Keeping a Strong Presence and Influence through Crisis with Alisa Cohn

All right, good morning everybody and happy Thursday. It's Chris Schembra with my dear friend Alisa Cohn for today's episode of 747 Conversations right here on LinkedIn Live. We are broadcasting live, literally. If you have any questions, please put them in the comments. Please let us know where are you calling in from, how are you spending your time. It's great to meet you. Today I have a dear friend, Alisa Cohn. She is an executive coach who works with senior executives and high potential leaders to help create a positive environment, uh, to create permanent shifts in their leadership impact and the results they achieved. She was ranked the number 1 startup coach in the world by the Marshall Goldsmith Thinkers 50 2019 coaching awards, and we're so excited to have her with us today. I met her through a dear friend, dear mutual friend, Dori Clark, many years ago. And it's such— it's been such a blessing following her, her path ever since. So, Alisa, welcome to the LinkedIn Live.

Thanks, Chris. It's great to be here with you. And I've so enjoyed following your path since we met. So it's amazing.

Yeah, we've been privileged to do a few things together over the years, and I can't wait to dive into that in a little bit. Well, to start our conversation today, I have a simple question. I asked it to you last night, and I've asked it to you on numerous occasions. If you could give credit or thanks to one person in your life that you don't give enough credit or thanks to, who would that be?

Um, we talked about that last night, and I just wanted to say that I'm the kind of person that gives a lot of credit and thanks to my friends, like, on a regular basis. But who popped into my mind is my brother Dan Cohn. If you're out there, hi Dan, I appreciate you. My brother is so, you know, we're not always on the same page. And yet my brother is so thoughtful. My brother is so loyal. My brother is so considerate. My brother is so like always, you know, like, are you okay? You know, he hears about New York, like, are you okay? Are you okay? And my brother is like always so present with me. And I just want to say thank you to my brother, Dan.

Dan, if you're out there, you've done a wonderful job inspiring a sister and she's really had an impact on the world. Now today we're going to be talking about executive presence, communication, influence, charisma. How do leaders lead better by doing good? And the first question I have to ask you is, the world around you knows you as one of the most ferocious dumbbell lifting or kettlebell lifting, CrossFit participating, mental and physical fitness advocates.

Yes.

How has your fitness regime changed in this time of need? And how have you been supporting leaders through their physical and mental fitness routines as well?

Oh my God, thank you for asking my favorite topic, fitness. Yes. So I just wanna start by saying the reason I'm a fitness fanatic now is 'cause I grew up very sedentary. And so I came to fitness much later in life. And I have attacked it with a ferocity that you said, because it's just such— it's just so beautiful in every way. First of all, I never feel like doing it. So when I start, it's a triumph. And then as I go through, you know, my warm-up and intellectually, you know, my practice, and then I suddenly feel like it, and suddenly everything changes. My mood changes, my physical feelings change. And so I just see what a transformative experience it is to have that fitness, to go through even just one session of practice with the kettlebell journey with heavy weights. And so that is very powerful for me. And then how it changes my own— well, first of all, I also, I work with a strength coach, um, Tom LaFerra. Hi, you're amazing. He's taught me a lot about coaching. He's taught me a lot about— he's super positive. He's super curious about how it's working and what's going on. There's no judgment or criticism whatsoever, ever, with Tom. And yet he also inspires me. He says things like, "Just try," or, "Okay, put your hand on the weight," as in stop stalling and just do it. And there's a lot of those techniques that come out that I've learned a lot about coaching from Tom. And then just for myself, I see how that kind of structure and routine, something I'm very, very focused on, How do you have the right routine to help you kind of win the day? And so I definitely devote all of that to my clients in terms of my own journey.

Now it's such an interesting thing. You talk about routines and starting your day.

Yeah.

Here we are, you're used to working with literally some of the world's largest companies. Yeah. In those companies, structure reigns supreme. Systems are the solution. But now those leaders are taken out of their executive environment and they're having to work from home where it's a, it's kind of a mishmash of what's work, what's play. They used to be able to have routines that separated work, physical fitness, home, family.

Yeah.

Put them into buckets. Yeah. How are they dealing with the lack of structure and routine in their daily life through your work?

Yeah, it is such a great question, Chris, because To your point, senior, you don't get to be the CEO of a large company or the founder CEO of a startup without having a sense of like self-determination and kind of how to put your things, put your structure together. And so now we're all like, oh, how do we redo this? The CEOs that I work with have been very, very, very focused on helping their people get situated in their own environments. I've encouraged them all to do like a tour of your workspace so they can really help them think about how are they gonna get work done. But yes, the CEOs that I work with have also neglected their own structure and routine. And so one by one, I've had multiple conversations with the CEOs to step back and think about, okay, it's great, we're taking care of everybody else, that's important, but how are you gonna be your best in this environment? And it starts with having your own routine and how are you gonna put together your own routine? And we literally go step by step through the workspace and what is the first 90 minutes of your day look like and what makes you feel great? And what did you used to do that worked for you that we can now sort of repurpose and have it work differently for you now? It's been a very powerful discussion, important.

You know, it's interesting when you look at the leadership landscape today, in times of crisis, people can do one of two things. They either sacrifice themselves to save others. Yeah. Or they sacrifice others to save themselves. A lot of the clients you work on, are going to come out on the right side of history, having become empathetic leaders, having taken care of their employees, having sacrificed personally. What could leaders have done to have prepared for being on the right or the wrong side of history?

Do you mean sort of back in February, or do you mean sort of through their character development?

Through their character development. How they learn to lead and develop influence and charisma?

Well, you know, it's very interesting. As a leader becomes more responsible for more people, what I have found in many of my clients is they naturally begin to realize and care for the people around them, as in the well-being of their executives and employees becomes paramount in their mind. And over and over again, when I'm helping a startup go through an acquisition, when they get bought, which is a celebratory event, they're like not thinking about their own needs. They're thinking about making sure their employees are well-placed. When I work with some of my large company clients, even right now, they're really thinking a lot about how do we make sure that our people are safe and well, and ultimately how do we bring them back to work safely and well? And I think it comes from your ability to have emotional intelligence, to have your own self-awareness and tune into what you're thinking and feeling, and then recognize how that it all impacts other people and use time to reflect on the times that the things in your professional career that have been meaningful for you, that have like really hurt you or upset you, that have really empowered you and inspired you. If you care about being that kind of leader, like you're saying, empathetic leader, it's really being very clear with yourself about the things that have brought out the best in you and translating those for other people around you.

Now you mentioned emotional intelligence. You mentioned empathy. In times like today, you know, empathy is needed now more than ever. This is the opportunity to reach across the aisle, the opportunity to step into someone else's shoes.

Yeah.

And one of the things that we can do is immerse ourselves in art and culture and creativity. Now, one of the things that you've done in recent years has become, outside of a successful startup coach and executive coach, you've become a successful Broadway investor.

Yeah.

In multiple award-winning shows.

Yeah.

How has that dip into creativity in the arts affected your role as a coach?

Oh, it's such a great question. I mean, creativity has always been very important to me. And so being able to be involved in the business side of what it takes to put a show together, what it takes to bring all these people together, I think has just broadened my view about the way pieces come together. So when you enter a show, you know, it's like still coming together and there's like a lot of confusing pieces and you don't always know who is who and what's going on. So really sort of seeing from the ground floor, like how those pieces come together, the different kinds of people. So you've got the creative folks, you've got the business folks, you have the process folks, how they all come together And what I think a lot about is how do you take a beautiful diverse set of people and help them work together? That translates very well into the corporate environment for sure.

I mean, that sounds like the definition of the first, the angel seed and maybe A round of a startup.

Definitely.

You've got the vision, but you don't know what the moving pieces are along the way.

It's so true. It's so true. And for all of us, there's also a test and learn quality. Is this going to work? Is that going to work? And so especially early stage, figuring it all out, it's important to be able to sort of see that you need to run experiments to see what's going to work.

As we move forward through this crisis and we really look at what kind of skills need to be up-leveled on a national basis to give us better leaders for the future.

Yes.

What are some of those skills that we need to do as a society to prepare for the next generation of leaders?

Well, prepare, right? So planning, better planning skills. But I think it starts with adaptability. I think that increasingly we talk about the pace of change is accelerating itself. What we're seeing right now is a massive acceleration of change and a massive acceleration of sort of, I would even say constant change. So it's like we're sort of walking on tectonic plates. They're moving. We as leaders all have to be adaptable to that movement, accept what is going on, really, really play in the present and plan for the future based on knowing that this is the reality we have now, not the reality we had 2 weeks ago, the reality we have now, it will definitely change. Try to make some predictions about how it's gonna change, but adapt your style and your actions and the people, sort of coming and watching you. That is a critical skill, I think, as we come. But I would add, adaptability feels kind of fluid, but I would also add project planning. What's interesting to me is that increasingly I just see that people think, okay, that's all set. And I'm like, well, what's the deliverable date? And what does done look like? And people don't always have their arms around the mechanics of what it takes to think about a project from beginning, middle to end. And that has to do with how do we prepare for various different scenarios? With real heft, with real weight.

You know, it's interesting, you talk about project planning and you talk about, you know, setting a goal to get something done. When is the date deliverable? What does done even look like? What we learned from theater is that the first thing you do is pick a date.

Yeah.

And then work backwards.

Totally.

You commit to a theater. Right, right. 8 months out.

Yes.

And then you just start selling the seats, working backwards.

You better be ready.

Right?

Right.

Now, talking about adaptability.

Yeah.

A lot of your work is in supporting executive leaders, workshops, one-on-one trainings. How will your role as a coach, as a trusted advisor, as a consultant look different in this next phase of humanity?

Well, it's an interesting question that's still evolving, right? So first of all, a lot of what we're all learning is digital skills. So I'm trying to up my own game in terms of technology, but also use. So even on this video now, I'm in this place now, in my boyfriend's place in Montclair, New Jersey. So I've had 3 different workspaces here to kind of figure out what's the background supposed to look like and what's the lighting supposed to look like. So like literally just the mechanics of that kind of thing, but in terms of the technology, And then how do you translate the dynamism of an in-person experience online? I am absolutely gonna be thinking about that for sure. But I would add that it's not for me to think about that. It's also for my leaders to think about that. They have to communicate differently. So my role is to help them accept today's reality, play the game we're in right now, and think about how they have to adapt their style rapidly and advise them on what I'm hearing from around them to see if they're communicating effectively. Are they communicating empathetically and emotionally enough? And then also helping them see how do they really lead people through this unprecedented, unfamiliar landscape when they themselves don't know where they're going. So I just wrote an article recently for Forbes about how do you plan for a future that nobody can plan for? And we're all now tasked with thinking about that very differently.

You mentioned about leading from afar. You talk about influence and charisma from afar. How are you seeing your leaders step up to the plate? Are you happy with how quickly they've adapted? You know, what are the things leaders need to work on better?

Yeah.

You know, in the short term?

Well, So I'm really impressed with the different ways that the leaders that I work with have adapted some best practices to their own scenarios. So I have one CEO that I work with, startup CEO, and he's very quite brilliant and he's doing a great job managing the company. And then oops, this crisis hits. He's not the most communicative. So now it's not a time to be quiet. So I've helped him really see that he needs to have daily meetings with various people and certainly daily executive team meetings in order to make sure that everybody's on the same page. And then there's another executive I work with and he wants to make sure that they have twice a week lunches together, the executive team. But it's about consistency and it's about what's going to work for those individuals specifically. And it's really about, I guess I would say, like back to adaptation, it's about more cadence, more regularity, more consistency, but also giving people a lot of room to have some concerns and anxiety and being open to talking about those things. That's what's required right now in leadership.

You know, it's interesting, you talk about giving people space and giving people room to sit in their anxieties and their fears.

Yes.

As we've learned through our dinners over the years, silence and space can actually be a tool for connection.

Yes, that's a great point.

Because the storyteller, or the person giving voice of something, your silence means actually that you're listening. Your silence, instead of you having a comeback, means that you've actually been fully present. Now, in terms of communication, if you are advocating— because I know a lot of friends whose main complaints is CEO absenteeism. Mm-hmm.

As in, see their CEO? Is that what you mean?

As in, their CEOs are not having frequent touchpoints as you recommend.

Yeah.

What if the leader just doesn't have anything to say? What if they're as scared as that employee? How do they take— how do they fill that time for daily briefings? What would you advise for?

Actually, what they should say. Yeah, that's a really interesting question. I mean, I think first of all, I would step back and say, what do you think is the leadership that's required in this moment? Who do you need to be as a leader in this moment? Do you need to be a leader with nothing to say? I doubt it. So then it's about what does, what do people need to hear from you now? And there is definitely a sense of, I guess I would say vision for the future. And I would add some tactical road signs along the way. This is a time to also really manufacture and merchandise quick wins. This is a time to give people a sense of momentum, even towards a future where we don't know what's coming. We may not know what's coming long-term, but you can really think about how can I plan myself this week? How can we create a project this month that's gonna help us go in the right direction and then help people, you, the CEO, and then the leaders under you, and then everybody through the organization carve out small pieces of work Complete them and feel the victory and momentum that comes from those kinds of wins.

So in the face of uncertainty, nail out some few quick wins to really build employee confidence.

Yes, employee confidence is exactly right, Chris. That's perfect.

I love that. Yeah. Well, you know, Alisa Cohn, you are a very creative, artistic, woman, the theaters are shut down. Where are you getting your daily dose of creativity and inspiration from the arts?

Such a great question. First of all, I'm loving Instagram and people doing the live things, right? So live concerts at home, live fitness classes, of course I love that. I also am following something called the Isolation Journals. Which is a daily prompt for creative journaling. I'm loving that. And also, I'm enjoying connecting with, you know, family and friends in a different kind of way and being more authentic. And that's also creative in a moment.

You know, it's interesting. We— you came to a virtual dinner last night of ours. And one of the things we talked about today, because you're pretty much my coach in these times right now with that. But yeah. You talk about how to create greater opportunities for connection in the small groups that are virtual dinners. My question to you is, how much content, how much free content is too much content? And what can people be doing with free internet platforms to create connection rather than a speaker stand?

Oh, yeah. I mean, small groups, small groups and prompts, right? That's, that is the biggest way to do it, that you create you know, you had this beautiful context of like having, was it a 15-person dinner, something like that?

Last night was 26.

Oh, 26. Oh, sorry. I didn't even realize. Yeah. 20, the Zoom is like, the boxes are small, right? So 26 people, that's a big group online, hard to really connect. But then Chris, what you did beautifully is you put us into small groups and then gave us specific questions to answer together. And then even did a great job of giving us a timeline, a time limit, like 5 minutes per person or whatever it was. Beautiful. And that's really what it takes, a context for smaller groups and specific prompts. By the way, Dori and I have been hosting cocktail parties, as we told you, we're going to get you to one of them. And in the cocktail party, we do kind of facilitate it. We've got only about 8 people or so, 8 or 9 people at the most. And we ask people to answer one question just by way of introduction. And then one other question, you know, like, what are you grateful for? Or what are some things that are meaningful to you now, or other kinds of prompts like that. And that helps everyone get to know each other. And it's like the right theme for a virtual event.

Yeah. And you have even put together a list of great prompts. Yes, I have. And help people through this. Where can people go to find those, that list?

It's gonna be on my website by Monday. AlisaCohn.com. And I'm gonna have a downloadable, sheet that you can like use to pull prompts from, from that.

For awesome. Now, now, I'm, I'm sitting here watching this interview online from afar. What do I as a founder or an executive need to be feeling in order to wake up and say, I gotta call Alisa right now? What is that person feeling?

Well, that's an interesting question. I think that what they're probably feeling is, I could use partnership. So what they might be feeling is, I recognize that I only know what I know. I need a sounding board and I need partnership. And you should definitely call me if that's true. Obviously, if you're feeling anxious or concerned, understandably so, it's also a good time to call me And we can talk about that because ultimately, again, everybody, but certainly founders and certainly startup CEOs, right now is a time for a certain kind of leadership. Ask yourself that question. What is needed? What is the leadership that I need to express right here, right now to make it past this difficult point? That is a powerful question for everyone to ask themselves.

Well, I'm definitely going to go and sit on that question. Myself, your, your dear friend and mentor Marshall Goldsmith once said, what got you here won't get you there. And Alisa is the key that will get you to that next growth period of profitability. So Alisa, thank you for being with us today. Do you have any comments in closing before we wrap up?

Well, I would just say one of my favorite kind of expressions is we don't rise to the level of aspirations, We fall to the level of our training. So I would invite everybody to think about what is the personal practice and personal training you're doing to meet this moment.

Oh, I love that. You all heard it here first. Check out AlisaCohn.com for further information and to reach out. She publishes amazing articles on Forbes with tremendous leadership insights. Please check out her column there. Stay tuned. We will be publishing our episode with Ned Hallowell tomorrow morning, the world's foremost expert on ADHD, a New York Times bestselling author of Driven to Distraction, the preeminent book on understanding what is actually one of the greatest tools for entrepreneurship, ADHD. So I hope you all have enjoyed this episode of 747 Conversations. I hope you all are having a phenomenal day on Earth. Remember, folks, It's your world, go explore, and we'll see you next episode.