Toxins and Autoimmunity, with Dr. Aly Cohen

We now have 7 to 14% estimated percent of the US population that has some type of autoimmune disease. And there's a rise of these cases. And what's happening is that we're seeing them now in younger patients with no particular family history. So these are de novo cases. It's really because this is a collision between what we're walking through, eating, drinking, putting on our skin, using this feminine care, and, and really how this affects the human body at the cellular and tissue level.

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Hold on to your ha.

Hello and welcome to the Feel Freaking Amazing podcast. I'm Wendy Trubo. Obviously, Ed's not with us today because it's just me. And today we have an awesome guest whose subject is near and dear to my heart, which is toxins. Her name is Dr. Ailey Cohen. She is an environmental health expert and board certified physician who practices rheumatology and integrative medicine in Princeton, New Jersey. Her new book, Detoxify, which came out recently, connects the dots between everyday chemicals and the epidemic rise in immune disorders and autoimmune disease and what we can do about it because it's not all doom and gloom. Ailee, welcome. I'm so excited to have this conversation with you today.

Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. And hello to your community.

My pleasure. You know, when we were doing the research for our book, one of the studies that I fell on and was like, you have to be kidding me, was published in 1989. And it was a Massachusetts study which automatically caught my attention because I'm in Massachusetts. And it looked at that one in every six deaths could be attributed to either air or water quality. And this is from 1989. This is at 20 years old. This is almost 40 years old. Like, we've known this for a long time.

And yeah, things are not getting better, they're getting worse in the epidemiology. You know, I tell patients, you know, listen, and I tell the community, I wouldn't be doing this if I wasn't a rheumatologist for 22 years now. I mean, I've watched the landscape of my own practices that I've been in, and the current one I'm in now. And you know, I've been seeing an increase, a rise in autoimmune disease cases and also immune, not just autoimmune, but immune disease cases like food allergies and dermatitis and all of these inflammatory conditions that are not necessarily directed at self like autoimmune diseases. But what I've been seeing is mirrored by what the epidemiologic papers are showing, what the NHANES data is showing. We now have 7 to 14% estimated percent of the US population that has some type of autoimmune disease. And there's 80 classically written about in the western medicine journals. But technically we have a rise of these cases. And what's happening is that we're seeing them now in younger patients with no particular family history. So these are de novo cases. You know, 1% of the world's population is rheumatoid. That is not because we're getting better as doctors at diagnosing, in my opinion. It's because we have 15 minutes with our doctors. How could you possibly learn the vast majority of information? It's really because this is a collision between what we're walking through, eating, drinking, putting on our skin, using as feminine care, and really how this affects the human body at the cellular and tissue level. I mean, that's what I'm trying to explain.

Right? And you see this. I mean, what's crazy is you're a rheumatologist, so you see the autoimmune and immune component, and then when you talk to the oncologists, they're seeing the cancer component. Right. So it's not just autoimmune and immune dysfunction. It's cancer earlier, younger, more aggressive, and a lot of it tracks back to these environmental toxins. So talk to me about when you talk about immune disrupting chemicals, what are you referring to? Which ones are you particularly focused on?

Yeah, immune disrupting chemicals or IDCs was basically, I coined it because I've been studying and researching and writing about EDCs, endocrine disrupting chemicals, which are unbelievably robust in the literature, in terms of the papers, internationally, in terms of the endocrine society with their statement papers and the, you know, reproductive and ob GYN societies, all of these pediatric American College of Pediatrics. Every society now recognizes endocrine disrupting chemicals as a term for how many of these chemicals affect human hormones and the endocrine system in one way or another at very low doses, you know, over time in general, and how they work differently from just Dose makes the poison in terms of, you know, classical toxicology. I threw in this concept of immune disrupting chemicals. I coined that because I said to my colleagues who actually are really deep in the, in the weeds of EDCs, I said, why aren't we framing this around how they work from an immune system component? And that really came up. That's how I kind of derive it. So the immune disrupting chemicals, I'll give you an example. Bisphenol A or bpa. Okay, so many of your audience members, many maybe not have heard of BPA as being a problem. It was taken out of baby bottles that were plastic in 2012 because it was so well known as an endocrine disrupting chemical. It could not only affect the estrogen receptors in upregulating, downregulating, but it has direct effects on the gut microbiome. It has effects on thyroid, it has effects on insulin, really resistance so much in the peripheral tissues, but also increases in the amounts of insulin that's produced. So it has metabolic effects. But BPA has effects on pretty much any hormone system in the body, but some more than others. BPA was also recognized as having immune system effects, and that's what I call out in the book. But it's also all over the place in the literature. It can affect cytokine production. It can create what's called molecular mimicry. Where our bodies see BPA from what we ingest in a variety ways, maybe canned foods has BPA on the interior lining and some other ways, mostly ingestion, and essentially causes a, a response where it doesn't recognize human tissue from bpa. So that's called molecular mimicry. It's basically mimicking human tissue to self antigen. So the idea is that there's lots of mechanisms, different chemicals work in different ways. We're starting to see classes being studied, like phthalates are being studied for their effects. The bisphenols are being studied, the heav metals are being studied. We know this and we're just. I'm applying this to where do we see these things in day to day everyday life? Let's look at that in the book and let's see where we're getting exposed so that we can kind of reduce those exposures and reduce our risk for developing health conditions, you know, connected to these chemicals.

So in your clinical practice, what are you noticing? Do you, or so I guess I should back up. Do you test for the environmental toxicants in your clinical practice?

So interestingly enough, I used to be very avid about doing this But I realized that in New Jersey, for instance, it's an out of pocket expense. A lot of practices that do kind of holistic wellness, functional integrative will do a lot of out of network testing because they can or they want to. I can do them too. But what I've realized is we're all contaminated. We're all contaminated with a lot of different things. So what I'd rather people do and what I write about and post about on the Smart Human, which is my platform, is give people solutions to spend that money in a different way. So in other words, why don't we consider big ticket items that are going to change our health in bigger ways than just testing, where in any minute, day to day, you're going to have a different level depending on where you're exposed, what you eat, what you breathe.

So you would say basically you don't need to test, you know you're contaminated.

And if you want to test. I have tests for ICD10 codes where people can use their insurance. So I have a list of all the companies that are reputable in terms of chemical testing like you're asking, which I do in certain cases and I talk about some of the cases in the book. Then I have also the ICD10 numbers which are what doctors use to justify ordering a test, where you can hand it to your doctor and say, I'd like my heavy metals run, cadmium, arsenic, lead and mercury. Here's the code, here's the test, let's do that. I have a couple cancer codes in there. I want people to be really advocate for themselves in a world where I think it's so variable in the medical system. I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I just think doctors, western doctors like myself, yourself, we've been trained to follow a certain path. And I want people to have the ability to ask the right questions and come informed to whoever their healthcare practitioner is.

That's great. So when you're talking about the big ticket items that people will focus on, what are those things that you, you recommend people focus on?

Yeah, I think about high yield items like number one, why, why bring a bunch of products into your home where it's going to get into your home, you know, get onto surfaces, maybe hand to mouth behavior with pets and kids. So things like, you know, why do we need so many house cleaners? Just thinking about big ticket items, you know, why do we need a sink counter, a sink cleaner, oven cleaner, carpet cleaner, window cleaner, you know, so I wanted people to know that those Things we can cut back. It's part of my, what I call the four A's of environmental health navigation. It's in the book. It's how my 21 day plan is broken down. It's very simple, but you want to assess first thing and see where these things might be coming in. There's even a 50 question survey which I think every doctor should at least take a look at and pull from what they know those questions. The second thing of the forays is avoid or swap. So avoiding by reduction of products we may not even need in the first place or not want because we've been marketed to. We can also swap. We can swap to products we do like, like a cleaner lip balm or a body spray or you know, a self tanner I use the other day was a level one on EWG because my legs are so white. We just came out of winter. So there's lots of choices that we have and we can either reduce or swap. The third A, by the way, out of the four A's is add. What are we adding into our bodies to make it thrive? We can get into that. And then the last A, since we're on it is allow, which is life. It's my hair coloring, it's my lacrosse game I have to go to in a couple hours to see my kids on really toxic turf. It's allow, it's travel, it's birthday cake. And you need that piece in order to do some of the harder change outs, I think.

Right. Cause perfection only exists on the Hollywood movie screen. So you're not expected to be perfect. You're expected to be in the game and dance with the exposures you get. For example, we travel a lot and I travel with a topical glutathione spray. So whenever I'm on the plane, I'm like, oh, let me get detoxing while I'm on the plane rather than wait for later and let it build up. So that's a great. Allow is such a great approach because you're not going to be perfect and perfection is not real. In fact, it makes you stressed and then you shut down your detox anyway. Okay. Do you recommend people do water filtration and air filtration in their homes?

Yeah. So first assess. And part of that big assessment is what are the big ticket items as we were talking about? So certainly food by volume is one of the biggest contributors to a lot of chemicals, variety of chemicals, food additives, colors, preservatives, packaging. Food packaging has an effect. So by thinking about less Processed or less ultra processed foods in general is a much greater, better way to look at food. And also thinking about USDA organic frozen. USDA organic foods happen to be even remarkably not just cleaned or cleaner from a USDA organic certified perspective. Less pesticides, less genetically modified or no genetically modified ingredients, preservatives and all that. But it also happens to be really chock full of nutritional value. So frozen organics are like to me, the new fresh. Growing up when I needed fresh or was told fresh is the best, turns out in supermarkets now, fresh has traveled a long time. So unless you're really growing your own food or you have wonderful farmers markets like we have here in New Jersey that have organic sellers, or you wash your stuff in a variety white vinegar, I do it yourself recipes on how to wash produce. But technically in modern day times, our nutritional value is a lot lower than we would expect. Soil, quality, transit. And so that's why I really say from food, think about frozen USDA organics. And then from another perspective, water. Water is one of the most, in my opinion, most unrecognized contributor to human health conditions that people don't think about. And water filters run the gamut on pricing, but they're really inexpensive now, even for reverse osmosis, which I recommend most. And I even talk about that in a whole chapter on the book about how water matters so much. Where, how we can carry it cleaner, how we can clean it better, why it matters. And those are two huge volumes into the body.

My husband thought I was nuts when I was like, we're filtering the house. I went through a massive health challenge of my own and ultimately learned that I had heavy metals, mycotoxins, and not as much environmental toxins, mostly heavy metals and mycotoxins. And I was like, that's it. We're not getting exposed to anything else. So we put in a whole house water filter. And at first he was like, okay, honey, whatever you want. You haven't met my husband. He's a really nice guy, he's really easygoing. But he really was like, do we need to do this? And I was like, we need to do this. So we put in the whole house water filter. And then he goes, we should put a filter on the bathroom sink because we drink from the bathroom sink and I don't think it's filtered enough. I was like, who are you and what have you done with my easygoing husband? So, you know, we filter at the kitchen, we filter at the bathroom where we're drinking it, and then we filter the whole house. And we originally thought like, oh, it's not a big deal, you know, we live in a town with great municipal water. But guess what? These filters are disgusting when we change them. There's so much.

Oh yeah, you know, upstream from that is, you know, if people understand, as I explain in the book, what our water system regulations are, which are really outdated, they're from the 1970s. In fact, 1974 was the safe Drinking Water act that was passed and really only covers 91 chemicals at that time. And now fast forward 50 odd years later, we have had thousands of chemicals added into our environment, including that end up in lakes and streams and waters and sewage that end up in our drinking water because it cycles back to municipal tap. And yet we haven't changed the infrastructure to manage those additional chemicals. So that's the disconnect between our regulation for water and what we're actually seeing now, mind you, also water at these wastewater treatment plants, which service 85% of the US population, they actually add things like fluoride and chlorine and detergents in order to process that water and then send it out. Then it travels through, you know, PVC piping or lead piping or any breaks in the piping. Ours is 30 miles away. And I actually did an interview with all them. They're doing all their jobs. Right. It's just that when water leaves a wastewater treatment plant, it's actually quite dirty, even from what we add to it, let alone what else is added to it. So we have an opportunity to clean water when it hits our home at the point of use. And so I really do push for people to at the very least just get one in your kitchen to cook with, to drink with, to fill up with. Because, you know, you can also get filters on shower heads and that kind of thing. But those are expensive purchases. I want people to start thinking just mostly drinking and cooking to start with.

Well, also when you think about everything's better than nothing. So if you're doing nothing, you're getting nothing. But if you're doing something, anything you're doing is better than not doing anything. So if you can do.

Not at all. Yeah, right.

Like countertop is better than straight tap. And then, you know, filtered. You're like you're partial to reverse osmosis. I'm just partial to. I'm not actually, but that's to me not a fighting point. It's like, whatever, get something on your filters. So, okay. And you know, it's funny because I think at one point I was doing research for a talk. And I think the last time the EPA banned something was in 1989, I think.

Well, we almost got six perfluor alkyl out last fall. That was going to be the really big change actually, because there's over 15,000 forever chemicals. People have heard about these in the news that are from Teflon and nonstick chemicals and stain guard and you know, these were, you know, I guess they were the focus of Dark Waters if you saw that movie with Mark Ruffalo. So, so there are 15,000. They've made it into our water systems from military sites and from manufacturing. So there were six that were going to be removed from, you know, we're going to be remediated, meaning if they hit a certain level, you would have a maximum concentration level. They would be caught at these 160,000 wastewater treatment plants and they would be removed. Right. So six is number one. Six is a drop in the bucket out of the 50.

Pathetic. Honestly, pathetic.

Pathetic. Number two, we didn't have the infrastructure yet. So how are you going to change out 160,000 wastewater treatment plants to manage those six? That would take a few years. So even if they put that into, into regulation, it doesn't mean it has to start for actionable changes for several years. And by the way, it's been taken off the table anyway, you know, from an EPA perspective. And you know, so my message has always been do not wait for regulation. Do not wait for whatever red dye number three. That's great, I applaud it all. But I would never wait for the amount of chemicals we're talking over 100,000 now that pretty much make their way into our lives from all of our stuff we love, you know, water, food, cosmetics, personal care, cleaning, industrial. Don't wait for all of these regulations. It won't take, you know, during our course of our lifetime, they won't make a difference if you wait for one at a time. Even what we need to do is for ourselves. That was always my educational work for high schools and college. It's my book. It's really saying and how I post. Even for the smart human, it's here's the nugget that you need to do the why and here's the what to do and let's do it for ourselves. Let's have agency over our body and empower ourselves instead of waiting for anyone else to make those changes, in my opinion.

Yeah, it's funny, Ailey, because the thing that you're kind of underscoring and I really believe that people make behavior change. Either there's someone who wants to wait for a problem to exist and then they'll respond, or they want to make change because they know it's the right thing to do for themselves. But the vast majority of people need to wait for a problem. And so now here I want to bring it back full circle because as a rheumatologist you see these problems. And so I would even say the next layer is don't just do it because the regulations aren't going to change, but do it because so many of us have an autoimmune or an immune dysfunction or some type of chronic illness that when you kind of dump in metabolic associated fatty liver disease and obesity and insulin resistance and all the metabolic dysfunction on top of all the rheumatological dysfunctions, we're Talking about like 85% of the population, like everyone's got something. So if you're waiting for a problem, if you aren't in the best health of your life, the problem is now basically there's nothing to wait for.

Yeah, absolutely. And listen, you know, when I talk to my patients and when I talk to anyone, I always say listen, you know, it's very hard to do anything when it doesn't affect you immediately. Right. I, you know, we're not into delayed gratification. It's just not how society is kind of working. Right. Even with myself, you know, no one wants to, you know, kind of do anything. But what I argue and what my, my points are is that this stuff is so low energy change, low effort change. These are just making different choices, knowing what you need to know. This is low cost in terms of water filters or how to choose, you know, organic foods or wash your foods and produce without, you know, having organic available or how do you swap cosmetics and personal care products. I just spoke to 600 kids at my kids high school and taught them really quickly how to look up their stuff and boom, they're off and running. So the idea, when it's risk, benefit, you know, basically the benefit is huge for very little risk and effort. And so even if you're one of those people who feels really good or feels really healthy, it pays to get this stuff on board anyway so that you can stave off harm and healthful health issues down the line. Especially if you're going to get pregnant one day or you're considering conceiving, I think that's a good time to start to think about this stuff. I never blame moms, I never blame, I Mean, I was, as I write in the book, I was rolling up to McDonald's every morning for their deluxe breakfast on hot plastic. I mean, this is what I ate every day when I was pregnant. So I want people to really think this is not about regret or shame or judgment. It's really about a journey that everyone takes to do little bits of change over time, I think starting with things like habits. If you're going to have tea or coffee in the morning, maybe consider that water, maybe filter that water. Maybe you're thinking about whether it's in a Styrofoam cup or it's a cup that you go to Starbucks, maybe bring your own stainless steel. These little changes over time actually really do add up. You can measure them in the blood, you can measure them in the urine, you can measure them in breast milk. But why do that? Put your money into the doing instead of the testing?

For the most part, yeah, 100%. So you talk about this anti chemical dietary pyramid. Can you talk a little more about that?

Yeah, you know, I'm a product of Dr. Andrew Weil and all of his training and I work with him. In fact, two books were in his series for Oxford and he has the anti inflammatory pyramid or the anti inflammatory diet, which is in a pyramid. And it's wonderful. It's based on the Mediterranean diet similar to say the Blue Zones, you know, and then Mark Hyman has the Pegan diet. And there's been a couple pyramids that I have seen over the years of my training and I thought I would take the best of what I thought those had to offer and really add in the environmental health piece. So the bottom has the detoxification premises of what people should be thinking, I think very simplistically, then moving into food packaging and then moving into water and then moving into food. Because I think if you just take food and you don't think about the quality of your food, if you don't think about the food packaging that contributes so much of some of these chemicals and you don't think about the detox picture, you're missing the full picture. So that's kind of what I, you know, I put together, took months and it really, it's in the book and people can certainly, you know, print it out and put it on their fridge. And it's just really a bigger picture of sort of the anti inflammatory diet with this environmental component piece. And I think it's, it's very useful and very simple.

Yeah. And it's interesting because we're always saying to people. Look, you know, people come to us and they're like, I want to do detox, I want to be evaluated, I want to get rid of it. I'm like, that's cool. But like, like, are you pooping? Are you sleeping? Are you managing your stress?

Very simple stuff.

Toxic. So I call those the foundations of your health that you literally can't step over the foundations of your health. You have to sleep, you have to eat food that serves your body, you have to move your body and sweat. You need to manage your stress. You have to have relationships that work for you to have a purpose in life, that those are the foundations of your life and then you can get onto. Because if you don't have a purpose, why bother, right? What? So it's so interesting, like, you know, it's all in a pyramid creation. That makes a lot of sense.

Yeah, no, absolutely. And in fact, you're, you're describing a lot of the AD out of my four A's, you know, assess, avoid, or swap. And ad. The AD is all the things that have made humans thrive for millions of years. It's the sweating, it's the using our muscles, it's getting great sleep to affect the glymphatic system, which is the fluid around our brain and our spinal cord that actually collects chemicals during the day that we now know great science washes out while we sleep. So sleep should not just be for waking up and cognition and memory, we'd love that. But there's a clean cycle when it comes to sleeping. It's adding in the right nutrition that offsets some of the epigenetic changes from environmental chemicals. As the science shows, it's adding in cruciferous vegetables and foods that churn up your liver function to break down many of these chemicals into safer byproducts. So there's lots to add in spiritual community. You know, all of those things matter to human health. And that's the piece. So it's not just taking away toxins. I think that's too simplistic and it's not so easy. But it's also adding in the pieces that make our bodies thrive and work better.

You have a 21 day detox plan you've referenced. Can you talk about that? Yeah.

And it's by no means perfection. It's a way to get started because. And it's broken down into the four A's, you know, assess, which is starting with the 50 questions that I have in here, one or zero, you add up your numbers, you just kind of get a Starting point. So it starts with assess, and then it goes through avoid, and then it goes into add that component of what we bring in. And then the allow at the end to sort of tie it all together. But it's really like, boom, you get started right away. You don't have to think too much. Everyone thinks this is really a heady topic. It is. I'm trying desperately to show people that you can get started and get going at your own pace. And here's the way to do it. And at the end of the 21 days, there's even symptom tracker trackers, you know, like, you know, in the beginning and at the end, so you can actually see whether you feel better. And even some of the patients in the book, I have a rheumatoid arthritis patient, I have a patient who comes in with fatigue. How do I assess that patient? What do I rule out? And then how do they feel better from the beginning of where they started to where, you know, 21 days later? And I accept, you know, usually beyond 21 days, they're just moving on with those great habits that they've incorporated. So it's a really great foundation to get started in a very difficult subject to navigate. And I've gotten the most positive response for that 21 day plan, for sure.

Yeah, I'm a huge fan of replace the thing that you're running out of and don't worry about it until you start to run out of it. So women are always like, oh, my God, all these products. I'm like, yeah, all these products. But you just spent your money on it and the needle's not going to move massively if you finish that product. So finish it out and then buy a new one based on the EWG's rating and go for something that's a one and swap it when you're ready. Same as when you run out of whatever that candy is. Swap it out or whatever that, you know, whatever kid's favorite food is, swap it when you run out, as opposed to, you don't have to clear out your whole pantry. Use it up, use it up. Replace it when you're done, for sure.

And, you know, I, look, I'm keen on money and saving money, right? So, like when we were using paper plates for years and years and years, and I finally realized, you know what, I bet there's something on those paper plates and, oh, I bet they use a little bit of chlorine to clean up that paper. And then I basically stopped using them after a while. And then we got more into the dishwasher and then I thought, oh, oh, I have to think about the dishwasher soap and what have I used? So like it's almost like you're. I want people to be in the driver's seat. I want people to say like this is almost gamifying the process. You know, I'm in control, I'm not the victim of our circumstance. And I think, you know, even every day I'm changing out like my laundry determinant. Maybe I can get a better one, maybe the formulations change, but at least I have the resources, the websites, the apps that are free to do that seamlessly, you know. And so that's the idea is that this is about, you know, resources and arming yourself with the right information, not just going, getting flipped out on TikTok and some of these products that are like crazy doodle. I think people should just do this in a way that you, you utilize the best resources out there to make very simple choices over time and have.

Grace for yourself when you screw it up or when you have a gap. Right?

The.

I think the most important thing that any. I'll speak to the women who are listening because we're all really hard on ourselves. All the women listening. Have grace on yourself. I think I've told you, I've told a lot of them this, I'll tell you this, I was so excited. I found a detergent that came in a paper box and didn't have a smell and worked and I was all excited. I bought it for like three rounds on auto ship and I have four kids. So we go through a boatload of laundry and on the third round I got the shipment done. I went, oh, I never looked to see if this was the cleanest brand. So I look and of course it's not the cleanest brand. It was just good marketing and, and I was like, I just got a four month supply. What do I do? What do I do? What do I do? Use it. So I'm like, I'm using it and it gives me four months to cancel my subscription and find something that's actually new, right? Like have some grace. And now it's a good story, right? Like, oh, the detox stock didn't do that. So have some grace for yourself for sure.

I mean, I can't even tell you how mistakes, mistakes, you know, the fact is that when we know better, we do better. That's it. You know, and if you, I mean I say with patients with their supplements, as I'm trying to Move them into maybe some cleaner brands that have more substance and less chemical fillers and all that. Use them up. Use your stuff up. You spend for it. Use them up. Don't feel bad. And then when they come out, you know, when you're running through them, you move on to something else and you become this tapestry of improvement over time. Layering it in.

Exactly. Okay, where can people. We're going to put this all in the show notes. Where can people find. You follow, you get the book, all of it.

I appreciate that. So I'm actually in Princeton, New Jersey. I'm still practicing. I plan on practicing until my dad, who's now 85, is still practicing as a nephrologist. So I do plan on being around a while, hopefully working. So if anyone needs me on that regard, I do telemedicine as well. But I am found online for the, you know, it's the smart human with Dr. Ailey Cohen. So it's the. @ the smarthuman on YouTube, the smarthuman.com, i even have courses that people are interesting interested on doing very small courses on heavy metals, on pesticides, on EMF radiation. I have those courses available. And so it's all the Smart Human. And then yes, on Amazon, Barnes and Noble. This is my new book and I put my heart and soul into it. Five years, and I hope people get out of it what, you know, you know, what I think they want to, but also what my patients seem to feel is pretty good. But it's very usable, very practical, and actually very empowering. I don't think there's any negativity in it. So people will check it out and that's it. You can find me online.

Too. Awesome. Ailee, thank you for being here. This was awesome. This is a wealth of information. And for the listeners, go get the book, follow her on Instagram, get in touch, and, you know, make a step today to make your life better. So, Ailey, thank you for being.

Here. Oh, it's my pleasure. And thank you for sharing this information with your community because it really does take a village. So thanks for recognizing that it.

Does. All right, guys, thanks for listening to another episode of the Feel Freakin Amazing podcast. Have a great day. Don't go it.

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