Ep. 152 Moderate This!

Hey there, Mark Brown, being the moderator. Oh my goodness, the game just changed when you go from speaker to moderator. And Mark Brown, you have done this for us many times. You got another one year panelists coming up, but let's talk today about moderating and next week let's dive into being the panelist. But right now, by the way, we just did my launch party and Ed Tate was the moderator and man, he is so good. So, Mark Brown, what are your initial opening thoughts about being the moderator?

Yeah, Darren, I can recall back in 2016 when you asked me to moderate a panel of women professionals for lady and the Champs. Oh my gosh. My first thought was, this is intimidating. But I found out with a few simple ideas and principles, it can be an experience you will not forget. For good reason.

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Mark Brown. Mark Brown. Mark Brown. It's. Let's just say moderate this.

We can go with that. Moderate this. Yeah, it's funny you say that. I remember six years ago in 2016 when you said, we want to do something different for lady and the Champs. We want to have a panel of professional women in. In the speaking industry. And you said, mark, I need you to moderate this. See what I did there?

I see.

And of course, my first thought was the best person for that job was Patricia Fripp, our mentor, past NSA president. But of course, she was a panelist that day. And I was then tasked with being the one to host the event. What was interesting was as the moderator of a panel, I had the responsibility, first of all, to get acquainted with all the panelists, three of whom I had not met before. So one of the first thoughts, I have idea. Number one, if you get asked to moderate a panel, and we say this because as presenters, we now need to be as diverse and as flexible as we can to serve the industry. Getting up on stage, giving a keynote is nice, but there's so much more you can do. And sometimes having that particular additional skill will be that which gets you the assignment or gets you into a good stead with a bureau, with a client, with an industry. So open your Mind to the idea of doing this because one more tool in your presenter's tool belt. That being said, I had to introduce myself to all the panelists. I knew two of them, I had to meet three more. I knew three of them, had to meet two more, and I had to invest the time to build a quick relationship with them. Of course, you got to intro yourself, but they know why I was having the conversation to get to know them. Because when you're moderating a panel, one of your first responsibilities is to introduce the panelists very briefly before the actual conversation begins, without building that before rapport, as we call it, and get to know people. I could not have done as well as I was told I did. So, number one, contact them, get to know them. Not just look, email is great, but a telephone call, you hear their voice, you hear their voice, you get a little bit acquainted. That way, when the event does occur, you know you aren't going in cold. We have met, we've had a conversation. I understand their slant on the topic, their perspective, which becomes important later on in our discussion. So, number one, contact panelists, get to know them, introduce yourself, have a conversations with them. Not just text or email or anything like that. Have a conversation with them, become acquainted with them and also their level of expertise on the topic. Now, I don't know, Darren, if you had to be a marketer before, I know you've been a panelist, but it's one key point. Number one, having that relationship was for me, literally a game changer because my tension, my first time doing this six years ago was, okay, I can breathe now because they know who I am, I know who they are. And it really led itself to a level of comfort. And here's a little bonus part of this. In the panel discussion, you're really having a conversation with the panelists. But having had the prior conversation, your level of comfort is much more, much more palatable. You feel more relaxed because you've been down that road before.

Yeah. And Mark, real important to getting the introduction from them and making sure that you make it really tight, because I'm sure when you deal for anyone, you deal with different personalities. One person is not going to get it. They're going to send you the whole bio. Another person is not going to get back to you until the day of an F30, 32 different excuses as to why they had this drama going on. But as the moderator, we've got to cope with all that. But no, some people get back to you right away. Some people give you what you need, and some people won't. But building that relationship is key, and I think you can't underestimate that. We see our friend Ed Tate does this really well. Just taking the time, even before you call them, to actually do a little research, write down a few facts, because it's gonna help you in the interview, but it's also gonna help you, as you said, build the relationship.

Yeah, it's true. And I know it's a very easy temptation to find out by going to two places. I'll go to LinkedIn and I'll go to their website. And of course, generally, websites are gonna give you, as you said, Darren, the cv, the bio, the whole nine, where they went to school, what they studied, if the individual panelist does not get back, and even if they do, even if they do, it's useful to look at the information, their profile on LinkedIn, if they have a LinkedIn profile and also on their website, because you can then look for interesting tidbits about them from those two sources. Because the last thing you want to do is recite their bio. Unless a particular point of the education is germane to the topic is significant. It's a salient point the audience needs to hear. Fine, but you don't want to go there and read the resume. You want to find interesting things. One point about the education, an accomplishment, an interesting or unique circumstance you can draw on or even call upon in the conversation to add to the discussion. But it's important, yes. To do your research before as well as have that conversation. Definitely. That's point number one. Have that conversation. And in addition to that, my point number two is very general. When I say prepare in advance, what I mean is, yes, do the research, but understanding who the individuals are and their perspective on the topic of discussion, it would be helpful for you knowing all of this to say, ah, I know I can ask a particular question heading in a particular direction for that particular panelist, whereas for a different panelist, I'll ask a different question or I point in a different direction. Or what that means is, along with doing the research, the number two prep piece includes finding out what points of interest you would want to highlight and deliberately bring up in conversation for each of the panelists. Remember, they all have their own perspective, they all have their own experience. And as a moderator, you want to make sure you give them the opportunity to share that perspective, but govern it and manage it well. So the research, the prep piece involves finding out the unique individual points of view that would be helpful for the conversation. The last thing the audience wants is to hear the same question five times and the same perspective five times. That defeats the purpose of a panel because you want different ideas from different presenters.

Yeah, great point, Mark. And I think it also goes back to. I don't know if this is one of your points, but intention. What is the intention of the panel? And like you said, just realizing we don't want to ask the same question. So where are you from? What do you think? You know, that was. Yeah, that does not serve the audience. It's about you as the moderator, making it not about you.

Yeah, well said.

It's about you making it not about you, but making it for the audience and what the audience needs. So what we have to do, as you're saying, Mark, just to come at it from a different perspective, as you say, we need to set up near the beginning the credibility of our panelists. The credibility of our panelists and why we should listen to them. And we also maybe not want to. This is probably harsh to say, Mark, but we want to invite different perspectives. Maybe not conflict, though. It could happen.

It could. It could. Yes.

But that's good, you know, other than maybe a fist fight and throwing bottles of water.

No, we wouldn't do that.

We don't want to make it like Meet the Press, but the idea is that there's different people with different perspectives and they're all valid from their world, but we need to make it about the audience's world and give them that plethora of perspective.

Yes, I like that. And by the way, your point was really point number three, right. To set up the credibility of the panelists. And that's going to be important as point number three, set up the credibility. Because here's the blessing you're offering to your audience, those who are live or hybrid or tuning in online. The beauty is when you do this, when we do this well, we give the audience the opportunity to hear, in effect, three, four or five presenters in one session. Now, just think for a second what that means. It means that we have now given the audience a chance to open their minds to different perspectives, because we're accustomed to one presenter. And one presenter will give you their perspective, their experience, their wisdom, and that's wonderful. But in this hour or 90 minutes, we have the opportunity to lead these panelists into giving the audience a broad spectrum. And in one individual session, that is not enormously easy, but it is important and it done well, you can really make the experience unforgettable because they'll walk away saying, Wow. I got so much from Darren, so much from Ed, so much from Verity, so much from Melissa, and I'm leaving full. And when you moderate well, you will give the audience a blessing, having received so much from so many in such a compact period of time. And Darren, you said earlier it's important to govern how much time is spent because you don't want one person to be a chatterbox or to rattle off too much. And there's some ways you can do that. One of the things that I recommend that you do, I was able to do well is point number four, and that is on the day, allow each panelist a specific time for opening remarks. That should not be a 20 minute mini speech speech or a 7 minute TEDx talk. It should be an opening remark on the topic that everyone knows that we're there, we establish a topic. And when you have the conversations with each panelist, what I found helped me was I said, I know your era of expertise is this. I'm going to ask for a brief opening remark, 30 seconds or fewer on this particular perspective on a topic. Will that be okay? Yes. So I set up the expectation of the audience that day, but I set up the expectation of the panelists in advance. So I allow, I ask for, I ask for opening remarks on the topic. And sometimes that alone can spark some discussion, depending upon the topic, depending on the panelists, and depending on the remarks that they give in the opening.

I think you hit an important point too, but I want to make sure we go deep enough on it that it's your responsibility. Now, you might be speaking for an organization who brought you in to be the moderator. However, it's still on you to brief the panelists that we need short, specific, because a lot of them maybe a well known expert or speaker, but they might not have the experience of being on a panel. So we've got to frame it that it's got to be, as Patricia would say, short, specific opening remarks. So telling them 30 seconds. And we've got to use a little bit of authority to make sure they get that we're going to have to politely cut them off if they go on and on in three or four minutes when they're supposed to do 30 seconds. So you're dealing with egos here too. So this is the ultimate improv exercise. And that's why the more preparation we do beforehand, the easier and more powerful the actual panel can be.

Yes, I agree to brief the panelists to be brief in their opening remarks is going to be important. But point number Four is you want to make sure the opening remarks are delivered by each panelist. It sets up their perspective, their level of expertise, and it really should help whet the audience's appetite. And by the way, as a sidebar, don't be afraid to bring a folder with notes in it. You don't want, you know, looking cool is not important here. Having the expertise at your fingertips is important. I know I saw photographs of this recently. I had my notes in front of me. I even kept my notes in a document I'm looking at right now when we had Patricia Fripp, Janelle Barlow, Judy Morio, Cathy Amir standing for Lear. I have all my notes from six years ago because that was important for me to manage, because as a moderator, you're actually managing that session, because it's important to make sure that they are brief in their opening remarks. Point number five is a very broad point. Darren and I would like to get your thoughts on this because you're a proponent of having her good flow in a presentation. And my point number five is this. The flow of the session is really on your shoulders. What I mean by that, the tension I felt inside was not visible because most of the time, the audience had their eyes on our five panelists. But I kept thinking to myself, okay, who has not spoken yet? How can I invite them in so they don't feel left out and someone doesn't dominate the conversation? This sounds simple in principle, but trust me, especially with animated conversation, it can be difficult to keep track of who has not spoken, who needs to be given a chance to speak, and that way, you want to create a kind of flow where everyone's perspective is heard, everyone's point of view is managed. And sometimes you will need to use a line like, well, please hold on a second. I want to get Janelle's take on this because I know in her experience, she has. And you call back to the research you have done, that qualifies you to specifically ask a particular panelist to weigh in on the direction in which the conversation is going. I want to say it again, and hopefully in simpler terms. It's wise to be aware of when it's appropriate to say, hang on, let's sit here for a while. I do want to get speaker number five's perspective on this because I know in the past three years they have that is it at all. So now the audience knows where I'm going and why I'm going, and they're now anticipating another perspective from someone who is credible enough to offer an opinion that's part of managing the flow. It's giving every individual a chance to speak and also making sure it is balanced. Because, Darren, you and I both know some speakers will say a lot in 15 seconds and some will say a little in 15 minutes. And that can be really interesting because here's the key. You're dealing with five different personalities at one time. It looks smooth when someone who's good does it, but it isn't as easy as it may look.

Exactly. And one of the challenges, you might not have been the person who chose the panel. So.

Ah, that's true.

You're given a lot of. Yeah. I still remember when I think it was Bill, when he was Patriots coach back before Belichick, and he just had this great analogy because he was asked to coach the team, but he wasn't given any insight on who they would choose, you know, when they were drafting. So he's like, look, if you want me to cook the dinner, at least let me choose the groceries, you know, or have a say in it. But anyway, we have to understand that you've got people with ego that we have to manage, and that's our job. And when you get asked to moderate, it might sound like, oh, this would be cool and fun, and it can be. But please understand that there's a lot of preparation to be able to make that moment, those moments on stage go smoothly. So, Mark, I don't know if I went off on a tangent here on what you passed over to me that popped up, but I just wanted to make sure that people get that. It's not as easy as it looks when you see a skilled moderator who did their homework. It's one thing when you talk about your expertise. It's another thing when you are a panelist, which we'll talk about next week. But being the moderator, there's a lot more pressure on you than you would think.

Yeah. And I found I prepared questions for the panelists. I prepared more than I considered necessary. And I will confess this as well. I also asked each of the panelists for that particular event six years ago. I said, is there one specific question you would like me to ask to help you to deliver one of the messages you have for our audience to hear what that question did for me, but actually for the panelists, was it let them know I was genuinely interested in getting their perspective, and I was willing to lead them with at least one question to lead them in a direction that allowed them to really expand on their expertise, their experience, and the benefit they had for the audience and all the panelists were able to appreciate that I had two or three questions for each panelist in the conversation that we had. I probably had time to ask two, and here's why. Goes back to the flow. Very often with panelists, what you're going to see is that they will give a statement. They'll make a statement that leads to a conversation, a discussion, and at times, a contrary perspective. My recommendation, don't shy away from that. Having a contrary perspective is not necessarily a bad thing. It again, provides your audience with a broader perspective on the topic of. And someone who says, well, I don't quite see it that way, and here's why. Now your audience gets. Ooh, another point of view. I'm learning more than I thought. I always thought that Josh was the expert, but now Selena just said something I didn't think of before. That's pretty awesome. So what happens is you allow the discussion to open up, but be aware of your time and be aware of when something becomes repetitive or being said too many times. You have to be firm and loving in making sure the flow is good and staying within time, which means also throughout the entire period, you have to be aware of what time it is. I recommend if you're on a large stage or on the live stage, having a clock on the floor facing you and the panelists.

And the panelists.

And the panelists. Yeah, so you can all see nice bright red or bright green flashing countdown timer. So you know where you need to be. Is all planning. It really is. Does require more planning than it looks like it takes. But you know, with the last 20 to go, this is going to happen. And you tell the panelists in advance, we have. We have 75 minutes for this. Okay. And you may or may not, depending on your environment. You may or may not yield questions from the audience.

Okay.

And that's number six. Number six is be aware. If the event is going to allow for the audience to ask questions or will the moderator be the one to guide the whole process? You may have either or scenario. Be aware upfront. And if you know you're going to have a Q and A session as part of it, you need to allocate enough time with the meeting planner for the questions to be given to individual. And you won't ask everyone the same question. That's just too much time. But you want to have enough time for the panelists to receive the questions and to respond to them. You govern that. And like doing a regular Q and A, you want to make sure you Let everyone know we have time for two more questions. And then I'm going to ask each other panelists to give their closing remarks 30 seconds or fewer. That sets up the expectation of when we're going to wind this thing down. So be very, very aware of, of the parameters of the meeting and what you will need to do to make sure you govern the Q and A. Now, we did a whole podcast on Q and A. Check that out when you can. It'll really help you to handle that. But just be aware as moderator, that's on you to govern, to manage how questions are going to be handled. The other piece of that regarding the Q and A, the bonus piece of that is you need to be sure in advance how it's going to be done. In some scenarios, individuals in an association, for example, a particular demographic, they'll say, okay, we're going to allow our members to submit questions to us by email in advance. We're going to choose some of those questions. Or some may say, we will set up two microphones, one to the right, one to the left. We're going to ask people to come up and ask the question. It all depends on how the organization governs their Q and A higher level I've been in, they make sure they know what the questions are in advance. So there's no surprise questions, no trick questions, no embarrassing questions, and no panelists feel set up. The last thing you want is for a panelist to feel you set them up at a big no, no. Okay. You want to be very, very careful about that. So the Q and A piece, if you're going to have individuals in the room, has to be governed by very, very carefully. In collaboration with your meeting planner and association executives.

Yeah, I think one of the things that we did really well is when we run Game Changers, Michael Davis is the moderator for the panel. And what we've done in the past when we had the larger event pre Covid, we had people on a piece of paper write out their question, and then Mike got the handful of questions and he could sort it out and he could categorize them.

Right.

So we again, for flow. And, you know, some of the questions are repetitive. It is very helpful when you can say whether it was sent in ahead of time from Bob Stanley, who has been a veteran in this industry. Now you're lifting him up, you're lifting the question. And. And they're sitting there, you know, some of them. Well, well, that was my question, you know.

Yeah. So.

But now it gets. It creates that engagement without Losing control. And Mark, just another quick. We talk about different perspectives, but to give you an example from your situation, we had Patricia Fripp, who is a legend in the industry. And of course, our audience is presenters. We had Kathy Armillas, who is a TedX coach, which that's different. And then we had Jennifer Joseph, who is literally a Las Vegas performer, like, headliner. I'm like, are you kidding me now?

Performance.

So she comes at it from one way, TEDx Coach comes at it from one way, legend comes at it from another way. And the audience wins. It is refreshing to have all their perspectives. And Mark, I have two quick ideas before we wrap this up. So one is you still gotta write your own introduction. Who's gonna set you up? Is it gonna be a video? Are you gonna walk on cold? Hopefully they could have the host of the event bring you up and introduce you. But you have to have and create an introduction. Remember why you have some credibility so the audience knows that you come to this from a perspective as well of credibility. You're not the outsider. And then I'll have a final thought as we wrap it up. But that's my other insight that I thought would be important for this, Mark.

Yeah, I appreciate that. Like I said, as you come to the end, you want to govern Q and A very, very carefully, but always you want to leave the audience with the last words of every panelist. And sometimes, well, oftentimes what happens is at the end of a session, in their closing remarks, a panelist may reiterate their opening remarks in a different way, but they oftentimes, their closing remarks will include their take on a perspective that someone else on the panel gave that they have now embraced. So the added bonuses, they're reinforcing their point, but they're also going to reinforce the point of somebody else in the panel. And again, the audience wins. But the respect you afford the panelists by giving them the opportunity to deliver their closing remarks and again, within the confines of time, is going to be very, very important. And it becomes your responsibility to close out in a way that once again revalidates the panelists, uplifts the audience. And what you'll find is some very good moderators will reiterate what we call keepers at Stakestown University. We talk about key points that they take away. And I've seen other moderators do that very, very well. They don't belabor it, but they'll say, there's three really powerful thoughts I'm going to bring in in my life as well. And Here they are. Boom, boom, boom. But your closing remarks must revalidate the panelists, uplift the audience, so everyone leaves in a win, win environment. And that's how you can be an unforgettable moderator. Darren, I can't wait to hear your perspective on this.

My biggest thing is, remember this one critical factor. Make it fun. Make it fun. That's like the secret ingredient, the yeast that goes throughout the bread that allows it to, you know, and we have to set that up sometimes. And some of your moderator, some of the people you're moderating, some of the panelists are not going to have that mindset. You've got to bring that joy and that positivity to your questions. You've got to laugh at their jokes, not inauthentically, authentically. You've got to create this place of fun. I remember watching early in my comedy career, I would go to interviews when my mentor was being interviewed, like on the radio or something. He always told me, make it your job to make the host laugh. And so we have to help make the panelists laugh. So the audience. But we got to bring that joy. And we've also, Mark, even set that up in our Q and A with the individual panelist conversations earlier. Say, hey, I really want to make this fun. So is there a fun fact maybe you could get from each one of them just to bring the human side of it as well? So, Mark Brown, final thoughts?

Well, yeah, a couple of things, actually, because you mentioned that I've had a chance to be a moderator as well. And the fun fact is important. And as a moderator, depending upon your circumstance, situation, or how it's being done, it's okay to let people know we're going to be doing this. You know, I'm going to be on a panel. I'm going to be a panelist. Coming up this weekend, a few. You know, you're gonna get this on Thursday. Two days later, I'm doing a panel with two other Toastmasters world champions for a global event for Toastmasters. I can't wait to do it. It's gonna be fun for me. And as Darren says, if you as a moderator, set the tone, set the atmosphere, you are the barometer. You know, you're the thermostat. And make it a fun experience for the panelists is going to flow right out to the audience, physical, virtual, or hybrid. And that way, everybody not only learns, but they have fun in the process. So here's my thought for you. If you get the opportunity to be a moderator, don't Forget. Contact panelists in advance. Get to know them. Build a relationship. Okay. Prepare in every possible way. Learn those fun facts. Forget their bios. Set up their credibility when you get there. You want to get them to give open remarks, certainly. And set it up. But you govern the flow. You govern the Q and A. You govern the experience that you have. Let them cheer their final thoughts. And when you all walk away, you walk away saying, man, I am so happy I got to be a part of the experience. I can't wait. You do that, you will create a memorable panel discussion and it will be unforgettable.

Join us next week about being on the other side, being the panelist.

See you then.

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