Thrive in Any Market: The Wicked Smart Blueprint with Chris Prefontaine - Ep- 577

Don't follow the masses and certainly don't follow the media. Connect with someone if you're an accredited investor like Allen. If you're building that up, connect with someone like us. But goodness sakes, if it's not one of us, find someone who's been through different economic cycles who can navigate with you. There's plenty of people out there with the use of the internet now versus listening to the masses, because we know the masses aren't the ones out there creating wealth.

Fact.

Not shooting arrows at anyone. So there's plenty of people that can help you out there and we'd love to do that.

Most investors wait for the perfect market, but what if the real advantage comes from learning how to profit in any market? This episode reveals a blueprint that turns uncertainty into opportunity and creates multiple paydays from one investment. Welcome to Streams to Impact, brought to you by Steed Talker Capital. I'm your host, Dr. Allen. Many high-achieving professionals reach a point where they realize that even with strong income and career success, their wealth is still tied to their time. And for those who are fulfilled in their professions, the answer isn't working harder or taking on a second job. It's finding ways to put their money to work through multiple streams of passive income. The ultra-wealthy have understood this for decades. Financial freedom comes not from earning more, but from building income streams that work independently of your time, creating resilience, flexibility, and long-term wealth. And that's exactly what we explore here on Streams to Impact. If today's conversation resonates with you, I'd like to extend a more personal invitation. Join me for a Path to Prosperity discovery call. It's 15 minutes of focused enlightenment where we examine your current financial landscape, clarify what genuine prosperity looks like for you, and identify the first deliberate steps towards securing it. And this is a one-on-one conversation, not a sales presentation. It's a quiet space for thoughtful professionals to think out loud with someone who has walked the path and to leave with at least one insight worth the quarter hour invested. So to reserve your time, visit www.steedtucker.com. Just a brief disclaimer, all information shared on Streams to Impact is for educational purposes only. It is not to be construed as investment, financial, legal, or tax advice. All investment involves risk. You should not invest if you're not prepared to lose 100% of your investment, and you are always encouraged to consult your legal, accounting, and tax advisors before making any investment. So what does it take to build a real estate business that thrives through market crashes, economic uncertainty, and even personal life challenges? Well, today's guest has done exactly that. Chris Prefontaine is the chairman and founder of Smart Real Estate Coach, a 4-time bestselling author, Forbes Business Council member, and 3-time Inc. 5000 honoree, recognized for leading one of the fastest-growing companies in the nation. With decades of experience, Chris has guided his wicked smart community through hundreds of real estate transactions across North America. But what makes his journey especially compelling is not just the success, it is the resilience behind it. From navigating the 2008 financial crisis and the aftermath of 9/11 to a near-death experience involving his son and the global disruption of COVID-19, Chris has repeatedly re-engineered his business to thrive in any economic climate. Alongside his wife of 38 years, Kim, and their children, Nick and Kayla, who now play key roles in the family business, Chris has built more than a company. He has built a family-driven mission focused on empowering individuals to become confident real estate investors capable of succeeding in any market. Today, we're going to explore how buying and selling on terms created multiple paydays from a single deal and built resilient investment strategies can help us investors not just survive market cycles but truly thrive in them. So welcome, Chris. I'm so glad to have you back with us today.

Thanks. Thanks for having me on. Always good to hang out.

You bet. So you've navigated multiple economic disruptions. So How did those experiences shape the philosophy about building a real estate business that can thrive in any market?

I would say because of what you and I both went through in '08, it literally was the impetus to do everything that we're doing today, to create everything we're doing today. Because when I went through the crash, I'm sure similar to you, I said, okay, wait a minute. If we're going to go back and do this, I had already had 18 or 19 years in the business. So, people, it's in theory, people go, well, didn't you have it figured out? I thought I did. But what happened was, um, similar to a lot of industries, I thought the real estate industry was a never-ending ATM, right? And it wasn't ever going to retreat. Well, um, in February of '08, like you flipped a switch, that came to a screeching halt. And it took me— there's a piece of this that I don't know if we've talked about before, but it took me 4 years from February of '08 till '12. To get out of my own way. That was a mindset issue, had nothing to do with the market, nothing to do with finances, but all that caused the mindset problems or challenges. So when I finally get out of my own way after reaching out to a few mentors, I said, all right, I'll— I'm gonna, I'm gonna put the kind of put the boots back on in real estate, but I'm gonna redefine how I do it. And one was don't use banks anymore. One was, and that entails signing personally, so no more signing personally. And one was, let's not— to your reference of 3 paydays, let's not do a deal anymore that's transactional because transactional now in hindsight is a job. That's why so many people in real estate, they start out with, say, you know, the wholesaling niche or the fix and flip. And I know you've experienced some of that. Well, that's great, but it's a job. So they try to do this while they're trying to leave their job and they just create a second job. And so what we've done is create the 3 paydays that creates money now, money over time, and money long term. Completely different quality income than the transactional kind of proverbial treadmill. And I love it, as I said on my show with you, that our— you and I, our tribes, so to speak, can marry. Because as we teach people to parlay the 3 paydays, they then move to someone in the expertise of your neck of the woods, and it's perfect. So it's just like a stair stepper, if you will.

Mm-hmm. Well, Chris, one of the things that I face with talking with a lot of people who are new to real estate investing, they're familiar probably with public markets and that's what they've been doing. They want to go into real estate and they think they have to own their own single-family home to do rentals or short-term rentals or what ever. And they're just fascinated with that idea and they just think it's going to be the greatest, most wonderful thing ever. How do you approach that with those people in terms of going, hey, there's a better way?

Yeah, from the conventional, so to speak. Well, I mean, first I share my war story and then so that gets their attention. So I'm not just in theory, right? I like to talk very specifics. But the other piece of it is The piece I just shared with you in passing really quickly where people in high income— I'm talking anywhere from, you know, small 6 figures to multiple 6 figures. I had a gentleman in my conference room the other day making half a million dollars a year saying, Chris, I am begging my supervisor to lay me off. Like, he doesn't want to be there because it strapped him. And before meeting us, yes, he was going to go the very conventional buy and hold. Well, I have a couple thoughts with it. First of all, To your question, first of all, you're limited, right? You're limited by your own capital and by how many the bank's going to loan you. And I don't care who you go to; there are limitations all over the place. Secondly, when the market takes its turns, and there's one constant real estate is it constantly changes. So when it does that, no fault of the bankers or no fault of anyone else. But if you sign personally, they're coming to you and you have no leverage. In our world, when the market changes. Through different cycles like you mentioned we've been through, who holds the leverage?

We do.

I'm not signed personally on any projects or deals or any kind of asset class whatsoever, 'cause you can do this in every asset class. So, when I put my head on the pillow at night, it's a little bit different than the '08 crisis when I was doing everything conventional. It's dramatically different. So, yeah, I just, you talked on my show recently about kind of people being conditioned That rang true to me as soon as I— you, you said it, because the same thing here. I was conditioned from 1991 till 2007 and a half to do things conventionally, and until someone kind of rattled my cage, including the market. Well, that's what I try to do with everyone, to get them to see the bigger picture, because we can all go along, in your, in your words, being conditioned for decades, decades, and nothing changes. And it's sad. I just want to shake people and say, you don't have to be there. You do not have to be there. If you're in a position where you just want that change, people like yourself and me, we've been there. Just reach out. It's not brain science anymore. You can reach out and people can guide you.

Well, Chris, I talk to a lot of investors being a podcaster and talk to a lot of people who are doing You know, financing the way that you do it. But your program is one that has really been perfected, and you're the only one who really has perfected this idea of the 3 paydays.

Mm-hmm.

So take us through the 3 paydays and what they are and how it is that, that, that is— it's a consistent approach for everybody who works with you. You— it is consistent that there's always going to be at least those 3 paydays.

Yeah. So, yeah, I talked about how they came about. What they are is this. Um, look, let's— let me precede it with this. If you and I were going to open a business tomorrow, and let's just say nothing to do with real estate, any business you want to pick, uh, restaurant, and someone said to us, hey, Alan and Chris, I have this particular model for this restaurant, or this franchise, let's say, has a really cool income model. It pays you right when you get started up It also pays you monthly, and then by the way, it's going to pay you some longer-term wealth. You and I would probably say, well, that sounds like a cool model income-wise, quality of income-wise. Okay, so when we exit our properties now, not all properties are the same, right? We buy office buildings, multifamily, but let's just talk single for a second. When we exit our properties, we exit them with people or we sell them to people who need time. Now, who is that? There is an onslaught right now. Uh, growing every year since COVID of people in corporate America looking to start their own business. Perhaps they have great credit, perhaps they were making $2, $3, $4, $500,000 a year, and now they want to start their own business. But here's the challenge. A lot of them don't realize this. They're not bankable. They can't go get a house loan tomorrow. That sounds crazy, right? It's crazy. They can have, they can have $2, $3 million in assets, be leaving a job that's $200,000 or $300,000 or $500,000, but can't buy a house. Why? Unless they buy cash. Because they're not bankable. They need to have what's called seasoning for 2 years. So they come into the picture as our, what we call tenant buyer, someone who needs time. Payday 1 is their down payment. Payday 2 is the spread every month that we make from the difference between what they're paying us and we're paying on the property. And payday 3 is the markup of the property and all the principal paydown that's accumulated throughout the term. So they're happy. It's a win-win. situation. And Mycela, who I helped out of probably a challenge, is happy. It's a 3-way win-win. That's pretty cool. And if you look statistically now, this is fascinating. I don't know if you've had Lon Welsh on your show. I forget if we both knew him mutually, but—

I don't.

He was on my show recently and he was going over statistics, very statistic-driven with his fund. And he didn't intentionally do this, but every stat he was pointing to, almost every, is driving creative real estate. So examples, simple examples. The average first-time homebuyer now is approaching 40, no longer in the 20s. So what about the person in their 30s who no longer wants that conventional apartment, run up and downstairs, let the dog out? I mean, these are simple things, but that's what's going on statistically. The rent-to-own gives them a home and it gives them a pathway to true homeownership. If you look at every other blip economically, '08 that you and I lived through, dramatically different. People say, oh, it's the same. Here comes '08 again. No, this is so different than '08. It's not even, not even close. One of them is in '08, there was a lack of equity. In fact, the statistics were a lot of houses upside down, right? Everybody remembers that. Now, the amount of free and clear properties in the United States has grown to 40%. 40%.

Wow.

It was 33% back like a decade ago. So, that's really cool. That's people I can talk to that are not on the market. I can structure owner financing with them and do some really neat things. And that's growing. And then the amount of equity in homes across the United States has grown dramatically. So it's just a different time. But now we have an issue with sellers going, well, I got a 2 or 3% mortgage and I want to leave. I want to— I need to go over here for my kids or I want to leave here for a job. But what about this mortgage? They can sell it to us and keep it in place. So I just rattled off different things that are going on now, but they're driving creative real estate big time right now.

Yeah, that is interesting. So in terms of— I mean, those are are standing as statistics, or they're going on right now. What do you think that the recent events, how do you think that is going to affect what it is that you're doing?

Yeah, I have 2 comments. The billionaires don't know, so I don't, but I have 2 comments on it though. One is Um, it is turmoil. I'm using the word turmoil, confusion. Whenever that happens for us in creative, and it could be anything, it could be interest rate change, it could be the war going, it could be anything. Whenever that happens, sellers and buyers look for a guide, especially sellers. They go, oh gosh, I don't know if I can sell. And I'm talking any asset class. So we come into the picture there because we can create and structure terms that are custom to them like the banks can't, right? So that that's going to drive our we'll be busy. It's when there's none of that going on that we go okay, we're okay, but we're not we're not overwhelmed with deals. Now we are overwhelmed with deals. Secondly, again, I don't have a crystal ball, but if I was to guess, I'd say that you're going to look back in 2028-29 and say I wished I was in the market in 26 and 27. That's my opinion. So you can date this episode and see if that happens. But I feel strongly about that, and I'm screaming to our community. To double down right now. Uh, by the way, similar to what I did in COVID where I had good friends, competitors but good friends, go out of business. Like, close the doors, go, I guess we're done. Like, literally 2 of them are out of business today, and I was screaming to the community to double down. And as a result, a lot of them created some serious wealth. So I, I think we're going a similar situation, but we'll see.

We'll see. Yeah, a lot of uncertainty, uh, to be certain. In terms of going forward, it looked like at the beginning of the year interest rates were going to decline, and then the recent turmoil has turned that around and it looks like they're probably going to be increasing. So with these 40% people who— how many? I forgot the percentage.

Free and clear. Yeah, 40% of the United States homeowners have no mortgage.

have no mortgage. So it's going to be challenging for them to go out and find purchasing opportunities that aren't going to require financing, and they're going to be facing high interest rates. How are you going to help them?

Yeah, good question. So most of— if I think, as you were saying that, to most of the avatars in that category that we buy from that are free and clear, they range in this area. They range in people like I bought my building from, who is one of the largest landowners in the area. Like, this wasn't his residence, this was a building, and he wanted to sell it in a manner that from a tax planning, right, capital gains, and an estate planning mechanism to sell it that way over time. So I bought it, 20-year note on that.

Mm-hmm.

Others, I'm seeing like second, third homes So they're not, they don't have to go replace that to your question. They just, they just want to be done with it. Or they're juggling second or third homes and age-wise they're going, you know, I'm done with that. I'm not going there anymore. That happened a lot since COVID's still happening. So that's more who we're dealing with versus primary younger family, not debt-free, have to go get something else, have to move the little equity they have to something else. Usually not with us. Usually it's the other categories. And, and that's rampant right now with the aging population.

Are there any areas of the country that are more advantageous to be starting this kind of business?

Uh, interesting question, because when Lon was on the show, he, he showed the map of, um, and they can see this on my show, but they show— he showed the map of the pockets, because I hate to say market all the time, right? And I'm sure you're the same. Like, I wish there was one real estate market, but there's pockets. And so let me answer 2 ways. Generally speaking, creative real estate in terms can operate anywhere. Are there pockets where the market's softer?

Yeah.

And that's going to change every, every quarter, let's say. And so where people are needing more solutions than conventional can do? Yes, of course. But I don't tell people to go outside of their market Because of the nature of the profitability of our three paydays, it ranges like from forty-five grand to three hundred fifty grand per deal. So if you're talking six figures per deal, most people looking at what we do want to do between twelve and twenty deals a year, and that's a life changer for them. So can they find that in a fifty-mile radius of their house versus going and trying to hunt down these markets that are that are you know troubled? Yeah, they can find it right in their own backyard. We show them how, but it's nice to be aware of those markets because some people. As these cycles dip and turn, they're probably going to be hit with that, right? At some point in their marketplace.

Are just in general, I'm just wondering, are there, is it more advantageous to be in, say, an industrial area or a tourist area or an area that is strong in healthcare or tech?

Yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to give you an answer of yes to all of the above. However, let me break it down. So I like transient areas, like I live in a touristy area right now. So, so am I seeing more second and third properties, time for them to unload or they're tired or they're tired landlords? Yes. So I like that as far as creative real estate goes. I also like not immediate city, but outside of immediate city. Doesn't mean you can't do it. Like I have someone just talked to me and he's in New York City and I said, well, Rich, why don't we go outside it a little bit? It's not that people won't owner finance there. Of course they will. But it's also a little hotter market right there than it is on the outskirts. That's all. It just depends on their goals. Everybody's a little different, but there's no bad area to do it in because let's just— let's talk industrial just because you brought it up. Are there some properties there, if that's your niche, that perhaps tired owners, tired landlords and/or free and clear?

Yes, they are.

You can buy lists now. A lot of people are amazed at the data we can get in the US now, not in Canada, but you can get data in the US of almost anything. I can get, I can get a list of distressed homeowners that haven't even hit pre-foreclosure yet. They're just distressed because now they track credit cards and utilities and all those things, car payments that others weren't tracking 5 years ago. This is a new list called distressed.

Mm-hmm.

Can I track, uh, owners of multi-use projects that, uh, multi-use buildings that where I might want to go buy my building, which is how I found mine. That are free and clear and out of state.

Yep.

So you can, you can pinpoint now what type of deals you want to go fish in that pond for. That makes sense.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. But what I'm, what I'm hearing you saying, you, you probably, you're recommending that people really start in, if not their immediate area, within, uh, just outside of their immediate areas. Um, and, um, Talk a little bit more about that. Why is that really the recommended way to begin?

Because unless they have— I'll give you some caveats, exceptions— but unless they have a reason to go outside the area, what would be a reason? Well, my parents used to live in Marco Island until recently when they, when they get up in age. So I did some playing around there. Why? Because if I go visit them, I have some properties I can write the trip off and just have fun, and I have reasons to visit them. That's There was a woman during COVID in our community who lived in a high-rise in New York, and as a result, her job was put aside. So she prospected in areas in Florida where her parents were. Second homes. I want a second home. Recent example in the Poconos for someone in my community. All right, good. Well, well, I'll teach you how to find things in that area. I want an office building in this particular— okay, I'll teach you how to do that. But by and large, to accomplish someone's financial goals only without looking at everything else, they can do that in a 50-mile radius. And if they don't have a sort of a passion for an asset class, I'll start them in single. But we have plenty of people that come in, like Annette comes to mind in our community. Annette came in with some mobile home experience. And so what does she— who does she prospect? Free and clear mom-and-pop mobile home parks. that she can buy with no banks all day long. So again, that was her passion. So we helped her go that route. Just depends on the individual. Yeah.

Lots of different ways to go with that. So Chris, tell us about your program and how it is that people can find you and get involved.

Yeah, so they can go to— we have a free book for your, your tribe as usual. Just go to 3paydaysbooks— that's the number 3— 3paydaysbooks.com/Allen with the number 3. So 3paydaysbooks.com/Allen and the number 3. Um, that'll— that's a free offer, by the way. It's not one of those free offers where you go free offer and then I gotta put in shipping for a credit card. You put nothing in, we'll ship you the books. Probably, probably some goodies in there. I also offer a free class, Alan, because unfortunately they— the listeners are bombarded on social media and otherwise other ads that, that are all get rich quick tomorrow things. And that's just not the case. So I try to give a lot of freeaways so that they understand what it is we do. And if it's a fit, fantastic. If it's not, it's okay. They can go to smartrealestatecoach.com/masters class, and that gives them a free workshop with me, but nobody breathing down their neck to see when they're going to do, how they're going to do. Just go enjoy it. And if it's something you want to pursue, there'll be some resources there for you.

Okay. Well, great. Well, Chris, as we close out here, what are your last closing words of wisdom?

Well, because of the market we're in, and I guess we could say this almost every time we get together, but particularly now with all the stuff going on in the economy, Don't follow the masses and certainly don't follow the media. Connect with someone if you're an accredited investor like Allen. If you're building that up, connect with someone like us. But goodness sakes, if it's not one of us, find someone who's been through different economic cycles who can navigate with you. There's plenty of people out there with the use of the internet now versus listening to the masses because we know the masses aren't The ones out there creating wealth. Fact. Not, not shooting arrows at anyone. So there's plenty of people that can help you out there, and we'd love to do that.

Well, Chris, it's been a pleasure. Always is. Thank you for being with us today.

Appreciate you having me, Alan. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you for tuning in to Streams to Impact, brought to you by Steedtalker Capital, a company empowering passionate professionals like you to develop multiple streams of passive income built on solid passive real estate investments. As a significant part of our endeavors to make a cosmic and meaningful impact for this world, Steed Talker Capital contributes significant portions of our profits to activities and organizations committed to better understanding the equine. These endeavors attempt to enhance the treatment of horses worldwide. Steed Talker Capital, working for a world where all creatures great and Flourish abundantly. If you are ready to learn how our passive investors have earned an average 33% annual return on their investments, schedule your complimentary Passive Income to Prideful Impact consultation. Obviously, we cannot continue indefinitely to offer these valuable consultations for free, so grab your Passive Income to Prideful Impact consultation while you still can. Go to steedtalker.com/passive.