Justin Rashidi: The future of SDRs, BDRs, and AI-powered sales development

Business. Business. Business. Business.

Welcome to Go to Market, a podcast for RevOps, sales, and marketing leaders to dive deep into industry insights and best practices. Go to Market is sponsored by Fulcast and Silicon Slopes. My name is Amy Cook and I am so excited to introduce Justin Rashidi, co-founder at SeedX. How are you doing, Justin?

Excellent. Thank you for having me today.

So glad to have you today. Thank you so much for giving us, you know, a little bit of your time. I know it's very busy and so appreciate you taking a few moments.

Yeah, excited, excited to have some good conversation.

That's right. I know there's lots of questions. So tell me first to just get started, can you tell me a little bit about your background?

Yeah, I mean, I guess I have a kind of interesting background. I, I got a degree in biochemistry actually, and then I made my way like into entrepreneurship. I kind of randomly, I actually just started a company like out of college. I didn't think I was starting a company. It was just a service company at the time that got basically bought off. And then I decided to freelance and then that actually grew into a marketing agency. Of what we have now. So kind of a random little path to where I am now.

That is awesome. I love it. You know, marketing— I used to run a marketing agency as well, and marketing has gone through so many shifts and so many different twists and turns. My marketing agency was mostly B2B focused. And what about you? Do you go more consumer, more B2B? Is it, is it both?

Yeah, we're somewhat evenly split. And then we do a lot of companies that are B2B to C. So like at certain stage sizes of like organizations, they end up being like you have both wholesale and you also have a direct-to-consumer path. Or yeah, even if you're a consumer company, like wholesale could be a huge aspect of your, your organization. So we end up speaking to both traditional like B2B lead gen and then also standard like consumer marketing as well.

Okay, well that makes sense. So as you've been trying to, you know, as you've been doing marketing for a number of companies in this space right now, Go-to-market is going through such a huge change. So what are you seeing in the marketplace that maybe other people are not seeing quite yet and that we need to address?

Changes in the market? I mean, the biggest one that everyone's talking about is like AI in the market. The, the weird thing I think that is that maybe there's too much emphasis there and I think still not enough emphasis on like the basics that work. A lot of like the, from my perspective, a lot of like standard basic things work. In the B2B realm. And I think that people just overcomplicate it actually.

Really?

I think so. Yeah.

I mean, I think so too, actually. So give, give me an example.

I mean, I think people want to have like these like crazy funnels and like do these, like, I don't know, like whatever things or like the big one for my, my personal like experience in the B2B world is that leadership doesn't understand marketing and how to like actually go to market. They might be more of a sales-led organization. If you are a sales-led organization, I would say like maybe the differences is like how, like how people respond to things. So like maybe the big changes are like cold email doesn't work as well anymore. That's probably like the biggest one, especially with like AI adoption. But the things that like do work is like good messaging, like good value props, good offers, like getting people on calls, going out. I think honestly, like I've even, I'm kind of young, but like I'm, I feel like I act kind of old in that I'm like, you know how you really develop sales and go-to-market? You go meet people in person. That's true.

It's, there's no, there's no compensation for it. There's no way you can reproduce that relationship aspect than going face to face.

Everything that we do, like from an online lead generation standpoint, like we try to like funnel into like in-person behaviors. Like even if it's like first a Zoom call or like some type of online meeting, but then like eventually like facilitating some type of in-person meetings. Uh, and. Yeah, like some of these things are so simple. It's like you have a good product, you have a message that makes sense, right? You know how you're differentiated and you go and actually meet with people. And I was like, I, I don't know why, like I think all of those things still work and like they've worked for like the last 100 years. They'll probably work for like the next 100 years. Like it hasn't changed.

Yeah, I totally agree. What are some tips for being able to develop an online lead funnel that ends up into an in-person event of some sort, and what are some of the best channels that you've seen lately?

Well, it depends on like the, the, so if we're doing like, if we're talking about like true, like B2B where like, you're targeting like, let's say like not SMBs, like you're targeting like mid-market enterprise, uh, like LinkedIn, I still think is like a top, it's like this top one, honestly, LinkedIn and then Google, like if you have like search intent, and then yeah, then outbound, like still is like productive and then organic, but like for us, like we like LinkedIn, like LinkedIn ads, LinkedIn inbound, and then like we funnel them into like demos. We get them on demos and then from there, like, I'm actually just talking about our own funnel. Uh, from there, like usually we're trying to get like incentive to actually get people on calls with us. Like getting someone on the call is the hardest, hardest part actually. Like then you build rapport. And then the way that we work is like we actually have like a set amount of conferences that we're going every year and we're inviting like people all the time to those conferences. Mm-hmm. Uh, or if they're like nearby, we'll take 'em to dinner and then we facilitate like that. And then that usually provides like a whole like 360 interaction, both with like, like the person who's leading sales, but also with like the entire team. And people really like that.

Yeah, I love that. What is your opinion currently on like SDRs and BDRs? Uh, there's so much discussion right now about that saying it's a, It's not a, it's not a good use of people's time anymore. It's not a good use of people's resources. But then like, how do you hunt otherwise? Like, can you give me a little bit of your opinion on that?

On SDRs? I mean, I think a lot of people are also saying AI is like gonna take over like more of the SDR role. And I actually kind of believe that like a little bit. It depends on what the SDR is doing. Like, are they just doing, like, are they building lists and just like reaching out to people like the first time and then You know, like, are they like, I kind of think that AI actually does a better job than like most SDRs, uh, and depends on the role because people like mix up the, the role, like the definitions of SDRs and BDRs. Like, so it depends on your organization, but like the idea of like someone reaching out and doing these simple outreaches, like should probably be automated. It'd probably be better if it was automated.

Yeah, I think so too. There's a lot. Do you think things can be like completely automated or do you think you still need like a human in the mix?

Yeah, I think you need human in the loop. I mean, I believe a lot in that, like, you're going to have, like, agents, like, connected with people. Like, at our organization, that's what we're doing more of. It's like one person connected with 5 different agents, and they're overseeing agents and producing more work. And then they're funneling up, like, the same with customer service. It's like all the easy ones, like, are all the easy tasks are getting, like, done at the agent level, and then they're, like, kicking out, like, the harder ones or, like, the more valuable ones to like a human in the loop.

Yeah, I totally agree with that. That's very interesting. So if you were to talk with a CMO today, what would you say? And the CMO was like, hey, lay it, give it to me straight, lay it on me. What are some things that most CMOs are doing wrong that I can learn from and get a competitive advantage? What would you say to them?

Most CMOs probably don't understand their sales process enough.

I could agree with that.

Yeah, like I would say like the battle between like marketing and sales is good and alive as ever. So most of the time I feel like the frustration, so like a lot of the times when we're talking to like different marketing, like executives or leaders, a lot of times like we're actually starting at the sales side and understanding like what roles they have. Like does your marketing like leader really understand like that job description of an SDR or a BDR? Like, does your, does your sales team gonna complain? Like if you're just bringing them a lead or do like, they really want this lead worked, right? Is the SDR gonna work the lead or is someone else gonna work the lead? Right? These are all like different types of things that I feel like, yeah, marketing people are like so obsessed with like attribution and then they like forget that like we have to like interact with sales like a lot. And so yeah, I think good definitions, good understanding of process, and then I mean, that's like the one that I feel like we see the most is just like there's so much tension between these, these teams and like people just don't understand what the sales team is doing. Like from a media standpoint though, like what's, what CMOs should be thinking about? I mean, honestly, just like spending more money. Like I feel like people are allergic to like spending money sometimes on the B2B side. And I'm like, guys, like if you're getting a meeting for whatever cost, like what do we care? Like, what do you care if you spend $100,000 or $200,000 a month? Like who cares?

Right.

That's—

I totally agree with that. That's very interesting. One thing that just coming from an agency background myself and then going in-house as a chief marketing officer, it was very interesting and telling for me when I, when I had my first in-house CMO position, how little I knew about the sales process. So I totally identify with you in terms of like, you know, in order to, in order for sales and marketing to work well, you have to really be in each other's business and understand what's going on as, as the lead, you know, goes full funnel and as outbound goes full funnel. And you have to have that mutual understanding and respect. So I think that it is really good. It's a really good opportunity for CMOs to, to really like become best friends with their CRO. And be able to, you know, bridge that gap. Do you have any other tips for bridging the gap between sales and marketing?

I don't know. This is a tough one because I think a lot of it gets into like leadership. Like I just have to—

Oh, let's talk about that. Tell me about that.

Yeah, I don't know. Like, uh, the, the hardest part, I think, like, okay, so like, yeah, the sales, like sales, sales leaders or like CROs or whoever, like They're frustrated with marketing because they don't like think that they like follow the lead all the way to close, right? And then, but like the, the, what the CMO generally feels is that like marketing in a lot of B organizations is put like secondary to, to sales, right? And then I think like being able to like showcase your value to leadership, right? And being able to like show that you should be like seen as an equal. I know you like, you guys could each have like a chief title, right? But like. you know, then there's like, are you actually viewed as that? Or is like, if this wiki sales team, like, you know, pipes up, like all of a sudden, like this is just like pushed to the side. And so, yeah, I think a lot of that gets into like leadership, showing value, being able to explain like how investment is working, being able to follow like the pipeline to close, like these different types of things. And, and that's, I don't know. Yeah. Like it's kind of weird because then it seems like, does the CMO have to do like the entire like CRO shop in some capacity? Like, I don't know, it's like, does it feel like that?

Oh, sometimes. Yeah, absolutely.

I think so.

Sometimes, sometimes it feels like that. And I, I, the more that I have understood what our CRO does, like the one that I work with, I deeply respect, his name's Pete and he is just wonderful. And the one that, that's the heads of sales and the CROs that I've worked with in the past that are more open about their processes and are like kind of a little more humble about saying like, hey, like this piece of the funnel isn't working yet, let's figure it out together. Those are the ones that I work with really, really well because it's, it's just a problem to solve. Right. But with others, I think, I think oftentimes marketing really does get the brunt of the work in a lot of ways, because if you're only expecting from sales to have 100% of your leads come from inbound and then just be there to like catch the lead and close it, then you're missing a lot of revenue for your company and you're not, you don't really have the best practices for how to go to market.

Yeah, I mean, I think the CMO role is like the most controversial role. Like it has like the least amount of tenure and like the highest turnover rates. And it kind of makes sense because it's kind of a complicated role that you're supposed to like generate demand but also work the pipeline at the same time. And it's quite complicated in that regard in terms of like what your responsibility is and like where does marketing end and where does sales begin? Right. And at what level of support does marketing support sales or et cetera? Right.

Yeah, I totally agree. Well, you know, it's really exciting to talk with someone who has worked with so many CMOs and is such a good support system. You clearly are at the top of your game. And so my last question is, what do you do to stay there? And it could be anything from like reading marketing books to going on walks and during meetings, like what, what do you do to, to stay there? Stay fresh and to stay on the top of your game?

I read a lot of Twitter or X, honestly. Like I, I read, I read a lot. I'm not like a book person though. Like I don't read, like I don't take courses. I just read a bunch of like micro information all the time.

Mm-hmm.

And I, I like that more. Like, yeah, like new, like small newsletters or small pieces of information. I feel like daily information is better than like, you know, like some course.

Like going, going down deep into a book or a course. Once a quarter, it's better to just be always refreshing with what's latest and the latest news.

Yeah, I like deep dives too, but like, I, I don't know why, like every once in a while I'll just like read something and then like it helps me like, like 3 different ideas together. Mm-hmm. And I probably read that idea or I even maybe done a course on this and like it didn't click then and then I'm like, oh, it finally clicked. And right. I don't know, I, I have a lot of those daily things and I always feel like it helps us so much when Like, I'm like, I finally got this one concept.

Yep. I totally get that. And I'm, I'm the same way. It's always fun to be able to stay up with the latest on the benchmarks and everything that's going on in the industry. Well, Justin, thank you so much for being part of the podcast today. It's really wonderful to get to know you a little bit better and a little bit about your company. If people want to know more about how to get in touch with you and how your agency can help them. How do they get in touch with you?

Yeah, the best is just to send us messages on LinkedIn or send a contact form.

Okay, awesome. Well, thank you again. I really appreciate your time. Likewise.

Thanks for having me.