Gut Health 101 Ep.2: The Gut-Hormone Connection with Becky Hartman

Welcome back once again, everybody. I'm super excited to talk keep on talking about all things gut. Last episode, Dr. Genti myself went from the mouth to anus to describe what the gut is. Today I'm here with Becky Hartman, Chief Innovation Officer for Rich Minigram Functional Medicine, who also happens to be my wife. She's a clinician as well, a occupational therapist, specialized with kids with special needs. And she's going to bring an interesting perspective because in many ways Becky is the kind of patient I see every day in the office, but she also has a clinical view and she's been on the back end. So I think we'll have a great conversation talking about all things gut and health related.

So coming from the patient perspective, I've been seen as a patient and as all of the labs are coming in and you're getting all of this information, it's starts to get a little overwhelming. And you start, at least I did as a patient, start thinking like, how am I going to address all of these things? Like, what are we going to even do? Obviously the doctor is going to dictate a lot of that, but I have known for years that I've had hormone issues and that feels more daunting to address. And then as more labs came in, more information was gathered and then I had my follow up visit. I realized and was told that really like the foundation of that is addressing my gut first, not actually jumping right into hormones because my gut is probably why everything is kind of out of balance. And that was a little bit, not just a revelation, but also very. It helped make it be just one thing. I just need to address this one thing. It's a big thing to address, but it helped consolidate everything that I felt like I was going to need to do into like sort of one quote unquote problem. And so I'm really excited to talk more about this today and learn more. I have a little bit of a foundation in gut health, but like I said, I hadn't thought, gosh, my hormones are all really driven by that. Even though I happen to live with somebody who had told me that over and over again, it still was very insightful when the labs actually came back that way.

Well, I think it's interesting you say that because there's so many things with, with Becky's health that was a learning process, whether it took 15 years to figure out that a formaldehyde exposure in grad school started her anxiety and a bunch of mental health issues that were actually just her brain on fire. But this is where the gut comes to play because the gut plays a central role in all things health, whether it's inflammation, which we now know as the root cause for all chronic illness, aging, infection, risk, metabolism, you know, which has to do with weight. But your hormones, which are a huge, huge part of women's health, in many ways, it's a female's superpower. I mean, think about. You can have a foreign human growing in your womb that you're in any other stage of life or any other place, your body would attack it and reject it. It stays there, and then your body not only grows organs, but then delivers it and still provides nourishment to it for another three, four, five, six months. That's pretty amazing. But the gut health, your gut is where a lot of these hormones are. 70% of estrogen, for example, is detoxified through your GI tract. So the gut really is a pivotal part of your health. And so, Becky, what are some insights you've had about gut health? Because again, you mentioned for years and years and years knew you had hormone issues, fatiguing issues, you were on fire. But it's literally only recently when you actually had the hard data. How did that inform some of your past, some of the clinical things, you know, whether some anxiety issues or other things? How did that kind of help solidify for you, your gut being at the center of your. Of a lot of your health issues?

I think sort of like a wow moment, looking at the. All of this is realizing that, like, I. I wasn't really a person who had a lot of, you know, quote, unquote, gut issues. I don't feel like I have, like, indigestion all the time. We actually used to laugh about this growing up because, like, I was the kid who could, like, eat anything, and I never really felt, you know, I get the tummy aches and stuff that my sibling and other kids that I would be around had. So I think, for me, like, realizing that it's not just digestion. Like, yes, a lot of people in our country and our culture have issues with digestion. You know, we've got a lot of ibs and different gut things where you feel your gut not working properly. I think realizing that it's extends so far beyond that. Maybe you can speak to a little bit of, like, how gut is the. Is the foundation of so many things.

I mean, yeah, great. So let's talk about more people. We know, you know, if you have pcos or you have endometriosis or really heavy periods, what we know now is that PCOS actually is an autoimmune syndrome. There are actually autoantibodies that attack your ovaries. And part of that is getting endometriosis, which is this really kind of weird thing. We actually grow tissues that are supposed to be on the lining of your uterus, actually in the walls of it. And then adenomyosis actually goes even deeper. And ultimately, any autoimmune issue, there's four things that are going on. You have to have a genetic predisposition. You have to have a triggering event, which can be trauma, chemical exposure, periods of stress, which you've had a few of those in our life. Having family is stressful. You have to have a chronic infection of some sort. And then you have to have leaky gut. And so for many, many people, the chronic infection is not something complicated like chronic Lyme disease or reactivation of Epstein Barr. It's dysbiosis or gut issues. You have overgrowth of strep, staph, and then leaky gut, which is where toxins that are. You know, think about your stool. Your stool is foul. It's foul. But those toxins, if your gut is leaky, can actually get exposed right to your immune system. And with 70% of your immune system being around your GI tract, all of a sudden, now your gut can be a part of your fertility issues of your heavy periods. With that information, could you talk about some of the things you dealt with that, you know, earlier on, when we first met, that heavy cycles, periods, some things like that that you figured out? Diet was a part of it, but ultimately your gut was the root of those things.

Yeah, I didn't recognize it as an a gut issue at all. But I was a. Even as a teen, like, I was the. I was a kid who had to occasionally, not always. There was a lot that I just dealt with. And I have a pretty high pain tolerance, but I definitely had days where I had to call my mom and have her come get me from school because I had cramped so bad. I was doubled over. And blessedly, my mom was compassionate about those types of situations because she understood it. And, yeah, I had horrible, horrible periods. Eventually that culminated in endometriosis and adenomyosis and, like, tumors just all over my abdomen, where I ended up having a supracervical hysterectomy. And when they removed my uterus, it was 16 times the size of a normal uterus for someone my age, which is bad. That's a very large. That's a lot of tumors and a lot of problems. It Was a great decision for me, but it was also one of those things. Things for anybody who's listening, who's in sort of like on your journey, you. You eat the right way, you do the right things, you know, you move, you are doing all the, you know, quote unquote, functional medicine things, and you still end up in a situation where you need to make a decision like that. It was a bit of a reckoning, like, I had to really think about, you know, can I address this another way? And at the point where I was. It was pretty much too, Too far gone at that point to correct it. But if I'd known the things that now, you know, those pieces, I feel like. I feel like we kind of get a second chance with our daughters actually, where we can give them tools and teach them about their bodies in a way and how things work together and teach them, you know, when you eat this, notice how your next period feels. And they can do that and realize like, oh, when I went to summer camp and ate junk the entire time because that's what was available to me, I felt horrible. And it's pretty cool to like, see them make those connections and actually have tools that weren't at my disposal at their ages to understand their bodies better.

Yeah. And by the time. And it's really, you know, the worst person to be your. Your doctor. The worst. What's the saying? The worst physician is one who treats himself, and the second worst one is the one who treats his family. And so, you know, it's easy to talk about things, but families are still too close. But I remember at some point in time, you're like, I think I have a. No. Oh, yeah. You said, I think I have a tumor. And you're like, getting a little stressed about it, I think, because you thought you had some kind of like, like ovarian cancer or something worse with that. I'm like, let me check. And I examined her. I'm like, this feels like a pregnant uterus. It wasn't. It was a massive fibroid. But at that point in time, it was kind of like, okay, we need to stop. Kind of just kind of need to become more serious about this. And one of the interesting things that can happen, which unfortunately by time that stage, is that uterine fibroids, if they get to a certain size, can actually. They can become autonomous and start making their own hormones. So that's where, you know, this is not to poo poo traditional medicine whatsoever. Because knowing that and knowing the size of it, it was like, you Know, we need to probably do something about this because when they get to a certain size, all of a sudden the, the fibroid itself can start making hormones. And then there's no amount of detoxifying herbs and gut health and stuff. You, you need to remove the source of the, the hormones at that point in time, which I've had other patients have these ovarian cysts that are very similar that contain their own inflammation, and you have to actually remove those surgically. What. One of my passions, I don't like the word passion too much, but one of my things I'm really excited about, I don't know, is kids. Like, like. And that's where our daughters come into play. Finding kids and finding people like my wife 20 years ahead of the time and going, hey, there's bad cycles you have every month where you feel debilitated and you can't work for two, three days. You feel like you have to roll up in a ball. Horrible pain, heavy bleeding, or the time up to that. You have, you know, pmdd. We have mood swings, you know, those. That's not optimal. It's unfortunately as normal now in our current society, but through diet to work on the gut. And that's where the gut comes into play because you're, there's this thing called the strabolome, which actually you said that was today is the first time you heard that word, the strabolome. The strabolome, it's like your metabolism, your metabolome, your proteome. It's, it's a fancy word that means all things related to estrogen. And so, yeah, ovaries make estrogen, like estradiol, placenta makes estriol or E3, fat tissue makes, makes estrone or E1. But then it has to be detoxifies, be broken down. And so your liver has to start the process. But ultimately 70% of that breakdown and, and detoxification occurs in the GI tract. So now we're back to the gut again, the gut being a super important thing for detoxifying hormones, particularly estrogen. And then all of a sudden, now it's also where 70% of the immune system is. And hormonal issues, interesting enough, have a massive inflammatory component to it, whether it's headaches, migraines, joint aches and pains, fatigue. Could you talk about some of, some of the things you dealt with over your journey of your hormonal journey that would relate to inflammation, some of your symptoms, joints and pains, getting injured really easy. You know, slip discs, slip disc, nerve impingement kind of stuff.

Yeah, I, I've had a lot of inflammation related issues over time. And again I mentioned earlier, I have a high pain tolerance. So I did a lot of like suck it up and, and carry on type behavior. Not necessarily. And part of that's just survival and being a mom and kids need you and there's, there's some degree to which that is okay and sometimes what we need to do. But also I've learned basically the hard way, the hardest possible way that I have to listen to when my body is giving me warning signals. So, you know, joint aches and pains and, and you know, fibromyalgia, like symptoms just achy all the time. And you know, I'd get up in the middle of the night to use the bathroom and it's like I felt like an elderly person where I'm like shuffling to the bathroom because like everything is stiff and sore and just from like being laying down for a little bit and just. Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to think like listing off all of the symptoms I've had all of the symptoms, everything that you can think of that people associate with inflammation, you know, headaches. I have a pretty crazy medical history if you think about it. And yeah, all of that stuff just being. Yeah, again, it's, it's still, still like dawning on me how much it's all does really go back to the gut, which it's like, I guess you can have the book knowledge, but like associating it with your own story sometimes takes some extra steps that you don't always get to right away, which is a. Interesting part of the process. What was the other part that you had asked me?

Don't remember.

Okay. Yeah, a lot of, A lot of just pain, like I would say chronic pain. Like that's the easiest way to describe the Nerf.

Some nerve pain stuff.

Yeah. Well, I did have a herniated disc that was pinching on a nerve, so that was really not fun. And then a lot of the ways to address things I don't handle very well. So if you give me a steroid, it makes me feel worse than I probably felt before I took the steroid, which is never fun. So what, what other things do you want me to.

Well, let's, let's transition a little bit to some of the mental health stuff. Again, gut health, mental health, you know, when you realize that 90, 95% of all serotonin, which is your feel good positive mood neurotransmitter, is made in your GI tract when you realize that if you 50% of dopamine, which is the ADHD neurotransmitter, is made in your GI tract, 75% of all neurotransmitters are made in your GI tract. And it has as many neurons in your GI tract that are in your spinal cord, which is sometimes the reason why it's called the second brain. All of a sudden it's not far fetched to think, wait a second, gut health and mood and anxiety. So why don't you talk a little bit about your first mental health. I want to use the word crisis, but kind of was a crisis because you were thinking about dropping out of grad school.

Yeah. So we've talked about this on a previous episode actually. But in, in grad school I was in my mid-20s, early to mid mid-20s. We had a full summer semester of first quarter, I guess of anatomy. So like in anatomy lab, breathing literal toxins as we're dissecting a cadaver. We actually have five cadavers in the room for our, our class of 20 something students. And we did not realize until just a few years ago really that this was what precipitated what came next for me. But at the time, the term premenstrual dysphoric disorder had become like popular because I think a specific drug was on the market that was pushing, you know.

Pushing people towards that brand, a brand of Prozac called Seraphim, which was the same dose for the antidepressant dose of 20 milligrams. They changed name to Seraphim. And all of a sudden, bam, you take it for premenstrual Dysphoric disorder because. And it boosts serotonin, which is made in your gut.

So I, you know, being directly marketed to by commercials, which is a separate.

Topic that we probably talk about that later.

We won't get into too much right now. But you know, it put this idea in my head that like, oh, that's maybe what's going on with me. And I, very briefly, I did not go on this for very long because again, it, it again, much like any time I've taken various medications, it made everything worse. But you know, I thought, oh, this is my problem, let me take this pill. And it got, it did make everything worse and I just felt like I couldn't. Like I was struggling to concentrate. I wasn't learning the material in like say my kinesiology class. I actually did fine in the anatomy class. It was like after that, the next quarter that happened after that was where I started seeing a lot of just mood regulation issues and I chalked everything up to. Well, I guess, you know, school is finally really challenging for me. And I'm just struggling to learn all of this and never at the time realized that it was actually probably this massive toxin hit from breathing formaldehyde every day. We didn't wear masks or anything like that because it was like, oh, why bother with the hassle of that stuff? And we wouldn't have worn the right types of masks anyway. It would have probably been useless.

But from out of hide, you need like the painter's mask that have the activated charcoal on the side. Yeah, no one, no one wears those.

No, nobody's gonna do that. So. So yeah, I. In hindsight, when I look back over that time, I had the. The insult that we now recognize.

The trigger.

Yes. The triggering event.

Genetic presposition trigger.

Yeah, triggering event. And then things just went downhill and I just struggled and I struggled. And if I look over the timeline, I did try medication very briefly, like I said. I think I used it for like less than six weeks. Like it was not a good fit. Had to wean back off of that. And then I, you know, it wasn't helpful. So. And I, looking back, I can see where the farther I got out from this, you know, toxic load that was from the anatomy lab, the better I was able to, like, study and learn, get my grades came up. Like, everything got better as far as that stuff. Again, did not ever make any of those connections until years later, literally decades and decades later, like probably almost 20 years later. And it, you know, now looking at it, it's like, you can see, like the trajectory went like, you know, triggering event, boom. Like, everything just got worse. Everything. My mood, my grades, everything. And then time passing, which presumably was, you know, giving my body time to do what it needed to do and detoxify and like it naturally would do. Even though I didn't know any of the right supports to be putting in at the time. Still, the passage of time, like you. Everything just got better. And then it was. Was all good after that part because thankfully we didn't have to keep going back into the anatomy lab.

But I think another point of this is knowing your own history. You know, one of the things when you do an evaluation by a functional practitioner or do any type of intake as you go through the history and what kind of brought some of this insight for us is, you know, when. When your parents put new carpet in the second floor of their house, went there and stayed. New carpet is high in VOCs, especially from out of hide. And you got this really bad fatigue, headaches, felt horrible for like a week straight. And even then we didn't realize it, but just realizing that, you know, it's really interesting how all these things, one of the ways your body detoxifies, those different phases of detoxification, and one of those is where your body takes solvents, are fat soluble, which means they get stuck in your fat tissues. And so if people lose a lot of weight, sometimes get a big toxin, toxin hit. But one of the things your body does is like, well, these things are fat soluble. Some of those things you can sweat out, which sweating is great for getting out, all kinds of PFAs, which are the fever chemicals, as well as things like formaldehyde, ammonia, things like that. But if you're not sweating, regardless if you are sweating or not, the primary way your body gets rid of these things is actually making fat soluble, water soluble, which is what your liver does when you make bile and you put in your gut. But if you've got the wrong bacteria there, they actually, which is part of phase three detoxification, is the gut bacteria in your gut do their own detoxification. Interesting statistic. 50% of all Medicaid or all pharmaceuticals are broken down or detoxified by gut bacteria. Which is one of the reasons why so many people react so differently with different medications, which you have, you've had issues with reacting with medications. You take things and you have paradoxical responses. And a lot of the patients I see in the clinic are the exact same way. But all of a sudden, now the gut bacteria, you know, not only do they make vitamin K for your immune system and B vitamins, not only is your gut making neurotransmitters, but they're critically important for detoxification. If you have the wrong bacteria there, then all of a sudden you reabsorb toxins and chemicals. You don't get rid of them. But to transition, you know, people, you know, why, why do people, you know, care? We were looking at some interesting things, like up to 80% of the people who, who are engaged with RF&M or FM in some way are women. And, you know, the issues with mental health, energy levels, hormonal levels, like, are, you know, top of mind for everybody right now. And it's amazing how super critical the gut is for all of these things. And, you know, 80% of what Americans are eating now is processed. 60% of what we eat is ultra processed, which means it's not even like chemical. Didn't even physically look like, like real food. And we don't take the natural supports their ancestors took, whether it's bitter herbs, fermented foods. Times of fasting was actually pretty commonplace. Every ancient religion has like these fasting built in and now we're learning about fasting. Now on that note, could you share with us one of your fasting experiences that didn't turn out so well for you?

I. So there's a couple places, a couple ways I could go with this one is related to a longer term. Is that the one that you're wanting.

Me to go to the 30 day one where you did it and crashed?

Yeah, it was basically a very low.

Calorie which by the way has become popular again.

Yeah, it was a very low calorie. It wasn't like you know, intermittent fasting or anything like that. This was like a low calorie plan that I got it in my head that I wanted to do. I was advised not to do it by somebody very close to me who also is speaking to the camera right now. And I am stubborn and I'm also not a quitter. So I went ahead and did it and when I started to feel terrible, I continued doing it because I'm not a quitter and I'm gonna finish this thing and da da da. And it actually triggered five years of debilitating chronic fatigue when our kids were little and needed a mom that was not struggling to get out of bed every day. And this was also, you know, timing wise was happening when some huge things in our family were happening. I don't know, I don't remember if we shared in previous episodes about like our family story. But not everybody watching might know we have three children who are all adopted. They came from hard places. We do have permission to share a bit about each of their stories. They have graciously given told us that if it will help people that they, that they don't mind if we share a little bit about, about their stories. But anyway, those things are stressful for the parents adopting the kids. We had to fight the system at various points. We had sort of like even health care, medical system, you know, working against us at many points and just figuring all that out and navigating it, which I'm sure a lot of people listening can relate to potentially with their own stories. Whether or not they happen to have adopted children. It is, it's a lot. And I, I basically wanted to lose some weight and did this ill advised plan and it was disastrous. Like quite honestly disastrous at this Point I have the perspective that I can be thankful for what happened because I've learned so much about not only my own body, but also ways that we can help other people. And now I would say it has fed into my passion to help more people navigate things and figure out what they need to do for themselves faster and you know, save them the time it took me five years to figure things out. One thing that I learned through that is that, and I'm curious to ask you a follow up question about this. I respond far better to sort of like herbals and I would describe them as like gentler type supplements. And we were just talking a second ago about, you know, how our gut works and you were talking about how prescription medications are metabolized. But I'm curious even, even sometimes like heavier duty nutraceuticals that are like, you look at the ingredients list, they look great. I don't always do that well on those either. So I'm curious like how that actually ties into, you know, the gut thing.

Well, it's something we've learned recently with gut health is that a lot of the colors and herbs, the polyphenols, but it could be purple, red, blue, whatever color they are. Actually the power is not in us absorbing them in our blood because most of them aren't absorbed. It's actually and they, they become food for bacteria. And so when you, the colors you eat in foods actually will make different bacteria grow. So that aspect of that, a lot of the herbs have these polyphenols, these different plant alkaloids, all these things you learned about when you did your medicinal aromatherapy training about these things, how you can concentrate those and essential oils and whatnot. But then there's the, and I actually learned this when I was doing a lot of my lads, my chronic Lyme disease training that herbals are multimodal, they do many things. And so it's not just an antimicrobial herbal. They also have these plant compounds that feed bacteria and they're anti inflammatory as well. So all of a sudden there's things like Houtunia which is used for croc, Lyme, it helps with biofilms. Summing also impact biofilms. Now we know that all chronic infections are biofilm issues. So all of a sudden like, wait, it's an herb, it's gentle, it's not super potent, but you're getting an anti inflammatory effect, an antimicrobial effect. You're getting this biofilm effect from any of these. And oh by the way, many of these Herbs actually are digestives. They actually make more bile. They activate the liver to make. And so all of a sudden, even though it's a little gentle here, a little gentle there, a little gentle there, a little gentle there, when you put them all together, they're doing a lot, a lot of stuff. And you and I have many patients, you're not a patient, but many patients who like, you can't do the really super powerful stuff. And that's sometimes where things like homeopathics come into play as well. You've done well. I mean, you had, you know, you had your uterus removed and controlled your pain with like, like day one was ibuprofen, and then the rest of you using homeopathics to control your pain. And again, it's another thing where you're using the energy from the plant, which sounds a little weird, but there's actually a lot of science behind it. We're not going to go into that today. That worked well. That worked well for you. And I have many, many patients. And the thing about it is the longer I. We're getting sicker, people are getting sicker, we're getting more complex issues. I did a previous interview with several well known functional medicine doctors, Dr. Neal Nathan was one of them, and Dr. Jill Carnahan. And they all pretty much agree that 20 years ago they weren't seeing, you know, someone had Hashimoto's. You remove gluten, you put some probiotics on board, some herbs, and people were better in three months. Now it's like you don't just get a Hashimoto's patient. It's like people have layers of, layers of, layers of illness, which I think comes to, you know, how is, how is our conversation today pertinent for people that are watching? I think one, you have to pay attention to your body. You know, unfortunately, our healthcare system teaches doctors, especially when dealing with female patients. It's all in your head. Ignore your symptoms. I know you heard. I can't explain scientifically, which I'm starting to not like that term anymore. Being someone who's triple board certified, who's a clinical scientist, I'm not working liking the word science these days for different reasons. But you're trained. Hey, ignore, ignore those symptoms because we don't have a biologic plausibility. And the answer is, well, no. Listen to your body. Listen to your innate wisdom intuition, which women are better at than men actually, especially moms, because they're trying to keep young children from killing themselves. First things, listen to your body. Second is with detoxification and your gut, you know, healthy fats, the food you eat, lots of fluids, all of a sudden the average American is, is dehydrated. Something I learned this past week when I was doing some studies, that when you're dehydrated, which happens on planes, when you fly, you're more prone to get infections. One of the things about the super sparrows during the pandemic is a certain subset of the population who make more aerosolized particles. And when they're dehydrated, which the average American is dehydrated, or if you fly on a plane which makes you more dehydrated, you then 10x the amount of particles you make. So all of a sudden something just as basic as being, well hydrated can eliminate you from being a super spreader. And oh, by the way, you detoxify these water soluble things. Both your kidneys eating healthy fats, which are diets are riddled with seed oils these days, which are sunflower, safflower, canola oil. All these partially plasticized fats make toxins stick in your cells. So all of a sudden you're seeing real fat drinking lots of clean mineral water. And minerals, and mineral water help your kidneys work better with detoxification. 80% of Americans are magnesium deficient, up to 100%, depending what research you look at, of Americans are potassium deficient. So all of a sudden basic things help your gut to work better, help your liver to look better, work better. And all of a sudden these can be massive boons for gut health, mental health, general system functioning. But ultimately the part of this series and today's conversation is, is the general gut health? So if you do it, Becky, if you think of like one or two things you want people to take that are listening, you know, what would you have wanted to know, I don't know, 15 years ago about your gut health, about mental health, about inflammation, about hormones. If you could think of one or two things or three things, maybe takeaways that you want people. If you could find your younger self and give your younger self those takeaways, what would that have been?

Well, one of them you already said, which is listen to your body. And honestly, like that one would have saved me probably the most heartache and, and like literal pain. I think there's, it's multifactorial. I do think that the healthcare system, especially in the US does not do a great job of taking care of women. I think, you know, we use, we've heard a lot of people have Heard the term medical gaslighting. I kind of like that term because it's pretty apt like to describe a lot of times what happens. I blessedly haven't had that experience as much because I am a bit of a self starter and kind of like would dig in and try to figure things out myself. Which is also why it took five years for me to get better when I did have a crash. But because I'm not a doctor and I'm not, I didn't have. Maybe it would have taken just as long either way because it's hard to treat yourself. But I think that one like listening to your body, like if you're a parent, you know that sometimes you have this intuition about your child. And you know, a lot of moms will describe moms, especially dads, it can happen to dads too, but can take their child to the pediatrician and they're like, you know, something isn't right. Something isn't right. And you know, sometimes it gets dismissed. Sometimes you have a great, you know, physician who's willing to walk alongside you. I think the same thing happens with ourselves only, you know, in the interest of getting things done or, or functioning in our lives or being in survival mode or whatever, a lot of times we end up dismissing our own selves too instead of pressing in. If I had listened to my body when I was literally crashing, like my systems were crashing, they were stopping functioning and I continued to do this thing because it was like, well, you know, it's part of the process or I don't know what I was telling myself to be honest. Looking back on it, it's like, oh man, I will not do that anymore. I'm thankfully have gained some wisdom through the experience, but I think that's the biggest one. Like when you feel like something is off or not working the right way. Trust that. And if you're seeing a physician, that is, you continue to feel dismissed by them or they're telling you what you think is going on isn't what's actually going on. You know, at the very least try to talk to some more people beyond that that person. Sometimes there can be other things going on that impact things. But I would say in general, I think women are excessively dismissed in health care and later come to find, you know, like for, for me, you know, it's like I feel a certain way and later come to find out I have like massive tumors all over my, my uterus or I have another, have another story of a time when I had toxic shock syndrome.

Well, Can I go off on that? So a little side with that? And at that point in time, we knew enough about inflammation. It was recommended in our local area to have a robotic procedure done. And the way they removed the uterus with that is they do a couple buttonholes, which is really cool, but they take a macerator and go in and basically grind up the uterus and suck it out. Which in my thinking I understand like, well, that will create these things called damps or damage associated molecular patterns which can activate your immune system. It's almost like a car accident and you get hit and you get a crush injury. And people can have these really crazy sepsis, like cytokine, like inflammatory storms just from their tissues being exposed to the genetic DNA content. It's actually a big activator for mitochondria making your cells die. So I mean, again, things I think about, you know, in my spare time. So anyway, so we're like, let's not do this. And so you researched. Then I found a place in Maryland that did this procedure where they basically, it was outpatient and it was, it was, you know, still surgery, still painful, but it wasn't. And then put you under, it was a shorter procedure. So you went under general anesthesia for as long. And that's when I was learning about general anesthesia, particularly women being associated with an increased risk for Alzheimer's disease. So I was like, well, let's avoid that as much as possible. Cyril's like, you know, in that case it was a combination of me knowing some things and you having the. And you actually found the place in Maryland because you're the big researcher. But it's just interesting how, you know, if something doesn't feel right, just ask questions. And the person you're working with doesn't like you asking questions, then you probably need to find someone else. And there's lots of people out there to work with. So I think we'll wrap it for this episode.

I have a couple more things for women. Actually. I have a couple more things that I want to say about, about things. I know I hammered on the trust your body, listen to your body, but I think also a huge lesson that I've learned just in the last year is your body can build muscle regardless of if you're in perimenopause, what, what stage you're at. I. This is one thing where I think social media can sometimes be a blessing because I happen to see a handful of women who were a little bit like a few years older than me who had like Pressed in and gotten into the gym and like were doing weights and building muscle. And I think a mistake that I made. You know, we just talked about this terrible diet that I did. But I've, you know, I've done other things where I'm like, I'm gonna eat this certain way or whatever, you know, and you cut things way back. But I never was investing into like making sure that muscle was also being built. So I think I would lose muscle mass probably every time I would like eat better. And this past year I made a huge shift there where I was eating more protein. Actually did some things to like, very specifically monitor what I was eating from just to kind of know. Not that I. And I did all of this with real food. I didn't do anything. I wasn't eating anything weird or like processed stuff. A little bit of like supplementation in there. But I am, I can honestly say I think I'm stronger than I was probably even in my late 20s because I've built muscle and this isn't gut related, but I feel like that has been a huge game changer for me as well. And then just what, what you take into your body, like the food that you put in there is really important. Like it shouldn't be overlooked. It is unfortunately more expensive to buy real food. We subsidize a lot of things that are very, very, like you mentioned the plasticized fats. That's all subsidized food that is, is cheaper, but it's also literally going to kill you. And I think between those, between those things, listen to your body, your body will make move, like just get out moving and, and also like do things that you know are going to build some muscle. Lifting things that are heavy is great.

And then.

The food and the things like invest in nourishing yourself, like mentally, physically, in every way. Like, nourishment is just something that we don't. It's like we don't have time for it. I feel like in, in our country, like we just are like, that's like, that takes time, it takes effort, it's expensive and you deserve it. Like you deserve to nourish yourself. And that means don't do diets where your calories are extremely restricted and you crash yourself into chronic fatigue. For five years that was not nourishing. And now I have this perspective of like the things that I do nourish me and that in turn serves my family. It makes me a better wife and a better mom. And I don't shuffle off to the. I'm older now and I don't shuffle off to the bathroom in the middle of the night. I don't wake up achy at all. I don't have all of these things that were just sort of like my reality for so long and I just sucked up and handled. I do still have a lot of work to do on my gut and that is I think just always going to be something that I have to keep at the forefront. But yeah, those would be the three things that I would want women to hear.

And one thing I want to throw in there real quick is that your gut, you know, question people ask me, you know, when, when can I stop doing this diet of healthy, nutritious food that that feeds my body and helps me be healthier? When can I? They're not asking the question like this, but they are asking the question like this. This is the question they're asking when I go back to sad American diet that everybody else is doing that's making half our kids obese and has insulin resistance. 80% of Americans are. 80% of Americans are insulin resistant. 30%, 15% of Americans are full up diabetic. You know, we can't go back to that diet. And the answer is like, well, if you want to maintain your gains, you have to nourish your body. And the key for gut health, the thing we've learned in our family with all of our kids, from just, you know, our simplest child who fixes asthma and eczema with diet to a more complicated child with severe handicaps, is real food has been at the center of that, figuring that out. And if you don't know what that is, we have resources on our website. We have a whole series we did on real food diaries. We have resources reach out to us through. So through our website, you'll get access to that stuff somehow. Hopefully this was helpful. You know, we're going to continue to talk about gut. I'm not sure if it's the next one, but Dr. Njinski, I will talk to be talking about the gut immune brain access, which is super exciting. It's basically how your gut affects mental function at a much deeper science. Science level. And if you have questions, please put those wherever you're watching this. Our very last episode is going to be a Q and A session where we answer questions where actually I answer questions that people are putting out there about stuff so that over the over, you know, however many sessions this is, you can have a reliable resource of information of on gut health, all things gut. So if you like this, if this is helpful. Subscribe, because the only way for this to get out there is if you subscribe and follow us and then share. Otherwise this stuff gets. Tends to get buried and not get out there. So. And again, post your questions wherever you're watching this and then we'll put together and do a Q A session at the end and answer all those questions. Take care, be well. We'll talk to you soon.

Before you turn it off. All right, this part is not. It's awkward, but I want to give some practical action steps and so I'm just going to read them into the camera because I think this will be helpful for people. So under immune health, you need to be eating a diverse range of whole plant based foods. And that cultivates microbiome diversity like we had talked about a little bit earlier. Fermented foods like yogurt, sauerkraut, kimchi, things that are like naturally fermented are actually amazing for your microbiome. If you can eat them. If you cannot eat them, that's okay. You don't need to send a message telling us that you can't eat those things.

If you have histamine issues, which is a whole different thing, that's part of that. If you have sibo, which a lot of times comes from low stomach acid, that's a part of that. So that's when you probably need to see a practitioner and get advanced stool testing done.

Yeah, this is just general for, you know, the average person who wants to be healthier, you know, not any super unusual complicating things. And then, you know, antibiotics, we are not anti antibiotics by any means. They're amazing tools when you need them. But you, you always want to be judicious about when those get used because they do kind of destroy your, the bacteria in your gut. And it's just something to bear in mind. It doesn't mean if you have strep like that you're going to avoid the antibiotic. Just. Can we say this?

Yeah, we use antibiotics or anti inflammatories. So we've taken them from the original use, which is treating rheumatic heart disease, treating sepsis, treating pneumonia, preventing women from dying from infections and childbirth. Like that's all amazing stuff. But we've gone from that and gone, wait a second. I realized that people's sinuses get better and their lungs get better and the joints hurt, feel better. And you're probably treating their low level Lyme disease, which actually doxycycline used to be an improved, not used to be Used to treat rheumatoid arthritis back in the 70s and 80s before we knew, before we had fancy drugs and before we knew that chronic lyme disease and tick borne illness for example, could treat that. So what happened was over decades we started using ambox to treat inflammation. And hey, if you've got sibone dysbiosis and you take, you know, Bactrim or tetracycline, doxycycline, it actually can treat some kinds of sibo. So what happened was over decades we started using these things because they're 100% safe and there's no downside. Right. We started using them like Candy and then 50 years later it's a big whoops. Not just antibiotic associate resistance and all kinds of bacteria, which is a big deal in hospital, in hospital settings. But now we're realizing we're seeing more asthma, more eczema in kids, more autoimmune issues, obesity. Okay, here's, you know, gut microbiome. There's a direct correlation with antibiotic use, childhood and adult obesity. This is common knowledge in the veterinarian world. So much so that they put anabox in cattle feed to make the cows get fatter quicker. They put them in chicken, feed the chicken to get fatter quicker. And then all of a sudden we eat that stuff or we put it in our kids all the time we wonder why they're getting fatter. So anabox have their use. I use them when they're right, but they're not risk free. And I think that's the point. They're not this risk free. You can't have any issue with the kind of thing they actually have risks. We need to use them judiciously, which is when you want to have a skilled practitioner working with you that can figure out when's it appropriate to treat pneumonia and when the sinus infection, which is usually viral or allergic, can go away on its own with some herbs, some quercetin, some antihistamines and some netty neti pot stuff and you'll be fine in two weeks regardless of what the doctor does.

All right, so some practical tips regarding gut and hormone health are fiber, eat lots of fiber. Flax seeds, chia seeds, that can help with healthy estrogen metabolism. Basically you almost can't get too much fiber. And so, so that, just keep that, keep fiber at the forefront. I have to make an effort to eat enough fiber and I would say we eat a very fiber diverse diet generally. But I still, it would be very difficult for me to eat too much fiber Reduce processed foods. I would say just don't, don't eat anything ultra processed. And try not to eat processed foods unless you're talking about like cheese which is technically processed dairy but. But processed. You know, anything that comes in a package that you have to tear open, be suspicious because a lot of it is just not great. And then sugar also is a gut microbiome disruptor. And then stress management. I didn't even mention this but that's been a huge game changer for me. Breath work, working out actually helps my.

We'll talk about stress. That's on the docket to talk about.

Yeah, yeah. But just, just. I'm just giving some tips that helps keep cortisol levels in check. Obviously, you know we do sometimes we talk about gut feelings when you have things. When I have anxiety, I feel it in my gut. All of these things can help quell that. And it is gut related. And then gut and mental health. High quality probiotic is awesome and super helpful and a great thing to be. Including omega threes help with gut brain communication. Did you read this stuff?

And I was trying to do it more conversational, but yes, please.

Well, I wanted to get it.

There's important. They're super important. Yes.

I like to give the tips the. So hydration we are definitely already covered that pretty well. But being hydrated is key. And avoid excessive alcohol. But really alcohol just isn't. It's not, it's not the best. If you like games, it really helps to track your sleep and see how alcohol affects it. It makes it a lot easier to decide that it's not a great idea to be drinking.

One of the most disappointing things I learned this past year, which was super upsetting, is that alcohol, there's no healthy amount. It's all bad. And I was very upset about that. But that's just an unfortunate reality. I'm not saying that you can't drink it. I'm not saying there's not Blue zones. We have their little glass of wine Sardinia here in America. There's just not a healthy. I think it's two. Two drinks a week is the amount of alcohol you can consume without it shrinking your hippocampus, which is where your memory sits. So if you're gonna consume it in a safe level, that's probably like the, you know, two five ounce glasses a week.

Two five ounce glasses of wine, not liquor.

And thanks for clarifying.

Not on the same night. Like it could be like 5 ounces and then several days later 5 ounces. And that's like your tops, which is just. That's a good rule of thumb, I think.

Anyway, it's still disappointing.

Those are my practical tips.

Well, thank you for that. Thanks for keeping us straight. Hopefully this information was helpful for you. Again, like like below, subscribe, Follow Share that is how you get this information out there. Ask your questions below and we'll be answering them in a future episode. Take care and we'll talk to you soon.