Ep. 57 The Story Behind the 2020 World Champion Speaker, Mike Carr

Hey, Darren, how you doing today?

I'm doing great, dude. We have got a celebrity, the newest celebrity, known round the name, known round the world in Toastmasters. Oh, my goodness. And not only that, Mark, not only do we have the current World Champion, the reigning World Champion of public speaking, he's the first one ever since 1938 to do it virtually, which is a whole new challenge on many, many levels. And Mark, from what I hear, sources say that you helped coach him a little bit on the previous speech that got him to the World Champion, the semifinal speech. Is that true?

Well, I cannot tell a lie. That is true. But I tell you what, I take very little credit for what this man has done, and I won't say anything more. I just can't wait for the audience to meet our guest today, the 2021 world champion of public speaking, Mike Carr. Let's do this thing. Here we go.

Anyone can give a presentation. Few deliver unforgettable presentations. What's the difference? You're about to find out. Welcome to the Unforgettable Presentations podcast with your hosts, World champion speakers and coaches, Mark Brown.

Mark Brown, your life tells a story and there's someone out there who needs to hear it.

And Darren Lacroix. And Darren Lacroix.

Stage time. Stage time.

Stage time.

Ready for some powerful presentation. Ahas. Let's dive right in.

Yeah.

Darren, man, I had a thrill this past summer just getting to know our guest today, Mike Carr. You know, he and I became friends, fast friends, when he engaged me to kind of work with him on his presentation. And having to compete at this level in the semifinals and the finals virtually for the first time, I can't begin to imagine some of the concerns because, you know, you and I are kind of old school. But it was a great ride and I was so thrilled to be with you, watching that contest virtually and to hear the new World Champion is Mike Carr. So I am so glad to welcome to our guest, the 2020 World Champion of public speaking, Mike Carr. How are you doing, Mike?

Oh, fantastic. Thank you, guys. It is so wonderful to be with you. I just. I'm a big fan of both of yours, so thank you for inviting me.

Who's a bigger fan? Like, are you a bigger fan of me or Mark? Like, let's put him on the spot.

Mark helped me get to the party most recently.

All right, good point, good point. That's irrelevant. Okay, so what were you going to say, Mark?

No, the party is officially over. But, Mike, have you come down off the high of being the new World Champion yet?

I don't know. I don't think so, because they're. Every now and again, my wife sent me the Wikipedia page, and I happened to see my name on there. I was like, what? Who let this guy? Who let this guy in? How did that happen? I know me, I wouldn't let me do that, but it's pretty fun.

It is great to know that Mike and I know our listeners want to hear all about Mike Carr and his unforgettable virtual presentation, which I know is revolutionary, but I always ask, especially if it's somebody who's come this far in the Toastmasters world. Where did the journey begin for you as a Toastmaster? Did you envision being a world champion when you began, and what put you on this path?

Years ago, I was 25. 25 years ago, I was trying to build a financial services business and. And had a good friend tell me, you know, you say ah or. Or so or. And it seems like every other word and it's distracting. And even worse, they say you start going down one point and then you tangent over here and then you tangent back and you tangent. Or you rarely finish the point that you started or answer the question. So what do you think about Toastmasters? Went to Toastmasters. There was a guy who had gone to the world championship three times, and he said, after I went three times, I decided I wasn't going to go again. But he was a guy named Don Reynolds, really helped me early on, and I thought he was speaking professionally. I thought, that sounds kind of fun. That'd be fun to do every now and again. And I thought at the time, I thought, oh, there's a contest. Well, sure, sure, I can win that thing. And then went and lost as much as I could for the next 25 years. And at some point, just really kind of decided, you know, I just don't think that's in it for me. I probably am never going to do that. And fell more in love with what the contest can do for a speech than winning the ultimate trophy at the end.

Wow. I fell more in love with what the contest could do for a speech than the ultimate trophy at the end. Now, you said you heard about this 25 years ago, so 25 years from the inception to losing all these contests, but at some point, you decide to enter again. And I believe you've been to a few district finals in the last few years. At some point, though, did you think maybe, just maybe, I could go all the way?

So, yes, there's a quote and there's A Chinese philosopher that I have come to love. And there's a long history behind that. I can get into it if you want me to. But about 2008, we had a real, real business disruption, real family disruption, and I just had to keep moving forward, even though goals were obliterated and we thought we might really be completely financially devastated. And I found this Chinese philosopher and the quote that grabbed me at the time was, expectation is the grandfather of disappointment. The world can never own a person who wants nothing. So I thought, well, I don't think I can want nothing. But I was getting so wrapped up in this idea of I want to win the world championship, I want to win the world Championship that I just, I felt the emotions of not wanting to enter the contest the next year whenever I would fail out at the district level or the regional level or somewhere before. And I just, I decided to give myself a pass. And I just thought, you know, I want to find a different reason for doing that. And it was that the. I always saw the benefit of what the contest did for my speeches and I believed in the messages I wanted to share. And especially that message that got me back in this, this one about my dear friend that I call blue. And so that really became the motivating factor. Even when I made the finals, even this year, I was telling some professional speaker friends I thought, if can just at least get to the final, at least I can put that on my cv. Maybe that gets me a few more bookings in the next year. So when I got to the final, I thought, woo hoo, I'm done. I'm good.

Nice. And for everyone listening too, even though we're talking about Toastmasters, the commonality the three of us have, this is not just about Toastmasters. This is about the journey. And this is the journey to be unforgettable. So even if you're not, quote, unquote, ever going to compete in a contest, if you're a pastor just working on your sermons, it's still almost a competition with yourself and how to connect more deeply. And you had to do it virtually, which is obviously a new thing. We all are learning how to, as Mark says, how to connect with your friends behind the lens. What were some of the mistakes that you learned by not winning? Like, what were some of the growth points for Mike Carr along the way?

Oh, I think one of them was making excuses that I, I probably was too quick to listen to people that said, oh, that was just political or your speech was actually the best. But it was that other person's time or something like that. And we could argue whether in the world dealing with humans, everything is political. So that should be no surprise. But the decision to view the world that way, I think was a mistake because then it starts spinning out other. Other bad thoughts, other ancillary thoughts, other demotivating thoughts. So that was one. Not preparing enough. I got cocky one year that in my club, my club contest and I went into the area contest deciding, oh, I can mail this in, it's just the area. And I happened to speak against the guy who ultimately, ultimately went to semifinals and he knocked me out at the area. And I walked away saying, lesson learned. That was a good one. You know, Darren, actually years ago I heard you say that you lost a contest. And you said, that's it, I'm not going to do the contest anymore. And you said the contest did not miss you. That was really. That was a timely. That was a timely word I heard from you at the time. Because I think I was thinking some of that at the time as well. And the other piece, I'd say the other piece is not to both continue to realize the magic that if I'm talking to someone out there that is lost and lost and lost and lost, I would say don't discount the message you have and your unique ability to bring that message, because I think I discounted that. But on the other side, I also got arrogant sometimes where I would think, well, I can mail it in. And those are both bad extremes. I think that the lesson was find that middle road where it's that quiet confidence, but also knowing we've got to do the work.

And I know that you worked with Mark. So I know for people who struggle, they want to be unforgettable, they're willing to work hard. But I, you know, we have this commonality, Mike. We both were coached by Mark. I realized after working with Mark the true value of having a qualified coach actually being your guide your Yoda through the process. What was it like being coached and what would you recommend to other people about finding the right coach?

I think it's really good. I think it's really good along the way, especially, especially getting to the district because the, the. If the goal is to go as far and be as effective in the contest as possible, then that district level speech is really important because it goes to the regional. The video at least now goes to the regional via more international audience outside of the district and then beyond. And so especially in those regions. It was after I had won division that I thought I think I really need to get some broader Toastmaster perspective and also some broader international perspective. And, Darren, I'd heard you talk about Mark. I'd seen Mark in some instances, and I thought, this sounds like the kind of guy that I'd like to get wisdom from. So some of the. And sorry, I want to remember. Remember, I used to go off on tangents. That's the reason I came. Toastmasters.

It's okay.

The question was what I got from that as well.

Yeah. What you learned through the coaching experience that you hadn't learned from all those losses early on.

Right, right. Some of it was. I know there was more of an international perspective, Mark, that you had. There was a time in that first speech where the original speech said, I laughed and I laughed, so I blew coke out my nose. And Mark said, you know, some of these international audiences, they. They see a lot of US Movies, they see a lot of United States television shows, and coke can be cocaine, especially in the nose. And I thought. And that, you know, he said, it made complete sense, and it was an easy pivot just to talk about milk. And it eliminated something that could have caused a key member of the audience who needed that message to get distracted and not hear what really they were. They were meant to hear that. The international component piece, but also just the ability. I was looking at it from a perspective of, you know, here's a story about my friend dying. And so I started out kind of lower tone, right. And I'd been competing, I'd won my district a few times, so I was beginning to get that. Get into that negative spot. It's a positive, but it's also a negative where people in the district say, oh, well, Mike Carr said it. And so that might be. That must be the way it is. And I always got some really good feedback, but it was less and less pretty critical. And so it was great to have Mark, who doesn't care who Mike Carr is, come in and say, I'm not feeling it. You look like a reporter. You're not showing the emotion of what you're saying. So great perspective. And also, there are different regional perspectives. I get a perspective from Central Texas, Central and South Texas at a lot of those clubs. Mark does not live in Central and South Texas, so he can give more of that. So I would say those were the biggest ones.

And, Mark, I'm going to jump in, since I am the outsider for you two. Mark, when you worked with Mike, what were some of the insights that, from your perspective, he needed or you helped him with what was that experience like from the coach's perspective?

Well, first of all, always an honor to help someone who comes and asks for support. And the first thing was Mike's coachability. I'm not going to spend time comparing Mike's coachability and Darren's coachability.

I can mute you, you know. I can mute you.

Yes.

Well, someone once said, mike, if you are not coachable, there is no cure. And that someone is my co host, Darren. And all kidding aside, I will reveal a secret here, Darren. And I don't know if Mike remembers this, but I was not eager to jump in and say, okay, I'll be the guy. I said, if I am the. We talked first. I said if I'm the right guy for you, get back to me and let me know. So I gave Mike time to think about do I really want to work with this person? Because my goal is not to say, okay, I coach five world champions, I quote, no, I want to make sure I bring value. So I highly respected the fact Mike took time to make sure I was the one he wanted to work with. And so he's being willing to subject himself to me and to allow me to share what I had with him was the first thing he was available. And he was coachable. He was, he listened to what I had to say. And his being that receptive is a big deal to me because not everyone is as quickly as you know, Darren is as quick to receive what you had to say. Also had to couch my comments with my recommendation is this. But remember, you are the president of your presentation. You decide what goes in, what comes out. And we discussed that blue speech in different ways. And just seeing Mike's brain, he would think it through. He'd envision why you need to have more dialogue there, why do you need to feel the emotion, why that pause works. And he was in many ways a sponge. And that was the best part. It was not difficult to work with Mike because he saw I was trying to help him be better, not just win a trophy. And that's one more key piece. So many people come to us, you're a champion, help me win a trophy. And Darren, you have your own thoughts on that. And if Mike, if you saw it differently, please feel free to jump in anytime.

I'm gonna interview both of you just for a few more minutes because I just think people don't understand the coaching process and how having the right coach, it's not just having a coach, but having the right coach that you're submissive or open to what they have to say for both of you. Either one of you can answer this. Were there any moments that just became that memorable, like aha or something specific? Bring us to a couple moments.

He's thinking really hard, and so am I, Because I know you and I had our moments, Darren, back in 2001. Right. We won't go into those. I don't say there was pushback because again, I'm very careful to offer suggestions and recommendations. I don't say, you must do this. I rarely say that. You see my thinking just now. That's how he was. He was pensive. He thought through what I offered him. And if he felt it wasn't exactly how he would do it, he'd say, yeah, I get the idea. And I'll say it in this way. But, I mean, he did things like he wore a blue tie and a blue shirt and a blue flower on his lapel because his. His speech was blue. And he had the thematic aspect to it. And I saw that he was willing to do whatever he could to make the presentation worthwhile. So it wasn't so much as any kind of pushback. The best thing is he would not just take it as gospel and run with it. He process it and apply it in the best way that worked for him. Now, I don't know how Mike saw it. I'll let him answer the question.

Right. Right. I don't remember a pushback time, I.

Think, or even a breakthrough, you know, a breakthrough moment where all of a sudden we hear the choirs of angels.

Right Now, I would say there were several of those. Your feedback to me, Mark, that you look like a reporter. When I went back and looked at that division speech, it made complete sense. That was a breakthrough. And then I think you even said. When we talked after my district speech, you kind of said, is this the same guy? You kind of went from one extreme to the other. And I think there was. That. There was a point. There was a point. A real breakthrough piece was whenever I said, I laughed and marked Mark said, why don't you. What do you think about this? Whenever you say. And I just laughed. And that in terms of a feeling that gave me a feeling in the speech that kind of blossomed out some other things. What is.

Mike, real quick, before you leave that point, I got little goosebumps just now because I really want everyone to understand something. That was my. To me, that was the most powerful advice I gave you in that it gave you the opportunity to do what Darren and I preach. Don't just Retell the story, relive the story. And in that moment, when you said. And I laughed, said, no, and I laughed. Just seeing you do that, you not only laughed with the word, but you actually moved back as if you were rolling back. That was so genuine, so real, so honest, so credible. I'm like, yes, Mike, that's what you did in the moment, and that's what the audience needs to see. So please hear me, friends, when you relive the moment, truly relive not just the words, but the emotion and the entire experience, because you want the audience to enjoy or to feel the experience with you. And that can be transformative with regard to your impact on the audience. Thanks, Mike.

Yeah, and I'm so glad you said that, because a big question I've been asked a lot is, how do you, in this environment, speak to the audience and get yourself into that authentic place? And that was part of it. I didn't realize it until you just said it right now, but I thought, that's exactly right, because it put me immediately right back, however many years ago that was in that spot, in that moment where I'm really reliving it. And so it makes it so much more authentic and so much easy, or so much more easy. So much easier to be able to tell it in the moment and feel it. And I think that came across. So I really appreciate that was a big breakthrough. I think there was some pushback, if I remember correctly, and just kind of.

The way that I. Yeah, we block it out, Mike. Just so you know, we naturally block out those moments. Go ahead, Mike.

I think there was some discussion you'd had, some suggestions, maybe either at the beginning of that speech, kind of toward the end, and I thought about it and I thought, oh, I think I want to default back to, you know, back. It just feels better the way I originally had done it. But I don't think I admitted to you that I was going to do that. I just did it.

That was okay. I think the biggest piece towards the end was I said, you know, you end did with your emotion about dealing with your friends passing and the sky being blue. That's wonderful. Well done. The theme is there. I get it. But what about us and your audience? You had to add more for us to use this message in a way that we can apply it. And you did eventually make a few tweaks towards your conclusion that invited us in to think about, who are we? Are we the ones who will. Who will live our lives in a way to impact others in the way that you were impacted by her life. And the third one regarding emotion again was, I didn't understand why you were angry in the church. I said, mike, you gotta really build that. We gotta know. I want to see you angry. Don't tell me. I was so mad I walked out. Dude, I don't believe you. I guess the hardest thing was I said, mike, I'm not buying it. I don't believe you. And that was mild compared to Darren's arguments. But the idea of we have to be credible friends, you have to be believable. And what we often fail to understand as presenters is we're saying the words from where we are, but the audience has to hear and see them and they have to be credible and authentic for them to believe it. So by pushing you in that direction, Mike, I'm not feeling it. I don't know why you're mad. Let me know why you're mad. And that really transformed that whole scene up in the woods by yourself and it made it more real to me as an audience member. So that was kind of powerful. But I say all that to point out, to answer Darren's first question about the coaching process is that if you can't go through this journey and come out on the end of it, not only with the client feeling better and being better, but you as a coach feeling you've delivered value and even learning something, then maybe you need to revisit that relationship. I lay it there with this final thought. For me, it was mutually beneficial. Back to you, Darren.

Anything to add to that, Mike?

You know, just what I thought about was just personality styles. In the middle of that, on another conversation, I've shared with you all that one of my biggest, one of the things I had to really guard against was, you know, I'm a people pleaser from way back. I was kind of groomed to be that as a child and I've recognized that about myself through some wonderful, wonderful therapy. But I had to really be careful that I asked myself, okay, is that authentic? To me, whenever coaching would come out like that, and I think there are some coaches. One reason I felt like that, Mark, you and I were a fit, was that right up front you said, remember you're the CEO of your speech. I think that what I see and have experienced, sometimes coaches will come out and will and are used to working with a personality style that feels like I have all the answers. And so the coach needs to come in and say, you don't. Here are some answers you don't have. And Matching a coach that comes out and says this is what you ought to do. And I have all the answers. With a personality style that is way too ready to accept everything. The danger is that for someone like me, the danger is that my authenticity can get lost in that can get lost. And essentially I'm giving by rote then a speech that a strong minded coach has put out there. Not that she's written the speech for me, but that she's coached it into her style. And so finding that relationship I think was really vital in this coaching relationship because whether you sensed it or just that's the person you are marking telegraphing right off the bat, you, Mike, you need to trust yourself on this speech. It helped me know this was the right coaching relationship and it also, I think it helped, it really informed the result at the end.

I'll add two things very quickly, Darren, before we move on. Number one is as a coach, I tell people I don't want to anyone to hear you speak and say, you know, it sounds like Mark Brown. If that happens, I have failed. And the second piece, not everyone will adhere or subscribe to this and that's okay friends, but the second piece is this. I wanted to know who was Mike Carr, so I did. I kind of, I semi stalked him. I watched some of his videos on YouTube.

That doesn't scare me at all.

I watched a contest speech he gave in a place that looked like a grotto somewhere in an underground cavern. I don't know where that was Mike. But I also found out what our affinities were. I'm a father of three. Mike is the father of eight. Oh my gosh. And the piece de resistance, he likes Arsenal Football club in England. The same club my brother, my brother in law and my nephew like who are bitter rivals of my football club in England. So I knew the affinity in English football. I knew the family consideration. I found out the faith connection and all those things in his background told me it might be a good fit. Again, not everybody will want to do that, but it worked for me, it worked for Mike and me in our relationship and it might work for you if you want to broaden your relationship with your clients.

For other United States sports fans, they mean soccer when they say football, kids. And if you're listening to this highly recommend, if you're looking for a coach, check out episode 14 of this podcast. Episode 14 where Mark and I went in detail about finding the right coach. Not just who's the best coach, it's no who's the best coach. For you. Or we also posted that episode right on getaspeakingcoach.com but I want to switch lanes because what people really want to know is the winning speech. How did you come up with the idea? I know you didn't necessarily work with Mark on that one, but I'm assuming some of what you learned bled over to that experience. Let's talk a little bit about the winning speech. Where did you come up with the idea? How did you know what it was? And we really want to know about the virtual aspect, using the screen in the creative way that you did.

Well, the beginning of it started with a conversation with Mark where I essentially said, oh, yeah, if I make it to the finals, then I've got a speech that's a redo from. From a semifinal speech that I gave in 2013. And Mark said, well, how much of a redo? Because they've changed the rules. Which was news to me at the time. You know, another lesson I learned. Another lesson I learned. Yeah, I learned this from Mark, too. When you change sub. When you change subjects, switch. Switch pages. Another subject I learned is best to read the rule book. When they say best to read the rulebook. So I discovered that I couldn't give that speech as a redo. And then I started to try to make it different enough, change the stories, but the same structure. And it just looked boring when it. Visually, whenever I would give it, that speech was. I was supposed to start out on my knees. Well, I mean, that. That doesn't. How do you. How do you do that? You move the camera. So I tried to push that round peg into a square hole in about three weeks, maybe. When we finished the district and Mark gave me feedback saying, I think there's an okay chance. It seems like it's pretty good. There's an okay chance to go on to the final. I started thinking, oh, man, I need to be prepared. And tried to get that speech. And then I just. I figured out I couldn't do it, so I scrapped it. There was the story about the librarian and Mrs. Montgomery. Mrs. Landon is not her real name, but that. That happened. I had shared that with my kids, with my wife, Julie, a number of times, just with the idea that somebody can try something early on and even if it failure and somebody coming in and saying, if that fails, there's this big cost and that better not happen. That can really change the way we look at risk taking going forward. So I played with that. I tried to work it into different speeches, and we were trying to figure out We. I was talking to my wife about saying what could be interesting here. In my mind, I knew Kwong at that point was going to the final. I'm a big fan of Kwong. I've seen him in a number of finals, and I thought, yeah, I think this is his year. So what I think I want to build. And, Mark, this is kind of what we talked about the day before was I don't think that I'm going to win this contest. So what I want is maybe something that I'm proud of, is a piece of art that I would enjoy giving. And thirdly, would be something that then I could get a good video on, put it out in marketing, and it might open doors to speaking to associations and corporations. And that's where that idea of a risky speech. Risky because I kind of thought toastmaster judges would hate all those machinations around the screen and covering up the camera. I kept emailing the semifinals saying, is there a rule against this? Is there a rule against that? And they said, no. The judges have just been told, watch how someone uses the virtual stage. And you have to decide if you think the judges will like that. And I just came to the conclusion, no, I think I want to just have a speech that I'm proud of, gives a message I really believe in, and I'm not going to win this thing anyway. So then I have something I can roll out.

And in terms of if somebody hasn't seen the championship speech, go on YouTube, check it out. Really easy to find, a gazillion views. I mean, you instantly had us. I remember Mark, it was Willie Jones who. He came out on the stage, and everyone came right to the center of the stage, and he said, no, no, I'm going right up front on the front edge of the stage. And that was just an instant. That's different. And you did the same thing virtually where you had your head like that in the corner, and it's like, oh, well, okay, I'm listening. How did you decide how much of that you were going to do? And did you worry at all about it backfiring?

I did. I did worry. So I'll answer that second part first and then back up to the first. So much so that I really. I was going to. I watched the speech with about three other speaker friends of mine, socially distanced. They have an outdoor patio. We were gonna sit down, watch it. I woke up Saturday morning, the day they were streaming the speeches, just in a full panic. I Woke up at 5am I waited until my wife woke up and she said, so, how you doing? I said, I went too far. I've embarrassed myself. This is. This is not gonna work. People. People are going to hate it and hate it so bad that I'm not even going to be able to do the contest anymore. I was in full panic mode. So I called my friends and I was supposed to be there at nine. That's when it's supposed to stream. And I said, I'm not going to be there at 9. It's posted. I want to fast forward and just make sure I didn't embarrass myself. And if I embarrass myself, I'm just not coming. So I fast forwarded, I looked at it, I went, okay, well, the audience may hate it, judges may hate it, but I did. I don't think I embarrass myself. I can at least use it maybe to. In some marketing. And that's all right. So to how I got there. The way I started down here was actually the day before I was just kind of doing this, looking at different perspectives. I went, huh, well, that's an interesting perspective right there. Oh, a little sixth grader of a sixth grader. Yeah, that would be short and looking up. And so that's when that came into play. And that seems to be what a lot of people talk about now. And it just, again, speaks to that idea of experimentation, brings about some of these epiphanies.

Write that one down, Mark, please.

Experimentation brings about epiphanies.

Right?

Experimentation.

Right.

I'm trying to write, my friend. Go ahead.

All right. I've got a lot of other thoughts on that that I'll save to look at.

Keep going, keep going, keep going.

But the way the other things came into about were when we. When I was talking to Julie and talking with my wife. Julie is a speaker and author as well, and so she has a lot of great experience. And we were talking about. I said, I think I saw everybody else starting right here in the middle of the frame and beginning to. They would kind of move up and back, but for the most part, we're right here. And I had an old sales manager that told me, differences sell, similarities don't. So, you know, our brains, the way our psychology we do, crave similarity, but we also crave novelty. And so finding a space in there that it's not so far out on the outer edge, but it is different enough. Like you, like you said, Darren, going out to the outer edge of the stage, it's just enough of a difference to catch somebody's attention so we were talking about, in this idea of what could be fun, what could be a fun piece of art to give to this audience. And the story we were talking about was using a projector and my tearing it apart. And Julie said, ooh, like a movie projector, there's a lot of fun things if it's projected. And when she said that, I thought, of course, this frame, it's like it's projected up on the wall. And what would that look like originally? Also, I was gonna. I was gonna start here, climb up out of the hole, but then I couldn't seem to get up over and land. And just messing with different perspectives. That's where the sliding door happened.

I love. I love this. That was.

I did not. That was the thing that I was afraid was gonna be too much or cartoony. That's the piece I wanted to go look at because I just didn't know if it was gonna work. But I kind of like the thought of the projector doing that.

Brilliant, Brilliant. And when you did that, I immediately went back to junior high school. Seriously.

I mean, thank you. That was my hope.

I gotta comment on this, and here's why I gotta comment on this. I'm gonna go back, Darren, to when Mike and I first began to work together and I saw his district video and to talk about transformation in his. The first about his videos at Mike, you started in the middle of the frame, and to get close, you had to spread your legs and kind of get set. You remember that Mike, when you were. You weren't comfortably standing there, the height of the computer was lower. And you had this. You had this started like this. Yeah. And like, why are you doing that? And you come from a guy who was in an awkward, like, karate sense to do his speech, to have completely transformed the use of the medium in a matter of weeks. So I find this both amusing, but quite fascinating. And even was it yesterday, you were on a local news program there in Austin and you were discussing the use of the medium. And I predicted that individuals worldwide are going to be thinking, how can I use the medium? Like Mike Carr did it. You will be the standard. I think you already have become the standard of different ways to use the medium. So I just see the first time you're, like standing like this in a crouch, trying to be natural to now transforming the way it's being used. And I also suspect you're not done yet. I think.

Can I say two. Can I say two things about that? I think one is being open to getting that feedback because I tried something and it was great to get feedback. Saying that did not work. It looked bad. But I think the second thing is I hope that it's easier to take those risks when I'm not going for a trophy or I'm not going for a result. I'm just trying something. And I really believe in that message. And if you're right, Mark, that people around the world, not everything's going to work, but it will all push creativity and presentation skills forward. And I think that all of us should give ourselves that grace to both get the feedback and also know that not everything's going to work. But that still made it valuable.

Yeah. Because the victory is in the try.

Well, I believe that.

I'm just pleased you went from awkward using the camera, getting the right stance, to finding different ways to make it effective. And people are still talking about that and they won't stop for a while. Darren?

Yeah. Any other insight from your creating the process even when you were testing it and delivering? I know we've touched on some of it. When did you go to any clubs and get some random feedback that was maybe off the wall and some that maybe is like, oh, okay. How did feedback incorporate into creating a better presentation?

There is an area director, pretty new toastmaster somewhere here in District 55 that I need to go find him and hug him, buy him maybe a new car because I gave the blues speech to their club. It was closer to the final and gave the blues speech. I was still trying to figure out a final speech and he just happened to say, wow, I really like the way you came right up in the camera. That's using that space differently than anybody else. I hope you do advance because I'd love to see you use that space even more. And that. That just triggered everything else kind of went. My brain went wild with that. So, like I said, I need. I need to find him and hug him for saying that. That was a big piece. The other. On the other side feedback that I got were from individuals saying, it's too much. Your. Whenever you're right up in the. In the camera, it looks kind of cartoony. Your motions are too big, it's too loud. And that was some of the feedback that I decided, well, now I'll probably set that to the side. But I heard a bit of that.

Well, you know, real quickly, before Darren's comment, my mentor, David Brooks, when he competed 30 years ago, 1990, he came on stage in what he called a Texas tuxedo. He had a white shirt and he had a Bolo tie, and he had blue jeans and cowboy boots. And he's right there in Austin, your hometown. And people told him, that's crazy. How could he even do that? And then he planned to have the audience call in response. He would say, you know, a Hardy. And they say, hi, ho, Silver away. You want the audience to respond to you. That's never gonna work. So both the things they told him would never work are now in the history books as pioneering acts that have made him a world champion. And you have done something this year that would never work. And you are the world champion. So for you who are watching or listening outside, give some thought to those two world champion examples 30 years apart. And in the middle of that, somebody fell on his face on stage. That was kind of bold and kind of crazy, but it worked for him, too. I'm just saying.

Just a cautionary note, though. It's gotta tie into the message. It's gotta tie into the story. Don't do the thing for the sake of the thing, because that's why. That's what David Brooks, I had asked him for advice. He was coaching someone else. So he said, ask me general questions, I'll answer them, but not specific. And I told him, I'm planning on doing this thing that's really dramatic. And he said, you might win by it, you might lose by it, but you'll stand out. And when I went back and talked to Mark, I realized it's the essence of my message, so I can't get marked off by trying to be dramatic. But my other question that may be inspiring to people, I hope, is whether it was the semifinal speech or the final speech. How much time or effort did you put into practicing or rehearsing or writing on it? Like, is there any way to quantify that?

I answered this on a podcast, and the guy did some math later and came back and he said, I estimate that you worked that went through that speech 642 times. I said, how do you get to the two? But I'm a big believer in consistent habits. And so what I did with that blue speech, it started back when we were commuting to offices. I would get in my car on the way to the commute, and the first thing I would do is run the speech. And then I work all day, get in my car to come on the way home, and the first thing I would do is run the speech. And then as I was brushing my teeth, then I would run the speech in my head afterward. Then I get up in the morning If I was doing quick exercise, I would run the speech and tried to run the speech in times where there was distraction so that in the event that there and there was in that division speech, somebody accidentally shared their screen and it pops up this big advertisement right on the screen, then it would continue to be able to flow. So that was the running. And that started. I had written this speech. I'd written Blue for the club maybe three years ago, but started probably in January, maybe December, doing that because I changed in the final speech and I was weeks away. I'm not sure I did much of anything else than wandering around in my world and running this speech. And even out loud, I don't know.

How you pulled that off with eight children. I didn't do anything else. Who was watching the kids?

Oh, you know, it's amazing what Froot Loops, you know, on the corner of the floor will do.

Nice, Nice.

Well, you know, Mike, I know maybe I shouldn't go there, but I'm sure people are saying, wait, he's got eight kids in his house. How does he even do that? Can you share a little of your family background and also the level of support you got from your wife and kids during this process?

Certainly, certainly, yes. And I know I'd love to share about those. So my eight kids, a lot of times that we're asked, are they all of ours? And yes, yes, they are. And they start at age. Well, I guess really they start now at my daughter, who's 29, living in Chicago, Illinois. Great town. Everybody else lives around here. And they are. I guess they are. Well, I'm not going to. The ages change every now again, so I'll just tell you. They're every two to three years from age 29 to. Our only set of twins are 13. We have five of them living in the house right now. Two of those are currently in college, and then the other three are in school. However we define that these days, we've done a lot of homeschooling, so that this time has not been incredibly unusual for us. The way that they are the most supportive, quite honestly, is my wife Julie, births funny children. And so they live their lives. And I read something somewhere at one point, it said, live a life that is worth blogging about or live a life that is worth telling stories about. And I have to say, my kids contribute to that in spades. They are funny, they have unique experiences. They are transparent. They share a lot of things with their mom and me that I didn't share with my parents. And so I Get to hear some of those. And a lot of that is funny. We laugh a lot. So the humor of that, the support, I think I've talked about, you know, Julie allowing me to bounce ideas off her and her sharing ideas and sharing her perspective on different things. There was a lot of that, especially in that final speech, because we're kind of under the gun to get it done. But the kids, beyond that, the kids are just. Yeah, you're doing a speech contest again. Okay, well, let us know now.

I appreciate that because those who know my story know that when I was going to my region, which was what we call semifinals now, back in 95, my 11 year old daughter told me, dad, your speech lacks humor. It's not funny enough. Yeah, exactly. I was rehearsing one day and on a lark, I threw a dumb crazy line in and she said, dad, that's funny. Use it. I said, you're kidding me. That's ridiculous. Corny. Dad, it's funny, use it.

Okay?

I said, well, listen, I'm the dad, I'm the adult. So therefore, I used it and got a 13 second laugh from a line my daughter told me to use. Right. And look on your face, Mike. Those who can't see this, go to the YouTube video. Look at Mike's face here. My point being that you never know how much a supportive, loving family can help, even when they're 11 years old. And I also know on a very serious note, Mike, that we can't do what you and I did without family support. I have a friend of mine in New York and I won out of New York back in 95. During my journey, he said to me, mark, I could never do what you were doing because I don't believe my wife would support me. And my mentor, David Brooks, said when he decided after fits and stuck and stumbles and fumbles to go for it in 1990, his wife Beth said, let's do this. The word let's was us. We're together, we're a family. We're doing it as a unit. And it was so powerful to hear that. And my wife and my kids came to both my finals in 94 and 95. In 94, my wife was seven and a half months pregnant with David. In 95, he was less than a year old. And I say all that to say I can appreciate what having a family behind you can do to help you to be successful. And I wanted the audience to kind of hear about your awesome family dynamic, the fun you have together, and the impact of their support on you along this journey. So thank you for sharing that, Mike Darren.

Certainly, my pleasure.

And Mike, as we start wrapping this up, if you were sitting across a table in a comfortable setting at a coffee shop without masks on, but socially distant, across from an emerging presenter, and they asked you what's the best advice you could offer me, what would you say?

I would tell them you don't know how powerful your particular approach is, but it is. And that nobody thinks their stories are funny, are unique or interesting. No one thinks that their life experience has something to teach, but the reality is that every single life has something to teach. I learned something from a mentor years ago. He would say that he actually learned from his father that every single person we ever meet is superior to us in at least one way. And our job is to find out that one way and learn from them. What that means is the person sitting right across from me then is superior to me and everyone else in at least one way. And it's mining the gems of that reality and sharing those lessons and those stories in their unique way. And that is gold. Is absolutely gold. Real quick example of that. We have a wonderful toastmaster in our club here in Austin, Toastmasters. And she could barely stand to stand in front of the audience, was noticeably nervous the entire time. Fast forward now. She's been president of the club, president of the club, all these officers. But the most amazing thing is she discovered that her delivery is so dry and sometimes monotone, but she uses that with such dry humor. And now she has the funniest speeches of almost anybody has won speech contests. She used her unique ability and if she tried to do what I do, it never would have translated. But I cannot do what she does. So I would say it's there and use it.

And as Mark puts together the keepers. Mike, if somebody wants to learn more from you, connect with you. What social media platforms, what's your website? How can we find out more about Mike Carr, the 2020 world champion of public speaking? How would they connect with you?

My website, mikecarofficial.com is probably the best there will be. Newsletter and white papers and YouTube channel attached to that very soon, very soon there better be.

I'm watching you.

These guys have convinced me and I don't have bruises yet, but I'm told I will if I don't. No, no, it's no. I really appreciate those admonitions. Primarily I'm on Facebook and on Instagram, on LinkedIn and on Twitter because I have a 13 year old. I do post some life lessons on TikTok. And so that is there, but it may not be to your taste, but those areas would be the best. So thank you for asking.

Absolutely. So please connect with Mike Mark before we go to keepers just coming up. If you're listening to this and you want to know the step by step how to. Mark and I have a two day virtual event coming up called Unforgettable Presentations where we'll walk you through a seven step process and with you hand in, hand over these two days. So go check that out@stagetimeworkshops.com Mark Brown, what do we have for keepers?

All right, keepers. I think this one was kind of half mine, but Mike insists don't be a reporter. Relive the experience in every story. And he has four nuggets about the speech you give. One, give a speech you enjoy giving. Two, give a speech you are proud of. Three, deliver a message you really believe in. And four, deliver a work of art. I love that fourth one. Okay, get this. Every single life has something worthwhile to teach. I love that one. And here we go. Use your unique ability to connect with your audience. And remember, experimentation creates epiphanies. Find your message, experiment, use the medium in different and unique ways and you never know the results you're going to give. Mike, really powerful keepers. Thank you so much. I don't know if Darren has one, but I'll turn it back over to him.

No, that was just awesome. Mike Keeper is Don't have a podcast without letting the landscaping next door know that you're doing a podcast. That's my keeper. But Mike Carr, thank you for joining us. Seriously, we wish you all the best. If there's any way we can help you, please let us know. Thanks for all the work you put in and the effort. And now it's cool to see that your message and what you're teaching you're just a good dude. Is spreading around the world and hopefully our listeners will connect with you. Seriously, thanks for being here. My Mark Brown, take us home.

Hey Mike, again from me. Special thanks for enduring me for all those weeks while I get ready for the championship. And friends who are listening to this, when you get a chance, check out mycarofficial.com, look at his videotape of the World Championship on YouTube and find all the nuggets. Look at the lessons that you can learn from this because you too can be unforgettable. We'll see you next week.

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