You Were Taught Not To Trust Your Body

Welcome back once again to— we're finishing up our series on medical blind spots, things we think that are right, they're just plain wrong. That results in medical gaslighting. People are told there's nothing wrong with them, it's all in their head. And now that's converted us into becoming medical feminists, realizing that women's health needs a different lens. Taking care of our female patients requires a totally different toolkit, skill set, and a different lens. Because the female's physiology is vastly different than a male's physiology and the needs are vastly different. So I don't know if, Dr. Ginski, you have any—

Yeah.

Any words before we hop into this?

Sure.

Last of these.

I think also presentations are different. It's just, it's— I think you said it, it's women's health requires a different lens. So the vantage point, the perspective through which we look to diagnose and treat these wonderful individuals needs to change because what's, what's happening right now isn't working. If anything, it's, it's harming individuals. So expanding your knowledge, being curious, being an advocate for yourself, understanding that the physiologies are different. It's kind of like when you're going through training, you know, I learned this in, in emergency medicine. When you're talking about when you go through trauma surgery training and you're learning pediatric trauma versus adult trauma, one of the things that you learn is that kids just aren't small adults. Their physiology is different. You can't treat them even though you use the same or similar drugs the same. Everything's gotta be weight-based. Everything's gotta be weighed against this and that. So it's kind of the same thing. Like men and women are both adults, but women aren't just different men, they're women. And so we have to understand that. Understand the physiology, understand the different disease processes that are more— and pathophysiology that's more prevalent in, in that, in that landscape. And then how it presents and what treatment options do we have and what we can do about it.

I think the other thing to think about is women's health as it's become more popular. I remember I'm not training at the Medical College of Virginia. They had like women's health department and while I was doing my OB-GYN training, you had this department, it was focused on women's health, but it it was literally just sexual health. So it was, it was breast health and uterine, vaginal, cervical health. And that was it. And so it was almost like the women's health had been minimalized to these two parts of a female's body. And not realizing that the physiology is the entire body is vastly different. Sleep-wake cycles are different. Protein requirements are different. How women, as they get in their 40s and 50s, how they actually recycle protein is vastly different, hence the increased need for different, different kinds of protein. So it, it's almost like in our, in our system's attempt to recognize the place of women's health, they simplified it, reduced it to like the—

to the body parts that a 2-year-old can point out.

Oh, come on.

That's a woman.

Yeah.

That's a man. I mean, like literally they, they simplified it to target reproductive organs, which I get it, but at the same time, what supports those reproductive organs, you know, understand that women's vascular disease is different. Understand that, you know, hormones are different. All the things that go along with that. It's—

yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, also because of the way a female's body is made, that you also have to respect not just hormones cycle throughout the month. Right. So we think most medical students know Estrogen's low, the, you know, every, everything's low for the, the cycle. Then estrogen starts going up the follicular phase, peaks out, comes down a little bit. Your luteal phase, progesterone goes up, comes down. You have a cycle. That's like the basic kind of, you learn that actually in, in health women's, you know, sexual health when you're in 8th grade or whatever it is.

My daughter's about to learn that in 6th grade.

Oh, 6th grade. 6th grade.

6th grade.

Oh wow.

Maybe they're learning it next, you know, maybe it's next year, 7th grade.

7th grade.

It's happening soon. We got some sort of memo.

12, man.

Some sort of memo.

Yeah. It's the memo. Yes.

We already had the talk with her like 3 years ago when she asked. She asked and we made a decision that we weren't gonna pull punches, that we were gonna be honest and kind of gauge what her comfort level would be. She asked really intelligent questions for her age. And then when it got to the point where my medical explanation or my wife's sugarcoated version of my medical explanation made her feel off or awkward, she, we would stop. And she now understands it and feels empowered by it. But like, she was curious and everyone was like, you're too young for this conversation.

My son who's 15, when my wife and I ever talk about stuff, he just basically covers his face up and like, it's all embarrassed at 15.

Yeah. My son, my son's going to be 11. He still doesn't know any of this stuff. Doesn't ask. She wants to tell him so desperately. We're like, don't you dare. He will come to us when he's ready. And so that's, this is an ongoing thing in my house.

But, you know, but we learn those basics, you know, in 6th grade or whatever it is. But the thing is, like, the way this cycle, this cycle works and the, the levels of these is different from age, let's say, 16 to your first child. It's different between every child you have, and it's different from, like, your 30s to your 40s and from your 40s to your 50s. And then this whole peripause, the peri you know, the perimenopause area where things are changing, where it's like it's going to change sometimes month to month and there's fluctuations and affect the entire physiology. Yeah, I was actually talking with a patient this past week and it was interesting. She was talking about her, her GYN. It's like, I don't do hormone replacement therapy. I'm like, and she was a little upset about it. I'm like, it's complicated. It's like you have 5 to 8 minutes. You can't talk about the hormonal hierarchy and thyroid. I mean, they farm thyroid off to endocrinologists, you know, and then insulin balance and gut health and stress and detox and diet. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's kind of complicated.

So, so, but, but part of complicated for 8 minutes, not overly complicated for that person who has more time and is willing to learn.

100%. I stand corrected. Yes. For the practitioner who's trained in it, who actually has the time, their schedule, their practice is built to have the time.

Yeah.

To have the communication. But that makes women's health different. Something else I want to— that also the idea of trusting your gut. I actually talk about this in my book, but women are innately more intuitive, which I don't think that's really controversial. It's not. It's not, okay.

Not if you're smart. Not if you're a smart man.

Okay. Because you got to be careful sometimes what you say. It's like, but they're not.

No, that's a good one.

Okay. Fair enough. And it's funny. Okay. Safe. Don't want to get— Burn down. Burn down for now. But, but they're naturally more intuitive, right? They have that spidey sense, that safety kind of sense. And what— so take that data point. Let's go— some of the newer, the newer neuroscience is looking at this idea of a gut hunch, your gut instincts. Like you have as many neurons in your GI tract as your spinal cord. And there's actually now literature coming out like that initial, like emotional sense you get before you have a conscious thought. Like this feels off. It doesn't feel right. And then you might 10 minutes later go, oh, that's the reason it was off.

Yeah.

Actually, Malcolm Gladwell talks about it. He calls it thin slicing his book on Blink. And a little deviation here, talks about some experts. They're looking at this David statue. It was a perfect forgery, but no one knew it. And the experts looked at it and they're like, it's gross, it's ugly, it makes me want to vomit. They had all these emotional responses to it. And it was the perfect David. Like the perfect statue. But they had been at so many digs and touched so many pieces in hands and stuff and seen things. They, they innately intuitively knew this was off. Well, the museum that was going to buy it spent the $20 million on it, bought it because they didn't believe those experts. They believed the other experts that said it's perfect, you should buy it. You know, come to find out it was a perfect forgery done in the early 1800s. So they're using the same technology as the Greeks used or whatever, or Italians or whatever. Um, it was done from the same rock in the same place in Italy. So it was all the same technology. It was just hadn't had the 2,000 years of exposure to the weathering that changes the angle of the ears, changes the glistening. They had an emotional response. Oh, this was, this is ugly. And now there's all this science backing up that gut hunch, that feeling you get. Um, it's the gaps are filled in with, with learning and understanding. And women are uniquely because of their physiology uniquely have this intuition, like trust your gut.

Yeah.

Don't ignore it. And it's funny how the new, some of the newer neuroscience now is realizing, hey, you actually, and even like with experts, I go to these big fancy meetings, these masterminds where people pay lots of money to get educated. And one of the things, high-level entrepreneurs, which lots of them are dyslexic and, you know, have other things going on, but trusting that intuition when you're making decisions. And someone who's educated. So I think the point is like our healthcare system routinely ignores women's hunches, their gut feeling, you know, intuition. Intuition. It's, it's, and like, and the newer science is saying no, it's true. Embrace it.

Embrace it. Yeah.

You might not comprehend, you might not understand like what that feeling is. Educate, study, learn, percolate, give yourself some time. Don't make like rash decisions on a hunch.

Yeah.

But do not Dismiss it. Do not dismiss it. And that is like counterintuitive to our current healthcare system. Yeah.

Which takes it a step further. And by gaslighting those patients makes them then question their own hunches. And so not only are they told, eh, your hunch isn't really a thing, they start to believe that their hunch isn't a thing. And then women lose a little bit of that intuition. I think it's Again, it just, it's pervasive and it's problematic.

And to your point, like I have a colleague who she's actually trained hers very, very well. And her expertise is actually, she's a psychologist that works with trauma patients and she's actually trained her intuition to the point that she'll actually really quickly can kind of tell what, where people are coming from after 20 years of training it. So I think to your point, if you ignore it and suppress it, it'll get dull. Yeah. But if you actually feed it, get educated, learn about yourself, you can hone it. You can hone it.

Oh my God. Yeah. I mean, that's what I called my spidey sense. Are.

I mean, I've developed that in my clinic practice as well with patients, and we've just kind of leaned into it. And that's what experts do. Experts will take their, their, the mass of their knowledge and kind of lean into their hunches. They won't make life-changing decisions on them, but they'll actually like, why I feel this way. Let me, let me go down this pathway. So I think, you know, how is this, what does this mean for patients? What does this mean for our female listeners? One, your health is more than, you know, two parts of your body. It's your entire body. Trust your, your gut, trust your heart, trust, trust your intuition, but educate it. I think the other thing is just realize what are the previous paradigms or previous areas in which our healthcare system has got it flat out wrong.

Yeah.

You know, and then as you learn about those, the question is what areas right now are we getting it wrong that you can avert, you know, making a catastrophic mistake, whether it's not having access to hormone replacement therapy or, You know, not doing allergy stuff the right way, or, you know, making a big deal about cholesterol and not eating fat for decades and then actually making yourself sick and getting metabolic issues. So I think learning that, then what other, what other things do you think take-home messages for our female patients from this to avoid becoming stuck in this trap, to be active, become medical feminist, become active in their own healthcare?

I mean, I think the main thing is to find, find a practitioner that is willing to work with you on these things, because there's going to be a great deal that you can probably do on your own. And that's the point of what we're doing. It's to educate, to kind of open up some doors, to shake a couple of cages, to start some conversations. The goal is ultimately start a dialogue with people that you care about and you trust. Do some of your own research, but start with subtle things that you can do and then move to bigger things in your own life. Improve your diet, work out, manage your stress, figure out what that means. Prioritize your sleep, do what is necessary, pluck the low-hanging fruit, but you need to, you need to find a practitioner that's willing to work with you. And kind of think outside the box, but I'll be honest with you. The box should be really big. You wouldn't, you shouldn't have to think outside of it. There's plenty of room in it for everything. And, and I think it's, it's just a phrase we get caught up saying. I, I think the reality is work with somebody who's curious and is amenable to doing some extra testing or doesn't necessarily need solid standard of care objective data to say, now we're gonna intervene. That's why you have. Symptom clusters. That's why you have constellations of symptoms. That's why listening and taking a good history and knowing how to do a good exam and maybe some objective data collectively, then you can put together an intelligent treatment plan that may not be the standard of care, but if it's doing no harm and your patient is getting informed consent and agreeing to it, then you can do a therapeutic diagnostic trial. Then you can figure some stuff out together. But first things first, start with the basics. Clean up your gut, advocate for your hormone health, manage your stress and have somebody help you if you need it. Um, exercise, prioritize your sleep, detoxify your environment, start there and get somebody who's solid in your life that can pull some other strings. And I think some of these gaps will be closed.

Yeah. So just to summarize, so part of becoming more engaged, becoming active, becoming a medical feminist, realizing that the healthcare of women requires something totally different than our current system has for them. You know, number one is realizing you're more than just some of your body parts.

Yes.

Focusing on two parts. The second thing is listen to your gut, trust your intuition, educate it, train it. The third one is, is get a team around you. Yeah. Find a practitioner because ultimately this, this, you can learn, you can only learn so much and you're not, you know, physicians. You can only learn so much. Find someone who will actually learn with you, learn alongside you. Okay. I think that's a great way to figure out how do you navigate the current system in a healthy way. So let's talk about some dangers or pitfalls, you know, being, being aware of the potential pitfalls. And we've seen these and I think you'll agree with me with some of these. The first one I think is, is, is being wary of sounding boards because I've had a lot of patients who like, because of looking for answers, they go to these, you know, Facebook groups or sounding boards where everybody's like, having a miserable experience and they share their misery. And there's a certain solace in sharing suffering, you know, we're supposed to bear each other's burdens, right? But that can become its own pathology. What other dangers, or if you want to fill that one a little bit, other dangers too?

I mean, that one is a pet peeve of mine because when patients bring those to my attention, My heart breaks for those individuals on those boards, on those, on those sites, because I want them to get better and I want them to get help, but that's why they're there. They haven't had somebody make change in their life. They haven't had somebody help them feel seen and heard, at least point them in a trajectory that feels a little bit hopeful. And so that's what I reassure my patients. I said, these are the individuals that aren't where you're at. You're here in my office and we're going to figure this out. Like, You don't need to be surrounded by that negativity. I know that that peer grouping may feel, make you feel better in the moment because there's others out there like you, you feel less estranged, less alone. But if that becomes problematic, then it's not helpful and you need to move on from it. And they typically do like, you know what, you're right. I'm not going to go on there anymore. There's also a lot of individuals on the sounding boards that are really, really jaded. And I don't want to say hopeless and not coming back, but they're jaded to the point where no matter what is said, um, if it's remotely optimistic, it just gets shot down because they're just angry. And those are the ones I feel the most for. Um, those would be the ones that'd be the hardest to treat, to be honest, but doesn't mean they don't deserve treatment. So I think the sounding boards, that's a big problem. Um, I think how hormones are handled. Um, how hormones are prescribed. This is a big problem. Um, I, I don't know if this is a little bit of a soapbox, but I just feel like the writing's been on the wall. The FDA removing the black box warning. Um, I get the trepidation, but how do you not see these women in your practice every single day suffering and not do anything about it, or offer them like one or two things, or like just not test? So many of my female patients that are, that have hormone-related symptoms, like their, their OB-GYNs, their women's health physicians, their PCPs, they're not even testing. They're not doing blood work. They're not doing urine or saliva. They're just basically telling them like, this is normal. And, and, and to me that's a big problem. Yeah.

I mean, it's, it's, it's really hard. I was actually, um, doing, doing a bunch of podcasts for my book and one of them required a pre-interview, so I Did a 15-minute thing with the, uh, podcaster. She had a really big podcast. And so part of the conversation was, you know, what's the message I'm gonna bring to her audience, right? And it was really, I ended up not going on, actually ended up bowing out of that situation because part of her thing was, well, I don't want you to offer too much hope to my, my audience. They've already been to lots of people and been let down. Like, I don't want to, I don't want you to, to give them false promises. And it was, it was almost, I'm not listening like, I mean, all I have is hope. Like, without hope, my daughter would be blind in a wheelchair, slumped over herself, slobbering on herself. Like, yeah, like, oh my gosh, like, like, that's how people survive concentration camps. Like, yeah, but she was a big moderator for a big thing, and it was like her perspective. She wanted to protect her people, which I understand, that could have been hurt. But it's almost like there's, there's this— when you get in these, these, these ecosystems, these sounding boards, there's almost a certain amount of despair that happens to the point that if you're the person who comes in with the good news, like, no, there's hope, you get crucified. And so it's where, that's where I, you know, I, to your point where you said your pet peeve is that really there's, I know they're helpful for some individuals, but you know, when people are working with us, like we're walking alongside them, I think we offer more than that. And there's also a danger in those situations that people get in these spirals that it's hard to get out of. Yeah. You know, and to your point about hormones, how hormones are handled, you know, the dangers, the, the sounding boards, the hormone stuff is I have patients that I've been working with for years who know me and trust me. I see their entire family and we order their hormone panel and they're like, I am scared to address it. So literally they come in every 6 months or a year. We've changed some things and they're in their 60s and 70s. We, we check the hormones and they're still low. And there's one I'm thinking in particular, it's, we're year 3 now and she's getting ready to pull the trigger to start some hormone replacement therapy. But it's, it's just amazing how strong the fear is, how strong the trepidation because of what we've been told for 23 years that these are bad, bad, bad, bad. And then now we're like, oops, actually just kidding.

They're not. And you don't need to be within 3 to 5 years of perimenopause and they're not gonna cause cancer. And it's just, yeah. And I think. That's the danger. The danger is the not treating. The danger is, um, partial treating. The danger is miseducation. The danger is not testing. I mean, if we're trying to prove that this is the right thing to do, why the heck are we not testing? Why are we not accumulating data? Why are we not all putting our heads together and getting objective measurements that we can then cross-evaluate and say, this is what should be the standard of care. I mean, we think we have one. But you and I know that standard care is personalized to every patient in our practice, right? There is no standard of care.

It's individual. The standard of care is there's no standard of care.

Standard of care is that there's no standard of care. And, and your plan is your plan. You know, I tell my patients, they're like, what diet should I eat? If you said that to me, I'd say the Aaron diet. And you'd be like, what's the Aaron diet? I never saw that one online. It's your diet, buddy. And it's gonna be based on what your body tells me it needs and doesn't want. And we're going to figure that out together. Like, it's got to be specific to the individual. But, but I think that those are two really, really big, important issues.

The other thing I think— the other thing I wrote down as we're talking, other dangers— following the herd. Because social media is so powerful, Facebook is so powerful, the news is so powerful, advertisement marketing is so powerful. People don't realize, actually, um, there's a great book by, I think Bernard's called Propaganda, and basically all common— all modern-day marketing is actually based on propaganda in the 1920s and '30s. And it's propaganda is not good or bad. It's just a thing, you know, and, and it's such a powerful thing that ultimately you're following the herd and you're doing what everybody else is doing. And anybody who has a business, anybody who's cutting edge, anybody who's like, um, out of things outside the box, meet, you know, the whole Warren Buffett, you know, um, Munger, you know, thinking, you know, you basically, whatever the herd's doing, you don't do that. You, you, you suppose that you sell when people are fearful. And you, um, you, you buy when people are fearful and you sell when people are greedy. Like you do the opposite of the herd mentality, right? Because the herd's usually wrong. Yeah. But yet so many of our individuals are looking at the herd and being like, okay, I'm gonna, it's safe. I'm like, everybody's doing this. This is the, this is the new most modern fancy thing.

Yeah. Because if you were on the fringe of the herd, you got picked off by the lions, right? Like it's safer in the middle.

It is. But I think it's my, you might hear a new thing. A new whatever when I'm learning new things all the time. But if it comes from social media, I'll automatically have like a show me the ingredients, show me the box, show me the thing. Like, yeah, what's this based on? What's the study?

Same.

What's the claim? I think our— because I think many, many of our patients, because of marketing and social media, get sucked into the herd mentality, which our kind of medicine, by definition, we're not. We're doing above the standard of care. So we're doing above the herd. And so, um, and I think, you know, I, I'm the same as you.

I, I, in that regard, I, I'm sure you get those messages from your patients. What about this? And, and, and we have the same reactions. Um, but it's not, again, you just have to be cautious. I can't fault them because these are individuals that are doing some research online. Learning about their own health, trying to learn about what we're doing. And then the computer algorithm that's spying on them starts spitting out advertisements for this supplement and that supplement and this vibration plate and this rebounder. And, you know, and then they're like, oh, what? And then they see that it's on TikTok and they're like, well, what about this? I get it. We're all inundated and overwhelmed. You just got to do your due diligence. You can't follow every shiny penny everywhere. And again, it all goes back to making sure that you have a conversation and if there's literature that supports it, fantastic. But a lot of them are greenlit to try whatever they want in my practice. Like, look, if you want to try something and you don't have to run it by me, you can try something, but just don't hurt yourself. If you want my advice, my advice is going to be, I don't know what that is. And I haven't seen the study and I'm pretty sure it's a marketing gig, but you know, to me, if it, if it's safe and you're not doing any harm and you are feeling better and it shows improvement, it's good medicine.

First thing is first and foremost, do no harm.

Yeah.

So, if you're trying a new supplement, make sure you personally vetted it. Yeah. Meanwhile, a quarter to half to a third, depending on what article you look at, of supplements currently in the market are either tainted with something.

Yeah.

Adulterant or they're not as advertised. Like, you really have to be, when you buy, when you go out there and buy stuff online, you have to do due diligence. Yeah. So, and I think you might like this little something. Actually, my wife just went to an AI thing. But this, I think you'll like this factoid, which leads to the need to be careful. So what's happening right now in the AI world is AI has like read through the mass of human knowledge like twice. And it's actually, when people do prompting, they actually create new knowledge for the knowledge base. So you have all these people out there prompting and they get these things back and that becomes part of the knowledge base. So what's happening now, and it's gone through it twice. So what's happening now is what's been created on these, in the AI world is this ever-expanding knowledge base of new stuff that's AI generated. And it's like the dragon consuming its own tail. Now it's coming back and starting to feed on itself. And so we're at the stage now, this is better, and if you've, in this, if you've, this, the date of this recording is April 8th. If you're in the area of which my wife and I are, you've noticed that a lot of the, a lot of things have changed in the last 3 to 4 weeks. 'Cause we've met, we've got to that stage where now the dragon's self-consuming. And now we're in a different world. So the point of people when this comes out, which will be probably months from now, who knows what'll be happening then, but is that there's even more caution. I think this justifies your innate concern about it because now that the dragon, the AI dragon's self-consuming, it has to be prompted differently, it has to be dealt with differently. And the average person who's searching just doesn't even know that. And so now that you have something that's creating its own information and now it's consuming that and now it's putting stuff out, the world's crazier than it was before as far as the stuff. And so, people really need to work with someone who's at least making an attempt to consume the data and learn it. But ultimately, as a clinician, because it doesn't matter if I read in a journal, if I try in real life and doesn't work, I don't try it a whole lot of times regardless of what journal the article's put out. I don't care how fancy, Lancet, whatever. If I try something a couple times, a couple patients, and it's a flop, it might have worked in that study, it doesn't work in real life. And that's where working with people who actually their livelihood is actually doing that.

Yeah, that's the art of medicine.

That's key. Yeah. And then I think last thing is, is you mentioned standard therapeutic trials. That's all we do. Yeah. It's individual therapeutic trials.

Yeah.

In a one.

Yeah.

That is the practice of medicine. I just, that's just kind of something I wrote down.

I think that's the best way to do it. And I mean, I'm always, always, always trying to utilize objective data. I mean, you know this, I lab test a ton and And you're a great listener. And I think collectively, you know, hearing the story, doing a physical exam, getting objective data, that's enough usually to put together a treatment plan, more than enough. There's always stuff that patients come in expecting and then stuff that they weren't in that we find, and then we just work on it together. And then you just use time as part of that treatment plan. And over time you reassess that which was abnormal to become normal and then optimal. And you're always clinically correlating and then What's the least amount of stuff that I need to take to hold this space? But along that way, sometimes there's symptoms and signs on physical exam that aren't necessarily objectified on labs that you then have to say, well, what about this? Well, that's the art of medicine. That's the clinical acumen. That's that reputation and, um, and training that you have, but that's also the relationship and dialogue that you have with that patient that you can then intervene in a way that allows you the freedom to truly practice medicine. If more individuals practice like that, a lot of what we're talking about would be moot. We wouldn't even be able to— we wouldn't have any information to make these, these 3 episodes. So the goal now is we want more people to be like that. We want more people to be intellectually curious, more people to be open-minded, more people to try some things that are safe, but use objective data, work with somebody trustworthy, listen to your intuition, know that as a woman This is— these are the, the hills and obstacles and roadblocks that you're going to have to get through, but you can. And that there are those of us out there that are working towards that goal. But you also have to do the work. And anyone listening to this that is a practitioner that wants to learn about this stuff, to just go out there and like start learning about it, like find a way to broaden your knowledge and then try it with a couple of patients. And when you have these patients that have been the same for 4 years, all of a sudden tell you that this is the best they felt in 5 years. That feels really good.

Yeah.

And you want more of it. So I think that's really what you should do.

Now, on the education side, we've created a website for this. We have over 400 blogs. We actually have practitioners across the country reading the blogs on the website, the podcast. We have a book list. We've vetted over 500 books. There's about 70 or 80 currently on the website. So we have, we've created actually a pre-vetted, pre-looked at educational platform. Now we've got, we're like 130, 140 podcasts now, something along those range. But as we close things out, you know, we have the educational stuff. I also want people to share their stories. You know, when— I'm not sure when these are going to be coming out, but we did— I did a bunch of like small snippets on our social media stuff and on the YouTube channel as well, like taking a dive into like 40 or 50 different examples of these things, taking like little small deep dives. So if anybody's been medically gaslit, they feel like they were overlooked and they realized they had to become basically their own advocate, become a medical fitness for themselves. Yeah. I'd love to hear the story wherever you're watching this, hearing this, looking at this to share your little story. Because this is how this kind of stuff is going to get out there. You know, yes, we have, you know, actually we've had over 500,000 downloads on our podcast and at the stage now we're getting like 80,000 to 90,000 downloads a month. So the new, the message is getting out there. The only way this is actually going to blow up is if people start sharing, contributing, talking. So hopefully this will be a a spark for people just to realize and share their stories wherever they're seeing this. I hope so. And then, you know, get educated and change. The thing I'm really excited about with a lot of my patients is the, the, the, my female patients have a family, they have kids. I'm really excited about changing the trajectory of the kid's life. That for me is like, I think that's my passion is like get the family change because this next generation, currently the kids are getting sicker.

Yeah.

It's like, it doesn't have to be that way.

Yeah.

The kids can actually be healthier.

Yeah. The trickle-down effect is pretty awesome. I mean, like, like, let's be real. Who's at the center of that? The women that we've just been talking about. Your moms, right? The moms, the moms that are going to make the dietary changes for the entire family. The moms that are going to be motivating people to, you know, use cleaner products and go for a walk after dinner. We get these moms feeling good. They're superwomen. They can take care of the rest of the stuff. Then the whole family benefits.

Yeah.

You know, like that's the goal.

Yeah, that's the reason I practice kind of medicine is my wife nudged me this way and 'cause my daughter and, you know, she was like, throw a shingle up. And she's like, you should look for a new building. And so it's—

I'm glad she did, man. I'd still be in the ER.

I don't know.

I probably wouldn't be, but I don't know that I'd be here. Obviously I wouldn't be here.

You don't— you'd be somewhere.

I'd be somewhere.

You'd be somewhere.

I don't stay quiet for long.

You don't. You're a fighter, man. You're a swinger. You'd be swinging somewhere. I'm just glad you're swinging here.

So thanks, man.

Cool. All right. Anyway, hopefully this is helpful. Um, if there's something you'd like to hear us talk about, you know, um, we're in the process of creating a schedule for our next round of podcasts. We've gone through a lot of different topics over the last year and a half because it'll be 2 years for the podcast as of this November.

Nice.

I know, man. 2 years. It's been a while. So, um, we want to talk about things you want to learn about, not just things we think are cool. Um, so if you have any ideas, things you'd like to share, please drop them on our social media, drop them wherever you're watching this. My team's crowsing that stuff and collecting things. Otherwise, be well, take care, and we'll talk to you soon.

See you soon.