Episode 141: Ladder to Leader with Ryan Larson

So the big question is this: how do small business owners like us grow our leadership, develop our teams, and scale our business in a way that allows us to get our products and services out to the world yet still remain profitable?

That is the question, and this podcast will give you the answers.

I'm Bradley Hamner, and this is the Club Capital Leadership Podcast. Hey, before we get into today's episode, did you know that Club Capital is the largest accounting advisory firm for insurance agency owners in the country, providing monthly accounting, CFO services, and tax preparation.

Check them out at club.capital. Welcome to another episode of the Club Capital Leadership Podcast. My name is Bradley Hamner, your host. On today's episode, we have Ryan Larson. He is a seasoned wealth advisor and founder and CEO of First Line Financial based in Scottsdale, Arizona.

He—

Ryan, he embodies the qualities of trustworthy leader and believes everyone deserves a chance to lead a life they can breathe proud of as they enter retirement. In his new business memoir, Ladder to Leader: My Journey from Failure to FIRE to Financial Freedom, Ryan shares his true story of evolution from a troubled youth to successful founder and CEO and the many life and business lessons he's learned along the way. Without further ado, here's my conversation with Ryan. Larson.

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Ryan Larsen, welcome to the Club Capital Leadership Podcast.

Thank you, Brad. I appreciate it. Excited to be here.

Excited to have you. So we always start with background and origin story, and in preparing for the podcast, I think you just have a really fascinating story that I think a lot of people are going to be able to connect to. Maybe not the specifics, but I think a lot of people have a very similar story to yours. Why don't you just take us back and kind of tell your journey?

Yeah, we all— we definitely all have stories, don't we? Um, yeah, my story is a little bit different. Um, I'm, you know, I kind of was, was raised in a large family. Um, you know, my parents, blue-collar workers. Dad was in the Air Force. Mom worked as a cashier, still to this day, just providing for us 4 kids. And it was, uh, you know, we didn't have a lot of money, but, um, you know, my parents did the very best with what was coming in the door. Um, they always tried to sacrifice for the betterment of the kids. And I think that's what I learned with having 2 kids now, is just you know, to make those sacrifices to make sure that you're doing the best things that you can for your kids. With that being said, you know, we moved. I'm a native to Arizona. I moved to, you know, I was living in a duplex. I'll back up. I was living in a duplex, so I was sharing a house with another family when we were growing up. We got the opportunity to buy a home in Chandler, and really that's kind of where my footprint began, you know, through my elementary school days and junior high and high school days. So coming out of high school, I didn't really know what I wanted to do, and I was a good athlete. I was hoping that wrestling would take me somewhere, which it did not. Unfortunately, and my grades weren't there too. I was not the best kid. I shouldn't— well, I wasn't the best kid either, but I didn't have the best grades growing up as a kid also. And yeah, just kind of limited myself with getting into trouble and not having those grades academic-wise. I was fortunate to come out of high school and find my passion pretty quick. Um, which is, uh, becoming a firefighter. And the way that I found that was I was working at Home Depot as a cashier, and there was actually an incident where a young, um, uh, gentleman started a fire in the paint aisle, and that thing erupted, and there was a mass exit of the exodus of the building. And that's where I sat in the parking lot and was in awe watching this Home Depot just go up in flames. And it was right there where I kind of— something clicked. And I was like, man, I think, I think I know what I want to do with my life. And I went home, told my parents I was out of a job, but, uh, I think I knew my direction. And I followed that for the next couple years. And then I was fortunate to get picked up with a different, a couple different, uh, Valley fire departments. And, uh, yeah, I've been a fireman for the Phoenix Fire Department for about 21 years now. Hmm. So it's been a really good career and, um, you know, learned, learned a lot for sure. And I transitioned into my other passion, which was investing. And I started my own financial firm about 5 years ago. But I've been in this business for about 10 years now as, as a financial advisor.

Did—

when you became a firefighter, had 9/11 happened? At that point?

It was interesting because I was a, a booter, a rookie firefighter, and I was actually at the station the day of, uh, 9/11 when the Twin Towers hit, when the planes hit the Twin Towers. I was actually mopping the floor and the chief, uh, came out into the day room And he requested everyone to take a seat on the recliners. And as a booter, a rookie fireman, you're not supposed to do that. You're supposed to, you know, just stay busy throughout the whole day. Well, the chief was very insistent on us sitting down and watching what was unfolding. And yeah, we sat there for a couple hours why, you know, both towers came down and, you know, many of the, you know, fire departments, New York fire agencies, you know, essentially, you know, trying to, you know, help and save people during that day. So it was very, it was a very proud day for me to be a firefighter. Obviously, it was a very tragic day for, you know, for the, uh, for the country.

Yeah, yeah. You know, even looking back on that moment, you're seeing that Home Depot— I mean, it's, um, I, I certainly hope that everybody, you know, was okay in that, uh, but that for a lot of people is— I mean, you know, seeing a building of that size obviously catch on fire would have been, I mean, certainly a sight to see. But I think it's really interesting that obviously that happened in your life for you to be able to see that as a moment to say man, look out how these people are handling this. And to actually see that, that that's the moment that you're— the, the rest of your life was actually really changed. That's, uh, for, for me, I don't know if it was ever really moments along the way, like a specific thing, an event that happened in that way, right? I think for me it was a, it was a slow things I was getting exposed to along the way I, I don't remember the moment I first listened to a podcast myself, right? I, I, I, I don't remember that. I was like, what is a podcast? I'm gonna have no idea. And then I, I don't remember even the day that obviously I said, I think we should launch a podcast, you know. But, uh, or what was even in my mind to, to do that, to, to be able to hear, you know, stories like yourself. Well, what was the, what was the transition? How'd you go from doing that for what sounds like 15 years or so, to then saying, okay, I actually want to do this other thing? And then how did you decide that financial services was obviously going to be the, uh, the thing that you wanted to get into?

Yeah, there was actually, you know, the, the 9/11, uh, that day was actually— I look back on how things kind of played out in my, my life and my trajectory. And that day actually was very symbolic in different ways for me. Um, the one thing that I took away from that day was the conversations of firefighters, you know, having about their retirement accounts, how the markets were dropping. How it was, you know, causing them a lot of uneasiness about, you know, how they're going to pay for this and pay for that in retirement. So that's one of the takeaways that I remember during that day. The other, the other thing that happened that was really just symbolic in my life was I bought a high-rise tower on Tempe Town Lake. So if you've ever been to Tempe, Arizona, you know, we have this really epic, um, lake. Well, it used to be a dry riverbed. And actually, Brad, that's where I grew up. The duplex that I grew up butted up against that dry riverbed. And as kids, we would go out to this dry riverbed and we would, you know, build dirt forts and we throw rocks at each other and, you know, play like, uh, you know, soldiers or whatever it is. Um, but fast forward, like, uh, God, like 25 years later, I purchased almost a million-dollar condo, a high-rise condo on Tempe Town Lake, and I bought that in 2006. and it took about 2 years for them to build that. I believe it was a 12-story condo. So that puts us at around 2008. Um, you know, I did— this was a joint venture between me and my brother. 2008 happened, the real estate market corrected, and we were sitting there scratching our head, head going, oh crap. We just bought this million-dollar condo, which is now maybe worth $400,000. So that's where investing really, um, or thinking about my future really started, um, and how to kind of get out of this, this hole, if you will, that many of us were in, not just me. Thankfully, my girlfriend, my now wife, is— she had an advisor that we sat down and talked through our finances, and he actually was very adamant about me coming aboard his firm because how I got into that condo was I was actually trading foreign currency. Forex. They call it forex. And I was actually doing very well and made a lot of money, and that's kind of how I put that large down payment for that, that condo. Well, you know, when the markets went down, people lost a lot of money. I lost a lot of money, and I was scared to continue to trade forex because I just didn't have the cash flow. Yeah. So that's where the financial stepping into the financial advising arena really started with, with that financial advisor who I sat down with to talk through my own finances.

I think it was Warren Buffett that said, only when the tide goes out do you see who's been swimming naked. I think that's him. I may have that quote a little bit wrong, but that's true, right? Because everything's— everybody's happy. Everybody's happy when market's going up. Maybe not even the stock market, maybe just in your business, the market dynamics in your area for your agency, your financial service. People are coming and you're through no doing of your own. What I think is— what I hear in your saying is that you had to pay an incredibly large dumb tax.

Yes.

To learn.

100%.

My own hubris of thinking I can do no wrong. You know, we bought one of them, let's go buy a second one, right? I, I think that is really valid for a lot of people because if I could go back and rewind the 3 biggest financial mistakes that I've ever made, I'd be worth a lot more money. I'd have a lot more money.

Right.

And so I was just talking to Mike about this the other day, is that I wish— I, I think that so often, uh, and you can certainly speak to this from your financial services background, that we are too often in our businesses and in our financials, uh, uh, finances and our, and our retirement planning, we're looking for these home runs. Maybe we were hoping for a grand slam. I'm hiring 3 people, they all need to work out. Okay, well, they might, but so often we're better suited to avoid the big losses. If we could just avoid big losses along the way instead of trying to hit big home runs, we'd be well suited. Your thoughts?

Yeah, that couldn't be more accurate in my mind, especially right now. And, you know, as an advisor, we see a lot of clients, you know, facing whatever market downturns, but we don't advisors don't, um, I guess, break down their own walls to the outside world. And so maybe what I could share, Brad, that is a little bit of value for your listeners is, is in 2020 and 2021, I, I made a lot of money. I think a lot of people made a lot of money. And I think it was nearing fourth quarter of 2021, and I told my wife, I said, Kate, all our positions, all our holdings are green, which means they're all in the positives, right? And so what I did is I took a lot of those profits and I put everything in cash.

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And I was thinking to myself, I'm like, okay, well, I could sit in cash and, you know, my money's really not making anything and I could wait for a dip or whatever it is and then come back in. And so what I'm sharing with you is I was trying to be smarter than the market. So what happened is I was like, wait, I'm young, I have a long-term approach, and essentially my portfolio should be tilted towards risk. So what happened is I reinvested in late 2021, quarter 4, Q4. And what happened in January 2022? Well, that's when Russia invaded Ukraine. Markets dropped, right? So just because we could be really profitable one moment, doesn't mean we're smart and we can't subject ourselves to losses the next moment, right? And that's what happened even as an advisor, right? I was doing extremely well, made a lot of money, but I'm like, well, maybe I could continue to get this right and make more money. And we're— and sometimes we're greedy and we try to hit those home runs, and we don't need to. If I would have just sat in cash because I knew everything was very high, I mean, a correction was inevitable, right? And so if I would have just waited a few weeks, I would have had cash, market dropped 20%, I could have came in and probably made a lot of money. That's out the window. So what do I do now? I have to hold my losses because once again, if you sell those losses, it's a— it's— it's— you realize that, you know, it's just a paper loss. But until you sell it, it's— you're really losing money. So now I'm just holding some losses. But what I'm learning more and more as I get older, you need to position yourselves in other vehicles that, yeah, you might make 6%, 7%, 8% on good years, but then there's when there's bad years come, you know, come around, you might not lose anything. So there's vehicles out there that give you upside without any downside. And I think that's what, that's what people need to hear more and more. They don't need to just risk all their assets um, like, like we've always done, you know. There's ways to insulate and isolate yourself from those losses.

I also want to just say that you telling that story about yourself— I was on a call this morning with 11 other business owners, and this topic came up, not around, uh, personal investing, but it was this idea of We'll do all of these things, preparation for our clients. And oftentimes the thing that gets neglected the most are the things we need to do. So we'll help another client with their marketing plan. I'm thinking about, um, somebody in particular. I'll help them with a marketing plan. That's what I do. That's the, that's my business.

Yeah.

Oh, maybe I need to actually work on the marketing plan for myself too. And I don't think that that's being disingenuous. I think it's trying to put the best foot forward for your clients. But sometimes we've got to be able to look at it ourselves. And so for you to be a financial advisor, you know, it's like, okay, I got this client meeting, got this client, I got a prospect meeting, I've got to build all these things for them. You're spending all that time to say, wait a minute, I need to actually think about this, you know, for myself along the way as well, because I know there's a lot of people listen to this. Are, you know, really smart around their financials. I mean, that maybe they, maybe they manage themselves, or maybe they're just very familiar with stock market. And then there's other people that go, I don't know anything about that kind of stuff. I don't know the difference in a stock and a bond. Okay, that's, that's okay, you know, that, that's okay to do that. Um, but, but making sure that you lean into to say, okay, I need to make sure that I'm doing the things from my own personal retirement or from my own business, not just focusing on on somebody else's.

Yeah, sometimes we got to focus on tying our own shoe versus trying to tie everyone else's shoe, right? I think that is— yeah, that's the biggest takeaway is we need to make sure that we follow— like, I'm following my process that I put in place for my clients too, and I don't deviate from it because it works, right? And I've seen it. So if you believe in something wholeheartedly, why aren't you doing it yourself? Right? And so true. Right now I'm 44, and with the processes that I have in place, I mean, and kind of how we design portfolios and using different vehicles, I mean, Gosh, I mean, a lot of our clients are positive year to date, which speaks volumes. And that's— I should lean into making sure my own personal portfolio is aligned with what I believe in, what I'm putting in place for my clients, and being an advocate for the client as well.

So let me ask you this. What are some of the, what are some of the, um, maybe 2 or 3 biggest lessons or principles that you learned and are still are, um, but have been able to pull from being a firefighter over into your own business?

Wow. That's a great question. Um, I think the biggest thing for me is just Being a good listener first. You know, we go on a lot of calls and we need— we have like some like intake forms or EMS forms and we need to make sure that we're listening, you know, using our ears. And that's going to give us clues of, you know, what could potentially what the client could potentially have going on with their situation, right? Medically, that is. And I think the same holds true in the financial arena, right? I think we need to stop doing so much talking and spend more time listening, gather information on whether it's goals or concerns, what they want from their retirement, because that is going to allow us to build a good retirement plan. I think the biggest, you know, takeaway is just being a good listener, uh, first off, and then I think communi— just being a good communicator as well. You know, in high school, I definitely was the guy who didn't want to speak in front of, you know, people. I didn't want to stand up and tell a story or whatever it is in class. I got nervous. And as, as a fireman, you know, we need to talk to the community, talk to, you know, our patients, our clients. And like I said, just be an advocate, you know, for, for those who we serve. So I think being a good communicator, uh, through the fire department has transitioned in the financial arena because I get to share a story with the, the, the clients that I sit down with and, um, you know, present it in a way that it hit home, it hit, it hits home personally, and then they can align with it. You know, the message is very similar to their message.

Yeah, you know, there's, there's, uh, your story is, uh, definitely tied into your financial practice, um, you know, being on the front lines, right? Uh, for sure. So I don't think there's probably any surprise that you named it First Line Financial, right? Because you really are, you really are on the front lines. How'd you decide to write the book?

Oh my goodness. Yeah, you know, when 2020 came around, pandemic shut everything down. I just needed another avenue, um, to kind of, uh, I don't know, just kind of share my thoughts, right? I mean, there's a lot of things that I wanted to and, you know, we were just kind of in a weird, you know, situation during that whole period. And I just, I just wanted to start putting words on paper and see what came out and just kind of, I think I have a little bit of a different story and I just wanted to put my, you know, story on paper and see if it, you know, could go anywhere. Um, or if it could, you know, um, you know, inspire anyone. And I think that's where it really came from. So I just started writing in 2020, uh, just poured all my thoughts on paper and yeah, it's, uh, kind of, you know, made some chapters and made a mess of, of, you know, all that chicken scratch and it came out to be something pretty, pretty cool. So I'm very proud of it right now for sure.

You can speak to this cuz I, I don't, I don't have a book. It's it's certainly been in my thought process, but I've heard the book that changes your life is not the one you read, but the one you write.

Yes, yes. I mean, it, it brings out a lot of, um, just different thoughts, you know. I mean, you get to really self-reflective who you are, where you're going, and who you want to be. And I think that's what happened, you know, during that year. I think it allowed me to really grow as a person. It made me self-reflective, you know, the person I was, you know, in my younger days, which was not, not a good— I wasn't a good kid, you know. I was, I was rough around the edges for sure, but I've come so far, and that's what was really cool writing this book is I get to tell people, um, where I've come and where I'm at. And I think that's what is inspiring to a lot of people, because if, if it's— if they don't— if they're not where they want to be, it's, it's easy to change. You got— you just have to commit to changing. Right? And that's sometimes hard. You know, it's hard to change if you don't want to, but if you want to, it's easy.

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Love that. All right, so we're going to go into E9 rapid-fire questions, but before we do that, um, where can people pick up the book, find out more about you? Where would you point them to?

Yeah, I'll point them to ladder2leaderbook.com. You could purchase the book on there. I have a speaking or a teaser coming here pretty quick. I'm going to try to be getting on some of these bigger stages, doing a little bit more public speaking, if you will, so they could find out a little bit more about that through that website and just, you know, follow along on my journey at, you know, Ryan_Larz, L-A-R-Z, through Instagram.

Love it. Awesome. We'll make sure we'll put that in the show notes and then also to the email that we send out to our list about the podcast. All right, you ready to go?

Yes, sir. Yeah.

All right. What is the last book that you read?

Oh my goodness. I don't read a lot of books. I honestly, I try to listen to a lot of podcasts. I read a lot of quotes and try to get inspired in other ways. But books are definitely not my strong point. And I think that's why I wanted to write a book is because maybe it would make me want to pick up more books. And read them. So, uh, honestly, I appreciate that.

I appreciate that honesty. So you say like your last book you read was maybe yours, actually?

Uh, yeah, I've read that a little bit too many times now. And yeah, it's still— it's like, oh gosh, you know, reading is— reading is difficult. I was, as a young— as a young boy, I was in resource, and I wasn't the best, you know, student as a kid. And, you know, sometimes re— reading I just can't stay engaged. I have to find other avenues.

I get that. You do Audible?

Yeah.

Yeah, that's what it is. It's like a podcast, sort of.

Exactly. Exactly.

All right. What's your favorite podcast other than the Club Capital Leadership Podcast?

Of course.

You know, I like Eastman's Elevated. It's a hunting podcast. I'm a big outdoorsman. Okay, good. There's a gentleman, Brian Barney. He just talks about the great outdoors and, you know, how, how your mindset can, you know, really define being a successful bow hunter versus, you know, coming home to your family without any meat.

I love it, Mark. If you're listening to this, Mark, he's a buddy of mine. He listens to the podcast. Then you need to listen to that podcast. He just recommended. He knows who he is.

Yeah.

All right. What's your favorite travel destination?

Oh my goodness. I'm going to go Kauai. And the reason why is because that's where me and my lovely wife got married on the beach. And we have 2 kids now. And yeah, we have it kind of in the, in the books right now to take our kids there next year. So it'll be We just love Kauai. Just a beautiful, beautiful place.

Yeah. Very cool. What's the— what's your favorite quote?

Oh, you put me on the spot here.

That's the whole point.

That's— yeah, I know.

It's that—

that's the point of the enun. Well, we don't want people to prepare. People ask me, you need to send these questions beforehand. I'm not sending the questions beforehand.

I'm gonna, I'm gonna, um, quote something of my own, um, that I kind of put out there. I— the quote goes, there will be people out there who will support you at your worst and hate you at your best. That's true. That's true. Amen to that.

Love it. What'd you learn the most about yourself during the pandemic?

To really, um, take a, a deep dive into yourself, really understand who you are and how you want to be perceived in this world, right? Like, I want to be, I want to be as happy as possible. And I know there's been times in my life that, you know, I've had a lot of sad moments, a lot of moments that I've questioned that, you know, am I good enough? You know, will I make it?

Mm-hmm.

And I think that's what 2020 brought out the most is, you know, what do I truly want out of this life? And what do I gotta do to get there? And being happy to me is everything right now. Um, so whether that's talking to someone, spending time with your family, uh, more spending time with your kids outdoors, whatever it is. To make that happen. That's, that's really my takeaway from 2020.

All right. 30-second answer is going to be tough. Crypto, yay or nay?

I would say nay right now. Fair enough. Yeah, it's a delicate, delicate subject for sure. Crypto is one of the things I've dabbled in And I just think, yeah, it's been, it's been beat down a lot. I think there could be a lot of upside, but with the way the world is, the economy, um, I just think there's too much risk on the table, um, and you got to tread lightly in this market.

10-hour flight, you can sit next to anyone dead or alive, who would it be?

Oh my goodness. I'm gonna, I'm gonna sit next to Johnny Cash.

Johnny Cash. Okay, that's great. Nobody's ever answered it with a musician, actually, let alone Johnny Cash. That's great. I love it. When I think you— well, actually, I'll tell you what, I'll ask a different one. What's your biggest pet peeve?

Procrastination. Ooh, I, I think, I think we as people just tend to put things off. And gosh, you never know. I mean, especially being in the fire service, um, seeing how delicate life is, we, we really need to take the bulls by the horns on things that we want to do. And if you procrastinate I think it's just going to eat you alive. You might resent yourself for not doing the things that you truly desire to do. Oh, love it.

That's good. All right.

Last question.

It is the Club Capital Leadership Podcast. What's the best piece of leadership advice you've ever received?

Stay humble and stay engaged, meaning make sure that you are continuing to educate yourself on your business. Sit with like-minded individuals and, you know, don't think just because you started a company and the company's whatever it is, a Fortune 5000 company, that you should not be involved. You should always be involved in the company that you started because that's what you believe in, and it can help probably more people than you know.

Love it. Love it. Ron, great to have you on. Hope to have you back on in the future.

Thank you so much, Brad. It was a pleasure.

You know, each week I always try to give 1 or 2 or 3 maybe big takeaways from the guests that I just had on and interviewed. You know, I think the biggest overall thing that I took away from the conversation with Ryan is it made me reflect whenever he was telling the story about the Home Depot burning and then obviously whenever he was talking about, you know, 9/11 and how that had an impact on him. And so if you really go back to your own time and think about times that have had a profound impact in your life. It might have been 9/11, it might have been a personal failure, it might have been a family tragedy, it might have been a really tough time in your business. My goodness, I wish that we did not have to go through those trials to be able to learn so much about ourselves and to be able to kind of point us in the right direction, both personally and professionally. And I think that ultimately And after that conversation with Ryan, it made me reflect on some of those really challenging times and times that were really pivotal in my life, even before my business career was started.

And I know many of you will be able to relate to that.

Appreciate his service to business owners, to people around the country and their pursuit for their own retirement, but also, um, hopefully this was able to serve a all of you. As always, want to give thanks to our podcast sponsors: Coach P, Direct Clicks, Rock Solid Assistance, and of course Club Capital. If you're ready to take your business to the next level by training and developing your team, investing in them, go to coachpconsulting.com. Make sure you tell him that you heard about him on the Club Capital Leadership Podcast and you get your entire first month for free. Also, if you want to be able to dive more into your your personal finances, but your business financials to be able to make better decisions, go to club.capital, book a no-obligation demo, and make sure you ask them about the CFO services that you've heard about on the podcast. You've heard me many times talk about my, my team and my executive assistants that have been so incredibly, um, just impactful to me in my personal and professional life and You know, I've had to get to the point to where I was comfortable being able to say that I had an EA, I had an assistant. It felt strange for me, you know, who was I to be able to have an assistant? But ultimately there's only a handful of things that you really need to be doing in your business. And so if you're even interested in that, go to rocksolidassistance.com, reach out to Tracy and their team and book a discovery call for— they can walk you through and give you an idea. of what it would be like to be able to have an assistant to be able to help you in your business. It's getting close to the end of the year. Many of you want to be able to raise the, uh, conversions to be able to close out this year and, uh, knock the rest of the few months that we have remaining out of the park to wrap up the goals that you have. You want to be able to give your team, your sales team, some really quality leads. Go to DirectClicks inc.com. DirectClicksInc.com. All right, everyone, this is a good one. Till next episode, lead well.

So the big question is this: how do small business owners like us grow our leadership, develop our teams, and scale our business in a way that allows us to get our products and services out to the world yet still remain profitable?

That is the question, and this podcast will give give you the answers.

I'm Bradley Hamner, and this is the Club Capital Leadership Podcast. Hey, before we get into today's episode, did you know that Club Capital is the largest accounting and advisory firm for insurance agency owners in the country, providing monthly accounting, CFO services, and tax preparation? Check them out at club.capital.