E027 - Marco Karman from Be More You

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Welcome to the Green Element Podcast, where business and sustainability come together.

Welcome, Marco. Thank you very much for joining the Green Elements podcast. So tell me a bit about your business and what your purpose is and who you work with.

Well, I've become an entrepreneur to really add value to the system as a whole, and what I've— what I'm doing now with my company is help people to become aware about the fact that we have 2 ways of looking at what's happening in front of us. Either with your conscious mind, but also with your subconscious survival mechanism. And we help people to reduce the impact of that on their daily life. And we work with professionals from large to small corporations.

Brilliant. Interesting. So what would you say your business superpower was?

I think the superpower which we have is that we're able to unhide what's going on in your brain. And by doing so, we can make people aware whether they're in a proactive and constructive mode or in a reactive survival mode. And this is very powerful because people are very hardly aware about the fact that this is a process which is continuously going on in everybody's heads.

Okay, so that sounds really interesting. So could you let us know, so say someone comes to you on day 1, you know, at the beginning, And then could you just give us an idea of how it— this— the story goes to the end? So what happens with— when they come to talk to you?

Well, I think the key thing which you need to do to be able to change your behavior is to create space between stimulus and response. So in that space, you have the opportunity to choose and do something different than you did before. And that's easier said than done because normally once you've learned something and it's ingrained into your system, there's an automated— it's an automated system basically. Something— you see something, you respond without thinking about it. And like when you drive a car, once you've learned how to do it, you don't have to think about it anymore. That's also how behavior works. And to create this space and particularly to get out of the automatic rhythm that you jump into a survival mode because something happens in front of you and start to respond in a survival reflex. We really measure people's brain activity, and by doing so and let them watch a movie, and if in the movie something happens which triggers a survival mechanism, all of a sudden they see a screen which pops up and falls over the the movie they're watching. And because it's happening, people become aware that something is not as effective as they want. And initially, people get into a fight mode and try to move it away and open the screen again. But since you don't know how to do it, the only thing what happens is more and more triggers fire off and the screen gets more and more closed.

Okay.

And then we help people with exercises to be in the here and now and focus their attention on the part of the screen which they can see, whether it's very small or completely open, that doesn't matter. And they learn that through these exercises, and when they do that, they are able to cut the train. There's a trigger going off, you experience stress, and you jump into a survival mode. The trigger still goes off. you still feel the stress, but you don't respond. There you start creating your time between stimulus and response, and you're able to develop new behavior. And at the same time, people also develop their inner balance and calmness. And that's a very powerful learning experience because they very often claim that they've felt a sense of calmness in themselves, in themselves. which you have never experienced before.

Okay, so it's almost like an environmental mindfulness.

Yeah, it is, and it's mindfulness of the 21st century. And we've created this simulator setting, if you want, where we can show to people where brain triggers are going off or not.

Okay.

And it really enhances and accelerates the learning process. So within 2 days, because that's the first step people take with us, they've gained more leverage and learned more than they've ever done consciously in their life before.

Interesting. Okay, that's good.

And the result, because maybe that's what it's about, is that people are able to watch more open-minded to what's going on in front of their eyes rather than to jump into conclusions immediately. Be open, and by responding, looking at things and responding in an open way, there's a bigger chance that you will also get a constructive and open response from the other person you're dealing with.

Okay, okay, cool. That's, that's Really interesting. So can you tell us how you engage your staff, suppliers, customers with your mission and purpose?

Well, the way I engage my staff is by when I'm looking for new employees is that what we're doing is contributing to a better world. And I honestly believe that men and mankind have only one fundamental problem, which is this outdated survival mechanism in your brain. And people really jump on this mission to join the company. And that's all we do. So everything we do from early in the morning until the end of the day is focused on helping people make this shift. And also in dealing with our clients, we hear so often that people know that they want to do things differently. They've also invested time and money and effort to do so. But one way or another, they feel that they are stuck into their existing behavior, and sooner or later, the new things which they've learned sort of fall asleep, and they jump into their own known behavior before. And the thing, the fact that we are able to help people to make a definite transition, yeah, that's where companies really like to work with us. Because they've not experienced it before.

Okay, okay. So when it comes to running an ethical and sustainable business, what would you say your biggest struggle so far was, and can you tell us a bit about it and how you've overcome it?

Well, I started this company in 2010, and I think the biggest struggle which I've had, particularly in the beginning, is that what we have developed and offering is so innovative and so new that people tend to be very skeptical. And it was hard in the beginning to stick to what we believe is good for personal development and also good for mankind as a whole and not be sidetracked and do things which companies knew more before, were more easy to accept and buy from us rather than this innovative thing which we developed. So it has been hard in the beginning to stick to our path despite the fact that the low-hanging fruit was more outside what we developed. And that of course gave some financial constraints in the beginning as well.

I can imagine. So who would your target market be for, I mean, as an organization?

Yeah, that gets a bit difficult because the thing we developed is really a universal method. So when I look at the clients we've helped so far. It ranges from children at the age of 10 or 11, my own children came to us, but also people well over 60.

Right.

From a starting point, it was from people who got stuck into a burnout to the high potentials of a company, and from the working level, from people from the working floor, if you want, to directors. Because it's a one-to-one program, we make it tailor-made for everybody who attends.

So could you work with an organization as a whole that would pick people within that, within their own organization, to come and talk to you?

Oh, that's a good question, because the exciting thing is that what the core of our process is, this one-on-one approach, but we've also done the first development of teams now.

Okay.

Because it is— suppose that you and I are working together and something happens which sets a trigger in my system and I jump into this reactive behavior. Once you have gone through the same process and know what it's like and become more aware when it's happening with yourself but also with other people, you can tell to me, hey Marco, I think you're jumping into a reactive behavior. And if you're able to mention it to me in an open-minded way, you help me to get out of this survival mode immediately. So it drastically enhances the cooperation between colleagues.

Yeah, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I'm reading a book called Reinventing Organizations at the moment, and what you're talking about fits very nicely within that. I have a feeling it's a French author, but I couldn't— I'm obviously reading it in— well, obviously, but I am reading it— well, it kind of is to the rest of the world. It's obvious I'm reading in English. Which you are. It may not be necessarily obvious since we are speaking in English, but brilliant. Yeah, it's a brilliant, brilliant book. If you could offer one piece of advice to our listeners, which could help them with their purpose, what would that be?

Well, I think probably if there's one piece of advice I would give, it would be try to respond to people you'd like to be responded to yourself. It sounds easy, but it's easier said than done. And so often we find it easy to see what other persons are not doing right, And then when you really look at what you're doing yourself and be honest, you come to the conclusion, my God, I do things which I wouldn't like to have done to myself. So I think that's— if it's one thing, that would be the thing, I think.

Okay, so when it comes to reducing your environmental impact and carbon footprint of your business, what is your single biggest challenge or frustration?

Well, particularly on this, on the carbon dioxide footprint, I don't have a big challenge. I think the big— biggest frustration I have is in a different area, which is on the contribution footprint, which is something totally different. But I believe that everybody on Earth has something which is perfectly fitted for his or her personality, and that's basically your task in life. And what I see is that many people are struggling because of this reactive behavior in really getting the best out of themselves. I wish that a lot of people are open and have the courage to walk their path to fulfill their own task. And by doing so, I also believe that you understand that in honesty, we're not in competition with each other. Because if you have a unique spot in the world and so have I, we don't have to compete. The only thing which we can do together is is find something which is in between our unique spots and find if there's some possibility to co-create something extraordinary.

Okay, so going back to Be More You and your own business and how you approach environmental management, can you let us know how you do approach your environmental management and your Carbon footprints?

Yeah, well, our carbon footprint is really very small because we don't have that much of an impact. But the only thing which— well, the only thing which we do do is with everything which we purchase, we look for environmentally safe stuff.

Okay.

Paper or printing ink, all those things we buy as environmentally safe as possible. And we also— it's a bit indirect. Part of an organization called Maatschappelijk Verantwoord Ondernemen, which is how would you translate it in English? To act as a company in an environmental safe way. Right. It's a Dutch organization. We are a member and we visit their events to get additional ideas and also share our ideas with their members.

Ah, okay. Oh cool, okay, brilliant. So is there any advice or learning that you'd like to share with everyone listening to this podcast?

Learning in general, you mean?

Yeah, learning about sustainability, your mission, you know, any advice that you can think of and go, actually, you know what, I wish I'd learned this at the beginning, or I wish I knew what to do, or maybe it's about what it is that you're offering and maybe tidbits on what and how people could become better within themselves as well?

Well, I think the key learning is, is what I explained a little bit earlier, is that the awareness that what you consciously see is colored subconsciously by your outdated survival modes. And to become aware about the fact that this is happening and become aware that if this happens, you jump into an either fight, flight, or freeze mode and show ineffective reactive survival behavior is very powerful, particularly if you can not only see it with yourself but also be aware that it happens with other people. And if it, if it's does, try to be compassionate and understand that the people, the person in front of you, how ineffective he or she is behaving, it's the best possible thing he or she can do at this moment in time given the circumstances. And if you see someone is struggling, try to give a helping hand.

Yeah.

And help people to get out of this survival mode and see if you're able to get them into a more proactive, constructive behavior, which is good for that person but also for your relationship and the interaction between the two of you.

Okay, so is there a way that we can learn more from you? Um, are you— you know, where can we go? We'll be putting all links, um, that you mentioned on our website and on— but, um, yeah, so how How can we learn more about what it is that you do?

Well, the easiest thing of course is to visit our website. It's www.bemoreyou.nl, and there you will be able to read more about it. And also, if you're interested, download a free PDF which will give you more insights on the 3 key things which is hindering your proactive and constructive behavior.

Brilliant. And we'll put those links on our website. What I should also say is that your website is in English as well, for the majority of listeners are English speakers. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

As we speak, we're upgrading it, so it will be done in a few weeks, I think, in English.

It is in English now. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Just to let you know. Oh yeah, because I was reading through it before this interview.

Yes.

Thank you so much, Marco, for your time today. I look forward to hearing more about how you get on as well. We were talking about some of the troubles that you're having and, you know, trying to get your message out there, and hopefully this helps you with this. And yeah, so thank you very much for coming on the show.

Thanks for the invitation and good luck.

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