's something else for me, part of my business model. I love it when you hire me for a keynote. But I also, hey, hey, let's keep this momentum going. Let's actually implement these ideas. Let's make sure that your people close the skills gap. And again, companies hire me year after year after year. I just got a referral today from a client for five years in a government entity where it's a competing government organization. And they said they've had, we've had such good success in this space that this other competing county government, like the movie Harry Met Sally, I will have what they're having, you know, so that, that's something that, from a business standpoint, I like, I like keynoting and training, but I use keynoting as a tool to get me more training and more consulting work.

Yeah. And keynoting can learn to lead to training and training can lead to keynoting. And when we're talking about the duration, also just to wrap up duration, number two, I've been asked to go in for Wells Fargo and do a 35 minute training at a big conference. It was a breakout session. I was like, well, it's going to be the greatest 35 minutes they ever heard. So I turned it more into a keynote, even though it's a breakout, because I only had 35 minutes. But my goal, my intention was to inspire them that their presentations could be so much better. Because these are corporate executives who are training all the time, they're doing presentations all the time. So they kind of get that ego and they, they've been doing it for a while, but they haven't seen what I did. And so I kind of just like mustered up. I'm like, they're never gonna forget me. I'm gonna be the one that they're. Everybody at the conference is talking about. And so I sat there in the general session and took notes on all the executives. And right at the beginning, after my opening, I said, you want to know what I thought of the executives who spoke? And they're all like leaning in. So I called them out and guess what? They ended up showing up because I was doing this like three times during the conference. So they ended showing up later and it led to several high paid keynotes for my full fee keynotes. So there's going to be exceptions to everything. What we're saying is the general rule of thumb. So Ed, we got number one, intent, number two, duration.

Number three, one thought about duration. One of the reasons that training is longer is interaction. Takes. It takes more time. It just takes more time. So if you do an exercise or an activity, add three times the amount of time that you think it will take in your head in terms of training. So whatever exercise, activity it takes, you think, oh, this will take five minutes, multiply that times three, it's going to take 15. All right, so that's another reason why again, training takes longer. The third area, number three, it's tools. Speakers have different tools from trainers. Mark and Darren, you guys are keynote speakers. What are some of the tools that you use in your keynote presentations?

Well, I know for me the personal stories or stories of any kind are really, really good tools. To have. Because people want to hear about your story. They want that they can connect with. And a story is a good thing. Now, of course, stories are being told to them. There's no interaction there. But stories are definitely one of the tools that we have as keynote speakers. Jump in there anytime you want to. Just jump in.

Yeah. Questions, Questions is another tool for a keynote speech. And then pause. The pause in a keynote speech is critical because as Ed said, quoting Fripp, it's a higher level of abstraction. So there are different tools for a keynote speaker. Now, a keynoter may also use slides.

Which could be in both.

Exactly.

You know, Ed, what else?

So trainers, on the other hand, they have a whole host of different tools. They have exercises, activities. There's something called simulations. A simulation is an exercise that could take place for months. For months in terms of we, you know, we go back to duration. There's interaction, there is, you know, there's conversations, there's dialogues. Whereas a speech is. It's one way, whereas training is. It's binary. It's going. It's back and forth, back and forth. So they have a whole variety in terms of different types of tools to use in terms of trainings.

And I would be remiss if I didn't say this. This is the one thing I'm known for in the training world with my Darrenism, that when we look at training versus keynoting, in keynoting, the main tool, one of the main tools is stories. In training, instructions is the heartbeat of the training. You get the instructions wrong, you're gonna send them out and they're gonna be confused for however long the exercise is. Then when you come back and do the debrief, another tool for training, when you do the debrief, it's gonna be a waste of time because they didn't do the exercise. Why? Because the instructions were. Weren't right. Look, I am guilty. I had to learn this from Ed. But stories are to keynotes as instructions are to training. Ed.

Absolutely. You need to, as a speaker would practice their stories and their keynote. A trainer needs to practice the instructions and directions they give to their participants. Practice that like you would a speech. Rehearse it like you would a speech, for clarity so that people understand the activity and the exercise. Darren also alluded to something else that is very, very critical in terms of tools of a trainer, and that is the debrief. There is a trainer in the world. There's an individual in the world of. Of training. He goes by Tyagi. I cannot pronounce. His first name or his last name, but he's known as Tyagi. And he says people do not learn from the experience. They learn from reflecting on their experience. The failure to debrief is the main reason why people fail to reach their full potential and performance. The learning takes place in the debrief. That's where the learning takes place. It's in the debrief.

Yep. And Fripp says true learning happens in moments of reflection, which is directly in line with that. So there's many more tools that a trainer needs. And then here's what we also need to know. You gotta be a trainer and do training to get better at it. And it's an evolution. Even if you come up with a new exercise, how many people in a breakout room or how many people doing that exercise, it could work great with three people, it could work better with seven. But then if you have groups that are too big, you have that introvert like me who just sits there and shuts up and watches everybody else do it. You want everybody involved. So what is the exact best or optimal number of people in the exercise? So there's a lot more variables, but going back to that intent, what are the tools? So we got the debrief, we got the stories, we got the instructions, we got the exercise itself. And I thank God for Ed that you taught us about breakout rooms virtually in Zoom. Now there's many different platforms, but in Zoom, the breakout rooms, I wouldn't be able to, I wouldn't even attempt to do a all day, six hour training without breakout rooms. Mark.

Yeah. And there's something else that we learned regarding the tool of the breakout room or the sports or the group activity in the past. And we're going to confess, we're going to confess it publicly right here. We have assigned a specific amount of time for different groups to have activities. And we've, we thought it was right. And Ed said, you want to multiply by five? We've actually had it happen in live events where you know what, I think they should have had more time than we gave them because it went by so quickly. So I can't stress enough what Ed says. You can imagine how long an activity will take place, but until you rehearse it, do it, try it out, you'll be surprised. And we actually had to shift and adjust the amount of time for an activity on the fly in our own program. But a lesson learned for us. So understand not only how the tools work, but the best way to work the tools.

Darren, also another tool that we don't normally talk about, I think is critical for a trainer. Goes back on what you're saying, Mark, is improv. Your ability to improv and be in the moment and notice when something's not working, having that awareness that, oh, wait, they needed more time or that's too long. Okay, they got bored, they started talking about other things. That's why when we do our events, I, I jump into the breakouts, shut off my camera, I'm recording for the replays, but at the same time, I'm kind of taking the temperature of the group to see, is this too long, is this too short, do we need to have more people? Do we need to have fewer people? So that ability to improv now still important in keynoting because you've got to be able to improvise when all of a sudden your PowerPoint doesn't work. All of a sudden the microphone goes out or. And the fire alarm goes off. So it's critical in both. But I think it's even more important in training, usually because you're working with people and they're doing exercises. Now, your exercise might work for project managers, but you bring them over to speakers and you know, they're all yapping too much. So maybe they need more time or something or different instructions. So you're going to have to adjust it for the market. Ed, any other thoughts?

Well, you just remind me of something. Always be prepared to go unplugged, if you will, except virtually. You can't go unplugged virtually, but there was a time in Dallas, Texas, and they had tornadoes. However, several people made it to the particular venue and we actually lost power. But I knew the program so well that I didn't need, I didn't need PowerPoint. So I whipped out a flip chart and there was enough light in the facility that people could see my flip chart. We had handouts and I can, I taught the entire program from a flip chart because people said, hey, let's, I'm here, let's go. And that's what we did. So another thing that you have, you know, you, you have to be able to do is have that ability to go un, unplugged, if you will. If you're doing it, lived and, and, and be able to move on from there.

Guys, you know what's cool is when we do our live events, Darren will tell you. Darren, I think Darren buys five or six flip charts with a sticky tape. Because we use flip charts, we write by hand. And I hate when Darren says, mark, you Better scribe. I have awful handwriting. I don't write a print. But Darren, can I share with our listeners how you use that physical tool for training that you might think, well, it's not high tech, it's a flip chart with a sticky back. How do you use that in training effectively?

Well, I have to give credit to the company peak potentials, T Harv Eker, we learned it from him in the Train the trainer program that we went through, that I went through, that Ed went through. And we take the flip chart paper and we actually put it around the room and we do a debrief or as Ed says, we call it the rapid recall the next morning where we have people standing up, standing in front of each small group, standing around the room in front of each piece of flip chart paper because it's a different segment or different idea that we talked about. And we give them 60 seconds, we blow the horn, we have them move to the next one. So now they're physically up, they're talking and having conversations. So as Ed says, we're not doing the same. Okay, let's review yesterday. It's more fun, it's more engaging. Again, brilliance that Ed learned through his training and brought it, but he just really brought it to life. And so we have everyone moving around the room. Blow the whistle, everybody moves. Blow the whistle, everybody moves. So there's movement, which is, I learned from Ed, which is critical in training. Brilliant. Mark.

I don't know if our listeners, viewers will get a chance to do this or if their business model calls for it, but one of our events that we have, we have a select group of people who are part of our community who come together for a whole day and we devote some time to, to Q and A. But it's not the Q and A that you would expect. What we do is we ask, okay, what would you want to cover over the next couple of hours? I would put a flip chart up and someone writes down what they say. That activity in itself tells the participants, hey, they really care about what I think they want to serve me. It gives a strong quick connection and a really, it's a good deal of buy in because now they know we are writing down what they ask for and holding ourselves accountable to meet that need. Again, you may not be using that particular format, but that has been helpful for us for years. Have done that very, very effectively.

So we got number one, intent, number two, duration, number three, tools. And before we go to number four, Ed, if you're listening to this, one of the things That I love is when people go through our mastering virtual presentations. We are the example for them to model, you know, so in training, you got to be that example. So I love when people are blown away and they, I never thought of that. I never considered that. There's so much that they need. If you want to join us at one of our events, go to stagetime workshops.com stagetimeworkshops.com put in the code pod podcast 25 pod 25. You get 25% discount just for listening to the podcast. And I love hearing Mark from our friends, fans and followers that they listen all the time. They love it, and we have so much fun. And I think that's also a tool. Just one more tool to add is the fun factor that we love working with each other. And the goal, the goal of a training, too, because it's a longer duration, is wow. The, the listener, the, the trainee to say, wow, this flew by. That's the goal. This flew by. So they don't feel like it's a long duration. And that goes back to, are we keeping them engaged? So, Ed Tate, what's number four?

Well, before getting number four, there's two things you guys mentioned that I don't, I don't want us to skip past, because I think it's really, really important having this improv or this unplugged mindset, and that is in case things go wrong, you have to change. You have to be flexible, your technology goes down. So have that improv mindset that, that unplugged mindset. The other thing that Mark mentioned, and I've said this many times, movement makes your messages memorable. Whether you're training live or you're training, especially if you're training virtual, you've got to get the audience to move, that is to stand up. I'm not saying do calisthenics or exercises or anything like that, but if you can just get them to stand or to move, it makes your message memorable. So these are other tools in your toolbox of training. Step number four is results. This aphorism from one of our mentors, Mr. Dr. Alan Weiss, who says, results come later, results come last. What he means by that, Results come after the speech. They come after the training. They don't come during the speech, they don't come during the training. We actually see the behavior change, the results, the skills gap change after the course or the speech or the training has been over with.

And if I could throw in an example. So for a keynote speech, if I'm doing a keynote Speech. Oh crap. I have to give a presentation. One of the keynotes I would do at Toastmasters around the world. I'm inspiring them that there is is a structure that's important, that the listener needs to hear certain things in a certain order in order for them to absorb what you're saying. I can't teach them the whole speech structure in that one hour or 30 minutes. You can't. I can inspire them that it matters, that structure matters for the listener, for the result that you're looking for. But in a training now I can show them step by step how to do it because I've got more time. So again, one little difference and one more idea on how they're critically different and how we approach a training versus approaching a keynote speech. Mark, thoughts on results.

We have a thing called the cta, the Call to Action. And we talk about what do you want the audience to. Ed says no feel or do. Others say think, feel or do. And as a speaker, you really want to inspire the audience to hopefully adopt or adapt one of the ideas you share with them right there. It's tough to see as a result of a training program in the same way because training requires so many different steps, techniques, tools to try them out, to work with them. That's why you do a three or six week program. You won't get the results after the first or second or third week. They've got to go through the whole six week program, apply everything they learned and then check back in and see how it's developed. A keynote wants to leave a strong message and normally a keynote, like an opening keynoter, really has the keynote to set the tone for an event. Whereas training is designed for you to go out there, apply this now, and see the results down the road of what you do. The inspiration of the keynote is to get you going right now to really be. I'm going to tune in, I'm going to learn, I'm going to network, I'm going to do all these wonderful things, I'm going to change the behavior. That's great. But the long term benefit of a training program takes a longer while for it to sink in. They both get results, but there are different kinds of results and different formats. If anyone cares to elaborate on that, please feel free to do so now.

I'm going to take the conversation in a slightly different direction and I'm going to talk about training people, being members of the stagetime community. It's a really big benefit to you because one of the frustrations I have as A keynote speaker is, I never know who's going to take my advice. I give my advice, and you never know. You may never see those people ever again. However, when I do a training in Stage Time University, because I'm connected to the community, I hear back from people. And if you're a trainer, that that's got to be, that's worth something. That, that has to encourage you to, to go on and to, to, to develop more. But again, as a keynoter, man, you just, you never, never know. Occasionally I will hear from someone three or four years later. For example, one time I do surveys on LinkedIn and says, hey, you know, how did you hear about me? Why'd you sign up for my network? I saw you at a keynote, like, eight years ago. You said this and I did this, and that's how I found out. Otherwise I would have never, ever found out. But being part of stagetime Community, you can actually see the members grow. You can actually see people going from one spot to another. So, Sarah Bateman, longtime stagetime member, wouldn't you agree that she's made progress throughout her career? Absolutely, absolutely. She is significantly, she's significantly better. She's more confident, et cetera. So another. Again, being part of a community like stagetime University is not only a benefit to the facilitators, but it's also a benefit to the members because you can see them growing. They can also give you feedback in terms of how you're growing as well.

That's a good point, Ed, because I can't tell you how many times we do programs, and individuals who are part of our community have taken the program and they've learned so much. And the call goes out and they come back, they repeat. Darren calls them our alumni who come back in, and they'll say, you know what? I did this whole thing three days before, but I did it again, and I learned so much more now the second time around. But you can measure their progress and you can see the aha. It's kind of like watching a really great movie two or three times, and you go, oh, I didn't see that the first time. But having a community of people who are being trained together, it really does add to that camaraderie. But you can also, as Ed says, measure and see the result of what they've been doing, what they've been learning and how they're applying what you teach them. Especially when they turn around and say, hey, listen, I'm doing a program and I'm going to apply these techniques. And then they tell you what their attendees said in their trainings, and that's really, really satisfying. Darren?

Yeah, for results. My quick thought to, as I wrap up my idea on this is I can inspire people in a keynote. I can inspire you to want to be a better speaker in a breakout session or a training. I can show you how. So that's how I kind of look at the critical difference. And look, there's crossover, there's blurred lines, but we really want you to get this, that if you're a keynote or you want to do some training, you got to retrain yourself on how to train. And you can't just go from one to the other. The rules are different, the engagement is different, because why the event planner, if they're bringing you in for a training, they have a different result they want than if they're bringing you in for a keynote. So you're getting paid for a different result.

ED the flip side of that is true. If you are a trainer and you're hired for a keynote, they're not expecting a training. So it works both ways. It works both ways. So sometimes you'll have a trainer up there and they're doing exercises and activities, of which I do build exercises and activities into my keynotes, but it just can't be that. So if you're a, if you're a trainer, guess what, you need to be trained and skilled on how to be a keynoter, and vice versa.

Good point. My wife and I were both attending a convention several years ago, and the keynote speaker was trying to get the audience of 2000 people to perform a certain activity. And it just didn't seem, it didn't feel like I was in a room getting a keynote inspirational speech, and it kind of fell flat for me. My wife still talked about it years later. And it's important to understand what is the function you, you have. And as Ed says to reiterate this, you have to be very clear on the objective that the meeting planner or the person who's hiring you wants to achieve. You have to be very, very clear on the kind of results they want and consequently, what kind of program will best serve them. Darren.

So to recap, number one, intent, number two, the duration, number three, the tools that you use for very, very different, and you use them differently, and then for results. So, Ed Tate, your final thoughts on the way the critical ways that training is different from speaking.

I think if you need help with training, the place to go is Stagetime University. They will teach you not only live, but they will also teach you virtually how you can master this art. It's. It's a combination of art and skill and it's not something that you can Google and it's not something that if you're a keynote speaker that you think you can I can do a training. My background is this. I used to work for a company called Career Track, the largest training company in the world. I'm also a trainer for a company called the Denver Rocky Mountain News. Now for some of the younger people, when the earth's crust was cooling, there used to be something called a new newspaper and I worked for that type of organization. But that's my background and it took me years and years and years of mastering this craft, if you will, to make it appear to be effortless. To be a master it you, you need to grind. You need to put in the work.

Darren, and you still need the direction and you need the correction. You need the guidance. You need that mentor, whether it's us or someone else. But you got to get serious if you want to go from training to keynoting or keynoting to training. Our main point is they're different and know how and why they're different so you can be more successful for you to get the result that the event planner is paying you for. By the way, if you have a question for Mark and me, please go to unforgettable presentations podcast.com scroll down a little and there's a place where you can ask us a question. So question, comment, feedback, just go to that page, Unforgettable Presentations Podcast and submit your question to us. Mark Brown Final thoughts and take us home.

Listen. Whether you're a trainer or a speaker or dabbling in both, you can learn the tools to be effective in either one. Here at Stagetown University, we hope to see you Join us because we want you to go from good to great to unforgettable and we'll see you next week.

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