How to Tackle Interview Nerves

Hello and welcome to the Ace Your Consultant Interview podcast. I'm Tessa Davis.

And I'm Becky Platt.

And if you're a final year trainee or a locum consultant and you want to prep, not panic, then you're in the right place. Welcome back to our Ace Your Consultant Interview podcast. I am here with Becky, as always, looking at some interview tips and things to consider when you're prepping for your interview. Hi, Becky, how are you?

Oh, great. Thanks. How are you?

I'm very good and looking forward to getting going. So first up today, we've got our question of the week, which is a question that one of our Academy students has posed to us. And this week we've got the following question, which is, I'm feeling massively anxious about my interview in 4 days' time. What can I do to help calm myself? So what would you advise, Becky?

Okay, this is a pretty common scenario, right? Yeah, and we hear this all the time. Um, uh, and, and I think a lot of our, a lot of our work in the Academy is around being connected with our students and helping them manage their nerves in, in the run-up.

Yeah.

Um, I'm going to assume for the purposes of this question this is a student who's actually done the prep.

Yeah, that's true.

And they're not coming to us going Uh, so I've got this interview in, uh, 4 days' time, and it's the first time I've ever thought about going to interview.

Yeah.

So I'm, I'm assuming this is somebody who's, who's done the prep. Um, so I personally think that with 4 days to spare, you're, you're in the realm of just kind of consolidating, reminding yourself of, you know, all of the things that you've done, and then hopefully giving yourself some free time at the end to have a bit of relaxation. So I think I generally say to people, really try not to prep right up until the last minute. So, you know, maybe in the last few days you're just going through questions that you know will come up. You're probably just running through what that kind of first question is going to feel like. You know, you'll kind of tell me about yourself question. You've prepared that. You've got a way that you're going to answer that, tailoring it accordingly. You've done that. You're reminding yourself what your USPs are. You're just gently doing maybe a couple of answers a day with us or with somebody, or talking to yourself in the mirror or in the car or whatever you do. And then hopefully you've left yourself at least the evening and hopefully the day before to just chill. out, um, and try not to think about it too much. Do something nice and just get out of your head a little bit.

Yeah, and I think this is probably where we have a bit of good cop, bad cop, because sometimes I would be slightly firmer in the 4 days before stress, which is that, you know, at that point what you're at risk of is talking yourself out of the interview before you even get in the door. Because if you get yourself— I don't, I don't know what situation this person was in, but it that you can get yourself into such a state in the run-up that you're— it's self-fulfilling. You're just, I'm stressed because I'm going to mess it up, and what if this, and what if that, and, and you will make that happen. And, and it's a waste. It's a waste at that time. And actually, all it does is hold you back. It doesn't serve you any benefit at all. And so what's rather— in that stage, rather than last-minute cramming, last-minute prepping, actually you're better to spend your time getting into the right mindset and getting into the right headspace because 'Cause yeah, you can do some stuff, but like you say, the bulk of the work is done by this point. It is really consolidating and it's just reminding yourself, actually, I've done a load of work to get to this point and I am ready to go in and do my best and I deserve this job and I can go in and smash it. And if you can, you know, everyone knows themselves the best so that you know what works for you, how to get into the right headspace. But if you can spend your time thinking, right, how can I get myself out of this negative mindset?

Yeah.

And I know it sounds fluffy to people, but it makes a massive difference, 'cause if you go in thinking you're gonna mess it up, you will mess it up. But if you go in thinking, actually, I'm ready, I'm gonna give this my best shot, then it'll come across in a whole different way. So yeah, we really spend time encouraging people to work out what they can do to get into a better headspace for it, so that they can go in feeling as good as you can. And you will still be nervous. It's okay, you're expected to be nervous. It's a big deal. But those nerves is one thing. Anxiety, where you're just talking yourself out of the job is going to be like a massive negative for you as well on the day.

It's just brought to mind, I had a really nice experience with one of our students a few weeks ago who'd done a heck of a lot of work, and she was absolutely hitting all the points in her answers. She was brilliant. She was absolutely ready. And I had a final one-to-one with her 2 days before her interview. And, um, and she, she got onto the call with me, uh, and she was in, she was in her, uh, dressing gown, and, uh, which is fine. And she said, I spent the afternoon reading a book in the bath, um, because I knew that that's what I needed to relax myself before the interview, because I'm not going to do any more now. So I don't want you to ask, ask me any questions. What I want to do is just have a nice chat. Maybe you could give me a bit of a pep talk, and then I'll get off the phone. Get off the call. I was like, okay, that's, that sounds great. We did that. Uh, we agreed what the kind of strategy would be for the, for the next day, uh, which for her, she was going to go— she'd taken the day off before the interview. She's going to go for a nice long walk, have a nice bath in the evening, and then just go to the interview in the morning. And she messaged me that night, just had another bath, I'm feeling absolutely great. Um, and she went in there, smashed the interview, and got the job.

Fabulous.

So, and I love that because I think that that's really about understanding yourself. What do you need in the run-up to make you feel like you're your best self before you go into that interview?

Yeah.

And, you know, for some, some people need to go and do a long run. Some people will need to have a bath. Some people will need to do some power poses in the mirror.

We do love a power pose, don't we?

I know that you love a power pose. Do you wanna talk through a power pose?

I don't know if it'll translate to audio only, But we have considered putting together a little guide on power poses for our students before their interview, because they do love it. And yeah, I think it's whatever works for you is the right thing to do.

Yeah. What I will say is, I think from experience, what essentially doesn't work for anyone is leaving it to the last minute, cramming it all in, and still reading through your notes when you're waiting outside the interview. So, if you can possibly avoid that, Do, but really just get your prep done early, give yourself a bit of a buffer, and then work out what you need in that last 24 hours.

Yes. Baths seem to feature heavily, so nice bubble bath.

Lots of people love a bath.

Yeah. Doesn't hurt anyone. So let's go on to our golden example. So this is an example that a student has given us to use for one of their tell me about a time scenarios. So what have we got this week?

So, this is a golden example that one of our students suggested as a conflict with a colleague example, and that's something that comes up fairly frequently. So the example is, when the patient came into the anaesthetic room, the theatre staff were concerned that they didn't understand the consent because the patient had limited English and it had not been done with a translator, so the consent might have been invalid. The surgical registrar came into the anaesthetic room, and they were angry as they just wanted to get the case done so that they could leave on time. So, they were shouting at the theatre staff and at the student. This is the example of a conflict with a colleague. What do you think?

I like this example. One of the reasons I like it is that there's clearly a conflict. So, I think often when we hear these examples, we're like, so what was the, you know, was there a conflict, or was it just you didn't agree about the care, which is not really a conflict. That's just a discussion around management, or you're not sure, you know, people sometimes skim over that bit. Whereas this is really clear. The surgical registrar is angry. They're shouting, I think we're all clear. This is a conflict. So I think this is good. I think it's quite relatable. I don't know how common— obviously, I'm not a surgeon, but I don't know how commonly it would happen. But it could happen. And it's relatable. It's one of these things that is not necessarily anyone's fault, or certainly not anyone who's there at that that time, but this surgical reg is annoyed about it. And it fulfills our key criteria, which is that it should be a conflict with another colleague of the same grade as you in a different specialty, another doctor, same grade as you in a different specialty, for something when they're angry at you for something that's not your fault. So I think this is spot on, actually. I think this is a cracking example. What do you think about it?

Yeah, I really like it. I think that again, it's— I mean, it may or may not be common, but this kind of conflict around, you know, competing priorities is, and people under pressure, is common.

Yeah.

And I think also it's easy to understand, doesn't take loads of explanation. We can all understand how this arose, and that leaves you free in your answer to Just to focus on how you de-escalate conflict. And remember, in this answer, what we don't want to hear is, oh well, the reason we didn't use a translator was blah, and so actually we've got this whole new process where now we always have a— it does— that's wonderful. We don't care about this in that— in this particular answer. What we want to know is, can you de-escalate conflict? How did you do it? And what have you learned about de-escalating conflict as a result of this experience? And this example gives you the opportunity to do all of that.

Yeah, and the other thing we don't want to hear is, I called my consultant and they called their consultant and they sorted that out between them, because whether that may happen in some cases, but the whole idea is about your skills at de-escalating conflict. And if you have to, you know, ask your parent and they have to ask their parent, you know, I'm going to get my mum, then it kind of just flags you're a junior, you weren't able to handle the situation. What we want to know is that you are able to handle a situation of conflict because it's a consultant interview. So I would avoid having to call your bosses to resolve things as well.

Take the responsibility, de-escalate it, keep the patient at the centre. Remain— retain a professional relationship with this colleague. Done.

Yep. Agreed. Okay. So this is a really good example. A really good example.

Yeah. Go for it.

Okay. So then we're going to look at the interview question of the week. This is an actual interview question that you might get. This week we've got a really pretty common one, I would say, which is, what is your biggest weakness? Uh, how do you feel about this question, Becky?

I quite like it, but I think you've got to prepare for it because there's a massive opportunity to dig yourself a gigantic hole here, to come across incredibly badly, and to find it difficult to retrieve. So I think you've got to find a weakness that is a weakness, but it is not some kind of deal breaker. Um, and that doesn't leave the panel thinking either, oh my God, like, Tessa's some kind of sociopath, or, is that honestly a weakness? Uh, so I think there's kind of palatable weaknesses here that you can use, and there's some that are absolutely out of bounds. Um, so what are your thoughts?

Well, an out-of-bounds one would be, my weakness is, you know, I can't get out of bed in the morning on time, you know. So I'm always late, um, or, you know, I don't communicate well. Um, these are things that would be like— so nothing about, you know, my notes aren't good, or, you know, some— so these are, these are actual potential deal breakers where you'd be like, I do not want this person on my team. They're not going to be reliable. They're not going to get on well with people. Um, so that's it. That, you know, there's a definite too much. And then on the other side of what you're saying is the ones that's not really a weakness, but you're pretending is a weakness. So a common one is, you know, I just care so much about my patients. I end up talking to them for a really long time. And so it means that I take longer to see my clinic patients or whatever. And actually there is a weakness within that, but the weakness isn't that you spend so long with your patients and that you care, because obviously you're just showing like you're a great doctor because you love your patients. The weakness is actually you can't keep your clinics to time. And if you could actually say, my weakness is I struggled, I have struggled in the past to run my clinics to time. And the consequence of that is that the admin staff were having to stay, I realized the admin staff were all having to stay late. And so I knew something had to change. And then you go on and say what the things are, that's very different from saying, oh yeah, I'm just really, I'm a really great doctor. And I love talking to all my patients so that I know them really well, and they all feel listened to. So it can be the same weakness, but presented in a way that creates better impact for your interview answer.

Yeah. I think the other thing to avoid is kind of clichéd weaknesses, like, I'm a real perfectionist.

Yeah. We don't like a perfectionist.

So, nah. Just stay away from it. It's a no. It's just a no. I think you've got to find something that feels authentic to you. It is a weakness, and so it's got to be something that also remains a weakness. But you've got some factors that you use to mitigate it, and, or actually some kind of reflections that you've done on this that make you, you know, more insightful and, you know, a better human as a result of that. So I don't know, can you think of some good ones?

I think good ones, so a common one that people use is taking on too much or not being able to say no. And I think like the structure that we follow is kind of the one I mentioned, which is that you say, this is my weakness, this is the impact it had, and these are 3 ways that I address it now. And so the main focus is these are the 3 things I do to make sure it's under control. So common one that people do is, yeah, I take on too much. So I struggle to say no, I end up taking on too much, and an impact of that is, I actually missed a deadline to submit a research paper because I'd taken on too many projects at once. I missed the deadline and I ended up letting down the people on my team. And so I realized that something had to change. And so I now do X, Y, and Z to make sure I don't take on too much or make sure I set boundaries. So something like that, I think, could be good. And in the end, it has to be authentic. So it needs to be true, but then you can kind of shape How you share it in a way that's optimal for your for your interview answer, and just bearing in mind that it's it's a job interview, so you don't want to overshare. So something like I spend time ruminating over cases is a bit of a well. What does ruminating mean? You know, does that mean you're not sleeping? You're you know having to take time off. From stress because you're worried about every patient you've seen, or does it mean something specific? So I can spend quite a long time thinking about a patient when they've been very sick or when there's been an issue, a specific issue with their care. For example, in one particular occasion, this happened. So you just make it very specific. In one occasion, this happened, and I realized I was still thinking about it 3 hours later into the evening. And so I knew something had to change. And so now I, whatever. Let's do it. Do some power poses when I leave work. Do whatever it is that you, you know, listen to a podcast, have a bath when you leave work. So, you know, these are the things that you do. So it's taking a big problem, this is, I ruminate over cases, to, I ruminated over one specific case and realized something had to change. And I think if you can get your weakness to a manageable size, then it's much less likely to be a deal breaker.

I think that's really good advice, and it's a nice way to approach the answer as well.

Our tip and trick this week is thinking about when people use time in a role. So they might say when they're telling you about their clinical experience, I did 12 months as a cardiology reg, or I did 6 months respiratory in whatever hospital. So we generally advise against doing it in that way. What are the reasons for that, and what do you think about it, Becky?

Yeah, so I think when we're thinking about USPs, unique selling points, what we want you to be able to do is to describe that in enough detail that you, and therefore the panel, are clear about what are the skills and the knowledge that you've gained as a result of that, and what are you now bringing to this consultant role. So if you say 6 months in cardiology or whatever it is, the panel doesn't know what that means. So if you've done however long in a particular specialty, then think about what are the skills that you took away from that. So I've done X number of cases of this, I've done this number of outpatient clinics on my own. In each one of those clinics, I saw this number of patients and it ran this you know, a number of times every week or something like that, or I've run the multidisciplinary team meeting once a week for 6 months. And now the panel can see, oh, okay, that's interesting, that's a skill set that we need. So don't assume that just because you understand what you did in that 6 months that they can read your mind and understand it too. Just describe it in a way that talks about transferable skills rather than time spent, if that makes sense.

Yep, I think that's great advice. And it's actually not that hard for people to do that. It's just the initial thing. The easiest way to describe something is to say, well, I did— because that's how you write it in your CV. I was here for 12 months, I was there for 5 months, whatever. So that's the natural way that it comes out. But actually, if you dig a bit deeper than that, it's going to have much stronger impact for your panel as well. Okay, I think we will wrap up there. So thank you very much for another excellent chat, Becky. Next week we've got lots more good stuff to come, including someone who's got told they're going to have a stakeholder panel for their interview. So we're going to chat a little bit about what that might involve. So I look forward to seeing you then.

See you then.