Ep. 261 NSA’S LAST STORY STANDING WINNER – JEFF ROGERS

Hey there, Mark Brown. Again, we have Michael Davis with us. And we have NSA's last story standing winner, the Mr. Jeff Rogers coming up. I always love learning stories from winners, especially when it comes to storytelling. Mark, your thoughts.

It's gonna be great. Let's do this.

Anyone can give a presentation. Few deliver un. Unforgettable presentations. What's the difference? You're about to find out. Welcome to the Unforgettable Presentations podcasts with your hosts, world champion speakers and coaches, Mark Brown.

Mark Brown, your life tells a story, and there's someone out there who needs to hear it.

And Darren Lacroix. And Darren Lacroix.

Stage time. Stage time. Stage time.

Ready for some powerful presentation? Aha. Pause. Let's dive right in.

All right, so, Jeff, congratulations.

Thank you.

That was great. That was so funny. And I loved how you told the story. But for anyone who's listening, if you're not aware, nsa, the National Speakers association had a competition called the Last Story Standing, and Jeff just won a couple days ago on the main stage. Well, when you're listening to this, a week ago, but the main stage at nsa and Michael Davis was one, one, one, One of his coaches, and he's also one of our staff on stagetime University. So, Michael, let's have you lead the show, and then Mark and I will jump in with some questions. So congratulations to Mike Davis as one of the coaches. And by the way, just for the record, I was in the competition too, and Michael coached me as wondering if he was holding back.

Regional. You made it to regionals, though, didn't you?

I did, I did, yeah, I did. But now, you know, I'm like, well, was Michael holding back?

Or if you're going to put it that way, I'm going. I'm going to. I'm going to steal Michael thunder for a second. I'm going to ask the first question, and they're both going to respond to this. So, Jeff, why enter NSA's last story standing?

I'll be honest, Marc. I just recently joined nsa. I joined about a year ago. I've been on stage as a host at keynote as well as doing training and things for the last 30 years. But when I wanted to build my keynote business up and start doing it a little bit more as a pillar of my business, I thought, okay, let's join nsa. And this was literally, the timing couldn't have been better. I thought, oh, what a great way to get to know some of the other people, some of the other speakers. Right? This would be great. They kind of Get a sense of me and maybe where I fit in the. In this, you know, in the spectrum of speakers and stuff. And I had only been to a meeting or two, and so I was like, yeah, I'll, you know, submit it. And it literally just kept on falling up. I feel like as it moved up the ranks, it was more just to get to know people and become involved a little bit as well. Wow.

I'll make one comment and then lead the next question. My comment is this. I was with Darren Lacroix when he was competing in Toastmasters 23 years ago, and he really had an eye for the trophy at one point. But you just said you went into the program to build relationships, to get to know people and understand the organization. So your first goal was, I'm gonna win the trophy. Your goal was to build relationships. And I want to suspect that not only did you win a trophy, but you did build those relationships, right?

Yeah, it really did work to what my goal was for it, which was to build those relationships, get an understanding of the process and kind of what people think of how to use story in their keynotes and their process for doing it. There was a really interesting rubric for this contest, which was it was not just the best story, because there were, you know, if I'm being honest, there, there were better stories.

You're welcome.

That's true, Darren.

I'm just kidding.

Just kidding.

I got to watch Darren's because they posted our videos online, and I got to watch Darren's, and Darren's was a very touching story. One of the things that I hewed to though in mine was that they really wanted marketability and relatability, meaning. And their explanation of that was, could someone repeat your story and get the same effect out of it or the same impact? And so that defined a little bit of which story I told and how I told it. After working with Mike and another coach, Ray Engen, who the two of them, I feel like I have the two Greek gods of storytelling at my back.

Because, oh, boy, there's gonna be no living with Michael Davis from now on.

You know what?

Let me just change my name.

He does a great job, and he did a great job with me. Look, I mean, I've got 30 years on the stage and as a performer, as an improviser, as a keynote, as a host, so I feel like I've got a ton of experience. But when it came to sharpening this to where I thought this is where this needs to go, Mike and Ray were utterly and completely indispensable in helping me define that. And I would say that. And Darren, you did the same thing. You got somebody else to watch you and help you. Oh, absolutely. That's a lot of what stagetime University does, is it? It really provides that coaching so that you can get to that next level. And I'm a big believer in finding a coach and working with coaches to get to that next level.

Nice. Michael Davis, would you like to speak?

Greek gods don't need to speak.

His head fit in the frame of the screen.

Right now, I'm going to have to spotlight him or Jeff.

I didn't have the experience that Mark had when Darren approached him 23 years ago. And there's a story within the Stagetime community where Mark took a look at Darren's first speech and said, oh, Darren, we have some work to do. When you brought that story to Ray and me, Ray and I talked afterwards, that that's a really good story. And one of the things we knew about you because of your background in improv and presenting and hosting, and you're world class at all those delivery was never going to be an issue for you, which is a big part of the game for a lot of speakers, as we see here in stagetime University, is really getting them to not deliver a speech, but to connect with the audience. And that was never an issue for you. So we could really hone in on tweaking that material from day one. But from the start, it was really good.

Oops.

What is one insight you've gained about yourself in this journey?

I absolutely played this with no ego. That was a huge thing for me. I really did sort of step away from any ego about my performance or the content because I knew that would get in the way of delivering the best thing that I could deliver. So that was a big thing that worked. Just listening to both you two as coaches and input from several coaches that NSA provided as well. Jim Cathcart, who's a big. I mean, huge speaker. Kevin o' Connor in my local chapter, gave me some great insights. But Jim's insights were hysterical because he would do it in a really gentle, sly way. He just say, you know, Jeff, I gotta tell you, I have no notes to give you on this. This is really. You're in a great spot. I got nothing to say. I wonder if. And then he would. Right. I mean, and then he would just lay down this pearl. And I was like, of course I should be doing that. And that really was at the very final sort of level of just that tweaking and he just had one or two that were just really, I think, took it to that next level. Right. That made me feel very confident in it without being arrogant about it.

Nice.

And I like the way NSA set this up. I mean, all the speakers could get their own coaches, which Jeff did. But going higher up, you got hall of Fame speakers to give you feedback. And Darren, when he went through his journey, his coach said, I've never been on the world stage. You need to meet. Meet Mark Brown. So there a lot of parallel there between the two. As a storyteller, what is one storytelling skill you think you've picked up on this journey?

Well, I think one of the things I've always done, and maybe I amped it up a little bit for this, is that when I tell a story, I tend to enact it in order to really get the most out of it. So the characters have voices and they have perspectives and they have a reality to them. And that may come from my theater background, that may come from my performance background, but I really try and really put that into the story itself. So it's not just about talking about a place. I bring people into that moment as it's happening. And that was a big part of the goal for this in terms of my delivery goal. But then it became a really impactful part of the judging as well, because they mentioned that multiple times.

Patricia Fripp especially loved your dialogue.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, just the feedback I got from the judges was phenomenal in terms of their insightfulness and what they picked up on. So I would say that would be a big thing. If you're telling a story, live the story and make sure that your audience is there with you, because it makes it so much more engaging when it's delivered with that kind of passion and engagement.

What was fabulous about this story is, yes, it was your experience, but it was really the giant that was the focus. And that's the entire lesson. And that's what I saw in some of the other speeches in the competition from start to finish. But yours here is a metaphor for problems, and it's sellable in the marketplace. That's what's different. If you're watching this or listening to this, this is not a Toastmasters type outcome, because marketability was one of those questions. And because this is the first year and I was working with NSA Kentucky with their entire competition, we were really struggling with this, and we had to contact the home office, and I think they're still trying to figure that out. How do you determine what's Marketable. How do you judge that?

That's. That's a tough one.

It is.

Yeah.

Go ahead.

One thing they. A number of people came up to me and said, which I found very interesting. There were a number of times where I got feedback that was really illuminating and I had no perspective on, which really speaks to the idea of doing it to different audiences so that you can get that feedback and that different perspectives and the opportunity to do that from different sources. But at the event itself, one of the things I heard was, look, those other stories were great, but I've never been through that situation, and I have no idea what that situation is like. My story has to do with me working at a Macy's for five minutes during Black Friday and helping a giant out. And so. But that. That really. People identified with the everyday aspect of that. And then they also thought how wonderful that that's something in that simple moment, in that simple decision that I make in the. In the sort of the crux of the story is an opportunity for everybody to make that decision in their lives where they are. And that, again, purposeful. And yet the fact that people got that they really liked the fact that it was a simple story that really could happen to anybody. And that also, I think, touches on the idea of not being the hero of your story. I mean, I kind of am, but the real hero of the story is, I would say the giant or even the concept of helping other people is the hero of the story. And I'm sort of there as a guide. And that's a big thing I know Michael talks about all the time. And Ray, in terms of when you're telling a story, be the guide, not the hero. And so I think people got that idea. And I think that's one of the things they did is put themselves in the story and allow them to go along for the ride.

And I think if you're. If you're watching or listening, you've got to go see the video. And I know there'll be a link made available. Jeff's story is about being in a Macy's the day after Thanksgiving, going to buy a coat, which there's some humor behind that. This giant of a man approaches him thinking, Jeff works there. Jeff has to make a decision. Do I jump in and say, oh, no, I don't work here, or did he jump in and play? He decides to play. And Jeff, I told you this. Mark and Darren, you don't know this. When we were at stage time in Vegas staying in the Strat, I'd heard the early version of Jeff's story. It impacted me because I'm standing in a restaurant, that Asian restaurant, if you remember, that was right at the front of the Strat, and there's no host. And this couple walks in, and they look at me and say, are you seating? I thought of Jeff in that moment, and I played. I said, we'll be seating soon. Just hold on. Let me get you a couple menus. I went behind the host stand, and I played. I don't know if I would have done that if I hadn't heard Jeff's story.

Interesting.

So it impacted me to have fun in a moment where I might have automatically said, well, I don't work here. And it became a really fun 15 minutes.

That's awesome.

I'm curious. Aaron, you go first, please.

You go first. One of the things that you did that I actually encourage people not to do, but you pulled off magnificently was you had a lot of asides that were very funny, that you kind of stepped out of the speech and then delivered a line almost as a commentator or the narrator, and then you jumped right back in. And normally, most people can't pull it off. You did it brilliantly. You're, like the exception. Did anyone advise you against that? Was that just a natural tendency, your insights?

Yeah. So that very much is my style. To be able to, as a performer and as a host, an emcee, to be able to step out and say, step back in. That's definitely something I've worked on for years in terms of being comfortable with that. And I totally understand what you're saying in terms of. It's not easy, but it is something that I've done repetitively for years and years and years. So with me, the difficulty level is much lower because of repetitions.

Sure.

But it's also a thing. There were a couple of people. Now I start my story, like, literally right in the middle of it, and then I step back and start giving people the context of it. I was given direction to not do that because they felt that the audience would not understand it, not understand where it was. So there were a couple of points where I got some feedback, and I was like, yeah, no, my style is this. I know what I can do in my style or what I feel comfortable in, because the other side of it is. I feel like a lot of people are coached out of their personal style, and it's. It needs to be authentic. And in order to be authentic, you got to stay in your style. Now, it should be what I Call your host best. Like when you're hosting a party and you're engaging and charming and, you know, your very best self style, but your style, how you speak. And so for me, I love jumping in the middle of it and then giving context and then jumping back in and then having an aside and that kind of play with the format, you know, gives me a lot of comfort, and it's something I'm comfortable doing.

Yeah, I love what you said. And, Mark, I'm sure you probably wrote it down. We've seen a lot of people who are newer coaches, and they do exactly. They coach them to be their style as opposed to enhance your style and let you be you. And that if you're watching this, please get a coach and please make sure you get the right coach who doesn't take your style away from you like that. That's a big, big, big one. So Michael Davis and Ray Engin, thank you for being that advanced. So you knew what to do and what not to do because, like, that was one of the things that really helped you to stand out from the other contestants. Mark, you had a question.

Yes. Question for you, Jeff, about the coaching. What was the best advice you decided not to take? In other words, we might say that's a great idea. But Jeff said, no, it's not for me. What's the best advice you chose not to take?

Definitely the beginning stuff about I should start explaining the story before I jumped in because I jump in with the giant speaking first.

Excuse me. Excuse me.

Yeah, exactly. So there was definitely that. And then there was some advice about losing the play, Losing the word play and losing. Just cutting it out and cutting out the idea of play and making the talk strictly about your choice of showing up. Right. Your response. And that's one of the things that I point out, and I felt like that didn't align with who I am or what I wanted to share, like, my message. Right. And so if I go down, I want to go down with my message. I don't. I didn't want to win until I was in the final three. When I was in the final three, I was like, okay, now I kind of do want to win. I do see the pride. But honestly, it was great just to get to that level because even that was really, you know, incredible to be of the top three of 300 or so candidates who auditioned or competed. But that idea of losing play was the biggest thing that I said, no, I'm not going to lose it. I did tweak it a little bit, but I felt like it was central to the overall idea that when we play, we lower the stakes. When we lower the stakes, we're able to try different things. And I think most people aren't. They don't like the idea of being put in that spot where they're trying something they don't know for the first time. Right. Except if it's play, if we're playing, then it's okay to try something out. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. That's fine. We tried it out. Now we have the knowledge and experience that we can base our next attempt on. But if we don't play, we don't have that. And that's the mindset I really wanted to get across to people is, hey, remember to play. It's okay. It's what it's. Honestly, it's a. It's an evolutionary tool that we have that people dismiss because it also can bring fun. Heaven forbid we have fun.

Well, for the record. For the record, I thought play was brilliant because it was more lighthearted, more positive. We're more willing to play and to work. So I really love it. Darren.

I got a question for you, Mike. How was it working with Jeff? Like, what made Jeff stand out as being coachable?

Oh, he's impossible to work with now. It goes back to what you said, Darren, your point is that you've got to know the rules. We talk about this a lot in stage time. You got to know the foundational ideas which allowed Jeff to do. What we normally teach is don't step out of your scene because you ruined the flow. He does it so well. It never occurred to me until you just said it there and that's what he was doing. We never had to call it out on him because that's who Jeff is. Knowing Jeff for three years, as I have, his style is about play and having fun with an audience.

That's awesome.

That was the most fun when you know your client talking about client. But Jeff and I have been friends. When you know somebody that well, it makes it a lot easier to coach them because there were times, a couple times, Ray and I said, that's not you, Jeff. What are you trying to do? Because I think other people, as happens in a competition, get in your ear. It's like, no, step back. This is who you are.

Jeff and I know we're running out of time here because you have a busy schedule now that you're the champion. I remember those days. So, Jeff, if somebody do, we know where they're going. To post it the video yet or.

No, I'm not sure. I had a couple of friends in the audience who recorded it and so I'm going to see about posting their recording. I think that's okay.

Mark, on the core call last night.

Didn'T you have that was the recording on the website of his submitted video, which also. That's available if Darren. Darren can probably put it on the. In the show notes in the link below. But I have not seen the live performance. I'm also eager to see it, so we'll see what happens with that.

So if you're listening to this, look it up on YouTube. I'm assuming if you get it, you can put your version on YouTube. Jeff?

Yeah, if you go to jeffrogersunlimited.com I've got it on there. I've got the submitted version. So which gives you an idea of it. I will tell you one thing. It was a five minute ceiling on this for. In terms of length of time.

Yeah.

You know how close you came, right?

I keep. Right to the second. Right to the second. I mean it was. And I looked. What threw me off a little bit was the laughs. I know this sounds a little selfish, you know, aggrandizing, but the laughs were a little bit bigger than I had.

Yep.

It's live. It's live. It grows in its life.

700 people.

It's a huge audience. So the laugh, the first big laugh rolled out and then it rolled back.

Yeah.

I was like, oh, that just cost me 10 seconds.

Yep. I was literally watching my. I'm like, jeff, you got this. If you just shut up, Jeff, shut up.

I know. And then I had another big laugh in there that was way bigger than I thought it was going to be.

Always happening.

And then I literally. And that cost me 10 seconds of time and I had allotted like 30 seconds. So there was a build up this. So anyways, in my last kids I had. It was seven seconds and I had my last three lines and I had intended to go 1, 2, 3 and just end with that, you know that just. There you go. And so I look down and it's seven seconds. And so it goes 1, 2, 3. I knew I was gonna be super close. I was just hoping I wouldn't go over it.

And Jeff, in your final version, practicing by yourself, how long was it?

Oh, I had it down to about 4 minutes 20.

Yeah.

Without sounding like I was speeding through it. Right. I mean it was about 4:20 somewhere right around there. So it. That laughter. I left that top 40 seconds for laughter. And it ate up a good chunk of it.

Got every one of them.

The downside of having a great connection with the audience and being funny.

Yeah, right.

At least in a time competition. Our friend Ed Tate, who won in 2000, the world championship, 7 minutes and 30 seconds, he did not have one second to spare or he would have.

Lost, just like you. So Jeff, how, how can people follow you? Where else could they find you? Your website, Any social media?

Yep, yep, they can finally on@jeffrogersunlimited.com on LinkedIn and on Facebook and Instagram. Meet Jeff Rogers.

Meet Jeff Rogers.

Right.

And any advice to someone, the value of competing to work on your storytelling?

Oh, without a doubt, without a doubt. I would say listen, if I had two pieces of advice and I'm by no means, oh, because I've won this, I'm the best ever. But I think the two big reasons that I came through on this was first off, coaching, that would be number one, without a doubt was having those friends who are also incredible speakers and coaches in their own right, give me that feedback. And then the other thing is join, participate, don't stand back and go, oh, I'll see how it goes. Go play, go play. It doesn't matter how good you are, bad you are, you'll get better. And the only way to get better is by participating, by playing. And if you can do that, you win on so many other levels, it's not even funny. I met so many people and such good, good connections with people before I won and after I won. It was, you know, 10x effect. But jump in, play absolutely without a doubt.

Nice, Mark. Did we take notes on this one or no?

Did I take notes? Is my name Mark Brown? Come on, dude. Come on, man. Real quickly, some pros of wisdom. Build the relationships first, everything else follows. Seek to learn, get a coach and sharpen your story whenever you can. Be willing to step away from your ego. Don't just tell the story and act it. Know the different characters perspective in your story. Don't be the hero of your own story. And remember this, your story hero can even be a concept. Practice, repetition makes you better. Stay in your style. Don't let anyone coach you out of it. If you're gonna go down, go down with your message. And remember, participate. Go play.

Nice.

Pearls of wisdom, Jeff.

You said all. Yeah, you said all that, Jeff.

No kidding, this was brilliant.

Nice.

You're worth my friend.

Jeff. Thanks for squeezing us in. Michael, thanks for being here with us as well. Thanks for listening to the Unforgettable Presentations podcast, please find Jeff Speech Reach out to Jeff, say hello. Though he's super busy now that he's the champion, so good luck booking him. But anyway, thanks Jeff for being here. I know you gotta go, so thanks again for being part of Unforgettable Presentations.

Absolutely. Thanks guys.

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